# I Disagree with the "Its a hobby" people.



## JaguarSoul (Feb 17, 2012)

I have been read these forums for a few days and I see a lot of frustrated furries screaming and hollerin and hootin that Furry is a hobby and not to be taken serious and anyone who takes it serious is insane because Furry doesnt matter and is only a hobby. Well I DISAGREE. It might be a hobby for YOU but its not a hobby for all people who are furry. 

For a example, take a college kid in Creative Writing 101 who writes fan fiction once in a while has writing as a hobby. Its not that seriouse to him. But a amazing writer like George RR Martin, irs not a hobby for him, its a passion and a lifestyle because he spends most of his time writing and puts his heart and soul into his work.

So I think it is extremely wrong to scream Furry is a hobby at everyone because its not a hobby for everyone. For some people, myself included, it is a passion and it is a way of life. So there  is no need to constantrly scream this out and attack any newcomer who take Furry more seriously than you because it is not the same for everyone. What is a hobby for one person can be a LIFE for another.

Thats my two cents. 

Im not trying to stir up trouble just felt like saying this in response to all the posts ive been reading before I registered.


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## Dragonfurry (Feb 17, 2012)

Well obviously you are starting trouble because clearly you didnt read about this forum enough to know that this kinda discussion pisses of alot of people here. 

Now I shall wait for the wise of FaF to share their words of wisdom on the subject. :V


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## NEStalgia Fox (Feb 17, 2012)

*Implying that people never have ANY strong passion for their hobbies.*


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## Elim Garak (Feb 17, 2012)

I am an otherkin therian with a hyena totem that speaks to me about yiff and how much my own spirit wants to bone me. He also told me I should be hosting furpile parties at cons, it's the furry life style! I also need to tell my parents I am a furry but I am afraid they will surpress me like the evil facists they are, not respecting my murrsuit and totem. :V


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## Fay V (Feb 17, 2012)

You made a lot of fuss without really saying anything. 

So writing can be a passion and a career yes? but you have to work your ass off, make enough to be independent, otherwise it is just a hobby. Now there are minimal people in this world, a handful even, that are actually professionals and make a living off of furry. 

That's not really the point of the argument anyway. The issue pops up because furries have a habit of treating it like a sexuality. They talk about coming out to  their families, they whine that "clean furries" don't exist or are in denial. They treat it as if it is the core of their being, that all you need to know is that they find animal head people sexy. 

Well furry is not a core trait. Any furry gathering will show you that widely different people are furries. It's also not a sexuality. The lowest common denominator is Hobby. 
Some people have a passion for it. Some people have a passion for gaming, but a nine year old playing zelda isn't on a career path because there are people that are professional gamers. 
There are professionals in all hobbies. There are people that are passionate about it. That doesn't make it not a hobby and it certainly does not make it a sexuality, core trait, or a forced reason to be accepting and nice to all that happen to like talking dogs.


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## JaguarSoul (Feb 17, 2012)

Well its a sexuality to some. I for instance am not attracted to people but the only thing to get me sexually excited is furry porn. 

So how is it not a sexuaity type?

I am sure there are others like me.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 17, 2012)

then start on how is it a way of life, do what others have failed to really tell us: HOW THE FUCK IS IT A LIFESTYLE
Cause there is some as fuck furfags who have in the past gone "you arent a real furry cause you don't treat this fandom as a way of life"


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## Fay V (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Well its a sexuality to some. I for instance am not attracted to people but the only thing to get me sexually excited is furry porn.
> 
> So how is it not a sexuaity type?
> 
> I am sure there are others like me.



You know, that's probably not incredibly healthy. I don't mind people with a fur fetish, but if are ONLY aroused by nonexistent creatures then you're going to have a hell of a time interacting with people and functioning normally in terms of sexual exploration.


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## JaguarSoul (Feb 17, 2012)

Fay V said:


> You know, that's probably not incredibly healthy. I don't mind people with a fur fetish, but if are ONLY aroused by nonexistent creatures then you're going to have a hell of a time interacting with people and functioning normally in terms of sexual exploration.



Yeah I agree its messed up but thats how I am I guess. I dont have any normal function, I am 25 and never had a GF because I have only been attracted to non existant creatures since I can remember. Once I got the internet when I was like 12 and starting puberty, I was already looking for fantasy creature porn and was elated when I discovered the furry fandom because before then I would just pleasure myself to G rated pictures :/

So for me its a part of me thats more than a hobby.


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## SiLJinned (Feb 17, 2012)

Sexuality=/=Fetish

I guess by your words then all fetishes must be a way of life, too. There is no such thing as a sexuality for animal-headed people because they are not real people, as well as other pretty obvious reasons.


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## JaguarSoul (Feb 17, 2012)

SiLJinned said:


> Sexuality=/=Fetish
> 
> I guess by your words then all fetishes must be a way of life, too. There is no such thing as a sexuality for animal-headed people because they are not real people, as well as other pretty obvious reasons.



So if its not a sexuality, then what sexuality am I? I dont want to have sex with people, male or female, but I get turned on by drawings...?


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## Dragonfurry (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Yeah I agree its messed up but thats how I am I guess. I dont have any normal function, I am 25 and never had a GF because I have only been attracted to non existant creatures since I can remember. Once I got the internet when I was like 12 and starting puberty, I was already looking for fantasy creature porn and was elated when I discovered the furry fandom because before then I would just pleasure myself to G rated pictures :/
> 
> So for me its a part of me thats more than a hobby.



Either you are a troll or being serious.

Well for that I have a remedy for this if it is kinda the same people here will use for people like you who take it too seriously. How about you actually talk to the people who dont take it too seriously and try to get a understanding for their reasons/logic behind it. I doubt my advice is right so disregard it if it is incorrect and someone please correct me on this so I can find a better way to say this to people.


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## Aidy (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> So if its not a sexuality, then what sexuality am I? I dont want to have sex with people, male or female, but I get turned on by drawings...?



Anybody can get aroused by pictures or videos showing sexual acts, no matter what their sexuality is. That's just nature, there's more than homosexual, bisexual and heterosexual you know. Furry is not a sexuality.


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## SiLJinned (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> So if its not a sexuality, then what sexuality am I? I dont want to have sex with people, male or female, but I get turned on by drawings...?



Then you don't have any and happen to have a fetish that can't be fixed together with in real life.


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## JaguarSoul (Feb 17, 2012)

SiLJinned said:


> Then you don't have any and happen to have a fetish that can't be fixed together with in real life.



So I dont have a sexuality? But I want to have sex. Its just that what I want to have sex with doesnt exist.
 *psyduck*


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## Ariosto (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> So if its not a sexuality, then what sexuality am I? I dont want to have sex with people, male or female, but I get turned on by drawings...?



Asexual, perhaps? Or maybe it has more to do with the fact you haven't had (correct me if this isn't the case) the chance to interact with other people as to develop a clear idea of your sexual preferences. I think you're just confused about the whole deal, really. Start by interacting with more people and then you'll be able to judge the situation more clearly.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 17, 2012)

-_- GREAT, another damn fur that got fetish mixed up with lifestyle...can I just get someone who have it as a lifestyle so I can finally start doing research in that area. Its either Someone throwing around that its a lifestyle but really still within hobby grounds, got it mixed up with Fetish, or folks who really cant explain why its a lifestyle to them.


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## Sarcastic Coffeecup (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Yeah I agree its messed up but thats how I am I guess. I dont have any normal function, I am 25 and never had a GF because I have only been attracted to non existant creatures since I can remember. Once I got the internet when I was like 12 and starting puberty, I was already looking for fantasy creature porn and was elated when I discovered the furry fandom because before then I would just pleasure myself to G rated pictures :/
> 
> So for me its a part of me thats more than a hobby.


I am so interested about this. Do tell us more -_-


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## LizardKing (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Yeah I agree its messed up but thats how I am I guess. I dont have any normal function, I am 25 and never had a GF because I have only been attracted to non existant creatures since I can remember. Once I got the internet when I was like 12 and starting puberty, I was already looking for fantasy creature porn and was elated when I discovered the furry fandom because before then I would just pleasure myself to G rated pictures :/
> 
> So for me its a part of me thats more than a hobby.



Oh hi there. 

Otherkin who faps to dragons here (which I'm pretty sure is a surprise to no one at this point). But does that make it more than a hobby for me? No. Unless your entire life revolves around finding something to pleasure yourself to, I don't see how that raises it above hobby status. I'm not even sure that would be a lifestyle, but classed more as a "what the fuck is your problem" issue. Even if you're spending all your time making furry porn or whatever, that doesn't mean it's a lifestyle; it's just a hobby you take seriously. If you wear a fursuit everywhere, refuse to use cutlery, eat your meat raw, and communicate entirely in growls and whines, then I guess you could call it a lifestyle at that point. That, however, only applies to a minuscule (and frankly bizarre) minority.


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## Fay V (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Yeah I agree its messed up but thats how I am I guess. I dont have any normal function, I am 25 and never had a GF because I have only been attracted to non existant creatures since I can remember. Once I got the internet when I was like 12 and starting puberty, I was already looking for fantasy creature porn and was elated when I discovered the furry fandom because before then I would just pleasure myself to G rated pictures :/
> 
> So for me its a part of me thats more than a hobby.


At best that is a fetish, and at the worst it is a psychological crutch. 
What I would like to know is why your fetishism suddenly changes the nature of the thing. So you can not get off to anything but furry. People fuck cars, does that make cars a lifestyle for everyone?



Crysix Fousen said:


> -_- GREAT, another damn fur that got fetish mixed up with lifestyle...can I just get someone who have it as a lifestyle so I can finally start doing research in that area. Its either Someone throwing around that its a lifestyle but really still within hobby grounds, got it mixed up with Fetish, or folks who really cant explain why its a lifestyle to them.



I think for a while it was a lifestyle for me. My income came from furries, I spent about 40 hours a week doing furry art. It made up a fairly large portion of my life for a short time. Then I got a new job and let it go to the sidelines. I could see how it could be a livestyle for the very popular fursuit makers or artists. If that is their job and such, but otherwise the world will have you doing many other things.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 17, 2012)

Fay V said:


> I think for a while it was a lifestyle for me. My income came from furries, I spent about 40 hours a week doing furry art. It made up a fairly large portion of my life for a short time. Then I got a new job and let it go to the sidelines. I could see how it could be a livestyle for the very popular fursuit makers or artists. If that is their job and such, but otherwise the world will have you doing many other things.


Thats the thing, that would actually be their Livelihood really, something that IS pretty close to lifestyle, but sadly in fact isnt. gonna be forever till I find someone who actually have it as a lifestyle, not a pseudo one.


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## Aetius (Feb 17, 2012)

I really missed the Den Shit Threads, good to see them back.


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## Ad Hoc (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Yeah I agree its messed up but thats how I am I guess. I dont have any normal function, I am 25 and never had a GF because I have only been attracted to non existant creatures since I can remember. Once I got the internet when I was like 12 and starting puberty, I was already looking for fantasy creature porn and was elated when I discovered the furry fandom because before then I would just pleasure myself to G rated pictures :/
> 
> So for me its a part of me thats more than a hobby.


I think you might want to consider discussing this with a therapist. There's nothing with having a furry kink but if it's to the exclusion of having any interest in actual humans, you might be in a bit of trouble.


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## Fay V (Feb 17, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> Thats the thing, that would actually be their Livelihood really, something that IS pretty close to lifestyle, but sadly in fact isnt. gonna be forever till I find someone who actually have it as a lifestyle, not a pseudo one.


Well then, is there anything that legitimately is a lifestyle? I'm not sure how you are defining it so now I'm curious.


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## Lazykins (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Yeah I agree its messed up but thats how I am I guess. I dont have any normal function, I am 25 and never had a GF because I have only been attracted to non existant creatures since I can remember. Once I got the internet when I was like 12 and starting puberty, I was already looking for fantasy creature porn and was elated when I discovered the furry fandom because before then I would just pleasure myself to G rated pictures :/
> 
> So for me its a part of me thats more than a hobby.



You sound like a reprehensible and infinitely pitiable reprobate. So I'll piss you off with this: It's a hobby.

You can take a hobby to an extreme, which you're clearly doing.

I draw shit. That's about it. It's a hobby. Find help.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 17, 2012)

Fay V said:


> Well then, is there anything that legitimately is a lifestyle? I'm not sure how you are defining it so now I'm curious.


thats the thing, i'm trying to find what IS a lifestyle for a furry, but often a person that IS using the word Lifestyle tend to still treat it as a hobby or really cant describe it to me so I would have to assume they were just using the word. Though maybe my own definition is off, I mean I believe the person is doing what they have as their lifestyle 24/7/365(6) days a year, BUT they never turn off instead they drop in levels to make it bearable to folks outside.
if anything I'm following this definition
http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Lifestyle


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## Kitutal (Feb 17, 2012)

the bit I don't get is the whole 'it's only a hobby, you don't have to tell anyone' what other hobbies do they reccomend you not bothering telling anyone you enjoy?


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## Fay V (Feb 17, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> thats the thing, i'm trying to find what IS a lifestyle for a furry, but often a person that IS using the word Lifestyle tend to still treat it as a hobby or really cant describe it to me so I would have to assume they were just using the word. Though maybe my own definition is off, I mean I believe the person is doing what they have as their lifestyle 24/7/365(6) days a year, BUT they never turn off instead they drop in levels to make it bearable to folks outside.
> if anything I'm following this definition
> http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Lifestyle



I don't really think anything could fit that definition...there is no career where you never turn it off. A teacher will be a teacher all day, but after class and grading they'll go out to a movie or something. 
Even with military families they go out and do non-military things for entertainment or something. 

Maybe being a parent. you can't really ever stop doing that. 

I think when something is the majority interest in your life, that's your lifestyle. Like the student lifestyle. students aren't acting like students 24/7, but the majority of their time is spent at school. 

For the most part there is very little in furry that can support that kind of focus. You need a job that pays the bills, that's hard to do, so it becomes side entertainment while they spend most of their time working or going to school.



Kitutal said:


> the bit I don't get is the whole 'it's only a hobby, you don't have to tell anyone' what other hobbies do they reccomend you not bothering telling anyone you enjoy?


"have to" = require
There is no hobby requiring you to tell others. I am not required to come out as a gamer or go door to door getting a list signed. 
I'm happy to tell others that are interested, but I don't need to push it on people.


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## Keeroh (Feb 17, 2012)

[Deleted] Nevermind, I haven't had my coffee this morning.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 17, 2012)

Kitutal said:


> the bit I don't get is the whole 'it's only a hobby, you don't have to tell anyone' what other hobbies do they reccomend you not bothering telling anyone you enjoy?


all of them, unless someone asks or you know of the person also having said thing as a hobby often time "you dont have to tell". People dont NEED to know I'm a fan of Sega, unless they ask what gaming company I like. Its the "Need to know" basis that seem to have died a long time ago as everyone needs to tell everyone what they are doing (stares at twitter and other social networks)


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## BRN (Feb 17, 2012)

Furry can be a big part of your daily life. It can be the source of your pornography, and it might be the case that you interact almost solely with the furry community. You might even transfer capital within furry. Furry might, in fact, be a part of everything you choose to do. But as deep as it might penetrate your life, is it quite a lifestyle?

Admittedly the knee-jerk response of some members of this forum gets silly. But I can't see a way in which you can really claim it _is_ a lifestyle. Most likely, you're just arguing semantics rather than a case.

Also, you'll find that once you gain more sexual experience, humans do become more attractive.


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## Heimdal (Feb 17, 2012)

OP is completely obsessed with their hobby. I bet when they try to look at human porn, their mouse pointer is hovering impatiently over their furry porn folder!

Seriously, unless you're just not sexual at all, you're probably just so obsessed that nothing else compares anymore.


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## JaguarSoul (Feb 17, 2012)

Not really, I was never attracted to human porn or people in the first place. How am I suppose to have sex experience if people are soo...icky.


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## Keeroh (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Not really, I was never attracted to human porn or people in the first place. How am I suppose to have sex experience if people are soo...icky.



Perhaps you're asexual, with a furry fetish. 
Not everyone wants to fuck other people. Some folks just want to masturbate to assorted porn-y things.


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## Zenia (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> How am I suppose to have sex experience if people are soo...icky.


How are people 'icky' and what makes furry characters not 'icky'?


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## JaguarSoul (Feb 17, 2012)

Zenia said:


> How are people 'icky' and what makes furry characters not 'icky'?



I dunno just the way they look, when naked and all. Ppl look better with clothes on. Also the resemblance to monkeys/flat face etc, just all huge turn offs.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Not really, I was never attracted to human porn or people in the first place. How am I suppose to have sex experience if people are soo...icky.


...deep down I so want to say "go to SoFurry and hang with those furs" but I also know thats the worst thing I can do cause SoFurry furs would make keep this unhealthy status you have and seeing it as alright to have.


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## Keeroh (Feb 17, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> ...deep down I so want to say "go to SoFurry and hang with those furs" but I also know thats the worst thing I can do cause SoFurry furs would make keep this unhealthy status you have and seeing it as alright to have.



Well, what someone does on their own is their own business. Unless it's starting to affect those around him, let the fella wank it to animal people and feel like they are a special snowflake.


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## Zydala (Feb 17, 2012)

Sounds like an affliction really similar to those otakus in Japan who just want to marry anime girls and sleep with pillows because real women are 'gross'. It comes across as a bit concerning to most of society.

I'm all for people just doing what they like with their sex lives (I'm borderline asexual myself), and if you don't want to do it with another human being, well fine to that. It's just when one makes it everyone's business and try to push it as something that needs to define themselves beyond the bedroom, it sets off alarm bells.

The word "lifestyle" is a weird word anyway and terribly vague. The definition being something like "creating a sense of self". If the only sense of "self" one can create is through their sex and fetishes, it's not always seen as very healthy.


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## BRN (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> I dunno just the way they look, when naked and all. Ppl look better with clothes on. Also the resemblance to monkeys/flat face etc, just all huge turn offs.



I can relate to this, as I used to feel this way. When I was somewhat less experienced, Pokemon [as you might guess] were the only thing that interested me in any way, sexual or otherwise. As I was somewhat introverted and also somewhat seperated socially from my peers at the time, there really was nothing else to distract me from it. 

Later on I became popular in an online game community for being a skilled player and got the chance to socialise. I picked up some social skills and started translating them into real life. I'd had previous sexual experience from when I was much younger and I started to pick up some more mature experience and even a couple of friends.


I started to use the resources of the Internet to try and define myself, find out the breadth of any interests I didn't know I had yet, all the while trying to sharpen my skills and experience through social interaction offline and online. The merger can when I found a boyfriend in the fandom largely based on his original character. We met in real life and it was a pretty fun week. 

Take it slow. Try and experience everything you can. Learn more about yourself. Then use it in real life. You'd be surprised what can come to you with time and focus.


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## Piroshki (Feb 17, 2012)

I don't really like the use of the word hobby either, but it's for a petty, nit-picky reason. Either way, I can't really imagine what a 'furry lifestyle' would entail. Maybe it would be a lifestyle if someone fursuits 'round the clock, draws furries or makes suits for income, spends all their time with other furries and organizing furry events and whatnot, which I don't doubt some people do. I don't think rubbing off to furries makes it a way of life unless that's all you do all day.



JaguarSoul said:


> Not really, I was never attracted to human porn or people in the first place. How am I suppose to have sex experience if people are soo...icky.



I can kinda relate to this, though. What Thingymabob (you have no idea how many typos I made trying to type that,) said sounds about right.


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## Kitutal (Feb 17, 2012)

I felt the same way myself for many years, what would I want to be doing something like that with other people for? I never really saw much in the way of porn back then, furry or otherwise, so I can't comment on how I found that, but it's quite OK not to want to be intimate in that way with other people, far from uncommon even. (Or you could end up like me and just develop slower and take a little longer to find what you really like)
For what it's worth, between spending so much time on the websites, going to meets, trying to draw, looking at others' pictures... this is taking up rather more of my time than any other hobby I've ever had. In a sense, it isn't even one hobby, but a few sort of loosely bound together by the fact that some of the same people enjoy others of them. That's the real problem here, it's not a hobby, but a group of people that like the same hobbies, not everyone likes all of them, but enough that we're sort of in it together and talk about them together whilst still being disconnected enough to argue about it a lot. If most of someone's hobbies are connected in some way to the fandom, it can seem like it is the biggest part of their life.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 17, 2012)

Thingymabob said:


> Well, what someone does on their own is their own business. Unless it's starting to affect those around him, let the fella wank it to animal people and feel like they are a special snowflake.


thats one thing I dont like the "its not hurting anyone else" thing folks use
it may not be hurting ANYONE else, but still will damage the person themselves


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## Keeroh (Feb 17, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> thats one thing I dont like the "its not hurting anyone else" thing folks use
> it may not be hurting ANYONE else, but still will damage the person themselves



Unless they are a minor, they have a right to be as self-damaging as they want. It's their body. Another person has no right to say that they should or should not do something to their own self. It sucks to witness, but it's not yours to police.


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## Captain Howdy (Feb 17, 2012)

I wasn't aware ANYONE said that this furry hobby is a hobby to -everyone-, and not a passionate thing for others.


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## lupinealchemist (Feb 17, 2012)

The big problem about this hobby is it attracts the worst kinds of sexual deviants. I clearly hope that OP doesn't plan on mating with animals.


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## Heimdal (Feb 17, 2012)

I don't understand OPs writing example. I see writing as a possible lifestyle, as it has many uses and is a fully versatile form of self-expression. "Furry" is just a muse, and I would see a furry artist more as having art as their lifestyle.

If you are referring to 'lifestyle' interchangeably with 'obsession', then sure, that fits too, but it's brutally unhealthy. Consider the phrase, "a lifestyle in fantasy". That's what it is. It's not just inspired by fantasy, it's dependent on it. Does that sound healthy at all?

On the topic of furry sexual interests... Furries do not exist. Has it occurred to you that this is a very serious social problem you have? You can live without sex, and that's fine, but this sounds more like you're not a little different... You're completely fucked up. You need to identify the exact nature of the issue. If you're non-sexual in some way, then what you think won't apply to the majority of people; if you have a skewed or obsession-based attraction to something, then your advice can be damaging to other people.


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## triage (Feb 17, 2012)

oh god my sides


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## Verin Asper (Feb 17, 2012)

Thingymabob said:


> Unless they are a minor, they have a right to be as self-damaging as they want. It's their body. Another person has no right to say that they should or should not do something to their own self. It sucks to witness, but it's not yours to police.


and thus why folks learn of someone they know kill themselves feel bad, cause they COULD of done something to prevent the self-destruction but by your reasons they shouldnt, it wasnt their problem that they could of help said person not get worst to the point they killed themselves.

Yes by all means its not our problem, it doesnt change that we can still gawd damn help the person before it DOES become a problem to others if not an even worst situation for said person.

Its always why I hate "its not your problem" excuse folks use, they rather wait till it is a problem to others to deal with it


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## Heimdal (Feb 17, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> and thus why folks learn of someone they know kill themselves feel bad, cause they COULD of done something to prevent the self-destruction but by your reasons they shouldnt, it wasnt their problem that they could of help not get worst.



Yup. And same reason you tell someone with the flu to go home, because illnesses spread. Mental illnesses too.


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## Keeroh (Feb 17, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> and thus why folks learn of someone they know kill themselves feel bad, cause they COULD of done something to prevent the self-destruction but by your reasons they shouldnt, it wasnt their problem that they could of help not get worst.



People feel bad no matter how someone dies. With suicide, however, there's nobody to blame but the person who killed themselves- so people either take the blame upon themselves, or of someone who made them feel like shit. Nobody ever wants to say "Oh well, he offed himself. That's sad, but at the end of the day it was their choice." 
You can and should _offer_ help if someone asks for it, but if someone truly wants to go so far as to end their life,  that's up to them. More often than not, they will take themselves to an extreme and will have a revelation and find a way to help themselves out of that dark place. If they don't, well, their self destructive tendencies are out of the gene pool.


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## Dreaming (Feb 17, 2012)

Here's a better way of putting it, ''It's a hobby for the majority of the fandom''. 




JaguarSoul said:


> Well its a sexuality to some. I for instance am not attracted to people but the only thing to get me sexually excited is furry porn.
> 
> So how is it not a sexuaity type?
> 
> I am sure there are others like me.



No.


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## Sar (Feb 17, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Well its a sexuality to some. I for instance am not attracted to people but the only thing to get me sexually excited is furry porn.
> 
> So how is it not a sexuaity type?
> 
> I am sure there are others like me.


Well, you cant really have sex with something that doesent exist.


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## oddeofreq (Feb 17, 2012)

i like to think of bein furry as a state of mind.  I know that i am human but sometimes i have animal like tendencies and i have thoughts of my furry self doing something that only my furry self can do in certain situations (like ear twitching, tail wagging, dropping on all fours and sprinting.)


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## CannonFodder (Feb 17, 2012)

oddeofreq said:


> i like to think of bein furry as a state of mind.  I know that i am human but sometimes i have animal like tendencies and i have thoughts of my furry self doing something that only my furry self can do in certain situations (like ear twitching, tail wagging, dropping on all fours and sprinting.)


I think you need help.


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## BRN (Feb 17, 2012)

oddeofreq said:


> i like to think of bein furry as a state of mind.  I know that i am human but sometimes i have animal like tendencies and i have thoughts of my furry self doing something that only my furry self can do in certain situations (like ear twitching, tail wagging, dropping on all fours and sprinting.)



When you say you have thoughts of your furry self doing things only he can do, do you mean you have thoughts of yourself doing them, or just imagine the scenario? Can you explain that a bit?


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## Aidy (Feb 17, 2012)

oddeofreq said:


> i like to think of bein furry as a state of mind.  I know that i am human but sometimes i have animal like tendencies and i have thoughts of my furry self doing something that only my furry self can do in certain situations (like ear twitching, tail wagging, dropping on all fours and sprinting.)



I know a great counsellor you can chat to.


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## mirepoix (Feb 17, 2012)

Oh my gracious.  The furry community is a lot more cynical than I was anticipating.  This... this is awesome.

For content, is it wrong to think that being furry can mean whatever the hell you want it to mean?  Either otherkin, or phantom limbs or just touchin' yourself to Robin Hood 34, is it too much to just let people do what they want to do?  It all boils down to personal preference and opinion, and everyone is entitled to one of their own.  I don't think pointing fingers and calling out others' lifestyles is going to get us anywhere as a whole.


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## Kitutal (Feb 17, 2012)

Hey, I used to have an imaginary pet cat that I used to imagine doing stuff around me. Thinking of stuff that might happen but isn't going to in the real world can be fun, just so long as you don't take it too far and try to force others to see what you're imagining. (except from a couple of close and understanding friends that might be willing to play along, perhaps)
And of course, there's no knowing this is a permenant thing. I used to think and believe and imagine all sorts of things as a teenager, I think really I was much worse than this, I just didn't express it in public so much, but I turned out OK.


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## Drakonman (Feb 17, 2012)

GUYS THIS ISINT A HOBBY ITS A WAY OF LIFE! :V


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## Aetius (Feb 17, 2012)

Sarukai said:


> Well, you cant really have sex with something that doesent exist.



...then on the 8th day, God created BD.


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## SiLJinned (Feb 17, 2012)

oddeofreq said:


> i like to think of bein furry as a state of mind.  I know that i am human but sometimes i have animal like tendencies and i have thoughts of my furry self doing something that only my furry self can do in certain situations (like ear twitching, tail wagging, dropping on all fours and sprinting.)



Are you sure that's not your front tail wagging :V?


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## CynicalCirno (Feb 17, 2012)

Whether a person is furry or not, a writer is a writer. Your example is pretty invalid. Writing a lot doesn't make you a hardcore furry, it makes you a hardcore writer.

I can't understand why people say it's a way of life. It isn't a religion. You still work, pay taxes, drive, study, speak - the only different thing is what you do on your spare time, and well... that's called a hobby.


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## LizardKing (Feb 17, 2012)

Satellite One said:


> I can't understand why people say it's a way of life. It isn't a religion. You still work



at bad dragon



Satellite One said:


> pay taxes



under the name Wolfblade Darkpaw



Satellite One said:


> drive



in a car with paw decals and fake fur interior



Satellite One said:


> study



the best materials for making animal dildos



Satellite One said:


> speak



entirely in barks, growls, roars and howls

and eat raw steak in a bowl on the floor while on hands and knees

and poop in a litter box


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## NEStalgia Fox (Feb 17, 2012)

People obviously disagree with your disagreement.


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## TreacleFox (Feb 17, 2012)

Furry has more of a culture then any other 'hobby' I have ever heard of. It could easly mean diffrent things to diffrent people.


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## Armaetus (Feb 17, 2012)

It is and will _never_ be considered a lifestyle to me, I don't integrate furry stuff into my EVERYDAY life, and neither should you OP.


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## Kitutal (Feb 17, 2012)

it's not a hobby, though. writing is a hobby, looking at pictures is a hobby, hanging out with friends is a hobby. just so happens that I have a few hobbies that are associated with this 'furry' thing, same as many other people.


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## BRN (Feb 18, 2012)

I, in fact, fail to see what part of furry could possibly be considered a hobby, even if I can't see why it's a lifestyle. Writing, drawing, sculpting, rendering? Hobbies of _their own accord _- fursuiting? A hobby in itself. Conventioneering? Socialising, hardly a hobby.


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## FlynnCoyote (Feb 18, 2012)

It is the specific nature of those things that cause them to be thought of as hobbies in and of themselves apart from the generalization. 

But you do raise a valid point. Some people do take this far too seriously. I wouldn't refer to it as a hobby at all. It's an interest.


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## Andy Dingo Wolf (Feb 18, 2012)

It is still a hobby, my good man/person


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## FlynnCoyote (Feb 18, 2012)

Andy Dingo Wolf said:


> It is still a hobby, my good man/person



Man is correct.  

But as Six said, every aspect of this "hobby" is covered by a more general field. From all forms of art to cosplay and conventions. None of these are restricted to furry, so it is a requirement that a specific interest be there first. The term "Furry" should be a prefix for these hobbies, not the name of the hobby itself if this is the case. 

For example, "I like Furry" tells me fuck all about what you do with it. "I like Furry drawings" or "I like Furry cosplay" gives far more explanation. 

Obligatory wink?


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## Kitutal (Feb 18, 2012)

Serpion5 said:


> Man is correct.
> 
> But as Six said, every aspect of this "hobby" is covered by a more general field. From all forms of art to cosplay and conventions. None of these are restricted to furry, so it is a requirement that a specific interest be there first. The term "Furry" should be a prefix for these hobbies, not the name of the hobby itself if this is the case.
> 
> ...



Exactly, it's like one of those franchise things where you get books and TV programs and toys and games and everything about the same set of characters.
And this is where furry code comes in useful: FFD2acdw and so on, tells you a lot about these specific hobbies and such like


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## FlynnCoyote (Feb 18, 2012)

And on a whim, I solve one of the greatest issues of the internet!  :V


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## TreacleFox (Feb 18, 2012)

Furry can mean personally to you OP, whatever you want it to.
To most it is a fandom though, I believe.


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## Lunar (Feb 18, 2012)

Not gonna read the rest of the posts 'cause I'm a lazy bitch.  OP, this is something you keep your thoughts to yourself about.  If you're a furry, people both in the fandom and outside of it kind of already assume to a certain degree that you look at anthro porn.  Bawwing about the fact that no one seems to have said anything about what you fap to, really makes for a shit thread and a shit intro to forums like these.


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## Mentova (Feb 18, 2012)

This thread makes me want to throw my computer out the window.


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## Ames (Feb 18, 2012)

Mentova said:


> This thread makes me want to throw my computer out the window.



This thread makes me want to cover myself in vegetable oil and crawl around the kitchen floor like a giant slug.


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## Kellie Gator (Feb 18, 2012)

Ad Hoc said:


> I think you might want to consider discussing this with a therapist. There's nothing with having a furry kink but if it's to the exclusion of having any interest in actual humans, you might be in a bit of trouble.


I don't see how this is a bad thing, the world's overpopulated enough as it is!


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## Brazen (Feb 18, 2012)

>See thread title

Well, I guess this is worth a re-

>Started By JaguarSoul


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## Verin Asper (Feb 18, 2012)

Kellie Gator said:


> I don't see how this is a bad thing, the world's overpopulated enough as it is!


in truth its not, we just havent properly prepared for this population nor have we adapted our ways to support such a number.


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## Xash (Feb 18, 2012)

im a lifestyler furry and i fully agree with you. its really annoying hearing people call it a hobby


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## Armaetus (Feb 18, 2012)

Xash said:


> im a lifestyler furry and i fully agree with you. its really annoying hearing people call it a hobby



I'm sorry, but it is. What exactly do YOU add to your everyday life that is furry?


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## TreacleFox (Feb 18, 2012)

The definition of lifestyle is:



			
				Dictionary.com said:
			
		

> the habits, attitudes, tastes, moral standards, economic level, etc., that together constitute the mode of living of an individual or group.



I have seen the fandom effect these characteristics in many people.


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## Lazykins (Feb 18, 2012)

Xash said:


> im a lifestyler furry and i fully agree with you. its really annoying hearing people call it a hobby



Hate to break it to you, but it's a *hobby*. Want to know why? Because its a *hobby* that people decide to have as a *hobby* because its a *hobby *that as *hobbyists* they can enjoy as a *hobby*.

Because a* hobby* by definition is an activity regularly done in one's leisure time for pleasure. And that's what you're doing, Mr.Lifestyler. Just a* hobby*.

What makes a Lifestyler so different? Do you run around in fursuits cursing the fact you were born into a fleshy body, claiming that you're the spirit of some animal trapped within a human shell? Do you only eat, breath, and sleep furry? What constitutes a Lifestyling Furry I ask. Because no matter what you say, it's going to sound like a *hobby* that you're simply investing way too much time into to the point of it becoming an obsession.

Here's a drinking game by the way: Take a shot for every time I said* hobby*. Hope you have ten glasses ready.


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## Ariosto (Feb 18, 2012)

TreacleFox said:


> The definition of lifestyle is:
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen the fandom effect these characteristics in many people.



Lizardking's post in the last page inevitably comes to mind >.>


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## TreacleFox (Feb 19, 2012)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> Lizardking's post in the last page inevitably comes to mind >.>



A lifestyler would indeed have diffrent attitudes, tastes, prehaps moral standered, ect then a 'normal' person.
LK said things about learning, transportation, paying taxes, and other legal stuff that obviously anyone in most country's would have to do. Does this mean that everyone in all of America has only 1 lifestyle?


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## Ariosto (Feb 19, 2012)

TreacleFox said:


> A lifestyler would indeed have diffrent attitudes, tastes, prehaps moral standered, ect then a 'normal' person.
> LK said things about learning, transportation, paying taxes, and other legal stuff that obviously anyone in most country's would have to do. Does this mean that everyone in all of America has only 1 lifestyle?



I was mainly refering to the ridiculous images the words "furry lifestyler" bring to mind, much like any other fandom taken too far would. No, nobody has the same lifestyle as other people.

I think our main problem comes from the fact most of us see furry as something extremely minor without properly formed ideas, points of view and aesthetic choices. Yes, we like anthros, cool, but beyond that, what? Like most have pointed out, furry itself is already covered by a big range of more general activities, and the specialization it brings is just too shallow to be taken with a straight face. An artist has a lifestyle, and he has formed a philosophy that manifests itself through his art. In this case, what could a furry artist bring to the table aside from anthros? And even then he can be defined in more general styles, none of them related to "furry" specifically. You CAN make the anthros in your work have a purpose, but then what in a furry would justify it aside from "I don't want this to come as merely cool". Words-more-words-less, furry just isn't deep or complex enough a "thing-you-like"* to actually center your life around it.

But perhaps you could bring a few relevant examples? What does furry have that other fandoms don't? Its main element of attraction simply appears in many other fandoms without an specific purpose. 

*Pardon my lack of knowledge of this particular term of the English language.

EDIT: 
If any writer/artist/musician is reading this... how do you integrate anthros in your artistic philsophy? Do you just put them because you like them? Do you try to look for a reason to do it? How would you develop "furry" as an aesthetic choice/school of actual merit?


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## FlynnCoyote (Feb 19, 2012)

> If any writer/artist/musician is reading this... how do you integrate anthros in your artistic philsophy? Do you just put them because you like them? Do you try to look for a reason to do it? How would you develop "furry" as an aesthetic choice/school of actual merit?



I write about anthros because it gives me more flexibility to use plotwise as well as holding greater personal interest than just using human characters all the time. I don't write exclusively furry, but I do enjoy it to a higher degree. 

As I was saying before, it just comes back to what interests the individual.


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## Kellie Gator (Feb 19, 2012)

Serpion5 said:


> I write about anthros because it gives me more flexibility to use plotwise as well as holding greater personal interest than just using human characters all the time. I don't write exclusively furry, but I do enjoy it to a higher degree.
> 
> As I was saying before, it just comes back to what interests the individual.


This is loldumb. You can write pretty much anything with the use of human characters and if anything, furry characters (characters created by furries) aren't really anthropomorphic animals most of the time, they're just hairy humans.


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## Ariosto (Feb 19, 2012)

Serpion5 said:


> I write about anthros because it gives me more flexibility to use plotwise as well as holding greater personal interest than just using human characters all the time.



May I ask why? I'm actually interested in listening to your reasons.


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## Deo (Feb 19, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> So I think it is extremely wrong to scream Furry is a hobby at everyone because its not a hobby for everyone. For some people, myself included, it is a passion and it is a way of life. So there  is no need to constantrly scream this out and attack any newcomer who take Furry more seriously than you because it is not the same for everyone.


None of us claim to speak on behalf of all furries. Our opinions on furry being a hobby are our own and we are completely free to vocalize them on this public forum as we see fit. You have no right to censor us or make demands about what we say or how we view our furry hobby.
As  for it being a life, I think you need to broaden your horizons, get out  and socialize more, and find more enriching ways to spend your time.


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## Commiecomrade (Feb 19, 2012)

I read this title and was immediately like "AW SHIT NEWFAG WHAT ARE YOU DOING?"

Everyone can take their hobbies too far. For most hobbies it's taking time out of your real life and painting figurines or collecting dildos or something. For the furry fandom it's considering this hobby a lifestyle.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 19, 2012)

I can understand being a Greenfreak (Person who is heavy on recycling and trying to leave a small carbon footprint and the such) being a lifestyle
I can never figure out how furry can become one


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## Xash (Feb 19, 2012)

Lazykins said:


> Hate to break it to you, but it's a *hobby*. Want to know why? Because its a *hobby* that people decide to have as a *hobby* because its a *hobby *that as *hobbyists* they can enjoy as a *hobby*.
> 
> Because a* hobby* by definition is an activity regularly done in one's leisure time for pleasure. And that's what you're doing, Mr.Lifestyler. Just a* hobby*.
> 
> ...



fudgin' hell dude take a pill and calm the fudge down. a hobby is something you do in your spare time. a lifestyle is a lifestyle. plain and simple. not all of us are hobbyists


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## oddeofreq (Feb 19, 2012)

SIX said:


> When you say you have thoughts of your furry self doing things only he can do, do you mean you have thoughts of yourself doing them, or just imagine the scenario? Can you explain that a bit?


as in sometimes when i show up somewhere and i am feeling very energetic and i am excited, i can imagine myself (if i was an anthro) running around on all fours.  in real life i just chill-out.  some times i get bummed and (if i had the ears) i would let them drop as part of my expression.


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## Armaetus (Feb 19, 2012)

Xesh You have not answered my question. What do you add to your everyday life to make it furry?


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## Teal (Feb 19, 2012)

I have the same question as Glaice, so Xash answer it for us.


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## Antonin Scalia (Feb 19, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> I can understand being a Greenfreak (Person who is heavy on recycling and trying to leave a small carbon footprint and the such) being a lifestyle
> I can never figure out how furry can become one


Start by groping people in a fursuit, then complain to the internet that people hate you


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## Verin Asper (Feb 19, 2012)

Xash said:


> fudgin' hell dude take a pill and calm the fudge down. a hobby is something you do in your spare time. a lifestyle is a lifestyle. plain and simple. not all of us are hobbyists


Then explain to me how is it a lifestyle for you, do be the gawd damn first on FAF of all the folks who throw around "its a lifestyle to me" actually explain how you add furry to your EVERYDAY LIFE OF EVERY SECOND


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## Lazykins (Feb 19, 2012)

Xash said:


> fudgin' hell dude take a pill and calm the fudge down. a hobby is something you do in your spare time. a lifestyle is a lifestyle. plain and simple. not all of us are hobbyists



It's called sarcasm and intentionally egging you on.

Because you aren't supporting your claim with any evidence as to how a furry lifestyle isn't any different from a hobby.

Methinks you and the OP just wish to be special little snowflakes.


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## green wolf (Feb 19, 2012)

Ad Hoc said:


> I think you might want to consider discussing this with a therapist. There's nothing with having a furry kink but if it's to the exclusion of having any interest in actual humans, you might be in a bit of trouble.



well, I can put it like this. for me its a hobby. but i can see where  others may embrace the more fetished realm of furry fandom. its really a  matter of how far a person wishes to take it.

  now if non existant or 2  dimensional images are all that you relate to sexually, please get help!

my 2 cents


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## Lunar (Feb 19, 2012)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> EDIT:
> If any writer/artist/musician is reading this... how do you integrate anthros in your artistic philsophy? Do you just put them because you like them? Do you try to look for a reason to do it? How would you develop "furry" as an aesthetic choice/school of actual merit?


I don't really use furries in my writing.  I can write about humans and I'm much better at using words like "lips", "hands", "fuck", as opposed to "muzzle", "paws", and "yiff", respectively.  It just feels too weird.  But I can't draw humans worth a damn.


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## Trpdwarf (Feb 19, 2012)

You know it seems to me that the whole "Furry Lifestyler" thing is little more than a badge some people wear to make themselves seem more important than other furries. It is a superficial attempt at superiority to say "Well I'm more furry than the rest of you!" not unlike when two sports fans get into it over who is more hard-core. Keep in mind this is nothing more than my own opinion and my personal perception on the matter.

At the end of the day I personally push "It is just a hobby" because I dislike the idea of people trying to one-up another on "who is more furry" and experience in the fandom has taught me that getting too obsessed with it is generally a very bad idea and it doesn't end well. If you really really want to enjoy the furry fandom for an extended period of time treat it like hobby or you will burn yourself out.


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## Ozriel (Feb 19, 2012)

My morale dropped -20 when I read this thread.

Lifestylers are just people who need a hobby badly and makes it their life...all of the time because they (may) not have anything socially going for them so they need to take something to make them seem better or more special than the rest of mundane society because "THEY R FURRY".


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## Spatel (Feb 20, 2012)

SIX said:


> Also, you'll find that once you gain more sexual experience, humans do become more attractive.


Eh.... your mileage is going to vary on that one. I still find it difficult to get off without thinking about dragons at least once. This hasn't affected my relationships though. 



			
				Zeke Shadowfyre said:
			
		

> My morale dropped -20 when I read this thread.
> 
> Lifestylers are just people who need a hobby badly and makes it their  life...all of the time because they (may) not have anything socially  going for them so they need to take something to make them seem better  or more special than the rest of mundane society because "THEY R FURRY".


I have too many nerd hobbies. I play Smash Bros and  Chess competitively, I'm a CAD artist (not furry stuff), I collect  music, I make photoshops. I've seen every damn episode of Star Trek, and  I go to trek conventions and anime conventions. All this on top of having a career and relationships and friends. The last thing I need  is another nerdy hobby. I'd rather have a group of freaks to hang  out with. That's the void in my life that furries can fill. 



Ad  Hoc said:


> I think you might want to consider discussing this with a  therapist. There's nothing with having a furry kink but if it's to the  exclusion of having any interest in actual humans, you might be in a bit  of trouble.


Isn't this pathologizing asexuality though?


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## Ad Hoc (Feb 20, 2012)

Spatel said:


> Isn't this pathologizing asexuality though?


Mm, you've got a point there. 

I suppose it depends on whether or not the fella's genuinely happy with it, which of course isn't anyone's call to make but his.


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## Ozriel (Feb 20, 2012)

Spatel said:


> I have too many nerd hobbies. I play Smash Bros and  Chess competitively, I'm a CAD artist (not furry stuff), I collect  music, I make photoshops. I've seen every damn episode of Star Trek, and  I go to trek conventions and anime conventions. All this on top of having a career and relationships and friends. The last thing I need  is another nerdy hobby. I'd rather have a group of freaks to hang  out with. That's the void in my life that furries can fill.



Congrats, you are on the "normal" spectrum of nerddom. :V You win a soda! :3


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## BRN (Feb 20, 2012)

Spatel said:


> Eh.... your mileage is going to vary on that one. I still find it difficult to get off without thinking about dragons at least once. This hasn't affected my relationships though.


I suppose 'more attractive' might mean 'less repellant', in all honesty. I'm somewhat similar.


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## Ames (Feb 20, 2012)

this thread is making my eyeballs throw up


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## Lazykins (Feb 20, 2012)

JamesB said:


> this thread is making my eyeballs throw up



The redundancy of this thread is getting us nowhere and giving me a migrain. Or it may be the fact I'm running on no sleep.

Now hold me, you spaztastical bouncing man. I need a shoulder to cry on.


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## Aetius (Feb 20, 2012)

JamesB said:


> this thread is making my eyeballs throw up



I already tore mine out from the last Den Thread.


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## Heimdal (Feb 20, 2012)

After seeing the dictionary definition someone posted, yes furry can be a lifestyle. It is a terrible lifestyle, however. These are people who take an interest or hobby, and turn it into something more out of total obsession. There is no healthy reason to turn it into a lifestyle... It doesn't have any notable benefits to it that you don't get from it just being a hobby. It has plenty of pitfalls to it tho, I don't have the time or desire to list them all.

Alcoholism is a lifestyle too.

Obviously not all lifestyles are bad, but this one is. The is no good reason to be a proud furry lifestyler, it's just sad and misguided. Kinda like being a hipster, except hipsters are socially presentable.


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## Stratto the Hawk (Feb 20, 2012)

That feel when I come back into The Den despite my better judgement and find a thread like this.


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## Mentova (Feb 20, 2012)

Spatel said:


> Eh.... your mileage is going to vary on that one. I still find it difficult to get off without thinking about dragons at least once. This hasn't affected my relationships though.


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## Fay V (Feb 20, 2012)

Heimdal said:


> After seeing the dictionary definition someone posted, yes furry can be a lifestyle. It is a terrible lifestyle, however. These are people who take an interest or hobby, and turn it into something more out of total obsession. There is no healthy reason to turn it into a lifestyle... It doesn't have any notable benefits to it that you don't get from it just being a hobby. It has plenty of pitfalls to it tho, I don't have the time or desire to list them all.
> 
> Alcoholism is a lifestyle too.
> 
> Obviously not all lifestyles are bad, but this one is. The is no good reason to be a proud furry lifestyler, it's just sad and misguided. Kinda like being a hipster, except hipsters are socially presentable.



I think it can be perfectly healthy, in general however it isn't a natural lifestyle, and so it is an unhealthy obsession. There is a difference if an artist is good enough to make a lot of money off furry, and happens to have furry friends and enjoy cons and whatever. Something like that can develop naturally and should they choose to do something else it could just become a hobby again. But this obsession and trying to force the hobby you enjoy into a lifestyle that's unhealthy and stunts personal growth.


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## Spatel (Feb 21, 2012)

I think people are exaggerating the implications that "lifestyler" actually entails. Being a hippy or a punk is an 'alternative lifestyle'. Being gay is an 'alternative lifestyle'. Being in the BDSM community is an alternative lifestyle as well. It merely means being part of a subculture that has different values from mainstream society. It can be based on common interests, fetishes, sexual orientation/gender identity. For fuck's sake being an atheist is considered an alternative lifestyle in the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_lifestyle

You're acting like lifestyle means a closet obsession, when that's totally not the case. The main difference between a hobby and an alternative lifestyle is that a hobby is an activity that has a tangible goal, like drawing, building, and a lifestyle is a more nebulous affiliation with a community that has a subculture. It's the difference between liking motorcycles and collecting/repairing them, versus being in a biker gang.


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## Cchytale Murilega (Feb 21, 2012)

JaguarSoul said:


> Yeah I agree its messed up but thats how I am I guess. I dont have any normal function, I am 25 and never had a GF because I have only been attracted to non existant creatures since I can remember. Once I got the internet when I was like 12 and starting puberty, I was already looking for fantasy creature porn and was elated when I discovered the furry fandom because before then I would just pleasure myself to G rated pictures :/
> 
> So for me its a part of me thats more than a hobby.



Good lord you sound totally like me...

But anyway, I am one of those who treats it as a hobby, like any other.


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## The_Mask (Feb 21, 2012)

Huh...Well this is, uh, interesting. I will tell you what it is: it is a subculture. Now generally this means a particular hobby or activity has a large community built around it, and actively seeks a minority style. A subversion from what is "normal". In some cases members of subcultures become drawn entirely away from normality, and envelop themselves in the subculture only. This would be our lifestylers. I've noticed in the, eh, "discussion" y'all have been having, that neither party (lifestylers and hobbyists) are actually explaining what it is that differentiates the two. So for some clarification, here is a pair of lists.
Hobbyists:

Passive to active members of the subculture
Participate by creating goods relevant to the subculture, or by providing relevant services (I'm going to include suiting and other performances here)
Purchase said goods and services
Communication relevant to the subculture is casual, and on occasion immersive
Attend meetups and conventions relevant to the subculture to express interest
Lifestylers:

Active to Immersive members of the subculture
Do the same things as hobbyists, in addition to the below
Participate by creating a role relevant to the subculture, and applying it to their life. In the case of furries:
Taking on animal-like traits on a daily basis, such as noises, movement, food consumption methods
Wear clothing accessories on a daily basis generally intended for animals
Interacting with others in a manner generally attributed to animals

Create goods and services relevant to the roles they have applied to the subculture
Purchase said goods and services
Communication relevant to the subculture is immersive and often times serious
Now then, some people are on some middle ground here, but that's how this whole business works. These two overly-simplified templates mix and meld in a way that strengthens the subculture and provides a complete immersion to those who seek it. Anywho, the point is you're all wrong/right. There is not really a black and white here, it's mostly shades of gray. Granted most of us are closer to the hobby shade of gray, and we tend to get defensive when somebody closer to the lifestyle shade pops their head up.

Now commence pointing out how I made a mockery of myself.


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## DarrylWolf (Feb 21, 2012)

It's a hobby, yes but it's not one you can get out of really easily. It's a hobby that you carry with you for a long time, just like following a certain sports team or watching a certain band play.


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## Namba (Feb 21, 2012)

It's a lifestyle, guys. I'm born this way and can't help it. I have this genetic disorder that causes me to be sexually attracted to animals and behave like an animal and would appreciate it if people would just leave me alone about it, jeez.
:V (Normally I don't use a :V, but I'm amazed at how seriously people take these posts.)


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## Dreaming (Feb 21, 2012)

DarrylWolf said:


> It's a hobby, yes but it's not one you can get out of really easily. It's a hobby that you carry with you for a long time, just like following a certain sports team or watching a certain band play.


Are you saying that we can't drop the label and disassociate ourselves from the fandom, within a second?

Seems easy enough. Heck, if I wanted to, I could drop my association with the fandom right now. And, heck, as far as I and anyone else would be concerned, I'd no longer be a Furry. 

Dropping the hobby itself may be trickier for some people. Dropping your association with and dropping the use of the term Furry is as easy as.


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## Metalmeerkat (Feb 22, 2012)

If your lifestyle is wrapped around a hobby, furry or not, then it sounds like you don't have much of a life. Unlike in marriage, seeking extra action outside of your hobby relationship isn't frowned upon. Multiple hobbies = okay. Multiple hubbies = bad. Remember this distinction.


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## DarrylWolf (Feb 22, 2012)

Dreaming said:


> Are you saying that we can't drop the label and disassociate ourselves from the fandom, within a second?
> 
> Seems easy enough. Heck, if I wanted to, I could drop my association with the fandom right now. And, heck, as far as I and anyone else would be concerned, I'd no longer be a Furry.
> 
> Dropping the hobby itself may be trickier for some people. Dropping your association with and dropping the use of the term Furry is as easy as.



I've seen it happen with other hobbies, and even other lifestyles.

"I used to follow such and such sports team but then they traded certain good on and off the court player for a ball-hogging asshole and they don't play well anymore. So I'm not watching them anymore."
"I really enjoyed telling people I traveled here from a certain country but then my patriotism was called into question when their leader declared war on the country I currently live in. It will be a while before I say I'm from that country again."
"I used to be an avid hunter then I got sent to the hospital when someone accidentally shot me on a hunting trip."
"I followed that band but then they sold out and started writing crap so they suck now."

Can the same thing happen for Furries, or a member of any fandom? Yes. Is it likely? Not particularly but it does happen.


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## Kitutal (Feb 22, 2012)

I could leave any time I want... really I could... I'd prove it, but I just don't want to right now.
I'm struggling to think of it as a hobby myself, it's just too disjointed, how can drawing cartoon porn and throwing a frizbee around the park with friends be related parts of one hobby? It's... well, not anything at all, so far as I can tell, there's the problem, furry doesn't exist, we all ascribe to it, but in the end, it's just a word and we all do whatever we want regardless.
Then again 'hobby' and 'lifestyle' are words too, they can mean any number of different things to different people, depending on how you use them, on what you want them to mean at the time. as a result there is this huge overlap between different people's interpretations of what either one means to them.
Or something.


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## Hakar Kerarmor (Feb 22, 2012)

DarrylWolf said:


> Can the same thing happen for Furries, or a member of any fandom? Yes. Is it likely? Not particularly but it does happen.



So why is it unlikely?


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## Lazykins (Feb 22, 2012)

Hakar Kerarmor said:


> So why is it unlikely?



Clearly because he says so. Therefore it's such a major troof. :V

But yeah no, people deciding to stop wading around in this gigantically shallow cesspool we call the Fur Fandom is as likely as anything else. It's only unlikely if the person in question's having too much fun yanking it out to the terrabytes of bestially depraved pornography to think otherwise.


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## BRN (Feb 22, 2012)

Lazykins said:


> It's only unlikely if the person in question's having too much fun yanking it out to the terrabytes of bestially depraved pornography to think otherwise.



Not really. Furry's just a community, and even someone deep in porn can decide that they can find better company elsewhere, or develop a new interest that takes them anyway from the fandom. That won't change their sexual interests, but such things are hardly a part of being in the fandom, nor a cause or even a 'symptom' of.


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## Armaetus (Feb 22, 2012)

I still have gotten no response from Xash (and maybe  JaguarSoul, the OP) on his so-called one upping on his lifestyling to us. I ask again: What do you add to your everyday life to make it furry?

If you don't answer, I will consider you arrogant and just boasting to make yourself feel better and superior over hobbyists because JS did.


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## Lazykins (Feb 22, 2012)

SIX said:


> Not really. Furry's just a community, and even someone deep in porn can decide that they can find better company elsewhere, or develop a new interest that takes them anyway from the fandom. That won't change their sexual interests, but such things are hardly a part of being in the fandom, nor a cause or even a 'symptom' of.



Sarcasm, my dear Watson. Sarcasm.


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## BRN (Feb 22, 2012)

Lazykins said:


> Sarcasm, my dear Watson. Sarcasm.



If you say so, although you "but yeah, no'd" the :v you already had in there and sounded pretty passionate for a sarcastic statement.


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## Spatel (Feb 23, 2012)

Some people just use the cover of trolling to vent their shitty opinions without being judged.


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## Calemeyr (Feb 23, 2012)

I disagree with "Its a way of life" people.

Here's a question: how can furry be a lifestyle if there isn't a clear definition of what furry is? If the definition varies from person to person, then having furry as a "lifestyle" essentially means you've created your own lifestyle...which isn't really a "way" since there is no discernable pattern connecting you to other people. In essence, you are trying too hard to be different, trying too hard to stand out in the crowd. You gotta (mostly) go with the flow people. If you try to swim against the current, all you'll end up doing is drowning. Sure, there may be a few successful "salmon" out there, but, remember, there are more failures than successes. 

Honestly, is your statement of individuality going to leave a lasting impact on other people, leading them to follow or accept you, or will they shun you for being socially awkward? The individuals who stood out and had a lasting impact were those who had something to share with the rest of us, something new and exciting, not creepy pictures of naked hermaphroditic foxes literally impregnating themselves.

Remember: if the "lifestyle" gets to a point where it interferes with your function in society, it is maladaptive and unsuitable as a lifestyle. I'm not saying you can't have spiritual involvement--believe what you want to believe. I'm saying just don't go around jabbering like some subway station loon about weird sexual perversions for magic animal people from a work of fiction.

However, I am not saying for you to blindly follow others either. You have to find balance between individualism and "going with the flow." A "middle path," if you will. Just downplay the "I'm super special magical powerful and fuck you for saying otherwise."

Unless of course there is a pattern. Then it is a lifestyle...of course...that doesn't make the lifestyle anymore legitimate.


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## Commiecomrade (Feb 23, 2012)

I'll believe furry, taken to extremes, can be a lifestyle as soon as we call people who collect the fuck out of model trains and think it's the only thing they do a lifestyle.

Because both are just hobbies taken way too far.


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## DarrylWolf (Feb 23, 2012)

Hakar Kerarmor said:


> So why is it unlikely?



The joys of collecting new conbadges, meeting new and interesting people, and hanging out with a group of artistic misfits is just very difficult to leave. But it does happen, mostly because of what is called "drama" in the fandom, but I think most people who complain about that really ought to learn how to take insults and jokes and not be provoked by them. Hell, I've been called many things on this forum and I'm old enough not to care too much about what others think of me.


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## Verin Asper (Feb 23, 2012)

Spatel said:


> Some people just use the cover of trolling to vent their shitty opinions without being judged.


and I dislike folks who think my form of venting my I know for a damn fact crappy opinions as trolling.


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## Criminal Scum (Feb 23, 2012)

I, for one, agree with you, OP. Being a bucket isn't something I just decided out of the blue. This is who I've always been. As a small child I've always loved to just _hold things._ It was hard to tell my parents I am a bucket- not _physically, _but spiritually. They didn't believe me at first, but eventually I was thrown out of the house with nothing but my 37 bucket-porn magazines.

I hope someday, when genetic research advances more I can finally be myself. I hope someday I can finally be a bucket.


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## Ozriel (Feb 23, 2012)

Glaice said:


> I still have gotten no response from Xash (and maybe  JaguarSoul, the OP) on his so-called one upping on his lifestyling to us. I ask again: What do you add to your everyday life to make it furry?
> 
> If you don't answer, I will consider you arrogant and just boasting to make yourself feel better and superior over hobbyists because JS did.



I am starting to think that Sofurry's garbage is leaking into FAF to get back at our prommies here that "troll" them. :V


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## Spatel (Feb 23, 2012)

Marcus Stormchaser said:


> I disagree with "Its a way of life" people.
> 
> Here's a question: how can furry be a lifestyle if there isn't a clear definition of what furry is? If the definition varies from person to person, then having furry as a "lifestyle" essentially means you've created your own lifestyle...


Furry isn't a lifestyle for all furries, that's how. Lifestylers are a subset.

If you think you're permanently a furry, whether or not you identify as one publicly and associate with other furries, and whether or not you participate in any activities within the furry subculture... if you feel that you're programmed to be a furry and nothing can change that congrats you're a lifestyler. 

There are a variety of reasons someone would feel that way.


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## Aetius (Feb 23, 2012)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> I am starting to think that Sofurry's garbage is leaking into FAF to get back at our prommies here that "troll" them. :V



Hey, at least the sofurry fucks provide us with entertainment :V


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## Ozriel (Feb 23, 2012)

Crusader Mike said:


> Hey, at least the sofurry fucks provide us with entertainment :V




Indeed, but it's rather annoying to close threads that they create that has little to no content.


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## FiiCoon (Feb 23, 2012)

Here's my incoherent two cents on this because I can't argue well.

I think furry _can_ be a lifestyle, if it encompasses your life. Like, you live as your character would if they existed. Even so, I think of it more like, a state of mind I guess? Furries are really good at ignoring each other's obvious perversions/fetishes and seeing them for the person they are (even though often times the be freaky). It like, you don't give a shit if anyone gropes you because you stopped caring. I can let furries touch my boobs because i know that to them, they're just a part of anatomy that probably won't get them off because they've seen too much porn for titties to affect them. It's like, "Hey we're a bunch of perverted nerds, and we don't give a shit about very much." At least that's how the people I've met in person act.


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## Ozriel (Feb 23, 2012)

FiiCoon said:


> Here's my incoherent two cents on this because I can't argue well.
> 
> I think furry _can_ be a lifestyle, if it encompasses your life. Like, you live as your character would if they existed. Even so, I think of it more like, a state of mind I guess? Furries are really good at ignoring each other's obvious perversions/fetishes and seeing them for the person they are (even though often times the be freaky). It like, you don't give a shit if anyone gropes you because you stopped caring. I can let furries touch my boobs because i know that to them, they're just a part of anatomy that probably won't get them off because they've seen too much porn for titties to affect them. It's like, "Hey we're a bunch of perverted nerds, and we don't give a shit about very much." At least that's how the people I've met in person act.



It's all fun and games until they give you the "bad touch". Then you loose teeth. :V


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## Mentova (Feb 23, 2012)

FiiCoon said:


> Here's my incoherent two cents on this because I can't argue well.
> 
> I think furry _can_ be a lifestyle, if it encompasses your life. Like, you live as your character would if they existed. Even so, I think of it more like, a state of mind I guess? Furries are really good at ignoring each other's obvious perversions/fetishes and seeing them for the person they are (even though often times the be freaky). It like, you don't give a shit if anyone gropes you because you stopped caring. I can let furries touch my boobs because i know that to them, they're just a part of anatomy that probably won't get them off because they've seen too much porn for titties to affect them. It's like, "Hey we're a bunch of perverted nerds, and we don't give a shit about very much." At least that's how the people I've met in person act.


For starters, if you're living like how you think your character would live, you probably have some issues and you might need to go to a therapist. For the next part... I'd be pretty pissed off if furries just randomly grabbed my junk. Being a furry does not mean "I am free to grope and play with have fun!" I don't think your group of friends are an accurate representation of the fandom as a whole. Most of the furries I've met and gotten to know do not fit your description at all. I also don't find that the lifestyle you described has anything to do with the fandom. Just because your friends are pervy and grope you does not mean being pervy and groping each other is part of the debated furry lifestyle. That's like saying you need to be a gamer too because there are furries who play games.


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## BRN (Feb 23, 2012)

FiiCoon said:


> Here's my incoherent two cents on this because I can't argue well.
> 
> I think furry _can_ be a lifestyle, if it encompasses your life. Like, you live as your character would if they existed. Even so, I think of it more like, a state of mind I guess? Furries are really good at ignoring each other's obvious perversions/fetishes and seeing them for the person they are (even though often times the be freaky). It like, you don't give a shit if anyone gropes you because you stopped caring. I can let furries touch my boobs because i know that to them, they're just a part of anatomy that probably won't get them off because they've seen too much porn for titties to affect them. It's like, "Hey we're a bunch of perverted nerds, and we don't give a shit about very much." At least that's how the people I've met in person act.



I think I get you. You like the way in which furries can be sexualised without the horndogging?


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## FiiCoon (Feb 23, 2012)

Mentova said:


> For starters, if you're living like how you think your character would live, you probably have some issues and you might need to go to a therapist. For the next part... I'd be pretty pissed off if furries just randomly grabbed my junk. Being a furry does not mean "I am free to grope and play with have fun!" I don't think your group of friends are an accurate representation of the fandom as a whole. Most of the furries I've met and gotten to know do not fit your description at all. I also don't find that the lifestyle you described has anything to do with the fandom. Just because your friends are pervy and grope you does not mean being pervy and groping each other is part of the debated furry lifestyle. That's like saying you need to be a gamer too because there are furries who play games.


Well I mean it's an idea, you know? I don't try to have magical shapeshifty powers, just her ideas. Like be strong enough to overcome the things that keep you from being a functioning human being. Be kind to others and be learned without being pretentious. 

As for the rest I do see your point. I'm not trying to say every furry has to be okay with groping. Furries don't have to be everything I just said, it's more like, "I'm gonna be who I want without compromising personal space and forget you if you don't like it." If that makes sense. I mean not all my furry friends have the same hobbies, likes, personalities I do. What I meant to get across was that furry to me is more like "You can be whoever you want, don't hang out with the people who don't like you. Also here's some nifty art."


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## veeno (Feb 23, 2012)

*eye twitches*

Fuck this shit.

*runs away*


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## Heimdal (Feb 23, 2012)

FiiCoon said:


> Well I mean it's an idea, you know? I don't try to have magical shapeshifty powers, just her ideas. Like be strong enough to overcome the things that keep you from being a functioning human being. Be kind to others and be learned without being pretentious.
> 
> As for the rest I do see your point. I'm not trying to say every furry has to be okay with groping. Furries don't have to be everything I just said, it's more like, "I'm gonna be who I want without compromising personal space and forget you if you don't like it." If that makes sense. I mean not all my furry friends have the same hobbies, likes, personalities I do. What I meant to get across was that furry to me is more like "You can be whoever you want, don't hang out with the people who don't like you. Also here's some nifty art."



Seems pretty accurate to me.

Understand, though, that to self-proclaimed lifestylers, this commonly means a total lack of standards. The bottom of the barrel is good enough to be accepted by these other furries. The only things typically in common between furry lifestylers is usual lack of standards, and something to do with animals. (it really is no wonder drama is so common.. They never even have a plan for when big differences pop up, they just refuse it's happening while kicking eachother under the table.)

There are plenty of furries who hold to standards, definitely, but what do they have in common? Something to do with animals. That's about as much of a lifestyle choice as 'wearing a lot of blue' is a lifestyle choice.

I really gotta stretch the meaning of 'lifestyle' when furries have dick all in common with eachother. A diverse group is good, it's just a huge gaping problem when "everyone is perfect as they are" and compromise isn't even on mind. Thats something more furries should really try to understand.


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## Kitutal (Feb 24, 2012)

I can see your point here too, what initially attracted me was this idea that I could take how I have become over the years, all the bits of myself that I don't like and want to change, and effectivly put them to one side and act as I want to, around people that are doing much the same thing, where I can feel a little more comfortable with being a bit silly and also still a bit shy and socially awkward around others. 
The cute fluffy animals were an attraction too. 

I am hoping that something like this will give me the courage, practice and incentive I need to change how I really am to become more like how I want to be, though that doesn't involve, for me, wishing that I was more animal like, I passed through that stage a few years ago (yes, I went through all that, and yes I grew out of it eventually, maybe most others will at some point too, but I can still see the appeal and hence still defend those that feel that way) There is a thin line between obsession and spending a lot of time doing a range things you like, anywhere from looking at pictures to organising a convention. This line, I suspect, is different for everyone, and moves around as well, but I do worry just a little about people that seem to be right on it or even just a bit over it.

Also, woo, 300 posts now. going up quite fast.


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## stevegallacci (Feb 27, 2012)

Change a few names and titles and this could be a rant about SF fandom 70 years or so ago. Less sex, more politics/artistic snobbery, but basically the same thing. "Ooma-gooma, one of us" versus "purity of essence" versus "who is the bigger one", and variations. It's a laugh to watch, guys.


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## Kellie Gator (Feb 27, 2012)

stevegallacci said:


> Change a few names and titles and this could be a rant about SF fandom 70 years or so ago. Less sex, more politics/artistic snobbery, but basically the same thing. "Ooma-gooma, one of us" versus "purity of essence" versus "who is the bigger one", and variations. It's a laugh to watch, guys.


The fandom's had an odd development, hasn't it? Back in the late 70's/early 80's there was a demand for MORE sex in the fandom, and suddenly people want to have less.

I honestly feel bad for getting so invested sometimes. People should just chill out and carry on with doing their own thing.


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## ziK (Feb 27, 2012)

Kellie Gator said:


> The fandom's had an odd development, hasn't it? Back in the late 70's/early 80's there was a demand for MORE sex in the fandom, and suddenly people want to have less.



There's tons of sex now in the furry fandom. Problem is, people can't keep it to themselves. At some point the "furry acceptance" and the "furry masturbatory habits" kinda intermixed, I think


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## Verin Asper (Feb 28, 2012)

Kellie Gator said:


> The fandom's had an odd development, hasn't it? Back in the late 70's/early 80's there was a demand for MORE sex in the fandom, and suddenly people want to have less.
> 
> I honestly feel bad for getting so invested sometimes. People should just chill out and carry on with doing their own thing.



its mostly the problem of folks not keeping it to themselves and again too much of a thing..eh...ya get bored if it. I mean yea I commission porn...but cause I had a porn base idea, I dont get anything out of porn now...hentai ruined me pretty much.


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## Trpdwarf (Feb 28, 2012)

Kellie Gator said:


> The fandom's had an odd development, hasn't it? Back in the late 70's/early 80's there was a demand for MORE sex in the fandom, and suddenly people want to have less.
> 
> I honestly feel bad for getting so invested sometimes. People should just chill out and carry on with doing their own thing.



I don't find it so odd. When the furry fandom first got it's feet on the ground running it had lots of stuff to look at even if it wasn't really "Furry" but very little in the way of "Stuff" to satisfy a basic human element. At the time Furry started up you already had people making porn to cater to the Science Fiction Community. Just as the Anime Community saw a market pop up for sexual themes and porn associated with Anime so it was that Furry was going to face sexual themes and porn in the realm of Anthropomorphics. A market was there, and it wasn't filled yet because it was just made. So people filled it. What many people ought to recognize is that when we start our fandom was one of the first groups to openly accept gays/bi/trans. So when we opened our arms to those people a specific side group that is well...very very sexual came with it. Back then we had two areas that brought about what people look at as  "Demand for sexual content". It only makes sense that eventually as the fandom becomes saturated due to those two sources that people will back and go "Woah, lets tone it down a bit" or at least try to establish boundaries and for good reasons.


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## Goronian (Feb 28, 2012)

Hoo boy. Lots of stuff to adress.

See, it irks me, when people cry "it's a sexuality". Don't tell me about sexuality, numbnuts. I had to put up with "coming out", after I stopped being a teen, at least mentally. I can tell you stories about how weird and uncomfortable that all was, considering I already had my worldview pretty dead set and it got a huge dent in it. That's not even covering the issues with parents and society at large. So don't fucking tell me "getting a hard-on for people with animal characteristics" is remotely comparable.

With that said, I have a really good analogy. Say, I like guys. Specifically, really agile, athletic and lanky ones - your Flashes, Spidermen and Dantes. Imagine if there was a site, let's call it "lankyaffinity.com". I come there for the porn, but most people just like drawing lanky guys and I'm perfectly fine with that. But then some asshole cries, that we somehow offend his lanksona (even though he is a slightly overweight 20-something with no social life to speak of) and we're not "true" enough, because we don't communicate with our inner lank, or something. And when we gather around and tell him "chill, it's just a hobby", he throws a fit and claims it's a lifestyle.

I was so proud of this analogy, when I came up with it, that I can't even see, what there was to be proud of. Moving on...

An interesting question was raised a few pages back. "Why do you use anthros in your writing?" Frankly, I use them, so I'd have an excuse to post them here. Okay, to be fair, I have around... Ten, maybe furry characters in my SFW work, that are quite relevant to the plot. That's counting shapeshifters, who do have furry-like forms, but they tend to be less "furry" and more "monstrous". There are straight furs, though, even if some of them are on the weird side. Keep in mind, that there are literally dozens of other characters running around. I guess "anthro" is just not that bad of an idea, when you run out of races to put in your fantasy setting.

I already talked about the sexual side of the fandom in another thread, even changed my mind a little, so I won't bother repeating myself.

Bottom line. Furry can be a lifestyle, but it looks just kind of awkward. The "lowest common denominator" is still a hobby and should be left as that.


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