# Help what to look for in a new computer.



## Cynlife (Oct 1, 2013)

So I'm looking to get a desktop computer and though I can work with computers just fine, it's still difficult for me know what what specs I need to match my needs. I'd really love any help.

And before it happens, I have no know-how to build my own computer, plus I just don't really trust my self, so though many people will say that is the best (and sure is) I don't have the trust in myself to try and put it together. So unless there are websites good for that... well I still need help on what would best suit me ^^;

Now lets get into what I do/look for:
I know I need a big RAM because I run multiple programs, use the adobe suite programs (primarily photoshop and illustrator) [but what is the lowest I should go?]
But I'd like to be able to do gaming as well.
A graphics card I'm sure is also very important since I use photoshop and other art software pretty often.
And then I of course have large files to save, so I need to have a fair amount of storage (though I do have a terabyte storage system now so I can hold stuff on there)

Are there things I should make sure I get so everything works well? Like what kind of Processor would work well? Did I miss anything major important?

And since it will probably help with the decision I do have a top budget of about $1000.

I'd love any and all help on things I should make sure the computer I'm going to get has.


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## Runefox (Oct 1, 2013)

With a top budget of $1000, you'd probably be best off looking at an AMD A10 processor. It's the best balance between graphics performance and price, while sacrificing CPU performance (arguably less important but the A10 is on the higher end of AMD's A-series offerings). Games will mainly be CPU and graphics bound, and the A10 should handle most of what you throw at it on medium quality settings (at least as good though almost always better than current gen consoles). Most pre-built desktop computers nowadays will come with at least a 1TB hard drive, so from here, look for RAM. 8GB is about where you want to start with, as Windows 7 and later run best with 4GB or more and many games will eat upwards of 3GB on their own, which leaves a bit of overhead to keep things smooth. Adobe suite stuff really demands more depending on what you're working with, so if you can get 12GB or 16GB, all the better. With RAM, it really is "the more the merrier", but you should shoot for at least 8GB. You can always very easily and relatively inexpensively upgrade it later on down the road.

Now, if you were going to build your own PC, that's something entirely different. There are plenty of tutorials available online on how to do it, but picking out specific parts requires a bit of information: First and most importantly, what region of the world are you in? That determines part availability and price. $1000 CAD, $1000 USD, and $1000 AUD are all different in purchasing power. Secondly, what kinds of games will you be playing on the computer? Simpler games require less power, and will let you relax the specs of the processor/graphics to improve other areas. The latest games, particularly AAA titles, require quite a bit more horsepower and may require stretching the budget. The Adobe suite is, besides being a memory hog, mostly CPU-bound, so if this is more important, an Intel processor may be preferred due to the huge performance lead Intel has on AMD in that regard, particularly since the newer Haswell Iris graphics are pretty half decent on their own.


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## Arshes Nei (Oct 1, 2013)

Well if you want to look through building PCs Newegg does have some handy guides

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPIXAtNGGCw

Then once you get familiar http://pcpartpicker.com/parts/partlist/ has been rather helpful.


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## Cynlife (Oct 1, 2013)

Runefox said:


> With a top budget of $1000, you'd probably be best off looking at an AMD A10 processor. It's the best balance between graphics performance and price, while sacrificing CPU performance (arguably less important but the A10 is on the higher end of AMD's A-series offerings). Games will mainly be CPU and graphics bound, and the A10 should handle most of what you throw at it on medium quality settings (at least as good though almost always better than current gen consoles). Most pre-built desktop computers nowadays will come with at least a 1TB hard drive, so from here, look for RAM. 8GB is about where you want to start with, as Windows 7 and later run best with 4GB or more and many games will eat upwards of 3GB on their own, which leaves a bit of overhead to keep things smooth. Adobe suite stuff really demands more depending on what you're working with, so if you can get 12GB or 16GB, all the better. With RAM, it really is "the more the merrier", but you should shoot for at least 8GB. You can always very easily and relatively inexpensively upgrade it later on down the road.
> 
> Now, if you were going to build your own PC, that's something entirely different. There are plenty of tutorials available online on how to do it, but picking out specific parts requires a bit of information: First and most importantly, what region of the world are you in? That determines part availability and price. $1000 CAD, $1000 USD, and $1000 AUD are all different in purchasing power. Secondly, what kinds of games will you be playing on the computer? Simpler games require less power, and will let you relax the specs of the processor/graphics to improve other areas. The latest games, particularly AAA titles, require quite a bit more horsepower and may require stretching the budget. The Adobe suite is, besides being a memory hog, mostly CPU-bound, so if this is more important, an Intel processor may be preferred due to the huge performance lead Intel has on AMD in that regard, particularly since the newer Haswell Iris graphics are pretty half decent on their own.



Thank you Rune!
What about an Intel processor? The laptop I use has that and it works rather well, is it the fact that it just tends to be more expensive??
I just know I don't want to have any serious lag or flickering problems when I'm trying to work with any of my tools in Photoshop because I ran into that in the past when I got a desktop and I couldn't handled it and promptly reset the computer and returned it.
And I do agree with the Adobe Suite being a memory hog, that's why I'm heavily focused on having plenty of memory.

As for the gaming thing, it's definitely kinda in the background as a leisurely thing right now. But it'll probably be online gaming for the most part, so probably games that'll have to be downloaded and take up more memory. But again it's not my main focus, just something that will become part of the use of the computer.

And I'm in the US so I'd be paying with USD, but again I don't think I could figure out how to put a computer together even with the help of tutorials (and though pictures help, I am so much more of a hands on learner, or someone who needs to watch it happen.) so that would require me to have to try and get a hold of one of my more techy friends from the past and see if they'd be willing to help me out. I'd consider this option much more if I am available to get very good specs for the money/time it takes to put together (if that makes sense? As long as everything is great for what I need and affordable)

Edit: Sorry, went looking through best buy just to see what they had and I saw a lot of AMD E processors, what would be the main difference in that as well? ^^;


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## Lobar (Oct 1, 2013)

I don't agree with the recommendation of the AMD A10 processor.  The _only_ situation I would consider it is if you were getting a machine that had no dedicated graphics card and you had no plans to upgrade it either.  On a $1000 budget, you can get real graphics.  My recommendation would be a chip from Intel's Haswell line (i5-4570 or other 4XXX).

Building a computer really isn't that tough, either.  It's just a matter of securing your parts in the case and then plugging them into each other, and the connectors are all standardized.  If you can put together IKEA furniture, you can assemble a computer.  If you do decide to consider building your own, we can help you pick the right parts.

edit: I went ahead made a sample part list just because I like picking out parts.  If nothing else, it's something to benchmark against.  For $850 USD, you get a great processor, plenty of RAM, solid graphics, and a terabyte of storage.


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## Cynlife (Oct 1, 2013)

Lobar said:


> I don't agree with the recommendation of the AMD A10 processor.  The _only_ situation I would consider it is if you were getting a machine that had no dedicated graphics card and you had no plans to upgrade it either.  On a $1000 budget, you can get real graphics.  My recommendation would be a chip from Intel's Haswell line (i5-4570 or other 4XXX).
> 
> Building a computer really isn't that tough, either.  It's just a matter of securing your parts in the case and then plugging them into each other, and the connectors are all standardized.  If you can put together IKEA furniture, you can assemble a computer.  If you do decide to consider building your own, we can help you pick the right parts.



I thought that I was told before to not deal with AMD ^^; but that was well over a year ago so I couldn't remember if it was good or bad, so that's also why I've made sure to ask.

Heh, I've never put together IKEA furniture though! But I don't know what all goes into a computer aside from a processor, RAM, Hard drive, the basics. Unless the basic's is it and I'm just over complicating things in my head?


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## Lobar (Oct 1, 2013)

Cynlife said:


> I thought that I was told before to not deal with AMD ^^; but that was well over a year ago so I couldn't remember if it was good or bad, so that's also why I've made sure to ask.
> 
> Heh, I've never put together IKEA furniture though! But I don't know what all goes into a computer aside from a processor, RAM, Hard drive, the basics. Unless the basic's is it and I'm just over complicating things in my head?



There's nothing _bad_ about AMD, it's just that a few years back Intel took a substantial lead with their processor design and AMD has yet to catch up.  FWIW, my system has an AMD processor, built back when they were the smart choice.

The basics are pretty much it.  The only crucial parts that prebuilt system customers don't typically look at are the motherboard and the power supply (PSU).  The motherboard is the central board that all other components plug into, so you have to get one that has enough features to support all your other parts.  Reliable brands are ASUS, Gigabyte, and MSI (the first two more than the third).  The power supply takes power from your wall outlet and transforms it into 12V, 5V, and 3.3V DC power for all your parts.  Different power supplies are rated for different maximum wattages; if you have higher-performing, power-hungry parts, you need a better PSU.  It's easy to figure out the wattage you need with a calculator like http://www.extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp.  Reliable PSU brands are Corsair, Seasonic, PC Power & Cooling and Antec.

List of everything that is crucial to make a computer:

Processor
Motherboard
RAM
Hard drive
Power supply
Case
Operating system (Windows)

Things that you probably want to have:

Graphics card
DVD reader/writer

Extra stuff you don't really need:

Aftermarket heat sink
Extra case fans
Expansion cards (extra USB ports, Wi-Fi adapter, etc.)
New monitor/speakers/keyboard/mouse/other peripherals (unless you don't have them already, then you need them).


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## Cynlife (Oct 1, 2013)

Ah ok, I wasn't sure about that, I wasn't ever told why to lean more one way than the other when it came to AMD, Intel, whatever else.


I feel it'd be so much easier for me to buy a made one and upgrade it, but I know that can get expensive fast too. 
Part of that comes from that a DVD reader is a must for me (Because I prefer hard copies of anything software related), I would need a Wi-fi adapter since the computer is to be in my room and I'm in the basement currently (though looking to move into an apartment so that'd change potentially), and I don't have an available monitor or speakers so I'd have to buy those as well.
I'm concerned on building it costing more actually considering I need everything.


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## Lobar (Oct 1, 2013)

Acceptable monitors start at $100, a decent wireless networking adapter would be about $20, and speakers can be as cheap as $10.  A DVD reader/writer was already in the parts list I posted, so if you add it all up you come in right at $1000.

Here's a little more budget-conscious parts list too.  The motherboard is more limited and it gives up some RAM, but should still have plenty.  I also got a better deal on the graphics card without really downgrading, should have caught that the first time around.  Whoops.  Also added a wi-fi adapter.  $740 after $50 in rebates.


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## DarrylWolf (Oct 1, 2013)

Maybe something these guys will sell you.
http://www.foundfootagefest.com/2013/09/computers/

Just remember not to copy that floppy, and... hey, whatever happened to aol.com


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## Runefox (Oct 2, 2013)

The reason I mention AMD is because the IGP on the A10's actually provides excellent performance without having to purchase a separate graphics card. At $1000, shipping and taxes can eat dramatically into the budget, and considerations like power supply and motherboard are generally more important at this price point. That said, I go on to recommend an Intel processor given the general usage scenario, but caution that it may stretch the budget accordingly.

It's very important not to cheap out on the power supply or motherboard in this case. Higher-end builds will usually come with those higher end parts by default, but at $1000, it's a consideration, and I'd consider the MSI motherboard in Lobar's build to be inadequate as far as build quality goes. In addition, the RAM spec'd in that build is DDR3-1333, while the optimal for the i5 is -1600 or higher. The power supply would be adequate, but leaves little room for expansion.

I used the part list Lobar created earlier as a base to create this one, which brushes far closer to the ceiling but is a more robust configuration. Some explanation: 


The Gigabyte card should be better-cooled and more reliable than the HIS, and comes with 3GB of RAM vs 2GB; This will come in handy with newer games and the card's only $20 more. 
I upped the CPU to the 4670 for an additional $10; Not a huge performance increase, but not a huge price increase either. Since neither of these cards are overclockable, the extra performance will become more important over time. 
I switched to 16GB of Corsair Vengeance DDR3-1600 RAM. There is slightly cheaper RAM available, but not significantly so, and Corsair stuff is in my opinion the most reliable. $15 more than the Crucial 1333 kit. 
I swapped the power supply out for the 750W Enthusiast version. It's only another $20, and adds quite a bit of overhead for upgrades and comes with a 5 year warranty versus the CX500's 3. 
I changed the case to ATX for a bit more roomy build. It's easier to work in a larger case, and this allows for an ATX motherboard to be selected. $10. 
The motherboard I chose was the same I chose for a friend's build. It's a pretty good balance between performance and price, but it's the single biggest increase in price out of my changes at roughly $57. This motherboard will support a second video card later down the line if you find your performance lacking, which can be quite a boost without tossing everything. The MSI claims to be able to do this, but the H87 chipset isn't capable; The second slot runs at x4, which seriously hampers performance of the second card. The Gigabyte board boasts a much higher rating among reviewers and owners alike, with the MSI scoring abysmally, and the Gigabyte is built far more ruggedly. 

EDIT: I didn't catch the second build and monitor/wireless requirement. Will modify some more and re-edit.

EDIT 2: Here's a build with monitor, speakers and wireless adapter.

 It weighs in at $67.34 above your budget, but is really the best case scenario while remaining close to the target. You can save $25 by dropping the CPU down to the i5-4430, but I wouldn't recommend it as the price savings isn't really worth the downgrade in performance. While 400MHz isn't huge, it is tangible and you're not going to be able to overclock these non-K chips if you wanted to, so what it says on the box is what it'll do.

 You can save another $10-20 by dropping the wireless adapter a bit, but you sacrifice the 5GHz range of wireless N, which means you'll end up getting lower speeds via WiFi. I did end up finding a 16GB DDR3-1600 kit that actually is very inexpensive, so that's a huge plus. The XFX card in this case is actually cheaper and still the same, with more than adequate cooling; There is a less expensive version with a single fan, but that one's been known to overheat. The Creative speakers are fairly basic but should provide half decent sound quality for the price. The ASUS monitor is well-reviewed and a full-HD 1080p display, so I highly recommend that as a display in any case, especially for the price.

As far as price, most of the pre-built towers I'm seeing A) don't come with monitor or speakers, B) come with a very lacking graphics card (GT 640), and would be more expensive after adding the extras.


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## Lobar (Oct 2, 2013)

Yeah, about the cheap RAM: those great prices are all for stuff on back-order at NCIX.  I have my doubts that you'll ever actually receive RAM for that price.

MSI's always going to be a sticking point between us, I suppose.  I agree they're a tier below Asus and Gigabyte, but they're not worth-50-bucks-to-avoid below.  Crossfire/SLI is pretty much always going to be ridiculous for anyone with less than three monitors that's not mining Bitcoins, so I don't count two x8 lanes as much of a feature.  Even as an upgrade strategy, it's not any better than simple replacement, when you factor in the higher power consumption.


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## AshleyAshes (Oct 2, 2013)

Lobar said:


> Crossfire/SLI is pretty much always going to be ridiculous for anyone with less than three monitors that's not mining Bitcoins



I'm currently up to four monitors without crossfire.


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## Cynlife (Oct 2, 2013)

I really appreciate the input everyone!

So should I go ahead and try to either myself, or find one of my tech savvy friends to gather parts slowly and put a computer together?
I'm just an impatient person so that'd be a super slow process for me because I'd only be able to buy a few parts at a time (which is the same thing as me setting up a payment plan, just the fact I can't have/use it in the paying process heh.)


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## Runefox (Oct 2, 2013)

How slow is super slow? Depending on what kind of timeline you're talking, you may be crossing over into new generations of processors/graphics cards. That said, current motherboards should handle the next generation processors, and the case and power supply are not going to become irrelevant anytime soon. If it's going to take longer than 6 months, you might want to put the money in a savings account while you wait instead of buying the parts bit by bit.


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## Cynlife (Oct 2, 2013)

Runefox said:


> How slow is super slow? Depending on what kind of timeline you're talking, you may be crossing over into new generations of processors/graphics cards. That said, current motherboards should handle the next generation processors, and the case and power supply are not going to become irrelevant anytime soon. If it's going to take longer than 6 months, you might want to put the money in a savings account while you wait instead of buying the parts bit by bit.



I'm not sure exactly how long, it depends on the total cost if I can figure one out. Depending what way I go I'd probably be able to do $200 a month plus or minus maybe $50-$75, so maybe it would be a good idea to just save up in that case?


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## Lobar (Oct 2, 2013)

Cynlife said:


> I'm not sure exactly how long, it depends on the total cost if I can figure one out. Depending what way I go I'd probably be able to do $200 a month plus or minus maybe $50-$75, so maybe it would be a good idea to just save up in that case?



Yeah, save up enough to buy everything in one go.  Buying computers is like buying a car, those parts are going to depreciate in value as soon as you get them due to the continuing advancement of technology.


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## Runefox (Oct 2, 2013)

It's worth noting that while both Lobar and I put forward some examples of builds, you might find parts or configurations that may be better for your purposes. These are baselines to go from, and any parts can be swapped in and out as necessary (the huge advantage of building your own). I erred on the high side, and I feel that it's a good all around build that won't compromise on performance. Parts availability may be an issue, however this changes from week to week and by the time you're ready to build the computer, there will very likely be better options available for the price. Don't take our advice as gospel, but the exercise shows that you can build a good computer for the $1000 budget.

Feel free to post again when you've got the cash lined up and we'll have another round to put together some more options for you.


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## Saiko (Oct 2, 2013)

One thing I might remind you about is how the purpose of your computer will carry hidden costs and priorities. For example, a "hardcore gamer" obviously will need to ramp up the GPU and CPU price... and this will inevitably ramp up the power supply cost. Additionally, he'll need to spend more money on a mouse and perhaps a keyboard.

It appears that you'll be using this PC for a lot of artwork, so you'll of course need RAM. I would think 8 GB at 1600 MHz will be fine, but you could consider 16 GB. It'll be okay to cut the GPU and CPU some. Additionally, I don't know if you've thought about this or not, but you're going to want to invest in a good monitor as well. I would argue that gaming doesn't really require colors to be perfect... art kinda does. And a quality monitor will cost you.


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## Arshes Nei (Oct 2, 2013)

Most important for Artwork is stability, good amount of RAM. 8 is fine if you're not multitasking a lot or having a lot other programs open at once. Usually I can have Painter/Sai/Photoshop open at once so it can get hairy if not for the fact I did upgrade the PC for a good amount of RAM. (32gb) - but keep in mind if you're still using Windows 764bit and not getting Windows 8 - I believe Home Basic for 7 it was restricted to 8gb, Home Premium 16gb and Utlimate allows 32gb and higher (192?). Windows 8's limits on 64bit allows for much higher. However you don't really need much more than 16 if you're just multitasking programs. You may end up needing more if you're multitasking certain programs and livestreaming. Because Painter for example will immediately allocate all of the percentage you set it use (I have it set to 25 instead of default%), while others may do it incrementally. I need to remember if they changed this process in Painter X3 but it was certainly true for 12 for a while. 


Time you expect this computer to last and if you want upgrade paths to improve the purpose of computer.
Intel GPU - not always great with OpenGL so sometimes you'll hit issues with Photoshop and so forth, same with ATi

CPU speed less important for artwork as those cores don't really add much to the artmaking process. It may have impact (GPU included) on programs that do utilize it for large brush sizes and transformations. But that's only if you work at high resolutions, and a lot of times I find artists doing it as overkill. It's actually better to do a composition/rough drawing at a lower resolution then upscale it. Now that does mean you have to refine it at the higher resolution but at least you're not staring at a 5000x10000 pixel blank canvas not knowing what the fuck to do for background. Start small, then upscale for details and refinements. 

It depends on how much you need for your monitor. Is it more for color accuracy, less color shifting? Go with an IPS monitor, which 20" or above will cost you around $160+ (though this dell is about $140 http://www.amazon.com/Dell-CFGKT-IPS-LED-21-5-Inch-LED-lit-Monitor/dp/B009H0XQPU), for me I say 2 montiors are great. Use your old monitor for holding things like Palettes, tools, etc controls on the screen you're not painting on, and now you can have a full screen just for drawing.


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