# Operation Foxhole: A New Con Idea.



## KristopherTiberiusHaven (May 31, 2012)

This is an idea I had for a new Furry Convention/FurMeet.

_*Operation Foxhole:*_

The name is the title and the idea.

An exclusive "members only" style furry convention or furmeet made exclusively for Military personnel from around the world. Any country, any race, any creed, any religion, and any branch. Attendance would be restricted to Active Duty/Reserve/National Guard, Retired, Prior Service, and their dependents. Basically anyone DIRECTLY related to the Military from any country in the world who is a furry or is interested in the fandom or is just curious about what it means to be a furry would be allowed to attend.

Civilians that are not directly related to the Military would NOT be allowed to attend. This would guarantee it to be a better quality con for those in the Miitary.

Because let's face it, some of us just can't stand being around civilians sometimes.

I came up with this idea after I got back from Rocket City FurMeet in Huntsville, Alabama. While I did indeed enjoy the company of everyone in attendance, and I have never been more relaxed in my life to be honest, it made me wonder something.

Just how many secret, lost, and newly discovered furries are there in the Military? And why is there not a Convention just for us? I know that if there were alot of Military folks there instead of massive quantities of civilians and a few military (about 200 people attended, and about a third of that seemed to be realted to the Military in some way), it might have been even better because of the connection of the Brotherhood/Sisterhood between Military personel.

So what do you all think?


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## Teal (May 31, 2012)

How could you fund something like this?


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (May 31, 2012)

I would imagine the same way other cons are funded. Which from the way I understand it is with a Non-Profit organization, generally one that is related to the fandom in some way, and with the con entry fees. Pre-registration can net alot of the fees and surcharges, and donations to the non-profit could cover the rest.

Of course the con itself selling items and such, not for a profit of course, but to go into a slush fund that is designed to cover costs, might work.

A 1-3% surcharge on all Dealer's den and Artist's alley items sold could help alot. And any panels or events scheduled would require a fee to "rent" the time slot and convention space out.

A new Military Furry related non-profit organization would need to be started. Perhaps BOSS and MWR could assist in trip planning and coordinanting for FurMeet atendees as well.

A sort of FRG style of organization would need to be established as the non-profit.


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## Smelge (May 31, 2012)

Are there really that many military people out there?

And what exactly would you all do? Sit around in fursuit and talk about how far that Iraqi mans head flew when you shot him.


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## Schwimmwagen (May 31, 2012)

Foxhole.

Is this a convention set up mostly for sex?


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## Teal (May 31, 2012)

Smelge said:


> Are there really that many military *furs* out there?
> 
> And what exactly would you all do? Sit around in fursuit and talk about how far that Iraqi mans head flew when you shot him.


 See OP here's another problem.



Gibby said:


> Foxhole.
> 
> Is this a convention set up mostly for sex?


 Military sex.  :/


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## Trpdwarf (May 31, 2012)

Somehow I don't think the name "foxhole" is that good of an idea.


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## Ozriel (May 31, 2012)

"Foxhole" is a bad name for your convention. May I suggest something else that does not denote copious amounts of anal penetration?

Also, some conventions have a "Millitary Furmeet pannel" for those in Active and Reserve duty.

Finally, how are you going to work out the Dealer's Den deal if Civilians not reated to the millitary are restricted? Most artists and dealers aren't active/retired duty or employed by the government.


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## Zoetrope (May 31, 2012)

KristopherTiberiusHaven said:


> Because let's face it, some of us just can't stand being around civilians sometimes.



I think this confirms a lot of my suspicions.


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## laser (May 31, 2012)

Trpdwarf said:


> Somehow I don't think the name "foxhole" is that good of an idea.



OR IS IT?



Ozriel said:


> May I suggest something else that does not denote copious amounts of anal penetration?



I would definitely have attended under that premise!


(No, I wouldn't)


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## Trpdwarf (May 31, 2012)

ga-be said:


> OR IS IT?
> 
> 
> 
> ...




So...do you want to be known as attending the con where everyone gets laid, and comes home with micro-hitchhikers, aka STD's?  :V


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## Ad Hoc (May 31, 2012)

I wonder if there will be any atheists there.


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## laser (Jun 1, 2012)

Trpdwarf said:


> So...do you want to be known as attending the  con where everyone gets laid, and comes home with micro-hitchhikers, aka  STD's?  :V








ga-be said:


> *(No, I wouldn't)*



...


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## DuncanHusky (Jun 1, 2012)

As one of several people who were involved in starting Midwest FurFest, I think I might be able to comment on this. I want to start with your statement:



> Because let's face it, some of us just can't stand being around civilians sometimes.




I have never been a member of the armed forces, but I can imagine what you mean by that statement. Lest others be alienated by this, think about it: months or years on end of being in a field combat situation, constantly needing to be in a state of readiness, perhaps frequently coming under fire. This leaves an impression on your life long-term, one that civilians can't understand (and, I admit, one that I can't claim to understand). It is one of the many reasons I feel members of our military are worthy of respect for their service. It also helps provide some insight for why an event like this might be desired.

Now, that having been said, I will say that you have set yourself a very difficult task. To consider the numbers:



KristopherTiberiusHaven said:


> I would imagine the same way other cons are funded. Which from the way I understand it is with a Non-Profit organization, generally one that is related to the fandom in some way, and with the con entry fees. Pre-registration can net alot of the fees and surcharges, and donations to the non-profit could cover the rest.



A seed fund will be necessary before the first pre-registration ever comes in. Incorporation will cost between $500-1,000 (state incorporation fee + cost of a lawyer), and hotels usually require some kind of deposit when contracts for space are made. Then there's capital expenditures, but those can possibly come later.



> Of course the con itself selling items and such, not for a profit of course, but to go into a slush fund that is designed to cover costs, might work.



Keep in mind that you need to purchase those items before you can sell them. Also, because you would be starting small (i.e. buying in lots less than 100, likely less than 50) you would be paying close to retail price for whatever the item is. This would likely be a small revenue stream.



> A 1-3% surcharge on all Dealer's den and Artist's alley items sold could help alot.



When I ran the Anthrocon Artists Alley we took a 3% fee (we stopped doing this in 2009, I believe) that generated around $950 for 150 artists over the weekend. For a first-year con, you might get 20-30 artists/dealers. I would not expect to make much money on this.



> And any panels or events scheduled would require a fee to "rent" the time slot and convention space out.



This is a non-starter. Midwest FurFest (and most furry conventions these days) has a hard enough time getting quality programming by having people volunteer their time and providing the space for free. If you charge for people to do it you won't get more than a handful of people expressing interest, if even that many.

Finally there's the issue of manpower: You are going to need at least 5 or 6 solid, reliable people to get any effort off the ground. If you try to do it with any fewer than this you are setting yourself up for burnout and potential failure.

So. Am I trying to discourage you from planning such an event? Absolutely not! I am however suggesting that you approach the event with your eyes open and that you fully consider all of the resources necessary for such an endeavor. My suggestion would be to start small. Perhaps a MilFur "Lounge" at one of the larger conventions (a suite set up with snacks and sodas to allow for socializing away from the tumult of the convention)? Or a one-day "pre-con" before a con for military attendees only to hang out, tour the area, or generally socialize? From these seeds a larger effort can grow, plus it provides two important benefits: it will help you gauge the level of interest before making a huge investment of time and money, and it will bring you into contact with people with similar interests who might be able to help run a future event.

I hope this helps! I wish you luck and success in any event that you end up planning.

Duncan da Husky


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

double post. deleted.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

Smelge said:


> Are there really that many military people out there?
> 
> And what exactly would you all do? Sit around in fursuit and talk about how far that Iraqi mans head flew when you shot him.



In reply to your first question, there are about 313 million citizens in the United states alone. Of that only one percent of the population has ever, is now, or will ever serve in the US Military at any one given time. In other words, roughly 3 million Men and Women are active Military here in the US. That is not counting all the MILLIONS of Men and Women from other Militaries around the world.

And to be honest, we are a bit nuts in the first place; we have to be. We raise our right hand, and swear an oath, a bond of our word and our signature, to DIE for our country if need be. So yeah we are freaking insane. We VOLUNTARILY say; "please send me, instead of those next to me, into that impending wall of bullets. I'll go."

So yes there are MILLIONS of us that are in fact...

... furries.

I went to Rocket City FurMeet in Huntsville, Alabama and I spoke with many furs there. I would say out of a crowd of around 200 that attended total, about one third of them were either Military, prior Military, retired military, or were directly related to (and thus listed as a dependent of) someone IN the Military.

So yes. There are ALOT of furries in the Military.

To answer your second question...

.... PFFTTTT HAHHHAAHAAHAHHAHAHAAAAA!!!!!! ROFL. I had a hard time trying to stop laughing at that. Morbid humor is something you get used to in the Military. But no, most Military Men and Women who have been to combat don't talk about it to be honest. The scarring effects of battle can take a heavy toll on many of us. To be a furry, to go to a place (like a con for instance) where there are no expectations of dress, or of any sort of decorum or real "rules" or "regulations" besides the basic laws, rules, and regulations of basic human (or furry) decency; and where everyone is just not giving a rat's ass...

... to many would be like walking through the pearly gates of heaven itself. Let me put it to you this way...

I went to RCFM; it was my very first con ever of any kind or type. I got there and looked around and saw a small collection of "super-nerds" and thought "oh God what have I gotten myself into now?" Then I walked around some more and saw alot of much older folks, some with walking canes even. I thought "oh crap, I have the back shelf collection from the local power puff girls convention on my left, and an old folks home on my right, can this get any weirder?"

Then everyone else showed up. "Ok now we have something here." I don't mind there being super-nerds and old folks, just so long as there is a generous helping of everyone in between to balance it all out. And let me tell you...

... as day two of the con rolled around; I realized something...

... I have never been more relaxed in my entire 27 years of life.

Never.

So yes. There are ALOT of furries in the Military. We just aren't very well known.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

bad post deleted.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

Gibby said:


> Foxhole.
> 
> Is this a convention set up mostly for sex?



HELL NO!!!

This is a FURRY CONVENTION.

Not a porn or sex con.

You want to do the nasty in your $5000 suit or you want to be a "messy" fur...

... I suggest you take that up to your room or don't come at all.

Operation Foxhole just sounds like that. I mean foxhole as in a foxhole that one digs to provide cover from bullets and explosions.

Where is your mind dirty boy? 

Military means professionalism.

This would be a convention/furmeet just for Military and their dependents (basically anyone who holds a Military Id card) to have a place to just cut loose and have fun without having to worry about some crackhead civilian slipping ecstacy or acid into their drink to try and get them stoned or high just for kicks.

Yes that is still a possibility but, once you eliminate the civilian factor it tends to be heavily reduced.

If some random sex happens in the privacy of someone's room...

... then it BETTER be consenual. Or else. :evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil:


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

TealMoon said:


> See OP here's another problem.
> 
> Military sex.  :/



Problems adressed, read replies below. Or above, whichever way this thing posts them; either way replies posted.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

Well the name is OPERATION FOXHOLE. I could have gone with Operation Bunker, The Warrior's Den, The Beast's Lair, The Eagle's Nest (although that one might be offensive because of the whole thing during WW2 and Hitler's bunker being named that), Foxtrot Charlie (*F*urry *C*onvention), Military Furry Convention (too unimaginitive), Military Furmeet (same problem as the last one), Predator Junction (sounds like a twisted kid's show), Predatorial, Beastling, Beast Con, Dragon Tank (sounds like a beer name), Fuzzy and In Uniform (too obvious sounding), Berserker Con (sounds like a WoW convention -shudders-), or any host of other names.

If you don't like the name...

... then be helpful and type me up a list of names and we can go from there.

In fact, if ANYONE does not like OPERATION FOXHOLE or thinks it inappropriate or just to innuendo sounding...

Help me out and come up with something better; or shush and don't complain.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

Ozriel said:


> "Foxhole" is a bad name for your convention. May I suggest something else that does not denote copious amounts of anal penetration?
> 
> Also, some conventions have a "Millitary Furmeet pannel" for those in Active and Reserve duty.
> 
> Finally, how are you going to work out the Dealer's Den deal if Civilians not reated to the millitary are restricted? Most artists and dealers aren't active/retired duty or employed by the government.



Yes PLEASE suggest something else. Evidently no one likes my name, so I will drop that name once someone comes up with a better one or I do.

Second question: Military Furmeet PANEL??? I don't want a dang panel, I want the whole dang convention. Sometimes I don't want ANYTHING to do with civiliians. Sometimes you guys just piss me and my buddies right the hell off. It is an attitude in the Military that many of us get from all the training we do. We train to basically shut our emotional response systems OFF so that we can don't lock up in the middle of a fire fight. Something civilians just can't do most of the time. And sometimes we want to be around ONLY those who will understand us the most.

To your last question about the dealers den...

... the con/furmeet would be open to Active Duty Military, Prior Military (meaning they got out but did not retire from service), Retired Military, and the dependents of all those Men AND Women who serve. With about 1.5 MILLION Men and Women on Active duty usually, that means there are ALOT of other people who ALSO hold Military ID cards out there that are NOT active duty. National Guard is Military too you know. Dependents are basically civilians who are simply legally and financially attached to those that are serving in some way.

I would estimate that at least 145 million Men, Women, and Children would be allowed to attend the convention. And that is JUST from the US Military. Other folks from OTHER militaries, like the British, Canadians, Germans, Australians, Japanese, Swedish, and many of our other allied nations Military Men and Women would be allowed to attend. US Military Furries are NOT the ONLY Military Furries out there hiding from their fellow Soldiers for fear of retribution. This would be a place of refuge for us of sorts.

So out of 7.6 BILLION folks worldwide, I would say you probably have 500 - 700 Million Men, Women, and Children that would be eligible to attend. There are plenty of artists in that kind of a crowd. Hell I personally know at least 50 artists, a rapper, a rock band, a DJ, 3 singers, 9 guitarists, 4 drummers, and 2 fur suit builders in the Military. And I have served in the same PLATOON as dang near all of them. I have even been deployed with over half of them. So yeah, the artist's alley and dealer's den would be covered six ways to Sunday.

And heck, we would still allow those artists who have made a major name for themselves, and especially those who wish to do those tribute tours and such, to come to the con as well. Celebrities seem to love thanking us forsome reason, why the hell I don't know though. W appreciate it though that's for sure. Yeah guys like Fossil, or Larry the Cable Guy go over rather well with Military furs.

JUST ONE MAIN RULE THOUGH...


... NO TALKING SHOP ON CONVENTION GROUNDS!!! Leave work at work. This con is for letting loose and having fun.

We like to let our freak flag fly too you know.

And no dang paparazzi/liberal media ruining our fun.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

And what suspicions would those be huh? That we are trying to hide something from you because we are always trying to murder babies? Is that what you mean?

We just have a different attitude than civilians do. A civilian goes to a convention and sits down to a bong and smokes a bowl. A Soldier goes to a Convention, and just has a good time feeling free, even if only for a short time. A civilian whines that the Military is screwing up the whole world and that we should go on strike or some other bull s*** like that.

A Soldier stands in front of that civilian and takes the bullets square in his chest and continues to stand just to try and keep that whiny civilian alive...

...even if only for a few more seconds. :evil:


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

No. No you wouldn't. Because it would not be for that.

No one is more professional than I. I am a Non-Commissioned Officer, a leader of Soldiers.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

Ad Hoc said:


> I wonder if there will be any atheists there.



Dude. You MUST be a civilian.

It was the US MILITARY that made Jedi a freaking official Religion. If it wasn't for us, and the many thousands of Star Wars fans IN the US Military, Jedi would have not become a religion the way it did.

So yeah, there would be ALOT of atheists.


Oh wait... you meant... PPFFFTTTT HA HA HA HAAAAA!!! :ROFL:

Never mind that civilian crack then.


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## Teal (Jun 1, 2012)

Dude.

1. Please combine your posts.
2. Please use the quotes, it's hard to tell what you are replying to.
3. Calm down.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 1, 2012)

DuncanHusky said:


> As one of several people who were involved in starting Midwest FurFest, I think I might be able to comment on this. I want to start with your statement:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ok, here we go.

First off, thank you for recognizing what I meant. You hit it pretty much right on the cold wet nose.

And yes, it is a very daunting task to start such an event. This I am somewhat aware of. Not as much aware as I would like but, aware though.

Seed fung is not really all that hard to get in the Military actually. It is actually easier to raise money in a Military setting than in a Civilian setting. I think this is because of the closeness we all feel and the small realtive size of our community. Heck my Troop (Company/battery/wing what ever you want to call it) raised over $2500 today in a "hit your chain-of-command in the face with a pie" auction event at a barbeque we did for JUST our Troop. We had less than 150 people there and we raised over $2500 just from that. Can you imagine how much we could raise if we had 5000 or 6000 Soldiers, Marines, Airmen, Sailors, and See-Bees donating? Alot. Slush funds and such can be easy once the proper channels have been established. Heck if i could spin it just right, I could even get the MWR and BOSS programs to chip in. And they have BILLIONS to use for the betterment of Soldier livelihood. Now getting them to sign onto somethinglike this though...

... might not be so easy. But I am sure a Military Furry related Non-Profit could be used to raise the money within the Military community. We have a very close knit network of connections in here. All it takes is the right kind of leverage.

Having to buy items to sell...

... bake sale bro. Art sales. Kids love making key chains and such. There is a HOST of possiblities for such a thing. And not all of them require large batch orders to be bought before being sold. It just takes someone with a creative mind (and a big set of juevos) to get it done.

Yikes, 150 artists only netted $950 at 3% per sale? Well that's a crap shoot and a half. 

Hmm, yeah I actually questioned that about charging a "rental" fee for panel slots and such as I wrote it. I was hoping someone would comment on that. Ok, no charge for the panel slots and such then. Thank you for that.

Volunteers?

NOOOO problem. There are so many Military wives, husbands, and dependents as well as retirees, prior service, and random celebrities that would JUMP at a chance to volunteer for something like this. It just needs to be advertised thoroughly enough.

The number of furries in the Military is insane.

I am definitely trying to keep my eyes open. I am very happy you gave a thorough response. It helped me think of some things and really made me think alot harder on some stuff. We have some very smart people in the Military. I would DEFINITELY not be alone on this. I just need some high level support for it. But as I am a BOSS representative for my unit; well that might help a litte. I doubt it though. We are taught to always analyze the situation BEFORE you get neck deep in it if you can. Sometimes stuff happens where analyzing will get ya' hurt but, this is not one of those situations. I have all the time in the world to plan it (unless I get deployed), and I have no lofty expectations for a timeframe. This is going to be tough (always did love a challenge  ).

Hmm, I like you starter ideas. Yes would definitely get some support for the full con idea. Hmm, now how to set those up though? Email the con Dev's I guess? Hmm.

Thank you for your advice. I will be sure not to waste it. Keep an ear to the ground. I may need a contact in the Midwest Furfest to help me out someday.


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## KristopherTiberiusHaven (Jun 2, 2012)

Gibby said:


> Foxhole.
> 
> Is this a convention set up mostly for sex?



HELL NO!!!

This is a FURRY CONVENTION.

Not a porn or sex con.

You want to do the nasty in your $5000 suit or you want to be a "messy" fur...

... I suggest you take that up to your room or don't come at all.

Military means professionalism.

This would be a convention/furmeet just for Military and their dependents (basically anyone who holds a Military Id card) to have a place to just cut loose and have fun without having to worry about some crackhead civilian slipping ecstacy or acid into their drink to try and get them stoned or high just for kicks.

Yes that is still a possibility but, once you eliminate the civilian factor it tends to be heavily reduced.

If some random sex happens in the privacy of someone's room...

... then it BETTER be consenual. Or else. :evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil::evil:


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