# Novel/Novella/Short Story



## Friday (Sep 8, 2013)

So, does anyone have good conventions for these distinctions? It seems a novel is anything more than 40,000 words, though some say 50,000, and others even more. A novella generally is less than 40,000 words, but the 'more than' is poorly defined, anything from 7,500 to 20,000, depending on who you ask. Obviously the minimum for a short story is 1 word (theoretically), but more realistically is probably like 1,000 to wherever your novella cutoff is.

And then some places don't even define it by # of words, but by things that are really difficult to quantify, like structure or number of themes/characters.

Wikipedia is clear-cut on this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Length_of_a_novel#In_fiction), but if you look other places, even on wikipedia, you'll find that's hardly the case.

Anyone have any strong input on this?


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## Alexxx-Returns (Sep 8, 2013)

I think I read somewhere that a novel is which surpasses the 70,000 word mark.

I remember this because I recall being so excited when I hit 70,000 words.


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## Poetigress (Sep 9, 2013)

Really, it depends on the market you're trying to sell it to, because yeah, different magazines and publishers and awards committees and whatever often draw their lines in different places. Assuming you're writing for adults, though, generally "short story" is anything from roughly 1000 words up to maybe 10K max (below 1000 would usually be considered flash fiction, with below 500ish often called microfiction -- again, all these terms vary), "novelette" is getting into the 10-20K area, and "novella" spans about 20-50K. Around 40-60K can be kind of a gray area, where some might still call it a novella and some a short novel. Novels for adults tend to run in the 70-100K range (I've sometimes heard 80-100K). 

So again, these are obviously not hard and fast limits, and I'm sure you can find sources that disagree with everything I've just said, several different ways.  What's important are the guidelines from the publisher.

If you're writing for children, that's a whole other deal; the word counts there all tend to be shorter (with, for example, a middle-grade novel -- which is aimed at 8- to 12-year-olds -- running about 35-50K).


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## Gnarl (Sep 9, 2013)

According to Daw publishing the last time I contacted then. A short story is anything 5K or less  a novella is anything 50K or less and they won't publish anything less than 80K.
The last one I submitted was 181K. When I copywrited it the scammer publisher came out of woodwork. I have heard different stories on these .


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## Sasya (Sep 9, 2013)

copy*right. 
*
As in, 'right to copy', not copy*write*, as in 'to write copy'.  I might be convinced that you were trying to advertise your work, but 'copywrited' would have been wrong in that case. 

As far as the convention goes, 50k is a -very- short novel, but, like all conventions, it depends on who you're selling it to. 

For my genre, when I look for work to publish I'm looking for a minimum of 90-100k words for a novel.  It's not a hard limit, but otherwise things start to get a bit thin. 

-Fox


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## SkyeLansing (Sep 13, 2013)

Just going to throw out some loose definitions I've been taught. They aren't set in stone but they make some good guidelines:

Flash Fiction: <1,000 Words
Short Story: 1,000-15,000 Words
Novella: 20,000-50,000 Words
Novel: >60,000 Words

Typically on the shorter end for Novels is intended for younger readers, though that isn't always the case. There is also a bit of play here. It is possible to have a 'long' short story or a 'short' novel. Honestly, though, most venues want Short Stories to be between 5k-10k words (long enough to clearly be a short story but short enough to not require too much space). Novellas are often done as serial publications or as a 'feature' for an anthology collection, though there is no hard and fast rule for that.


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## Gnarl (Sep 15, 2013)

Sasya said:


> copy*right.
> *
> As in, 'right to copy', not copy*write*, as in 'to write copy'.  I might be convinced that you were trying to advertise your work, but 'copywrited' would have been wrong in that case.
> 
> ...



Ok, I'm sorry already! I do not have any training in writing or spelling even. My degrees are in art not English. Just so you know I am not on FAF to sell any works. 
I just like the company and chatting. Thank the gods of the computer for spell check , when it works, or I would be in big trouble. 
I love the furry friends here and its great to learn about the writing stuff. I have had a lot of misconceptions in the past. Mostly because of all the rejections my father used to get from publishers and he had a masters in English. Nope I am just here for the people. Thanks for the comments and hope I didn't offend you but if the works sell then they do but not here!


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