# Left for dead 2 demo



## Aleister The Wolf (Oct 27, 2009)

anyone else played it yet?
I got it earlier today and thought it was awesome.
just asking for opinions here, trying to see how everyone felt about this game.(given they have the demo of course)


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## Kryn (Oct 27, 2009)

How have you played it already? It's hasn't been released on steam 

Just restarted my steam account and it's still not there.


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## Aleister The Wolf (Oct 27, 2009)

gamestop (and i think steam too) is giving out early access codes for preordering, its awesome.


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## Kryn (Oct 27, 2009)

Oh, I didn't realize the demo was on 360 too. I haven't been keeping up with consoles lately


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## Aleister The Wolf (Oct 27, 2009)

yea, its a pretty good demo though, you should get it.


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## CrispSkittlez (Oct 28, 2009)

Damn..... I still need to make my pre-order. :/


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## Daervhir (Oct 28, 2009)

I pre-ordered from GameStop...Do I need to go in and get a card or something?


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## LizardKing (Oct 28, 2009)

FUCK YOU VALVE

THIS SHIT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE RELEASED 8PM YESTERDAY

THEN 11PM

THEN 6AM THE NEXT DAY

THEN 8PM AGAIN

FOR NO FUCKING REASON

NO EXPLANATIONS

YOU'VE HAD MONTHS TO SORT THIS YOU BUTTPLUGS

AAAAAAAAAAARGH


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## Jyaki (Oct 28, 2009)

Valve sucks. You should know this. :|


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## LizardKing (Oct 28, 2009)

OH IT'S 9PM NOW

CUNTS


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## Jyaki (Oct 28, 2009)

Yep. One more hour, or 50 more mins to be exact.


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## Jyaki (Oct 28, 2009)

30 mins to go, lol....


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## Dawg (Oct 28, 2009)

LizardKing said:


> FUCK YOU VALVE
> 
> THIS SHIT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE RELEASED 8PM YESTERDAY
> 
> ...


Sort-of explains how I feel.


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## Kryn (Oct 28, 2009)

I'm finally decrypting it, about to finally play l4d2 wooooooooo!


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## Kaamos (Oct 28, 2009)

Damn, the demo isn't on the Xbox marketplace... But the new CSI is!!

 :/


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## Plasma Reflection (Oct 28, 2009)

...


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Oct 29, 2009)

lol playing Valve games on consoles


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## Rifter (Oct 29, 2009)

WolfoxOkamichan said:


> lol playing Valve games on consoles



lol people liking things that I don't

Demo was worth the (hilarious) wait. The new weapons and special infected round the experience out amazingly well, they just feel like things you didn't realize L4D was missing.


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## xcliber (Oct 29, 2009)

I agree. All the new stuff and changes made in L4D2 totally merit it being a $50 sequal as opposed to just an add-on.

There was so much lag and so many graphical glitches though. It _is_ just a demo though, so I'm expecting good things from the final product. 19 days to go, if Valve actually releases it on time.


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## Furlop (Oct 29, 2009)

The variety of weapons and the new sounds for each of them was pretty refreshing.

The first time I picked up the adrenaline, I thought "Oh no, they did away with pillz, what were they thinking?!" Only to soon find a bottle and listen to Coach say "I know one thing, I'm grabbing pills!" Laughter and relief ensued.

As for the new special infected, it's hard to really comment on them until it's possible to play Versus and really get a feel for them and their strategies. Sadly, it doesn't seem like any of the special infected AI has changed any, making them stupidly easy to predict and kill.

The introduction of different panic events is another thing that makes L4D2 much better. Forcing the survivors to move through eliminates the corner-camping melee spam that was common shows that the developers were paying attention to what strategies people were using to negate panic events. (Seriously, at the state L4D is in now, panic events are anything but what their name implies) 

Overall, it's a very promising look into what L4D2 is going to be. And from what I've seen, it's worth the purchase.


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Oct 29, 2009)

But seriously, Valve and console don't mix.


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## LotsOfNothing (Oct 29, 2009)

No one cares about your opinion, go jerk off on Gabe Newell some more.


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## Plasma Reflection (Oct 29, 2009)

...


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## Wreth (Oct 29, 2009)

WolfoxOkamichan said:


> But seriously, Valve and console don't mix.



Why not, not everyone wants to buy a console and a gaming PC.


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## LizardKing (Oct 29, 2009)

Holy shit

This is awesome


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Oct 29, 2009)

Wait... there are people who thought what I am saying is an... OPINION?!

XD

No, go ask people, not the random boxfag, but those who play Valve games. They'll say to you pretty much that the PC version is a lot friendlier, is generally updated, and well... looking at L4D... the patches are free.

Oh and dedicated servers.


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## Aleister The Wolf (Oct 29, 2009)

^ this is true.
pc is better.


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Oct 30, 2009)

Seriously, first day DLC purchases are now available in 360! WTF XD


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## Imperial Impact (Oct 30, 2009)

LotsOfNothing said:


> No one cares about your opinion, go jerk off on Gabe Newell some more.


But I thought you love him, Is there another man in your life?


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## LotsOfNothing (Oct 30, 2009)

Wait, who do I love?


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## Tobias-the-pink (Oct 30, 2009)

Yeah, I loved it. I'm still not bored with screaming "LEEROY JENKINS" down the microphone before rushing a tank with a machete! >:3
Hitting a witch with a boomer bile-vial was a highlight, too.


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Oct 31, 2009)

At one point in your life you'll realize that "fun" won't justify anything.


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## Shay Feral (Oct 31, 2009)

WolfoxOkamichan said:


> Wait... there are people who thought what I am saying is an... OPINION?!
> 
> XD
> 
> ...



PC = Elitism

L4D on the 360 was a fucking fun game, got countless hours playing it with my friends over and over again. The difference between PC and 360 is that I can buy a 360, and both games _at brand new pricing_ and still cost *less* than a PC required to run the first L4D game.

=========================

I've been watching demo footage on youtube, and I like what I see... Magnum Pistol (Desert Eagle) FTW!!!

I might reserve me a copy for mah 360


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## Ishnuvalok (Nov 1, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> PC = Elitism
> 
> L4D on the 360 was a fucking fun game, got countless hours playing it with my friends over and over again. The difference between PC and 360 is that I can buy a 360, and both games _at brand new pricing_ and still cost *less* than a PC required to run the first L4D game.



Actually, console gaming and PC gaming cost about the same. You spend more money on PC hardware, but consoles even that out by having more expensive games. You can actually make PC gaming cheaper than console gaming. Sure you won't be able to play the newest releases at max settings but hey, you can still play the game, that's what counts (unless your playing Crysis :V)

PC isn't Elitism. PC is just the most customizable and varied gaming "platform" out there. 

Not to mention PC games don't die out as easy as console games, thousands of people still play Quake 3 and Counter Strike, which came out over 10 years ago. How many people are still playing the original Halo? How many people will still play Modern Warfare when MW2 comes out?

*edit* 

Oh, and PC gaming is getting cheaper every year, if not month. A 14k SEK computer that could play the newest games at max settings, the equivalent about 6 months ago cost 10k SEK. And around now it costs 9k SEK.


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## Shay Feral (Nov 1, 2009)

Ishnuvalok said:


> Actually, console gaming and PC gaming cost about the same. You spend more money on PC hardware, but consoles even that out by having more expensive games. You can actually make PC gaming cheaper than console gaming. Sure you won't be able to play the newest releases at max settings but hey, you can still play the game, that's what counts (unless your playing Crysis :V)
> 
> PC isn't Elitism. PC is just the most customizable and varied gaming "platform" out there.
> 
> Not to mention PC games don't die out as easy as console games, thousands of people still play Quake 3 and Counter Strike, which came out over 10 years ago. How many people are still playing the original Halo? How many people will still play Modern Warfare when MW2 comes out?



Moot point... Modern Warfare is a mutli-platform game, including PC...

The thing I think that works in favor of the PC is graphics capability and customization, atleast for popular games... GTA: San Andreas is a very customizable game, Driver: Parallel Lines... not so much...

As for price... Not it does not equal out, wasn't Dead Space for the PC originally around $120? MW2 when it comes out for PC is going to cost the same for PC as it will on console...

And finally, how many people still play the original halo... On their pc? Halo was originally a PC game...

------------------

Granted: I would still be playing "Gearhead Garage" which is an old PC game, if Vista wouldn't fight me so much over it. and "Burnout: Hot Rod Championship drag racing" if I could find it again. But on the same card I still play games like "Perfect Dark", "007 Golden Eye", "Smackdown Vs Raw 2008" despite having newer versions of the games on newer consoles


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## Ishnuvalok (Nov 1, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> Moot point... Modern Warfare is a mutli-platform game, including PC...
> 
> The thing I think that works in favor of the PC is graphics capability and customization, atleast for popular games... GTA: San Andreas is a very customizable game, Driver: Parallel Lines... not so much...
> 
> ...



No, Dead Space was around, well, the same price for most PC games (300-400 SEK, compared to 600 for a console game). I got it for 100 SEK because of a summer sale. 

Halo wasn't released on the PC until about a year after the Xbox release. People played it for a while, but not so much. Mostly due to restrictions, it was a port, ports usually don't come with mod support, unless they've specifically re developed the game for PC. And iirc Halo: CE wasn't, was just a port.

Imo, one of the best console to PC ports I've seen is Mass Effect, they actually took time and redesigned menues, controls, graphic tweaks etc. Compare that to the Prince of Persia: Warrior Within which was basically just remapping the controls to keys _all over the fucking keyboard_. After that I came to learn that PoP games are better played on gamepads.


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## Shay Feral (Nov 1, 2009)

Ishnuvalok said:


> No, Dead Space was around, well, the same price for most PC games (300-400 SEK, compared to 600 for a console game). I got it for 100 SEK because of a summer sale.
> 
> Halo wasn't released on the PC until about a year after the Xbox release. People played it for a while, but not so much. Mostly due to restrictions, it was a port, ports usually don't come with mod support, unless they've specifically re developed the game for PC. And iirc Halo: CE wasn't, was just a port.



I specifically remember Halo being a PC game to begin with, and then making the leap the the Xbox console... And of course you can get Dead Space cheaper now, hell I could buy it for $20 or less used from game stop if I wanted it...

But new for the PC it had a pretty heafty price tag...


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## Ishnuvalok (Nov 1, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> I specifically remember Halo being a PC game to begin with, and then making the leap the the Xbox console... And of course you can get Dead Space cheaper now, hell I could buy it for $20 or less used from game stop if I wanted it...
> 
> But new for the PC it had a pretty heafty price tag...



I'd like to see a source for the PC price of Dead Space, I have a very, very hard time believing that Dead Space was over $100 on release. 

But Halo was an Xbox game first before it came to PC. Halo came out on the Xbox in 2001 in North America (In 2002 for the EU) then the Windows port was released in late 2003.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 1, 2009)

Ishnuvalok said:


> But Halo was an Xbox game first before it came to PC. Halo came out on the Xbox in 2001 in North America (In 2002 for the EU) then the Windows port was released in late 2003.



Actually...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halo:_Combat_Evolved#Development


> On July 21, 1999, during the Macworld Conference & Expo, Steve Jobs announced that Halo would be released for Mac OS and Windows simultaneously...As rumors had predicted, Microsoft announced on June 19, 2000 that it had acquired Bungie Studios...



But you could be right, I'm just sayin'.


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## Kaamos (Nov 1, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> And of course you can get Dead Space cheaper now, hell I could buy it for $20 or less used from game stop if I wanted it...
> 
> But new for the PC it had a pretty heafty price tag...



You can buy it directly on the Xbox Marketplace for $20, since they do this "games on demand" stuff now.


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## Ishnuvalok (Nov 1, 2009)

LotsOfNothing said:


> Actually...



It was first thought to be released for PC and Macintosh, but then Bungie was bought by Microsoft, and Halo was released on the Xbox first.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 1, 2009)

Ishnuvalok said:


> It was first thought to be released for PC and Macintosh, but then Bungie was bought by Microsoft, and Halo was released on the Xbox first.



But it was a PC and Mac idea first.  That's what he was saying.


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## Ishnuvalok (Nov 1, 2009)

LotsOfNothing said:


> But it was a PC and Mac idea first.  That's what he was saying.



Well yeah, that was the idea from the start, then it turned into the console FPS it is known as today. 

If Halo: CE was released for PC instead of the Xbox, it would not have gotten as popular as it is now, that's for sure.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 1, 2009)

Only because Microdumb love hyping generic ideas.


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## Shay Feral (Nov 1, 2009)

Ishnuvalok said:


> I'd like to see a source for the PC price of Dead Space, I have a very, very hard time believing that Dead Space was over $100 on release.



I'll be honest, I can't find a damn thing...


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## Holsety (Nov 1, 2009)

LotsOfNothing said:


> But it was a PC and Mac idea first.  That's what he was saying.


Yes but the PC/Mac game was completely different than the end result on the consoles. It's not even a good comparison to make simply because their only similarity was setting.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 1, 2009)

Holsety said:


> Yes but the PC/Mac game was completely different than the end result on the consoles. It's not even a good comparison to make simply because their only similarity was setting.



Wat

They're the exact same thing.  Only Microballs decided to buy Bungie out for GiantBox development.


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## Holsety (Nov 1, 2009)

LotsOfNothing said:


> Wat
> 
> They're the exact same thing.  Only Microballs decided to buy Bungie out for GiantBox development.


I was referring to the original game concept, not the port.

It was originally intended to be some form of a strategy game, not an FPS.


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## Ishnuvalok (Nov 1, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> I'll be honest, I can't find a damn thing...



Hm, Sorry, I just can't believe in a claim like that. It's way too exaggerated.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 1, 2009)

Holsety said:


> I was referring to the original game concept, not the port.
> 
> It was originally intended to be some form of a strategy game, not an FPS.



It was still a shooter.  A third-person one.  The "tech demo" video they showed was just Bungie showing off their virtual penis through whatever fancy effects they came up with.


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## Shay Feral (Nov 1, 2009)

Ishnuvalok said:


> Hm, Sorry, I just can't believe in a claim like that. It's way too exaggerated.



I'm not exaggerating anything, I'm speaking from memory of a preview I watched. If I could remember that preview I'd have something...

But thats the fallacy of this debate, just because I can't find any information, doesn't necessarily mean I'm wrong.


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## Garreth (Nov 1, 2009)

I liked how they made it more then an expansion + melee weapons, though I prefer they made the propane tank a legitimate melee weapon to use. >:/



Shay Feral said:


> PC = Elitism
> 
> L4D on the 360 was a fucking fun game, got countless hours playing it with my friends over and over again. The difference between PC and 360 is that I can buy a 360, and both games _at brand new pricing_ and still cost *less* than a PC required to run the first L4D game.
> 
> ...



You're only saying that because you're poor. :V


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## LizardKing (Nov 1, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> The difference between PC and 360 is that I can buy a 360, and both games _at brand new pricing_ and still cost *less* than a PC required to run the first L4D game.



The difference between a car and a bike is that I can buy a bike, and some protective clothing _at brand new pricing_, and still cost *less* than a car to drive to Ikea in!

What a terrible argument.


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## Sernion (Nov 1, 2009)

I wasn't going to buy L4D2 anytime soon, but I'm tempted to buy it thanks to this thread. :/


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## Shay Feral (Nov 1, 2009)

Garreth said:


> I liked how they made it more then an expansion + melee weapons, though I prefer they made the propane tank a legitimate melee weapon to use. >:/
> 
> 
> 
> You're only saying that because you're poor. :V



I'm saying that I am on a brand new $600 PC and can't play modern games, hell I cant even run GTA:SA without lag in many instances. Though partially due to vista.

But accusing me of being poor further verifies the elitism, I'm not gonna pay $1,000 for a laptop to play new video games. And I'm not going to dish out another $600 for a desktop PC either. On the subject of video games I get more value out of my Xbox 360 than I do my computer... It's as simple as that



LizardKing said:


> The difference between a car and a bike is that I can buy a bike, and some protective clothing _at brand new pricing_, and still cost *less* than a car to drive to Ikea in!
> 
> What a terrible argument.



*face palm* you wouldn't know a good argument if it hit you in the face.


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Nov 1, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> PC = Elitism
> 
> L4D on the 360 was a fucking fun game, got countless hours playing it with my friends over and over again. The difference between PC and 360 is that I can buy a 360, and both games _at brand new pricing_ and still cost *less* than a PC required to run the first L4D game.
> 
> ...



No. We just don't like sucking the company's dick.


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## LizardKing (Nov 2, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> *face palm* you wouldn't know a good argument if it hit you in the face.



Hey, get your 360 and open up Firefox.

Oh. Whoops.

Well what about Photoshop? Oh. Torrents? Hmm. _Notepad?_. Pfft. So you spent all that money on something that just plays games and you can't even repair it yourself? That sucks.


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## littleblue-fox (Nov 2, 2009)

Bringing the thread back on topic (boring i know )

Played the demo on PC and have to say i liked it, even if it was somewhat short.

Favourite aspect as to be the jukebox though - whats not to love about killing zombies whilst a song plays in the background, sung by a zombie about eating a colleagues brains slowly XD

Not too keen on the charger.......just seems like a poormans Tank. Like the Spitter; certainly makes it more interesting.
The Jockeys laugh terrifies me D:

Also loving the melee weapons. Theres something insanely satisfying in button mashing a frying pan into a tank 

Probably going to go for the Xbox version though; me/boyfriend like to play co-op quite a lot and my laptop isn't designed for gaming 

Debs
xxox

(oh....Banjo L4D theme is fucking win )


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## Sinjo (Nov 2, 2009)

Query

L4D2

or 

Borderlands.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 2, 2009)

LizardKing said:


> Hey, get your 360 and open up Firefox.
> 
> Oh. Whoops.
> 
> Well what about Photoshop? Oh. Torrents? Hmm. _Notepad?_. Pfft. So you spent all that money on something that just plays games and you can't even repair it yourself? That sucks.



Lol the reason people buy consoles is because they *aren't* computers.


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## Fay V (Nov 2, 2009)

I've played L4D on xbox and PC. I prefer the PC, But i already have a very nice laptop which i treated myself to when I could afford it. So...myeah

Anyway I love the Demo I just wish it was longer. The wandering witch is rather interesting and not as debilitating as I thought it would be. You can still easily sneak around if you want to. 

I don't much like the spitter, I suppose just because her audio que isn't very recognizable to me so I mistake her for a regular zombie a lot. 
I was also reeeally happy to see a second form of boomer, it looks kinda female (though hard to tell since I can never get a close look) and makes a slightly different audio que  Mostly i just love it for the variety. 
The defibulator is pretty cool too, did it take the place of hero closets? I haven't had anyone dead that long yet. 

I also dislike the charger. maybe I'll like it more when i can play some versus with it, but right now it just does the job of a tank, but not as well. 

Boomer bile is endless fun. I've been dicking around and trying to explore the game a bit, so as often as possible I love killing a tank with bile. 

All in all I am more than happy that I bought this game


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## Vinzin (Nov 2, 2009)

Fay V said:


> The defibulator is pretty cool too, did it take the place of hero closets? I haven't had anyone dead that long yet.



Nope, I've had a person with the defib and someone spawned in the bathroom stalls in the Park when we didn't bring them back.

I will say that the charger can cause some serious damage if it catches you when all of you are together and manages to tackle the victim a long distance (Say from the location of the magnum pistol all the way back to near the bar). The fact that it takes longer to get up if you get pushed down by it could also be deadly in versus if say a Smoker/Hunter/Jockey are nearby.


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## LizardKing (Nov 2, 2009)

LotsOfNothing said:


> Lol the reason people buy consoles is because they *aren't* computers.



Well yes, that's the point.


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## lilEmber (Nov 2, 2009)

LizardKing said:


> Well yes, that's the point.



"I'm gonna buy me a console!" ... "HEY THIS ISN'T A COMPUTER. U TRICKED ME :C"


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 2, 2009)

LizardKing said:


> Well yes, that's the point.




I know, but people keep comparing them to computers. 

"LOL CAN U RAN WERD ON IT"  No, it's not a PC.  It's a dedicated gaming console.


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## TehSean (Nov 2, 2009)

I thought this thread was about L4D2

Well. I had technical difficulties, but aside from that: Already pre-ordered.

I will have fun playing it for sure, just like the first game. The trouble is that I know it won't have staying power. It'll be fun for a few months, but I think that will be worth it.

As for the new stuff! Well! Yay! New weapons! I love new weapons! I love pointlessly diverse weapons! 007-ism!


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## Kryn (Nov 2, 2009)

Ishnuvalok said:


> Hm, Sorry, I just can't believe in a claim like that. It's way too exaggerated.



It can't be true. You know how smart the PC gaming community is. If a game as shitty as deadspace was was being sold at over $100 every pc gamer would just be completely appalled and it would be on every major gaming website on the internet. I have no recolection of any event like this.

EDIT: Well, after ONE google search I found what Shay Feral was talking about.
http://xbox.joystiq.com/2008/09/25/its-a-dead-space-ultra-limited-edition-and-its-149/
It was the Ultra Limited Edition, it simply included a bunch of crap nobody really wanted. It wasn't exclusive to the PC either, in fact it was exclusive only to the Xbox 360.


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## Fay V (Nov 2, 2009)

Vinzin said:


> Nope, I've had a person with the defib and someone spawned in the bathroom stalls in the Park when we didn't bring them back.
> 
> I will say that the charger can cause some serious damage if it catches you when all of you are together and manages to tackle the victim a long distance (Say from the location of the magnum pistol all the way back to near the bar). The fact that it takes longer to get up if you get pushed down by it could also be deadly in versus if say a Smoker/Hunter/Jockey are nearby.



yeah, i believe the spitter and charger were made more for versus games to keep people from holding up in corners. I'm sure I'll appreciate it more when I get to play versus. I'm disapointed that scavenger isn't available in some manner or realism, why can't we test out the new stuff


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## Krevan (Nov 3, 2009)

Really gotta get this when I come back, does the chainsaw run out of fuel?


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## Ishnuvalok (Nov 3, 2009)

Kryn said:


> It can't be true. You know how smart the PC gaming community is. If a game as shitty as deadspace was was being sold at over $100 every pc gamer would just be completely appalled and it would be on every major gaming website on the internet. I have no recolection of any event like this.
> 
> EDIT: Well, after ONE google search I found what Shay Feral was talking about.
> http://xbox.joystiq.com/2008/09/25/its-a-dead-space-ultra-limited-edition-and-its-149/
> It was the Ultra Limited Edition, it simply included a bunch of crap nobody really wanted. It wasn't exclusive to the PC either, in fact it was exclusive only to the Xbox 360.



Oh that's what he was talking about, lol, and I thought MW2's "Prestige Edition" was bad XD


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## CaptainCool (Nov 3, 2009)

i kinda liked the demo. ive never been a fan of left 4 dead but the demo of L4D2 was a lot more fun for me!
i probably wont buy the game but i definitely isnt bad


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## Sinjo (Nov 3, 2009)

way to short.


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## cetol (Nov 3, 2009)

Just finished playing the demo.
Intresting design and all-around fun level to play.

I still like the first one more though :3


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## CrispSkittlez (Nov 5, 2009)

I'm downloading the demo on Steam now. I wonder how bad it will run on my comp... >.>


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## Runefox (Nov 5, 2009)

L4D2. Well, I played it.

Let's start from the least important and work our way up:

The graphics... Good. Very good. Much better than L4D1, and that's saying a lot, since it was the best-looking Source engine game at the time. It's more proof that Source has a lot more potential as a modern engine yet. Almost all of the infected have had makeovers (except for the Hunter), and they all seem to fit into the setting very nicely - Even the bulletproof ones. The weapons are the most immediate improvement, and they all look much, much better. One thing that I'm not terribly fond of, though, is that all of it took place during the daytime - There was pretty much no use for flashlights.

The sounds... Well, it's good. The infected sound like they belong, and the moans and mumbles of some of them sound distinctly southern, and the Witch and all of the others have had a change in voice, as well (again, except for the Hunter, for some unknown reason, who sounds identical to the original). The gunshots sound a little better than they did before, and the survivor voiceovers work. The music's been remixed from the original to have a more southern/cajun feel to it, and there seems to be a larger variety of tracks that play. Of particular note, the track that plays when near the Witch is distinct, and it changes very audibly when you get too close.

The characters... Coach and Ellis are fun. The other two I don't think said or did a damned thing throughout the whole game, which leads me to believe that at least the guy in the suit (who I can't be bothered to remember his name) has no personality.

The weapons... Well. This is bad. It's cool that there are multiple weapons within the same class, but there isn't any major difference between them; But where the game falls flat is with the melee weapons. Not that I have a problem with there being melee weapons to begin with - No, I have a problem with the melee weapon taking up your pistol slot with no way to drop it except to pick up another melee weapon. In combat, when I wanted to pull a pistol (say, for example, I got surrounded, and was out of ammunition), I pulled my electric guitar out instead. OK, let's try that - Bash. Bash. Bash. Well, it makes short work of one or two at a time, but it doesn't come out fast enough and damned near got me killed. It's an interesting concept for a weapon, but it's not like the character drops the pistol when they strap a melee weapon to their back. However, I seem to remember something about "running out of bullets" being a theme in the first teaser they showed involving the melee weapons. If this is true, then that brings me to my next complaints:

The gameplay... Oh god no. You slide around an awful lot while moving, and it's hard to make precise movements that way. I guess if you wanted to be realistic about it, you can't change direction on a dime in reality, either, but seriously, it's hard to get used to. Aside from that, the shooting and everything is very much the same as it was before, with the addition of new goodies like vials of boomer bile to attract the horde to a specific spot, defibrillators to revive downed teammates, adrenaline, etc. The Witch also moves around, which makes it a little more difficult in some cases, but often, a confrontation isn't necessary (though you'll easily mistake her at a distance for a common infected if there are others around). But that's where the fun ends. You see, Left 4 Dead has a long history of trying to make you play a certain way - And this is terrible. Getting pinned by a Hunter, constricted by a Smoker or getting jumped by a Jockey (one of the new special infected) brings up a lovely message - "A team mate must save you!". Oh *joy*! _This_ again. AI teammates are all but useless and human teammates are unreliable. It's absolutely impossible to get out of these kinds of things on your own, which means you ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO stick together and hope someone notices when you get taken down. It's this kind of "No! You need to play this way!" attitude that makes me bitter towards Left 4 Dead in general. It was such a good premise, such a good game, and it was ruined by that alone. Another example is with the bulletproof infected - Again, you MUST take them down a certain way, and it almost forces you to use your melee weapons against them (or otherwise shove them and shoot them in the back). It repeats itself once more with melee weapons again - Running out of ammunition for your main weapon means not being able to switch to your pistol any more if you're carrying a melee weapon, once again shoehorning you into a certain style of gameplay. This hand-holding, dragging-along experience is absolutely the opposite of what one would expect - or want.

Re the 360 version of L4D: Impossible to control. It's hard enough to play L4D without shooting your damned teammates (not the smallest reason for which being that they walk through you) with a mouse, let alone a clunky old joystick. I to this day do not understand why people feel the need to make first-person shooters for consoles. Joysticks suck. Now, if I could get some mouse/keyboard action going on the 360? That'd be a different story altogether.


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## Jelly (Nov 5, 2009)

Its hilarious, and I like it.
The amount of weapons is great.
And I like the dumb redneck who never shuts up.
He's great.
He's an awesome contrast with the loan shark.

Again, though, I feel like these two are pulling most of the character weight in the game like Bill and Francis did the last time.


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## Furlop (Nov 5, 2009)

Runefox said:


> It's absolutely impossible to get out of these kinds of things on your own, which means you ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO stick together and hope someone notices when you get taken down. It's this kind of "No! You need to play this way!" attitude that makes me bitter towards Left 4 Dead in general. It was such a good premise, such a good game, and it was ruined by that alone.



Euhh, I think you're playing the wrong game if you've got beef with sticking together. That's what you do. That's what the whole game has been based around from the very start. A co-op game, meaning you aren't going to make it without your teammates help. Even in the commentary, the developers talk about how the smoker's main job is to try and *split up the group of survivors*, creating dangerous situations.

I agree that the AI is pretty bad (though I've been saved a lot of times in hopeless situations by a teleporting bot) but the game wasn't meant for single-player. It's meant for you to play with your friends.

Also, you don't have to pick up a melee weapon if you don't want. They're just an alternative to using pistols. The game isn't forcing you to use any weapon like you're imagining it to.


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## Runefox (Nov 5, 2009)

Furlop said:


> Euhh, I think you're playing the wrong game if you've got beef with sticking together. That's what you do.


See, it's not my major problem that that's what you're supposed to do, but the Hunting Rifle, for example, is all but useless as a support weapon because even holing up in a corner somewhere, you'll have a hunter or smoker randomly spawn and take you out while you're providing support from a distance. It precludes being able to do that and makes the hunting rifle useful only for taking out long lines of infected without even needing the scope. In other words, why bother with it at all?

And I mean, on top of that, if you get far enough away from everyone, the game deliberately starts spawning Hunters and Smokers to deal with you. Basically, the game's on rails.

It doesn't help matters if you're playing with friends on the higher difficulties and you get incapacitated even once - And then slowly run down to 1 health and limp along while the rest of your human teammates keep running forward. Basically, again, human teammates are unreliable, and at this point you'll get picked off by a Hunter or something. It's cheap and annoying.

Frankly, if not for the Special Infected, there wouldn't be a problem. Just crank up the difficulty on the common infected and pop more of them into the game world. Much more Romero-esque.



> Also, you don't have to pick up a melee weapon if you don't want. They're just an alternative to using pistols. The game isn't forcing you to use any weapon like you're imagining it to.



The game very much says "PICK UP A MELEE WEAPON!" in a very insistent manner, and never was I told that doing so would cause me to (for whatever stupid reason) lose my pistol. The fact that you then *cannot drop* said melee weapon basically says that the whole reason they're there is to go back to the whole "running out of bullets" thing they mentioned in the trailer.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 5, 2009)

jellyhurwit said:


> And I like the dumb redneck who never shuts up.



Y'all know what 'suck the heads' means?  Me an' Kieth came down here once, and he didn't know what it meant.  It's nothin' bad, it's about eatin'...



Runefox said:


> "PICK UP A MELEE WEAPON!"



That attitude will kill you in Expert.  Well, I dunno.


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## Furlop (Nov 5, 2009)

Runefox said:


> The game very much says "PICK UP A MELEE WEAPON!" in a very insistent manner, and never was I told that doing so would cause me to (for whatever stupid reason) lose my pistol. The fact that you then *cannot drop* said melee weapon basically says that the whole reason they're there is to go back to the whole "running out of bullets" thing they mentioned in the trailer.



You can drop the melee weapon by picking up your pistols again. The melee and pistols take up the second slot, so you can't have both at the same time.


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## Shay Feral (Nov 5, 2009)

LizardKing said:


> Hey, get your 360 and open up Firefox.
> 
> Oh. Whoops.
> 
> Well what about Photoshop? Oh. Torrents? Hmm. _Notepad?_. Pfft. So you spent all that money on something that *just plays games* and you can't even repair it yourself? That sucks.



So, you are telling me that I cant watch a DVD on my Xbox? Nor listen to music, nor chat with my friends, and I can't even view pictures on my 360?

Wow, I must have been imagining that, I could have sworn I was watching a DVD last night on my 360, right after I played some of the Left 4 Dead 2 demo. I guess I must not have music saved on my Xbox hard drive either.

And my laptop is about as repairable as a 360, except I can get my 360 repaired for free... Or replaced if it fouls up...

Lets not forget how much computers love to catch viruses!

You've got to have money to buy an expensive PC to play games, show me a computer that can play these newer games for as much as a new Xbox 360 and I may consider buying a new PC just for gaming. Until then, computers are for arrogant pricks who need a high price tag to compensate for their antisocial behavior.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 5, 2009)

I take offense to that last statement.






Asshole.


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## Runefox (Nov 5, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> You've got to have money to buy an expensive PC to play games, show me a computer that can play these newer games for as much as a new Xbox 360 and I may consider buying a new PC just for gaming. Until then, computers are for arrogant pricks who need a high price tag to compensate for their antisocial behavior.



No. A computer is a multifunctional device - Something that you have already and would buy another of if it died. When you buy a computer, expect to spend around $700 USD for a basic (non-shit - >$500 computers are disposables) model, which actually are pretty decent nowadays - Most of them come with dual core or quad core processors (if you're lucky), and at least 3GB of RAM and a nicely-sized hard drive; No problems there.

So, you've got your basic computer for your browsing, e-mail, chat, all that good stuff; How do you make it a gaming powerhouse? All you really need at this point is a decent graphics card. How much is a graphics card? For one that'll net you about the same performance or greater than the 360, about $110-$120, and you probably won't even need to worry about the power supply with this one, either. So with that computer that you would have bought already, you spend an extra $120 and you've got yourself a machine capable of matching a $199 360, and you'll get about the same lifetime out of the video card as you would out of the 360 - Even the more demanding, more modern games will run at lower settings. Seems like a good deal to me.

Contrary to popular belief, you don't need to spend $400-$500 on the top-tier video cards in order to make it worthwhile - I'm still using a first-generation Sapphire Radeon HD 4850 (which the 4770 linked above is about on-par with, better in some areas, weaker in others), and it handles everything I throw at it - L4D2 ran butter smooth, and I can guarantee you the graphic quality is higher than it would be on the 360, not to mention the controls. For all my complaints, the game runs really well. *Which is not something I can say for L4D1 on the 360 - OUCH.*


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## Shay Feral (Nov 5, 2009)

Runefox said:


> No. A computer is a multifunctional device - Something that you have already and would buy another of if it died. When you buy a computer, expect to spend around $700 USD for a basic (non-shit - >$500 computers are disposables) model, which actually are pretty decent nowadays - Most of them come with dual core or quad core processors (if you're lucky), and at least 3GB of RAM and a nicely-sized hard drive; No problems there.
> 
> So, you've got your basic computer for your browsing, e-mail, chat, all that good stuff; How do you make it a gaming powerhouse? All you really need at this point is a decent graphics card. How much is a graphics card? For one that'll net you about the same performance or greater than the 360, about $110-$120, and you probably won't even need to worry about the power supply with this one, either. So with that computer that you would have bought already, you spend an extra $120 and you've got yourself a machine capable of matching a $199 360, and you'll get about the same lifetime out of the video card as you would out of the 360 - Even the more demanding, more modern games will run at lower settings. Seems like a good deal to me.
> 
> Contrary to popular belief, you don't need to spend $400-$500 on the top-tier video cards in order to make it worthwhile - I'm still using a first-generation Sapphire Radeon HD 4850, and it handles everything I throw at it - L4D2 ran butter smooth, and I can guarantee you the graphic quality is higher than it would be on the 360, not to mention the controls. For all my complaints, the game runs really well.



It doesn't matter how you slice it, you are still going to spend more money trying to upgrade your computer, and keep it updated.

Consoles: You spend $300 - $400 and is *generally* a one time expense, you use it for 3 - 5 years before the next generation comes out.

PC: You spend $600 and pray to god your system is compatible with a game, you have it for 3 weeks to learn that a new game you want requires a new video card in which you will need to spend another $100 - $200 for. Every year you need to upgrade your computer for the "next big thing", but the positive side is you can keep upgrading your computer years after it's gone "out of date". Eventually it'll die, or the gaming industry will say "fuck you" to all your specs and hardware and you'll have to either overhaul the entire PC or buy a new one.


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## Runefox (Nov 5, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> PC: You spend $600 and pray to god your system is compatible with a game



Stop. (Hammer Time!)

Are you buying the PC solely to play games? If not, factor in the other usage you get out of the PC - Like the one you're on now, that you're (presumably) not using to play games. That's money you've already spent that isn't going towards games - If you upgrade your PC, the money you're spending upgrading it is the money you're spending on the gaming experience, much like that $300-400 for consoles is what you've spent on gaming for those.

Since you've *already* bought a $600 PC and are using it for things other than gaming, adding gaming capability to it is a mere ~$120 away, and it'll run games past and present, and continue to run games into the future. Compared to buying a console alongside your PC, it's not a bad deal.



> Every year you need to upgrade your computer for the "next big thing", but the positive side is you can keep upgrading your computer years after it's gone "out of date". Eventually it'll die, or the gaming industry will say "fuck you" to all your specs and hardware and you'll have to either overhaul the entire PC or buy a new one.



I can't think of a single time in history that this has happened - There are still people gaming on GeForce 7900-series graphics cards from three or four years ago that are still 100% awesome - Hell, until last year, I still had a Radeon 9600 from when I was in high school in 2002 (which was budget _then_), and I was still playing games with it. Unlike with consoles, where the next generation forces you to upgrade (another $300-$400), the great thing about the PC is that you can turn down graphics settings when things are too much for your computer, and if it comes time to upgrade, then you'll spend somewhere around that $120 mark again - In general, the only thing people have to worry about right now is the video card, because most CPU's are more than adequate nowadays and RAM is dirt cheap, so vendors are shipping PC's with absurd amounts of it (sometimes up to 8GB in a standard model!).

So considering the console's life span and cost, you'd have room to ugprade your graphics card three times in the run of five years - That's more than reasonable, especially considering you'd likely only need to do that once in that period. There isn't any "next big thing" that really forces the market in the PC realm, unlike console revisions. Software vendors make things as compatible as possible so as to enable the widest audience range as possible. The only thing that's stopping most people is onboard graphics.


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## Fay V (Nov 5, 2009)

If you're using a computer just to play games I would say yes, that's stupid, but I don't know of anyone that actually does that. I switched to PC gaming when i got my new laptop because i needed a laptop that could take near constant use, and getting it to super awesome game quality was just a few extra bucks so why not. 

In terms of the hunting rifle issue I think your playstyle is just incompatible with it. I like to take up support for the team when I play and I've gotten very good at using the hunting rifle in group and pegging the specials that spawn a long way off. 
I also find the NPCs to be fucking useless in higher difficulties, they don't have the where with all a human does and often die because of it. In less experienced groups it can be a detriment, but with 4 people that know what they're doing you can move more freely, explore, hold out, and all that goodness very easily. You just need to be aware of where your team is, and aware of when it's better to let yourself die and respawn, particularly if you've only got 1 health and are limping behind far enough to be a choice target.


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## Furlop (Nov 6, 2009)

Fay V said:


> I also find the NPCs to be fucking useless in higher difficulties, they don't have the where with all a human does and often die because of it.



I like to consider them mobile health kits in Expert.


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## LizardKing (Nov 6, 2009)

Oh hey look at me guys, I'm posting on the Internet!

Then I'm going to make a mod for my favourite game and playtest it.

Then maybe I'll go watch some videos on youtube or something.

Oh yeah and I need to burn some music to CD so I can listen to it when I go on holiday in a few weeks.

After that I'll probably render some stuff in Lightwave, or maybe break out Photoshop and play around with those pics I got from that website.

Man, PCs are awesome.


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## lilEmber (Nov 6, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> It doesn't matter how you slice it, you are still going to spend more money trying to upgrade your computer, and keep it updated.
> 
> Consoles: You spend $300 - $400 and is *generally* a one time expense, you use it for 3 - 5 years before the next generation comes out.
> 
> PC: You spend $600 and pray to god your system is compatible with a game, you have it for 3 weeks to learn that a new game you want requires a new video card in which you will need to spend another $100 - $200 for. Every year you need to upgrade your computer for the "next big thing", but the positive side is you can keep upgrading your computer years after it's gone "out of date". Eventually it'll die, or the gaming industry will say "fuck you" to all your specs and hardware and you'll have to either overhaul the entire PC or buy a new one.



Uh, for $600 you can build a computer that would be able to play any game you can list off at near highest or highest settings. It would last you much longer than any console would, and it would be able to do many other things besides just gaming. Consoles are fun, but consoles aren't as good as computers for gaming and add no other alternatives.

Right now the absolute best system I could put together, without going totally overboard (multiple GPU's, CPU's, or just top top top top top shit like $1.5k+ CPU) is ticking around $1500 and $1600 dollars. This is the best gaming CPU (without dipping into the 1.5k shit that doesn't actually increase performance) Phenom II x4 black and the best GPU ATi HD5870 (ONLY DX11 card, too), DDR3 motherboard, and six gigs of dominator ddr3 ram. An antec 900 case, PCpower and cooling 750 silencer PS, coolermaster V8 heatsink, and a bunch more things. 

With that computer you can play any game currently out today at the absolute highest settings, on three HIGH RESOLUTION monitors no less, getting 60 FPS with vsync on solid. YOu will be able to do this for every game listed coming out that I know of, and if one does come out you may have to take it down to a single monitor to get the 60FPS benchmark, which isn't that big a deal at all....actually I dislike multiple monitors for gaming anyway, those borders piss me off to no end.


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## Benn (Nov 7, 2009)

It is, in a word; hella-fuckin'-balls-to-the-wall-awesome.


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## LizardKing (Nov 7, 2009)

BRB deleting L4D2 demo to make way for L4D2 preload.

Actually they probably use the same GCFs and I can have both...

Fuck it


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## Runefox (Nov 7, 2009)

Here's a bit of weird info: Apparently the censored version (for German and Australian markets) will actually run about 40% faster than the uncut version, while playing on the same servers - Which means that in Versus, for example, a scene which might lag on the uncut version won't on the cut version. I'm not sure what, exactly, was cut from the cut version, but if the gameplay's the same, hell, for an extra 40% speed boost, they should release that alongside it for lower-end users.


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## CaptainCool (Nov 7, 2009)

Runefox said:


> Here's a bit of weird info: Apparently the censored version (for German and Australian markets) will actually run about 40% faster than the uncut version, while playing on the same servers - Which means that in Versus, for example, a scene which might lag on the uncut version won't on the cut version. I'm not sure what, exactly, was cut from the cut version, but if the gameplay's the same, hell, for an extra 40% speed boost, they should release that alongside it for lower-end users.



well... yeah, thats at least one advantage^^;
the censorship here is still bad though... im almost 21 and perfectly sane (yeah, right ) and the government still tells me what i may see and what i shall not see. and still they are oh so proud to be democratic >.>;
oh well, if they dont want my tax money for games ill just buy my stuff in england where its uncensored, kthx.


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## Runefox (Nov 7, 2009)

CaptainCool said:


> well... yeah, thats at least one advantage^^;
> the censorship here is still bad though... im almost 21 and perfectly sane (yeah, right ) and the government still tells me what i may see and what i shall not see. and still they are oh so proud to be democratic >.>;
> oh well, if they dont want my tax money for games ill just buy my stuff in england where its uncensored, kthx.



Yeah, I bet it's not great to have to put up with that crap. I guess it's not the same if you haven't had to experience it first-hand. Though I'd have to see what the difference is - If it's just less blood, then hell, why not?  It's still zombie-killing.


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## CaptainCool (Nov 7, 2009)

Runefox said:


> Yeah, I bet it's not great to have to put up with that crap. I guess it's not the same if you haven't had to experience it first-hand. Though I'd have to see what the difference is - If it's just less blood, then hell, why not?  It's still zombie-killing.



they cut out a lot of games like that. no blood/green/grey blood, no gore by default, no ragdoll effect, in C&C generals they replaces the voices of the soldiers with robot voices, call of duty 4 is missing an entire game mode, parts of campaigns are missing... its no fun at all. i dont need blood in a game but cutting out big chunks of a game and telling me what im supposed to see is still bad!


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## Furlop (Nov 7, 2009)

I've got a couple of friends who have the german censored version of L4D. Zombies don't light on fire (so, yes, they just wave their arms around in the air and topple over) and the survivors/zombies bodies disappear after being killed.

They're so annoyed by it they're having a swiss friend of theirs buy the game and ship it to them when it's released.


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## CaptainCool (Nov 7, 2009)

Furlop said:


> I've got a couple of friends who have the german censored version of L4D. Zombies don't light on fire (so, yes, they just wave their arms around in the air and topple over) and the survivors/zombies bodies disappear after being killed.
> 
> They're so annoyed by it they're having a swiss friend of theirs buy the game and ship it to them when it's released.



tell your friends to buy their games via www.ebay.co.uk ! way cheaper than the games in switzerland (they milk german players for their money because they know how screwed we are...)! and they can easily pay via paypal, too.
i pay about 35â‚¬ incl. shipping for a new 360 game their instead of 60â‚¬ to 70â‚¬ here in germany, this also counts for microsoft ponts and xbox live memberships. and PC games are even cheaper, about 20â‚¬


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## Adrianfolf (Nov 7, 2009)

Um Rune I would just like to say you seem to have a preferance to kb/m over joysticks which is cool and all. But have you ever thought for one minute that there may be others that are just more comfortable using a pair of joysticks? Now this is from my own personal experance. I have CoD4 on PC and W@W on my PS3. I've played both and enjoyed both but I do far better at W@W in terms of being able to kill and not die where as in CoD 4 I die and die and die repeatedly. The mouse is an awesome device and there are some games I can play on a kb/m better than joysticks but over all I just do much more better with joysticks than I do with a mouse. I still respect your opinion though


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## Runefox (Nov 7, 2009)

@Adrianfolf: Uh... Well, the mouse is necessarily a more accurate device for aiming/looking in shooters. Joysticks have a constant motion in the direction pressed - This means that no matter what, you won't ever have the same level of control as the mouse, which is an absolute input device. There are some games where joysticks are entirely the best method, but as far as shooters go, the best joystick-user will pale in comparison to a mouse-user. Preference is one thing, but there really is a better tool for the job in that scenario.

It's kinda like saying you like to cut your steak with a butter knife - Sure it'll work, but not nearly as well as a steak knife.


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## Rifter (Nov 7, 2009)

Runefox said:


> Yeah, I bet it's not great to have to put up with that crap. I guess it's not the same if you haven't had to experience it first-hand. Though I'd have to see what the difference is - If it's just less blood, then hell, why not?  It's still zombie-killing.



Zombies disappear before they even hit the ground, limbs and other bits can't be blown off, the blood is tamped down, list goes on. It's censored in such a way that immersion is completely broken.


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## Smelge (Nov 7, 2009)

Shay Feral said:


> You've got to have money to buy an expensive PC to play games, show me a computer that can play these newer games for as much as a new Xbox 360 and I may consider buying a new PC just for gaming. Until then, computers are for arrogant pricks who need a high price tag to compensate for their antisocial behavior.



Balls.

Most people buy PC's to actually have programs to do things other than just play games. Usually the gaming part is incidental.

For example, my computer cost me about Â£550. I bought it specifically to work with stuff like CS4 and 3dsMax. It's just luck that I can play games at pretty high quality on it too. I could have built the thing cheaper and still run most of these games if I had wanted to.

See, the advantage of PC over XBox is that there's no New Version that you need to upgrade to to play the new games. If a part wears out, you pull the side off and stick a new one in. It can be tailored to any purpose you need. An XBox is pretty much just a pc with most of the functionality removed so you can play games.

And if you're complaining about PC users having antisocial behaviour, I assume you've never played on XBox Live? Given the quality and intelligence of discussion on that thing, it's safe to say that executing every last person on there would increase the average IQ around the world.


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## Aleister The Wolf (Nov 7, 2009)

Can I change the name of this thread?
I was think something like; "360vsPC part'X', w/ some l4d2"
what do you think off topic users?


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## Smelge (Nov 7, 2009)

Fine then.

Impressions from L4D2 demo:

1) Melee weapons are fun, Guitar is fucking awesome, managed to fight off several panic events with just the guitar, machete is hugely overpowered, frying pan is satisfying but shit.
2) Chargers, are a little irritating but work well with seperating the group.
3) Spitters. Possibly the most terrifying infected. It's pretty ok up until where you stab it in the throat with a machete, and it slumps to the ground face down, ass up displaying sagging grey flesh hanging out of a fucking thong. AUGH! WHY?
4) Loads of guns. Some good, some bad. Mostly satisfying.
5) Witch. She seems too much like standard zombies now with the wandering. In fact, during an event, she wandered over to have a look before getting scared and ripping my nipples off. Other times, I've shot at her thinking she's jsut a regular zombie. She needs more to mark her out.
6) Jockies. They hump your face.
7) The new damage system for zombies. I love it. Realistic damage to body parts. Blow a limb off, they have ribs sticking out the hole. Gutshot them, they run across the road trailing intestines. Fantastic.
8) The bots are still retarded.
9) Most of the weapons seem to have a lower ammo capacity than the original.


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## Jelly (Nov 7, 2009)

uh
i think the point of the wandering witch is that you dont notice her, shoot her, and get fucked
its supposed to make you second guess plowing through areas full of zombies


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## Smelge (Nov 7, 2009)

In that case, it works well.

I assumed the wandering witch was so it made it a little harder to sneak past her if she got up and moved, and also stopped her from blocking the main route through making a witch encounter certain.

I always though the idea behind the witch was to force people to slow up and be a bit sneakier and more careful when she's around, which was spoilt when she'd turn up sat in the entrance to your safehouse.

Suppose either way works, though making you think twice before plowing through zombies kinda goes against the point of the game a little.


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## TheoWolf (Nov 7, 2009)

Abubabababababa..... Insert compliment here------------- DUSNT COMPUTE!/)(;3!>_?_>{â‚¬{^[â€¢!|â‚¬~â‚¬|><\_Â£Â£â‚¬Â¥}Â¥}â€¢|%


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## Sernion (Nov 7, 2009)

The pre-load is up!

Can't wait to play the new infected in versus mode.
They gave loads of advantages for Infected and disadvantages for survivors.


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## Runefox (Nov 8, 2009)

@Voidrunners: The wandering witch also seems like a "fix" for the situations where the Witch would spawn in a doorway or hallway that you needed to take in order to proceed, and therefore choke off your progression until you dealt with her (sneaking around not an option). One place in particular is the ammo room above the generator room in the second part of No Mercy in L4D - The witch tends to spawn in the hallways outside that place a lot, and in some cases, right in the doorway leading out - the only way to go.


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## ShÃ nwÃ ng (Nov 9, 2009)

Runefox said:


> @Voidrunners: The wandering witch also seems like a "fix" for the situations where the Witch would spawn in a doorway or hallway that you needed to take in order to proceed, and therefore choke off your progression until you dealt with her (sneaking around not an option). One place in particular is the ammo room above the generator room in the second part of No Mercy in L4D - The witch tends to spawn in the hallways outside that place a lot, and in some cases, right in the doorway leading out - the only way to go.



Personally that defeats an interesting game mechanic. Sometimes some situations other than rumbling with a tank are unavoidable and I like the challenge of dealing with it.

Also, favorite gameplay feature is definitely the melee. I spend more time smashing shit with the guitar or frying pan than I do actually shooting stuff. God damn, Melee kicks ass.


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## krimv (Nov 16, 2009)

It's interesting how they've made the game harder and more challenging.  The first game got to be pretty simple and routine once you played through the levels a few times especially on expert.  However, I think expert mode on this one is going to be ridiculous and cut down on how easy it was in the first game.  That and the whole dynamic "Director 2.0" (which I'm not sure if it was in there or not in the demo or if it's even in the game) will change things up for the better.


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Nov 16, 2009)

So far they made the game easier with the new rifles, magnum and the melee weapons. =/


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## TehSean (Nov 16, 2009)

My review:

Demo didn't present enough content.
Glitchy as fuck on the technical side. Gameplay seemed ok except for the oversensitive Friendly Fire detection.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 16, 2009)

WolfoxOkamichan said:


> So far they made the game easier with the new rifles, magnum and the melee weapons. =/



Play expert.


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Nov 16, 2009)

Yeah, nothing defines a "harder" game by increasing damage output. =/


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 16, 2009)

Then get the game and turn Realism Mode on if you're gonna be a little girl about it.


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## Shay Feral (Nov 16, 2009)

Runefox said:


> @Voidrunners: The wandering witch also seems like a "fix" for the situations where the Witch would spawn in a doorway or hallway that you needed to take in order to proceed, and therefore choke off your progression until you dealt with her (sneaking around not an option). One place in particular is the ammo room above the generator room in the second part of No Mercy in L4D - The witch tends to spawn in the hallways outside that place a lot, and in some cases, right in the doorway leading out - the only way to go.



I liked that though, it makes you think ahead a little bit. Gives you that sense of "Shit, we gotta deal with her!" sort of dread. Plus, it's fun to just gang-rape the bitch with 4 combat shotties, make her life span alot shorter!


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## Mikael Grizzly (Nov 16, 2009)

WolfoxOkamichan said:


> Yeah, nothing defines a "harder" game by increasing damage output. =/


 
Uh, no, the game has clear difficulty stages:

Normal is for casual players.
Advanced is for experienced FPS players.
Expert is for experts.

If you think the game is too easy, then play on a difficulty level appropriate for your skill level instead of complaining that you can't select the proper difficulty in the menu.


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## PenningtontheSkunk (Nov 16, 2009)

mememememe! So hot I'm getting it for my Xbox. I can't wait to play the full version. I know two campains you play in the demo are.... Both are cool.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 16, 2009)

Wtf demo are you thinking of?


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## PenningtontheSkunk (Nov 16, 2009)

WolfoxOkamichan said:


> Yeah, nothing defines a "harder" game by increasing damage output. =/


 Your telling me play Blood Harvast in L4D on expert level and lets talk about "how to die within 5mins. in a game?"


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## PenningtontheSkunk (Nov 16, 2009)

LotsOfNothing said:


> Wtf demo are you thinking of?


 Xbox demo.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 16, 2009)

I'm sure they'll have two whole campaigns on a demo.


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## PenningtontheSkunk (Nov 16, 2009)

They do.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 16, 2009)

Sure thing.

EDIT: Unless you mean two MAPS from a SINGLE CAMPAIGN.


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## PenningtontheSkunk (Nov 16, 2009)

Its awesome I recomend it!

New location. New special infected. More hoard members.


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## PenningtontheSkunk (Nov 16, 2009)

LotsOfNothing said:


> Sure thing.
> 
> EDIT: Unless you mean two MAPS from a SINGLE CAMPAIGN.


 No two different campaigns.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 16, 2009)

Well, judging how the demos are completely the same across the two platforms...No.


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Nov 16, 2009)

I was referring to L4D2 being easy due to the new weapons (lol I instakill u wif mah machete). L4D was fine.

Oh and lol 360 players. Go buy PC.


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## LotsOfNothing (Nov 16, 2009)

Actually there's the setback to the melee weapons.  You have to get right into the pack to deal any real damage, thus hurting yourself a lot.  It's really just supposed to be a non-gun solution to if and when you run out of primary ammo.


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## Kajet (Nov 17, 2009)

I have a question, has anyone seen shit like this and know how to fix it?


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## TehSean (Nov 17, 2009)

Kajet said:


> I have a question, has anyone seen shit like this and know how to fix it?



That's hilarious.


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## Kajet (Nov 17, 2009)

TehSean said:


> That's hilarious.



Yeah, but it sucks ass cause I can't see special infected like... at all...


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## TehSean (Nov 17, 2009)

I honestly dont know, man. My first impulse is that you might have aging or defective hardware somewhere in your computer. At best, it's just an incompatibility that driver updates or downgrades might fix.


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## ShÃ nwÃ ng (Nov 17, 2009)

Kajet said:


> Yeah, but it sucks ass cause I can't see special infected like... at all...




Confirmed on the L4D2 forums:



> None of the survivors have heads and special infected aren't rendering
> Reported by: DrCranePhD @ http://forums.steampowered.com/forum...3&postcount=92
> 
> Confirmed by:
> ...


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## WolfoxOkamichan (Nov 17, 2009)

Damn newbs! AI are much better partners than newbies in pubs! >:


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## Kajet (Nov 17, 2009)

Yeah... It's the drivers... Unfortunately it looks like the people who made my stuff haven't updated it since... 2006?

Time to learn how to use modded drivers I guess...


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