# New Server Order Date: DELAYED



## Dragoneer (Nov 25, 2006)

*NOTE: Server order date has been delayed. Server will be ordered first week of December. Delay is only to allow money transfers to finish processing. Estimated date is Dec 4 - 6th. We got way, way, WAY more donations than we expected!*

I'm going to be putting in the order for the new server on the 1st of December. If you would like to get in a *last minute donation* to help us buff and streamline the DB server, you've still got a few days left!







*Current Specs:*
AMD Opteron 275 Dual Core Processor, 940 pin Italy-core variant
Supermicro H8DA8 dual socket 940 motherboard
Redundant 2U 500W AC power supply w/ PFC
4GB of Corsair XMS RAM ECC/Buffered
3ware 9550SX-4LP 64-bit/133MHz PCI-X SATA II Raid Controller
4x 250GB 7200.10 Seagate Barracuda HD
2x 320GB 7200.10 Seagate Barracuda HD

*Donate for GREAT JUSTICE!* 

So keep the donations coming in! The more we get between now and December, the better off we'll be able to outfit this digital powerhouse to carry us out in the future with styyyyle.


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## dave hyena (Nov 25, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

One last minute donation then.

For all the inspiring art I've seen here.


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## netrat13 (Nov 25, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

^^  All the movies this weekend are pretty bad--so I'll put my money to where it'll be put to better use.  Here ya go, folks.


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## TheFox (Nov 25, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Is there any way I can donate with PayPal?

-Fox


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## Dragoneer (Nov 25, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				TheFox said:
			
		

> Is there any way I can donate with PayPal?
> 
> -Fox


Certainly. =) Note sent.


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## Charrio (Nov 25, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

I can donate commissions to the site if you want to aution them? 

Full color CG ones, say like 6 just let me know if you think you can use them. 

Charrio


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## DavidN (Nov 25, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> Donate for GREAT JUSTICE!



You have no chance to survive make your time. (Done!) It's not exactly a huge donation, but you could at least get yourself a bag of chips or something with it.


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## cesarin (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

dragoneer, you sure its convenient go to for the old 940 pin insteath of AM2?
AM2 can go to quadcore, socket 940 is stuck at (ddr 1 ) at  2.8 Ghz dual core 90 nm


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## Kairyu (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Cool, just made it! 
Its not a crazy amount but according to amazon's total that'll put you over the 1k mark ;D.


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				cesarin said:
			
		

> dragoneer, you sure its convenient go to for the old 940 pin insteath of AM2?
> AM2 can go to quadcore, socket 940 is stuck at (ddr 1 ) at  2.8 Ghz dual core 90 nm


If enough money comes in, the specs will jump up to a Xeon 5140, which smokes the fastest Opterons... for far less cash per capita. It's a bit more expensive of an initial investment, but the new Xeons are Apeshit Andy.

I'd love a 5150 if we had the money, but I'm not pushing my luck (or FA's budget!)


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Kairyu said:
			
		

> Cool, just made it!
> Its not a crazy amount but according to amazon's total that'll put you over the 1k mark ;D.





			
				DavidN said:
			
		

> You have no chance to survive make your time. (Done!) It's not exactly a huge donation, but you could at least get yourself a bag of chips or something with it.





			
				TheFox said:
			
		

> Is there any way I can donate with PayPal?





			
				NetRat13 said:
			
		

> ^^  All the movies this weekend are pretty bad--so I'll put my money to where it'll be put to better use.  Here ya go, folks.





			
				White Dingo said:
			
		

> -- E-mailed in a Paypal donation





			
				Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> One last minute donation then.


Thanks so much for the donations, guys! YOU ALL ROCK!


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## keeshah (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> I'm going to be putting in the order for the new server on the 1st of December. If you would like to get in a *last minute donation* to help us buff and streamline the DB server, you've still got a few days left!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Only 4GB of Ram?  I thought the problem was the 4Gb we have now wasn't enought..  what about 8GB of ram?


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## keeshah (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> cesarin said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What the $$$ level we have to reach to get to the Xeon 5140 an the 5150's?


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## Taristin (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

whats that paypal info now? Im not a fan of amazoon. >..>;;

mayhaps send the note on the main furaffinity page... I dont check the forums enough to notice it >..>


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Taristin said:
			
		

> whats that paypal info now? Im not a fan of amazoon. >..>;;
> 
> mayhaps send the note on the main furaffinity page... I dont check the forums enough to notice it >..>


it may be possible.


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				keeshah said:
			
		

> Only 4GB of Ram?  I thought the problem was the 4Gb we have now wasn't enought..  what about 8GB of ram?


Originally, we could only have one server... but now we have have two. So, we'll have one dedicated DB server (the new, ultra fast one) and one file server. Each server will have 4GB of RAM.

So, the server right now is using 4GB of RAM to do all tasks. If we can split that up, we can divide the ram to have a more proper efficiency.


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				keeshah said:
			
		

> What the $$$ level we have to reach to get to the Xeon 5140 an the 5150's?


We'd need about $200 more to get the chip.


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## Janglur (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Socket 940 is a bad investment, as it's basically obsolete.  If you get this, you'll be maxed out to start with, and nowhere to go for upgrades.

Also, I sure hope it can handle more than 4 GB of RAM.

It's not worth it to upgrade to 'just enough', Dragoneer, you need room to expand further in the future.  FA is overloaded now.  When the overload is fixed, those who were idle or non-participate will join back, raising the load higher.  Then new artists will join, as will those who didn't join initially because of speed issues, growing it further.

Plan for the future.

Also, i'd suggest faster and better HDDs.  Those aren't filer-server-grade by any means.


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Janglur said:
			
		

> Socket 940 is a bad investment, as it's basically obsolete.  If you get this, you'll be maxed out to start with, and nowhere to go for upgrades.
> 
> Also, I sure hope it can handle more than 4 GB of RAM.


The best of last-gen doesn't make it obsolete. It's the Google theory of get a great mid-range system. Any board I get is going to have a maximum upgrade path of 16 to 32GB of RAM. That doesn't mean I'm not looking at future upgradability, but six months ago, the 940's were the cream of the crop, and are by no means craptastic by today's means.


			
				Janglur said:
			
		

> It's not worth it to upgrade to 'just enough', Dragoneer, you need room to expand further in the future.  FA is overloaded now.  When the overload is fixed, those who were idle or non-participate will join back, raising the load higher.  Then new artists will join, as will those who didn't join initially because of speed issues, growing it further.
> 
> Plan for the future.


Splitting FA into two servers - a file server and a database server - will take off a huge amount of load on the current box, giving lots of room to grow. Once the code is revised and written more efficiently, we'll be able to further utilize the current resources better as well.

Proper utilization of multi-box delivery will improve things further.


			
				Janglur said:
			
		

> Also, i'd suggest faster and better HDDs.  Those aren't filer-server-grade by any means.


No, they're not... but as much as I'd love to get quad WD Raptors (or even SAS drives) they're not in the budget (unless, of course, we get a few hundred more in, then we can make a truly bad ass DB server).


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## Janglur (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Raptors aren't server drives either, they're desktop drives.
That board has built-in SCSI RAID, that eliminates the majority of the cost right there.


I'm seriously leery about these choices, I must say and say loudly.Â Â I'd reccomend just waiting a bit longer until you can at the very least afford better harddrives.Â Â Server grade U320 with 5 year+ warranties.

Budget or not, it's still a waste of money if it dies a few months in.


I'd reccomend http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16822332004Â Â if you have adequate cooling, else the cheaper and cooler running http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16822332002
Only about 3x more expensive than your current drives, but server-grade reliability, a long warranty, and excellent speed.Â Â One of the 15k drives can serve two to three times as many users as your current.
It effectively pays for itself.


Also note that that board only supports RAID 0, 1, 10, and JBOD


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Janglur said:
			
		

> Raptors aren't server drives either, they're desktop drives.
> That board has built-in SCSI RAID, that eliminates the majority of the cost right there.
> 
> Also note that that board only supports RAID 0, 1, 10, and JBOD


The RAID card we are getting supports RAID 0, 1, 10, 5, 50, Single Disk, & JBOD. I'm not doing built-in RAID, because that's just further inefficient.

I'd love to go with SAS, but I can't afford to buy three of those drives to do a RAID 5. I don't have an extra $2,000 to sink into the server's storage system. While it would be nice, it's not happening. FA doesn't haverich pockets to dip into.

Those SCSI drives offer a 5 year warranty, which is nice, but so does the Raptors.


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## Larathen (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

I'll donate the last $4 in my dead PayPal account.

Since I never use it might as well put it in for good use.

Paying info plz


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Well, after a bit of cobbling... we could work in a SCSI system.

TYAN B3992G24V4H 1U Barebone Server
4X  Seagate Cheetah 10K.7 74GB 10,000 RPM SCSI Ultra320
AMD Opteron 2214 Santa Rosa 2.2Ghz Dual Core
HP 409180-B21 PCI Express x4 SATA-150 / SAS Smart Array
2X Kingston 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 FB-DIMM DDR2 667 (PC2 5300)

$3,057.92


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## Janglur (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Just remember.

Spend $500 less, and lose $2000 in downtime.

Spend $500 more, and have it pay for itself.


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## Coyoroo (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

I must say it is definately worth it, just donated to it too! Thank you for your hard work to creating a site that allows anyone to post up their creations and works, it has been an awesome experience soo far ^.^

Thankies once again!!!!

Coy
http://www.roofur.com


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## tysla (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

*click, click, click* there, *whew* 

Almost forgot about that, hope it helps!


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## Larathen (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Whom do I send to in PayPal for my $4?


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## Dragoneer (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Larathen said:
			
		

> Whom do I send to in PayPal for my $4?


check your notes


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## Semi (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Aw, what the heck. Donated a few days ago, but I guess I can throw in a few more bucks. It's not a lot, but if enough people chip in, a little goes a long way.


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## Larathen (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

MAKE GOOD USE WITH MY $4 >:I


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## kyubi_youma (Nov 26, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

tried to pay $55to make it 1100 lol didnt work to well lol


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## Caliwayz (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*






HERE, TAKE ALL OF MY MONEY


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## inaki (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

At risk of starting flames, SATA is perfectly fine for servers. The cost per GB compared to reliability just makes sense, especially when you're on a budget. I've been running on 6 300GB Seagate SATAII drives on my server for the last year with absolutely no problems (I'm pushing close to 5mbit currently.) I've actually had more SCSI and Fiberchannel drives die on me than SATA at this point. ;>

The idea of splitting the servers is actually a really good one. I like it =D

As far as AM2 goes, I do agree its fantastic for desktops, but do they make AM2 server motherboards? I'd lean more towards 940 or Xeon if not. But ya.. Good luck with the upgrade. =D


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## winnme (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Heya, I just donated my $50 for your needs 
Just don't buy too restrictive hardware.....


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## Beo (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

:s, figures, i always find out about this stuff late, i dont even read forums for my games, but u guys got the privilage , ill have to get ya on the next charitable cause


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## Icelyon (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Woo, donation made ^^

This site deserves it  Now to do some commissions to make the money back XD


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## squire (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

$20 on its way 
it's a shame you're ordering so soon, i'll be giving another $200 on the 15th of Dec. it should help with something.


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## KimbaLion (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Hey =^-^=

i will do something for ya*purrr*
let me know the paypal-account, please *mew*



KL =^^=


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## Dragoneer (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				squire said:
			
		

> $20 on its way
> it's a shame you're ordering so soon, i'll be giving another $200 on the 15th of Dec. it should help with something.


I'm moving to Asia soon, so I wanna get thing squared away before I move.


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## Dragoneer (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				KimbaLion said:
			
		

> Hey =^-^=
> 
> i will do something for ya*purrr*
> let me know the paypal-account, please *mew*
> ...


If you wanna flop some donation our way it'd be welcomed.


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## PunkTiger (Nov 27, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

I just sent some munnee via PayPal for the server fund. Don't waste it all on hookers and blow. ^__^


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## Waccoon (Nov 28, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Probably been answered somewhere else, but...

Are you accepting donations any way that don't include middlemen, or allow more than $50?


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## squire (Nov 28, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



> I'm moving to Asia soon, so I wanna get thing squared away before I move.



you're getting it any way, so you can put it towards the monthly bills


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## nrr (Nov 28, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Everyone knows the answer.


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## Dragoneer (Nov 28, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				PunkTiger said:
			
		

> I just sent some munnee via PayPal for the server fund. Don't waste it all on hookers and blow. ^__^


^___^

How about JUST the blow?


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## Dragoneer (Nov 28, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Waccoon said:
			
		

> Probably been answered somewhere else, but...
> 
> Are you accepting donations any way that don't include middlemen, or allow more than $50?


I can accept USPS money order directly or Paypal, either one. =D


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## AX (Nov 28, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> PunkTiger said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Blow plz! <3


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## PunkTiger (Nov 28, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> PunkTiger said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Well... OK. You can waste some on a little blow. Just one nostril's worth, mind. And as long as it doesn't ruin your Vegenostrum.


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## keeshah (Nov 29, 2006)

*Amazon $$$ goal nearly reached!!!*

We are only $170.69 away from reaching the Goal on the Amazon server fund
site... on 77 donations. 
An this is not counting the donations being sent in via paypal, or money order, right? 

 Looks like we we will be fast an furry-ous on Xeon processors..


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## foxystallion (Nov 30, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				Dragoneer said:
			
		

> TheFox said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Please send me that data, too.  I hope that this new server will have the capacity to enable you to turn the search back on.  Thank you!!


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## Rhainor (Nov 30, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				foxystallion said:
			
		

> I hope that this new server will have the capacity to enable you to turn the search back on.



As has been stated numerous times, the search function will return when the site is switched over to the new Ferrox system.  This is a few months away, IIRC.


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## Ksilebo (Nov 30, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Its a bit close to the deadline, but I have some recommendations to the hardware.

I recommend 4 147 GB 10k RPM drives in RAID 10 (database data) and the remaining drive bays with 74 GB 10k RPM drives in RAID 1 (OS/Boot). I worked for a webhosting company and we did custom servers. You're almost right on for the most ideal DB server except for that small detail. Of course SCSI would be optimal but you're on a budget.

Also, I recommend the purchase of another RAID card to do the RAID 1 for the OS drives (3Ware 8000 series). The onboard RAID on the Supermicro motherboards is NOT hardware RAID. If you install Linux, it will NOT see it as a single drive and will instead show 2 seperate drives. For the amount of I/O you're going to be shoving through this server, software RAID will become a bottleneck.

Additionally, I suggest getting a quote from my previous company. They can likely get you a good deal on the hardware. If not, then, oh well.

If you wish to contact me, you're an admin so you can get my email address. Inaki keeps passing on what goes on with this so I thought I'd throw in my $.02.


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## yak (Nov 30, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

*Ksilebo*
This server is planned from the beginning to be a dedicated database box, not 'packed full' at the moment, but with the possibility to upgrade in the future. The hardware to be used is not yet decided upon, we are still discussing things. 
Here's what i'd suggest for a server.

CPU
-----
After much investigation, i believe the Opterons are way to go, and not Xeons.


* Much lower power consumption. 372 or 453 Watts at full load for Xeons (depending on the model), it way too much, in my opinion. Especially considering that the PSU will most likely be 500 or 600Watt. 
Xeons are a nuclear reactor waiting to melt the insides of the server.
* On-die memory controller, yielding twice the memory bandwidth throughput then any Xeon. Since with the addition of RAM, full table data caching is possible, CPU-Memory bandwidth becomes even more important then I/O bandwidth.
* Cheaper cost
* Doesn't need FB-DIMM in order to run, which, AFAIK is Intel-only kind of RAM. Also, FB-DIMM has a high latency, much higher then that of DDRII
* Much better support of both x64 and x32 code execution. Native x32 code execution capability.
* Performs slightly worse then Xeons, but if you compare their clocks...
* I'm an AMD fanboi.

I/O
--------
I seriously would love to see 74Gbyte 15k RPM SCSI drives in RAID 1+0 for the database. Yes, the storage space seems a bit low, but this is a pure database box, and given the growth speed of FA's DB at the moment, it would take many years to grow tables as big as 60GBytes. 
Having 147Gbyte drives /there/ currently would be an overkill, and that money better be used to get some more RAM, or SATA storage space for FA's data.

Standalone battery-backed hardware RAID controller capable of doing 1+0 and 5. AND NO SAS, please - it still has a crappy support under *nix. SCSI only. 

RAM
---------
Minimum 4Gbytes now, with the possibility to add 28 more, when it would be needed. ECC and whatever else feature are supposed to be in server-ram - i honestly don't know.

Platform
-----------
2U, nuff said. More 'inside' space for better cooling, more storage bays. Maybe, just maybe, it could be used for a file storage, if not for primary data then for regular backups.

Motherboard
----------------
Tyan makes pretty good mobo's. I can't advise anything in this case. 
It doesn't need to have a SCSI controller, since it will not be used anyway - but is should support SATA. 
2 processor capable, socket F i believe. With the upcoming quad core CPU's, it leaves a nice reserve in case we'd need more processing power. 

PSU
---------
Redundant, and that will still have ~15% more power then all power consumption of the box will have.

-----
That's about all i can think off at the moment..  I don't know if the raised money is enough to get that kind of hardware.


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## Dragoneer (Nov 30, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*



			
				yak said:
			
		

> CPU
> -----
> After much investigation, i believe the Opterons are way to go, and not Xeons.
> 
> ...




http://www.tgdaily.com/2006/06/24/woodcrest_benchmarks/

The Xeons that we would get are Woodcrest, which use as much OR LESS power than an Opteron. =) And that means less heat. Intel really cleaned up its act.


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## Dragoneer (Nov 30, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Just a note: server order date will be pushed back a few days while about $600 in donations transfer to the account.

$5,392.00 is the final server cost estimate. I will announce specs soon.


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## Dragoneer (Dec 1, 2006)

*RE: New Server Order Date: December 1st, 2006*

Nevermind. It looks like things worked out better than I expected.


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## knottyjames (Dec 1, 2006)

How could I send some money via PayPal?


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## Dragoneer (Dec 1, 2006)

knottyjames said:
			
		

> How could I send some money via PayPal?


You can send it to over if you want to help pay for my purchase of new hardware. =)


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