# FA Current Status : was The SQL Holocaust [UPDATED]



## Dragoneer (Mar 3, 2006)

Crypto is currently working on a fix to re-write how the FA code handles queries and talks to the server. Currently, our code became more inefficient than it should have been. I am not entirely sure what happened (I am not a coder) but Crypto is trying to fix it ASAP.

I should have more of an update on the situation tonight.

*SQL errors have been fixed. Thank Crypto and Jheryn. Currently, they are working on performance revisions to further enhance the site.*

My apologies for the latest problems. We are currently re-organizing the site and its priorities, as well as adding new admins to the site. I will make introductions soon.

*NOTE: THE SYSTEM IS CURRENTLY DOWN FOR UPGRADES 3/6/06*


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## Keffria (Mar 3, 2006)

Ah... so I guess that would explain why it doesn't even load. If I try to use my bookmark I end up staying at the same site I was at previously x_X;


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## uncia2000 (Mar 3, 2006)

*Re: The SQL Holocaust*



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> Crypto is currently working on a fix to re-write how the FA code handles queries and talks to the server. Currently, our code became more inefficient than it should have been.


Earlier this week d'you mean? Aside from the general/ongoing issues, that is...



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> I am not entirely sure what happened (I am not a coder) but Crypto is trying to fix it ASAP.
> 
> I should have more of an update on the situation tonight.


Thanks for the update.
Likewise thanks & good luck to Crypto (serious DB2 access path tuning and messing around in the guts of the database design/setup to resolve conflicts? Sounds like an interesting Friday evening...).


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## shep (Mar 3, 2006)

That explains it.  Thanks for telling us what's going on.  Keep struggling on!


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## Tiarhlu (Mar 3, 2006)

Thanks for finally saying something.


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## yak (Mar 3, 2006)

```
WWWWWWWWW_WW_KWWWKWWWWWWKWWWWWWW_WW_WWWWWWW_WWWWWWWWW_WWWWWWWWWW
WWWWW_WWWWWWWWW__W_WW_WWWWWWW_W_W_W_WWWWW_WWWWWWW____W_.W.WWW__W
W._WWWW...W.....................................................
................................................................
```
ok, FA is down. well, not really, but it is not serving anyone but my keep-alive connection. been doing this all day, and something like this for couple of days now. WSOD are everywhere. 
but what is a WSOD? to me it looks like a timed out(max_execution_time=30s) PHP script with error_reporting set to E_ALL, so users do not see this 'timed out' error message. 
timeouts from where? apache is fine, has a lot of free server-slots and running servers. PHP never times out, only in a case of severe data processing, which FA clearly does not have. so this leaves us with MySQL. 
and this recent error.

```
Database error in www.furaffinity.net: Invalid SQL: DELETE FROM df_useronline WHERE online<'1141262669'
mysql error: Lock wait timeout exceeded; try restarting transaction
```
that is odd, i thought you comented out the code responsible for 'online users' SQL queries?... 

and OMG - is that the DELETE query? sorry dudes, but i have all the reasons to suspect that this is a very badly written piece of code. 
just imagine 200 concurrent SELECT+DELETE queries on a single table? obviuosly SELECTs have to wait for DELETEs to complete, and DELETEs have to wait for SELECTs to complete - they are mutually exclusive in this case, since you SELECT and the DELETE on all the rows, hence all of them geting locked. as the result all these queries from all the concurrently running copies of the MySQL server are literally put in one huge queue.
so instead of running at the same time, each copy of MySQL, and thus each copy of PHP, and thus each copy of Apache, and thus each user are waining their turn to SELECT and DELETE data from that table. it is only obviuos that one day the server would not be capable to empty the queue  during peak times in a reasonable amount of time, and thus the queries would eventually time out, resulting in that confusing 'table lock' error - because the entire table is literally getting locked by each SELECT and DELETE.
to even worsten the case, these timeouts sometimes cause deadlocks, meaning that the table remains locked untill MySQL is restarted.. and this is kind of what i see now, thou there are only ~100 request/sec.

but really, i thought you were SELECT'ing every time, but DELETE'ing once in, say, 5 or 10 minutes or so (well, at least once a second for the sake of sanity, but not 200 times with each user request ). running both queries every time creates a huge ass bottleneck.  and this bug is so damn hard to trace....

so as i see it now, this was the major reason of slowdowns of the site. but then again, i haven't (yet? ) seen other SQL code or/and PHP code to be able to judge that. 

then again i could be wrong, but i really hope that helps, because i grew to be addicted somehow to the site and to some people around here... 

PS:
and you can also consider this handy little thing http://sqlrelay.sourceforge.net/ - for database connection pooling, proxying and load balancing they say. all you will need is pooling. haven't used it yet (i'll try eventually), but heart from some people that it helps a lot.

PPS:
and i suggest that you try to optimize apache for FA's way of it's usage  (my regards to you if you did it already, i really cannot tell it without seeing httpd.conf). even in the worst case you will probably manage to cut a megabyte or so off each of the running server processes. but you admin guys probably know this better then me, so  i'll just press the 'submit' button now... 

EDIT


> serious DB2 access path tuning and messing around in the guts of the database design/setup to resolve conflicts? Sounds like an interesting Friday evening


you bet. it is like a good detective story. intrigueing..


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## Catamount (Mar 3, 2006)

yes, I hope we are talking about bad coding here and not so much bad table design.  :? Thxs for the update anyways Dragoneer.


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## uncia2000 (Mar 4, 2006)

_(oops, didn't post this earlier today before heading out... )_


			
				yak said:
			
		

> ...so this leaves us with MySQL.
> and this recent error.
> 
> ```
> ...


Yes, I was perplexed by that, too... ( => http://www.furpawz.net/fa/forums/viewtopic.php?p=8830&highlight=#8830 )

I doubt that's the only issue, but it's the most visible one.
Still leaves me trying to guess whether that was a recently (badly) "tweaked" DB2 call or not, because things were not running this poorly last weekend.

Thanks, yak.



			
				yak said:
			
		

> but you admin guys probably know this better then me, so i'll just press the 'submit' button now...


There's that ol' admin vs. tech split again, btw.
I'd guess Cypto and Gushi have DBA knowledge, but wouldn't presume that all admins are automatically tech. gurus.


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## yak (Mar 4, 2006)

uncia2000 said:
			
		

> yak said:
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well, actually not. it is more like 'my english is so crappy that i sometimes misuse words, especially when trying to adress a number of different people with one word' case. :x
and if it wouldn't cause any problems, is it posible to tell just what was fixed and in what way :?: problem->solution situations like this pose a great value to the developers like myself.. thanks in advance.
and in the mean time it runs like never ran before. well done!


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## Suule (Mar 4, 2006)

Ummm... is the patch applied? I still experience MASSIVE slowdowns and SQL errors.


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## NeoWarriorCat (Mar 4, 2006)

It was working fine-ish for me earlier... now I can't get the main page to load up :/


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## tundra_arctic_wolf (Mar 4, 2006)

I'm having the same problem that you are, NeoWarriorCat.  I get just a blank page.  I hope FA comes back soon.

*Tundra patiently waits for FA to come back online*

cheers,
Tundra Arctic Wolf


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## Mitch_DLG (Mar 4, 2006)

I am still getting either "cannot locate server"  "Document contains no data" or SQL errors constantly, whith no actual access to the site all day.


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## yak (Mar 4, 2006)

symptoms are the same...  guess some table got a deadlock again.
this is a stupid suggestion, but while in the process of correcting mistakes, could, say, 'cron' the mysql server to be restarted each 6 hours or so? like i said, stupid...


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## Kougar (Mar 5, 2006)

*Re: The SQL Holocaust [UPDATED]*



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> *SQL errors have been fixed. Thank Crypto and Jheryn. Currently, they are working on performance revisions to further enhance the site.*



Not quite so fast, there!  :3

Long afer peak usage here, and not only am I getting them but it's a solid string of them. Hopefully is only due to work being done and such on something, but incase not I'll post this. 

Thanks for all of the effort so far, it's appreciated!  

Edit: It seems I was getting almost all of them from trying to +fav and +watch, while general image viewing/browsing was still working during the same time...


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## Tiarhlu (Mar 5, 2006)

8:30am central time, and I haven't been able to get on at all. Not even a MySql error, just times out.


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## Pico (Mar 5, 2006)

I can get pages to load now (barely), but I get lovely load times such as this:

 This page was generated in 105.71117 seconds. Queries used: 2. Server load: 0.03%


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## timoran (Mar 6, 2006)

Pico said:
			
		

> I can get pages to load now (barely), but I get lovely load times such as this:
> 
> This page was generated in 105.71117 seconds. Queries used: 2. Server load: 0.03%



I've got you beat on that one...

http://furaffinity.net/view/69566/


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## verix (Mar 6, 2006)

Pico said:
			
		

> I can get pages to load now (barely), but I get lovely load times such as this:
> 
> This page was generated in 105.71117 seconds. Queries used: 2. Server load: 0.03%


You can stop trolling now.


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## uncia2000 (Mar 6, 2006)

verix said:
			
		

> Pico said:
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Eh... Pico's definitely a FA supporter and OK by me.
We all get frustrated from time-to-time and there's plenty reason for people to feel that, at present. (Frustrated for self _and_ for the rest of the community...).
Hopefully everyone will have taken that "in context" and seems so, given there aren't a dozen follow-up gripes.

Thanks y'all for patience above-and-beyond the norm: hope that will be repaid in due course.

=
Nice "Bug Hunter" label, btw, verix. Good luck, friend!


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## verix (Mar 6, 2006)

uncia2000 said:
			
		

> Eh... Pico's definitely a FA supporter and OK by me.
> We all get frustrated from time-to-time and there's plenty reason for people to feel that, at present. (Frustrated for self _and_ for the rest of the community...).
> Hopefully everyone will have taken that "in context" and seems so, given there aren't a dozen follow-up gripes.
> 
> ...


uh I was kidding and I am pretty sure Pico would pick up on my sarcastic response  :shock: You could always call it cheerleading, I guess.

By the way, I stopped being a bug-hunter a few months ago. For some reason they just never got rid of this title. I'd divulge the details as to why, but I'd probably anger people by insighting some sort of drama or DISSENT AMONG THE USERS!! or something like that.


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## dave hyena (Mar 6, 2006)

verix said:
			
		

> I'd divulge the details as to why, but I'd probably anger people by insighting some sort of drama or DISSENT AMONG THE USERS!! or something like that.



You already posted "an open letter" about it on the FA LJ last year and garnered 29 comments worth of attention.

See:

http://community.livejournal.com/furaffinity/63019.html


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## verix (Mar 6, 2006)

Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> verix said:
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thanks that is kind of what I was trying not to post here


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## dave hyena (Mar 6, 2006)

verix said:
			
		

> Dave Hyena said:
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Preyfar himself admitted that there had been a breakdown in communication so I hardly think you're going to cause any drama.


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## Zephyer (Mar 6, 2006)

I'm getting the same problem as Keffria. Now, instead of SQL errors, I get a loading bar for about five minutes, then stay on the same page.


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## shinmew (Mar 6, 2006)

I hope this does not drive too many artist away. It is driving me up the wall as it is. The only things that keeps me here are the open-minded ppl. Everywhere else I go either will not let me post ALL my work I want to post, or the ppl there are closed-minded $%#holes.


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## Pico (Mar 6, 2006)

verix said:
			
		

> Pico said:
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no u


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## uncia2000 (Mar 6, 2006)

as of Monday 6th March: 1400 EST

*Jheryn is working on the live system at present, hence system is "unavailable" (was previously shown as "403 - Forbidden" error messages).*

Update to follow... Please feel free to join in on the forum and/or vent frustration re. the ongoing service problems. We are working on those.

Thank you, once again, for your patience and hope to have the community working *properly* again for y'all in due course.


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## Taristin (Mar 6, 2006)

Aww. Don't let it get you frustrated. Atleast it's being worked on. Unlike countless other projects I have seen rise and die. 

*nuzzles a feline admin* >..> 
<..<  *skitters off*


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## KaputOtter (Mar 6, 2006)

Keep up the good work, you guys.

You know you will always have my loyalty and support, 100%.


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## Dragoneer (Mar 6, 2006)

KaputOtter said:
			
		

> Keep up the good work, you guys.
> 
> You know you will always have my loyalty and support, 100%.


Well, we decided to roll over to v3 in an unfinished state. We'd rather introduce some potential new bugs but have a FAST, working site....

We'll be doing some cleanup and tweaking on it over the next few days. <3 Crypto, TOS and J.


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## Strawkitty (Mar 6, 2006)

Dragoneer said:
			
		

> Well, we decided to roll over to v3 in an unfinished state. We'd rather introduce some potential new bugs but have a FAST, working site....


Don't worry, we'll be here to whin... er notify you of them.  Though that decision sounds rather familiar and ominous(hopefully nothing).

Anyhow thank you guys for putting up with us commoners whom are going through withdrawal syndromes. And of course thanks for working on the site(and letting us know what's happening). <3


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## oolala (Mar 6, 2006)

*Mmmm*

Still slow, but at least it's working.   Well it was a second ago...hehe.  Good job.  *HUGS*


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## Xax (Mar 6, 2006)

That went well.

and now quoting myself from the IRC: 
<xax> p.s., the site is still not W3C compliant and it's /certainly/ not very accessible, and also the css is horribly confusing and you shouldn't use tables (much less NESTED tables) for layout purposes.

I'll follow that up with "but it's better than Sheezy ver3 because you don't seem to have a javascript boner"


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## Arshes Nei (Mar 6, 2006)

Right.

You think that because this is a community style image gallery.

http://www.arshesnei.weyrspace.co.uk/screenshots/yayfav3launchc.jpg

Wouldn't have been looked over?


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## Taristin (Mar 6, 2006)

Bugger, it goes up for the hour I'm in class, and as soon as I'm back, it goes back down 

*is a sad leezard*


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## m2pt5 (Mar 6, 2006)

Might I suggest that all subpages of the site be redirected to the current "we're working on it" main page? I only have my message console page bookmarked, and it comes up with a 404.


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## Daiki (Mar 6, 2006)

At least I have Dostoyevsky to occupy my time. Not that that's really any better, I suppose. While his _Notes From Underground_ is a good read, it is somewhat of a depressing book; what should one suspect when reading an author who's sole subject is on human misery?


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## Nightdancer (Mar 6, 2006)

I hope that the pictures aren't stored in the database as well, but that would explain why it takes the server so long to built up a page.
Normally only the location/link is stored in the php-database, because to sored the hole picture makes the database slow (it isn't designed to do this efficiently).
Normally the webserver gives the pictures out, because it is built to give files out quickly, not the database itself.


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## Dragoneer (Mar 6, 2006)

Nightdancer said:
			
		

> I hope that the pictures aren't stored in the database as well, but that would explain why it takes the server so long to built up a page.
> Normally only the location/link is stored in the php-database, because to sored the hole picture makes the database slow (it isn't designed to do this efficiently).
> Normally the webserver gives the pictures out, because it is built to give files out quickly, not the database itself.


Crypto thinks he may have found one of the reasons for the primary slowdown. We'll see. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.


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## Vgm22 (Mar 7, 2006)

I just want to thank you guys for fighting the good fight, to get FA running smoothly. To give us a nice community. Keep up the good work. I'm with you a 100% as well.


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## moredena (Mar 7, 2006)

*Wahoo?*

Well, I am glad you're working on it. 

Even if I am frustrated at the constant lag and backups.

Rock on guys!


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## ITOMIC (Mar 7, 2006)

Grrr. I was just getting used to the long-ass page loads also. 


Oh well...  :cry: 


(lol - My sig will never get old)


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## yak (Mar 7, 2006)

ITOMIC said:
			
		

> (lol - My sig will never get old)


Start searching for another...  This one will get old really fast... I have that feeling.


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## thorndraco (Mar 7, 2006)

Is there anyone working on getting this site W3C compliant and cleaning up the HTML and CSS?


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## Arcturus (Mar 7, 2006)

thorndraco said:
			
		

> Is there anyone working on getting this site W3C compliant and cleaning up the HTML and CSS?



You wish


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## Waccoon (Mar 7, 2006)

Since I'm in-between projects at the moment, I'd be willing to lend a hand with CSS and JS.  I'm sure you guys have your hands full with PHP at the moment.  :wink:

One thing in particular that drives me nuts is a problem in the JavaScript that controls the ToolTip.  If you install the "Web Developer" extension for Firefox, it'll loudy shout the problem, belching thousands of errors with every twitch of the mouse.


```
if(ns){doc = "document."; sty = ""}
if(ie){doc = "document.all."; sty = ".style"}

...

function MoveToolTip(layerName, FromTop, FromLeft, e) {
	if (ie) {
		eval(doc + layerName + sty + ".top = "  + (eval(FromTop) + document.body.scrollTop))
	}
	if (ns) {
		eval(doc + layerName + sty + ".top = "  +  eval(FromTop))
	}
	eval(doc + layerName + sty + ".left = " + (eval(FromLeft) + 15))
}
```

"doc" and "sty" may be global variables here, but they are defined only if a browser tests as either IE or NS.  Also, some browsers won't treat them as globals unless they are explicitly declared with "var".  I think Firefox does this, and treats them as locals, which generates the errors.

It's also not required to do so much content replacement if you use "item.style.display = ('block' || 'none')", but that would require some DOM-compliant additions.



> Nightdancer:  I hope that the pictures aren't stored in the database as well, but that would explain why it takes the server so long to built up a page.
> Normally only the location/link is stored in the php-database, because to sored the hole picture makes the database slow (it isn't designed to do this efficiently).


Not likely, as it seems PHP is taking up the largest chunk of execution time, not SQL queries.  I sure hope FurAffinity uses a template engine that supports caching.


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## thorndraco (Mar 7, 2006)

What I've been trying to figure out is why FA even needs the JS it uses... everything the site does doesn't seem to in any way neseccitate JS. I haven't even tested to see if the site still works correctly with Java turned off yet.


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## Waccoon (Mar 7, 2006)

JavaScript is needed for the same reason as every other InterWebThingy technology:  redundant eye candy.  :wink:


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## Catamount (Mar 7, 2006)

it is much faster   I just wanted to post the only problem I had (other than stuff that is uncoded)

http://www.furaffinity.net/favorites/swiftjames/ 

Gives mysql error 1054 and never comes up, everything else seems to work.

keep it up!


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## uncia2000 (Mar 7, 2006)

Catamount said:
			
		

> I just wanted to post the only problem I had (other than stuff that is uncoded)
> http://www.furaffinity.net/favorites/swiftjames/
> 
> Gives mysql error 1054 and never comes up, everything else seems to work.


Thanks for posting that observation, cougie.

*clips full error message for reference in case system goes offline again*

```
1054Database error in www.furaffinity.net: Invalid SQL: SELECT date, thumbnail, adultsubmission, rowid, title, username, message, lower FROM df_favorites WHERE user='7511' ORDER BY rowid DESC LIMIT 0,12
mysql error: Unknown column 'message' in 'field list'
mysql error number: 1054
User: uncia2000
Date: 07.03.2006 @ 13:58
Script: /favorites/swiftjames/
Referer: http://www.furpawz.net/fa/forums/viewtopic.php?t=799&start=45
MySql ERROR! Please check the logs for information on the error(s)
```
Unknown column is an interesting error message, if that is indeed the case!
_(*mutters* could never happen on an IBM m/frame dev... ^^)_


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## uncia2000 (Mar 7, 2006)

*Please post any v3 bugs in this thread => http://www.furpawz.net/fa/forums/viewtopic.php?t=814*

Thank you, in advance...


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## NeoWarriorCat (Mar 7, 2006)

Would it have killed you guys to, I dunno.... FINISH CODING the thing before putting it up?

In doing this, you merely replaced one set of problems with an entirely new set.


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## thorndraco (Mar 7, 2006)

Waccoon said:
			
		

> JavaScript is needed for the same reason as every other InterWebThingy technology:  redundant eye candy.  :wink:



The only stuff I can find that seems to be done with JS I can do with purely CSS.


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## Arshes Nei (Mar 7, 2006)

NeoWarriorCat said:
			
		

> Would it have killed you guys to, I dunno.... FINISH CODING the thing before putting it up?
> 
> In doing this, you merely replaced one set of problems with an entirely new set.



But it would be destroying the tradition.


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## uncia2000 (Mar 7, 2006)

Arshes Nei said:
			
		

> NeoWarriorCat said:
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touch?...


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## Vgm22 (Mar 7, 2006)

That's what you get for putting it up, when your still working on it to get it to run at 100%, more problems, but they are working on them and we should help out by pointing out new problems that pop-up, so that FA can be at 100% faster and sooner. :3 Hehe I'll shut up now.


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## Waccoon (Mar 8, 2006)

Hey, the ToolTip is now working in Firefox.  Good work, guys.



> Unknown column is an interesting error message, if that is indeed the case!


I get this error from phpMyAdmin all the time with perfectly heathy tables.  For some reason, phpMyAdmin sometimes blows up when using legal SQL code where the field names aren't delimited.  Also, it doesn't seem to like mixing delimiter types, but this might just be part of the phpMyAdmin parsing engine.

Sometimes this bombs:
SELECT usrpass FROM op_oekaki WHERE usrname='me'

But this works (?!)
SELECT `usrpass` FROM `op_oekaki` WHERE `usrname`=`me`

phpMyAdmin is really screwy at times.

Also note that MySQL 5 is much stricter than previous versions.  I've had all kinds of trouble updating my oekaki system to MySQL 5 due to the lack of default values on some fields.  Not to pry, but which version of MySQL does FA use?


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## uncia2000 (Mar 8, 2006)

Waccoon said:
			
		

> Sometimes this bombs:
> SELECT usrpass FROM op_oekaki WHERE usrname='me'
> 
> But this works (?!)
> SELECT `usrpass` FROM `op_oekaki` WHERE `usrname`=`me`


Akkk..... 



			
				Waccoon said:
			
		

> Also note that MySQL 5 is much stricter than previous versions.  I've had all kinds of trouble updating my oekaki system to MySQL 5 due to the lack of default values on some fields.  Not to pry, but which version of MySQL does FA use?


Thanks for asking.

Apache/1.3.34 (Unix) PHP/4.4.2
PHP Version: 4.4.2
Zend Version: 1.3.0
MySql Version: 4.1.15-log


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## verix (Mar 8, 2006)

KaputOtter said:
			
		

> Keep up the good work, you guys.
> 
> You know you will always have my loyalty and support, 100%.


the big brother problem has been fixed


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## dave hyena (Mar 11, 2006)

verix said:
			
		

> the big brother problem has been fixed



*gives you attention*


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## Zippo (Mar 11, 2006)

Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> verix said:
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Christ, and I thought *I* was bad  ^^


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## verix (Mar 11, 2006)

Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> *gives you attention*


Are you sure you want to do that? I mean, I _am_ a troll after all, and giving a troll attention is slightly counter-productive to the health of the forums!

Perhaps you should reconsider.


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## Vgm22 (Mar 11, 2006)

I thought FA didn't like trolls or trolling? Anyway what does all this talking have to to with the SQL Holocaust topic? Well I'm not anyone that can do anything about it, so carry on -walks away-


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## oolala (Mar 15, 2006)

*Adult Artwork*

Okay first my "View Adult Artwork" setting kept being switched to "no" when updated my profile.  Now it's says it's "yes" but I can't see ANY adult artwork.  Not even the stuff I uploaded.  *sighs*


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## Dragoneer (Mar 15, 2006)

Vgm22 said:
			
		

> I thought FA didn't like trolls or trolling? Anyway what does all this talking have to to with the SQL Holocaust topic? Well I'm not anyone that can do anything about it, so carry on -walks away-


We don't like trolls or trolling, but everybody has a voice an opinion. I'm not a fan of censoring unless forced into it.


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## oolala (Mar 15, 2006)

*Hmmm*

You know, I just thought about it...  There could be a couple people pissed off at me who WOULD be ass-holes egnough to try and tell FurAffinity adminstrators I'm not 18 or something.  If any admin is reading this, please note I AM telling the truth about my age.  The only reason I changed it to the 1960's once was to see if something weird happened with the date thing on the server to see if it allowed me to get my adult view back.  Currently I am stuck with getting more and more submissions and not being able to view them because I can't see any adult artwork even though I'm 25!


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## verix (Mar 17, 2006)

Vgm22 said:
			
		

> I thought FA didn't like trolls or trolling? Anyway what does all this talking have to to with the SQL Holocaust topic? Well I'm not anyone that can do anything about it, so carry on -walks away-


I wasn't being serious, really. I was just mocking DaveHyena's ~ACTION POSE~ toward that statement, since it came off as something like "hay you're a troll how clever you are let me throw you a bone and keep you in my back yard and I will call you Spot and you will be so cute because you are a cute troll _yes you ARE!_" In reality, I was just making a multi-layered joke with the statement of mine he quoted.

oh god why do i have to explain myself 

PS: Dragoneer, we need to make a special "blank-staring avatar" club for each other.


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## oolala (Mar 17, 2006)

*No Adult Artwork?*

Got it fixed.


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## Vgm22 (Mar 20, 2006)

verix said:
			
		

> Vgm22 said:
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Oh then I'm sorry, but I bet you'd make an awesome pet.  :lol:


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## verix (Mar 20, 2006)

Vgm22 said:
			
		

> Oh then I'm sorry, but I bet you'd make an awesome pet.  :lol:


Nah. I'm too uppity. :>


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