# Transexuals?



## Chainy (Aug 19, 2009)

What's your opinion on them?


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## Fuzzeh-Richard (Aug 19, 2009)

I find them Okey. If they wanna change, it's their choice.


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## Torrijos-sama (Aug 19, 2009)

They exist.


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## MaNiac (Aug 19, 2009)

I understand their position. I have no problem with them.


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## Fuzzle (Aug 19, 2009)

I usually prefer polyunsaturatedsexuals.


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## ~secret~ (Aug 19, 2009)

No more fucked up than the rest of us.


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## Aurali (Aug 19, 2009)

Can't really give an unbiased opinion about them XD

but to each their own.


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## Runefox (Aug 19, 2009)

I admire their drive and their deep insight on their inner selves; I fully support them, and I think of them no differently than anyone else. If you have a penis and you identify female, I will call you "her" and "she"; Conversely, if you don't have one and you identify male, I will call you "him" and "he".


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## Nocturne (Aug 19, 2009)

I'll just post what I've said before.

http://forums.furaffinity.net/showpost.php?p=1139179&postcount=66


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## Chainy (Aug 19, 2009)

I respect them fully and accept their choices. if someone wants to become a different gender, they should be able to. Besides, It's interesting to try different perspecitives. Heh, if I became a girl my best freind would FREAK OUT.


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## Ratte (Aug 19, 2009)

I always thought they were kinda cool.  :3


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## Piccard (Aug 19, 2009)

I find it strange that some people would go to such extents to change their genders.
But hey, if you want to change your sex, just do it.


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## CaptainCool (Aug 19, 2009)

i can totally understand them. that must be pretty rough =/


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## Aden (Aug 19, 2009)

You gotta do what you gotta do. I don't get the prejudice against them at all, to be honest.


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## Sparticle (Aug 19, 2009)

Sure it takes all sorts to make the world.
Variety is the spice of life


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## Kaamos (Aug 19, 2009)

They're pretty cool. I don't understand why anyone would hate them.


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## Chainy (Aug 19, 2009)

I understand them too. herms, transexuals, I respect just about anyone. ^^ 

Sometimes I think of changing my gender. I feel a lot of pain sometimes... it gets annoying.  But anyway, It is rough. The change takes a god few monthes. But to some it's worth it


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## Grimfang (Aug 19, 2009)

Pretty much what everyone is saying. It shouldn't be someone else's concern.


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## Gavrill (Aug 19, 2009)

I'm not happy with being female to be honest. But I don't know if the change from female to male is worth it.


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## Ratte (Aug 19, 2009)

Shenzebo said:


> I'm not happy with being female to be honest. But I don't know if the change from female to male is worth it.



DON'T WORRY SHENZI WE CAN BOTH BE BUTCH TOGETHERRRRR~


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## Vaelarsa (Aug 19, 2009)

They want to be the other gender.

/myopinion


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## Gavrill (Aug 19, 2009)

Ratte said:


> DON'T WORRY SHENZI WE CAN BOTH BE BUTCH TOGETHERRRRR~


BUT I WANT A PENIS


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## Aurali (Aug 19, 2009)

Shenzebo said:


> BUT I WANT A PENIS



Trade ya


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## Ratte (Aug 19, 2009)

Shenzebo said:


> BUT I WANT A PENIS



:[


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## Jack (Aug 19, 2009)

I have a freind on FS who wants the surgery. (& probly will)
not one of my turn-on's, but things like that make no difference to me.


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## HoneyPup (Aug 19, 2009)

They're alright.
It's their life and if they feel uncomfortable as one gender, I see nothing wrong with changing to fit what they feel they should be.


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## Azure (Aug 19, 2009)

I think it's weird and futile, but whatever floats your damn boat.  I won't change the pronouns around though.  Looks like a man, is a man, same for women.


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## Gavrill (Aug 19, 2009)

Eli said:


> Trade ya


Haha, we should totally trade x3


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## Nargle (Aug 19, 2009)

Fuzzle said:


> I usually prefer polyunsaturatedsexuals.



Lol

To the OP: Indifferent, I guess? I may identify, though. I sometimes feel sort of gender-neutral. It's not the same thing as being butch/tomboyish or wanting to become a male. In fact, my outward appearance is very feminine. I just feel some gray areas when it comes to gender.


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## nobu (Aug 19, 2009)

Runefox said:


> I admire their drive and their deep insight on their inner selves; I fully support them, and I think of them no differently than anyone else. If you have a penis and you identify female, I will call you "her" and "she"; Conversely, if you don't have one and you identify male, I will call you "him" and "he".



Well put.
I've met some really really convincing pre-op tv's, and all i have to say is warn a fella, please. *shudder*


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## Kryn (Aug 19, 2009)

I think people should be able to do whatever they want with their own bodies. I'd totally be a friend to someone who was transsexual but I dunno If i would ever go any further than that, just seems a little weird.


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## KaiFox (Aug 19, 2009)

I could care less about them.  It's a choice they make, and all the more power to them.


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## DiveBomberBat (Aug 19, 2009)

This thread makes me happy.


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## Ackslawsin (Aug 19, 2009)

I'm totally okay with it. Someone identifies with the other sex (not gender, gender is a sociological thing. Society sets up a gender image and... you all know this) then it's brilliant that they can swap to the other sex. It's a pity that the operations are so lengthy and not all that great.


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## ArielMT (Aug 19, 2009)

Might change how hot I think you look, but it won't in the least change what I think of you as a person.  This philosophy of mine is actually being put to the test by my former sis-in-law (now FTM).


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## TDK (Aug 19, 2009)

Could care less, it's a personal thing that dosen't affect me. Actually I will give them a clap for what their doing. It takes a lot of balls to do a sex change, thats basically saying that God made a mistake and your correcting him, it's like you using White-Out over your teacher's notes in school.


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## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

I think people will make their own choices but I'm never going to understand why someone would want to become the opposite sex.  Even if you identify with the opposite sex I don't see why you'd feel the need to have to change.  Of course I'm not a tranny so I can't relate.

If you're a guy and you're femme I don't see any problem. Why would someone feel so conflicted about their gender they would want to change it?  Can't they just be who they are?  Also, the majority of the time it just doesn't end up looking very natural.  Some people can pull it off but the good majority of times I think the person looked much better as they naturally are.

I have friends who have gone through this and that's basically what I tell them.  I don't understand but I'll support my friends in whatever they chose to do with their life.


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## Runefox (Aug 19, 2009)

AzurePhoenix said:


> I think it's weird and futile, but whatever floats your damn boat.  I won't change the pronouns around though.  Looks like a man, is a man, same for women.



XD So basically, if you're a woman and you look like a man, you're a man, and vice-versa?


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## furrygamer84 (Aug 19, 2009)

I think they are just like any other regular person and have the right to do what they want. but I have seen sex change operations and it just seems like mutilation to their body. plus the changed penis/vagina doesnt even function like a normal one, so I just dont get why they would want to change.


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## Lucy Bones (Aug 19, 2009)

I'm really not the biggest fan of transexuals. I feel you are what you are, no use going about changing that. 

Please don't go ranting on me because of this. It makes me feel bad. >3>


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

It can make for an awkward relationship.


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## Aurali (Aug 19, 2009)

Ahkmill said:


> Please don't go ranting on me because of this. It makes me feel bad. >3>



Not really wise to say your opinion and say "don't respond to it." It just never works.


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## 8-bit (Aug 19, 2009)

Fuzzle said:


> I usually prefer polyunsaturatedsexuals.



Those are just as unhealthy as transexuals. (OLOLOL)

Yeah, I don't care. But chopping off your penis and getting new boobs/getting a penis (and whatever else it is girls do to switch) shouldn't be enough.  They should be able to get a complete body makeover. Like,"This is what you would look like if you were born(whatever)."  And then make it so.


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## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

Ahkmill said:


> I'm really not the biggest fan of transexuals. I feel you are what you are, no use going about changing that.
> 
> Please don't go ranting on me because of this. It makes me feel bad. >3>



I agree with this though I only stated it in so many words in my last post...

It's kind of like saying "I'm really a wolf but trapped in a human's body!"  Why can't you just accept who you are?  You're human and whatever gender you happen to be born as.  I think I'll never understand this one.


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## Lucy Bones (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> I agree with this though I only stated it in so many words in my last post...
> 
> It's kind of like saying "I'm really a wolf but trapped in a human's body!"  Why can't you just accept who you are?  You're human and whatever gender you happen to be born as.  I think I'll never understand this one.


Yeah. I mean, if your born a guy, but you don't like girls, THERE'S SOMETHING FOR YOU. It's called being gay. It costs less than a sex change operation.


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## Aurali (Aug 19, 2009)

Ahkmill said:


> Yeah. I mean, if your born a guy, but you don't like girls, THERE'S SOMETHING FOR YOU. It's called being gay. It costs less than a sex change operation.



Now this is a FALLACY. Transgender has nothing to do with sexuality. It's a dislike of one's own gender, not one's attraction to the opposite sex.


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## Shindo (Aug 19, 2009)

i like dicks on guys
but whatever
they may do as they please


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

Ahkmill said:


> Yeah. I mean, if your born a guy, but you don't like girls, THERE'S SOMETHING FOR YOU. It's called being gay. It costs less than a sex change operation.


 Sex change operations are for people who don't want to risk a failed attempt of coming out of the closet, or for those missing the entire package.
"Mom, why does my birth certificate list me as male?"


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## Lucy Bones (Aug 19, 2009)

Eli said:


> Now this is a FALLACY. Transgender has nothing to do with sexuality. It's a dislike of one's own gender, not one's attraction to the opposite sex.



Heh, that sounded like phallic when I first read it... *Slaps self*

I don't really understand why someone wouldn't like they're own gender, though...



Shindo said:


> i like dicks on guys
> but whatever
> they may do as they please


^This


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## Aurali (Aug 19, 2009)

Ahkmill said:


> I don't really understand why someone wouldn't like they're own gender, though...



No. and to be honest. You never will. It's a mental issue. Which really can't be solved any other way.



gulielmus said:


> Sex change operations are for people who don't want to risk a failed attempt of coming out of the closet, or for those missing the entire package.
> "Mom, why does my birth certificate list me as male?"



Still false >.>


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## Nocturne (Aug 19, 2009)

Ahkmill said:


> Heh, that sounded like phallic when I first read it... *Slaps self*
> 
> I don't really understand why someone wouldn't like they're own gender, though...



This is why you are not transgendered.  Is it REALLY so hard of a stretch of imagination to go from people liking the same gender instead of the opposite to people mentally being the opposite gender?  No, I don't tihnk it is.



gulielmus said:


> Sex change operations are for people who don't want to risk a failed attempt of coming out of the closet, or for those missing the entire package.
> "Mom, why does my birth certificate list me as male?"



I find this post to be quite ignorant of the subject.


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

Eli said:


> No. and to be honest. You never will. It's a mental issue. Which really can't be solved any other way.
> 
> 
> 
> Still false >.>


If you can't get past that feeling that you just aren't right, give up and call the surgeon.


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## ArielMT (Aug 19, 2009)

Being a transsexual is about disagreeing with the sex you were born as so strongly that you're willing to go under the knife to fix it.  It has nothing to do with what sorts of sexual attraction to others you have, or if you're sexually attracted to anyone at all.


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## Lucy Bones (Aug 19, 2009)

ArielMT said:


> Being a transsexual is about disagreeing with the sex you were born as so strongly that you're willing to go under the knife to fix it.  It has nothing to do with what sorts of sexual attraction to others you have, or if you're sexually attracted to anyone at all.



I pretty much take this in as people who are so unhappy that they didn't get their way, that they'd mutilate their own bodies... Which pretty much makes me think, "Spoiled little punks..."


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## Aurali (Aug 19, 2009)

gulielmus said:


> If you can't get past that feeling that you just aren't right, give up and call the surgeon.



That's basically it. It eats at you until you do decide to take the plunge.


Ahkmill said:


> I pretty much take this in as people who are so unhappy that they didn't get their way, that they'd mutilate their own bodies... Which pretty much makes me think, "Spoiled little punks..."


... No.


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## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

Eli said:


> Now this is a FALLACY. Transgender has nothing to do with sexuality. It's a dislike of one's own gender, not one's attraction to the opposite sex.



But why dislike your own gender?  If it's not to cope with one's sexual identity there has to be certain traits inherently associated with that gender one does not like.  Still, I can't really grasp it.  There are guys who look or act "femme" and I don't see why that's a problem.  Honestly, I think it's cute a lot of the time.


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## Nocturne (Aug 19, 2009)

Ahkmill said:


> I pretty much take this in as people who are so unhappy that they didn't get their way, that they'd mutilate their own bodies... Which pretty much makes me think, "Spoiled little punks..."



I'd be careful about saying things like this when you yourself don't understand the perspective.

We could also open up some more gay reeducation camps while we're at it.  Those spoiled punks, wanting to get their way and date the same sex 9.9



Ricky said:


> But why dislike your own gender?  If it's not to cope with one's sexual identity there has to be certain traits inherently associated with that gender one does not like.  Still, I can't really grasp it.  There are guys who look or act "femme" and I don't see why that's a problem.  Honestly, I think it's cute a lot of the time.



Its not about not liking a particular gender.  It's about self identity.  If you woke up tomorrow physically female, would you be ok with that?


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## Lucy Bones (Aug 19, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> Its not about not liking a particular gender.  It's about self identity.  If you woke up tomorrow physically female, would you be ok with that?



I'd be like, "Wow, that's new..." But I would accept it. If that's the way the cookie crumbles, so be it.

And now I shall extract myself from this thread before I get on anybody's hate list.


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## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> If you woke up tomorrow physically female, would you be ok with that?



No, because that wouldn't happen. I've lived my whole life as a dude (and I like it that way).  If I was born as a female it would be different.



Nocturne said:


> Its not about not liking a particular gender.  It's about self identity.



Again, it's the same thing to me as saying you're really a wolf trapped in a human body.  I just don't buy it.


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## Aurali (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> No, because that wouldn't happen. I've lived my whole life as a dude (and I like it that way).  If I was born as a female it would be different.
> 
> Again, it's the same thing to me as saying you're really a wolf trapped in a human body.  I just don't buy it.


Different Scenario. If a guy came to you and told you that he was going to make you female. and YOU HAD TO DO IT... you'd get pissed and tell the guy off.. you wouldn't just accept what he was going to do to you.


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## Nocturne (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> No, because that wouldn't happen. I've lived my whole life as a dude (and I like it that way).  If I was born as a female it would be different.
> 
> Again, it's the same thing to me as saying you're really a wolf trapped in a human body.  I just don't buy it.



The difference between the male and female paths of development can amount to a single gene product.  There are thousands of ways this pathway could be disrupted to varying degrees.  The difference between males and females is caused by very slight modifications during development.  This is in no way comparable to the difference between a human and a wolf.  Again, why is it so much of a logical leap to believe someone could be born mentally the opposite gender then to believe one could be born attracted to the same gender?


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## ArielMT (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> No, because that wouldn't happen. I've lived my whole life as a dude (and I like it that way).



But imagine that you did one day wake up female.  How far would you be willing to go to be male again?



Ricky said:


> If I was born as a female it would be different.



Only so far that the thought experiment would go the other way.


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## Aden (Aug 19, 2009)

Some Transexual said:
			
		

> I identify with myself as the opposite sex





Ricky said:


> you're really a wolf trapped in a human body.



One of these things is more of a stretch than the other. :V


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

Is it just me, or is this thread going down the slippery slope to a lock?


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## twelvestring (Aug 19, 2009)

I got nothing against mahus.(transexuals)But does it seem to anyone else that they mostly have the same career? You know, the oldest career.


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## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

Eli said:


> Different Scenario. If a guy came to you and told you that he was going to make you female. and YOU HAD TO DO IT... you'd get pissed and tell the guy off.. you wouldn't just accept what he was going to do to you.



Um...  Yeah, but just because I'd think he's a weirdo and would want anyone who suggests something like that to back the hell away...  lol

I get your point though.  I think I could accept being either a male or female if that's what I was.  If I were a female I'd probably be a pretty butch acting chick who likes dudes but that's also a lot to do with hormones, so if I were female that could change.  The bottom line is I really do believe I could accept myself as either gender.  I'm just pretty masculine though so picturing myself as a chick seems pretty weird as it stands.  I'm sure it would work out though if it had to.



Nocturne said:


> The difference between the male and female paths of development can amount to a single gene product. There are thousands of ways this pathway could be disrupted to varying degrees. The difference between males and females is caused by very slight modifications during development. This is in no way comparable to the difference between a human and a wolf. Again, why is it so much of a logical leap to believe someone could be born mentally the opposite gender then to believe one could be born attracted to the same gender?



That was just an analogy -- maybe there is a better one out there but the bottom line is you are born a certain way and you should hopefully be able to accept yourself for whom you are.  Even if you feel girly and you have a dick that just makes you a "girly"-guy.

Oh, so here's one.  What if I told you I was born white but I'm really a black person inside and I want to become a bro.  Wouldn't you think that's kinda weird?  And that would stand up to your DNA argument as well.


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## Aden (Aug 19, 2009)

gulielmus said:


> Is it just me, or is this thread going down the slippery slope to a lock?



As if everyone didn't see it coming from the start.


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## DiveBomberBat (Aug 19, 2009)

twelvestring said:


> I got nothing against mahus.(transexuals)But does it seem to anyone else that they mostly have the same career? You know, the oldest career.



Did you just compare transgenders to prostitutes?


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## ArielMT (Aug 19, 2009)

gulielmus said:


> Is it just me, or is this thread going down the slippery slope to a lock?



I hope not.  We're still on topic, and we're not hurling insults at each other.


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

twelvestring said:


> I got nothing against mahus.(transexuals)But does it seem to anyone else that they mostly have the same career? You know, the oldest career.


Tranny hunters?


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## Nocturne (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> That was just an analogy -- maybe there is a better one out there but the bottom line is you are born a certain way and you should hopefully be able to accept yourself for who you are.  Even if you feel girly and you have a dick that just makes you a "girly"-guy.
> 
> Oh, so here's one.  What if I told you I was born white but I'm really a black person inside and I want to become a bro.  Wouldn't you think that's kinda weird?  And that would stand up to your DNA argument as well.



No, it wouldn't.  The race difference to which you refer is not the biological difference, but the cultural difference, in other words the cultural artifact of race and not the biological difference.  While gender roles are cultural in basis, transexualism goes beyond wanting to be seen as a member of a specific gender role.  Again it has to do with self identity.


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## 8-bit (Aug 19, 2009)

I thought this would have ended already.


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## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> No, it wouldn't.  The race difference to which you refer is not the biological difference, but the cultural difference, in other words the cultural artifact of race and not the biological difference.  While gender roles are cultural in basis, transexualism goes beyond wanting to be seen as a member of a specific gender role.  Again it has to do with self identity.



There is both a biological and a cultural counterpart to each of these scenarios.  Either one you could say is part of one's identity.

Do you think that it's a physical or a cultural basis that someone would want to change like this?  For example is it one's personality and trying to fit it into society, or is it an actual physical distaste for one's own genetailia?


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## Aurali (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> Do you think that it's a physical or a cultural basis that someone would want to change like this?  For example is it one's personality and trying to fit it into society, or is it an actual physical distaste for one's own genetailia?



Both!


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## DiveBomberBat (Aug 19, 2009)

It's not just about the genitalia. It's about being who you feel like you are inside.


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## Lobo Roo (Aug 19, 2009)

They exist, and there's nothing wrong with it. As you can see, my gender is listed as trans! For me, it simply means I consider myself gender nuetral, leaning towards male - so I'm not transsexual, but I'm totally in their corner.


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

DiveBomberBat said:


> It's not just about the genitalia. It's about being who you feel like you are inside.


That's how I remember it being described.
Kinda like the "I'm a wolf in a man's body" but not so crazy sounding.


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## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

DiveBomberBat said:


> It's not just about the genitalia. It's about being who you feel like you are inside.



*nods*  I guess I just won't understand it >.<

That's ok, though -- like I said I don't have any problem with people who chose to go down this path and it's their choice so I don't really need to understand it to begin with.


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## 8-bit (Aug 19, 2009)

It takes a lot of courage to take a knife to the crotch.


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> it's their choice so I don't really need to understand it to begin with.


It's sad that some people don't get that.


			
				8-bit said:
			
		

> It takes a lot of courage to take a knife to the crotch.


No, vodka works just fine enough.


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## DiveBomberBat (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> *nods*  I guess I just won't understand it >.<
> 
> That's ok, though -- like I said I don't have any problem with people who chose to go down this path and it's their choice so I don't really need to understand it to begin with.



Kudos to you for respecting that opinion and choice.


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## twelvestring (Aug 19, 2009)

Lobo Roo said:


> They exist, and there's nothing wrong with it. As you can see, my gender is listed as trans! For me, it simply means I consider myself gender nuetral, leaning towards male - so I'm not transsexual, but I'm totally in their corner.


okay, now I'm confused.(this happens to me alot)The difference between transexual and transgender is...?


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## 8-bit (Aug 19, 2009)

gulielmus said:


> No, vodka works just fine enough.




OLOLOL, Pain Olympics.


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## Lukar (Aug 19, 2009)

Lol, I don't have anything against them. =3


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

8-bit said:


> OLOLOL, Pain Olympics.


LALALA Can't hear you...


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## 8-bit (Aug 19, 2009)

gulielmus said:


> LALALA Can't hear you...





OLOLOL, PAIN  OLYMPICS!!!!!


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## Lobo Roo (Aug 19, 2009)

twelvestring said:


> okay, now I'm confused.(this happens to me alot)The difference between transexual and transgender is...?



Oh god, I asked for that, didn't I? There are so many terms under the "transgender umbrella" that I can't keep up with them myself!

The simplest answer I can give you is that transgender is a more general term for anyone who deviates from traditional gender, in whatever way. Transsexual is generally used to refer to people who have actually had operations to change their physical sex from one to the other.

For me, I feel more gender nuetral than anything, and maybe leaning towards masculine. I was born with a female body, though, and I don't plan on having surgery. Really, the terms are so confusing at this point that they drive me nuts....other than very simple answers, I'm not much help. I generally just go with transgender, or genderqueer and leave it at that.


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

8-bit said:


> OLOLOL, PAIN  OLYMPICS!!!!!


Apologies to anyone who tried to google this and came up on youtube and...


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## 8-bit (Aug 19, 2009)

<----- (not sorry)


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

My opinion can be summarized as such: go do what you want, I don't care.


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## Azure (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> *nods*  I guess I just won't understand it >.<
> 
> That's ok, though -- like I said I don't have any problem with people who chose to go down this path and it's their choice so I don't really need to understand it to begin with.


You either, huh?


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## Dreaming (Aug 19, 2009)

They are ok, the ones that are out about it in your face all the time can get annoying though.


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

DreamerHusky said:


> They are ok, the ones that are out about it in your face all the time can get annoying though.


Isn't that true for any demographic?


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## Runefox (Aug 19, 2009)

There are so many definitions of gender that it's pretty difficult to really contain it. There's the traditional male and female, but there are also a menagerie of intersexed genders (under the intersex/genderqueer umbrella term), and then also transgender, which is when the physical and emotional genders don't match - I suppose you could consider it a form of intersex/genderqueer, manifesting in the mind instead of body.

It's easy to look at it as a black-and-white, but it simply isn't - Neither in mind nor body. After all, we all come from the same genetic pool, and a matter of chromosomes is all that differs between male and female during conception. There's still so much about even the human body that we don't know, let alone the mind and, if you believe in it, the soul.


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## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

Runefox said:


> There are so many definitions of gender that it's pretty difficult to really contain it. There's the traditional male and female, but there are also a menagerie of intersexed genders (under the intersex/genderqueer umbrella term), and then also transgender, which is when the physical and emotional genders don't match - I suppose you could consider it a form of intersex/genderqueer, manifesting in the mind instead of body.
> 
> It's easy to look at it as a black-and-white, but it simply isn't - Neither in mind nor body. After all, we all come from the same genetic pool, and a matter of chromosomes is all that differs between male and female during conception. There's still so much about even the human body that we don't know, let alone the mind and, if you believe in it, the soul.


Don't forget the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_gender


----------



## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

Boys have a penis.  Girls have a vagina.


----------



## Liam (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> Boys have a penis.  Girls have a vagina.


That was as relevant as what the boy said.   I like it.  :V


----------



## Ricky (Aug 19, 2009)

gulielmus said:


> That was as relevant as what the boy said.   I like it.  :V



I thought maybe some people were confused


----------



## Nocturne (Aug 19, 2009)

Ricky said:


> *nods*  I guess I just won't understand it >.<
> 
> That's ok, though -- like I said I don't have any problem with people who chose to go down this path and it's their choice so I don't really need to understand it to begin with.



That's all that people really need I think.  Even if someone doesn't understand it, if they have an open mind about it, that's fine.


----------



## Hir (Aug 19, 2009)

I honestly don't really care.


----------



## furrygamer84 (Aug 20, 2009)

Just thought about this, everyone should refer to the episode of south park called mr. Garrisons fancy new vagina.

Mr. Garrison gets a sex change into a woman, then kyle is to short and jewish to become a basketball player so he gets an operation to make him tall and black. Then kyles dad goes to sue the doctor, but then the doctor convinces him to get an operation to change into a dolphin cause he loves dolphins.

Moral of they story is the operation will not actually turn you into a woman / black guy / dolphin. You are still a man or woman with a mutilated body


----------



## Asswings (Aug 20, 2009)

You best be trollin', furrygamer84. 


Anyways, I admire their courage to be who they feel they should be inside, it takes guts to do something that so many people will look down on you and harass you for. And I've found that the ones I know a lot of times have richer personalities, because they allow said personalities. 

As to what they have 'down there'? Why should I fucking care? It's not like it has anything to do with me whatsoever. I'm going to treat you the same as I treat everyone else, whether you have a penis, a vagina, both, neither, or a pet mouse grafted to your crotch with SCIENCE.


----------



## furrygamer84 (Aug 20, 2009)

I'm not saying I have anything against them, but I have heard somewhere that some of the people that have gotten the operation have regretted it because the "equipment" doesn't work quite well down there


----------



## Shark_the_raptor (Aug 20, 2009)

Chainy said:


> What's your opinion on them?



Indifferent.  Whatever they want to do, it's none of my business.


----------



## Irreverent (Aug 20, 2009)

Shark_the_raptor said:


> Indifferent.  Whatever they want to do, it's none of my business.



Same.


----------



## Shino (Aug 20, 2009)

I somehow feel inclined to make some sort of humorous refrence to Tim Curry in Rocky Horror...

Eh. Personally, I'm indifferent.


----------



## Runefox (Aug 20, 2009)

furrygamer84 said:


> I'm not saying I have anything against them, but I have heard somewhere that some of the people that have gotten the operation have regretted it because the "equipment" doesn't work quite well down there



Actually, from what I've read, modern surgery can make it very convincing and functional. Obviously, you won't be able to bear or sire children, but... That's not the point, is it? Your South Park reference refers to people who listen to other people about what's best for them.

Mr. Garrison was gay; The doctor convinced him that inside, he must be a woman. Kyle couldn't play basketball; The doctor convinced him that he should change that. Etc. It's about being insecure and unsure, about letting other people dictate your life; Not about transsexuals.


----------



## Endless Humiliation (Aug 20, 2009)

hey you guys remember that tucker max story where he realized he slept with a trans woman


i was talkin to my bros about that and it set off a total spew chain


----------



## Asswings (Aug 20, 2009)

Load_Blown said:


> hey you guys remember that tucker max story where he realized he slept with a trans woman
> 
> 
> i was talkin to my bros about that and it set off a total spew chain





Max Tucker is a lying idiot. :V


And I'm sad that I know what you're talking about.


----------



## 8-bit (Aug 20, 2009)

Runefox said:


> Actually, from what I've read, modern surgery can make it very convincing and functional. Obviously, you won't be able to bear or sire children, but... That's not the point, is it? Your South Park reference refers to people who listen to other people about what's best for them.
> 
> Mr. Garrison was gay; The doctor convinced him that inside, he must be a woman. Kyle couldn't play basketball; The doctor convinced him that he should change that. Etc. It's about being insecure and unsure, about letting other people dictate your life; Not about transsexuals.




But its STILL a funny episode.


----------



## Takun (Aug 20, 2009)

The ones I have seen freak me out from the point that they still _look_ male or female but like dressed up and plasticy.  D:


----------



## 8-bit (Aug 20, 2009)

Takumi_L said:


> The ones I have seen freak me out from the point that they still _look_ male or female but like dressed up and plasticy.  D:




It puts the lotion on its skin, or else it gets the hose again.


----------



## Dyluck (Aug 20, 2009)

Do not want.

Do not want to even be around or interact with.


----------



## Surgat (Aug 20, 2009)

furrygamer84 said:


> Just thought about this, everyone should refer to the episode of south park called mr. Garrisons fancy new vagina.
> 
> Mr. Garrison gets a sex change into a woman, then kyle is to short and jewish to become a basketball player so he gets an operation to make him tall and black. Then kyles dad goes to sue the doctor, but then the doctor convinces him to get an operation to change into a dolphin cause he loves dolphins.
> 
> Moral of they story is the operation will not actually turn you into a woman / black guy / dolphin. You are still a man or woman with a mutilated body



There needs to be a new discussion convention like Godwin's Law, only for South Park. 

Any reference to South Park as an authority indicates that the offending poster has ran out of points, or at a minimum fails to understand the concept of source credibility. In either case, the offending poster loses the argument. 

Seriously, this shit needs to stop.


----------



## Endless Humiliation (Aug 20, 2009)

Surgat said:


> Seriously, this shit needs to stop.



IT'S TRUE


THE MIDDLE WAY REALLY _IS_ THE MOST SENSIBLE 






RON PAUL


----------



## Jashwa (Aug 20, 2009)

My opinion?  I actually don't mind them, I just mind when they go and make shitloads of threads about the same topic and pointing out that they're a transsexual (you know who you are).  Also, I refuse to change pronouns for them out of principle.


----------



## Irreverent (Aug 20, 2009)

Surgat said:


> There needs to be a new discussion convention like Godwin's Law, only for South Park.



Here after, referred to as *"Surgat's Axe-iom."*


----------



## Ricky (Aug 20, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> Also, I refuse to change pronouns for them out of principle.



This...

I try to be as respectful as I can but it's confusing.  Especially in the case where it's a guy who wants to be called "she" but it's obviously a guy, or vice-versa and sometimes they'll get really offended if I get it wrong.  I mean really...  You're doing something that's not normal so please don't get upset if I get confused about it.


----------



## Surgat (Aug 21, 2009)

Irreverent said:


> Here after, referred to as *"Surgat's Axe-iom."*



Yes. 

We need a couple for 1984 and Brave New World comparisons too.


----------



## CrispSkittlez (Aug 21, 2009)

It's not really in my place to discourage it, it's their choice.

You have to admit they've got balls (or a want for them) if they do through with it, though. XD


----------



## Get-dancing (Aug 21, 2009)

Surgat said:


> There needs to be a new discussion convention like Godwin's Law, only for South Park.
> 
> Any reference to South Park as an authority indicates that the offending poster has ran out of points, or at a minimum fails to understand the concept of source credibility. In either case, the offending poster loses the argument.
> 
> Seriously, this shit needs to stop.



South Park = Brimmed with philisophical, political and religious satire 

Well alright it started off pretty crude, but it's come a long way from talking feces and killing off one character every episode. Alough at times it is tounge in cheek I'd say it's a strong candiate for most right-winged show on TV, don't see how it's any more correct than members of the radical left quoting George Carlin etc humorously. Geeze do you even watch it?


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## Nocturne (Aug 21, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> Also, I refuse to change pronouns for them out of principle.





Ricky said:


> This...
> 
> I try to be as respectful as I can but it's confusing.  Especially in the case where it's a guy who wants to be called "she" but it's obviously a guy, or vice-versa and sometimes they'll get really offended if I get it wrong.  I mean really...  You're doing something that's not normal so please don't get upset if I get confused about it.



It's not your fault if you make a mistake.  However, if you know the person I would hope that you would respect them enough to use the proper pronouns.


----------



## Aurali (Aug 21, 2009)

Get-dancing said:


> Geeze do you even watch it?



One of the ingrained jokes in south park is M. Garrison doesn't have any idea what he's doing.


----------



## Wolf-Bone (Aug 21, 2009)

Surgat said:


> There needs to be a new discussion convention like Godwin's Law, only for South Park.
> 
> Any reference to South Park as an authority indicates that the offending poster has ran out of points, or at a minimum fails to understand the concept of source credibility. In either case, the offending poster loses the argument.
> 
> Seriously, this shit needs to stop.



For once I actually agree with something you said. Also about the 1984/Brave New World thing.

Think about it. There's an entire subset of LOLbertarian assholes called "southpark republicans". Check them off the list. Now all the people comparing Obama to Big Brother. Check them off the list. And of course, all the people comparing him to Hitler.

Check them all off the list and how many people left actually have any *legit* criticism?


----------



## Runefox (Aug 21, 2009)

> Check them all off the list and how many people left actually have any legit criticism?



But but but... Public health care is eugenics! He's like Hitler's reincarnation! The Germans before World War II probably had this same debate! ... Before ein fuhrer had them arrested and shot. But it's only a matter of time! We'll have Death Panels and gas chambers and only blacks will be able to walk the streets freely because Obama is racist! But of course he's not actually racist, but he's racist!

It's sad that people actually believe the above. But that's off-topic.


----------



## Azure (Aug 21, 2009)

Wolf-Bone said:


> For once I actually agree with something you said. Also about the 1984/Brave New World thing.
> 
> Think about it. There's an entire subset of LOLbertarian assholes called "southpark republicans". Check them off the list. Now all the people comparing Obama to Big Brother. Check them off the list. And of course, all the people comparing him to Hitler.
> 
> Check them all off the list and how many people left actually have any *legit* criticism?


People who have read the bill? There are plenty of those. I personally would agree with the killing of old people and people with terminal diseases. They aren't very productive, and cost a lot of money to keep alive, just so they can die. Also,

Dear People who call Obama Hitler,

Hitler only engaged in the eradication of a few select ethnic groups.  Obama just wants to kill your granny to save money, not because he hates her.

Love,
Eugenics Supporter


----------



## Jashwa (Aug 21, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> It's not your fault if you make a mistake.  However, if you know the person I would hope that you would respect them enough to use the proper pronouns.


If you're physically a female, I'm going to call you she unless you do such a good job that I can't tell you're female.  If you're physically a male, I'm going to call you he.  It's that simple.


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## Azure (Aug 21, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> If you're physically a female, I'm going to call you she unless you do such a good job that I can't tell you're female. If you're physically a male, I'm going to call you he. It's that simple.


 SCIENCE! Aint it grand?


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## Aden (Aug 21, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> If you're physically a female, I'm going to call you she unless you do such a good job that I can't tell you're female.  If you're physically a male, I'm going to call you he.  It's that simple.



I'm taking it you don't have many transexual friends.


----------



## Jashwa (Aug 21, 2009)

Aden said:


> I'm taking it you don't have many transexual friends.


None that I know of.


----------



## Hateful Bitch (Aug 21, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> None that I know of.



Then they must be very convincing.


----------



## Aden (Aug 21, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> None that I know of.



Well, get back to us when you do. You'll have learned a few things.


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## Azure (Aug 21, 2009)

Transsexuals are pretty much just dramawhores. I call it Penis Envy, or whatever the opposing side is for people who want to be women. Vagina Envy?  Who wants a vagina anyway?


----------



## Torrent (Aug 21, 2009)

I've got a few transsexual friends, and I honestly couldn't care less what they were born as, only who they feel they are now.  There are so many things we don't know or understand in general, I don't see how anyone could feel so certain that everyone is born exactly as they should be, and that they *must* identify with whatever sex they came out as.


----------



## Ricky (Aug 21, 2009)

AzurePhoenix said:


> Transsexuals are pretty much just dramawhores. I call it Penis Envy, or whatever the opposing side is for people who want to be women. Vagina Envy?  Who wants a vagina anyway?



See the thing I have with that...  Well, with girls...

well... isn't 3 holes just a bit excessive?


----------



## Azure (Aug 21, 2009)

Ricky said:


> See the thing I have with that... Well, with girls...
> 
> well... isn't 3 holes just a bit excessive?


 Tis indeed. I've just the two, and they both operate fine. I just wish they got regular use .


----------



## Thatch (Aug 21, 2009)

Ricky said:


> See the thing I have with that...  Well, with girls...
> 
> well... isn't 3 holes just a bit excessive?



Depends on how your wild orgies you have :V
And I'd say that liking the same hole where poop comes out daily is worse (sex/gender/whatever irrelevant) :V


And I don't know any transexuals irl (or don't know wheter any are) and on the internet everyone is who they want to be, so I don't give a fuck.


----------



## Get-dancing (Aug 21, 2009)

AzurePhoenix said:


> SCIENCE! Aint it grand?



Hate to be the guy who tells you this but; you can't anwser everything with just science.



> We'll have Death Panels and gas chambers and only blacks will be able to walk the streets freely because Obama is racist! But of course he's not actually racist, but he's racist!
> 
> It's sad that people actually believe the above. But that's off-topic.



I've said it before and I'll say it again. Despite this myth created by the far left to gain a false sense of racism defeat in Obama getting in. The vast majority of white supremacists actually voted for him because atleast then the world would know once and for all just what a bad job a black man would do of presidentcy.


----------



## Slade (Aug 21, 2009)

Stop being so tolerant. This is boring. Â¬.Â¬


----------



## Nocturne (Aug 21, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> If you're physically a female, I'm going to call you she unless you do such a good job that I can't tell you're female.  If you're physically a male, I'm going to call you he.  It's that simple.



So how about people that are born somewhere inbetween and girls that look like guys or guys that look like girls?  There are girls with XY chromosomes.  Is a guy physically a guy anymore after surgery to become female?  Where do you draw the line?  Our ideas of what someone of a specific gender should look like are based on almost cartoonish caricatures.  There's wayy too much leeway.  If a girl with XX chromosomes who was born with a vagina comes up to you but looks like a guy to you, are you gonna call her "he?"  That is after this person informed you they are female.  I should hope you wouldn't be so cruel.  It is exactly the same thing.



Ricky said:


> See the thing I have with that...  Well, with girls...
> 
> well... isn't 3 holes just a bit excessive?



Isn't a third leg a bit excessive


----------



## Dyluck (Aug 21, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> Isn't a third leg a bit excessive



No.  Never.


----------



## Jashwa (Aug 21, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> So how about people that are born somewhere inbetween and girls that look like guys or guys that look like girls?  There are girls with XY chromosomes.  Is a guy physically a guy anymore after surgery to become female?  Where do you draw the line?  Our ideas of what someone of a specific gender should look like are based on almost cartoonish caricatures.  There's wayy too much leeway.  If a girl with XX chromosomes who was born with a vagina comes up to you but looks like a guy to you, are you gonna call her "he?"  That is after this person informed you they are female.  I should hope you wouldn't be so cruel.  It is exactly the same thing.


If I see them in real life, and they look convincing enough, I'd refer to them as whatever gender they're trying to be.  It's that simple.  If it's a FTM that looks like a man, I'll call her a him.  If it's an MTF that looks like a man still, I'll refer to him as him, whether he identifies with females more or not.  Over the internet, however, I'm going to refer to you by your biological gender if you make it known to me.  

A girl being mistaken for a guy=\=a guy wanting to be called she.  It's not the same thing, not at all.


----------



## Azure (Aug 21, 2009)

Get-dancing said:


> Hate to be the guy who tells you this but; you can't anwser everything with just science.


 Like? Pose a question that science can't answer. In b4 does god exist, philosophy already answered that one.


----------



## Nocturne (Aug 21, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> If I see them in real life, and they look convincing enough, I'd refer to them as whatever gender they're trying to be.  It's that simple.  If it's a FTM that looks like a man, I'll call her a him.  If it's an MTF that looks like a man still, I'll refer to him as him, whether he identifies with females more or not.  Over the internet, however, I'm going to refer to you by your biological gender if you make it known to me.
> 
> A girl being mistaken for a guy=\=a guy wanting to be called she.  It's not the same thing, not at all.



Both are mentally female but look like guys.  Whats the difference?  And since when is the brain and psychology not biological?

I'm assuming the difference to you is one was born with a vagina and the other wasn't.  I still fail to see why this difference is so important.  There's a myriad of ways people can be born with either or both organs in various states of development.  Is it bodily mutilation when someone born with a incompletely formed version of either, but identifies as either male or female has surgery to create the associated organ?  What exactly is your hang up here?

No matter what it is, is it possible that as odd as you feel about the idea of transexuality because of the society that you were raised in, thats a semblance how they feel about themselves because of the sex they were born?  It's all about perspective.  I can't claim to understand exactly what its like, but I'd wager thats probably a good guess.


----------



## Azure (Aug 21, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> Both are mentally female but look like guys. Whats the difference? And since when is the brain and psychology not biological?
> 
> I'm assuming the difference to you is one was born with a vagina and the other wasn't. I still fail to see why this difference is so important. There's a myriad of ways people can be born with either or both organs in various states of development. Is it bodily mutilation when someone born with a incompletely formed version of either, but identifies as either male or female has surgery to create the associated organ? What exactly is your hang up here?
> 
> No matter what it is, is it possible that as odd as you feel about the idea of transexuality because of the society that you were raised in, thats a semblance how they feel about themselves because of the sex they were born? It's all about perspective. I can't claim to understand exactly what its like, but I'd wager thats probably a good guess.


 Screw that attention whoring bullcrap. Looks like a man, is a man, looks like a woman, is a woman.  Unless they pull out their junk and show me otherwise, that's what it's gonna be.  I don't care what people identify as, I care about what I can identify them as. Basic human nature.


----------



## Nocturne (Aug 21, 2009)

AzurePhoenix said:


> Screw that attention whoring bullcrap. Looks like a man, is a man, looks like a woman, is a woman.  Unless they pull out their junk and show me otherwise, that's what it's gonna be.  I don't care what people identify as, I care about what I can identify them as. Basic human nature.



Don't judge a book by its cover etc etc etc

You shouldn't be accountable for your first impression because of that but after you get to know someone you should know that people are more than appearances.


----------



## 8-bit (Aug 21, 2009)

This thread is getting WAY too much attention.


----------



## Nocturne (Aug 21, 2009)

8-bit said:


> This thread is getting WAY too much attention.



Some things I'll just argue about to no end.  Anyway, I don't think anyone is convinced of anything different at this point, and before the arguments get any more repetitious I'll end my arguments having said my peace.


----------



## Azure (Aug 21, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> Don't judge a book by its cover etc etc etc
> 
> You shouldn't be accountable for your first impression because of that but after you get to know someone you should know that people are more than appearances.


 Meh.  Most Transsexuals also happen to be fringe dwellers of society, and are often intravenous drug users.


----------



## Jashwa (Aug 21, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> Some things I'll just argue about to no end.  Anyway, I don't think anyone is convinced of anything different at this point, and before the arguments get any more repetitious I'll end my arguments having said my peace.


True.  You're not going to convince either Azure or myself that we're wrong in calling people by the genders that they were born as, we've both heard the arguments before and made personal decisions that we don't give a fuck if someone identifies as the opposite gender.  If that makes me a dick, then I guess I am.  I'm going to continue calling people by what they were born as.


----------



## Azure (Aug 21, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> True. You're not going to convince either Azure or myself that we're wrong in calling people by the genders that they were born as, we've both heard the arguments before and made personal decisions that we don't give a fuck if someone identifies as the opposite gender. If that makes me a dick, then I guess I am. I'm going to continue calling people by what they were born as.


 It does make you a dick.  And I love you for it.


----------



## 8-bit (Aug 21, 2009)

Does that mean this thread is over now?


----------



## Ricky (Aug 21, 2009)

Nocturne said:


> So how about people that are born somewhere inbetween and girls that look like guys or guys that look like girls?  There are girls with XY chromosomes.  Is a guy physically a guy anymore after surgery to become female?  Where do you draw the line?  Our ideas of what someone of a specific gender should look like are based on almost cartoonish caricatures.  There's wayy too much leeway.  If a girl with XX chromosomes who was born with a vagina comes up to you but looks like a guy to you, are you gonna call her "he?"  That is after this person informed you they are female.  I should hope you wouldn't be so cruel.  It is exactly the same thing.



OK, this is a complete stretch.  Yes, there are biological hermaphrodites but it's extremely uncommon.  We're not talking about that we're talking about people who were obviously born either a boy or girl but want to change that for some reason.



> Does that mean this thread is over now



I can't let that happen!


----------



## 8-bit (Aug 21, 2009)

If you love it, let go. FOR-EV-ER!!!


----------



## Thatch (Aug 21, 2009)

8-bit said:


> If you love it, let go. FOR-EV-ER!!!



I though you beat it into submission until it isn't able to leave.


----------



## Jashwa (Aug 21, 2009)

AzurePhoenix said:


> It does make you a dick.  And I love you for it.


Well, you do love dicks, so that's only logical.  Thanks.


----------



## 8-bit (Aug 21, 2009)

szopaw said:


> I though you beat it into submission until it isn't able to leave.



No, that's only if it owes you money.


http://img.youtube.com/vi/8AGzm9HXvI8/0.jpg


----------



## Takoto (Aug 21, 2009)

Most of the Transsexuals I know are nice people. c:


----------



## Thatch (Aug 21, 2009)

8-bit said:


> No, that's only if it owes you money.
> 
> 
> http://img.youtube.com/vi/8AGzm9HXvI8/0.jpg



Tell it to those who keep their loved it in the basement.


----------



## 8-bit (Aug 21, 2009)

szopaw said:


> Tell it to those who keep their loved it in the basement.




It puts the lotion on its skin, or else it gets the hose again? :twisted:


----------



## Thatch (Aug 21, 2009)

8-bit said:


> It puts the lotion on its skin, or else it gets the hose again? :twisted:



Cat-o-ninetails optional.


----------



## 8-bit (Aug 21, 2009)

szopaw said:


> Cat-o-ninetails optional.



Heh heh heh heh heh. . . *wide grin*


----------



## Get-dancing (Aug 22, 2009)

AzurePhoenix said:


> Like? Pose a question that science can't answer. In b4 does god exist, philosophy already answered that one.



Originally Posted by Surgat 
Prove to me, using scientific methodologies alone, and without circularity or other question-begging: 

-That other people have consciousness 
-Whether or not abortion is morally acceptable 
-How should doctors handle triage situations 
-Whether or not there is such a thing as a state of "well-being" or a good life, universal for all humans 
-What would constitute a well-ordered society
-How is criminal punishment just
-Whether or not humans have free will in some form 
-Whether or not we are morally obligated to follow unjust laws
-That inductive inferences are justified 
-That inductive inferences for things like "grue" (i.e. that emeralds will be green up until Time T, after which they will turn blue) are invalid
-That scientific methodologies can give us true information about the world
-Whether or not science advances throughout history, or just switches incommensurable world views periodically, and develops them
-What knowledge is/what is the criterion for knowledge
-How and under what circumstances can I rely on my memories
-That things and people persist through time, and how 
-What separates science from pseudo-science 
-How do biologists classify different species 
-What is art
-etc.

Be sure to use large sample sizes, don't confuse correlations with causation, don't make non-sequiturs, and remember: no circularity. Good luck! 

Protip: you'll fail. You need philosophy to answer those questions. 


Check-mate.


----------



## ArielMT (Aug 22, 2009)

8-bit said:


> Does that mean this thread is over now?



Apparently not.


----------



## Azure (Aug 22, 2009)

Get-dancing said:


> Originally Posted by Surgat
> Prove to me, using scientific methodologies alone, and without circularity or other question-begging:
> 
> -That other people have consciousness
> ...


Brother.  Philosophy and Science are two different things.  And lemme tell ya. Your Christianity don't help you with any of this.  Religion isn't Philosophy. Please, come original with some new material, I've already handled your little copy paste conundrum several times before. And stop using Surgats post, which he created, if I remember correctly, to debunk your own dumb ass in some ancient thread a long long time ago.


----------



## Get-dancing (Aug 22, 2009)

AzurePhoenix said:


> Brother.  Philosophy and Science are two different things.  And lemme tell ya. Your Christianity don't help you with any of this.  Religion isn't Philosophy. Please, come original with some new material, I've already handled your little copy paste conundrum several times before. And stop using Surgats post, which he created, if I remember correctly, to debunk your own dumb ass in some ancient thread a long long time ago.



Went for the red-herring as well as the ad-homien tatic I see? And incorrect anyway, that post was not originally used in one of my threads nor to debunk any of my arguements.


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## Randy-Darkshade (Aug 22, 2009)

Each to themselves.....each to themselves.


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## Azure (Aug 22, 2009)

Get-dancing said:


> Blah blah blah


Go to church, jackass.


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## Get-dancing (Aug 22, 2009)

You think you're so open-minded but you can't even accept people for having different beliefs than you. Go die.


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## Aden (Aug 22, 2009)

Get-dancing said:


> Go die.



My maturity-detection meter died.


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## Azure (Aug 22, 2009)

Get-dancing said:


> You think you're so open-minded but you can't even accept people for having different beliefs than you. Go die.


Sorry, I don't accept beliefs that are, at their very base, retarded, and without base or proof.  Otherwise, I'm pretty open minded.  Though it should be brought to light, that you are the one who is dying.  Your mythos is slowly fading, being replaced by reason and science.  Still, it was a good run. 6,000 years ain't such a shabby amount of time to dominate the weak willed and weak minded. I'll congratulate you on all of your various atrocities and crusades as well.  Those were pretty lulzy.


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## Ragnarok-Cookies (Aug 22, 2009)

Some people find it kinky.


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## Revy (Aug 23, 2009)

thread is full of lulz

id so let a girl with a cock fuck me no questions asked.


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## Randy-Darkshade (Aug 23, 2009)

Revy said:


> thread is full of lulz
> 
> id so let a girl with a cock fuck me no questions asked.



If it has a cock it is a guy, not a girl.


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## lilEmber (Aug 23, 2009)

Cuntboys <3


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## Sassy (Aug 23, 2009)

RandyDarkshade said:


> If it has a cock it is a guy, not a girl.


If it has animal features and you want to fuck it; it's bestiality.


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## lilEmber (Aug 23, 2009)

Sassy said:


> If it has animal features and you want to fuck it; it's bestiality.


Semicolon should just be a comma. :\
/sig heil


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## Sassy (Aug 23, 2009)

NewfDraggie said:


> Semicolon should just be a comma. :\
> /sig heil


I over-use the semi-colon to make up for all those who under-use it


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## lilEmber (Aug 23, 2009)

Sassy said:


> I over-use the semi-colon to make up for all those who under-use it


Carry on, brave soldier.


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## Wreth (Aug 23, 2009)

Sassy said:


> If it has animal features and you want to fuck it; it's bestiality.



Says the person with a topless catgirl in their avatar.


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## lilEmber (Aug 23, 2009)

Zoopedia said:


> Says the person with a topless catgirl in their avatar.


It was sarcasm, read it again. Now.


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## Ragnarok-Cookies (Aug 23, 2009)

While we are on the question of transsexual, do they still have a anus? 

Then again having a bewbies AND a cawk makes my bisexual self raise a brow.


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## Aden (Aug 23, 2009)

Ragnarok-Cookies said:


> While we are on the question of transsexual, do they still have a anus?



Please tell me you're kidding.


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## Azure (Aug 23, 2009)

Aden said:


> Please tell me you're kidding.


I was gonna post that.


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## Ragnarok-Cookies (Aug 23, 2009)

Aden said:


> Please tell me you're kidding.





AzurePhoenix said:


> I was gonna post that.


Wait nevermind, I'm thinking herms.


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## Randy-Darkshade (Aug 23, 2009)

NewfDraggie said:


> Cuntboys <3



LOL!


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## Randy-Darkshade (Aug 23, 2009)

Ragnarok-Cookies said:


> While we are on the question of transsexual, do they still have a anus?



*facepalms* Please tell me you didn't just ask this.


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## Ragnarok-Cookies (Aug 23, 2009)

RandyDarkshade said:


> *facepalms* Please tell me you didn't just ask this.


No I was thinking of Herms at that time.

I think you people have misconception that I was talking about actual people in real life.


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## ArielMT (Aug 23, 2009)

Ragnarok-Cookies said:


> While we are on the question of transsexual, do they still have a anus?



A herm without an anus.  I don't think that's been done before.


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## Runefox (Aug 23, 2009)

Ragnarok-Cookies said:


> No I was thinking of Herms at that time.



But but but... Where does the poop come from? D=


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## Aurali (Aug 23, 2009)

Runefox said:


> But but but... Where does the poop come from? D=



Out the mouth like half the forum? XD

Meh, I'm just as sickened by this discussion as half of you... but *Shrugs* As long as you don't try to change others... >.>


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## FenrisWolfbane (Aug 23, 2009)

As stated... I am transgendered. It's something that I've known for a very long time (read early childhood before I even knew what transgender meant). I don't dislike my sex... I just don't feel right in a female body. My personality is predominantly male... and I'm not a butch girl. My friends and family all knew this was coming... some accept it... some don't. I don't think I know of any other transgendered people... meaning know them personally. But I have met some online and I think they're pretty cool. One thing... I have never EVER met a FtoM trans.


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## 8-bit (Aug 24, 2009)

Ugh... Hitler is just like Hitler.

There, can this thread die now?


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## Jashwa (Aug 24, 2009)

Ragnarok-Cookies said:


> While we are on the question of transsexual, do they still have a anus?


Sigged.


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## vombatiformes (Aug 24, 2009)

-facepalm-

I don't want to speak for every transgender person/transsexual ever but why does everyone think it has to do with liking trucks or dolls or whatever feminine/masculine equivalent you can come up with?

I'm FTM, but I'm not masculine. At all. But it has fuck-all to do with my personality. I'm not unhappy with having a feminine personality. I'm not unhappy about female clothes or whatever. I'm unhappy with my body, for reasons I don't know and really no one in the world really knows/can prove right now. 

But it has been proven time and time again that the only way to "treat" transsexuals is to allow them to make physical changes to their bodies since mental treatment doesn't change the way they feel about their body. It's called "gender dysphoria". 

I've been diagnosed as having GID (gender identity disorder). It's not like some choice you make one day. It's an actual medical diagnosis. :/


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## Wreth (Aug 25, 2009)

vombatiformes said:


> -facepalm-
> 
> I've been diagnosed as having GID (gender identity disorder). It's not like some choice you make one day. It's an actual medical diagnosis. :/



I'm not saying you don't have a real problem that shouldn't be fixed. I'm all for you having the neccessary surgery or whatever. ''It's an actual medical diagnosis isn't a valid arguement. I'm not saying your wrong in what you think. It's just that i guarantee that every single person on earth could go to a doctor anc find some sort of mental ''problem''.


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## vombatiformes (Aug 25, 2009)

Zoopedia said:


> I'm not saying you don't have a real problem that shouldn't be fixed. I'm all for you having the neccessary surgery or whatever. ''It's an actual medical diagnosis isn't a valid arguement. I'm not saying your wrong in what you think. It's just that i guarantee that every single person on earth could go to a doctor anc find some sort of mental ''problem''.




All I really meant to get across by that is that this isn't something people are just up and doing one day. You aren't even allowed to physically transition without supervision of a doctor and a psychologist. That's all.


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## Wreth (Aug 25, 2009)

vombatiformes said:


> All I really meant to get across by that is that this isn't something people are just up and doing one day. You aren't even allowed to physically transition without supervision of a doctor and a psychologist. That's all.



Ah ok, I think that's wise. Stops people making decisions they weill regret. I'm sure there are many people who would like to be the opposite sex, but some people want it more than others. You couldn't bare the thought of being female physically for the rest of your life. While I for example if given the option to start my life over as a gender of my choice I would probably choose female (longer life spans, less genetic diseases and a few other advantages females have) but I am quite happy being male and it's not going to ruin my life at all.


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## Aurali (Aug 25, 2009)

vombatiformes said:


> All I really meant to get across by that is that this isn't something people are just up and doing one day. You aren't even allowed to physically transition without supervision of a doctor and a psychologist. That's all.



You are also given a three month waiting period for HRT and another year for SRS >.>


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## 8-bit (Aug 25, 2009)

Why won't someone say something new?

Everyone is saying the same shit over and over.


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## Nocturne (Aug 25, 2009)

8-bit said:


> Why won't someone say something new?
> 
> Everyone is saying the same shit over and over.



gtfo etc etc


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## Wreth (Aug 25, 2009)

8-bit said:


> Why won't someone say something new?
> 
> Everyone is saying the same shit over and over.



Quit whinging and make an new on topic discussion then.

>={


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## vombatiformes (Aug 25, 2009)

Eli said:


> You are also given a three month waiting period for HRT and another year for SRS >.>




Not always. Depends on the individual and their physician.


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## Aurali (Aug 25, 2009)

vombatiformes said:


> Not always. Depends on the individual and their physician.



:roll:
You know I'm MtF myself, right? 
Heh. never could find a physician to bend the system.


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## Jashwa (Aug 25, 2009)

Eli said:


> :roll:
> You know I'm MtF myself, right?


I see a solution.  You swap vombat brains.  It works in cartoons, doesn't it?


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## Aurali (Aug 25, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> I see a solution.  You swap vombat brains.  It works in cartoons, doesn't it?



Nawr, me and shenzi are swapping. I promised her XD


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## Nocturne (Aug 25, 2009)

Eli said:


> Nawr, me and shenzi are swapping. I promised her XD



Now wait one second XD


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## Jashwa (Aug 25, 2009)

Eli said:


> Nawr, me and shenzi are swapping. I promised her XD


Oh, yeah, that'd work.  Then she'd be able to decide on a gender for her 9000 characters.


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## Wreth (Aug 25, 2009)

Jashwa said:


> Oh, yeah, that'd work.  Then she'd be able to decide on a gender for her 9000 characters.



I think if Shenzi got a sex change she would want to change back, and then back to mal and then to female again and etc etc


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## vombatiformes (Aug 25, 2009)

Eli said:


> :roll:
> You know I'm MtF myself, right?
> Heh. never could find a physician to bend the system.




Er, what's with the attitude? ; I wasn't attacking you or accusing you of being ignorant or anything. It was a pretty simple statement. 

I felt the need to correct it for the benefit of anyone else that is reading the thread and is curious about these things.

There really isn't currently a set of "rules", anyway. There are accepted norms when it comes to transsexual medical care. For example, some surgeons won't operate on people <18, but many do. Some won't allow people to have any surgery unless they have a year of evaluation. I never had to go through that. Everyone's mileage may vary. I'm not really saying any of this for your benefit, lol.


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## Runefox (Aug 25, 2009)

For the most part, the waiting period is a Cover Your Ass kind of thing. Kind of like a cool-down period. It's to keep people from rushing into it without the proper motivation and psychological profile and regretting it later and suing the fuck out of whoever prescribed it for them. Therefore, there's a lot of hoops to jump through and a lot of psychological stuff to deal with before you really get anywhere with it.

At least, that's my understanding of the situation.


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## vombatiformes (Aug 25, 2009)

Runefox said:


> For the most part, the waiting period is a Cover Your Ass kind of thing. Kind of like a cool-down period. It's to keep people from rushing into it without the proper motivation and psychological profile and regretting it later and suing the fuck out of whoever prescribed it for them. Therefore, there's a lot of hoops to jump through and a lot of psychological stuff to deal with before you really get anywhere with it.
> 
> At least, that's my understanding of the situation.



There are definitely a lot of hoops. Too many hoops, if you want my opinion on it.

It's a bit ridiculous that we have to be diagnosed as basically being insane in order to make SERIOUS medical/surgical decisions about what we want to do with our bodies. It's my body. If I feel that's right for me I should be allowed to have it done. :/ But then it would be MY responsibility if I ever decided I had not gone about it in the right way. 

Unfortunately people are assholes. :<

I guess on the positive side at least I know that I have the medical diagnosis behind me. :/ But it puts trans people at a serious disadvantage to have a mental diagnosis behind their belt when one really isn't needed. I'm not dysfunctional, I don't have any more problems mentally than any other average person. There is nothing about me and my mental state that makes incapable of holding a job, interacting in society, etc, but having that diagnosis could hinder my ability to do those things. :| Simply because people are ignorant.


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## Cressie (Jan 14, 2010)

Shenzebo said:


> BUT I WANT A PENIS



mee tooo


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## Kit H. Ruppell (Jan 14, 2010)

...are totally insane if they think it's really possible to change their gender. If your sex chromosomes (the last pair of chromosomes) are XX, you are female forever. If they are XY, you are male forever. Anything else is superficial. Also, a &quot;hermaphrodite&quot; is an organism that has both male and female sex organs THAT ALLOW IT TO REPRODUCE ON ITS OWN! This is not an issue of morals, but of scientific fact!


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## Dyluck (Jan 14, 2010)

yeah i could use a penis right about now, too


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## Cressie (Jan 14, 2010)

Yea, I don't want to change but it's fun to pretend, that's all I do. It works for me.


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## Shred Uhh Sore Us (Jan 14, 2010)

pre-op: hey if you feel like you have to try to be the opposite sex to be happy then go for it. though im sorry to say, but no matter what you feel inside, you will never truly _be_ the opposite sex. but do what makes you happy.

post-op: same as above, only now not only did you mutilate your body and possibly ruin the rest of your life, you have to live with that decision because theres no going back, plus finding someone that will accept you and love you the same for it might prove to be difficult. but if it makes you happy then whatever, i just pity you for thinking that getting surgery to change who you are on the outside will change who you are on the inside. you will always truly be the sex you were born, even if you change what body parts you have. but hey its your life and your body not mine.


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## CynicalCirno (Jan 14, 2010)

There are up to 5000 live expiermentals here that are in a worser condition than transexuality.
Although, I don't like it.


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## Gight (Jan 14, 2010)

STOP REVIVING THREADS!!!

GAHHHH!!!!!!!
*Creates Rant*


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## Surgat (Jan 14, 2010)

Gight said:


> STOP REVIVING THREADS!!!
> 
> GAHHHH!!!!!!!
> *Creates Rant*



This.


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