# onstar and GPS



## foxhunter (Apr 20, 2008)

(rant alert) 

dose anyone have that stuff? i see it advertized on the tv alot and i dont like it. in my opinion its just a way for the government to have control of you. first onstar. onstar gives you the ability to call people for assistance in medical emergencies, car wreck, or if you lock your damn keys in the car or even have them start or stop the engine by computer. which is just stupid it allows them to track you and take control of the cars engine at the push of a button. do you want people having that power over your car and you? i dont sure its nice having help on call if you crash but being able to render the car useless to the driver if they want to. NO.  now GPS. in general another tracking device shit people learn to read a map its not hard enough said. whats all your opinion on GPS and onstar?


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## Aden (Apr 21, 2008)

GPS is the shit, but OnStar is rarely necessary.


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## net-cat (Apr 21, 2008)

GPS is win when you don't know where you're going. (Although you have to take it with a grain of salt. It thinks nothing of routing you through areas of a city that are, well, not so nice.)

OnStar seems like something I wouldn't even be slightly interested in. I have a cell phone for emergencies and I've locked my keys in my car maybe once in my life. So, not worth $16/month.


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## Grimfang (Apr 21, 2008)

I can think of many times where GPS would've been a life-saver, but I think the experience was cool.. driving all over Virginia with just a horribly tiny-scaled map, trying to find my way back.


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## net-cat (Apr 21, 2008)

Hah. My experience with traffic in Virginia (at least, near DC) is that it's generally faster to walk...


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## Cray (Apr 21, 2008)

foxhunter said:
			
		

> (rant alert)
> 
> dose anyone have that stuff? i see it advertized on the tv alot and i dont like it. in my opinion its just a way for the government to have control of you. (...)  now GPS. in general another tracking device shit people learn to read a map its not hard enough said. whats all your opinion on GPS and onstar?



Wow, talk about paranoid.

Consumer in-car GPS units don't transmit.  Period.  Thus, there is no way you can be tracked remotely (by the government or anyone else) with one.

I know how to read a map.  A GPS is better, especially for long hauls.  Honestly, though, using both is best.  I'll typically plot out a route for the major highways using a map, and follow that until I get near my destination.  Then I flip on the GPS, and let it guide me from the highway to my destination.  Because while a GPS's directions will get you where you're going, they're not always the best/shortest/fastest/cheapest.


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## Grimfang (Apr 22, 2008)

net-cat said:
			
		

> Hah. My experience with traffic in Virginia (at least, near DC) is that it's generally faster to walk...



It's true. 9-to-5 job? Don't bother with a set of wheels here. x_x


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## foxhunter (Apr 22, 2008)

ok i got GPS mixed in with GPRS oops. it still is not that necessary to have and that. people are becoming heavily dependant on this technology because there way to lazy to use a map(my opinion). i will say that its not cool though giving onstar power over your car. and just as net-cat said it is also a waist of 16 bucks.


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## Grimfang (Apr 22, 2008)

I'd say GPS can be useful for travelers, but I think it's pointless for your average person.

The average person drives to the same places everyday, with occasional trips to less frequently visited places.

I know I've had a couple experiences where it would have been useful, but not useful enough to be worth the money spent on one. And my cigarette outlet is dedicated to my Zune's FM Transmitter ONLY!

Music > Directions


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## lilEmber (Apr 22, 2008)

I use to work for General Motors, they own On-Star, anyway it saves hundreds of people a year, and assists thousands more with everything from starting a car to resetting the language on the dash, emergency and such, my uncle works for On-Star itself, I got to see the systems they use. In fact if a GM vehicle is speeding they can tell, they can also tell what the speed limit is on that street and call the driver to see if something is wrong and if they need assistance, also can inform the authorities of such behavior.

In the event of a high speed chase On-Star has the ability to apply brake pressure slowly and disengaged the motor effectively lowing and damage they might of caused.

As for GPS, it is used all around the world from military to fishing, if you don't like it, well I don't see how you can't? it dose NOT harm anyone, it works, and it works well, you can mark spots, find you way out of a woods, assists the military on making sure no collateral damage is done and that coordinates for Artiliary and such are confirmed as well GPS Bombs, now the GPS in cars it works good too for tourists in a new city, finding hotels gas stations restaurants, if this technology didn't exist many, many people would of gotten lost, possibly killed.

As for oyur average person, its good for hunting, fishing, even just finding things nearby or names of streets, great for a cab driver thats new, or even old on the job.


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## Aden (Apr 22, 2008)

*NewfDraggie*: That sounds pretty cool, actually. Too bad you have to have a GM vehicle to get one, bah.

/So wait, can you get busted for speeding through OnStar?


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## Grimfang (Apr 22, 2008)

What I always wondered though... is there just like a microphone in the steering wheel or something? I don't understand how it just connects to a car and you're talking to an On-Star operator. Hopefully there's a tone or beep of some sort before someone starts talking, so the driver doesn't freak out about voices in the vehicle, heheh


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## lilEmber (Apr 22, 2008)

No, its actually in the dash, or in the roof, on most models you can see the speaker, on newer ones now though its in the dash, the onstar control itself is wired into the entiare car, the buttons are in the rear-view mirror, and yea onstar can do anything, they can even lock the steering wheel and shut off the breaks all together, but the E-Brake always works, its not attached to anything electronic, also they can not control the accelerator.

They can put down the windows, unlock the doors, start the car, deploy the airbags, inform emergency the exact coordinates of the veh for assistance, same with tow trucks.

Its a wonderful system and yes, it is only in GM products so that means Pontiac, Chevrolet, Cadillac, Hummer, SAAB, Saturn, GMC cars all have it. and you get 3 years free on purchase of the car, and its only a cheep cost per year to keep the service going (i don't work with them anymore i'm not trying to sell the damn things, foreign cars are better anyway, just onstar is amazing)

There is also a few other features such as now they are implementing bluetooth technology into the onstar, making it possible to connect a bluetooth headset or cell phone into the onstar speaker and it works just like its part of the system, kinda neat.

Oh and calling numbers on a onstar system is simple as saying "Call" then the area code and number and it dials automatically, this can be turned off easily though if you find it annoying.

And no there is no tone to indicate they are listing or on the line, for safety reasons pushing the button will connect you to them and they will wait usually 2-3 seconds before saying anything, "This is onstar how may we be of a assistance" because if its a car jacking they would hear it, and would contact the authorities immediately and not say anything at all, as not to startle the assailant into attacking.


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## foxhunter (Apr 22, 2008)

see thats what im talkin about. i dont want onstar to be able to control my vehicle PERIOD. it may save lives in certain situations but it still is an invasion of my privacy. i wouldn't doubt they can watch you as well.


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## net-cat (Apr 22, 2008)

NewfDraggie said:
			
		

> No, its actually in the dash, or in the roof, on most models you can see the speaker, on newer ones now though its in the dash, the onstar control itself is wired into the entiare car, the buttons are in the rear-view mirror, and yea onstar can do anything, they can even lock the steering wheel and shut off the breaks all together, but the E-Brake always works, its not attached to anything electronic, also they can not control the accelerator.
> 
> They can put down the windows, unlock the doors, start the car, deploy the airbags, inform emergency the exact coordinates of the veh for assistance, same with tow trucks.


Let me reiterate:

[size=xx-large]DO. NOT. WANT.[/size]


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## Eevee (Apr 22, 2008)

Wow.  Uh.  You're a bit paranoid there, buddy.

Just another way for the _government_ to control you?

Is your entire house wrapped in tinfoil?


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## lilEmber (Apr 22, 2008)

foxhunter said:
			
		

> see thats what I'm talking about. i don't want onstar to be able to control my vehicle PERIOD. it may save lives in certain situations but it still is an invasion of my privacy. i wouldn't doubt they can watch you as well.



NO it is IMPOSSIBLE for them to access anything unless you or authorities contact them, or something like a collision occurs or airbags deeply, in that case sensors override that and send a message to On-Star and they immediately attempt contact to see if its ok or a false alarm, they CAN see your speed limit but with millions of cars on the roads, do you think they can or would try to monitor any unless they were radically off the charts? in that case you should be forced to have this if you don't want it, kinda suspicious not to want then to find out your breaking the law...

But yea they need a security key to do anything, or a law enforcement agency have override keys that they can get from your license plate and registration.

If every car had this, mandatory deaths in vehicular related accidents would be reduced by a lot and high speed chases would be only a few seconds long, the background report and screening people go through to become On-Star employee's is very good and even if they wanted to lock the breakes on the car or the steering you can always override by turning off the key or using the e-brake, AND they would need access to do that, and only you know the pin and police have a override pin that will only work once then its changed again.


Also there is no cameras in the car period that can upload to onstar or anything else, what a waste of money to do that...

AND even the On-Star need your code to put down the windows for god sakes and oyu can change the code anytime online, the police can override like I said, and in the event of emergency where a sensor, such as heat, pressure, collision, air bag deployment goes off the password system on your car is shut down and onstar can gain full control over every electrical system and can call you, unlock your doors, disengage the motor and fuel pumps, and call emergancy, unless one of those sensors are triggered they can't even unlock your doors. That goes for someone trying different frequency's on a remote to unlock your doors through the on-star system, not only is it satalight but they need the proper encryption to do that.


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## Tudd (Apr 22, 2008)

GM used to offer OnStar to a few other companies (I know Acura was one of them) but they quickly reverted to GM exclusive.

On topic though... I'd say GPS is useful, to some degree, but OnStar looses my vote simply because I prefer vehicles other than domestic brands. To me there are much more important factors in deciding on a vehicle than the manufacturers in-car support system. That pretty much leaves me unable to vote. Maybe if there were more options... ;3 As for a real reason... I'm fine with having CAA/AAA support if I need it, and for less money too. 

Hmm... Look at the 407 Expressway in Canada. It uses cameras at all entrances and exits and a transponder system to detect the vehicles entering and exiting the freeway. They COULD in theory calculate your average speed from the time you get on and off and charge you based on your average if it was over the speed limit. However its run by a private company, not the government, therefore its in the companies best interest to simply ignore the large number of people speeding. Imagine how many people would refuse to buy GM simply because OnStar was in the vehicle because of the privacy violations.


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## lilEmber (Apr 22, 2008)

Tudd said:
			
		

> GM used to offer OnStar to a few other companies (I know Acura was one of them) but they quickly reverted to GM exclusive.
> 
> On topic though... I'd say GPS is useful, to some degree, but OnStar looses my vote simply because I prefer vehicles other than domestic brands. To me there are much more important factors in deciding on a vehicle than the manufacturers in-car support system. That pretty much leaves me unable to vote. Maybe if there were more options... ;3 As for a real reason... I'm fine with having CAA/AAA support if I need it, and for less money too.



*Cough* Has nothing to DO with GM, has to do with the On-Star system not purchasing a car, I'm talking strictly about the system, that every car should have this or something similar.


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## Tudd (Apr 22, 2008)

NewfDraggie said:
			
		

> *Cough* Has nothing to DO with GM, has to do with the On-Star system not purchasing a car, I'm talking strictly about the system, that every car should have this or something similar.



If the cost of running the company was included in purchasing the car then I wouldn't mind at all. Keep in mind though, laws to make sales of M-rated games to minors are constantly being shot down in the U.S. on a "constitutional basis". All it takes is the mention of the loss of "personal privacy".

From a safety perspective, the OnStar system is a great idea and has much more potential for improving driver safety, but it comes at a cost. Personally I'm not willing to pay the fee for it on a monthly basis and theres going to be many others who do not wish to pay for it either. Thats where the problem exists. Its a good idea, but not everyone is willing to pay for it.


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## lilEmber (Apr 22, 2008)

The only possible loss of privacy you would get is if you pushed the onstar call button by accident and then didn't pay attention to the voice and just started to talk about your mastercard number randomly O..o seriously, I've worked for GM we could at any time call customer home numbers and ask them questions, but why we didn't? because its a job we don't have time to listin in on the millions of cars, and I mean MILLIONS I mean even if we wanted to we wouldn't hear anything that would matter and you need warrants to use anything at all in court, even if you overheard a murder plot, he could simply say he was kidding and they were listing to him without a warrant to do so and then On-star would be down a few million in lawsuit charges.

I understnad peoples want and need for privacy, but seriously thats in the past now they can tap your phone wirelessly now, they can have a device that by walking by you scans your credit cards and then they can make a copy on a blank card and use that, no kidding, they can listin in on cell phones, portable phones, and hackers can crack the cameras that are around your city (if they got them) so why worry about something that can save lives and keep down on crime, if you really cared about privacy you would never buy a computer, touch the net, or own a cell phone.


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## Tudd (Apr 22, 2008)

Here comes the big "but"... I'm not exactly concerned with my privacy when it comes to the OnStar system. Its simply that I do not find the OnStar system is worth the $16 a month. If it actually made the roads that much safer I would pay the $16 a month, but in its current form its more of a luxury than a tool to make the roads safer. It seems to replace the role of companies like CAA/AAA with the services it currently provides. If they're trying to sell it for safety then they'd have to prove why it does improve my safety. (Save for theft in progress.)


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## lilEmber (Apr 22, 2008)

Umm...16 dollars a month is actually wrong, its more like 100$ a year, also its primary is safety, not luxury even a cheep Pontiac gets it, the simple fact is its great for people that simply leave their keys in the car, or want that extra caution from theft or a accident.


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## net-cat (Apr 22, 2008)

Huh. Maybe it varies with area? Or a bulk discount sort of thing? Every time I hear about it on the radio, they always say $16/month.


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## Tudd (Apr 22, 2008)

Well I can't argue with that. ^^ My reasoning for calling it a luxury is that CAA/AAA can open your car for you, but it takes much longer for them to get you. Theres no comparison really, OnStar is instant meanwhile CAA/AAA can take hours. 

Most people are going to want some sort of service such as the one OnStar (GM), TeleAid (Mercedes), or BMW Assist provide, but some arn't willing to accept it in the form that they provide. For those, we have traditional companies like AAA/CAA. And then theres people who don't even have insurance on their car. So I'm folding and agreeing... Those services are useful, but for some are too involved. My advice to anyone considering it, more and more companies are rolling out their own version of this system so it will only be a matter of time before it becomes a standard feature all around so waiting isnt always that bad.


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## Aden (Apr 22, 2008)

Well, after reading this thread, I would probably get OnStar if not for the fact that you must buy a GM vehicle. Honestly, if some third party did something like this and got some other major manufacturers on board (Toyota, Honda, Mitsubishi, VW, etc.), I would be completely for it.


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## Ceceil Felias (Apr 23, 2008)

Eevee said:
			
		

> Wow.  Uh.  You're a bit paranoid there, buddy.
> 
> Just another way for the _government_ to control you?
> 
> Is your entire house wrapped in tinfoil?


I'm actually kinda tempted to try doing that one day just as a random waste of time.


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## Eevee (Apr 23, 2008)

Wrap your house, or wrap the OP's house?  8)


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## MacroKaiju (Apr 23, 2008)

I've got a gps, a kinda old one but it works... kinda
I think it has some kind of beta AI cause it likes to play jokes on me "exit interstate 84, on the right, drive 5 miles, reenter interstate 84 on the right" WTF?! then there's the time it said I was driving through cornfileds off the map *note the new road was just finished months prior)


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## Tudd (Apr 23, 2008)

MacroKaiju,

It sounds like you might need to update the software in your GPS. XP


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## Digitalpotato (Apr 23, 2008)

My mother has Onstar in her Saturn Aura. The phone function has been a regular pain in the ass. When she says "Home", they always ask her to repeat it slower, sometimes several times after that, and they even dial the wrong number in the end sometimes. And for the dial number, they give you the wrong numbers several times. (I once got a "Seven" in place of a "three") I also don't reccomend it while driving simply because it's dangerous. 


Now the other functions such as GPS, we've never used it too too much. We got a better GPS that always seems determined ot make us drive the wrong way down a one-way road but it's probably a hiccup. It also doesn't know how to pronounce "paradise" but it pronounces Spanish words well enough. 


But one little thing...I hear that you can dial onstar from your phone if you accidentally lock your keys in the car and they unlock it for you. That's one nifty thing to have, although we've never had to use it so far.


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## MacroKaiju (Apr 23, 2008)

Tudd said:
			
		

> MacroKaiju,
> 
> It sounds like you might need to update the software in your GPS. XP



Really? o.=.O never thought of that XP


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## Ceceil Felias (Apr 23, 2008)

Eevee said:
			
		

> Wrap your house, or wrap the OP's house?  8)


Mine. I don't even know where the OP lives, even if he'd think everyone knows because the government gave it out to SILENCE HIM FOR KNOWING TOO MUCH. :O


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## Dragoneer (Apr 23, 2008)

I can't live without my GPS nowadays. Screw the black helicopters, I need the quickest route to a Starbucks from any location at any time, any where... NO MATTER WHAT!


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## Kimmerset (Apr 23, 2008)

Oh my God, I never even thought about using it to locate specific venues!

*Saves for a GPS unit*


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## Dragoneer (Apr 23, 2008)

Kimmerset said:
			
		

> Oh my God, I never even thought about using it to locate specific venues!
> 
> *Saves for a GPS unit*


Yeah, my Garmin Nuvi 750 will tell me of damn near anything within a 5 mile radius from me. Gas stations, hospitals, hotels, restaurants, police stations, entertainment, movies...

If I'm on a road trip with friends, and we want Italian food... push a few buttons and every Italian restaurant within a five mile radius pops up. If we decide to go to Olive Garden, I click a button, and it auto-programs the fastest route there for me. Or if my shirt spontaneously bursts into flame (as it's prone to do) I press another button, find my favorite clothing store... and go get a new shirt. 

It's pretty wicked.


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## Kimmerset (Apr 23, 2008)

It would totally solve that "Hey, where do you wanna go?" "I dunno, I don't really know this area..." "Well?" "....." 

GPS!  

So you got another GPS unit, did you?


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## Dragoneer (Apr 23, 2008)

Kimmerset said:
			
		

> It would totally solve that "Hey, where do you wanna go?" "I dunno, I don't really know this area..." "Well?" "....."
> 
> GPS!
> 
> So you got another GPS unit, did you?


Yep. I went from a Garmin Nuvi 270 (the one that got stolen) to Garmin Nuvi 750. =)


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## Jelly (Apr 28, 2008)

Useful for fieldwork, don't knock it.


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## Ceceil Felias (Apr 28, 2008)

Jelly brings up a good point. If I start doing onsite computer repairs, it'll be hell if I don't have one handy.

Hurray for Google maps in the meantime? ;;


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