# Need some advice for life drawing...?



## Kailombax (Jun 28, 2011)

Hello,

Well I'm going to be starting college soon and I decided it's time I got to improving my art. I'm going to sign up for some life drawing classes to help with my art (generally with anatomy and proportions as I need to work on that subject heavily). The thing is, I'm not sure how to go about drawing the subject matter...  So I thought maybe it would be good to ask for some advice/tips?


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## Arshes Nei (Jun 28, 2011)

You do what the teacher tells you.

NSFW nudity: http://conceptart.org/forums/showthread.php?t=222986


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## SlushPuppy (Jun 28, 2011)

Draw what you see not what you know.
Also, try covering one eye- I usually just close one, but one drawing teacher I had would always have eye patches handy for the purpose!
Lastly, don't get embarrassed about nudity. It won't help you at all.  You're supposed to look and see, so hiding or trying not to see certain parts won't help.
Mr Bean + his art class


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## Jw (Jun 28, 2011)

Kailombax said:


> Hello,
> 
> Well I'm going to be starting college soon and I decided it's time I got to improving my art. I'm going to sign up for some life drawing classes to help with my art (generally with anatomy and proportions as I need to work on that subject heavily). The thing is, I'm not sure how to go about drawing the subject matter...  So I thought maybe it would be good to ask for some advice/tips?


 
Not to be blunt, but you're going to college. Ask your professor. I hope he or she knows a hell of a lot more than me or any of us here. 

Regardless, you will need to work large and with lots of full arm movement at fist, then gradually refine your drawing. i hate that about many often "how to draw books" imply you're working your way down a body and finalizing as you go. That's crap. Working evenly on the entire body is the best way to maintain good proportions and make sure you do well to keep the inherent motion of the person IN your figure. 

That's the #1 mistake I see people make starting out.


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## Karnak (Jun 28, 2011)

First post but its something i know about having graduated from art college. I would concur with the previous post regarding drawing what you see and forgetting any preconceptions you will have about human construction. You must try and see the model as any other still life like a bowl of fruit or something.   Try many types of media and don't limit yourself to simply pens and pencils, we would often create collages, stain or paint an abstract mess onto the paper or canvas before starting.   My flatmate and fellow graduate is currently improving his anatomic drawing skills by a combination of sketching the public and studying muscle and bone structure in medical books and art books, grey's anatomy is a good book for artists as its amazingly well illustrated.  Nothing can ever approximate drawing living models though


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## SlushPuppy (Jun 28, 2011)

Karnak said:


> grey's anatomy is a good book for artists as its amazingly well illustrated.  Nothing can ever approximate drawing living models though


 
I <3 Grey's anatomy. That one is never far from my fingers.


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## Arshes Nei (Jun 28, 2011)

Jw said:


> Not to be blunt, but you're going to college. Ask your professor. I hope he or she knows a hell of a lot more than me or any of us here.


 
I never understood why people who go to pay to go to college ask the internet (who are not paid for this profession for the most part) before asking their teacher.

The teacher is being paid to tell you what to do and give you an approach.

Also guys, life drawing class not always = figure drawing. Meaning that depending on the instructor it can also mean a lot of still life observations. So like I said listen to what the teacher says first before asking us for advice. You may end up spending it on materials and books that won't go with your class.


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## Kailombax (Jun 28, 2011)

Jw said:


> Not to be blunt, but you're going to college. Ask your professor. I hope he or she knows a hell of a lot more than me or any of us here.
> 
> Regardless, you will need to work large and with lots of full arm movement at fist, then gradually refine your drawing. i hate that about many often "how to draw books" imply you're working your way down a body and finalizing as you go. That's crap. Working evenly on the entire body is the best way to maintain good proportions and make sure you do well to keep the inherent motion of the person IN your figure.
> 
> That's the #1 mistake I see people make starting out.


 
Okay, noted. Thank you for the advice. And I'll definitely ask my teacher when I start the class.



SlushPuppy said:


> Draw what you see not what you know.
> Also, try covering one eye- I usually just close one, but one drawing teacher I had would always have eye patches handy for the purpose!
> Lastly, don't get embarrassed about nudity. It won't help you at all.  You're supposed to look and see, so hiding or trying not to see certain parts won't help.
> Mr Bean + his art class



Oh the nudity thing won't be a big deal to me so I think I'll be fine there.  

And try drawing with one eye covered? Hmm, that doesn't sound like a bad idea. I'll give it a shot. Thank you for the advice. 



Arshes Nei said:


> I never understood why people who go to pay to go to college ask the internet (who are not paid for this profession for the most part) before asking their teacher.
> 
> The teacher is being paid to tell you what to do and give you an approach.
> 
> Also guys, life drawing class not always = figure drawing. Meaning that depending on the instructor it can also mean a lot of still life observations. So like I said listen to what the teacher says first before asking us for advice. You may end up spending it on materials and books that won't go with your class.


 
I only came to ask because I was curious, that's all.
And I'm excited for when the class starts in two months so I just figured I'd ask for some advice or anything I need to know before. 
And I'll keep that in mind to listen to the teacher and ask him/her for advice. Thank you for your answer.


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## Kailombax (Jun 28, 2011)

Karnak said:


> First post but its something i know about having graduated from art college. I would concur with the previous post regarding drawing what you see and forgetting any preconceptions you will have about human construction. You must try and see the model as any other still life like a bowl of fruit or something.   Try many types of media and don't limit yourself to simply pens and pencils, we would often create collages, stain or paint an abstract mess onto the paper or canvas before starting.   My flatmate and fellow graduate is currently improving his anatomic drawing skills by a combination of sketching the public and studying muscle and bone structure in medical books and art books, grey's anatomy is a good book for artists as its amazingly well illustrated.  Nothing can ever approximate drawing living models though


 
Noted and noted, thank you for the advice. 
And I actually have tried drawing from life before. I was sitting at a park with my sketch pad and sketched the different people moving. Even though my gesture like sketches turned out horrid, it did feel good to step out of my boundary and draw movement in life.


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## shenlong4626 (Jun 29, 2011)

Something that a lot of people forget about, when learning or teaching art/drawing/painting, is that they type of thinking you are familiar with plays a part in how your artistic intention is laid out. Many people try to use their analytical mind to append their thoughts and observations to the medium in which they are using. 

While this is great and all, it is usually the harder way to work. Studying anatomy is a wonderful way to improve your characters. Human, Animal, Plant, Insect, and even Microbial anatomy will help greatly when you are faced with the challenge of juxtaposition of traits from one archetype onto another. But, if you are too focused in your thinking of "This should be this size" or "That should be this shape" it will cause you a lot of headaches as you learn. 

There is are a few techniques that one of my art teachers from ages past taught us, but one that I think you might benefit from most  It's actually fairly simple. All you have to do is turn the image you are working from(or actual life) upside down. Once you have done that sketch, paint, collage what you see... Don't try to identify what the shapes you are interpreting as something like... foot, bones, building, chair, cloud, or anything other than the shape you are scribing into your medium. 







Above ^^ is a very popular exercise for the method. Don't flip the image over when you are drawing it, and don't try to identify it, or it's pieces, while you draw it. Just draw what you see 



If you are going to try to draw with one eye covered you should cover the Right side eye, that way the Left eye/Right Brain(the Art side) is the side you are interpreting with.


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## dewclawpaw (Jun 29, 2011)

Don't copy the figure, analyze it. I'd say the best books to have on hand would be Forcerawing for animators, Spirit of the pose, Andrew Loomis, get an anatomy book, Anything by Ron Lemen is good. Theres no right way to draw but theres sure a wrong way. Don't copy the figure draw what your analyzing.


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## SlushPuppy (Jun 29, 2011)

Arshes Nei said:


> I never understood why people who go to pay to go to college ask the internet (who are not paid for this profession for the most part) before asking their teacher.
> 
> The teacher is being paid to tell you what to do and give you an approach.
> 
> Also guys, life drawing class not always = figure drawing. Meaning that depending on the instructor it can also mean a lot of still life observations. So like I said listen to what the teacher says first before asking us for advice. You may end up spending it on materials and books that won't go with your class.


 
Wisdom is free, and is always freely given. Receiving input from more than one source isn't a bad thing. And if it dis-spells some heebee-jeebee's there's no harm. 

As for figure vs still life- Arshes is right, expect to do TONS of set ups before getting to draw any people. It gets old and tedious, but really there's not much better way to practice drawing what's there vs known, and to become familiar with lighting, textures, and composition.


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## Jw (Jun 29, 2011)

SlushPuppy said:


> Wisdom is free, and is always freely given. Receiving input from more than one source isn't a bad thing. And if it dis-spells some heebee-jeebee's there's no harm.
> 
> As for figure vs still life- Arshes is right, expect to do TONS of set ups before getting to draw any people. It gets old and tedious, but really there's not much better way to practice drawing what's there vs known, and to become familiar with lighting, textures, and composition.



The point she was making: the professor will guide you in the path he or she wants you to go in while drawing. There's no sense to go out and purchase all of these books and supplies if you're going to spend the first couple of weeks only using vine charcoal. 

Now as for us, we CAN offer advice, but it's best to listen to the person that you're paying via tuition first, especially if he or she has a doctorate in fine arts or even a  few masters. *Once they get going in the class and want to do some drawings in their free time we can help out as needed.* But really, when I took my class on graphic design, there was SO much I learned by talking with my professor one-on-one after classes and in the middle of projects that I actually could improve my skills and better my understanding of composition, flow, weight and line emphasis.


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## Arshes Nei (Jun 29, 2011)

SlushPuppy said:


> Wisdom is free, and is always freely given. Receiving input from more than one source isn't a bad thing. And if it dis-spells some heebee-jeebee's there's no harm.
> 
> As for figure vs still life- Arshes is right, expect to do TONS of set ups before getting to draw any people. It gets old and tedious, but really there's not much better way to practice drawing what's there vs known, and to become familiar with lighting, textures, and composition.


 
My advice IS advice. Listen to/ engage with your teacher - you're PAYING them. The OP is now going to have someone there who will fill in the blanks we can't do. Teacher can show how to make a good stroke when doing life drawing - we can only describe it. Don't go out and spend money on books like Grey's Anatomy because knowing a muscle is different than drawing the form. Doctors memorize anatomy all the time - this doesn't make them artists. OP's teacher *may* recommend getting it, but may also teach that person how to look for form and how to draw it. That teacher may know a better book to understand artistic anatomy. That and how to dissect it and make it work so you can draw from your imagination. 

So what I'm saying is now that person is going to have access to first hand engagement and throwing money at this person to do it. Get the most out of it you can, don't use us so much. You got a question, ask that teacher first! Then if you don't understand what your professor is saying ask us to see if we can interpret. Of course do so reasonably, the only way you get better is drawing a lot. So you have to think, you want to learn a lot - is it going to do you good spending time dinking about on the internet and responding to every post, or better utilizing that time to work on the assignments? I'm not saying don't take breaks because you'll need them, but everyone talks about the mistakes an artist makes.

The biggest mistake is not managing his/her time to draw and utilizing things he/she pays for.


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## Kailombax (Jun 30, 2011)

SlushPuppy said:


> Wisdom is free, and is always freely given. Receiving input from more than one source isn't a bad thing. And if it dis-spells some heebee-jeebee's there's no harm.
> 
> As for figure vs still life- Arshes is right, expect to do TONS of set ups before getting to draw any people. It gets old and tedious, but really there's not much better way to practice drawing what's there vs known, and to become familiar with lighting, textures, and composition.


 
Ah okay. Well then it will be just like when I took an art class for a summer program I took when I was 17. We did all sorts of objects and while it was mundane and kind of boring, it really was a challenge and I ended up liking it. But yeah, thank you for the heads up. 



dewclawpaw said:


> Don't copy the figure, analyze it. I'd say the best books to have on hand would be Forcerawing for animators, Spirit of the pose, Andrew Loomis, get an anatomy book, Anything by Ron Lemen is good. Theres no right way to draw but theres sure a wrong way. Don't copy the figure draw what your analyzing.



Well I'll defnitely keep the "Don't copy the figure, analyze it" in mind for sure. That was one of my problems in the beginning, I'd always try to draw exactly what I saw. And I'll take Arhes advise and not purchase any books yet until I start the class. But thanks for the suggestions, I actually did look through "Force: Drawing for Animators", it wasn't a bad read at all. I'll definitely check out the other books next time I go to a bookstore. Thank you for suggestions nonetheless. 



shenlong4626 said:


> Something that a lot of people forget about, when learning or teaching art/drawing/painting, is that they type of thinking you are familiar with plays a part in how your artistic intention is laid out. Many people try to use their analytical mind to append their thoughts and observations to the medium in which they are using.
> 
> While this is great and all, it is usually the harder way to work. Studying anatomy is a wonderful way to improve your characters. Human, Animal, Plant, Insect, and even Microbial anatomy will help greatly when you are faced with the challenge of juxtaposition of traits from one archetype onto another. But, if you are too focused in your thinking of "This should be this size" or "That should be this shape" it will cause you a lot of headaches as you learn.
> 
> ...



Ah, drawing with the object upside down sounds like a good exercise. I'll definitely try that experiment for sure. And cover my right eye? Gotcha. Thank you for the advice, I really appreciate it.


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## Kailombax (Jun 30, 2011)

Arshes Nei said:


> My advice IS advice. Listen to/ engage with your teacher - you're PAYING them. The OP is now going to have someone there who will fill in the blanks we can't do. Teacher can show how to make a good stroke when doing life drawing - we can only describe it. Don't go out and spend money on books like Grey's Anatomy because knowing a muscle is different than drawing the form. Doctors memorize anatomy all the time - this doesn't make them artists. OP's teacher *may* recommend getting it, but may also teach that person how to look for form and how to draw it. That teacher may know a better book to understand artistic anatomy. That and how to dissect it and make it work so you can draw from your imagination.
> 
> So what I'm saying is now that person is going to have access to first hand engagement and throwing money at this person to do it. Get the most out of it you can, don't use us so much. You got a question, ask that teacher first! Then if you don't understand what your professor is saying ask us to see if we can interpret. Of course do so reasonably, the only way you get better is drawing a lot. So you have to think, you want to learn a lot - is it going to do you good spending time dinking about on the internet and responding to every post, or better utilizing that time to work on the assignments? I'm not saying don't take breaks because you'll need them, but everyone talks about the mistakes an artist makes.
> 
> The biggest mistake is not managing his/her time to draw and utilizing things he/she pays for.


 
I really thank you for the advice. I understand where you are coming from now. I'll take your advice and be sure to ask my teacher for help and tips. I was actually talking to my dad a few days ago and he told me that when I start my class, I should find a drawing teacher/mentor that I can have 1on1 time with so that he/she can show me some tips on how to do whatever it is I need to work on so I'm definitely going to reach out for guidance. 

Thank you in advance Arshes, I really appreciate it.


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## Arshes Nei (Jun 30, 2011)

Kailombax said:


> I really thank you for the advice. I understand where you are coming from now. I'll take your advice and be sure to ask my teacher for help and tips. I was actually talking to my dad a few days ago and he told me that when I start my class, I should find a drawing teacher/mentor that I can have 1on1 time with so that he/she can show me some tips on how to do whatever it is I need to work on so I'm definitely going to reach out for guidance.
> 
> Thank you in advance Arshes, I really appreciate it.



Well a lot of it is how bad you want to do this. All the teachers and supplementary materials in the world won't help if you don't put a lot of effort into it. Also hang out with the right kind of people and goals.

While I am telling you to hold off on the books, it's just to see what the teacher says first because your instructor may know better which books will click with you. However, if those books aren't clicking, then find other books.

What I mean about like minded goals is like having an exercise buddy. If you need to loose weight or get in shape with more muscle, do you hang around the people eating potato chips and junk food all day complaining how they are fat, or do you hang out with the people who are working hard to get in shape? Art is no different, though you can go this alone too - since it is all up to you.


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## Kailombax (Jun 30, 2011)

Arshes Nei said:


> Well a lot of it is how bad you want to do this. All the teachers and supplementary materials in the world won't help if you don't put a lot of effort into it. Also hang out with the right kind of people and goals.
> 
> While I am telling you to hold off on the books, it's just to see what the teacher says first because your instructor may know better which books will click with you. However, if those books aren't clicking, then find other books.
> 
> What I mean about like minded goals is like having an exercise buddy. If you need to loose weight or get in shape with more muscle, do you hang around the people eating potato chips and junk food all day complaining how they are fat, or do you hang out with the people who are working hard to get in shape? Art is no different, though you can go this alone too - since it is all up to you.


 
I assure, I really do want to become better. And it's not to impress others, it's for me. I wanna improve on doing what I enjoy and make a career out of it. I can't picture myself doing a day job counting numbers and the like. And yeah, I will try to look for like minded people with goals. Like I said, I don't know any people in real life who are passionate with art like I am (those I have met were back in high school and they only drawing/art as a side hobby and then grew out of it after school). So yeah, I literally have no art friends in real life as yet but hopefully, I can meet some in college. I'd actually want a drawing buddy because it gets pretty lonely just drawing on my own. 

And I'll take your advice on the books as well.


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