# Creating an original species



## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Okay, bear with me folks, I'm not sure if this should go here in Fursona Personas or in the Art area.

Anyways since it's Halloween I've been working on making a monster species to call my own. I decided that a cross between a moray eel, a snake, and a tiger would be cool. Something sleek and lithe and fast. Good on land and better in the water.

But the cool thing with snakes and morays are the jaws. They both have specialized distinct jaw features that I wanted in my "original" species. Original? Hybrid? I'm going for original. Sue me.











So what do you think? I want to make it so that the creatures can walk as bipeds and quadrupeds and I want a sleek long fluid look. (Though I really have nothing but pencil sketches for the body and musculature). They also have really elastic skin allowing them to swallow animals whole like snakes do.


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## Sharga (Nov 1, 2011)

The more original species, the better! It's also cool to see more takes on original creatures that veer away from foxes, bunnies and dragons - everyone's favorite base for new anthro species. I create monsters all the time, but not anthropromorphic so much as sci-fi/horror. There's a lot of fun in making something as weird as possible that could still be plausibly alive.    Anyway, one would have to see a full body sketch of the creature before judging it but keep in mind there's already several semi-famous fictional species with a similar idea floating around on sites like Deviantart such as the alien "Lockjaw".


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## Volkodav (Nov 1, 2011)

that is so pimp, deo


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## Fay V (Nov 1, 2011)

hhhnnnnng I want to come up with stuff for this.


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## Roose Hurro (Nov 1, 2011)

I'd like to see some full-body sketches, too.  Also some material on their culture and the like, if they're sentient monsters.  Though they make for a really neat alien species that would be fun to play with.  As for being original, well, inspiration can come from anything that strikes your fancy... my most original alien is a species that looks like a column of fur, capped by a rim of optical structures that serve both as eyes and as a visual projector, this species means of communication.  In fact, their entire bodies are based on a 360 degree symmetry.  Under all that fur, they have limbs that enable them to move/interact in any direction, without turning around.  In the story idea I had where this creature showed up, I had another character refer to it as a "Wookie".


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## Sharga (Nov 1, 2011)

Just wanted to add that if you want an idea of things that can plausibly exist but still fit Earth's laws of, erm, creature building, look up all the extinct families of prehistoric creatures you can - not just dinosaurs! There are so many freaky birds, lizards and mammals that have long since left us but are really cool to look at. Also, the documentary "The Future is Wild", while a little old and suffering from dated CGI, is worth a look because it tries to put creatures together based on evolutionary trends existing animals seem to already be following. 

Another source of inspiration can be the deep sea, which probably hosts the most bizarre (to our sensibilities) collection of living animals today.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Fay V said:


> hhhnnnnng I want to come up with stuff for this.


I'd be fine with a little help!
They have opposable thumbs. Shorter bulkier fingers and longer palms, so their hand moments are not as refined as the human hands. I've also been toying around with the idea of ossified horns or hollow noise making keratin horns, but I think that might just look retarded and like I was just trying to plop random shit on it.

Anyways, as for the culture I know that ear cropping is a major fashion trend in the species. They prefer the look of the long crop aesthetically, but those involved (past of present) in military are easily spotted by them having battle crops.
http://hqbullies.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/crops.jpg

They have long, large, rudder like tails and some skin webbing between their fingers. In higher society this webbing is removed for fashion statements, and in some military circles that use human weapons it's also removed to not allow the webbing to get caught in the mechanics.

Coat colors and patterns hugely vary, the next comparable species might be the domestic cat for it's differentiation in coat colors. They have tortoiseshell, blues, stripes, spots, barrings, and lots of natural colors like oranges, golds, yellows, browns, blacks, whites, and grays like "russian blue". http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/catstut6.jpeg


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## Fay V (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> I'd be fine with a little help!
> They have opposable thumbs. Shorter bulkier fingers and longer palms, so their hand moments are not as refined as the human hands. I've also been toying around with the idea of ossified horns or hollow noise making keratin horns, but I think that might just look retarded and like I was just trying to plop random shit on it.
> 
> Anyways, as for the culture I know that ear cropping is a major fashion trend in the species. They prefer the look of the long crop aesthetically, but those involved (past of present) in military are easily spotted by them having battle crops.
> ...


How would you feel about a second set of arms? I dunno way but after looking at the jaw stuff, all I can think of is just this second tiny set for smaller more refined movements and gestures.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Fay V said:


> How would you feel about a second set of arms? I dunno way but after looking at the jaw stuff, all I can think of is just this second tiny set for smaller more refined movements and gestures.


OMG. WE HAVE A MIND LINK.
I was toying with that too. I was just trying to figure out how the scapulas would mesh when it was running. I think it'd be really neat, and if I did that I'd change their thick hands into more bear-like hands (to help them stun/knock unconscious/kill prey).


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## Sharga (Nov 1, 2011)

You could always take that horn idea and make it into a bony crest. That's how certain dinosaurs did it! Or depending on the species' facial shape, hollow/long nose chambers for the same effect. Speaking of dinos, the hands of the Iguanadon http://what-when-how.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/tmp2E24_thumb22.jpg are a good example of primitive, handlike body plans that don't look like cheap sci-fi gloves. 

I like the idea of ear cropping as a fashion. It's more original than the tattoo thing a lot of made up species go for.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Sharga said:


> Anyway, one would have to see a full body sketch of the creature before judging it but keep in mind there's already several semi-famous fictional species with a similar idea floating around on sites like Deviantart such as the alien "Lockjaw".


Uh, my species has nothing to do with BeastOfOblivion's Lockjaws. Lockjaws for one don't have double jaws, they are shapeshifters, and they look completely different. So, uh, I don't get what you're implying? That I should seek out other people's original species and purposefully avoid them? If I've never seen them before what comes out of my head should be original.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Sharga said:


> You could always take that horn idea and make it into a bony crest. That's how certain dinosaurs did it! Or depending on the species' facial shape, hollow/long nose chambers for the same effect.
> 
> I like the idea of ear cropping as a fashion. It's more original than the tattoo thing a lot of made up species go for.


That's what I said. The bony crest was an ossification. You really like dinosaurs huh? Well I was liking the giant headedness of Andewsarchus, but I don't think it'll fit the sleek look of this species. So yeah, I looked into extinct animals too. No worries bro.

And I like the look of cropping, and I think that being sentient and having the choice to do it to themselves makes the difference. I'd never crop my dog's ears, but these creatures are making the decision for themselves. (Again, I don't endorse ear cropping in actual living animals).


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## RayO_ElGatubelo (Nov 1, 2011)

Keep this up, Deo, and you might make a species as popular as the sergal.


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## Sharga (Nov 1, 2011)

I wasn't saying yours were Lockjaws at all! Hell, there haven't even been any pictures yet so that would be thoroughly retarded of me. I was just warning you about several semi popular species because I know from personal experience how awful it feels to labor over something original, designing every aspect, only to pop on Deviantart and see something that looks way too similar for comfort. 

On liking dinosaurs...guilty as charged. Hell, anything that has lived or will someday live as well as mythical beasts. And yeah, ear cropping is not something I endorse either but it makes sense for a sentient species to do onto themselves, much like our piercings and tattoos.

I eagerly await the design sketches. :3


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 1, 2011)

This will be muchly interesting. I'm looking forward to seeing the idea progress! :3c

Shit I wish I could draw decently. I'd totally draw one up myself, I have an idea or two for a new creature species.


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## LizardKing (Nov 1, 2011)

Reminds me of some of Isis' stuff. They draw a lot of 4-legged snake things.


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## Fay V (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> OMG. WE HAVE A MIND LINK.
> I was toying with that too. I was just trying to figure out how the scapulas would mesh when it was running. I think it'd be really neat, and if I did that I'd change their thick hands into more bear-like hands (to help them stun/knock unconscious/kill prey).



So would the bipedal function be like that of a bear? the feet are all plantigrade and the creature can stand and walk somewhat bipedally, but is more quadrapedal?


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## Smelge (Nov 1, 2011)

RayO_ElGatubelo said:


> Keep this up, Deo, and you might make a species as popular as the sergal.



Unlikely.

I'm pretty certain people only like Sergals because of the prehensile clitorii. This sounds like a species with an actual though process behind it other than "how can we make the females be capable of horrifying rape?". That said though, if Deo did want to make something similar, the secondary arms could be mounted just above the groin, for easy fondling.

Needless to say, this is also classified under horrifying.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

In colder climates it's a sign of wealth and power to have a shaved tail. The tails are thin and lose body heat rapidly and the long hair on them is used as a blanket to wrap the animal in. Shaved tails can also be a mark of beauty, as markings are on the skin and not just the fur, so a creature will nice markings may shave it's tail in ego to show off that it's remarkable beauty is also skin deep.

In southern climates the tails are commonly shaved to regulate body temperature. A wealthy creature in the south is one marked by having an unshavbed tail, which means they can afford to artificially cool their dwelling.

The smaller arms have scapulae similar to a Tyrannasaurus Rex, in which the scaulae merge with coracoid, clavicle, and sternum to create a socket for the tiny arm. The scapulae are also thin and small whereas the scapulae for the major arms are large and bulky with heavy muscle.



The sketches above are just a V1 idea, nothing NOTHING is set in stone. I'm just playing about here.


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 1, 2011)

Looks pretty badass, actually. Personally, I think the little extra arms should go, though, or perhaps be moved to the middle and be like regular ol' digitigrade legs like on the back, but with monkey-like feet that can be used for things (or they could be a lot more like the front legs). It'd then be like some big fluffy centipede with a scary-ass second set of jaws and a fierce wolverine vibe to it. Also, what size is it meant to be? I think it'd be a very interesting animal if it were, say, quite large. Bigger than bears, lions, tigers, etc, but not elephant-tall. It'd almost be a cross between a dragon and a mammal, with mammalian features (aside from that inner jaw) with a large, long serpent-like build and way of moving.

And I just love the large pic, standing tall, all happy, intelligent-looking, and otherwise loveable. But I just like to imagine it getting on all fours (or sixes) and being all like BLARGARGHARHGH and shit-your-pants-scary when it's pissed off or hunting or something. :3c

But that's just my idea, fair enough if you're not a fan of it. But are you aiming for something more anthro or feral? Whenever a new "species" is being thought up, I always like to think of it as totally feral.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

They're sorta 3.5-5 foot to the shoulder and 12-21 feet long from nose to tail tip. I think. I don't want to just make them gigantic and god mod everything though. OH MY THING IS BIGGER THAN BLUE WHALE AN IT EATD U

The skull of an adult is generally a foot long, the canine teeth generally 3-6 inches long, the claws are always extended and are 5 or so inches long.



As for the second small arms, as a species they're prone to a genetic disorder in which cartilage growth is hampered, so they lack the second small arms that form during the later parts of gestation and their ears are shrivelly. Lacking the small arms though makes you an untouchable. They're seen as cripples or the products of incest, generally looked down as less than. Lacking the arms can also show which specimens will get joint problems and arthritis earlier than other healthier specimens. However, you can choose to make one (still no name, ha ha) that lacks the second small set of arms upon your choosing. The small set of arms is for tasks that require being more dexterous, such as suturing, jewelry making, and writing. The larger arms and hands can with a lot of effort sloppily do these jobs, but the larger hands just were not meant to function as nimbly.


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## LizardKing (Nov 1, 2011)

So they can give itty bitty babby hugs or MANLY HUGS


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> They're sorta 3.5-5 foot to the shoulder and 12-21 feet long from nose to tail tip. I think. I don't want to just make them gigantic and god mod everything though. OH MY THING IS BIGGER THAN BLUE WHALE AN IT EATD U



Yeah, I can't stand seeing some potentially awesome looking creatures being ruined by being too damn pointlessly large. Big is good when we're talking about making something badass, but not big so it makes them look like there was little real inspiration for creating it other than satisfying the need for vore/macro-related fantasies or being a boss for a videogame. Anyway, that sounds pretty big, but not ridiculously big, a good size, like, big enough to ride but small enough to keep in a stable or something. Not that I'm implying that's what the background for this animal should be or anything, but that's my way of describing the size I envision because I'm silly like that (provided that I know imperial measurements well enough, hohoho).


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Gibby said:


> satisfying the need for vore/macro-related fantasies







WHAT HAVE I DONE
OH GOD


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## LizardKing (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> WHAT HAVE I DONE
> OH GOD



You were doomed from the first post



Deo said:


> They also have really elastic skin allowing them to swallow animals whole like snakes do.



OMG HAWT


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> As for the second small arms, as a species they're prone to a genetic disorder in which cartilage growth is hampered, so they lack the second small arms that form during the later parts of gestation and their ears are shrivelly. Lacking the small arms though makes you an untouchable. They're seen as cripples or the products of incest, generally looked down as less than. Lacking the arms can also show which specimens will get joint problems and arthritis earlier than other healthier specimens. However, you can choose to make one (still no name, ha ha) that lacks the second small set of arms upon your choosing. The small set of arms is for tasks that require being more dexterous, such as suturing, jewelry making, and writing. The larger arms and hands can with a lot of effort sloppily do these jobs, but the larger hands just were not meant to function as nimbly.



Interesting o: It's like you have nearly every single nook and cranny explored here in your idea. And you say I could shoot for an seperate idea myself related to this? Well that's aweshum of you, as I can't help but think of some bird-like variant of this, like, in relation with some kind of wyvern or something.









Deo said:


> WHAT HAVE I DONE
> OH GOD



Lolno, please don't take me of all people too seriously!


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## Smelge (Nov 1, 2011)

Ok, inr esponse to the picture on the last page, the arms look a bit silly. Possibly if you moved them south and more central, a bit like some kind of insect. Also, the lower portion of it needs bulked up. You have a huge upper body and tiny legs.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Ya know, I don't think this whole bipedial/quadrapedial thing works. Maybe just for breif instances or "display" or intimidation it can stand on it's back legs wile using it's tail for support. But as you've said, small back legs make the bipedial thing rediculous.

And I love bulky fronts and tiny backs. Think of giraffes. ;w;







Gibby said:


> Interesting o: It's like you have nearly every  single nook and cranny explored here in your idea. And you say I could  shoot for an seperate idea myself related to this? Well that's aweshum  of you, as I can't help but think of some bird-like variant of this,  like, in relation with some kind of wyvern or something.


Well,  I kinda don't want my species just meshed with other species. Feel free  to make your own, but I'm sorta going for "you can make your own  factually acceptable biological changes to my organism if you want to  use it as a character". However this is no where near ready for any of  that. But I promise you guys that when I'm done I'll make some lineart  and empty ref sheets for all the world to use for free.


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## Fay V (Nov 1, 2011)

Oh god that is gorgeous. Nyeah I wanna take your thingy and just...culturize it and shit. 

anyway a few questions that will seem rather awkward, but they have a point. 
1. I am assuming they are mammalian like with the body heat and stuff...but would they lay eggs like platypi? Or Live birth?
2. What is the general level or intelligence and technology? They look carnivorous, but have they reached a stage of ranching and such, or are they hunter tribes?
3. clothing. I assume they must wear it in some form. probably decorative for the most part. Armor of some sort if they are military like, but  I wanted to know what you were thinking.

edit: I like the tiny arms between big arms. it makes sense to me. I'm also considering how armor and stuff would be able to cover the tiny arms. And how you want the small manipulating hands to be long enough to touch your face in order to carefully care for the sensitive areas of chest and face (assuming heart and lungs are chest area) it looks silly but it works sooo well.


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## Ad Hoc (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


>


Personally I would make the arms a smidge longer. I also think that . . . sort of notch in the muzzle (when shown in profile) is very strange and out of place. Big cats don't have that, and neither do snakes or eels--frankly I can't think of any real animal that has such a muzzle shape, at least not so extremely. Some have protruding brows; the muzzle itself is usually straight or even slightly convex. It does seem to be a common feature on cartoon characters (Scar, Balto, Diego from Ice Age, etc.,) but looks out of place on a mostly realistic animal, to me.

That's just me, though. 

I do really like the thought you're putting into this, though, it looks like these will be very fun monsters when they're completed.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Ad Hoc said:


> Personally I would make the arms a smidge longer. I also think that . . . sort of notch in the muzzle (when shown in profile) is very strange and out of place. Big cats don't have that, and neither do snakes or eels--frankly I can't think of any real animal that has such a muzzle shape, at least not so extremely. Some have protruding brows; the muzzle itself is usually straight or even slightly convex. It does seem to be a common feature on cartoon characters (Scar, Balto, Diego from Ice Age, etc.,) but looks out of place on a mostly realistic animal, to me.
> 
> That's just me, though.
> 
> I do really like the thought you're putting into this, though, it looks like these will be very fun monsters when they're completed.


When I get to drawing it realistically I'll totally keep that in mind. I sorta drew that as a stand in for a hollow noise making ossified protrusion or some sort of fat lump that could be used in territorial display. But everything is so up in the air right now. I don't want to sit down and draw something for real and take that time only to ditch it five minutes later. So I like the discussion, and the making it better before I do more sketching. 


Fay, I kind of imagined them like China. Some really modern cities, but also really meshed small no-tech rural communities. Rural communities or outlier tribes would be more set in older customs and tradition while the more modern dwelling city creatures would have access to technology similar to what we had in the early to mid portion of the Industrial Revolution.


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> Well,  I kinda don't want my species just meshed with other species. Feel free  to make your own, but I'm sorta going for "you can make your own  factually acceptable biological changes to my organism if you want to  use it as a character". However this is no where near ready for any of  that. But I promise you guys that when I'm done I'll make some lineart  and empty ref sheets for all the world to use for free.








Come to think of it, my idea for a wyvern/bird/quadruped/serpentine thing is hardly related to this _at all_. The only thing it could possible have in common is stance, and even that isn't overly likely. Anyhoo, I'll be watching out for more on this thing, and best of luck with it! :3c


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## Fay V (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> When I get to drawing it realistically I'll totally keep that in mind. I sorta drew that as a stand in for a hollow noise making ossified protrusion or some sort of fat lump that could be used in territorial display. But everything is so up in the air right now. I don't want to sit down and draw something for real and take that time only to ditch it five minutes later. So I like the discussion, and the making it better before I do more sketching.
> 
> 
> Fay, I kind of imagined them like China. Some really modern cities, but also really meshed small no-tech rural communities. Rural communities or outlier tribes would be more set in older customs and tradition while the more modern dwelling city creatures would have access to technology similar to what we had in the early to mid portion of the Industrial Revolution.



okay so, global conciousness is industrial revolution era, got it. 

I am not going to make some Anglo Saxony thingies, because you need a culture of "eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow we die" 

Also, eggs or live birth?


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

I think being an egg laying mammal would be cool. I'll have to do a bit more research to see about how the internal organs will mesh, but I like the idea of them being egg laying mammals. I considered marsupials, but I'd rather keep the adults moving, fighting, hunting, and don't want to be all "hurr durr females must stay at home because BABBEE in pouch". Not that such occurs in the wild, but sentient beings would try to protect their young as much as possible.

As for clothing it would be ceremonial, for fashion, or for blatant statements of wealth and power. Armor would only be for the wealthy who could afford it. (probably basic steel plates or heavy leather, I doubt they could do chain mail with those hands). 

"Eat, drink, fight, fuck, and be merry for tomorrow we die"?


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## Fay V (Nov 1, 2011)

The anglo saxons are all about drinking and living it up because tomorrow they would die. It is a culture with no future, they literally had no future tense because they didn't believe in it. 
I'm translating the battle of Maldon where a 60 year old hero had the vikings at bay with one of the best tactical positions ever and said "fuck it, come on over" to fight them fair and square. It is a culture where it is a formal ceremony to get drunk and say what you want to do in the morning...then actually have to hold that up. 
It is my favorite culture ever...also the ladies actually got to fight. Which is bitchin. 

But anyway I imagine they could manage chainmail with tiny arms, but that's not what I'm thinking. I'm thinking the living weapon thing where the weapons and armor have fiddly details


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## Evan of Phrygia (Nov 1, 2011)

Wow.

deo, you win.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 1, 2011)

i think it looks too cat like. Seems more of a chimera than a new species, which most species that are /created/ but I think you should fuse the eel face and the cat face. I drew something but its shitty and i feel bad :/


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## Smelge (Nov 1, 2011)

I had a little rummage around:






I think that chest needs to be deeper, brings the forearms to a bit more prominence. Also allows those pesky organs to fit in. Something like this will need large lungs and heart, so a deeper chest might be beneficial from a biological standpoint. The rear has been maimed about a bit. Just doing a straight down leg makes it look like it has turkey drumsticks. A bit of bend in there as a natural position and elongation of the ankle to the ball of the foot would give it a bit more of a spring to it's stride. Also, it puts the balancing sections of the foot further forward, so standing bipedal would be a bit easier with the tail to counterbalance a bit more.

I'm not sure why I extended the shoulderblades. It looked cool. Also gives a more aggressive posture, like it's permanently hunting something.

The arms don't feel right. They clutter the chest a bit too much. Under the armpits is sensible, but the size of them makes it look a bit stupid. Possibly lower chest might work, at the base of the ribcage. Could have hunting practicalities as well if this thing is large. If something stops still during a chase and the critter runs over the top of it, it can still grab the prey. Or use the arms to hold it while it feasts on the succulent bloody flesh.

Also, it likes lipstick and eyeshadow. Just throwing that one out there.

Just ideas. I'm liking this so far.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Still no fur drawn on the body or tail, just the form. 

Double thumbs seems cool. For my personal one of this species I think I'll toss the mini arms. I sort of like them and sort of don't. Thoughts on this? 
I changed the bridge of the muzzle to be more cat-like, and extended the body to be more eel like. Made the rib cage larger too. The mouth is still fucked up, I'll do an overlay with the skull later to figure that out.


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## Fay V (Nov 1, 2011)

I love my character with two thumbs on his feet. it's adorable and weird. 
I think the little arms should be a bit longer, able to reach the face and muzzle or something. I dunno, this makes me want to work with skahunds now.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

Longer arms. And the armless genetic mishap version.


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## iconmaster (Nov 1, 2011)

What you have there Deo is simply amazing. Maybe someday I will have te ability to come up with such original concepts. Anywho, a suggestion: The tiny arms are a cool idea, but they look odd in the center like that. Maybe make them larger and/or more to the sides? Other than that, this new species looks to be going somewhere!

EDIT: Looks like I was ninja'd by Deo's sketch. Maybe below the big arms? I don't know.


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

I just wanted to try some colors out on it. So this is a shaved, southern living, creature that lacks the second pair of arms.
I really need to draw out the fluffy furred version.


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## Ad Hoc (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> Longer arms. And the armless genetic mishap version.


The face and arms look much better. The tail looks distinctly reptilian, though. Earlier you mentioned that they're thin but covered in thick fur, but right now it looks like a solid lump of flesh, almost like an unusually flexible dinosaur tail. Doesn't seem like a dino tail would suit an animal with locomotion similar to a bear/hyena. (I assume it moves like a bear/hyena, given the long forelegs/short hind legs. Guessing correctly? Unless it's more like a tree anteater, those have thick tails, albeit for climbing.)


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## Deo (Nov 1, 2011)

The tail is thin, like an eel. Locomotion I'm thinking is more like a large cat (when out of the water) with bursts of speed (35-40 mph?) for a few short minutes to catch prey.


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## Fay V (Nov 1, 2011)

You might considered a mane that goes the length of the spine, like on oriental dragons. Longer and more prmoninant on males. It could be something they fiddle with, crop, cut, whatever but I think it would be reminiscent of the eel fin thing on the back.


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## LizardKing (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> [noparse]
> 
> 
> 
> ...



When the moon hits your eye like a big pizza pie...

(Sorry)

Also this thing is starting to look pretty badass. Nice job.


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## Ad Hoc (Nov 1, 2011)

Deo said:


> The tail is thin, like an eel. Locomotion I'm thinking is more like a large cat (when out of the water) with bursts of speed (35-40 mph?) for a few short minutes to catch prey.


It does not seem sensible that an animal with a body like a bear/hyena (long front legs, short hind legs, compact body) would move like a big cat, or at least move efficiently. The only big cat that I'm aware of with a similar body is the tiger (longer forelegs than hind legs; the body is still longish and straight-backed though), funnily enough, but even then it's not so extreme, the leg length difference is hardly noticeable without a yardstick. I would reconsider your anatomy if you want something more pantherine. I also suspect that making the body longer would also make it more recognizably aquatic (tigers are one of the only semi-aquatic big cats and they are very long-bodied; also compare otters); I would never have guessed this was an aquatic hunter just looking at it, and had to go back and re-read the OP to remember.

EDIT: Furthermore, why does an aquatic mammal have long ears? Tigers and fishing cats are the only semi-aquatic cats, and they both have proportionately small ears. The same is reflected in other aquatic/semi-aquatic animals such as otters, muskrats, capybaras, beavers, etc., Furthermore, why the smilodon teeth? Smilodon looked fierce but its bite was weak and its fangs fragile. The general consensus that is that they were for piercing the neck arteries of its prey, but such an attack with such tools required nearly surgical precision; meaning, most likely it hunted cooperatively, with several hunters holding the prey down while a single cat did the coup de grace. So, do these hunt cooperatively? How did an animal which evolved to swallow prey whole share a meal with fellow hunters? Surely they can figure it out now, but how did that evolve in the first place? 

Or, perhaps they most hunt small prey, or kill their prey by drowning it like a crocodile, and the teeth are only for show. P: 


Not meaning to be nitpicky, I do like the animal and I'd like to see this come to fruition, but what is the function behind the form?


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## Roose Hurro (Nov 2, 2011)

Fay V said:


> How would you feel about a second set of arms? I dunno way but after looking at the jaw stuff, all I can think of *is just this second tiny set for smaller more refined movements and gestures*.



I have a few species like this, the Shesh, the "Deek" and the Kah'Saun.




Deo said:


> OMG. WE HAVE A MIND LINK.
> I was toying with that too. *I was just trying to figure out how the scapulas would mesh when it was running.* I think it'd be really neat, and if I did that I'd change their thick hands into more bear-like hands (to help them stun/knock unconscious/kill prey).



I solved that problem by designing the limbs to just fold against the chest when my creatures run, or to only lightly touch down (to provide brief support/balance) while the main forelimbs lift in a leaping type run after prey.




Deo said:


> In colder climates it's a sign of wealth and power to have a shaved tail. The tails are thin and lose body heat rapidly and the long hair on them is used as a blanket to wrap the animal in. Shaved tails can also be a mark of beauty, as markings are on the skin and not just the fur, so a creature will nice markings may shave it's tail in ego to show off that it's remarkable beauty is also skin deep.
> 
> In southern climates the tails are commonly shaved to regulate body temperature. A wealthy creature in the south is one marked by having an unshavbed tail, which means they can afford to artificially cool their dwelling.
> 
> ...



That's how it works, come up with ideas, paly with them to see what works and or what you like.  When I created my Nism ( http://s23.photobucket.com/albums/b...on=view&current=DisneyInspiredDeen_Sketch.png ), I knew I wanted them to be mammals, but I didn't want females to have external mammary glands... so I gave the species "milk tongues", long, thin, retractable, feelerish tongues, one on each side of their "normal" tongues, that secrete "milk" when the young suckle.  Heh... also decided both sexes have them, and can nurse the young.

Also, you'll notice that feathered "shroudruff" on the male Nism in that pic... it is not only for display, to attract a female's attention, but also serves as shade and cover for newborn young.  The father can "hide" them under his shroudruff, and carry them about safe and sound.  So, those feathers are not just decorative, but practical.

What you have is a very good start here... keep it up, from what little you've provided, they look and sound interesting.




Deo said:


> As for the second small arms, as a species they're prone to a genetic disorder in which cartilage growth is hampered, so they lack the second small arms that form during the later parts of gestation and their ears are shrivelly. Lacking the small arms though makes you an untouchable. They're seen as cripples or the products of incest, generally looked down as less than. Lacking the arms can also show which specimens will get joint problems and arthritis earlier than other healthier specimens. However, you can choose to make one (still no name, ha ha) that lacks the second small set of arms upon your choosing. *The small set of arms is for tasks that require being more dexterous, such as suturing, jewelry making, and writing. The larger arms and hands can with a lot of effort sloppily do these jobs, but the larger hands just were not meant to function as nimbly.*



Have you come up with an evolutionary reasoning for this?




Deo said:


> Well,  I kinda don't want my species just meshed with other species. Feel free  to make your own, but I'm sorta going for "you can make your own  factually acceptable biological changes to my organism if you want to  use it as a character". However this is no where near ready for any of  that. *But I promise you guys that when I'm done I'll make some lineart  and empty ref sheets for all the world to use for free.*



Heh... sounds great, looking forward to it.




Fay V said:


> Oh god that is gorgeous. Nyeah I wanna take your thingy and just...culturize it and shit.
> 
> anyway a few questions that will seem rather awkward, but they have a point.
> 1. I am assuming they are mammalian like with the body heat and stuff...but would they lay eggs like platypi? Or Live birth?
> ...



That was my idea for the second set of arms on my three listed species, a set of limbs specialized for grooming, though, of course, they could have other uses.  Oh, a cultural bit:  Kah'Saun tend to keep their second set of arms covered in public, especially when offworld.




Deo said:


> Fay, I kind of imagined them like China. Some really modern cities, but also really meshed small no-tech rural communities. Rural communities or outlier tribes would be more set in older customs and tradition while the more modern dwelling city creatures would have access to technology similar to what we had in the early to mid portion of the Industrial Revolution.



Sounds like a good era, lots of room for adventure...




Deo said:


> I think being an egg laying mammal would be cool.



Sounds like you want them to be monotremes.




Deo said:


> As for clothing *it would be ceremonial, for fashion, or for blatant statements of wealth and power*. Armor would only be for the wealthy who could afford it. (probably basic steel plates or heavy leather, I doubt they could do chain mail with those hands).



Meaning the "common" people would be naked.  For Roose's species, I set it up that children tend to run around in the buff, unless they need the pockets, while adults are more commonly dressed, though it has nothing to do with wealth or power in their culture.




Deo said:


> Double thumbs seems cool.



This is an alternative:  http://www.montgomerycollege.edu/Departments/planet/Science_Club/NatHisMuseum/23 koala hand.JPG




iconmaster said:


> What you have there Deo is simply amazing. Maybe someday I will have te ability to come up with such original concepts. Anywho, a suggestion: The tiny arms are a cool idea, but they look odd in the center like that. Maybe make them larger and/or more to the sides? Other than that, this new species looks to be going somewhere!
> 
> EDIT: Looks like I was ninja'd by Deo's sketch. *Maybe below the big arms?* I don't know.



What about neck arms?


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## No-Will-To-Live (Jun 1, 2019)

Deo said:


> In colder climates it's a sign of wealth and power to have a shaved tail. The tails are thin and lose body heat rapidly and the long hair on them is used as a blanket to wrap the animal in. Shaved tails can also be a mark of beauty, as markings are on the skin and not just the fur, so a creature will nice markings may shave it's tail in ego to show off that it's remarkable beauty is also skin deep.
> 
> In southern climates the tails are commonly shaved to regulate body temperature. A wealthy creature in the south is one marked by having an unshavbed tail, which means they can afford to artificially cool their dwelling.
> 
> ...


Now make sure you make a fursuit of this, it would look awesome. Do you have any tips because I wanted to make a species for myself and I want to know if it needs to be complicated or can it be simple yet unique enough to be a great species.


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## Tendo64 (Jun 2, 2019)

No-Will-To-Live said:


> What I want to know is,what is original? I want to make an original species as well but it is a bit of a struggle because what is original? I really want to make one of my own instead of just being the next wolf I want to be an individual.


My dude, did you read the date this topic was made? That person hasn't been on in over seven years, don't think you'll be getting an answer any time soon.

By the way, necro-ing threads is kinda frowned upon here for this reason. If the last time something was brought up was over a year ago, just make a new thread.


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## No-Will-To-Live (Jun 2, 2019)

Tendo64 said:


> My dude, did you read the date this topic was made? That person hasn't been on in over seven years, don't think you'll be getting an answer any time soon.
> 
> By the way, necro-ing threads is kinda frowned upon here for this reason. If the last time something was brought up was over a year ago, just make a new thread.


Oh, whoops excuse my out of place comments.


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