# I hate furry heterophobes



## vermillion (Jan 6, 2015)

On FA mainsite (and other furry sites) I've seen posts from mostly gay men saying that they hate vaginas, hate women, hate "breeders" (pejorative for straight people), etc. It makes me really mad and upset at how immature and ignorant they are. It also makes me really ashamed to be a gay male. I love my straight friends (which is mostly all of them since honestly I don't get along well with other gay people) and I love females too. I'm not grossed out by vaginas (unless they has teh blue wafflez), I think they're cool, I wouldn't mind having one (if I could keep my dick too). Anyway, has anyone else seen furry heterophobia and what was your reaction to it?


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## Taralack (Jan 6, 2015)

I've seen Tumblr heterophobia. It's just funny.


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## dirtypaws (Jan 6, 2015)

this is so obviously a troll post...


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## Zeitzbach (Jan 6, 2015)

Girls are like icebergs to my Titanic.


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## Mikazuki Marazhu (Jan 6, 2015)

I am somewhat like that. On my planet. We don't have females, male pregnancy is possible. If we want to get pregnant... We do oral sex.


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## Brass (Jan 6, 2015)

vermillion said:


> On FA mainsite (and other furry sites) I've seen posts from mostly gay men saying that they hate vaginas, hate women, hate "breeders" (pejorative for straight people), etc. It makes me really mad and upset at how immature and ignorant they are. It also makes me really ashamed to be a gay male. I love my straight friends (which is mostly all of them since honestly I don't get along well with other gay people) and I love females too. I'm not grossed out by vaginas (unless they has teh blue wafflez), I think they're cool, I wouldn't mind having one (if I could keep my dick too). Anyway, has anyone else seen furry heterophobia and what was your reaction to it?



10/10 thread OP. I've only ever seen this problem on tumblr. You really can't come up with a rational reason to hate heterosexuals, and even if you could, you'd still be a hypocrite. Tasty bait.


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## mcjoel (Jan 6, 2015)

Obvious Troll is obvious
Can't say i've encountered hetrophobia but maybe I'm just an exception.


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## Maugryph (Jan 6, 2015)

Written as a steam review.

discovered troll thread. 
Left feeling empty inside.
ran into a catus
would thread again 10/10


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## Taralack (Jan 6, 2015)

mcjoel said:


> Obvious Troll is obvious
> Can't say i've encountered hetrophobia but maybe I'm just an exception.



I've actually seen the type of comments mentioned in the OP. It's not pretty.


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## Riltmos (Jan 6, 2015)

Taralack said:


> I've actually seen the type of comments mentioned in the OP. It's not pretty.



I've seen it as well, it mostly just looks like homophobia, but with a few words swapped around. But I haven't really seen any of it here honestly, so I can't really say much more to this thread than; "hating people for their body parts and sexual preference is bad." So I will say that.


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## Catilda Lily (Jan 6, 2015)

Zeitzbach said:


> Girls are like icebergs to my Titanic.



They make you go down?


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## pinkie (Jan 6, 2015)

somebody save the heteros


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## Pinky (Jan 6, 2015)

100% chance of them being from Tumblr.


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## mcjoel (Jan 6, 2015)

Taralack said:


> I've actually seen the type of comments mentioned in the OP. It's not pretty.



That's crazy but doesn't really surprise me Just shows that humans are hateful dicks no matter what though probably half if the offenders aren't even gay.


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## Catilda Lily (Jan 6, 2015)

pinkie said:


> somebody save the heteros





Pinky said:


> 100% chance of them being from Tumblr.



Two pinkies in one thread and they happen to post one after the other.


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## Brass (Jan 6, 2015)

Riltmos said:


> I've seen it as well, it mostly just looks like homophobia, but with a few words swapped around. But I haven't really seen any of it here honestly, so I can't really say much more to this thread than; "hating people for their body parts and sexual preference is bad." So I will say that.



People are people. I blame it on people becoming jaded and stooping to the level of bigots. What I have seen more of is in-fighting in the LGTB community. A lot of homosexual folks won't recognize trans people and it gets super nasty really fast.



pinkie said:


> somebody save the heteros


It's not like they can help it any more than anyone else.


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## Butters Shikkon (Jan 6, 2015)

vermillion said:


> It also makes me really ashamed to be a gay male.



 That's sorta an overreaction. 

I'll be honest, I've never come across straight up "heterophobia". I've come across a lot of sexist furries though. Some of them homosexual. Which I think is sad, because you'd think gay men and straight women would be natural allies. Almost all my irl friends are ladies soooo yeah shame on those nasty comments.


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## pinkie (Jan 6, 2015)

Catilda Lily said:


> Two pinkies in one thread and they happen to post one after the other.


Its bound to happen


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## SparkyWolf (Jan 6, 2015)

I feel ya on this one. I've gotten myself sooooo worked up over this kinda thing, that I've yelled and cursed (Which I don't do often). But I've come to realize that there's absolutely NOTHING I or any other single person can do to fix it. I now just try my best to ignore them on the basis that these people don't deserve my time and energy.


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## vermillion (Jan 6, 2015)

Butters Shikkon said:


> That's sorta an overreaction.
> 
> I'll be honest, I've never come across straight up "heterophobia". I've come across a lot of sexist furries though. Some of them homosexual. Which I think is sad, because you'd think gay men and straight women would be natural allies. Almost all my irl friends are ladies soooo yeah shame on those nasty comments.


No it's not, it's a perfectly good reaction.

Also I know that there is sort of a reason for it but it's still not justifyable. You see, straight women love having gay male friends if their gay friends adhere to the gay femme stereotype- loves shopping and fashion, very flambouyant, etc. But most gay furries are just the lonely nerd type- the same type that these girls would have made fun of or rejected as friends in school. I know this first hand because I was one and you know what? For a while, I had only male friends, not one girl was willing to go near me. They thought I was a creepy loner. That's just straight girls going through high school bullshit though. People change, sometimes for better and sometimes for worse. Now the majority of my friends are girls but that's because I became more social and met girls who accepted me. Some of these loser nerd types never meet any good girls so they stay sexist forever. It's sad but true. And nobody really wants to hangout with someone who shoves dragon dildos in their butt (or even in their dick) anyway (I bet only guys are customers at Bad Dragon to be honest). Also, from a young age, girls are taught that weird loner guys could be creepers or potential rapists, so they back away from them. Our society is pretty messed up, now that I come to think of it.

Also, for all of you saying you never saw it: back on FA mainsite like... 3 or 4 years ago? (maybe even longer than that) there was a big controversy in the gayfurries page. The admin at the time would always post controversial journals but one day he posted one that said "Vaginas: What do you think of them?". All the gay men said heterophobic stuff like "eww they're nasty!!!11111" and then the straight guys and the girls got mad (why they even were on a page for gay males, I don't know, but that's besides the point) and I remember one guy telling them to "get [their] shit-crusted dicks off of FA" or something like that. Eventually the admin had to delete the journal I think but I'm surprised that none of you guys remember that. Oh and there was a comic that mentioned heterophobia and once again all the queer men got raged saying "I SUFFER MORE THAN THEY DO!!!111" and got all butthurt about anything that wasn't making them the victims.


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## GarthTheWereWolf (Jan 6, 2015)

I've never really experienced, "heterophobia" from the gay community on the fa main site, but I have seen quite a lot of misogyny from gay guys who go above and beyond simply finding the vag to be squicky and instead into the realm of seeing all women as subhuman. Its a pretty irritating attitude since a lot of girls are some of the coolest people I know. It gets under my skin to encounter this prejudice in gay guys whom are otherwise really nice. 

I have debated this with a few of them and a common theme I'd heard was that they'd been bullied by girls growing up. Not because they were 'the creepy kid' like vermillion pointed out, but just general childhood bullying. They resented the fact that they couldn't respond to it because boys are taught from a young age that you shouldn't hit girls or you shouldn't say mean things to girls and that girls are generally to be treated differently. They resented that double standard and it festered into prejudice for the entire gender. It's sad, because they're really missing out by isolating themselves from having relationships with half the human population like that.


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## TrishaCat (Jan 6, 2015)

why


vermillion said:


> You see, straight women love having gay male friends if their gay friends adhere to the gay femme stereotype- loves shopping and fashion, very flambouyant, etc. But most gay furries are just the lonely nerd type-


Please no generalizations regarding women or gay furries.
Generalizations are bad.

Also in all seriousness I've noticed heterophobia on Tumblr and its dumb.


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## Butters Shikkon (Jan 6, 2015)

vermillion said:


> Also I know that there is sort of a reason for it but it's still not justifyable. You see, straight women love having gay male friends if their gay friends adhere to the gay femme stereotype- loves shopping and fashion, very flambouyant, etc. But most gay furries are just the lonely nerd type- the same type that these girls would have made fun of or rejected as friends in school. I know this first hand because I was one and you know what? For a while, I had only male friends, not one girl was willing to go near me. They thought I was a creepy loner. That's just straight girls going through high school bullshit though. People change, sometimes for better and sometimes for worse. Now the majority of my friends are girls but that's because I became more social and met girls who accepted me. Some of these loser nerd types never meet any good girls so they stay sexist forever. It's sad but true. And nobody really wants to hangout with someone who shoves dragon dildos in their butt (or even in their dick) anyway (I bet only guys are customers at Bad Dragon to be honest). Also, from a young age, girls are taught that weird loner guys could be creepers or potential rapists, so they back away from them. Our society is pretty messed up, now that I come to think of it.
> 
> Also, for all of you saying you never saw it: back on FA mainsite like... 3 or 4 years ago? (maybe even longer than that) there was a big controversy in the gayfurries page. The admin at the time would always post controversial journals but one day he posted one that said "Vaginas: What do you think of them?". All the gay men said heterophobic stuff like "eww they're nasty!!!11111" and then the straight guys and the girls got mad (why they even were on a page for gay males, I don't know, but that's besides the point) and I remember one guy telling them to "get [their] shit-crusted dicks off of FA" or something like that. Eventually the admin had to delete the journal I think but I'm surprised that none of you guys remember that. Oh and there was a comic that mentioned heterophobia and once again all the queer men got raged saying "I SUFFER MORE THAN THEY DO!!!111" and got all butthurt about anything that wasn't making them the victims.



Mkay. I don't like how you sound like a ranting panicky fool who was obviously damaged from some odd high school...rejection? I can't even tell. But you go on hating your gayness for silly reasons all you want, its not really any skin off my nose and I'm low on fucks atm anyway. 

I can't say I'd expect homosexual menfolk to find a vagina particularly beautiful, but I guess you are some sorta Pollyanna for obscure subculture lgbt groups.


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## Ayattar (Jan 6, 2015)

Heterophobia doesn't exist just as the anti-white racism doesn't exist! DEAL WITH IT!


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## Armored Chocobo (Jan 6, 2015)

Wait, there's actually people that hate straight people and call them "breeders"?

Where's the logic in that? "Yeah! fuck those guys that continue my species because I choose not to by porking a member of the same sex! They suck!"


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## Ayattar (Jan 6, 2015)

Actually we fuck, it's the homos who suck


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 6, 2015)

I still don't know if I am straight or bi (or pansexual).  I am into both male and female (and other) anthros, but when it comes to irl...I just can't see myself with another male.  There HAVE been two males that I immediately felt a physical attraction to (that warm feeling you get in your chest), but could not justify any reason to pursue it.  There have also been a few females that I experienced the same feeling for.




Ayattar said:


> Actually we fuck, it's the homos who suck



OH YOU


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## Ayattar (Jan 6, 2015)

Personally I think that purely male bodies are disgusting. Straight women and gays must be truly fucked up to like them. Actually, since they like disgusting things I consider them disgusting too.


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## Filter (Jan 6, 2015)

Phobes can be annoying, regardless of what flag they fly. Having different tastes doesn't justify harassing others for theirs. Apparently, the folks you're talking about don't buy into the rainbow concept, which is supposed to include all types. Not just gay guys.


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 6, 2015)

Haters
Gonna
Hate


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## Ayattar (Jan 6, 2015)

Filter said:


> Phobes can be annoying



Yes, especially those damn hydrophobes!
Fuck them!


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 6, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> Yes, especially those damn hydrophobes!
> Fuck them!



Hey, it's only deep water that I'm afraid of.  

Well, just the stuff you can't see the bottom of.  That and stagnant water.  Swim in a lake or pond?  Fuck that shit.


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## Zenia (Jan 6, 2015)

My favorite thing... is that a lot of the fandom artists that those type of people love (and even just the guys that are misogynists) are female. Females make the porn they love. Sure, there are male artists but I think the majority are females.


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## 1000bluntz (Jan 6, 2015)

vermillion said:


> On FA mainsite (and other furry sites) I've seen posts from mostly gay men saying that they hate vaginas, hate women, hate "breeders" (pejorative for straight people)



Yeah you see that a lot in NYC, especially in the upper west side. Wealthy upper class gay men, thinly veiled misogynistic behavior. But your whole OP is kinda silly. Heteros are not the target of hate crimes. Heteros don't have to live in fear of being threatened or harmed because of their sexual orientation. I think it's stupid to blindly hate straight people..but at the same time I can see why many queer people would rather reject what's considered "normal" in society because those standards are not friendly to everybody.


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## Ozriel (Jan 6, 2015)

1000bluntz said:


> Yeah you see that a lot in NYC, especially in the upper west side. Wealthy upper class gay men, thinly veiled misogynistic behavior. But your whole OP is kinda silly. Heteros are not the target of hate crimes. Heteros don't have to live in fear of being threatened or harmed because of their sexual orientation. I think it's stupid to blindly hate straight people..but at the same time I can see why many queer people would rather reject what's considered "normal" in society because those standards are not friendly to everybody.



That and they feel that heteros are entitled to that hate for all the ill-treatment brought to them. It's a pretty toxic mindset, especially to the allies that support LGBTQs.

But on the subject, I know a few that have this mindset and are misogynistic to female furries in general UNLESS they can get something from them. Mostly in the way of free art or leeching off of their popularity. (Like female artists drawing them free stuff, etc)
The same goes for a few transgenders (FtM) who turn to that route as well.


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## 1000bluntz (Jan 6, 2015)

Ozriel said:


> That and they feel that heteros are entitled to that hate for all the ill-treatment brought to them. It's a pretty toxic mindset, especially to the allies that support LGBTQs.



You're not an ally if you sit on the sidelines blowing your whistle when somebody says "fuck straight america". If you were an ally you would be saying it with them or questioning why this system not only murders it's queer citizens but also encourages their murder by ignoring these hate crimes.

You're no ally of mine if you don't actually take an active stance against this stuff. So what if some radicals hurt your feelings, those are the people that never stop fighting until shit gets done. Those are my allies, not straight people who say "wh-what about us, we have feelings too".


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## dirtypaws (Jan 6, 2015)

The "heterophobia" thing seems the worst out of "gold star gays" (who are always total assholes about transgender people too, go figure) who act like vaginas are lined with teeth and that "ONLY WOMEN HAVE THOSE YUCKY THINGS" and end up being really misogynistic.

There's definitely a problem of people hating heteros/cisgender heteros too but that stems more from LGBTQ people who have been treated like shit systematically for not being cishet and end up being jaded against them in general. i'll admit i definitely have a sour taste with cisgender heterosexuals, but that doesn't mean i hate them automatically. i can't imagine hating anyone by default.


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## Half-Note (Jan 6, 2015)

Jesus, why can't we all just be friends?


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## Ozriel (Jan 6, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> The "heterophobia" thing seems the worst out of "gold star gays" (who are always total assholes about transgender people too, go figure) who act like vaginas are lined with teeth and that "ONLY WOMEN HAVE THOSE YUCKY THINGS" and end up being really misogynistic.
> 
> There's definitely a problem of people hating heteros/cisgender heteros too but that stems more from LGBTQ people who have been treated like shit systematically for not being cishet and end up being jaded against them in general. i'll admit i definitely have a sour taste with cisgender heterosexuals, but that doesn't mean i hate them automatically. i can't imagine hating anyone by default.



Thinking about it systematically, yeah. Most of the shitty things that have been done to gays have always been from the (lol) "Cis scum hetero trash" and their religious zealotry. However, telling a person that "you breeders should fucking die off" is counter productive. Especially if a person supports the same cause you do and has nothing to do with the zealots.

Realistically, most of the shit done to gays have been from the religious community. Not saying that all people in said religions do it, but the psychotic, fearmongering "Fire and Brimstone" shitlords are usually the root of it.


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## Half-Note (Jan 6, 2015)

On a more serious note. Why are they afraid? Sure it's understandable that gay people would be angry about the way they've been treated, but making a reflection on the way you were treated by returning the same behavior really will just make both them and the LGBT community look no better than the people that were, and/or still are harassing them. Besides, showing fear of and hatred for someone just because of their sexual orientation will give people the impression that you are insecure about your own sexuality.


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## Xela-Dasi (Jan 6, 2015)

Armored Chocobo said:


> Wait, there's actually people that hate straight people and call them "breeders"?
> 
> Where's the logic in that? "Yeah! fuck those guys that continue my species because I choose not to by porking a member of the same sex! They suck!"



Actually gay people aren't "born" gay. They just hate humanity so much they refuse to have sexual pleasure with the opposite sex because they risk helping their own species! ~


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## Zop (Jan 6, 2015)

I don't even know if it's heterophobia in the strict sense. It almost seems more like "if I can't have sex with it, I don't care about it".


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## pinkie (Jan 6, 2015)

Armored Chocobo said:


> Wait, there's actually people that hate straight people and call them "breeders"?
> 
> Where's the logic in that? "Yeah! fuck those guys that continue my species because I choose not to by porking a member of the same sex! They suck!"


gay people can reproduce.


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## Ozriel (Jan 6, 2015)

Zop said:


> I don't even know if it's heterophobia in the strict sense. It almost seems more like "if I can't have sex with it, I don't care about it".



Not really. It's easy to ignore something that refuses to bang you. But the vitriol towards a person that's a different sexuality is another matter in itself.


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## Zop (Jan 6, 2015)

Ozriel said:


> Not really. It's easy to ignore something that refuses to bang you. But the vitriol towards a person that's a different sexuality is another matter in itself.



Yeah that's true. I guess I'm just speaking anecdotally on what I heard from a gay friend. He mentioned that the community where he lives shares that sort of sentiment. Then again, everywhere is different.


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## Ayattar (Jan 6, 2015)

Ok, now I need to request nickname change to _Dat cisgender Nazi scum_


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## Troj (Jan 6, 2015)

I've called people breeders, and technically, I _am one_.

Seriously, I can't muster up much indignation around heterophobia, since I've never been adversely affected by it, nor has anyone else that I can think of.


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 6, 2015)

pinkie said:


> gay people can reproduce.



Yeah, with a female's womb.


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## RedSavage (Jan 6, 2015)

I think we should all hate each other equally regardless of race, gender, sexuality, or religion. 


Which is none at all.


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## dirtypaws (Jan 6, 2015)

isuckatdrawing said:


> Yeah, with a female's womb.



Trans people exist. :I


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 6, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> Trans people exist. :I



Oh yeah.  Derp.


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## GarthTheWereWolf (Jan 6, 2015)

Troj said:


> I've called people breeders, and technically, I _am one_.
> 
> Seriously, I can't muster up much indignation around heterophobia, since I've never been adversely affected by it, nor has anyone else that I can think of.



I call my friends breeders too~ Not because they're heterosexual, but because they had their biological clock go off and are in "I NEED BABY! GIVE ME BABEH NOW!" crazy mode. Its a rather creepy phenomena. I hope it never happens to me. Children are gross.


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 6, 2015)

GarthTheWereWolf said:


> I call my friends breeders too~ Not because they're heterosexual, but because they had their biological clock go off and are in "I NEED BABY! GIVE ME BABEH NOW!" crazy mode. Its a rather creepy phenomena. I hope it never happens to me. Children are gross.



IKR.  I can't see myself ever having a child....but it will probably happen at some point.  We'll probably understand once we find a mate.


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## pinkie (Jan 7, 2015)

GarthTheWereWolf said:


> I call my friends breeders too~ Not because they're heterosexual, but because they had their biological clock go off and are in "I NEED BABY! GIVE ME BABEH NOW!" crazy mode. Its a rather creepy phenomena. I hope it never happens to me. Children are gross.


 My best friend does this! ugghhhh


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## Brass (Jan 7, 2015)

GarthTheWereWolf said:


> I call my friends breeders too~ Not because they're heterosexual, but because they had their biological clock go off and are in "I NEED BABY! GIVE ME BABEH NOW!" crazy mode. Its a rather creepy phenomena. I hope it never happens to me. Children are gross.



It's probs hormonal. At least they're not in their 40s or something bitching about running out of time to have kids. Seriously do people not think of adopting or do they just want to fuckle until a baby pops out?


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## Ayattar (Jan 7, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> Trans people exist. :I



And? There is no such thing as a "male womb".
Even if a female mar herself and becomes were-man she still has female womb. In fact she's still a female because motherfucking chromosomes don't change even if you stuff yourself full of testosterone.
Try harder.


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 7, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> And? There is no such thing as a "male womb".
> Even if a female mar herself and becomes were-man she still has female womb. In fact she's still a female because motherfucking chromosomes don't change even if you stuff yourself full of testosterone.
> Try harder.



Yeah, this is kinda how I feel about that as well.


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## dirtypaws (Jan 7, 2015)

isuckatdrawing said:


> Yeah, this is kinda how I feel about that as well.



i'm ignoring ayattar's response because he's intentionally inflammatory, but really? that's a horribly transphobic mindset to have.


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 7, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> i'm ignoring ayattar's response because he's intentionally inflammatory, but really? that's a horribly transphobic mindset to have.



I wouldn't have said it the way he did, but FtM transgenders still have a female womb.  No, that doesn't mean that they are female, but their bodies are not entirely male.


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## dirtypaws (Jan 7, 2015)

isuckatdrawing said:


> I wouldn't have said it the way he did, but FtM transgenders still have a female womb.  No, that doesn't mean that they are female, but their bodies are not entirely male.



that's a useless thing to say, though. there's no reason to call it a "female womb", even scientifically. If your body is legally male and you are taking male hormones, at that point even doctors need to treat you as a male because of the effects things used for "females" could have on you. Referring to body parts as "female" or "male" is archaic at this point. It doesn't really do anything but promote discrimination and make people feel awful.


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 7, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> that's a useless thing to say, though. there's no reason to call it a "female womb", even scientifically. If your body is legally male and you are taking male hormones, at that point even doctors need to treat you as a male because of the effects things used for "females" could have on you. Referring to body parts as "female" or "male" is archaic at this point. It doesn't really do anything but promote discrimination and make people feel awful.



So I guess there are such things as male wombs?  

In truth, I really don't know enough about transgenders to be commenting on their sexual anatomy...


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## dirtypaws (Jan 7, 2015)

isuckatdrawing said:


> So I guess there are such things as male wombs?
> 
> In truth, I really don't know enough about transgenders to be commenting on their sexual anatomy...



Transgender people are what they say they are. If someone is a trans man, they don't have a "female womb", they don't "still have girl parts", or anything like that. they're a male, and gendering their anatomy is archaic. Even doctors who aren't close-minded fundamentalists agree that the gendering of anatomy is archaic. if you have a womb, you have a womb. if you have testicles, you have testicles. that's not a "female womb" or "male testicles". the important part, the only part medically necessary, is knowing what hormones you still dominantly produce: testosterone or estrogen. Not "male hormones" or "female hormones", just testosterone or estrogen. Gendering body parts is archaic at this point.


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 7, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> Transgender people are what they say they are. If someone is a trans man, they don't have a "female womb", they don't "still have girl parts", or anything like that. they're a male, and gendering their anatomy is archaic. Even doctors who aren't close-minded fundamentalists agree that the gendering of anatomy is archaic. if you have a womb, you have a womb. if you have testicles, you have testicles. that's not a "female womb" or "male testicles". the important part, the only part medically necessary, is knowing what hormones you still dominantly produce: testosterone or estrogen. Not "male hormones" or "female hormones", just testosterone or estrogen. Gendering body parts is archaic at this point.



I was not aware of that.  Thank you.


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## dirtypaws (Jan 7, 2015)

isuckatdrawing said:


> I was not aware of that.  Thank you.



You're welcome. Thanks for listening. There's a lot of misconceptions about transgender people because of how the media and society has wanted to hush us for so long, and a lot of straight up discrimination is guised under things like "medical terminology" or "dictionary terms" or other things that even doctors agree are not necessary nowadays. Sex is actually a spectrum, and a lot of people don't know that. Even if you are completely a cisgender "male", you still produce estrogen. Your body may produce more than others. Some cis men have ovaries in them, still. Some cis women produce a large amount of testosterone, etc. Intersex people are actually very common, too, as common as redheads. So, for people to want to hang on to medical terms that are outdated and try to force gendered terms on things that don't need it actually serves no scientific or medical purpose!


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## -Sliqq- (Jan 7, 2015)

I'm heterogeneous and I'm proud! Oh wait, that's not what this is about.

What's so wrong about being straight? Likewise homo? You like what you like and that's all that's there to it.


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## WolfNightV4X1 (Jan 7, 2015)

isuckatdrawing said:


> I was not aware of that.  Thank you.



Whoa? An argument that got resolved peacefully? That's a first


---

In other news hating certain genitalia=/=heterophobia

I mean really? I dont blame gays for hating vagina, I hate vagina

It's a sexuality preference not a hate crime!


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 7, 2015)

WolfNightV4X1 said:


> Whoa? An argument that got resolved peacefully? That's a first



I am a logical individual with virtually infinite patience (no, seriously).

If someone shows me solid evidence that I'm wrong, I won't attempt to argue otherwise.  I'm a physicist, so that helps.


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## vermillion (Jan 7, 2015)

Ozriel said:


> The same goes for a few transgenders (FtM) who turn to that route as well.


I really don't get misogynist transmen. It's one thing to hate the fact that you were born in a biologically XX chromosome body, but to go hating all females because of that? I know there's really feminist misandrist transwomen too. I just don't get these people.


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## dirtypaws (Jan 7, 2015)

vermillion said:


> I really don't get misogynist transmen. It's one thing to hate the fact that you were born in a biologically XX chromosome body, but to go hating all females because of that? I know there's really feminist misandrist transwomen too. I just don't get these people.



yea, i see a lot of really misandrist trans women and i REALLY don't understand it. to not dig cis dudes is one things but to HATE ALL MEN and like lump trans men in when they don't get an ounce of the male privilege cis dudes get is ridiculous.


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## Armored Chocobo (Jan 8, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> And? There is no such thing as a "male womb".



Stan disagrees.


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## Ayattar (Jan 8, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> i'm ignoring ayattar's response because he's intentionally inflammatory, but really? that's a horribly transphobic mindset to have.



No, it's a normal mindset to have. The amount of pseudo-progressive bullshit in your posts is just incredible. You're even confusing sex with gender.



dirtypaws said:


> It doesn't really do anything but  promote discrimination and make people feel awful.



Yes, because telling the truth, that penis is a male organ and womb is female is obvious discrimination. But of course that there are no males and females nowadays! We're all hyooomans that just happen to have male or female traits! Right? 

No.

And here you are, even wikipedia
The *uterus* (from Latin "uterus", plural _uteri_) or *womb* is a major female hormone-responsive reproductive sex organ of most mammals, including humans.

Try harder with your "progressive" reality enchanting.


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## Mikazuki Marazhu (Jan 8, 2015)

I really wish male pregnancy is possible. Its sad to grow old with no one to carry your memory. I'm sure if I die... No one will ever know I existed.


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## shteev (Jan 8, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> this is so obviously a troll post...





Brass said:


> 10/10 thread OP... Tasty bait.



You guys are so rude sometimes. If you're gonna post in a thread just to denounce the OP and declare it a troll thread, why bother posting? Leave it alone or let the mods take action if necessary.

And it's not like this _is_ a troll thread, anyway. OP brought a serious topic to the table with a thought-out intro and a call for discussion. If the subject matter is too touchy or odd for you to participate maturely, close the tab. 

The only troll posts here are the replies calling the thread a "troll post"


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## GarthTheWereWolf (Jan 8, 2015)

Mikazuki Marazhu said:


> I really wish male pregnancy is possible. Its sad to grow old with no one to carry your memory. I'm sure if I die... No one will ever know I existed.



Could always adopt a kid.


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## Ayattar (Jan 8, 2015)

Or buy the services of a temporary mother.


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## Mikazuki Marazhu (Jan 8, 2015)

GarthTheWereWolf said:


> Could always adopt a kid.



Still different from having your own child.
Carl shared that some people what to have children to immortalize themselves. I'm not sure what that even mean but were both sad.


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## GarthTheWereWolf (Jan 8, 2015)

Considering that men don't have to deal with the pregnancy aspect of children, I don't see how it would be that different. Either way, whether you adopt or you knock some girl up~ a baby just pops into your life one day and you're tasked with raising it.


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## Mikazuki Marazhu (Jan 8, 2015)

GarthTheWereWolf said:


> Considering that men don't have to deal with the pregnancy aspect of children, I don't see how it would be that different. Either way, whether you adopt or you knock some girl up~ a baby just pops into your life one day and you're tasked with raising it.



If I were to do that..
The question is..
Who's banging?


----------



## GarthTheWereWolf (Jan 8, 2015)

Mikazuki Marazhu said:


> If I were to do that..
> The question is..
> Who's banging?



Pssh V: you're gay. Obviously a turkey baster and a lot of alcohol would be involved.


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## Ayattar (Jan 8, 2015)

Just ask a lesbian couple who want to have children


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## Parasoul (Jan 8, 2015)

*tumblr voice* why be a cishetwhen you could not, stupid breeders!!
Ok but seriously instead of claiming that heterophobia and white racism exist, we just get rid if it all


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 8, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> No, it's a normal mindset to have. The amount of pseudo-progressive bullshit in your posts is just incredible. You're even confusing sex with gender.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If doctors treat FtMs (with "female" wombs) as males when it comes to treatment and medication, then I'd call that a womb in a male's body.  The fact that the "womb is a major female hormone-responsive reproductive sex organ" is simply stating that it only responds to female hormones, not that it is necessarily a female organ.




Mikazuki Marazhu said:


> I really wish male pregnancy is possible. Its sad to grow old with no one to carry your memory. I'm sure if I die... No one will ever know I existed.



Don't be a sad panda.  

  You could always find a surrogate mother.


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## Ayattar (Jan 8, 2015)

This is just no comment level of stupid.


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## Deleted member 93706 (Jan 8, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> This is just no comment level of stupid.



Then please, do enlighten.

I'll be back in several hours to continue the debate.


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## dirtypaws (Jan 8, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> This is just no comment level of stupid.



Sorry to tread on your outdated medical theories. you're all about washed-up, archaic ideas though so i can't necessarily say i'm surprised.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

"_____phobia requires societal prejudice and power" is something made up by social justice warriors who don't want to feel guilty about being bigots.

I yell at LGBT people who shit on straight people because they make me and the movement look bad.


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## Ayattar (Jan 8, 2015)

dirtypaws said:


> Sorry to tread on your outdated medical theories. you're all about washed-up, archaic ideas though so i can't necessarily say i'm surprised.



First you'd need to prove that they're outdated. So far you brought nothing to the table, just as expected from the LBGTQ crusader who has nothing but arbitrary statements.


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## dirtypaws (Jan 8, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> First you'd need to prove that they're outdated. So far you brought nothing to the table, just as expected from the LBGTQ crusader who has nothing but arbitrary statements.



Well, for what do you want sources and explanations? Why transgender inclusion and respect is important? Why it's dangerous to continue to use outdated gender binary terminology? Why it's important to understand that there are things like "male wombs" and "female testicles" in reference to healthcare? What do you want out of me, don't just say "proof".


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## Ayattar (Jan 8, 2015)

Why a womb of a transgender man should be considered male womb not female womb if it was formed as a female reproductive organ in female organism.

And you know that there is a 1mln $ reward for any man who manages to get pregnant? Then why may I ask nobody got it? Aren't those wombs male enough?


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Why don't we just call them testicles and wombs like everybody else does


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## dirtypaws (Jan 8, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> Why a womb of a transgender man should be considered male womb not female womb if it was formed as a female reproductive organ in female organism.
> 
> And you know that there is a 1mln $ reward for any man who manages to get pregnant? Then why may I ask nobody got it? Aren't those wombs male enough?



Well, for starters it needs to be addressed how transgender discrimination and erasure is extremely harmful to trans people, as they already have a very high rate of suicide due to the uphill battle that is surviving in this country. Even our medical professionals can be very discriminatory to us, and even if they're not, a lot of them don't even know what they're doing in relation to us. We are, however, very much still functioning people and it needs to be addressed that our medical conditions can vary based on gender identity. The idea of defining urogenital organs as "male" or "female" causes a lot of issues in leading to a confusion that already exists in the medical field. It causes problems because, as it's plain to see, a lot of "medical professionals" still have no idea who we are. For shit's sake, when i told my doctor i was trans his response was "so, like, a sex change?". i wanted to say "for fuck's sake there's a little MORE to it than that, but yea that's the plan." The demand of "well wombs are female organs" or "testicles are male organs" is problematic because it adds to the age-old problem of "okay you say you're a girl but you're REALLY a guy, right? like you have a penis?", which is something holding us back from a lot of advancements in our societal protection, also disregarding the frequency of intersex individuals, who may very well be male with a womb, or female with at least a micropenis. 

I had a good article by a doctor on why it's important to not gender organs, but i can't find it right now, so bear with me. 

Sex is, and always has been, a spectrum, not set-in-stone "male" and "female". This can be easily be seen by the frequency of intersex individuals, and how often even cis men and women have organs that would not be "lined up" with their sex, such as men with dormant ovaries or women with micropenises, as i stated earlier. More often than not, the latter is surgically reconsctructed at birth, but that doesn't change the fact that it's there and does affect hormones. Thus, gendering organs by saying things like "okay men can have ovaries and wombs but those are female parts" not only is perpetuating that intersex people don't exist (when they're actually pretty common) but also perpetuates that trans people are not, and never will be, what they say they are, which is incredibly harmful to our survival. Trans attempted suicide rate is 41%, that's close to half of all trans people trying to kill themselves. Little things like this add to the struggle, please don't make it worse.


----------



## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Are intersex people really that common?


----------



## Ayattar (Jan 8, 2015)

Volkodav said:


> Are intersex people really that common?



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex#Population_figures

I'll respond to the post later after I read all the links.


----------



## Armored Chocobo (Jan 8, 2015)

Ayattar said:


> We're all hyooomans



Hey, don't lump me in with the hairless monkeys. That's ignorant!


----------



## Ayattar (Jan 8, 2015)

Actually I can sum it up in two sentences. It's not backed by the science but by the wishful policy of the trans. It's not backed by the medicine but by the demands to make you mentally comfortable.

Ok, first of all. Why are organs being called male or female? What is their main purpose? It's reproduction. During the reproduction a human being can play a role of female or male, mother or father depending on the type of reproductive cell he can produce. There are no betweens. Sperm, ovum or nothing. What is needed to play the role of the female, to be the mother? Right! A female reproductive system: fellopian tube, vagina, ovaries, cervix, uterus. All needed to produce and sustain egg cell. Lack of even one of them means that a female can't play it's role. Likewise, when it comes to men.

I'm perfectly aware that there are ten determinants when it comes to sex: genotype, gonads (testes/ovaries), gonadophoric (vas deferens an fallopian tubes), external sex organs, fenotype, hormono-type, metabolism, social role, brain activity zones/preferences and mental affiliation. You can have them mixed in whatever order you want, you can have 5 times female traits and 5 times male traits. But that doesn't change a thing about them being male- or female-specific.

Now, apart from the social role and mental affiliation if everything goes all right all sexes should match the genotype. If they don't... then you know what? Then something fucked up, may it be a dysfunction of something somewhere, error or just an unhappy case. It's really no different from a child being born with any given dysfunction. The mechanism is absolutely identical - something didn't clicked, and it's perfectly understandable as the process of the formation of the fetus is complicated as hell. It's enough to read the wikipedia, all the causes are given in the descriptions of the following variations: dysfunction of this, dysfunction of that, lack of this, lack of that.

So yes, a male can have a womb, but it doesn't change a thing about womb being female-specific organ. Changing nomenclature won't change it.

And sorry about that, but you're going to endure your shit untill the gene treatment will become avaiable or fetus prophylaxis will reach superb levels allowing proper treatment happening in time.


And actually by "transgender man" I meant a woman who changed her fenotype sex to male using chormone treatment, not intersex-born transgender man.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Gender is a man made construct, sex is biology. My biological sex is male, my gender is female. I'm transgender, because my sex doesn't match my gender. This causes gender dysphoria, and hence discomfort, severe depression, and other very unpleasant things. To me, that's the gist of it.

And about the OP: tumblr sjw idiots, amirite? Actually, nah. I know this was a troll post, but I'm still going to reply as if it were serious. Because a lot of people pretend to be ironically shitposting about this, but I'm seeing a lot of actual opinions in there (and badpinions at that ). So here we go:

If I were you, I'd just shrug it off and let them be idiots if they call you a breeder. If you're straight, you have heteronormativity on your side. Gays often get ridiculed, excluded, kicked out/disowned by family, treated as less than human, and even violated and killed because of their sexuality. Picking on them would be shitting on a group of people already constantly being shat on. However, picking on straight people for being straight... It sure is a silly thing to do, but you have the privilege of not actually being oppressed, so I say: Just let those silly gays have this.

Tl;dr: Yes, I'm unironically saying "Check your privelege, man". Deal with it. :V


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Intolerance is bad but we should give it a pass if it comes from someone who is often the victim of intolerance.
This cycle is a stupid one.
How about we scold the gays who shit on straights? It's not hard, is it? I don't hate straights and I'm no worse for wear.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Tbh, we should just round up all the gays and 



Spoiler



hug them


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

The belief that the discriminated should have the right to discriminate because they've been descriminated against is the shit that fuels ideals like Robert Mugabe's. Whites are bad, whites can't own farms, whites have to live in apartments, kill white people, rape their daughters, hack off their heads with machetes because they're bad and treated us like shit.
You know what this intolerance leads to? Whites completely fucking you over and taking everything you've got.

"Let them have fun"
Uhhuh.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Except I've never heard a gay unironically call straight people 'breeders', and stuff like that. I still stand by my opinion. Letting an oppressed group have some fun at the expense of those that aren't is just considerate imo.

And when I say having fun, I mean ironic remarks and name calling. _Ironic_. People who seriously shit on straight people for being straight are no better than homophobes. So given this context, I would agree with you, Volkodav.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

What is "fun" though? The only time I've ever heard of "let them have fun" (well, not in those exact words) in regards to an oppressed group is when said oppressed group is shitting on another group, dehumanizing, and insulting them.
Straight, white, cis men are just absolutely shit! Horrible people. Absolute crap. 

I have NEVER seen someone "have fun" at the expense of a straight person by saying "haha straighties, you're so silly". 
This is your "fun":


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Uh, I don't really see that example as an ironic statement. Why are you putting words in my mouth? That is not "my fun". I was agreeing with you earlier, and I think that the person in the example you just gave me is a shithead and should be called out for it. :/

Seriously, twisting people's words is a pretty toxic (not to mention inherently flawed) way to support an argument you're making. Please don't do that. :c


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

I'm not twisting your words. I never said you do this.
I'm saying that when you say gays should be able to "have fun" in regards to talking smack about straights, this is what you're supporting. 
These are your words:
_"Letting an oppressed group have some fun at the expense of those that aren't is just considerate imo."_

Gays don't just go "tee hee, breeders" when allowed to rant about heterosexuals unchecked, they go balls out and spout hateful shit. It NEEDS to be curbed, these gays are a curse on the LGBTQA movement.

We cannot turn a blind eye to intolerance towards heterosexuals just because a group that has been the subject of intolerance is the one slinging the insults.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Hey, you're obviously right as far as actual intolerance goes. "I'm not twisting your words" - You _did_ say that that is "my fun" (even though that I'm mostly straight myself).

_- "Gays don't just go "tee hee, breeders" when allowed to rant about heterosexuals unchecked"_

Except they do. Way to blame gays in general for what a few loud dumb teenagers on tumblr are doing, by the way.

But you're right. We gotta keep those gays in check. I'm feeling so oppressed by those gays. I'm so afraid to show affection to my boyfriend in public, because publicly coming out as straight like that... Ugh, people just call you "breeder", you can see them laughing behind your back, and some people will even get in-your-face upset about it and say they don't agree with your sexuality, lifestyle and that what you're doing is wrong! I'm so glad more states are allowing more straight people the same privileges the gays have, because homonormativity is just so unfair. I can't stand it. Why should it matter what sexuality you are? Those gays just won't give us straight people a break!!!


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Sorry, I should have said "this is the fun that you're talking about"
You talk about intolerance from straights - clearly you think that this is bad, that you shouldn't treat homosexuals poorly due to their sexual preference.


Tell me why, in detail, you support hetero-bashing.

Also tell me if you support Robert Mugabe and why or why not.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

I have no idea who Robert Mugabe is. I just think that when you see a gay ironically call heteros "breeders", you should just look the other way. Because it has zero effect on your life, and that's your privilege. Enjoy that, and embrace it. If you're actually being oppressed because you're straight, then you can go ahead and get all upset about that. If not, just look the other way.

I think you see this issue way more black and white than I do. Just in case you don't understand me, let me give you a definition of irony:
_
"The use of words to express something different from and often opposite to their literal meaning" _(= saying something you don't really mean)_
_
So if you see someone jokingly referring to heteros as "breeders", just raise an eye brow and let them be silly. If you see someone who literally values gay lives over straight ones and wishes death upon straight people (like in the example you posted), THEN you have every right to get butthurt at them about it. IMO.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Snakebite said:


> I have no idea who Robert Mugabe is. I just think that when you see a gay ironically call heteros "breeders", you should just look the other way. Because it has zero effect on your life, and that's your privilege. Enjoy that, and embrace it. If you're actually being oppressed because you're straight, then you can go ahead and get all upset about that. If not, just look the other way.
> 
> I think you see this issue way more black and white than I do. Just in case you don't understand me, let me give you a definition of irony:
> _
> ...



Why does a straight person have to ignore "breeder"?
Why can't I correct a gay person when they lower another human being to the status if a mindless, sex-crazed animal whose only desire in life is to produce offspring?

BTW, Robert Mugabe: https://forums.furaffinity.net/thre...heterophobes?p=5029183&viewfull=1#post5029183


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Because they're making a harmless joke, that has literally no effect on your life unless you seek to be offended by it. Though if you really _really_ take offence to it, you could probably politely mention to them that you'd appreciate it if they wouldn't say that in your presence because it offends you. And any reasonably considerate person would then stop saying that around you. Problem solved.

And thank you for educating me on who Robert Mugabe is.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Snakebite said:


> Because they're making a harmless joke, that has literally no effect on your life unless you seek to be offended by it. Though if you really _really_ take offence to it, you could probably politely mention to them that you'd appreciate it if they wouldn't say that in your presence because it offends you. And any reasonably considerate person would then stop saying that around you. Problem solved.
> 
> And thank you for educating me on who Robert Mugabe is.



Why do you get to dictate what is or isn't a "harmless joke"?
Those guys and their gay pride parades, am I right? Limp-wrist sparkly dudes. Hahah! Harmless!
Ohh, don't like it? Choose not to be offended by it. You gays are so sensitive.


What do you think about Robert Mugabe?


----------



## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

I just said that if you're offended, you can say so to the offender and if they're considerate enough (= most people) they'll stop if you ask them. I didn't say "Offended? DEAL WITH IT SUCKA!", like you seem to be implying I said. I think you're only half reading my posts...

And frankly, you even questioning whether I do or don't support Robert Mugabe's notions you listed in the post you linked to, is kind of hurtful. I'm sorry that I seem that outrageous of a person to you...


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Oops, maybe I'm just misunderstanding what you meant by "I just think that when you see a gay ironically call heteros "breeders", you should just look the other way. Because it has zero effect on your life, and that's your privilege."

Maybe I'm just misunderstanding, really. The way I see this is that you're saying that if a slur is used ironically or in a joking manner, it's perfectly okay.

I'm such a silly faggot.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Well, for your own sake, I really think that that's what you should do. But I also mentioned that if you're still offended (and I indeed can't tell people when they're allowed to be offended), that you could just mention that to the offender, who will then just stop unless they're a jerk who really doesn't give a crap about your feelings.

"I'm such a silly faggot." Now you're just seeking to offend. How about we just disagree with each other and continue this discussion, without being a jerk about it? This isn't an election debate or something, you don't have to completely and utterly _destroy_ my point of view while we could just agree to disagree.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

I'm not looking to offend you. I was joking about my own homosexuality. 
See, when I use a homophobic slur in a joking manner, it automatically makes it not offensive. I'm actually surprised that you were offended by this - maybe you should try not to be offended over a silly joke?


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

No. Just because you're fine being called a faggot, doesn't mean all the other gays have to be. "It's ok cuz I'm gay" is a bad excuse to say offensive stuff. 

And I'm not offended, don't worry.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

I never said I was fine with being called a faggot.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Ah, I see what you were doing. However, 'breeder' as a slur doesn't even come close to having the history of hate and abuse 'faggot' has. Something about comparing apples to oranges.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Doesn't matter. It's a term used to dehumanize another person.

Ever heard of the slur "mick"?


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

It does matter. Some things are definitely more terrible to call a person than other things are. What's worse, calling someone who made an avoidable mistake 'a ditz' or 'retarded'? Or doesn't it matter, because they're both slurs?


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

You don't get to determine that though. You don't get to decide whether or not a straight person should be offended or not.
"Retarded" is a slur, "ditz" isn't.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

It's a derogatory term. What makes it not a slur?


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

A "slur" is a word stemming from negative stereotypes about a group or has a history in dehumanization.
Which is whyyyy......
"nigger" is a slur but "black" isn't
"faggot" is a slur but "gay" isn't
"breeder" is a slur but "straight" isn't
"mick" is a slur but "Irish" isn't


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Actually, now that I looked it up, "ditz" is definitely a slur, as it means "dumb blonde white woman". I learned something today!

So the example I used wasn't really good, but the point still stands.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Source please


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

http://www.rsdb.org/slur/ditz


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Snakebite said:


> http://www.rsdb.org/slur/ditz



"This database was created entirely from data gleaned off the 'net and via submissions from people like you and your parents. It's supposed to be funny and/or informational. Calm down. "

This is about as legitimate a source as urbandictionary.


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

As far as a source on swear words and slang can be official and legitimate anyway. :/


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## WolfNightV4X1 (Jan 8, 2015)

[video]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JzYMi5wSc7g[/video]


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

I'm looking for legit sources.
Example using "Mick" (very uncommon slur)
"Mick" is a slur that originated from the common Irish names that begin with "Mac" or "Mc" (pronounced "mick"). Back when anti-irish racism was alive and well in the UK, people were beaten up, chased out of town, not hired, etc for having "Irish sounding names". 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Irish_sentiment

That's where a slur comes from.


While I don't know for sure, perhaps this is where the term "mickey" comes from when referring to a 375mL bottle of alcohol.. hmmm.


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## Ozriel (Jan 8, 2015)

Any words used to dehumanize a group is still dehumanizing. To give an excuse like "We we're oppressed because the cischet sum do X and Y to gays" makes you just as ignorant as the ones who use the same excuse to dehumanize gays.

That's like me walking up to you and calling you some sort of slur, and then saying "I am a Oppressed minority because you used to herd my native American family into reservations and killed of a lot of my people during the trail of tears incident. And my black family for enslaving them to pick your cotton".

You cannot call a spade a shovel despite using it to dig. It is still a spade. And intolerance is still intolerance. Trying to justify it is terrible all around.


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## Machine (Jan 8, 2015)

I'm a straight woman.

Clearly this means I'm a disgusting homophobe who exists only to have babies. :C


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Volkodav said:


> I'm looking for legit sources.
> Example using "Mick" (very uncommon slur)
> "Mick" is a slur that originated from the common Irish names that begin with "Mac" or "Mc" (pronounced "mick"). Back when anti-irish racism was alive and well in the UK, people were beaten up, chased out of town, not hired, etc for having "Irish sounding names".
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Irish_sentiment
> ...


If ditz really means blonde dumb woman, it sure as hell is a slur because blonde haired women are usually appreciated for anything but their wisdom, and are far too often being seen as their dumb stereotype.

While we're on the subject of "legit sources", here's one for the definition of 'slur':

"A disparaging remark; an aspersion" (disparaging = disrespectful, aspersion = a false or damaging accusation or insinuation).
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/slur

Literally any word can be a slur, depending on tone, context, et cetera. You don't get to define what is and isn't a slur.


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## Ozriel (Jan 8, 2015)

Machine said:


> I'm a straight woman.
> 
> Clearly this means I'm a disgusting homophobe who exists only to have babies. :C



You're disgusting. DIE CIS SCUM!


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_slurs


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Those are specifically ethnic slurs, I'm just talking about slurs in general...


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

Me too
I'm linking you to a page with ethnic slurs that explains why and how they're slurs.
"Ditz" isn't and never has been a slur.


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## Ozriel (Jan 8, 2015)

Alright guys, let's go back onto the topic train.


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## Calemeyr (Jan 8, 2015)

The only people I ever hear use the term "breeder" are dumb straight white people who decide they speak for humanity by saying all the bad things in the world make reproduction wrong. Overpopulation is a thing, yes, but this extent comes off as misanthropy and subconscious racism.

As for sexist gay furries, this may be more to do with them being furries than them being gay. Remember, furries are geeks, and many geeks can be misogynist (and very perverted) at times. I have no idea why. Rejection and bullying in high school maybe? You'd think the people on the bottom of the HS popularity totem pole would be a little more welcoming of other people.


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## Butters Shikkon (Jan 8, 2015)

GarthTheWereWolf said:


> Considering that men don't have to deal with the pregnancy aspect of children, I don't see how it would be that different. Either way, whether you adopt or you knock some girl up~ a baby just pops into your life one day and you're tasked with raising it.



It's the same reason Straight couples desire children of their own. To see your spouse in the eyes of your children. To know the child was made from your love.


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## Machine (Jan 8, 2015)

Ozriel said:


> You're disgusting. DIE CIS SCUM!


_Literally triggered_


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## Snakebite (Jan 8, 2015)

Tbh, I hardly encounter misogyny among furries, aside from the occasional "ew boobs" from gay furs, much like lesbians can go "ew, dicks". But maybe I just hang out with all the right people, if there's a significant amount of misogynists among furries that I simply haven't encountered yet in 10 years time.


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## Zop (Jan 8, 2015)

Snakebite said:


> Tbh, I hardly encounter misogyny among furries, aside from the occasional "ew boobs" from gay furs, much like lesbians can go "ew, dicks". But maybe I just hang out with all the right people, if there's a significant amount of misogynists among furries that I simply haven't encountered yet in 10 years time.



I guess it exists elsewhere? At least enough for OP to say something.


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## Ozriel (Jan 8, 2015)

Snakebite said:


> Tbh, I hardly encounter misogyny among furries, aside from the occasional "ew boobs" from gay furs, much like lesbians can go "ew, dicks". But maybe I just hang out with all the right people, if there's a significant amount of misogynists among furries that I simply haven't encountered yet in 10 years time.



I've experienced it in public furry circles like meets from I guess you'd call the "SJW Fedora" hybrid types of the furry fandom. Though They are jerks anyhow and just hate women and make fun of straight people to the level of making them unwelcome.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

I see it with some furries who draw only gay porn and furries get mat that they wont draw striaght porn ahhaha
"bend to what i want you to draw or youre intolerant"

its veyr rare though


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## GarthTheWereWolf (Jan 8, 2015)

Butters Shikkon said:


> It's the same reason Straight couples desire children of their own. To see your spouse in the eyes of your children. To know the child was made from your love.



Sounds extremely egotistical.


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## Volkodav (Jan 8, 2015)

HAHAHA that sounds very egotistical LOL

hace children i dont give a shit just stop making me fucking babysit your goddamn precocious ashole children.


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## Butters Shikkon (Jan 9, 2015)

GarthTheWereWolf said:


> Sounds extremely egotistical.



Perhaps, Garth, when you get older you may well understand. Some of us on this forum are at the time of our lives where we are settling down.


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## GarthTheWereWolf (Jan 9, 2015)

Butters Shikkon said:


> Perhaps, Garth, when you get older you may well understand. Some of us on this forum are at the time of our lives where we are settling down.



You know I'm the same age as you right? I'm just saying~ only wanting a kid because its a mini version of you seems a little egotistical. As if by adopting a child they'd be incapable of loving it as much simply because of a lack of genetic ties. They're still raising it from infancy, seeing it grow, getting to know it, forming bonds with it, and experiencing it loving them back.

Just seems kind of a messed up attitude to me. But what do I know? I think children are disgusting and God help us all if I ever feel the need to procreate~ lol V:


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## Batty Krueger (Jan 9, 2015)

FUCK YOU STRAIGHT PEOPLE.




fucking weidos with your "vaginal sex"! whats a vagine anyway? 



ATTICA, ATTICA!


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## jtrekkie (Jan 9, 2015)

Read through this and I still don't know what's going on in here.


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## Volkodav (Jan 9, 2015)

I strongly believe that if we are to request that society and the government stay out of our bedrooms and leave us alone to be with our same-sex partners, we shouldn't be poking around in the business of straight couples either.


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## Butters Shikkon (Jan 9, 2015)

GarthTheWereWolf said:


> only wanting a kid because its a mini version of you



You have a real problem with reading comprehension, Garth. And I stick by my "when you get older and are actually loved by a spouse" statement.


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