# The anatomy trap?



## Zeitzbach (Nov 14, 2016)

When I see someone asking for criticism, no matter how well drawn a piece is, I usually see someone talk about "Anatomy".

"Anything I can do work on?"

"Anatomy"

"Anything you feel like should be fixed in the picture?"

"I guess I will have to say, learn about the anatomy"

Composition, color, shading, they are never mentioned. It's always the anatomy. I do agree that sometime, anatomy needs to be worked on if it is inhuman but when it's an anime drawing, cartoony stuffs or just personal preference type of body, Anatomy isn't exactly something I will comment on, especially when nothing is wrong with them to begin with.

And the thing is, most learning or self-taught artist will take these criticism seriously and try to find a way to fix what is not broken in the first place. Some focus too much that they never move to work on any other area for a whole month, or year, because someone still tells them to work on the anatomy for some reason.

When you work on a piece, you're supposed to look at the picture as a whole. Far, Middle, Close. Dark. Light. It goes together. Even when the character looks perfectly fine, you still have to crop them if necessary to improve the composition. Sometime, you even have to purposefully ruin or blur a certain part to save the entire picture so that it doesn't feel "off" to look at.

Why is anatomy barely mentioned when someone is criticising some kind of over-the-top muscle pieces? Often it is because the one looking is already seeing what they want to see in a ridiculous fashion. It's not like drawing a slender girl. Some wants the girl to be way taller with long legs. Some want the neck to be longer. Some wants the body to be longer. It becomes the whole "My type of body vs your type of body and if you don't follow what they envisioned from what they used to see, the anatomy is incorrect".

I'm starting to feel like this whole "Anatomy needs to be fixed" type of criticism is just there because the one that is giving the criticism is just nit picking part of the picture 90% of the time.


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## nerdbat (Nov 14, 2016)

This post is pretty rough around the edges, I think you should work on anatomy.


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## um_pineapplez (Nov 14, 2016)

Because it looks more fluid when it's accurate.

But how would I know. That's what Pikapetey said to work on before he banned me.


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## Tigers-on-Unicycles (Nov 14, 2016)

I think the reason for this is that people, to a certain degree, expect art to be a replica of real life, and when the anatomy of a creature or person is skewed it looks bizarre to us and raises a red flag; but telling a person to 'work on the anatomy' without going into further detail remains extremely unhelpful. That is not what I call constructive criticism. When somebody comes to you with that sort of response, demand further information from them. If they still can't explain their reasoning I would just ignore it and move on to somebody who can.

I feel a good understanding of real life anatomical structures is important for every artist. It really doesn't matter what creature it is: bones, muscles, and tendons all work in the same way, and animals (and people!) vary so widely in appearance only because of what they are specialized to do and the environments they must survive. Learning how to draw something realistically first will mean that any time you switch to an extreme style, say cartoony, it will be more believable to the viewer. 'Inaccurate', yes, but still reminiscent of the real thing it came from.

If you know how a thing is constructed and how it works than lighting and shading come more easily. 

Really, beginning and intermediate artists need other artists to help them and to offer critique because another beginning artist is not going to know. 

Tl;dr version: yeah, it's frustrating when people don't explain themselves properly.


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## um_pineapplez (Nov 14, 2016)

Tigers-on-Unicycles said:


> I think the reason for this is that people, to a certain degree, expect art to be a replica of real life, and when the anatomy of a creature or person is skewed it looks bizarre to us and raises a red flag; but telling a person to 'work on the anatomy' without going into further detail remains extremely unhelpful. That is not what I call constructive criticism. When somebody comes to you with that sort of response, demand further information from them. If they still can't explain their reasoning I would just ignore it and move on to somebody who can.
> 
> I feel a good understanding of real life anatomical structures is important for every artist. It really doesn't matter what creature it is: bones, muscles, and tendons all work in the same way, and animals (and people!) vary so widely in appearance only because of what they are specialized to do and the environments they must survive. Learning how to draw something realistically first will mean that any time you switch to an extreme style, say cartoony, it will be more believable to the viewer. 'Inaccurate', yes, but still reminiscent of the real thing it came from.
> 
> ...


Like Pikapetey. He shows us anatomy, then says "oh you won't be able to learn from watching me show you.'


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## Discofurry (Nov 14, 2016)

When I would teach my students about creating their own "style" I pressed them to learn anatomy because it improves style so much. Even when you are going for an over the top cartoon style, knowing which parts to change up and which to keep normal can carry you miles in the art world. "Learn the rules, then learn how to break them." If you like, I can go over your work and tell you where specifically you tend to have issues.


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## quoting_mungo (Nov 15, 2016)

To be fair, a lot of furry artists will often do the thing where you have a character hanging out in blank space. Myself included. If you look at something like this there's really sod-all to say about composition, or backgrounds (beyond "try to include a background" which on one hand arguably is helpful advice, but on the other says little about what's actually present in the piece, so could be seen as if anything more of a cop-out piece of advice). Now, I'm not saying I'm an expert at anatomy, but in that piece you can see, even with me having tried to emulate the official art style, that I have at least a basic understanding of how the (human) body is built up. Stylization is not, and should never be, an excuse not to learn anatomy. I took sequential art for a year, and we did quite a bit of figure drawing before we got into different stylized art styles. Because anatomy is the foundation from which you develop a toonier style.

It's also the area where it's easiest to notice something being subtly "off" - color theory only really results in a strong instinctive response that we're likely to notice when things get utterly garish, and honestly I'm not going to, with all my years in art classes, notice that you screwed up your shading unless you did an utterly exceptionally poor job on it. Because I'm still waiting for someone to explain shading to me in a way I can brain; in the meantime I tend to stick to "muck around with it until it looks right" when I bother at all. 

Your mileage may vary, of course, but given the attachment furry fandom generally has to characters, it's hardly surprising critique would focus on making the characters look "right".


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## metatem (Nov 15, 2016)




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## lyar (Nov 15, 2016)

Zeitzbach said:


> Composition, color, shading, they are never mentioned.
> I'm starting to feel like this whole "Anatomy needs to be fixed" type of criticism is just there because the one that is giving the criticism is just nit picking part of the picture 90% of the time.


I don't think there's really any right way to criticize art because its so subjective. Also many people just post art and ask for criticism without any specifications or explanation of what they are trying to accomplish. You want me to criticize the color? Well, people have different tastes so when I do criticize the color there's a possibility that the person will just say, "its supposed to look like that". What I am saying is that art is a hard thing to judge objectively unless you describe a theme or style you're trying to depict. So here are your options: Just keep drawing despite what anyone thinks to get yourself better or ask for specific advice instead of general criticism.


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## striker479 (Nov 16, 2016)

Learning about the anatomy is quite important and how the musculature meshs with the skelatal structure. When you're drawing up a piece you have to look at how the appendage moves and how the muscles flex properly. When I draw i usually start with a roughly sketch of the skelaton then i add muscles onto the frame followed by whatever else. One thing you have to keep in mind is the differences between male and female. Study the human anatomy and of the differences. If anything watch videos of people doing dynamic things and how the entire body moves or go to a large mirror and study how your body moves plus perspectives


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## Jax Cottontail (Nov 17, 2016)

If you are drawing characters or creatures learning anatomy is the most crucial foundational study to master. Even if you only plan on drawing cartoons, anime, different body types, or fantasy creatures you must first understand real anatomy. 

Anatomy teaches us how living things move and function. It also gives us a sense of proportion. In cartoons like the Simpsons there is still anatomy and proportions at play. We have seen their skeletons, which gives us an idea of how they are built and proportioned.  Their bodies move and bend in a similar fashion albeit exaggerated compared to real humans. Therefore, "the anatomy" of the character is believable--and accepted by the viewer--because the proportions of the character are believable. 

I think that sometimes when people critique artwork that is meant to be cartoon-ish or stylized they say anatomy, but what they really mean is proportions. If your proportions are off it can easily destroy a design. Say the knees on your cartoon character were placed 3/4 of the way down the leg; It would look really odd and someone might say that the anatomy is off, but really its the ratio of the knee placement on the leg that is off.

Your character's pose might also be in an odd pose that wouldn't be achievable unless the character was in severe pain (like an arm broken and bent at the elbow in the wrong direction). That's why learning how the human body works and moves can be crucial to designing a cartoon or a fantasy creature. One exercise is to draw a fantasy creature, but also draw its bone structure and draw the muscle structure. Consider how this creature moves, fights / defends, eats, and mates. 

Learning gesture is also crucial, but that's a whole other thing that deserves its own thread. I hope this helps.


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## Mobius (Nov 17, 2016)

tl;dr :
Sans verbose artist babble, art is just engineering for hippies. You gotta learn the internals to draw the externals.


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## Tigers-on-Unicycles (Nov 17, 2016)

Mobius said:


> tl;dr :
> Sans verbose artist babble, art is just engineering for hippies. You gotta learn the internals to draw the externals.


The concise nature of your response inundates me with trepidation.


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## Revous (Nov 22, 2016)

I wouldn't say "anatomy", but "proportion". Take Tim Burton as a loose example, his characters are closer to a fashion croqui proportion than cartoon proportion, and very absurd, yet they flow and pose beautifully because he knows how much weight and curves and lines go where they go.

You can practice anatomy hardcore 100% all day erryday and git gud at it, but if you don't practice proportion you'll never render/color/shade properly. You (not OP, multiple people) need to get behind the hand/brain barrier instead of going "muh skills r good enuff/nobody teaches me".

Taking american comic studios for example (DC, Marvel, etc). They sometimes commit absurd mistakes on anatomy (on purpose AND on accident) yet they render so well that it feels dynamic instead of plain wrong. 
Meanwhile, you have some anime studios who do crazy detail and watercolor and oil painted background yet their proportion is so wrong that they look like mutated people.

You should learn a bit of everything BEFORE figuring out what your strength is.


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## RailRide (Dec 22, 2016)

um_pineapplez said:


> Like Pikapetey. He shows us anatomy, then says "oh you won't be able to learn from watching me show you.'



There is a difference between knowing how to do something and knowing how to _teach_ it. Not many can do both.

This fellow you cite may really know his stuff backward and forward (I don't know, never saw their work), but if so much of that skill has become like muscle memory (i.e. you no longer have to think about _how_ you're doing it) it's quite likely that he doesn't even _know_ how to explain how he does what he does to others.

---PCJ


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