# Somewhat concerned...



## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

I'm wondering... and if this is the wrong place to ask this, or a completely stupid question to ask, you can beat me with a chain.
But since there has been a pretty devastating hardware failure.... Is there any chance that people will lose their art or even their accounts?
*wears something flame retardant*


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## kaskae (Sep 9, 2012)

There was a HDD failure in the RAID, but according to what Yak and 'Neer have confirmed, nothing personal (art, account data, etc.) has been lost. They'll let us know if that becomes the case.


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## Summercat (Sep 9, 2012)

ArtemisZiebenwolf said:


> I'm wondering... and if this is the wrong place to ask this, or a completely stupid question to ask, you can beat me with a chain.
> But since there has been a pretty devastating hardware failure.... Is there any chance that people will lose their art or even their accounts?
> *wears something flame retardant*



Nope. Unless the situation is even worse than I understand it to be (always a possibility)...

What happened is one of our database array HDDs died. But it's a clone of all the others that are still alive. The problem lies with a firmware issue on the array's controller.

TL;DR: As Summerderp understands it, no data has been lost.


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## Arcsol (Sep 9, 2012)

Even if it does delete all the art, if you have everything saved on your computer you just start over from scratch. Now if all the user profiles were deleted like you mentioned that would be another story.


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## Teal (Sep 9, 2012)

Arcsol said:


> Even if it does delete all the art, if you have everything saved on your computer you just start over from scratch. *Now if all the user profiles were deleted like you mentioned that would be another story*.


 If all the accounts were dumped the chaos and everything else would kill FA.


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

TealMoon said:


> If all the accounts were dumped the chaos and everything else would kill FA.


Yeah. It would be the apocalypse of butthurt furries.
It would be the bright red butt seen around the world.
Or rather, a warm, but bright red glow of simultaneous butthurt.


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## Wet Coyote (Sep 9, 2012)

I like my butt to hurt, but not in THIS way  8-P


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

It'd be like an enama, cleansing as it'd get all the s*** out, but really uncomfortable. Only the people worthwhile would hang around though.


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## Kaeko (Sep 9, 2012)

TeenageAngst said:


> It'd be like an enama, cleansing as it'd get all the s*** out, but really uncomfortable. Only the people worthwhile would hang around though.




id have to say that i would be one of those people.

granted id lose everything from 08-11 i have most everything from 12.

id just make a new account. and start over. fa if people let it, would pick itself up with the help of loyal users


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

I have so much crap floating around my account even after my self-afflicted purging. Plus half of it is old so I'd have an opportunity to revise all the hastily-done projects and maybe finish some of them.


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## Kaeko (Sep 9, 2012)

cant just let a site crash make you quit. I for one, feel that if this does infact happen, the amount of business people make with FA alone will keep the users coming back and just restarting. 

And maybe that just what fa needs anyway. I nice fresh start. But really I kinda hope it doesnt happen :c never saved all my awesome fanart lol


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

Yeah, you can't quit just because of a setback. Sites go down, data is lost, you carry on. Now from an administrative standpoint this *is* a good time to seriously consider cloud computing (coming from a guy who hates cloud computing) instead of keeping a RAID array in your dad's basement, but I digress.

I don't have all my work backed up either >_> I probably should do that some time. If it doesn't survive at least I'll have an excuse to rewrite some of it.


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## Taralack (Sep 9, 2012)

I never could understand people who upload art to a site and that becomes their only copy of that artwork. You don't keep archives or anything??

And as for art people have done for you... your first response upon receiving a piece of artwork should immediately be to right click and save it. Anything could happen, and it's always better to have a copy sitting in your personal files rather than relying on the good will of someone's server space that it will still be up weeks or months down the road.


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## Kaeko (Sep 9, 2012)

TeenageAngst said:


> Yeah, you can't quit just because of a setback. Sites go down, data is lost, you carry on. Now from an administrative standpoint this *is* a good time to seriously consider cloud computing (coming from a guy who hates cloud computing) instead of keeping a RAID array in your dad's basement, but I digress.
> 
> I don't have all my work backed up either >_> I probably should do that some time. If it doesn't survive at least I'll have an excuse to rewrite some of it.




ive heard of cloud! im no tech, so most of that is jumble too me.

im really getting tired of people knocking FA so badly. If yu dont like it leave, stop complaining, we dont want to hear it. 

btw/ dude two up, two down


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## Kaeko (Sep 9, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> I never could understand people who upload art to a site and that becomes their only copy of that artwork. You don't keep archives or anything??
> 
> And as for art people have done for you... your first response upon receiving a piece of artwork should immediately be to right click and save it. Anything could happen, and it's always better to have a copy sitting in your personal files rather than relying on the good will of someone's server space that it will still be up weeks or months down the road.





not all of us are very lucky. ive had 3 computer crashes with no CD drive to burn a back up. ive lost many gigs of art. but my most recent stuff is backed up. I just had poor luck with computers for a while. Its not like i was expecting fa for run forever without any problems.


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> I never could understand people who upload art to a site and that becomes their only copy of that artwork. You don't keep archives or anything??
> 
> And as for art people have done for you... your first response upon receiving a piece of artwork should immediately be to right click and save it. Anything could happen, and it's always better to have a copy sitting in your personal files rather than relying on the good will of someone's server space that it will still be up weeks or months down the road.


I do save my work.
There is just some arts that I received the the morning before the crash that I couldn't take the 30 seconds to save to my computer...
and I didn't get back on it until this afternoonish when I discovered the site was down.
I was really wanting to show my mate that piece, too. x.x ah well. Guess I'll have to wait.
I'm not really worried about it being gone, though, since people have confirmed that it won't.


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> I never could understand people who upload art to a site and that becomes their only copy of that artwork. You don't keep archives or anything??
> 
> And as for art people have done for you... your first response upon receiving a piece of artwork should immediately be to right click and save it. Anything could happen, and it's always better to have a copy sitting in your personal files rather than relying on the good will of someone's server space that it will still be up weeks or months down the road.



I have backups of all my commissions as well as most of my recent work. Some of the stuff gets lost in revisions though, so while I have most of it saved I don't know what versions. They get scattered over the years.

And cloud computing is basically off-site hosting. If FA used cloud computing they'd be operating off of servers professionally maintained by Amazon or someone while using their own server as a backup in case Amazon went offline for whatever reason.


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## Cyanide_tiger (Sep 9, 2012)

Arcsol said:


> Now if all the user profiles were deleted like you mentioned that would be another story.





TealMoon said:


> If all the accounts were dumped the chaos and everything else would kill FA.



Amd I the only one that thinks it would just be outright hilarious if this happened?


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

Cyanide_tiger said:


> Amd I the only one that thinks it would just be outright hilarious if this happened?


No. I would die laughing, but feel sorry for those that lost all of their arts.


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## Kaeko (Sep 9, 2012)

Cyanide_tiger said:


> Amd I the only one that thinks it would just be outright hilarious if this happened?



what i find hilarious, is the people making a huge deal out of it for the wrong reasons.

I live off commissions. so this kinda sucks. the forums dont bring as good business for me. 

but yes, the ragequit tableflip furs are quite hilarious


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

I have to admit I'd be laughing my ass off. Typing furiously to make up all the lost art, but laughing every step of the way.


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

TeenageAngst said:


> I have to admit I'd be laughing my ass off. Typing furiously to make up all the lost art, but laughing every step of the way.


That laughter is the sound of your sanity sublimating slowly from your very conscious.


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## Cyanide_tiger (Sep 9, 2012)

Kaeko said:


> what i find hilarious, is the people making a huge deal out of it for the wrong reasons.
> 
> I live off commissions. so this kinda sucks. the forums dont bring as good business for me.
> 
> but yes, the ragequit tableflip furs are quite hilarious



I have to agree, I'd feel a little bad for the people that actually depend on FA's social network to make money to get through college or are holding them between jobs, but damn if I wouldn't just sit back and laugh until tears came due to the sheer shitstorm of raeg the forum would get hit with.


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## GamerFox (Sep 9, 2012)

I doubt major cloud service providers would want FA's business.


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## Kaeko (Sep 9, 2012)

Cyanide_tiger said:


> I have to agree, I'd feel a little bad for the people that actually depend on FA's social network to make money to get through college or are holding them between jobs, but damn if I wouldn't just sit back and laugh until tears came due to the sheer shitstorm of raeg the forum would get hit with.



yeah for example. Ive been saving up for a major surgery for about 2 months now. And lately im hearing. 

"when will fa come back?! I need my renaporn!"

more like...when will fa come back, I want babies. lol

i cant believe the amount for slander fa is getting today.


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## Bittertooth (Sep 9, 2012)

Direct links to submissions still work as of posting (example: https://d.facdn.net/art/nathradas/1323114130.nathradas_nzjj.png ) i didn't draw that
So if it's evident they're still there now, then our art should be safe and sound when the site comes back.

Unless something goes horribly wrong during the maintenance


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

Kaeko said:


> i cant believe the amount for slander fa is getting today.


You can't? I can, and sometimes I don't blame people for being even remotely angry.
But that's a whole 'nother ball of wax that I don't want to get into... Since I've only caught wind of certain situations, and don't know much about it.


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## Cyanide_tiger (Sep 9, 2012)

Kaeko said:


> yeah for example. Ive been saving up for a major surgery for about 2 months now. And lately im hearing.
> 
> "when will fa come back?! I need my renaporn!"
> 
> ...



Oh, the amount of flak the admins are catching for this is also quite entertaining. I, personally, think this one of the more entertaining days I've seen since I've been around FA/FAF. 

Speaking of the slander, some people have taken it to a whole new level: Personally, this one is my favorite. This one is is entertaining too.

But yeah, for the sake of this not being entirely off-topic, the admins keep saying that all the data is safe, so nothing to worry about except how long it will take to get your porn back. :V


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

Bittertooth said:


> Direct links to submissions still work as of posting (example: https://d.facdn.net/art/nathradas/1323114130.nathradas_nzjj.png )
> So if it's evident they're still there now, then our art should be safe and sound when the site comes back.
> 
> Unless something goes horribly wrong during the maintenance


Holy christ on a cracker that is beautiful o_o
But yes. I agree, and am completely comfortable now.


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## Kaeko (Sep 9, 2012)

I think bitter mightve won this. why didnt we think of that. But awesome.

still linking to artwork is a very good sign!


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

All the wasted speculation...


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

TeenageAngst said:


> All the wasted speculation...


We can still speculate the thousands of things that FA could do/could have done to decrease their server downtime.
But what do I know about networking. :mrgreen:


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## Cyanide_tiger (Sep 9, 2012)

ArtemisZiebenwolf said:


> We can still speculate the thousands of things that FA could do/could have done to decrease their server downtime.
> But what do I know about networking. :mrgreen:



Such as having a proper tech staff, instead of being short-handed constantly? :V


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

I've honestly never run a dedicated server before so I can't really talk but I do know that the computer science house at RIT maintains various servers for bootlegged material that are stable, pretty anonymous, and never lose data. If a bunch of students working haphazardly in their spare time can maintain server networks for bootlegs under the prying eyes of the school officials I doubt it's all that hard.


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## CannonFodder (Sep 9, 2012)

Meh, the only reason why I'm annoyed this time is that it crashed before I could save a reference picture for a freebie I'm doing for someone.  Worst timing ever.


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 9, 2012)

Cyanide_tiger said:


> Such as having a proper tech staff, instead of being short-handed constantly? :V


Pfft.
Not even that, but actually having back up HDD's already on hand, so we wouldn't have to wait 24-72+ hours for repairs.
Meh. Coulda-shoulda-woulda.


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## DragonTalon (Sep 9, 2012)

The problem with cloud computing for a site like FA is they would not longer have physical servers.  If Amazon decided that FA was breaking laws or otherwise putting them at risk, or FA ran out of money for a month, they could just shut the site down and poof, all that data would just be GONE.  The setup they have now, they rent a rack to put all their computers in, but they own those computers and drives.  Worst case if they get kicked out of the facility is they have to move them elsewhere, but they will still have all their data.

This of course assumes it's the company doing the shutdown and not the government deciding to raid FA for some reason.  In that case, your're just screwed.


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## nrr (Sep 9, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> If Amazon decided that FA was breaking laws or otherwise putting them at risk, or FA ran out of money for a month, they could just shut the site down and poof, all that data would just be GONE.


 
Right on the money here, but there's a good point to be made as well: For setting up a quick slave as a means of having at least one copy of your database somewhere else, it works amazingly well, even if latency is kind of disgustingly high.



DragonTalon said:


> The setup they have now, they rent a rack to put all their computers in, but they own those computers and drives.  Worst case if they get kicked out of the facility is they have to move them elsewhere, but they will still have all their data.



Some colocation facilities require all debts to be paid in full before equipment can be remitted, and there's often a grace period before the host will opt to auction off the hardware to help recoup costs. There's definitely more data security there, but how much really depends on whether you can pay your bills to get your kit back.


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

I never advocated having FA use a cloud service for ALL their data but using a major provider either as a backup or as the main site would mean the site would ALWAYS be online. If the server crashed, you have the cloud host. If that went offline, you'd have the physical server rack.

Or you know, god forbid you have backup HDDs or something on hand as Artemis said. How much does FA make on ad revenue again?


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## DarrylWolf (Sep 9, 2012)

We will all survive the FurAffinity Art Apocalypse and breathe in the fresh air of a new FurAffinity- one without Babyfur art!


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## Quilmeleon (Sep 9, 2012)

TeenageAngst said:


> I never advocated having FA use a cloud service for ALL their data but using a major provider either as a backup or as the main site would mean the site would ALWAYS be online. If the server crashed, you have the cloud host. If that went offline, you'd have the physical server rack.
> 
> Or you know, god forbid you have backup HDDs or something on hand as Artemis said. How much does FA make on ad revenue again?



Not enough to warrant purchasing such systems. Trust me they want it. Follow their tweets for proof.


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## Pocketmew (Sep 9, 2012)

Lols I've been getting money to hold me over until financial aid comes in for college. It is kinda sucky not being able to work for 2 days xD


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

I'm intrigued by that one person who mentioned surgery, babies, and money generated from FA all in one post. I'd like to know how doing commissions on FA funds baby-giving surgery.


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## Pocketmew (Sep 9, 2012)

TeenageAngst said:


> I'm intrigued by that one person who mentioned surgery, babies, and money generated from FA all in one post. I'd like to know how doing commissions on FA funds baby-giving surgery.



If you know how to advertise, and are a good artist...Raising funds over time from commissions can pay for many things. I got enough for my intuos tablet in about..3 days? This was in the past however on a different website. And I was well known on it


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## Pocketmew (Sep 9, 2012)

Blah.


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 9, 2012)

Damn shame I'm a writer instead of a porn artist. I wouldn't need a part time job.


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## Taralack (Sep 9, 2012)

Pocketmew said:


> Lols I've been getting money to hold me over until financial aid comes in for college. It is kinda sucky not being able to work for 2 days xD



This is why you get people to email you and/or you save note correspondences locally.


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## Wet Coyote (Sep 9, 2012)

TeenageAngst said:


> Damn shame I'm a writer instead of a porn artist. I wouldn't need a part time job.



Look at it this way however... You prolly save your texts so even if every copy out there disappeared in a crash, you could re submit it.

I still don't understand how artists don't have a copy of what they created and submitted.

"I will upload it to FA and delete every other copy - nothing could go wrong there..."


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## Koda (Sep 9, 2012)

I dunno, for a seemingly volunteer organization (I don't presume the IT folks really get paid much if anything), FA's team manages well for a site of 10k visitors at any given time. Computer stuff breaks, hard drives die. Its kind of like a fact of computing. 

Certainly, if FA just poofed up 20, 30 grand, I bet they'd be pimped out with new replicated database servers, load balancers, all kinds of neat stuff like that. But, since 20g's aren't just going to appear out of thin air, just deal with a couple days a year wherein you can't get your furry fix. Stop bitching.

Anyway.

I've been researching for the past few weeks some RAID controllers for my own home backup server use. If I could ask, what brand/series of controller is in FA's database server? I've been considering the Adaptec 6805, but its hard to justify the cost by just looking at the specs.

----
On another note, I keep copies of every piece of art I upload. Stuff I draw, or commission whatever. The only thing I would be sad to see go is the comments and user-driven content. Building a list of watchers and people who like your stuff takes years, especially when you're no superstar. No records of favs, notes, comments would suck. I think that loss of notariety would hurt the struggling 'new' artists the most. The superstar furs will always be able to re-attract the hoards. 

I backup my watch list occasionally, do you?


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## muddypaws (Sep 9, 2012)

I thought the same Koda.  But, I think we'll just all have to wait and see.  (Keeps my claws crossed).


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## Hunter (Sep 9, 2012)

Knowing how RAID works (kills bugs dead too) , am 99.9% positive our data is safe with the possible loss of the last couple of hours. 

And if we lost it all ? it's not the end of the world , Being allowed to host our work for free is a privilege and a gift , not a right.


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## Pocketmew (Sep 9, 2012)

Koda said:


> ----
> On another note, I keep copies of every piece of art I upload. Stuff I draw, or commission whatever. The only thing I would be sad to see go is the comments and user-driven content. Building a list of watchers and people who like your stuff takes years, especially when you're no superstar. No records of favs, notes, comments would suck. I think that loss of notariety would hurt the struggling 'new' artists the most. The superstar furs will always be able to re-attract the hoards.
> 
> I backup my watch list occasionally, do you?



I actually do not keep backups! :O I keep a very good amount of newer art on my computer, but prefer to have very little of it. Reason being, pictures take up a lot of room. I should invest in an external harddrive for art though...Honestly IF Fa did completely lose everything, it wouldn't bother me too bad. As long as I can draw, it can be built back up. ^^;


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## STrRedWolf (Sep 9, 2012)

All my artwork that I've ever done is backed up onto a 16 gig flash drive... it only takes 5 gigs, though.

Eventually it will be uploaded to a privately-held server in Las Vegas.


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## Pocketmew (Sep 9, 2012)

Hunter said:


> And if we lost it all ? it's not the end of the world , Being allowed to host our work for free is a privilege and a gift , not a right.



THANK YOU! Haha, it always bothers me how people act like their entitled to the services FA provides. Almost like it is their property or something and if FA goes down they freak out...I understand for people who donate money to help keep it running, but honestly it is still a donation. Make your own online gallery if you don't like how theirs is run!


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## Taralack (Sep 9, 2012)

Pocketmew said:


> I actually do not keep backups! :O I keep a very good amount of newer art on my computer, but prefer to have very little of it. Reason being, pictures take up a lot of room. I should invest in an external harddrive for art though...Honestly IF Fa did completely lose everything, it wouldn't bother me too bad. As long as I can draw, it can be built back up. ^^;



You have a tiny ass computer or something? JPGs for web should not go larger than 1MB, and PSDs depending on how you use them are usually between 10-20MB. My current year's art folder is 25++GB but that's because I have a crap ton of art as well as 3d models in there. 

If my computer died and I lost all my art files, it would be a severe blow to my productivity and business, as those files contain my portfolio and my website's files, as well as showreels and other things. That's why I have an external specially dedicated to backing up my art folders. A 500GB external cost me $99 and that is a small price to pay for having peace of mind. 

Then again, if your artwork is not as important to you as mine is to me, then all of this is moot.


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## Pocketmew (Sep 10, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> You have a tiny ass computer or something? JPGs for web should not go larger than 1MB, and PSDs depending on how you use them are usually between 10-20MB. My current year's art folder is 25++GB but that's because I have a crap ton of art as well as 3d models in there.
> 
> If my computer died and I lost all my art files, it would be a severe blow to my productivity and business, as those files contain my portfolio and my website's files, as well as showreels and other things. That's why I have an external specially dedicated to backing up my art folders. A 500GB external cost me $99 and that is a small price to pay for having peace of mind.
> 
> Then again, if your artwork is not as important to you as mine is to me, then all of this is moot.





My computer has 900gig. I'm just paranoid around new computers.. I think the reason it doesn't bother me is because I don't care about my art as much because after about 10 pictures or so I begin hating my artwork and struggling to improve anatomy and composition. Which I know that happens with a lot of artists, it just happens pretty quick for me. Also from what I gather, you spend more time on your artwork. My full pieces take about 3hours at the most. So in my eyes, they're easily replaceable. 

Like I said though, I should invest in an external drive if I'm so uncomfortable with keeping things on my computer . Lately I've been spending longer and longer on my pictures, and it would be a shame to lose em.


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## Taralack (Sep 10, 2012)

Pocketmew said:


> Also from what I gather, you spend more time on your artwork.



Actually, something like this took me about 3+ hours. It's all a matter of perspective.


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## Teal (Sep 10, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> A 500GB external cost me $99 and that is a small price to pay for having peace of mind.
> .


 You can get a 1TB for $99 now.


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## Summercat (Sep 10, 2012)

TealMoon said:


> You can get a 1TB for $99 now.



External or Internal?

(And conversion cases are shit.)


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## FoxWolfie (Sep 10, 2012)

Summercat said:


> External or Internal?



I bought an external 1TB drive last November for only $89.  I can only assume that the prices have dropped at least a little since then.  In my case, it's a WD drive, and it has performed well without any problems, so far.


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## Taralack (Sep 10, 2012)

TealMoon said:


> You can get a 1TB for $99 now.



To be fair, I was a little lazy and bought it at a JB Hifi, instead of going to the computer parts wholesaler who might have it for cheaper. 

Also I think electronics might be priced differently in Australia, but I'm not sure. I saw 1TB ones going for about $125-150, but they all needed external power.


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## Hendikins (Sep 10, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> To be fair, I was a little lazy and bought it at a JB Hifi, instead of going to the computer parts wholesaler who might have it for cheaper



Ah, JB. If you don't already use it, it's well worth price searching on staticICE - and you can often get a price match out of JB that way too.

And yes, the point that one should back up their material is an important one. When you upload something on the internet, one of two things will happen:
* If you want everyone to see it, sooner or later it will disappear.
* If you ever want to get rid of something, you can't!


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## Bokebo (Sep 10, 2012)

I'm just thrilled we have the forums to find out what's going on in the first place. =)

Also glad it's not a repeat of "the site owner fallout" several years ago.


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## Foreman (Sep 10, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> To be fair, I was a little lazy and bought it at a JB Hifi, instead of going to the computer parts wholesaler who might have it for cheaper.
> 
> Also I think electronics might be priced differently in Australia, but I'm not sure. I saw 1TB ones going for about $125-150, but they all needed external power.



I got 2TB drives from Officeworks for $129.  http://www.officeworks.com.au/retai...al-Hard-Drives/Desktop-Hard-Drives/SGTC2000BK


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 10, 2012)

yak said:


> IWith an exception of one database table containing technical information all of the database files have been successfully copied to a networked server.
> Will be setting up and attempting to run a database server off that hardware and copied files.



So, what? Up sometime tomorrow then?


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## Hendikins (Sep 10, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> So, what? Up sometime tomorrow then?



The only really accurate answer is "When it's ready". Things are getting done using the time and resources available to the relevant staff.


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## Elim Garak (Sep 10, 2012)

Can someone inform me here:
There is no indication there isn't a back up for the data, the thing is the main system is down. They just need to repair the main system, they can't do a production run from a back up store. Be it tapes or slow drives. You basically have back up data stores and some websites who have one hot system and a cold system standing by to switch over.
I assume FA just has a back up data storage which is less expensive, an extra SAN in the datacenter or so. Which is normal for most websites with a lower budget.


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## nrr (Sep 10, 2012)

Elim Garak said:


> Can someone inform me here:
> There is no indication there isn't a back up for the data, the thing is the main system is down. They just need to repair the main system, they can't do a production run from a back up store. Be it tapes or slow drives. You basically have back up data stores and some websites who have one hot system and a cold system standing by to switch over.



The update from yak concerning copying over the InnoDB files implied very strongly, at least to me, that there was't a backup that resided elsewhere.



Elim Garak said:


> I assume FA just has a back up data storage which is less expensive, an extra SAN in the datacenter or so. Which is normal for most websites with a lower budget.



FA has nothing even remotely approximating any SAN hardware anywhere, let alone the standard fare you'd find in enterprise shops like tape drives or even a legitimate backup system, even one built with tar and rsync. It's a disparate collection of commodity machines running a somewhat recent release of FreeBSD. That's it.


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## Quilmeleon (Sep 10, 2012)

Summercat said:


> External or Internal?
> 
> (And conversion cases are shit.)



External and normally only 7200 RPM. I paid $90 for my 1TB external drive during a big sale. 

And I agree conversion rates suck for some of these drives


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 10, 2012)

After looking at the price of hard drives, server equipment, and judging by the fact that backup computer components are falling from the sky in most office and university settings, I'm utterly baffled how FA manages to be this poorly equipped. I've seen Minecraft and private WoW servers perform better and I'm willing to bet their revenue streams are quite similar. It has been *days* now.


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## Armaetus (Sep 10, 2012)

Kaeko said:


> im really getting tired of people knocking FA so badly. If yu dont like it leave, stop complaining, we dont want to hear it.



Are you gonna go to that stupid argument? Really? You don't know how much shit us users have gone through since Alkora gave Dragoneer the servers. Some of us remember it far better than the majority who just want their porn/commissions/asskissing/etc.

We're allowed to bitch (within reason) and there isn't anything you can do about, and don't tell me to go to IB and/or Sofurry..I already have accounts there in case this decrepit service does finally fail/close.


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 10, 2012)

^ That, FA going down is becoming less a trifle and more a legitimate inconvenience. I still have outstanding commissions I ordered with no other way of contacting the people involved.


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## Taralack (Sep 10, 2012)

TeenageAngst said:


> ^ That, FA going down is becoming less a trifle and more a legitimate inconvenience. I still have outstanding commissions I ordered with no other way of contacting the people involved.



Again... this is why you forgo notes and make it a requirement that people attach their refs in an email. :V


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 10, 2012)

This is also why a basic RAID 0+1 setup isn't the best option for outdated hardware running a high-traffic site.

Oh wait, it's not FA's fault, it's mine for relying on them.

You know, gmail is a free email provider. I assume if my inbox was made unavailable for 2-3 days I'd have no reason to complain about that either.


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## Elim Garak (Sep 10, 2012)

nrr said:


> The update from yak concerning copying over the InnoDB files implied very strongly, at least to me, that there was't a backup that resided elsewhere.
> 
> 
> 
> FA has nothing even remotely approximating any SAN hardware anywhere, let alone the standard fare you'd find in enterprise shops like tape drives or even a legitimate backup system, even one built with tar and rsync. It's a disparate collection of commodity machines running a somewhat recent release of FreeBSD. That's it.


Yes, but unless someone that works server side can confirm this, we can't be sure.
I can understand that a backup isn't fully recent seeing the mass of data storage needed for all the furry porn which is why they rather copy the more up to date version than restore it from a day or older back up.

Also people, server HDDs are not as cheap as desktop HDDs, they get way more data written and read from them so they need to be more durable.
Hosting a big site on a dedicated server isn't that cheap, especially with FA's bandwith.


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## RadioCatastrophe (Sep 10, 2012)

Wondering if FA's staff running all this is as knowledgeable as they should be. It seems the users are more in tune with the site and how things should be versus how they are and possibly will continue to be, like, how I've seen some good web layout concepts and yet they're all over looked for one reason or another... Personally I think everything about FA needs a revamp, but I hardly know anything about running a dedicate server that can handle the traffic FA gets (even if it isn't much compared to other websites) but at least they should look into the user base a little more when they need more staff on deck to help solve and prevent issues as well as giving new and innovated ideas for the sites interface and setup that the public interacts with.

I don't see myself leaving unless forced to (through shutdown or being banned) so I'm not really complaining, just concerned with how "professional" FA is as a whole with how the staff is and we the users not knowing even if these people are legitimately qualified for the job they currently have with the site. Hopefully Dragoneer or whoever is truly pulling the strings figures out that what they're doing isn't the way to go and try to fix things...

Anyways, still waiting to get my daily dose of furry whether good or bad.


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## Kitch (Sep 10, 2012)

Keep in mind, FA has had far worse downtimes than this. I remember one time when they were down for far longer. I'm inclined to say a lot longer than a week. This is only day #2. Relax.


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## TeenageAngst (Sep 10, 2012)

It's always nice to remember the hardware and admins have a track record far worse than our current predicament. Hopes are high.


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## Heliophobic (Sep 10, 2012)

Wet Coyote said:


> I like my butt to hurt, but not in THIS way  8-P



_What?_


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## RadioCatastrophe (Sep 10, 2012)

This is my first year with FA, I've seen and visited the site before but I've never been as active as I am now so I'm clueless to the past troubles the site has gone through. But I'll try to imagine this being a bump compared to previous slopes.


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## nrr (Sep 10, 2012)

Elim Garak said:


> Yes, but unless someone that works server side can confirm this, we can't be sure.



Trust me on this one; I know almost as much about FA's architecture as their ops staff does. I've gone drinking with one or two of them to boot. I know what I'm talking about. 



Elim Garak said:


> I can understand that a backup isn't fully recent seeing the mass of data storage needed for all the furry porn which is why they rather copy the more up to date version than restore it from a day or older back up.



The only concern is the database; the images are fine. See https://d.facdn.net/art/keedot/1346265858.keedot_tsareia.png (NSFW on account of there being a questionably nude (yet amazingly cute) snowleopard girl behind the link).


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## Koda (Sep 10, 2012)

Anyone care to comment about the RAID question I posed earlier? My comment was the last of a page so it was probably buried


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## RailRide (Sep 11, 2012)

(Note: I did read the entire thread as of this post. Below is just what I wanted to expand upon)


Toraneko said:


> I never could understand people who upload art to a site and that becomes their only copy of that artwork. You don't keep archives or anything??
> 
> And as for art people have done for you... your first response upon receiving a piece of artwork should immediately be to right click and save it. Anything could happen, and it's always better to have a copy sitting in your personal files rather than relying on the good will of someone's server space that it will still be up weeks or months down the road.



My methodology:

--Every pic that I know I'm going to finish gets a project name + number, and lives in a folder named the same way on a flash drive. Not only does this let me use more than one system to work on a pic, but shields them from HDD failures.

--Once the project is completed (or if it gets back-burnered), the folder gets copied to *two* external hard drives (I've already had one "backup drive" die, so I keep two now)

--The original project folder stays on the flash drive. Because they're so cheap nowadays*, I just buy another one when the present one fills up. I also duplicate the last dozen or so  projects onto the new drive so I can go back to them for color samples, etc. Now there are at least _four_ archive copies (not counting a third external HD that lives in my locker at work)
*4-8GB drives can be frequently had for a buck a gig. Even less for 16-32GB ones.

Within each project folder I keep separate files:
--pencil scans
--vector versions (if applicable)
--lineart
--flat-shaded version
--full color
   Those last three are if I'm making a single-layer image--if it's a multilayer one with shading and effects on different layers atop a flatshaded version, then that file stands in for everything but the pencil scan (since I can output the other versions just by turning off certain layers and saving out a standard bitmap image.
--25% size versions and JPG's of the same for posting.
--custom thumbnails, if any
--any reference photos used
--a text file of the description when posted (I write them up in Notepad before posting, so I can just copy/paste them into the desc field when uploading)

So, even if FA's data went kablooey, I could restore all my submissions (somewhere around 450) along with the descriptions I wrote for them, in much the same order they were originally uploaded. For a short while, I thought about archiving their comments, but rejected that as being too anal. Same for journals--few of them contain info that I'd revisit. The idea of backing up one's watchlist sounds like a plan, since I seldom add to mine.

---PCJ


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## Kadah (Sep 11, 2012)

Kitch said:


> Keep in mind, FA has had far worse downtimes than this. I remember one time when they were down for far longer. I'm inclined to say a lot longer than a week. This is only day #2. Relax.


One of the last major downtimes was like 2 weeks I think. That was rather annoying. 



Koda said:


> Anyone care to comment about the RAID question I posed earlier? My comment was the last of a page so it was probably buried


I didn't see it. Was it on a different thread?

I don't know much as far as details about the affected server. For an HA database server I would have used redundant SAS controls (and the kind that store the array configs on the drives ), plus have at least a couple spare disks attached. Funds permitting of course; the fancy raid controls are quite pricey.

My history with RAID is full of always buying a more expensive card every time the previous one, that I got instead becasue it was cheaper, fails due to annoying shit like config loss or firmware bugs. The data was always recoverable, but often it would take all week to reconstruct the array manually.


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## yak (Sep 11, 2012)

nrr said:


> The update from yak concerning copying over the InnoDB files implied very strongly, at least to me, that there was't a backup that resided elsewhere.


There was, just that I wasn't willing to lose a week's worth of data by restoring it instead.


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## Taralack (Sep 11, 2012)

RadioCatastrophe said:


> just concerned with how "professional" FA is as a whole with how the staff is and we the users not knowing even if these people are legitimately qualified for the job they currently have with the site.



FA's staff have never exactly been what I'd consider "professional", to say the least...


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## Elim Garak (Sep 11, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> FA's staff have never exactly been what I'd consider "professional", to say the least...


They are professional enough for working in their free time.
Unlike the CNN example which is an actual company with massive profits and pays their employees.


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## Taralack (Sep 11, 2012)

Elim Garak said:


> They are professional enough for working in their free time.
> Unlike the CNN example which is an actual company with massive profits and pays their employees.



Even then, they have been proven to favour friends for mod positions on the mainsite. But that's not a can of worms I'd like to open.


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## Gryphoneer (Sep 11, 2012)

Elim Garak said:


> They are professional enough for working in their free time.


You've seen very few mods working in their free time, eh?


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## RadioCatastrophe (Sep 11, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> FA's staff have never exactly been what I'd consider "professional", to say the least...



I've never really had much 1on1 contact with much of the mods aside from one who was rude to me when I asked a simple question and also explained to them that I had the artists permission to re-post the commission and they thought I was talking about using it as an avatar... (it was a bouncing/swaying icon). I didn't know the back story behind the icons so I asked and got a snarky reply and was never answered


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## Elim Garak (Sep 11, 2012)

Toraneko said:


> Even then, they have been proven to favour friends for mod positions on the mainsite. But that's not a can of worms I'd like to open.


Oh that's what I used to do, but only if they could handle it.
If I have been a friend with someone for 3 years and know them inside out and they seem perfect for the position from a almost neutral way of looking at it(It's possible, I once fired a friend IRL for messing up and I didn't hire him FYI) then you would rather go with that person than a person you don't know but have other people that you don't really know tell them they are perfect. I would pick the person you really know. If you owned a company and you have two good canidates: a friend or a stranger, who would you pick?


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## Devious Bane (Sep 11, 2012)

Elim Garak said:


> They are professional enough for working in their free time.
> Unlike the CNN example which is an actual company with massive profits and pays their employees.


Comparing FA to CNN is like comparing Garbage to a Garbage Bin*.

There are plenty of admins out there, who work without pay, that provide a much more professional experience and handling of issues. Some are not even as active as FA's admins, however when they are there they do their jobs and they do so providing satisfactory results.

Not being paid isn't an excuse for being incompetent.

*I think CNN's news broadcasts are garbage, however as far as their business is concerned I'm impartial.


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## nrr (Sep 11, 2012)

Devious Bane said:


> Not being paid isn't an excuse for being incompetent.
> 
> *I think CNN's news broadcasts are garbage, however as far as their business is concerned I'm impartial.



I can't speak to either since I work for CNN, but the example pretty much went to the effect of, "CNN.com is free to its end-users, but when shit goes wrong, wouldn't you have an expectation to see it handled in a professional manner, profitability notwithstanding?"

(What I can say is that Ted Turner is a pretty neat guy with a lot of personality, but take from that what you will.)

At this point, the responsibility of FA to its community is to become a self-sustaining entity and to get out of this notion of everyone volunteering. It's cute to be able to toss around the "volunteer help" excuse, but it's been seven years. Isn't it time to get serious?


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## Koda (Sep 11, 2012)

I'd pay a subscription fee. As long as it was cheap (like, a dollar or two a month), and there was still an option for anyone who wishes to keep an account for free. 

A subscription might include features for managing commissions, exporting notes, or better filtering of submissions. Uploading content and sharing it with the community should be unaffected. 
The money from the subscriptions (plus ads and donations) would be enough to support the infrastructure costs, and perhaps pay a NOC to keep the servers up and running. I've seen this before, where a company pays a datacenter to manage and monitor their servers and hardware. Whereas with a cloud or shared hosting you don't actually own the server, in this scenario, all the hardware is yours, there's just pros there who deal with it 24/7.


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## Devious Bane (Sep 11, 2012)

FA already makes money from advertisements and donations.
The moment they start doing subscription fees, they're going to lose most of their user-base because a lot of self-respecting artists don't want lazy, intolerance dickwads profitting from their work unless they're getting a piece of the pie.


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## Koda (Sep 11, 2012)

Hence why I said "and there was still an option for anyone who wishes to keep an account for free".

If you're providing a service, something like a commission tracker I suggested, I think artists would find it useful. Not scare anybody off. And "oh no! They're making money off me" is bs. Google makes money off you every day, do you complain?

You certainly wouldn't be forcing it down anyone's throats if there was always a 'basic' user. Live Journal uses that. So does Deviant Art. You pay a bit, you get something better, but it doesn't affect those people who don't want to pay anything. You just dont get all the cool shineys you dont have right now anyway. BFD.


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## thoron (Sep 11, 2012)

Koda said:


> Hence why I said "and there was still an option for anyone who wishes to keep an account for free".
> 
> If you're providing a service, something like a commission tracker I suggested, I think artists would find it useful. Not scare anybody off. And "oh no! They're making money off me" is bs. Google makes money off you every day, do you complain?
> 
> You certainly wouldn't be forcing it down anyone's throats if there was always a 'basic' user. Live Journal uses that. So does Deviant Art. You pay a bit, you get something better, but it doesn't affect those people who don't want to pay anything. You just dont get all the cool shineys you dont have right now anyway. BFD.



DA isn't the best example of that since you only really get anything if you pay a subscription fee, these days DA is so gimpy, imparctical and has so many limits placed on it that its almost not worth having an account there unless you pay up. I don't think FA wants to start heading down that path.


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## Summercat (Sep 11, 2012)

thoron said:


> DA isn't the best example of that since you only really get anything if you pay a subscription fee, these days DA is so gimpy and impractical unless you shell money over to them and I doubte FA wants to even start down that road.



I sure don't.


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## kaskae (Sep 11, 2012)

I'd probably jump ship if it came down to subscriptions. From what I've seen with dA, it takes a lot of what made the site great in the first place and makes it something you have to shell out cash to get. I don't think I could transition very well, seeing as I wouldn't be partaking in the subscription service.


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 11, 2012)

So can I cross my fingers for FA being up tomorrow?? Not sure how long it will take to recover the database...


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## Hunter (Sep 12, 2012)

RadioCatastrophe said:


> I've never really had much 1on1 contact with much of the mods aside from one who was rude to me when I asked a simple question and also explained to them that I had the artists permission to re-post the commission and they thought I was talking about using it as an avatar... (it was a bouncing/swaying icon). I didn't know the back story behind the icons so I asked and got a snarky reply and was never answered



that's pretty much my experience here on FaF , if am not getting slammed for my faulty grammar then i get MODED for not towing the FaF line. 

I don't really depend on Fa socially and am not really stressing over the down time , just gives me more time to scribble out more stuff .

It's a free private site , being allowed to post here is a privilege , not a right ,so am going to be patient and wait for the staff to put it back together.


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## Summercat (Sep 12, 2012)

Hunter said:


> ...not towing the FaF line.



Look, dude, it's your own fault. We needed to get the ship past the rocks, and we needed all the tugs to work IN TANDEM. You're just lucky that the ship didn't end up breaking the back of it's hull, you could have been fired!

/snark


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## RadioCatastrophe (Sep 12, 2012)

Hunter said:


> that's pretty much my experience here on FaF , if am not getting slammed for my faulty grammar then i get MODED for not towing the FaF line.
> 
> I don't really depend on Fa socially and am not really stressing over the down time , just gives me more time to scribble out more stuff .
> 
> It's a free private site , being allowed to post here is a privilege , not a right ,so am going to be patient and wait for the staff to put it back together.



I try not to stick out myself to attract attention from staff cock-suckers, or staff in general. Best to avoid all unneeded contact/conversation at all costs, doesn't seem anything good comes of it.
At least it isn't as bad IMVU here, getting random warning because they didn't think my outfit fit their theme for a contest :I


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 12, 2012)

RadioCatastrophe said:


> At least it isn't as bad IMVU here, getting random warning because they didn't think my outfit fit their theme for a contest :I


Lol dafuq?


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 12, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> So can I cross my fingers for FA being up tomorrow?? Not sure how long it will take to recover the database...


No, you can't cross your fingers for FA being up tomorrow.
This is going to take quite a while.
Starting today; I do believe it will be another 3-5 days max.
But this is just me being generous and not looking forward to a whole lot.


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## Devious Bane (Sep 12, 2012)

There's an edit button, remember to use it.


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 12, 2012)

Devious Bane said:


> There's an edit button, remember to use it.


To be quite honest with you, I thought my internet hiccuped and it didn't go through, since I got a DNS error after posting.
My bad.


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 12, 2012)

ArtemisZiebenwolf said:


> No, you can't cross your fingers for FA being up tomorrow.
> This is going to take quite a while.
> Starting today; I do believe it will be another 3-5 days max.
> But this is just me being generous and not looking forward to a whole lot.



What does THIS mean then?

"Primary database server back online. Restoring the database. This will take a while, and barring further issues should be finished today."


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 12, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> What does THIS mean then?
> 
> "Primary database server back online. Restoring the database. This will take a while, and barring further issues should be finished today."


Okay fine. I reiterate. 
2-3 days.


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 12, 2012)

ArtemisZiebenwolf said:


> Okay fine. I reiterate.
> 2-3 days.



Honestly, if it says TODAY it should be TODAY. If there ARE issues they should let us know, even though I personally feel that issues are unlikely, given they've gone through the necessary steps to fix the problem so far.


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 12, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> Honestly, if it says TODAY it should be TODAY. If there ARE issues they should let us know, even though I personally feel that issues are unlikely, given they've gone through the necessary steps to fix the problem so far.


FA isn't known for being speedy or meeting promised deadlines.
*shrug*


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## thoron (Sep 12, 2012)

ArtemisZiebenwolf said:


> FA isn't known for being speedy or meeting promised deadlines.
> *shrug*



If it happens by midnight pacific time, its still technically back online today.


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## ArtemisZiebenwolf (Sep 12, 2012)

thoron said:


> If it happens by midnight pacific time, its still technically back online today.


This is a good point. 
But we'll see about that.
Is Pacific time -8 or -7? I don't remember.... Feh.


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 12, 2012)

3 hours from now is 12AM Pacific Time.


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## Kaeko (Sep 13, 2012)

Everyone needs tto be patient. Personally from what I heard, as they are doing this, the staff is also doing some extra work with the site. Id much rather wait 2-3 more days then go on a prematurely fixed site they rushed to get back online cause all the banter and complaining.

Be grateful you even have the staff working to repair the problem. :/ 

Just my two sense..


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## Kesteh (Sep 13, 2012)

"Today" on FA terms means "Next week". Nothing is ever on time here.
For example: The UI update which is a few years late.


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## Kaeko (Sep 13, 2012)

Kesteh said:


> "Today" on FA terms means "Next week". Nothing is ever on time here.
> For example: The UI update which is a few years late.




Might be true. But also shouldnnt matter how long it takes. As long as they get the job done.

Yeah id like a more frequent update about the database status, but sit back, skim 4chan and be patient. That's all we can do. Complaining about it isn't gonna make it go any faster.


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## RadioCatastrophe (Sep 13, 2012)

Kaeko said:


> Everyone needs tto be patient. Personally from what I heard, as they are doing this, the staff is also doing some extra work with the site. Id much rather wait 2-3 more days then go on a prematurely fixed site they rushed to get back online cause all the banter and complaining.
> 
> Be grateful you even have the staff working to repair the problem. :/
> 
> Just my two sense..



They have people paying them for ad space :I
Unless they're willing to reimburse them they need to get the site back up pronto. This hiccup or any other should last for so long unless it was a major hardware failure that could not be stopped. A firmware and hardware issues for a back-up of a back-up shouldn't take this long to fix in my opinion, yeah I'm grateful they provide the site to us but act as if no one has been patient and telling us to be grateful is.. I dunno how to describe it other than wrong. I won't go much into detail so I don't spark a huge argument but, they knew what they were in for when they got into working with a large social art website they should be ready and prepared with more staff on deck who can help solve these problems faster and more appropriately so that everything is done right and is stable.


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

The DB transfer is taking longer than expected. It's currently in message_center.

...I really think we should start auto-purging inboxes :v


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

RadioCatastrophe said:


> They have people paying them for ad space :I
> Unless they're willing to reimburse them they need to get the site back up pronto. This hiccup or any other should last for so long unless it was a major hardware failure that could not be stopped. A firmware and hardware issues for a back-up of a back-up shouldn't take this long to fix in my opinion, yeah I'm grateful they provide the site to us but act as if no one has been patient and telling us to be grateful is.. I dunno how to describe it other than wrong. I won't go much into detail so I don't spark a huge argument but, they knew what they were in for when they got into working with a large social art website they should be ready and prepared with more staff on deck who can help solve these problems faster and more appropriately so that everything is done right and is stable.



People who have adspace on FA will be compensated with the lengthening of their ads for the duration of the downtime.


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## Arcsol (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> The DB transfer is taking longer than expected. It's currently in message_center.
> 
> ...I really think we should start auto-purging inboxes :v


 I would agree with that, but seeing as some comissioners keep some of their info in their notes only, probably wouldnt be the wisest thing. Although that could be a good way to get more butthurt furries on here.


----------



## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

Arcsol said:


> I would agree with that, but seeing as some comissioners keep some of their info in their notes only, probably wouldnt be the wisest thing. Although that could be a good way to get more butthurt furries on here.



Notes I'm not too worried about. This is the message center notifications, saying you have submissions, comments, favorites, etc.


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## RadioCatastrophe (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> People who have adspace on FA will be compensated with the lengthening of their ads for the duration of the downtime.



That's good to hear, is there an official announcement on this? I mean I haven't heard any really complain about this but I'm just wondering for those who don't visit the forums.


----------



## Kaeko (Sep 13, 2012)

RadioCatastrophe said:


> They have people paying them for ad space :I
> Unless they're willing to reimburse them they need to get the site back up pronto. This hiccup or any other should last for so long unless it was a major hardware failure that could not be stopped. A firmware and hardware issues for a back-up of a back-up shouldn't take this long to fix in my opinion, yeah I'm grateful they provide the site to us but act as if no one has been patient and telling us to be grateful is.. I dunno how to describe it other than wrong. I won't go much into detail so I don't spark a huge argument but, they knew what they were in for when they got into working with a large social art website they should be ready and prepared with more staff on deck who can help solve these problems faster and more appropriately so that everything is done right and is stable.


More than likely they were reimburse, or maybe add on a few days?  perhaps? But I do understand where you are coming from. I'm sure they could've had things up sooner if they had bee prepared for something like this. And because its happened. Let's hope they prepare for the next time it may happen and learn from it?

And don't worry. I'm not an arguementive type.


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## Kesteh (Sep 13, 2012)

I cringe everytime a user on a stream goes to FA and suddenly you see their message center span 1/4th the browser window because they NEVER FUCKING DELETE MESSAGES EVER BECAUSE THEY MIGHT NEED A BOOKMARK.
Yeah those 3000+ messages you'll look at maybe twice in their entire lifetime... nuke them. All of them.


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## kaskae (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> The DB transfer is taking longer than expected. It's currently in message_center.
> 
> ...I really think we should start auto-purging inboxes :v



I had a massive 3S, 3C and 3J from before the crash. I have a massive pseudo-stroke if it gets above 10 in any category. I hate having new messages.


----------



## RadioCatastrophe (Sep 13, 2012)

Kesteh said:


> I cringe everytime a user on a stream goes to FA and suddenly you see their message center span 1/4th the browser window because they NEVER FUCKING DELETE MESSAGES EVER BECAUSE THEY MIGHT NEED A BOOKMARK.
> Yeah those 3000+ messages you'll look at maybe twice in their entire lifetime... nuke them. All of them.



Q_Q I must know every comment, fave, and journal created by every user everyday or I would just DIE! I'D JUST DIE OK!?


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## Kaeko (Sep 13, 2012)

kaskae said:


> I had a massive 3S, 3C and 3J from before the crash. I have a massive pseudo-stroke if it gets above 10 in any category. I hate having new messages.



I really don't like a bunch of new messages...but ill post something and get insta 30-80 favs to delete...its like
Hhhhhnnnnnngggg..id rather them be comments. Buut at least I don't have to reply to it all ono


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

RadioCatastrophe said:


> That's good to hear, is there an official announcement on this? I mean I haven't heard any really complain about this but I'm just wondering for those who don't visit the forums.



This is standard policy. We've always done this for outages. Sometimes (Not saying this time, that's HIS perogative) Dragoneer tosses in a few extra days.



kaskae said:


> I had a massive 3S, 3C and 3J from before the crash. I have a massive pseudo-stroke if it gets above 10 in any category. I hate having new messages.



I'm one of the bad guys myself. 



    @summercat
    â–¼ My FA
    33785 messages ( 32715S, 990J, 51F, 8W , 21TT )
    SFW
    Log Out

Of course, also

Is watching: Full List (4087)


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> The DB transfer is taking longer than expected. It's currently in message_center.
> 
> ...I really think we should start auto-purging inboxes :v



Honestly, though, how long could messages take? They're just text. It's the images that would take a lot more time, right?


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 13, 2012)

kaskae said:


> I had a massive 3S, 3C and 3J from before the crash. I have a massive pseudo-stroke if it gets above 10 in any category. I hate having new messages.


 Well, once the darn site gets back up be prepared!


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## Kaeko (Sep 13, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> Honestly, though, how long could messages take? They're just text. It's the images that would take a lot more time, right?





Id have to look at it like this. What's the avverage submissions by artists? Over the average, favs, comments and watches tallied together..:/


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> Honestly, though, how long could messages take? They're just text. It's the images that would take a lot more time, right?



Each one by themselves? Not very long (although it has to pull all the data surrounding them, too, like who it belongs to, what's it from, etc)

It's just a grain of sand.

Which is what a beach is made out of.


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> Each one by themselves? Not very long (although it has to pull all the data surrounding them, too, like who it belongs to, what's it from, etc)
> 
> It's just a grain of sand.
> 
> Which is what a beach is made out of.



But essentially, the site's coming back after this is done? You wouldn't happen to have an ETA would you? Just curious because it seems like we're almost there...


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> But essentially, the site's coming back after this is done? You wouldn't happen to have an ETA would you? Just curious because it seems like we're almost there...



Our ETA was several hours ago. I really can't say other than it's in the middle of something and taking longer donig it. This is an automatic process we can't speed up or manipulate.

Okay, and once again I'll say

When FA comes back up? It'll be slow. REALLY slow. VERY slow. This is the server recacheing everything. As things cache it'll speed up.


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## kaskae (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> ]I'm one of the bad guys myself.
> @summercat
> â–¼ My FA
> 33785 messages ( 32715S, 990J, 51F, 8W , 21TT )
> ...



Jesus christ. I had a friend with a few thousand watches himself, and I would laugh when he exceeded 5,000. Any plans to, uh, go through those or is a nuke in order?


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## Kaeko (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> Our ETA was several hours ago. I really can't say other than it's in the middle of something and taking longer donig it. This is an automatic process we can't speed up or manipulate.
> 
> Okay, and once again I'll say
> 
> When FA comes back up? It'll be slow. REALLY slow. VERY slow. This is the server recacheing everything. As things cache it'll speed up.



This is why I will probably go to the beach for the weekend and check fa Monday lol


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

kaskae said:


> Jesus christ. I had a friend with a few thousand watches himself, and I would laugh when he exceeded 5,000. Any plans to, uh, go through those or is a nuke in order?



Nuking is in order. Frankly, it's unmanagable, and I keep idly asking yak for a watchlist nuker.


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> Our ETA was several hours ago. I really can't say other than it's in the middle of something and taking longer donig it. This is an automatic process we can't speed up or manipulate.
> 
> Okay, and once again I'll say
> 
> When FA comes back up? It'll be slow. REALLY slow. VERY slow. This is the server recacheing everything. As things cache it'll speed up.




*twitches*


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## Accountability (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> The DB transfer is taking longer than expected. It's currently in message_center.
> 
> ...I really think we should start auto-purging inboxes :v



I seem to recall this happening once before!

Why messages over a year old are kept around is beyond me.


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

Accountability said:


> I seem to recall this happening once before!
> 
> Why messages over a year old are kept around is beyond me.



Can I snark? PLEEEAAAASEEEE? No? Goddamnit.

Anyhow

There's quite a few things I dislike with priorities, but hopefully the new coder/s we're bringing aboard might be able to help :3 Plus I noticed an interesting package being installed that might mean I can halp out a tad. Probably not, though xD


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## GamerFox (Sep 13, 2012)

Slap some sense into yak, with several trout if need be.


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## Kaeko (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> Can I snark? PLEEEAAAASEEEE? No? Goddamnit.
> 
> Anyhow
> 
> There's quite a few things I dislike with priorities, but hopefully the new coder/s we're bringing aboard might be able to help :3 Plus I noticed an interesting package being installed that might mean I can halp out a tad. Probably not, though xD


Does this mean what I think it means?


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

Kaeko said:


> Does this mean what I think it means?



I...

I have no clue what you think it means.


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## Accountability (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> There's quite a few things I dislike with priorities, but hopefully the new coder/s we're bringing aboard might be able to help :3 Plus I noticed an interesting package being installed that might mean I can halp out a tad. Probably not, though xD



Is something actually going to happen this time?


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

Accountability said:


> Is something actually going to happen this time?



I've got my hopes up, but I don't want to wind you up and say "SURE YES YES". Again, I'm not a coder, so can't comment on that directly. One of these days I'll have to find someone to drag my head through the basics and intermediates of PHP so I can start looking at the code to do minor cleanups/hole checking.


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## kaskae (Sep 13, 2012)

Accountability said:


> I seem to recall this happening once before!
> 
> Why messages over a year old are kept around is beyond me.



How am I supposed to find purged images from a year ago after I ragequit and subsequently come back to FA?


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 13, 2012)

Arcsol said:


> I would agree with that, but seeing as some comissioners keep some of their info in their notes only, probably wouldnt be the wisest thing. Although that could be a good way to get more butthurt furries on here.



I gotta agree here. Some artists are even backed up (I know a few) and don't really get to my commissions right away so I have em left in my message center. Yeah, they're just sitting there. But they will be needed in the future. No I don't know when. So purging notes would be a really bad idea.



Summercat said:


> Notes I'm not too worried about. This is the message center notifications, saying you have submissions, comments, favorites, etc.



I'm not so sure about this either. Removing notifications? Users would miss out on the recent artwork their watched artists have uploaded, and journals, and probably notes (if this is what you're getting at)

I think it's best to wait until they finish, even though I'm really hating how long it's taking to complete.


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 13, 2012)

I mean, at least update the dang banner! Unless of course you think it'll finish today (Thursday) but still, perhaps "it is taking a bit longer than we expected but should be finished today" or something...

I'm sorry, the site's been down for 4 1/2 days. I'm ready for that to change.


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> I gotta agree here. Some artists are even backed up (I know a few) and don't really get to my commissions right away so I have em left in my message center. Yeah, they're just sitting there. But they will be needed in the future. No I don't know when. So purging notes would be a really bad idea.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No, you misunderstood me.

What we should have put in a while ago (and I've added it on my list of things to badger yak about) is something that automatically clears notices that are past a set expatriation date (say, 6 months).


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## PheagleAdler (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> No, you misunderstood me.
> 
> What we should have put in a while ago (and I've added it on my list of things to badger yak about) is something that automatically clears notices that are past a set expatriation date (say, 6 months).



Well, yeah, that makes sense.


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## Valicyn (Sep 13, 2012)

I wonder though if there should be a upload limitation applied to the site for the first two or three days after the page is back up functioning.
Because frankly, people WILL dump their stuff onto FA again as soon they can submit it onto the site, and I wouldn't be surprised that this will cause the page again to slow down to a crawl and everyone recieves 504's/Timeouts for hours, which in result angers the community more and are raging hard on the boards here and on journals.


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## Gryphoneer (Sep 13, 2012)

Summercat said:


> new coder/s


Identities and credentials or it didn't happen.


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## Summercat (Sep 13, 2012)

Gryphoneer said:


> Identities and credentials or it didn't happen.



And let you start harassing them? Nope.jpg


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## DragonTalon (Sep 20, 2012)

Summercat said:


> ...I really think we should start auto-purging inboxes :v



I'd be fine with this if there was a button I could click to download/archive my inbox and outbox messages.  If I could do that, I'd clear the darn thing out immediately!  I don't mind using my own disk space for it.

I don't want to just mass delete it because I have commission info in there I want to keep for my records.  Plus I just like having it available.  I'm like a crazy cat lady, but with data...


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## Gryphoneer (Sep 20, 2012)

Summercat said:


> And let you start harassing them? Nope.jpg


WTF a whole week how the fuck could I have missed that

What kinda spurious excuse is that?

But yeah, better not to disclose their identities so you can spare yourselves the PR fallout once they, too, are driven away by the bad working atmosphere, amirite?


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## Summercat (Sep 21, 2012)

Gryphoneer said:


> WTF a whole week how the fuck could I have missed that
> 
> What kinda spurious excuse is that?
> 
> But yeah, better not to disclose their identities so you can spare yourselves the PR fallout once they, too, are driven away by the bad working atmosphere, amirite?



Snrk.

Keep telling that to yourself, boyo.


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## kayfox (Sep 21, 2012)

Summercat said:


> Keep telling that to yourself, boyo.



The problem is, noone can tell if your lying, and because this very subject has been lied about so much in the past, how are we to know its not being lied about right now?


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## Summercat (Sep 21, 2012)

kayfox said:


> The problem is, noone can tell if your lying, and because this very subject has been lied about so much in the past, how are we to know its not being lied about right now?



That's... not really any of my concern. You can believe me or not. Up to you, and it's not my job to make you believe me.


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## Saellyn (Sep 21, 2012)

I don't think it actually matters who the new coders are as long as we can see evidence that something is actually happening. It's kind of pointless otherwise. Personally, I would like to see the Ferrox project revived from its long slumber. *Some people* have been complaining for years about how they "inherited crappy coding". Perhaps it's time (lololol, more like PAST time) to think about a complete revamp.

If new coders are actually being brought on, that is.


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## Gryphoneer (Sep 21, 2012)

Summercat said:


> Snrk.
> 
> Keep telling that to yourself, boyo.


Yep, that never happened before.

Except for Crypto.

And Eevee.

And Jurann.

And...


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## Saellyn (Sep 21, 2012)

Gryphoneer said:


> Yep, that never happened before.
> 
> Except for Crypto.
> 
> ...



Mmm... the history of FA is kind of sad if you actually think about it.
*removes brain*

MUCH BETMURR~


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## DragonTalon (Sep 21, 2012)

Well clearly SOMEONE is working on the code since several bugs were introduced (and almost all fixed) in the past week.

Bugs are a bad sign, but getting them FIXED is a much better sign!  Everyone makes mistakes.  But plenty of bugs stick around for years, so seeing one get fixed in a day or two is nice to see.

I have my fingers crossed this trend will continue.

EDIT: And, the other bug got fixed now too.  I'm happy!  Gonna see if I can't be a squeaky wheel about some other longstanding issues now...


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