# Site broken



## Trunchbull (Apr 1, 2012)

Alright guys, which one of you broke the site layout? The previews are broken, thumbnails won't show in Gallery mode, everything looks fat and blotched, and it all started with that Registration announcement on the top of the page.

Darn you fa, why do you have to change a perfectly good layout?
http://i.imgur.com/Y9hoG.png


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## CaptainCool (Apr 1, 2012)

i dont think they are breaking it, they are actually changing it :O the thumbnails on the new submissions page look completely different!


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## Maikeru (Apr 1, 2012)

Huh.  I guess that FA's April Fools joke is to make thumbnails and user galleries completely non-functional.


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## Viridis (Apr 1, 2012)

I don't know, but it corresponded with the FA United 5 notification being posted as a reminder on the top of the page, just under the advertisement banners.


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## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

FA's thumbnails / design has changed. This means the server has to rebuild the thumbnail cache, which is going to take a while.
When most thumbnails are generated again, FA should be running as it normally would.


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## TechKat (Apr 1, 2012)

Please tell me you did not just say the old layout was already better... MY EYES ARE PLAYING TRICKS ON ME?! HAHAHAAHAHAH, RIGHT?! AHAHAH!!!


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## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

I don't think this is an accident.  They changed the size of the thumbnails, which required more than just a simple typo somewhere.

The slow loading is due to the cache server having to rebuild thumbnails for all art.  Last time this happened it was days before the site was functional again.

Bad timing though, doing it on April Fools.  Unless it IS a joke... but if it is, it's a bad one.


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## theguywiththecamera (Apr 1, 2012)

They're probably just doing a test and the system needs time to generate larger thumbnails. I don't think it's a stretch of the imagination for them to be oblivious to it being April Fools and doing a test. Unless it is a joke to try and make people think they're updating the UI, then it kinda would be in poor taste.


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## Trunchbull (Apr 1, 2012)

TechKat said:


> Please tell me you did not just say the old layout was already better... MY EYES ARE PLAYING TRICKS ON ME?! HAHAHAAHAHAH, RIGHT?! AHAHAH!!!


i don't see what's wrong with saying it. /: I liked the old layout because the thumbnails weren't surrounded by fat ugly colours.  And they didn't float in the center of the page.


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## BRN (Apr 1, 2012)

Hey guys, guys

guys


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## da-fox (Apr 1, 2012)

as they say::

Administrator notice:
Thumbnails may not be displaying right now. We are upgrading our thumbnail system, and they should start displaying once they system catches up rendering them.


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## Viridis (Apr 1, 2012)

SIX said:


> Hey guys, guys
> 
> guys



Whoah...   That certainly was a big layout change.


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## ZENX49 (Apr 1, 2012)

I kinda like the new look of things. I'll just wait patiently for the thumb nail cache to catch up. Looks sleeker than boxes inside of bordered tables anyway. -o-


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## TechKat (Apr 1, 2012)

Trunchbull said:


> i don't see what's wrong with saying it. /: I liked the old layout because the thumbnails weren't surrounded by fat ugly colours.  And they didn't float in the center of the page.



I'd rather have the new "promised" Summer UI than this bullcrap. <table> is the worst kind of code to make a site.

<div></ftw>


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## BRN (Apr 1, 2012)

ZENX49 said:


> I kinda like the new look of things. I'll just wait patiently for the thumb nail cache to catch up. Looks sleeker than boxes inside of bordered tables anyway. -o-



Personally I'm in love with this: http://puu.sh/npGs


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## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

theguywiththecamera said:


> They're probably just doing a test and the system needs time to generate larger thumbnails. I don't think it's a stretch of the imagination for them to be oblivious to it being April Fools and doing a test. Unless it is a joke to try and make people think they're updating the UI, then it kinda would be in poor taste.



So, you're not even thinking it might be a option we're -actually- doing a UI update?

... Thanks, bud.


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## JamesTheDog (Apr 1, 2012)

Does anyone else think the new thumbnails are too big?


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## Trunchbull (Apr 1, 2012)

What will happen to the thumbnails we create during upload? I'm not seeing them in Gallery view, but i can see them on the profile view


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## TechKat (Apr 1, 2012)

@Cerbrus

Why not just ignore doing updates on the old layout, and focus on the new UI that we were promised... last Summer?


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## Smelge (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> So, you're not even thinking it might be a option we're -actually- doing a UI update?
> 
> ... Thanks, bud.



Sorry, but it really is something that could be an april fools joke. At this point the whole thing is a joke after so many promises and failures to meet them. If you wanted people to actually expect something like this, then some work needs done on the PR thing as well as the "actually doing what we say we're doing" thing.


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## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

Trunchbull said:


> i don't see what's wrong with saying it. /: I liked the old layout because the thumbnails weren't surrounded by fat ugly colours.  And they didn't float in the center of the page.



I'm undecided until I can actually get a page to load and see how it looks.  I am crossing my fingers hoping story icons are now using this new size too.. would be great to have those large thumbnails at the top of story submissions, and also not have the horribly broken "shrink then enlarge" process story thumbnails have been using. 

I just wish they could have built the cache BEFORE switching to the new layout.  Thumbnail links have the image size right in the filename so no reason they couldn't have both during the transition.

The larger thumbnails are nice though.  As is the larger number of submissions shown on the front page now.


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## BRN (Apr 1, 2012)

I actually really like the sleeker look. I don't know if any coding's changed underneath the gloss but that doesn't honestly affect me, as I'm of the opinion that the site works.

Plus, the new frontpage is a lot more appealing.


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## theguywiththecamera (Apr 1, 2012)

da-fox said:


> Administrator notice:
> Thumbnails may not be displaying right now. We are upgrading our thumbnail system, and they should start displaying once they system catches up rendering them.



I wish they would've posted a notice before hand. It's nice that it's happening so I really don't want to complain.


​


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## Viridis (Apr 1, 2012)

Just noticed something.

When the drop down menu for "+ My FA" is opened, some of the pop-out options for account and page management get cut off on the right side of the screen.

Does anyone else see this?


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## theguywiththecamera (Apr 1, 2012)

Sorry I started typing before your post and wouldn't have said test if I had the opportunity to read it. In my opinion even if it was a test that would mean is was actually going to happen near future and was a part of an update process. Not trying to get on anyone's case because I'm happy to see the changes.


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## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

Argh.  Looks like story thumbnails are STILL tiny.  With the new layout, it looks pretty awful now when viewing a gallery that has stories.  You have all this whitespace around the tiny story thumbnails that looks pretty bad, especially when sitting next to the nice big ones.

I assume the bug where story thumbnails are shrunk down then enlarged back up giving a horrible, blurry look is still there too, but I am not going to submit a story just to check.

Please fix this?  Pretty please?


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## theguywiththecamera (Apr 1, 2012)

viridis_coyote said:


> Just noticed something.
> 
> When the drop down menu for "+ My FA" is opened, some of the pop-out options for account and page management get cut off on the right side of the screen.
> 
> Does anyone else see this?



It isn't cutting off for me.


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## Calemeyr (Apr 1, 2012)

derp april fools derp...you know the joke isn't a joke if it isn't funny. What would be nice is if you did something like google...oh wait that would require effort. :V

Of course..if this isn't an april fools joke...why do it today of all days?

The main problem is, once again, lack of notification on the mainsite.  It was all kind of sudden. If it it was mentioned on twitter, ok, but  many of us aren't following Dragoneer or the admins on there, or don't  even use twitter.

I'm having trouble understanding if this is a joke or not because stuff like this has happened before.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Maikeru said:


> Huh.  I guess that FA's *April Fools joke* is to make thumbnails and user galleries completely non-functional.


Could have fooled me.
*rimshot*


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## Viridis (Apr 1, 2012)

theguywiththecamera said:


> It isn't cutting off for me.



Are you using this one: http://preyfar.dev.furaffinity.net/

Or this one: http://www.furaffinity.net/

The cutoff issue comes with the first one, which I assume is a beta version, or just an elaborate April Fools joke.  

Seriously, why would you guys do something like this today of all days?


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

What ever, it looks horrid. This is FA for the legally blind now. Can I have my small thumbnails back please? (I doubt it will happen) The old layout for thumbnails and size was perfect. Who's the incompetent retard who designed this?


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## Mayonnaise (Apr 1, 2012)

viridis_coyote said:


> Are you using this one: http://preyfar.dev.furaffinity.net/
> 
> Or this one: http://www.furaffinity.net/
> 
> ...


Well there's no "+ My FA" in the second one. Yet...


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## Trunchbull (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> What ever, it looks horrid. This is FA for the legally blind now. Can I have my small thumbnails back please? (I doubt it will happen) The old layout for thumbnails and size was perfect. Who's the incompetent retard who designed this?


There shoudl be an option to switch back. I dont like this huge thumbnail scheme. X:


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## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

So much for discretion :/

I've casually browsed FA on many occasions without attracting the attention of those I live with, as the icons were small and not visible unless up close. Where as now those previously indistinguishable icons are quite large and clear when within the room. I'm looking at the dragon other section right now, and there is a clearly distinguishable image of a gaping cunt on the screen and some dongs on the bottom, obvious to anyone who glances the screens direction; even though they haven't been opened.

This update is going to be the bane of anyone living with others and would rather them not see the entire contents of a FA section on screen.


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## Calemeyr (Apr 1, 2012)

What happened to the news column? Maybe it just hasn't loaded yet, but on both schemes, it isn't showing up.
I'll be candid here. Hmm...if the April Fools joke is to cause drama...it's not half bad. Pretty good even.

If not...you guys just got rid of one of the main sources of notification for future updates aside from the forums. Perhaps it was an oversight. In any case, it would be wise to keep the news column.


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

The thumbnails and previews don't even compile correctly in the profile layout, I've viewed it with both compatibility mode on and off in IE8 and niether looks right. The nimrod who designed this needs to get his or her ass back in the computer design classes.


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## Calemeyr (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> The thumbnails and previews don't even compile correctly in the profile layout, I've viewed it with both compatibility mode on and off in IE8 and niether looks right. The nimrod who designed this needs to get his or her ass back in the computer design classes.



Remember these are furries we are talking about, so, relatively, it's a pretty good job. :V
All joking aside, I'm starting to think this a april fool's joke more and more.


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## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> IE8


And you're telling someone to get their asses back into computer design classes? 

[Edit]
(that's a joke ^ )

Please update your browser. Use Chrome, Firefox, or if you have to stick to IE, IE9.
Besides, I've got IE8 on my laptop (For testing purposes), and the site loads just fine. Yea, some thumbnails ain't loading, but those are still being generated by our thumbnail service.


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

Marcus Stormchaser said:


> Remember these are furries we are talking about, so, relatively, it's a pretty good job. :V



The layout I could expect. Still, my main issue is with how the thumbnails are ungodly large. There's no need for them to been that big, anyone who need thumbnails that is has to be so blind I question if they could really see whats on the screen at all. Also, where the hell is the news column? Who's the retard who removed that?


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## PheagleAdler (Apr 1, 2012)

Fix the cigarette lighter!


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> And you're telling someone to get their asses back into computer design classes?



I hate and despise the look of IE9. Again, a bunch of retarts messing with something that doesn't need to be fixed graphics wise. (Idiots of microsoft)


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## ElCid (Apr 1, 2012)

This had better be a joke, cause if it's an actual update, it's a godawful one.


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## PheagleAdler (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> The thumbnails and previews don't even compile correctly in the profile layout, I've viewed it with both compatibility mode on and off in IE8 and niether looks right. The nimrod who designed this needs to get his or her ass back in the computer design classes.





CerbrusNL said:


> And you're telling someone to get their asses back into computer design classes?



IE8? XD Who in their right mind would use IE?


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## Calemeyr (Apr 1, 2012)

Well actually, if the thumbnails are larger, it means the site loads slower...compound that with high traffic during certain hours of the day, the site could become ungodly slow. Could you guys program a user option to determine the size of thumbnails or something? Or could this be done through firefox add-ons?


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## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> I hate and despise the look of IE9. Again, a bunch of retarts messing with something that doesn't need to be fixed graphics wise. (Idiots of microsoft)



Then I'd suggest giving Chrome or Firefox a try.


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## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> I hate and despise the look of IE9. Again, a bunch of retarts messing with something that doesn't need to be fixed graphics wise. (Idiots of microsoft)



I haven't used a version of IE since 3.  

That said, it's a perfect example of why things go wrong in software, or lots of industries.  It's almost always easier to throw something away and start over than to fix or improve a working system.  Combined with the fact that every time a new CEO or department head comes in, the first thing they ALWAYS do is throw out everything their predecessor did and put their mark on the project by demanding changes.  That way they can claim credit if it does well.  "See, I said they needed to get rid of menus!"

Kind of like dogs peeing to mark their territory.

Don't get me started on micromanagement and managers desperate to show they are a visionary by changing things and thinking outside the box.

I fully expect IE10 to run on your desktop with no windows, and remove links, replacing them with a new interface where a big wheel of pages that may or may not be related to you comes up and you spin it to pick where you go next.


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

Marcus Stormchaser said:


> Well actually, if the thumbnails are larger, it means the site loads slower...compound that with high traffic during certain hours of the day, the site could become ungodly slow.



And yet somehow they think its a marvelous idea.

Can we please get the news column back please?


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## SirRob (Apr 1, 2012)

WHERE ARE MY SHARP EDGES

WHAT ARE THESE GRADIENTS DOING AROUND MY SUBMISSIONS

ARGHHHH


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## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

Marcus Stormchaser said:


> Well actually, if the thumbnails are larger, it means the site loads slower...compound that with high traffic during certain hours of the day, the site could become ungodly slow. Could you guys program a user option to determine the size of thumbnails or something? Or could this be done through firefox add-ons?



An option to select thumbnail sizes would be nice, but the issue is all the storage required.  The more options you have, the less efficient the caching system will be.  Not everyone uses Firefox so a solution limited to that platform would not work well either.  Everyone else would be left out.


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## Calemeyr (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> An option to select thumbnail sizes would be nice, but the issue is all the storage required.  The more options you have, the less efficient the caching system will be.  Not everyone uses Firefox so a solution limited to that platform would not work well either.  Everyone else would be left out.



Good point...I still think the news column should come back...and if having size select would also make the site slower, then the site should just use the old thumbnail size. The "My FA" drop down menu is nice, though.


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

Marcus Stormchaser said:


> Good point...I still think the news column should come back...and if having size select would also make the site slower, then the site should just use the old thumbnail size. The "My FA" drop down menu is nice, though.



Personally, the developers version does nothing for me. The drop downs being at the top of the screen to me at least looks bad.


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## chineseshell (Apr 1, 2012)

Why don't you guys just wait till everything is fixed? Seriously it's not the end of the world. Calm the fuck down.


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## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> The drop downs being at the top of the screen to me at least looks bad.



Where else would you have them?


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## Hanazawa (Apr 1, 2012)

ADF said:


> So much for discretion :/
> 
> ....
> 
> This update is going to be the bane of anyone living with others and would rather them not see the entire contents of a FA section on screen.



http://sfw.furaffinity.net/ when you're not alone bb


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> Where else would you have them?



Personally I'm not a big fan of drop downs for everything. I like everything where it was before. The site was simple and looked decent, it functioned fine (most of the time). I personally find the these layout updates to be pointless and stupid. The sites functionality was perfect as it was. There is no need for huge thumbnails (idiot designers), also, give me back my news column.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> Personally I'm not a big fan of drop downs for everything. I like everything where it was before. The site was simple and looked decent, it functioned fine (most of the time). I personally find the these layout updates to be pointless and stupid. The sites functionality was perfect as it was. There is no need for huge thumbnails (idiot designers), also, give me back my news column.


Not really the fact that they are adding in sprys shows they are finally getting their shit together and actually fixing the site.

Also the bigger thumbnails may be a padding error or something.  Once the site is back up completely I'm sure it won't look exactly like how it is right now.

Not to mention that the news section isn't showing up.

Tl:dr; hold your bitching until the site recaches.


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## Ben (Apr 1, 2012)

"So are we ever going to put anything worthwhile in the news updates?"

"No, probably not!"

*deletes it entirely*

---

But seriously, this strikes me as such an insubstantial, hand-wavey update, when you guys know that the thing at the top of everyone's wishlists isn't "bigger thumbnails." And I like that the solution to "We never post anything worthwhile in the news updates column!" is to get rid of it entirely instead of generating worthwhile things to put in it. The fact that it didn't even work flawlessly though really just adds insult to injury.


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

Ben said:


> "So are we ever going to put anything worthwhile in the news updates?"
> 
> "No, probably not!"
> 
> *deletes it entirely*



I like the news column most cause I can then find out who did the banners for the site.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Ben said:


> "So are we ever going to put anything worthwhile in the news updates?"
> 
> "No, probably not!"
> 
> *deletes it entirely*


Ugh.... From what alone I can see from the front page they've switched from tables to divisions so I don't think that was intentional.

I've done shit like that unintentionally several times before myself.  Normally it was just a fuck up with the float, it's a bitch to fix.  Most of the time I just say to hell with it and make the division width fixed.


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## Ben (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Ugh.... From what alone I can see from the front page they've switched from tables to divisions so I don't think that was intentional.



It's entirely intentional. This site design has been floating around for at least a month now, and it's always featured the news table gone, and more thumbnails appearing as you expand the window and/or make the font size smaller. Of course, they might change it down the road, but it definitely seems as though it was the intention at one point to remove the news column.


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## Smelge (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> OH MY GOD YOU ARE ALL STUPID FUCKS I KNOW THIS IS SHIT BEFORE I HAVE EVEN USED IT PROPERLY WHY CAN'T YOU MAKE IT WORK RIGHT ON MY OBSOLETE AND BUGGY BROWSER YOU ARE ALL GAY AND I CAN'T DEAL WITH A MINOR CHANGE OMG



Fixed that for you.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Ben said:


> It's entirely intentional. This site design has been floating around for at least a month now, and it's always featured the news table gone, and more thumbnails appearing as you expand the window and/or make the font size smaller.


Or they can be switching it over to the announcements, much like how FAU: 5 showed up on your announcements this morning.

There's a million different things that it could be.


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

Smelge said:


> Fixed that for you.



And you my good sir are an ass, but we all love you for that, myself inclued. But its not really a minor change either.

As a whole the choppiness is clearing up, but I still wish the designers and programmers at least had some common sense about the size that thumbnails should be.


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## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

Marcus Stormchaser said:


> Good point...I still think the news column should come back...and if having size select would also make the site slower, then the site should just use the old thumbnail size. The "My FA" drop down menu is nice, though.


The news column is gone, and has been replaced. Fender's journals will now represent the official FA news line of the site. When a new journal/notice is posted it will flag a news post that will notify you there's a new update. Click it, and get taken to the story.

It's really much more efficient moving forward.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> The news column is gone, and has been replaced. Fender's journals will now represent the official FA news line of the site. When a new journal/notice is posted it will flag a news post that will notify you there's a new update. Click it, and get taken to the story.
> 
> It's really much more efficient moving forward.


Hey Dragoneer I got a question, is my guess that the site is switching over to divisions instead of tables correct?


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## Smelge (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> And you my good sir are an ass, but we all love you for that, myself inclued. But its not really a minor change either.
> 
> As a whole the choppiness is clearing up, but I still wish the designers and programmers at least had some common sense about the size that thumbnails should be.



They should be bigger. And this is why.

How many times have you been browsing, and seen an interesting thumbnail that looks to be relevant to your interests. You click it, and see something you really wish you hadn't. Something you might have spotted from a larger thumbnail. All this shite about larger thumbnails increasing server load is entirely true. By a few kb per image. Not exactly a massive increase that will overload the servers and cause FA to collapse into a pool of lava.


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## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

Hanazawa said:


> http://sfw.furaffinity.net/ when you're not alone bb



Four people share this house and I share a room with one. Switching between SFW and NSFW based on the 10s of minutes I'm alone would be impractical.


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> The news column is gone, and has been replaced. Fender's journals will now represent the official FA news line of the site. When a new journal/notice is posted it will flag a news post that will notify you there's a new update. Click it, and get taken to the story.
> 
> It's really much more efficient moving forward.



So we can all be bombarded by unnecessarily large thumbnails I take it? This isn't a very good update.


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## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> As a whole the choppiness is clearing up, but I still wish the designers and programmers at least had some common sense about the size that thumbnails should be.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thumbnail#Dimensions
(I know, wiki's a terribad resource)
I'd say 150*150 is in the right range, actually.



thoron said:


> So we can all be bombarded by unnecessarily large thumbnails I take it? This isn't a very good update.



Look, unless you're going to come up with some good reasons why this update is as bad as you make it out to be, aside from your personal opinion, I'd like to ask you to take it down a notch.
We get it, you don't like the new layout. Really.


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## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

I just noticed something.  I had earlier approved of using the space from removing the news to show more submissions.  But now I see that stories and poetry sections were combined, so both of those don't actually get any extra space.

Makes me sad.  I have to disagree with this.  Us writers get the short end of the stick enough already, this makes me feel like I've been evicted from 2nd class and have to ride in steerage now.  Give us some love!

Edit: It's worse actually.  The extra space gives more icons but combining them actually means less show up for each section so it's not a sidegrade, but a downgrade.


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## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

Smelge said:


> They should be bigger. And this is why.
> 
> How many times have you been browsing, and seen an interesting thumbnail that looks to be relevant to your interests. You click it, and see something you really wish you hadn't. Something you might have spotted from a larger thumbnail. All this shite about larger thumbnails increasing server load is entirely true. By a few kb per image. Not exactly a massive increase that will overload the servers and cause FA to collapse into a pool of lava.



A few kb of data doesn't seem like much until you start getting into how many users there are on the site at any given time.


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## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

Ben said:


> But seriously, this strikes me as such an insubstantial, hand-wavey update, when you guys know that the thing at the top of everyone's wishlists isn't "bigger thumbnails." And I like that the solution to "We never post anything worthwhile in the news updates column!" is to get rid of it entirely instead of generating worthwhile things to put in it. The fact that it didn't even work flawlessly though really just adds insult to injury.


There's more to this update than merely thumbnails and a navbar. Have patience. We haven't given an official update yet, nor stated all the changes.

It does work flawlessly, but we have to convert over all the existing thumbnails. Takes a bit of time.


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## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

ADF said:


> Four people share this house and I share a room with one. Switching between SFW and NSFW based on the 10s of minutes I'm alone would be impractical.


Use a different browser for one -vs- the other. Will make life easier.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> So we can all be bombarded by unnecessarily large thumbnails I take it? This isn't a very good update.


Dude stop, at this point all you are doing is going "argh how dare they change something minor, the whole site is ruined!"


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## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Dude stop, at this point all you are doing is going "argh how dare they change something minor, the whole site is ruined!"


We tested the thumbnails with a variety of laptops, from a Kindle Fire, netbook (1366x768) to a 1920x1200 display. They actually view fairly well over a variety of devices.


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## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> I just noticed something.  I had earlier approved of using the space from removing the news to show more submissions.  But now I see that stories and poetry sections were combined, so both of those don't actually get any extra space.
> 
> Makes me sad.  I have to disagree with this.  Us writers get the short end of the stick enough already, this makes me feel like I've been evicted from 2nd class and have to ride in steerage now.  Give us some love!
> 
> Edit: It's worse actually.  The extra space gives more icons but combining them actually means less show up for each section so it's not a sidegrade, but a downgrade.



Did you consider the amount of stories / poetry being uploaded per hour, compared to art?
On average, a story has way more frontpage time than a submission.



Dragoneer said:


> We tested the thumbnails with a variety of laptops, from a Kindle Fire, netbook (1366x768) to a 1920x1200 display. They actually view fairly well over a variety of devices.



You can add a iPad (2) to that list.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Well since yak is now on here as well and my question didn't get answered-
Yak is my guess that the site now uses divisions correct?

Can you give me a rough summary of the changes?  Is this the beta for the new UI? etc.


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> Look, unless you're going to come up with some good reasons why this update is as bad as you make it out to be, aside from your personal opinion, I'd like to ask you to take it down a notch.
> We get it, you don't like the new layout. Really.



What it really comes down to is what is appealing to the eye, and this new set up is not very appealing. Maybe its because the old layout has better spacing for my monitor, the or maybe its because smaller thumbnails are easier on the eye when the page if full of them. Perhaps is a combination of both. The larger thumbnails just flat out don't look as good. Sure some love them because of how they can now see what thier getting before they click, but it does nothing for my and to a point is bothersome to the eye.


----------



## Trunchbull (Apr 1, 2012)

I wouldn't be complaining if the thumbnails weren't so ridiculously huge. The website isnt primarily visited with old folk hard of seeing.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> Did you consider the amount of stories / poetry being uploaded per hour, compared to art?
> On average, a story has way more frontpage time than a submission.



True, it does stay up there longer.  I'm just sad that that time has now been shortened.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Trunchbull said:


> I wouldn't be complaining if the thumbnails weren't so ridiculously huge. The website isnt primarily visited with old folk hard of seeing.


Think about it this way, if a submission has shitting dick nipples and the characters being torn limb from limb while pissing on each other a larger thumbnail will allow a person to realize what the submition actually contains instead of stumbling upon it by accident.


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Think about it this way, if a submission has shitting dick nipples and the characters being torn limb from limb while pissing on each other a larger thumbnail will allow a person to realize what the submition actually contains instead of stumbling upon it by accident.



Except that most of the time, assuming the "artist" isn't using a custom thumbnail, you should be able to see that even with the old smaller ones, I know I could, but then my vision is perfect.


----------



## JamesTheDog (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Think about it this way, if a submission has shitting dick nipples and the characters being torn limb from limb while pissing on each other a larger thumbnail will allow a person to realize what the submition actually contains instead of stumbling upon it by accident.



That's not always a good thing though, I know quite a few people who get by with the adult filter switched off because they found the thumbnails weren't really big enough to make it out enough to bother them- now it's a LOT easier to make out what's in a submission without needing to click on it.


----------



## Trunchbull (Apr 1, 2012)

Did they destroy the custom thumbnailing? The thumbnails i set for the art submission do not show up when I'm browsing through a Gallery. They do show up on the profile page.

question that was never answered.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> Except that most of the time, assuming the "artist" isn't using a custom thumbnail, you should be able to see that even with the old smaller ones, I know I could, but then my vision is perfect.


By that logic it wouldn't matter if the thumbnail was 150x150 or 10x10.  It's JUST a matter of making it easier to see.  ANYBODY with ANY sort of level of web design knows that a larger thumbnail is easier on the eyes.


I doubt a week from now you are even going to care.  Every time the site changes something furries go "ON NOES the site is ruined 4ever!" and a week later they forget.


JamesTheDog said:


> That's not always a good thing though, I know  quite a few people who get by with the adult filter switched off  because they found the thumbnails weren't really big enough to make it  out enough to bother them- now it's a LOT easier to make out what's in a  submission without needing to click on it.


If it's easier to make out what the submission is then it reduces the chances of a person accidentally clicking it.


----------



## yak (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Well since yak is now on here as well and my question didn't get answered-
> Yak is my guess that the site now uses divisions correct?


Just the gallery component.



CannonFodder said:


> Can you give me a rough summary of the changes?  Is this the beta for the new UI? etc.


No, it is not - but some changes done here are a prerequisite.
Three things changed:
* news section on frontpage abolished. news are now Fender's journal posts. allows for discussion
* replaced gallery component. horizontal and vertical alignment of images in their cells, consistent look across all parts of fa
* most important - almost all of the places where submission images are shown is now done through the thumbnail server. allows for arbitrary sized thumbnails and that in turn allows for larger res. uploads.

Despite optimizations the thumbnail server is taking a hit. Thumbs are generated and cached on demand; with an empty cache the server is resizing every thumbnail of every size as it's requested when as in normal operation, it would do so to 1 out of 100.
It will take some time before it starts working properly.


----------



## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> Use a different browser for one -vs- the other. Will make life easier.



Having to manage two different windows showing variations of the same content, flipping between them every time someone walks in, does not make life easier.

I'm not bawwing for things to be changed back the way they were, I know this is what we're stuck with now and I'll have to adapt. I'm just stating that these changes will make my browsing experience less enjoyable. Not only will it be more difficult to browse without attracting the attention of others to mature content on the screen, whether or not I'm actually viewing that particular piece, but if there is adult themes I personally don't like; I don't even have to click the icon to see the image properly. The content of these images is clearly visible from the icon alone now, that hyper penis image I'd usually avoid in the transformation section is now in clear detail on the screen.

It's just something I'm going to have to learn to accommodate. Where previously I could just not click on particular content when in the presence of others, I'll have to treat FA like a porn site, to be visited in privacy.


----------



## Smelge (Apr 1, 2012)

yak said:


> * news section on frontpage abolished. news are now Fender's journal posts. allows for discussion



Does that mean everyone is automatically watching Fender? Or do we have to go and manually watch him? And how exactly is that going to work for people who are not coming into this thread to see it? The newsbox they would have looked at has been abolished. Second, how exactly will that work? lots of people don't check their journals, so just another username in a list to get ignored or missed.


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> By that logic it wouldn't matter if the thumbnail was 150x150 or 10x10.  It's JUST a matter of making it easier to see.  ANYBODY with ANY sort of level of web design knows that a larger thumbnail is easier on the eyes.



I don't know if I'm a special case then, but the 6x8 grid that I had (I view 48 submissions at a time) looks miles better then whats going on here. Smaller with more thumbnails per row tends to look better on wider monitors.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

yak said:


> Just the gallery component.
> 
> 
> No, it is not - but some changes done here are a prerequisite.
> ...


And here furries are going "t3h site is ruined"

Lemme guess, just the gallery component has divisions for now cause the rest is being a bitch to fix?

*The news section change isn't to big of a change imo, I don't see why they are freaking out.
*Woohoo!
*I always wondered why Fa did that.

So about a day or so until the site is back to normal?


thoron said:


> I don't know if I'm a special case then, but the  6x8 grid that I had (I view 48 submissions at a time) looks miles better  then whats going on here. Smaller with more thumbnails per row tends to  look better on wider monitors.


Did you even read yak's post?


----------



## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

Smelge said:


> Does that mean everyone is automatically watching Fender? Or do we have to go and manually watch him? And how exactly is that going to work for people who are not coming into this thread to see it? The newsbox they would have looked at has been abolished. Second, how exactly will that work? lots of people don't check their journals, so just another username in a list to get ignored or missed.



You don't have to watch him. When a news post is made there will be a box above the recent gallery with a link and description of the news update, where you can click it... or close it after you read it. When a new post is made the box will pop back up.


----------



## Smelge (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> You don't have to watch him. When a news post is made there will be a box above the recent gallery with a link and description of the news update, where you can click it... or close it after you read it. When a new post is made the box will pop back up.



Like that FA:U one that's currently squatting under the banner?


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Did you even read yak's post?



Yes I did, the grid does adjust to the resolution of the window, but thats the problem, it doesn't look as good unless you have a larger monitor. 6x8 with the smaller thumbnails fit mine perfectly, it was easy on the eyes too.


----------



## Arshes Nei (Apr 1, 2012)

ADF said:


> Four people share this house and I share a room with one. Switching between SFW and NSFW based on the 10s of minutes I'm alone would be impractical.



Tabs sir, use Tabs. Get the plugin (if you got firefox) that lets you color your tabs too.


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

Arshes Nei said:


> Tabs sir, use Tabs. Get the plugin (if you got firefox) that lets you color your tabs too.



So your saying we should just make our own workarounds cause the site designers decided larger thumbnails who's details can be seen across the room was a good idea?


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> Yes I did, the grid does adjust to the resolution of the window, but thats the problem, it doesn't look as good unless you have a larger monitor. 6x8 with the smaller thumbnails fit mine perfectly, it was easy on the eyes too.


Christ.  You aren't even raising a valid point anymore or contributing to the discussion.  You are just spouting, "I don't think it looks look therefore the whole update is terrible."


----------



## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

Sorry if it has already been stated, but I notice the custom icons I assigned for images are pretty much only appearing in my user page and nowhere else. Not in the gallery or in the main FA art browser. 

Am I going to have to go through the entire gallery and re-select the icons for each image?


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Christ.  You aren't even raising a valid point anymore or contributing to the discussion.  You are just spouting, "I don't think it looks look therefore the whole update is terrible."



My only gripe against the update is the thumbnail size. Everything else if fine as far as I'm concerned at this point.


----------



## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> Yes I did, the grid does adjust to the resolution of the window, but thats the problem, it doesn't look as good unless you have a larger monitor. 6x8 with the smaller thumbnails fit mine perfectly, it was easy on the eyes too.



May I ask,
What device are you browsing on? And what's it's resolution?


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> My only gripe against the update is the thumbnail size. Everything else if fine as far as I'm concerned at this point.


That's my point.  You aren't contributing to the discussion, you are having a hissy fit.  Every last post of yours the last few pages has been the exact same thing just using different wording.


----------



## jayhusky (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> You don't have to watch him. When a news post is made there will be a box above the recent gallery with a link and description of the news update, where you can click it... or close it after you read it. When a new post is made the box will pop back up.



Sounds remarkably like something I suggested to you 'neer. Ah well at least it will look good 



Smelge said:


> Like that FA:U one that's currently squatting under the banner?



Yes I would think it would look rather like that one.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

ADF said:


> Having to manage two different windows showing variations of the same content, flipping between them every time someone walks in, does not make life easier.



I guess if you want to BROWSE PORN you have to accept people might see you BROWSING PORN.   As said before, you can turn off adult content entirely in your filter settings, that way no porn will show up for anyone to see.


----------



## Fenrari (Apr 1, 2012)

I'm lagging while looking at journals like a mofo...


----------



## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

Fenrari said:


> I'm lagging while looking at journals like a mofo...



...How?

Nothing on journal pages was changed. (Aside from some new content in the css file that doesn't change anything to journal pages)


----------



## Kyrodo (Apr 1, 2012)

Load progress after ten minutes of doing other things... I don't give a crap about the layout change, but the x20 increase in loading time is a no-no. Speed optimization requested. inb4 It's the damn site, not my internet connection. Actually starting to see pictures now though, it's just so effing slow it's ridiculous.


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> May I ask,
> What device are you browsing on? And what's it's resolution?



Its a dell inspiron and the monitor is about 13.5x7.5 so I think its about a 15in monitor. The issue now is more about aesthetic appeal more then anything else at this point, the smaller thumbnails just look better to me. Plus they allowed for the 6x8 grid that works well for this monitor.



CannonFodder said:


> That's my point.  You aren't contributing to the discussion, you are having a hissy fit.  Every last post of yours the last few pages has been the exact same thing just using different wording.



Its a gripe about the aesthetic details, which is still last I checked important to webdesign. Don't like it? Deal with it. Where are my sunglasses?


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

Another change I see is link formatting has changed again.

Links used to be white, but are now formatted exactly like bold text.   So you can't tell the difference between bold or a link anymore.

Whatever happened to underlined, blue links?  The lack of underlining especially hurts, as it's impossible to tell without mousing over the entire screen whats a link and what isn't.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

Kyrodo said:


> Load progress after ten minutes of doing other things... I don't give a crap about the layout change, but the x20 increase in loading time is a no-no. Speed optimization requested. inb4 It's the damn site, not my internet connection. Actually starting to see pictures now though, it's just so effing slow it's ridiculous.



This will be fixed when the thumbnail cashes are rebuilt.  This will happen... eventually.  

Read that big, red ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE right at the top of the screenshot you posted.  :-|


----------



## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

Kyrodo said:


> Load progress after ten minutes of doing other things... I don't give a crap about the layout change, but the x20 increase in loading time is a no-no. Speed optimization requested. inb4 It's the damn site, not my internet connection. Actually starting to see pictures now though, it's just so effing slow it's ridiculous.


Did you even read the announcement that's on every page on FA?



thoron said:


> Its a dell inspiron and the monitor is about 13.5x7.5 so I think its about a 15in monitor. The issue now is more about aesthetic appeal more then anything else at this point, the smaller thumbnails just look better to me. Plus they allowed for the 6x8 grid that works well for this monitor.



I didn't ask you about the screen's size, but it's resolution.


----------



## CrazyLee (Apr 1, 2012)

*checks date*

Eyup.


...Wait, are you saying this is ACTUALLY an update? Psh, if it is, it's a bad time to do it. If it isn't, I can just imagine the armies of furs angry they can't reach their fap material.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> Its a gripe the aesthetic details, which is still last I checked important to webdesign. Don't like it? Deal with it. Where are my sunglasses?


You know more about web design even though my degree requires _basic_ web design classes?  Tell me more about how you know more about my own field than I do.
Or better yet while you are at it how about you go tell a doctor you know more about medicine by doing a appendectomy?


----------



## Wolf Pup TK (Apr 1, 2012)

Custom thumbnails don't display. It just shows the shrunken image instead.


----------



## Kyrodo (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> This will be fixed when the thumbnail cashes are rebuilt.  This will happen... eventually.
> 
> Read that big, red ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE right at the top of the screenshot you posted.  :-|


Ah... well that is helpful.


----------



## Gavrill (Apr 1, 2012)

I think it's possible that since every time FA updates there tends to be a huge rush of people coming to see what's up, so that's likely why places other than the mainpage are loading so badly.

April Fools how did unbork FA tia


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## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

Gavrill said:


> I think it's possible that since every time FA updates there tends to be a huge rush of people coming to see what's up, so that's likely why places other than the mainpage are loading so badly.
> 
> April Fools how did unbork FA tia



Any page that has submission thumbnails will have trouble loading those.
Any page that doesn't should load just fine. (And does for me, actually)


----------



## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> I guess if you want to BROWSE PORN you have to accept people might see you BROWSING PORN.   As said before, you can turn off adult content entirely in your filter settings, that way no porn will show up for anyone to see.



And if I am not browsing PORN and just want to check the latest art, I have to change my viewing options on the fly; because the PORN sticks out like a sore thumb. I could be viewing general TF art and whoops sorry, you get hyper dick on your screen...

I've said my piece on the matter and I'm not interested in arguing with people who wish to defend the changes. I'll just get accused of droning on about it when I'd just be reacting to other people's responses.


----------



## Gavrill (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> Any page that has submission thumbnails will have trouble loading those.
> Any page that doesn't should load just fine. (And does for me, actually)


Journals/pages/individual submissions do load faster for me than anything with thumbnails, but it's still a bit laggy when I bring them up. I think this might be on my end though because my internet has randomly blipped out several times today. 
"April Fools from you local internet provider, teehee." >:[


----------



## Kihari (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> Whatever happened to underlined, blue links?



They went the way of frame layouts, light-grey backgrounds, and little GIF navigation icons at the bottom of every page.


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> You know more about web design even though my degree requires _basic_ web design classes?  Tell me more about how you know more about my own field than I do.
> Or better yet while you are at it how about you go tell a doctor you know more about medicine by doing a appendectomy?



The argument I'm making is about the aesthetic side of it, I'll be happy to admit I don't know much about the programing aspect, I just know what looks good.


----------



## thoron (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> I didn't ask you about the screen's size, but it's resolution.



Sorry about that, I got them mixed up. its 1366x768.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> The argument I'm making is about the aesthetic side of it, I'll be happy to admit I don't know much about the programing aspect, I just know what looks good.


There's far more to designing and making a website than "herp durp this dun look gud".


----------



## Velos (Apr 1, 2012)

I'm in no way a fan of the thumbnail size change either.  They are no longer _thumb_nails.

I used to be able to see a full 36-count page of new submissions in my windowed browser before.  Now, even when I maximize the window I can only see 15 thumbs at best.  On a user page, I could easily see all 10 recent gallery/favorite images before, now I only see _4_ unless I maximize the browser window.

This is on a standard 1280x1024 lcd screen.  I'm afraid to see how cramped the changes will be on my 1024x700 netbook.


----------



## -DC- (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Think about it this way, if a submission has shitting dick nipples and the characters being torn limb from limb while pissing on each other a larger thumbnail will allow a person to realize what the submition actually contains instead of stumbling upon it by accident.


So, what you're saying is that now, instead of the off chance you _might_ click something that is one of those types of submissions, which you could almost always tell well enough without detail with the small thumbs anyway, now we get to see every single shitting dick nipples and ripped off limbs in every single thumbnail in detail while trying to browse without seeing them? GENIUS!

It's so totally going to be much better seeing the details of every single submission we don't want to in these bigger thumbs instead of accidentally clicking on one once in a blue moon.

On a side note, one shouldn't have to buy a new computer / monitor / change how and what they use to browse the net just for this one website simply because the few people designing the site enjoy it that way. I don't know anyone browsing this site out in public on their ipads and laptops, most are on their desktop computers, and most aren't rich enough to buy all brand new shit, or care for super large resolutions. Of which, are the only ones that look even remotely good with this style. You could view much more images in smaller page space for much faster browsing before, and all lined up seamlessly, and one wasn't forced to see all the crap they didin't want to. There was nothing wrong with the design.

Personally, for me, the thumbs are all displaying vertically. They don't even line up. Not only that, but they are completely cut off after 2 images in the submissions and faves areas simply because that's all that fits there. I now have a mile of scrolling and see only 2 or 3 thumbnails on the screen at any time.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Velos said:


> I'm in no way a fan of the thumbnail size change either.  They are no longer _thumb_nails.
> 
> I used to be able to see a full 36-count page of new submissions in my windowed browser before.  Now, even when I maximize the window I can only see 15 thumbs at best.  On a user page, I could easily see all 10 recent gallery/favorite images before, now I only see _4_ unless I maximize the browser window.
> 
> This is on a standard 1280x1024 lcd screen.  I'm afraid to see how cramped the changes will be on my 1024x700 netbook.


Goddamnit not another one.


----------



## Kihari (Apr 1, 2012)

While we're talking about monitor resolutions, I should probably point out that the experimental header thing did not render as intended on my screen. I can't get to it now, but if I remember correctly, *+Community* was down on its own line at the very left, with about 15px of space between it and its buddies, and *~Kihari* was on the same line with it, kind of floating in the middle.

Having a bunch of stuff grouped under *+FA* certainly helped though. I think it was all just shy of fitting on the same line; fudging the margins between things might have put it right, but I've no way to measure it now to tell. Should have screencapped.

nb, my laptop is super-old and displays best at 1024px, which is where I keep it, so there's that.


----------



## CrazyLee (Apr 1, 2012)

For some reason I noticed a mature didn't have a red outline around it. All the other matures seemed to have the outlines, though.


I have to agree with above comments that having the thumbnails smaller so you don't have to have strange porn popping up large on your monitor was a good thing.

This seems more like just a site redesign rather than overhauling the back end, but it would have been nice to have a way to look at New Submissions while sorting them by maturity level, like being able to filter out the porn, or show only the clean art, or show only the mature art. Without having to go into the account settings and turning on/off the filter.

In fact, that sounds like a really easy thing to implement based on my limited knowledge of databases and web programming.


----------



## Accountability (Apr 1, 2012)

It's nice to see that the design that was leaked twice and everyone said "the thumbnails are too big!" was released with no changes and no options to revert to the old design. Clearly, the administration is thinking for _all_ the users and not just the ones with tablets and big monitors.

It also seemed to me the thumbnails were working just fine in the preview sites, even on new submissions. Glad to see the "Experts" are still in charge of the tech "team".


----------



## Arram (Apr 1, 2012)

ADF said:


> And if I am not browsing PORN and just want to check the latest art, I have to change my viewing options on the fly; because the PORN sticks out like a sore thumb. I could be viewing general TF art and whoops sorry, you get hyper dick on your screen...
> 
> I've said my piece on the matter and I'm not interested in arguing with people who wish to defend the changes. I'll just get accused of droning on about it when I'd just be reacting to other people's responses.



A solution has already been given to you. If you aren't going to be browsing porn, all you need to do is change the www in the url to sfw. This solution takes all of 3 seconds and minimal effort.


----------



## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> So your saying we should just make our own workarounds cause the site designers decided larger thumbnails who's details can be seen across the room was a good idea?


Your roommate issues are not site issues.


----------



## -DC- (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> You know more about web design even though my degree requires _basic_ web design classes?



Since when did knowing _basic_ anything make a person the guru of said subject?


----------



## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

Accountability said:


> It's nice to see that the design that was leaked twice and everyone said "the thumbnails are too big!" was released with no changes and no options to revert to the old design. Clearly, the administration is thinking for _all_ the users and not just the ones with tablets and big monitors.


Honestly, I'm fine with it. While some of the aspects were leaked, most people found the larger thumbnails fine. We had a lot of complaints about thumbnails being too small prior.

We'll never make everyone happy.


----------



## Deleted member 3615 (Apr 1, 2012)

Ya know, there's a reason why they're called "thumbnails" ...


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

-DC- said:


> Since when did knowing _basic_ anything make a person the guru of said subject?


I didn't say it did.  I was implying that violating the basic web design rules is just fucking stupid.
I'll give you a analogy, let's say a artist wanted to paint a brown on a canvas and then they decided to use shit for the brown.


Dragoneer said:


> Your roommate issue are not site issues.


I think at this point this thread has gone into the generic "Why aren't you pleasing every last person that uses fa".


----------



## Accountability (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> Honestly, I'm fine with it. While some of the aspects were leaked, most people found the larger thumbnails fine. We had a lot of complaints about thumbnails being too small prior.
> 
> We'll never make everyone happy.



The old thumbnails were small, yes, but doubling the size is a bit too much. A max height of 150px probably would have gone over better. Not too big, not too small.

See also the part about "options to revert to the old design".


----------



## sandfox (Apr 1, 2012)

These thumbnails are much too big

please can you make them no bigger than 150x150 or go back to the old ones if you cant


----------



## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

Arram said:


> A solution has already been given to you. If you aren't going to be browsing porn, all you need to do is change the www in the url to sfw. This solution takes all of 3 seconds and minimal effort.



I'm a big transformation fan, but as with anyone; I'm going to have varying tastes. The saying used to be that if you didn't like something, you didn't have to look at it. People could deal with diaper furs and the sort because the image icon was small enough not to be disgusting to them; while being just the right size to recognise its contents. But people can no longer "just not look at it" any more, we're seeing other people's taste in fetish art whether we like it or not. 

Right now in the transformation "tame" section, first image is a naked hairy man turning into a horse; with a TFing penis on show. This isn't my thing, but there it is in full clarity none the less. Three pages into the "tame" TF section, there is a fur in a diaper. Why there is a diaper fur in the transformation section is anyone's guess; but there it is none the less. Just the other day I probably wouldn't have even noticed these, but now I can pretty much see the full image while browsing.

But I'm being told I'm not allowed to criticise any of this, because I have the option of censoring "all" mature content. I can censor everything including the stuff I do like; if I don't want to see the stuff I don't like, and that's being presented as a valid solution.

Sorry, but this solution has the subtlety of a mallet. I recognise what has gone wrong for me with the main site, don't try to downplay it with none solutions. Quite frankly I think this is going to lead to more user vs user hate as with the cub furs, because the presence of such art is going to become more obvious and less ignorable.


----------



## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

Accountability said:


> The old thumbnails were small, yes, but doubling the size is a bit too much. A max height of 150px probably would have gone over better. Not too big, not too small.
> 
> See also the part about "options to revert to the old design".



I doubt it's just me, but I don't see any thumbnails that are larger than 150x150.

I don't think reverting to the old design is a option here, since that would more or less double out thumbnail cache, as well as some other technical issues I don't know enough about to use as a reason, here.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> I doubt it's just me, but I don't see any thumbnails that are larger than 150x150.
> 
> I don't think reverting to the old design is a option here, since that would more or less double out thumbnail cache, as well as some other technical issues I don't know enough about to use as a reason, here.


Oh god could you imagine the shit storm if there was a announcement going, "sorry guys the thumbnails will take two days to recache"?


----------



## celestialsunberry (Apr 1, 2012)

Even if this is a joke or not....Srsly....

IT'S A LAYOUT ON A WEBSITE, PEOPLE. A website!

Chill out. Relax.

It's a layout. on a website.

Joke or not.

Oh, furries...furries.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

ADF said:


> I'm a big transformation fan, but as with anyone; I'm going to have varying tastes. The saying used to be that if you didn't like something, you didn't have to look at it. People could deal with diaper furs and the sort because the image icon was small enough not to be disgusting to them; while being just the right size to recognise its contents. But people can no longer "just not look at it" any more, we're seeing other people's taste in fetish art whether we like it or not.



It is a fact of life that some people will not care, or know about rules, or make mistakes in classifying uploads.  No matter what FA or any other site does, you are going to be exposed to things you find disgusting, just as others will be exposed to things you like but they find disgusting.

Even if every images is perfectly cataloged, you are still going to run into pictures of a transforming half-horse man wearing a diaper.  People like to mix fetishes, and you will NEVER be able to filter them all out, not when new ones are always being invented.

If porn is showing up in art marked General, that's the uploaders fault.  I'm not defending the new thumbnail size here, just saying you can't expect the rest of the world to cater to your interests.  We all share this site.  We all see things we don't like.  Even with the smaller icons I can usually see enough to make me turn green.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> I doubt it's just me, but I don't see any thumbnails that are larger than 150x150.



Actually, the thumbnails for the Gallery and Favorites are 200x200.  Using Chrome.


----------



## Accountability (Apr 1, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> I doubt it's just me, but I don't see any thumbnails that are larger than 150x150.
> 
> I don't think reverting to the old design is a option here, since that would more or less double out thumbnail cache, as well as some other technical issues I don't know enough about to use as a reason, here.



Every thumbnail in my new submissions is 200px tall, and has "@200" in the url. 

Actually, now that I look at it, it seems that the 200px thumbnails are only in the new submissions page and the various browse pages. Thumbnails on the front page are 150px and thumbnails on the user page are 100px.

If there are already three sizes of thumbnails, then it would be trivial to implement an option to force using only one of the sizes across the entire site.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Accountability said:


> Every thumbnail in my new submissions is 200px tall, and has "@200" in the url.
> 
> Actually, now that I look at it, it seems that the 200px thumbnails are only in the new submissions page and the various browse pages. Thumbnails on the front page are 150px and thumbnails on the user page are 100px.
> 
> If there are already three sizes of thumbnails, then it would be trivial to implement an option to force using only one of the sizes across the entire site.


Design wise you aren't supposed to have thumbnails ALL the same size.


----------



## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> It is a fact of life that some people will not care, or know about rules, or make mistakes in classifying uploads.  No matter what FA or any other site does, you are going to be exposed to things you find disgusting, just as others will be exposed to things you like but they find disgusting.
> 
> Even if every images is perfectly cataloged, you are still going to run into pictures of a transforming half-horse man wearing a diaper.  People like to mix fetishes, and you will NEVER be able to filter them all out, not when new ones are always being invented.
> 
> If porn is showing up in art marked General, that's the uploaders fault.  I'm not defending the thumbnail art here,* just saying you can't expect the rest of the world to cater to your interests*.  We all share this site.  We all see things we don't like.  Even with the smaller icons I can usually see enough to make me turn green.



Clearly I don't expect that as I haven't said anything along those lines. What I am saying is before people could ignore the art they didn't like because the small icons hid most of the detail, we didn't bother each other because people's fetishes were not shoved in everyone's face. Art content is now fully visible even in icon form, so you cannot "just not look at it".

If people think the drama over baby furs is bad now, just wait until visible cub genitalia is showing up in the latest submissions. Then they can be told they shouldn't complain because they can broadly censor all the content they do like to block out those few distasteful images.


----------



## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Oh god could you imagine the shit storm if there was a announcement going, "sorry guys the thumbnails will take two days to recache"?


I'm sure people will rather like many of the other updates coming out, as well as some continued page fixes/cleanup which will be on-going throughout April.


----------



## Accountability (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> I'm sure people will rather like many of the other updates coming out, as well as some continued page fixes/cleanup which will be on-going throughout April.




Why not just work on the new UI instead of polishing the turd that is the old one?



CannonFodder said:


> Design wise you aren't supposed to have thumbnails ALL the same size.



FA did it for how many years now?


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Design wise you aren't supposed to have thumbnails ALL the same size.



I think he meant that if 150x150 icons exist in the cache, it should be trivial to be able to use those (or others) instead of the 200x200 ones in the galleries as an option.  The other sizes are fine, but letting people pick which ones to use would solve most of the complaints.  People who liek them big can see them, people who want to see lots at once to scan can, and those that want small ones to hide details can do so as well.

The sizes available it seems are...

100x100
120x120
150x150
200x200
300x300

And of course the full size image.


----------



## quoting_mungo (Apr 1, 2012)

No, not keen on the huge space-hogging thumbnails, either. 120 was fairly large for a thumbnail already; 150 or even 175 would've been plenty, and would've possibly allowed writing to come in above the fold. I don't need to see image details on the front page, and the drop shadow on the thumbnails makes the border color harder to distinguish. (And I would personally have _loved_ to see the site forcing square or whatever proportion thumbnails by the thumbnailer cropping things; it would have counteracted some of the "ick way too much empty space" response I have to this new layout. I'm just not feeling ANY continuty on the front page between the massive amounts of empty space and the removal of the site news column.)

Likewise, not liking the navbar squeezed in at the top of the window above the site banner on the dev site at all - it gets way too close to the browser menus and the text is small enough to make the teeny-tiny little bar practically disappear up there. I actually went to the dev site and spent several seconds going "but where did all the menu options go?" Kudos for finally moving the ad banners up where they should've been all along, but please consider moving the nav bar down BELOW the banners. I do enough misclicking and accidentally navigating over to bookmarked sites already just switching between tabs, don't need to have misclick potential from the other side as well.

It IS nice that the problem with not having space reserved for the big preview on user pages when mousing over recent submissions is finally fixed. 



Dragoneer said:


> The news column is gone, and has been replaced. Fender's journals will now represent the official FA news line of the site. When a new journal/notice is posted it will flag a news post that will notify you there's a new update. Click it, and get taken to the story.
> 
> It's really much more efficient moving forward.



Excuse my scepticism, but there was an announcement to the effect of "watch Fender's journal for site news" approximately half a year back and since I watched Fender I don't think I've gotten _one single update_ through that thing. Meanwhile, your journal has had all kinds of site news sprinkled in among the "look at the cool-stuff-of-the-day I found" type posts you make. (I mean no offense by that, but I personally have no interest in following your work OR the non-site-related journals you post.)


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Accountability said:


> FA did it for how many years now?


Just cause FA did it for years doesn't mean it's proper.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

Accountability said:


> Why not just work on the new UI instead of polishing the turd that is the old one?



This is why nobody is ever happy.  People can have vastly different tastes.  I actually LIKE the general design of FA>  I think there are some improvements that can be made of course, and serious bugs that need fixed, but I like the site.

The problem with a totally new UI is you are almost guaranteed to get rid of a ton of stuff people like, and replace current flaws with new flaws.   The current design has bugs and issues but the good thing is after years of use, we KNOW what those flaws and bugs are.  A new site would just give us a whole new list of bugs, but we would have to find them one by one all over again.


----------



## yak (Apr 1, 2012)

It is technically possible to allow a selection of a preferred thumbnail size, but to actually be able to allow it will take some work on styles and templates, and to a lesser degree - the code. 
Right now I just want to get the thumbnail server properly operational. When it's done I'll be looking over the feedback we've received and applying requested changes that seem reasonable.


----------



## chineseshell (Apr 1, 2012)

Lol why isn't it even a requirement to make thumbnails work safe friendly? That would end a good amount of complaining right there. You shouldn't have to see a bear pooping himself in a diaper just because it was a thumbnail on a user's page. You can have thumbnails that "reflect the images they represent" while keeping everything work safe. People already do that on their own just fine. It should be a requirement.


----------



## Dragoneer (Apr 1, 2012)

Accountability said:


> Why not just work on the new UI instead of polishing the turd that is the old one?


Because I'm honestly trying out some new things, and trying to improve - and that will translate over to the new UI when it's ready. The new Navbar that is going into play is directly from the new UI design, though not as refined as I'd like it yet. Main problem is the new UI is not ready. I just don't feel it's "there" yet. It's better, but not the huge jump it needs to be.

I'm learning a lot about CSS and trying to improve my skills. This can go forward towards that.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> I'm learning a lot about CSS and trying to improve my skills. This can go forward towards that.


I'm sure there's a number of people who'd be willing to help.  A couple of us on FaF know CSS.  I personally prefer handcoding it instead of using dreamweaver or such.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> Because I'm honestly trying out some new things, and trying to improve - and that will translate over to the new UI when it's ready.



Please please please make sure all the current features are in the new one.  SoFurry (formerly Yiffstar) is a perfect example of what not to do.  The transition to SoFurry was PAINFUL.  Nothing worked right for MONTHS.  The 2.0 transition was better, but there are still things that just got dropped and while there are some improvements, thats offset by the loss of things too.

I've seen (and overseen) web site transitions before.  Its a VERY tricky operation.  People choose what site to live on because they like it.  They choose FA or SoFurry or Inkbunny or DA because they like what they see there.  Huge, sudden changes, even when they are improvements can get rid of the very thing that attracted people to the old site.  Not to say no improvements should ever be done, that is a disaster too, albet a slower one.  

That said, I have no idea what you have planned so hopefully you knew all this already.  I just can't take that chance and stay silent.  The world depends on it!  Lives hang in the balance!


----------



## Draconas (Apr 1, 2012)

Uhh, I had a chrome extension called "FA previewer".... guess what doesn't work now?


----------



## Objection (Apr 1, 2012)

chineseshell said:


> Lol why isn't it even a requirement to make thumbnails work safe friendly? That would end a good amount of complaining right there. You shouldn't have to see a bear pooping himself in a diaper just because it was a thumbnail on a user's page. You can have thumbnails that "reflect the images they represent" while keeping everything work safe. People already do that on their own just fine. It should be a requirement.



i agree with this, or i wish that the filters worked towards this idea. instead of completely hiding a mature/adult work, have a generic thumbnail with the blue/red border indicating whether it was mature or adult, and then have a text list on top of the general thumbnail as to why the picture was given that rating, as many other art sites already do. that way i would know what was in the picture beforehand and wouldn't have to rely on the artist making a work-safe thumbnail.


----------



## LizardKing (Apr 1, 2012)

Draconas said:


> Uhh, I had a chrome extension called "FA previewer".... guess what doesn't work now?



FA's thumbnails?


----------



## Draconas (Apr 1, 2012)

LizardKing said:


> FA's thumbnails?



dunno, just know the app doesn't work.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

Objection said:


> i agree with this, or i wish that the filters worked towards this idea. instead of completely hiding a mature/adult work, have a generic thumbnail with the blue/red border indicating whether it was mature or adult, and then have a text list on top of the general thumbnail as to why the picture was given that rating, as many other art sites already do. that way i would know what was in the picture beforehand and wouldn't have to rely on the artist making a work-safe thumbnail.



That depends on people marking things correctly.  If I had to go and label everythign offensive in everything I posted I'd probably just slap "PORN" on it all and call it done.

What would be nice, is to see an example of a working site that does thumbnails and ratings and tags correctly.  The site e621.net does a pretty good job at tagging things, but that's a cooperative effort among the users.  New posts still take time to get properly tagged.  Even it doesn't alow you to filter OUT things you don't want.

Filtering stuff you dislike is hard, even in concept.  I would never use it because what if I filter out "diapers" and miss out a picture of a cast of characters from a comic or story I like just because it had a baby in diapers is in the picture.   

I have to imagine making work safe thumbnails a requirment would be worse than what we have.  You would have to click on the full size image for things, having no idea whats there other than a few vague words which may or may not be correctly applied.


----------



## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

quoting_mungo said:


> Excuse my scepticism, but there was an announcement to the effect of "watch Fender's journal for site news" approximately half a year back and since I watched Fender I don't think I've gotten _one single update_ through that thing. Meanwhile, your journal has had all kinds of site news sprinkled in among the "look at the cool-stuff-of-the-day I found" type posts you make. (I mean no offense by that, but I personally have no interest in following your work OR the non-site-related journals you post.)



We're moving the original news section over to Fender's journals. Same amount of news, different location, with a notification on the frontpage if there's something new posted.


CannonFodder said:


> I'm sure there's a number of people who'd be willing to help.  A couple of us on FaF know CSS.  I personally prefer handcoding it instead of using dreamweaver or such.


Handcoding for the freaking win, seriously. Dreamweaver's just... Slower :/


Draconas said:


> Uhh, I had a chrome extension called "FA previewer".... guess what doesn't work now?



Extension is ded. Not big surprise.
I'm sure the author'll update it.


----------



## LizardKing (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> Even it doesn't alow you to filter OUT things you don't want.



You mean like this?

(Yes that is a link to e621, yes it is NSFW)


----------



## Traediras (Apr 1, 2012)

o3o

Don't mind the larger thumbs, it's understandable when you have a metric f-ton of submissions that generating new thumbs will take a while.

Also, is it just me or can't we access the FA preview anymore? D: Would love to see all the new stuff planned for it.


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## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

SIX said:


> sfw.furaffinity.net , which you should be already using when living with others



You're like the 3rd person to refer me to it. The problem isn't mature art being available, the problem is mature art I don't even intend to look at being visible to everyone else in the room while I'm browsing. I can take advantage of a odd seconds/minutes the person I share a room with is off doing something else to look at a mature piece, but I won't even find that interesting mature piece if I'm using the SFW site. But if I use the normal site, god knows what is going to end up on the screen while browsing around.

It was better before because the thumbnails were too small to be seen by anyone not directly in front of the computer, so you could specifically select to view whatever you want; without advertising the content you don't even care about to the rest of the room. 

Your gallery/favourites is chock full of adult pieces. Imagine being told "just use the SFW site"? Chances are you wouldn't find a lot of art that is to your taste.


----------



## Mwako (Apr 1, 2012)

I would like to re-post a question that has been asked earlier in this thread, but has yet to get a response:

For those of us that were already using custom thumbnails (mostly to warn people about content that they might not want to see), will we need to re-submit all of them?

Also: Why? Shouldn't the thumbnail generator have simply used the preexisting user-submitted thumbnail before it generated a new one, even for the larger size? Wouldn't that have saved server run-time and, frankly, user and admin time?

Finally: Why is the server also apparently re-caching the half-size view for the submissions? Currently I am forced to go to the full view to see most submissions, including older ones (I would understand if there were issues with new submissions that hadn't been cached yet). Again, this seems like something that is wasting server-time that could be used for getting all the new, larger thumbnails created.


----------



## MRGamer01 (Apr 1, 2012)

Blah blah blah bitch bitch bitch etc...

We'll all get used to it at some point.  Even then, if you don't I'm sure someone out there is already on a plugin to revert the look back to how it was, or someone here will step forth to do so (at this time I am unaware if one does exist, and I can't be arsed to find one).


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 1, 2012)

LizardKing said:


> You mean like this? (Yes that is a link to e621, yes it is NSFW)



Yeah, I didn't phrase that very well.  I meant you can't save a list of filters that are applied to your browsing.   You can type in a list of 100 tags you don't want to see every time but it's not very convenient.  No matter how many tags you filter out, there is just no way people wont get surprise (whatever) porn showing up.


----------



## Kirune (Apr 1, 2012)

At this point I'm just waiting for Dragoneer to realize this was a terrible idea, change the layout back and say "April Fools!!!!!"
Because seriously, if there were ever an opportune moment for dragoneer to test out a shitty idea, it's april fool's day.


----------



## LizardKing (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> Yeah, I didn't phrase that very well.  I meant you can't save a list of filters that are applied to your browsing.   You can type in a list of 100 tags you don't want to see every time but it's not very convenient.  No matter how many tags you filter out, there is just no way people wont get surprise (whatever) porn showing up.



Log in, add tags to blacklist. Bam.

This is totally off-topic though so yeah the thumbnails seem to be mostly working now yay and stuff.


----------



## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

Mwako said:


> I would like to re-post a question that has been asked earlier in this thread, but has yet to get a response:
> 
> For those of us that were already using custom thumbnails (mostly to warn people about content that they might not want to see), will we need to re-submit all of them?
> 
> ...



The custom thumbnails are showing on userpages, as far as I'm aware, so they're still on the server.
The tech staff's aware of that issue, and currently looking into it, I believe. (Currently not in contact with'm, as I'm in bed.)

The small views are part of the thumbnail system, so they had to be regenerated.

Also:
100x100
120x120
150x150
200x200
300x300
400x400 <-- missed that one.


----------



## Objection (Apr 1, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> That depends on people marking things correctly.  If I had to go and label everythign offensive in everything I posted I'd probably just slap "PORN" on it all and call it done.
> 
> What would be nice, is to see an example of a working site that does thumbnails and ratings and tags correctly.  The site e621.net does a pretty good job at tagging things, but that's a cooperative effort among the users.  New posts still take time to get properly tagged.  Even it doesn't alow you to filter OUT things you don't want.
> 
> ...


it's not tagging specifically. the sites i generally go on don't require the user to input their own reasons, rather, have a check list of basic warnings like "nudity", "sexual themes", "violence," "language", which are all rather short and don't require the user to go super indepth as to why a drawing is posted the way it was, which i find to be a rather simple process. perhaps "pornography" or something could be added for FA.

then again, i don't really care about furry porn so i wouldn't be looking for extremely specific tags as many others are. i mostly would just like to know if an image is mature/adult because it's sexual, violent, both, etc, not if the image happens to be sexual with diapers, or sexual with horses, etc, just if it's sexual in general.

but i also don't understand what would be be the problem of having a mature thumbnail for filtering instead of making the site appear as if the mature/adult images were never posted. perhaps a coding issue or personal preference, but i'd like to know the mature/adult images at least exist so i can gauge the activity of a user rather than think that they fell off the face of the planet if they decided to do mostly porn for two months. so shrug.


----------



## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

No one really answered my custom icons question a few pages back.

If you click the paw under my name and look at my FA user page, you will note that the icons for the submissions are zoomed shots of the images with "commission" on them. However if you check the gallery, with the changes in the recent update; these icons have been replaced with the new large ones. It's the same if you look at this art by browsing through FA, it uses the new large icons and not my custom ones. However if I click "change thumbnail" under a submission, it shows the custom icon I selected and not the new large icon presently in use.

So basically if you use a custom icon, it can be viewed on your user page and nowhere else. Are custom icons therefore being phased out? Because they are pretty much useless in their current state. Or are we still able to select custom icons for submissions that people will see, but it will be the new size?


----------



## chineseshell (Apr 1, 2012)

Sorry if this was mentioned before but it seems I can only access the WSF site. I was wondering how long this might last. /can'tfaptomypronz


----------



## CerbrusNL (Apr 1, 2012)

ADF said:


> No one really answered my custom icons question a few pages back.
> 
> If you click the paw under my name and look at my FA user page, you will note that the icons for the submissions are zoomed shots of the images with "commission" on them. However if you check the gallery, with the changes in the recent update; these icons have been replaced with the new large ones. It's the same if you look at this art by browsing through FA, it uses the new large icons and not my custom ones. However if I click "change thumbnail" under a submission, it shows the custom icon I selected and not the new large icon presently in use.
> 
> So basically if you use a custom icon, it can be viewed on your user page and nowhere else. Are custom icons therefore being phased out? Because they are pretty much useless in their current state. Or are we still able to select custom icons for submissions that people will see, but it will be the new size?



They're not getting removed. As far as I know, it's a bug.


----------



## LizardKing (Apr 1, 2012)

Augh, last post on the page. This better not get bumped off 2minutes later >:[

Anyway, in regards to custom thumbnails, here's some more quotage from IRC.

From #furaffinity, Feb 1st.

<LizardKing> yak[away]: I notice these thumbnails are just shrunken versions of the full submission instead of the custom thumbnails. Are the old thumbnails just going to be ignored until someone uploads a new larger thumbnail or what?
<yak[away]> LizardKing: yes. except that allowing larger thumbnail uploads has not been implemented yet
<LizardKing> Is there an ETA on that?
<yak[away]> I kinda sorta consider the thumbnail size change complete, hence why i'm asking people to test it and maybe provide some feedback and suggestions. a few more days of this and I'll put this live. the changes regarding custom thumbnail size will be done by next weekends, probably


----------



## ADF (Apr 1, 2012)

LizardKing said:


> Augh, last post on the page. This better not get bumped off 2minutes later >:[
> 
> Anyway, in regards to custom thumbnails, here's some more quotage from IRC.
> 
> ...



Appreciated.

Guess I'll have to set up a 200x200 "Commissions" icon then.


----------



## E1337ist (Apr 1, 2012)

JamesTheDog said:


> Does anyone else think the new thumbnails are too big?



*HELL. YES.*

Plus, where'd the site updates go? The front page displayed everything you needed to know right there, and you didn't really have to scroll to view other types of submissions, both of which are supposed to be thought out in terms of web design.

In terms of a primitive site design, FA is the only one I've seen actually done _right._ The dark color scheme contrasted nicely to the whole <table> layout. Shit, I'm even designing a desktop theme based around it as we speak. Let's not screw this up now, guys.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

E1337ist said:


> Plus, where'd the site updates go? The front page displayed everything you needed to know right there, and you didn't really have to scroll to view other types of submissions, both of which are supposed to be thought out in terms of web design.


Read the damn thread.
Site updates are now moved to the announcements.


----------



## Traediras (Apr 1, 2012)

I actually don't think the thumbnails are that bad. I'm sure though that someone will come out with a userstyle that shrinks the thumbnails to a smaller size (if it can be done). 

I think really they want to put the focus on the art, not on news updates. If there's a link to the artist who made the FA banner embedded on (or otherwise linked to) the banner, then all should be good, because the majority of major announcements are made site-wide available anyway.


----------



## MitchZer0 (Apr 1, 2012)

Neer, my daily doggy dicks are bigger.

Is this your cruel april fools joke?


----------



## Gavrill (Apr 1, 2012)

The thumbnails are all loading at a decent speed for me now, without the lag I had earlier.
but how come they can't make me coffee or fetch the paper yet? _â€‹gawd_


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## E1337ist (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> Personally I'm not a big fan of drop downs for everything. I like everything where it was before. The site was simple and looked decent, it functioned fine (most of the time). I personally find the these layout updates to be pointless and stupid. The sites functionality was perfect as it was. There is no need for huge thumbnails (idiot designers), also, give me back my news column.



I would have sex with this comment if I could.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

E1337ist said:


> I would have sex with this comment if I could.


I would castract this comment to prevent future breeding if I could.

It's already been stated that they're going to add custom thumbnail size, they're going to release the function later.  It's better to release something that you know works than to push a half finished non-functioning product out the door to appease people.


----------



## TakeWalker (Apr 1, 2012)

With the front page now loading thumbs, it looks nice. My main complaint at this point -- and don't ask me to read the thread, it's hucking fuge -- is that the popup descriptions no longer seem to work. I'm using Chrome, current version. Hoping this either got overlooked or is being worked on.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

TakeWalker said:


> With the front page now loading thumbs, it looks nice. My main complaint at this point -- and don't ask me to read the thread, it's hucking fuge -- is that the popup descriptions no longer seem to work. I'm using Chrome, current version. Hoping this either got overlooked or is being worked on.


They are at a later day going to allow custom sized thumbnails, it's just they are making sure it'll work first.


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## Kirune (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder all your "this is stuff going to be added later" should be taken with a heaping tablespoon of salt. 
We're talking about the FA dev team here.
The people who have done almost nothing but fuck shit up and delay new "features"

Furthermore: it's really something when you update your site and the majority of reactions are "what the shit, FA broke"


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Kirune said:


> CannonFodder all your "this is stuff going to be added later" should be taken with a heaping tablespoon of salt.
> We're talking about the FA dev team here.
> The people who have done almost nothing but fuck shit up and delay new "features"
> 
> Furthermore: it's really something when you update your site and the majority of reactions are "what the shit, FA broke"


I got a brilliant idea, it's the "FaF sudo coder" drinking game.  Every time you hear a "hurpa durp the site should have everything I want done already even though  I don't know anything about coding"  you take a shot.

The staff has already stated that the function works and is ready to roll out.

What furries think programming is: "fadslkasdfj*begins smashing fingers against keyboard and magically produces website*"
reality: knowing what you want to do and 90% of the time trying to find out where you made a fuck up in your coding.


----------



## Kihari (Apr 1, 2012)

TakeWalker said:


> With the front page now loading thumbs, it looks nice. My main complaint at this point -- and don't ask me to read the thread, it's hucking fuge -- is that the popup descriptions no longer seem to work. I'm using Chrome, current version. Hoping this either got overlooked or is being worked on.



They seem to be working in both Firefox and Chrome for me, although I notice the description text in the popup box is rendered as plaintext (edit: as opposed to formatted text, not HTML-unescaped plaintext (at least, we hope)). Try the usual client-side fixes? or perhaps they've made some changes in the meantime.


----------



## Devious Bane (Apr 1, 2012)

I guess people will stop keep complaining about the resolution of thumbnails now. They're so big your co-workers can make out what they are 3 desks behind you.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Devious Bane said:


> I guess people will stop keep complaining about the resolution of thumbnails now. They're so big your co-workers can make out what they are 3 desks behind you.


Downside: Furries can't watch porn in public


----------



## Summercat (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Downside: Furries can't watch porn in public



Wait. That's a *downside*?


----------



## Bluflare (Apr 1, 2012)

FA will never put* U* and *I* and make it a *new*.

Yeah but damn thumbnails are fucking big

Is this some kind of testing site? http://chi.furaffinity.net/


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Summercat said:


> Wait. That's a *downside*?


You're forgetting to furries it is.


----------



## Arshes Nei (Apr 1, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Downside: Furries can't watch porn in public



Well I just want to chime in here and say the thumbs are a bit too big imo. It's not about the porn either. It's just a tad excessive. 150x150 is perfectly reasonable.


----------



## Mali-Kyte (Apr 1, 2012)

New thumbnails blows period


----------



## Mali-Kyte (Apr 1, 2012)

E1337ist said:


> I would have sex with this comment if I could.



I would to it were possible


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Mali-Kyte said:


> New thumbnails blows period


Is it just me or has the past few pages been nothing but people saying the whole update is terrible because of the thumbnail size even though the thumbnail size wasn't the only update?


----------



## Mali-Kyte (Apr 1, 2012)

thoron said:


> Personally I'm not a big fan of drop downs for everything. I like everything where it was before. The site was simple and looked decent, it functioned fine (most of the time). I personally find the these layout updates to be pointless and stupid. The sites functionality was perfect as it was. There is no need for huge thumbnails (idiot designers), also, give me back my news column.



10,000 this! ^^


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 1, 2012)

Mali-Kyte said:


> 10,000 this! ^^


Do you even know what a spry is?


----------



## Aetius (Apr 1, 2012)

SIX said:


> I actually really like the sleeker look. I don't know if any coding's changed underneath the gloss but that doesn't honestly affect me, as I'm of the opinion that the site works.
> 
> Plus, the new frontpage is a lot more appealing.



Same, its good to see at least some change coming to FA.


----------



## Bluflare (Apr 1, 2012)

Someone back there is pressing the wrong buttons : P

Don't worry people the site will be back to normal by tommorow trust me if not.

I will bash myself in the head 10 times with 2x4, and I will stream it for proof.


----------



## Foxxel (Apr 1, 2012)

Think of DA when they have a new post or beta post if your a beta tester. You'll always get the updates even if your not watching them.
And you should be able to delete it I assume. But I'm not completely sure on that.


----------



## drpickelle (Apr 2, 2012)

April Fools? Haha-- good one FA! :V


----------



## Cloudchaser (Apr 2, 2012)

I see a lot of complaints about the thumbnails.  But I can't see for myself because now FA seems to be offline completely.  Won't load at all.  And that's on one of my off nights when I'd normally use browsing FA as one way to stave off boredom.  Finding other things to do is too much work, especially if those things are work.


----------



## thoron (Apr 2, 2012)

Cloudchaser said:


> I see a lot of complaints about the thumbnails.  But I can't see for myself because now FA seems to be offline completely.  Won't load at all.  And that's on one of my off nights when I'd normally use browsing FA as one way to stave off boredom.  Finding other things to do is too much work, especially if those things are work.



It isn't down so much as its ungodly slow at the moment. But that happens with every update.


----------



## Ben (Apr 2, 2012)

I think the most important thing to remember here is that, not only are submission thumbnails bigger, but *uploading custom thumbnails for submissions no longer does anything. *Therefore, artists can no longer put disclaimers on extreme fetish pictures, and they appear larger. 

Couple this with the fact that tag filtering still doesn't exist after being promised six years ago, and this update's honestly kind of embarrassing, and no doubt infuriating for some people who don't like having their senses offended by the stranger side of fetishes.


----------



## PheagleAdler (Apr 2, 2012)

I wonder if this update will include an overhaul to the favorites counter...I noticed mine was off a while ago and 'Neer mentioned to me that they would (might?) be creating two separate counters for 'Favorites Given' and 'Favorites Received' or something like that.


----------



## PheagleAdler (Apr 2, 2012)

Ben said:


> I think the most important thing to remember here is that, not only are submission thumbnails bigger, but *uploading custom thumbnails for submissions no longer does anything. *Therefore, artists can no longer put disclaimers on extreme fetish pictures, and they appear larger.
> 
> Couple this with the fact that tag filtering still doesn't exist after being promised six years ago, and this update's honestly kind of embarrassing, and no doubt infuriating for some people who don't like having their senses offended by the stranger side of fetishes.




Custom thumbnails still show up on your user page. And Cerberus thinks it could be a bug that it's not showing elsewhere.



CerbrusNL said:


> They're not getting removed. As far as I know, it's a bug.


----------



## Ben (Apr 2, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> Custom thumbnails still show up on your user page. And Cerberus thinks it could be a bug that it's not showing elsewhere.



I'm aware, but the main page is where it matters most, followed by notifications, and then gallery. And I'm sure it's a bug, but it's one they should have worked out before imposing the change onto the public.


----------



## CerbrusNL (Apr 2, 2012)

Ben, if everything is as infuriating as you make it to be, why are you even here?
It's not like you have to use FA or anything.

Ah well, updates, no opdates. Bugs, no bugs... One can never please a furry. Not to mention all of them.


----------



## Ben (Apr 2, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> Ben, if everything is as infuriating as you make it to be, why are you even here?
> It's not like you have to use FA or anything.
> 
> Ah well, updates, no opdates. Bugs, no bugs... One can never please a furry. Not to mention all of them.



I didn't say it was infuriating me, I was pointing out that a lot of people who don't like having questionable material shoved in their faces like that will be infuriated. And this isn't an issue of "OH, YOU CAN'T PLEASE EVERYONE", it's an issue of *the site's functionality has objectively been made worse by making extreme fetish art larger and unconcealed by warnings.* "If you don't like it, don't use it!" is _really_ the wrong response when the coding team is squarely in the wrong here, and it's more than a subjective issue of "boohoo I don't like big thumbnails!" 

Like I said, it doesn't bother me on a personal level (hell, some of the funniest art is bad fetish art), but this is a pretty big-screwup for those it does bother. Really.


----------



## Verin Asper (Apr 2, 2012)

Ben, did you forget that FA dont really do things off to the side?
They often do it right there and then and work out the kinks over time while the process is active.
It will be done, stop treating it like they gonna leave it that way.


----------



## Ben (Apr 2, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> Ben, did you forget that FA dont really do things off to the side?
> They often do it right there and then and work out the kinks over time while the process is active.
> It will be done, stop treating it like they gonna leave it that way.



I know they'll probably maybe fix it eventually, but I'm not really sure why you're defending that means of doing things. _Always_ try to work kinks out in beta testing, especially ones that cripple an essential site function such as custom preview thumbnails. I know it's essentially par for the course for FA, but after seven years, it's a little depressing that this is still the way things are done.


----------



## Charem (Apr 2, 2012)

I have to agree with Ben here.  He seems to be taking a very moderate stance and making a good point.  Constructive critique should never be discouraged, as you other folks seem to be doing.  If you don't like what he says, fine, but don't put him down for saying it.

It may be true that kinks can be worked out after-the-fact of an update, and often need to be.  But to call this the 'way it works' for FA, and to call it something that simply needs to be 'accepted' is a very dangerous approach.  We should always be fair and reasonable towards a website and its staff; mistakes happen, and throwing a fit over them is childish.

But to be so lenient only encourages sloppy behavior from a site.  It's a case of accountability; users have every right to speak up about things that bother them about a site like FA, and it allows staff to form a better picture of what users want and expect.  The problem is that many who speak up do so immaturely, so there is an unreasonable stigma against 'negative' opinions.

Critique, stating what one likes and what one doesn't like...  Well, that's valuable information, when it's presented honestly and after some thought, such as Ben did.  Heck, Ben was even considering how other, less-mature people might respond to issues such as the broken custom thumbnails.  He's thinking in a scope larger than just himself, which is rare and something to be appreciated.

See...  I am the owner of a semi-popular forum, and I'm really the only one with any coding experience on my staff team, so when things around the forum change, it's my doing.  I try to do my best, but sometimes I screw up; it happens, because I'm not the best at coding.  The complaints I get alert me to the issues and help me figure out what's the matter, but some people are...well, too lenient.  They don't address the issues, and they don't really seem to care, so sometimes my mistakes fly under my radar for a while.  This makes the forum buggy or less-functional for a longer period of time...which, isn't good.  I appreciate honest critiques over my changes too, blunt opinions. It's all extremely useful to me and the other staff.

I know that FA's staff are good people, for the most part.  They'll listen to complaints if they're spoken wisely and maturely.

-EDIT-

Forgot to conclude by saying that, one should always strive to fix bugs BEFORE making a feature public.  I have test pages on my forum, so I can safely run new features by those pages and see what happens, how things work.  I know FA staff can do something similar when they want to.  It's normal for bugs to get out even after testing of more complex things, but...custom thumbnails breaking?  I'm sorry, but that's something that's quite big and quite obvious, and I can safely say if I were changing thumbnail sizes, checking to see how custom thumbnails were doing would've been one of the first things I'd do...


----------



## Verin Asper (Apr 2, 2012)

Ben said:


> I know they'll probably maybe fix it eventually, but I'm not really sure why you're defending that means of doing things. _Always_ try to work kinks out in beta testing, especially ones that cripple an essential site function such as custom preview thumbnails. I know it's essentially par for the course for FA, but after seven years, it's a little depressing that this is still the way things are done.


First thing first
Its sad you think I'm defending this, as I'm merely stating what will always happen with this site cause how often this is the usual course of things.
I'm expecting folks will bitch like always, and FA team will as always go "it will over and done with please bear with this transition" and I'm half expecting that the instant its fixed people will proceed to bitch about the system more. Its either go down one path of folks going "hey if you can redo the thumbnail system why can you give us our blacklisting ability OR folks will bitch that the thumbnails are too big and want it how it was before.


FA is forever stuck being a bitch pit, problem is actually both sides with users being sometimes VERY unbearable and the admin team somethings not stopping and damn thinking. Common damn sense would say "do this small scale somewhere it wont affect the main site...sucks that FA cant do that cause they also didnt stop to think that maybe they need someplace to TEST said items in small scale or beta test.

One thing I would wish is that the admin team eventually start actually stopping to think and actually plan instead of winging it and hope it works out in the end, cause that is the same damn thing that happens to be pissing off your user base if the site becomes so unusable cause you are doing a live work and didnt think to tell us "hey the site will be slow, maybe you shouldnt come onto FA" or even best yet "FA is temporary shut down to test an item that might be introduced onto FA, the site will be back after the tests"

But this is FA...and it will forever be run this way, and thus forever STUCK being a bitch pit.
I'm in support for the new thumbnails, but I do believe they need more work which I know is coming


----------



## Calico-Feathers (Apr 2, 2012)

CerbrusNL said:


> Ben, if everything is as infuriating as you make it to be, why are you even here?
> It's not like you have to use FA or anything.
> 
> Ah well, updates, no opdates. Bugs, no bugs... One can never please a furry. Not to mention all of them.



Really? _Really? _You're gonna jump on the don't-like-it-don't-use-it train? The unfortunate news is that the majority of us _wouldn't_ use FA except that the other alternatives aren't as popular or became havens for creeps. If you're an artist trying to make money, you go where the commissioners are, and that means where there's a bigger pool of clients. And if you're a commissioner you go where the good artists are. Unfortunately FA's sheer amount of users makes it bulletproof to everyone leaving at once.

The truth of the matter is the new thumbnails look horrible. And the lack of custom thumbnails only make matters that much worse. I'm with Ben on this one.


----------



## Bluflare (Apr 2, 2012)

Calico-Feathers said:


> Really? _Really? _You're gonna jump on the don't-like-it-don't-use-it train?


Oh I have seen alot of that lately, and for the fact that I have a few actual friends on FA that want to stay. Trust me I would leave no doubt, but I cannot not until my friends leave.


----------



## Ben (Apr 2, 2012)

Crysix Fousen said:


> First thing first
> Its sad you think I'm defending this, as I'm merely stating what will always happen with this site cause how often this is the usual course of things.



Well I mean, the overall tone of your post implied you were okay with (even if begrudgingly) the way site updates are handled, but sure.

Also, it's not impossible to pull FA out of a bitchpit, it's just that, because of the attitude that FA is stuck in a neverending spiral of mistakes, that it's just not possible to pull out, a solid effort to do so never materializes. So while it probably won't happen, it's definitely possible to change the general tone associated with the website. Granted it would involve stronger communication, making sure everything works before rolling it out, and actually having things to roll out, but hey, it is technically feasible, even if not likely.


----------



## ElCid (Apr 2, 2012)

Just now noticed pretty much all custom thumbnail images seem to be gone too. Brilliant, FA staff.


----------



## Smelge (Apr 2, 2012)

Kirune said:


> Furthermore: it's really something when you update your site and the majority of reactions are "what the shit, FA broke"



DUMB DUMB STUPID DUMB

Because everyone who complains is everyone on FA, right? No. The people who are fine with it, or don't care or like it don't feel the need to whine about it. So of course all you'll get is a load of negative comments.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 2, 2012)

Smelge said:


> DUMB DUMB STUPID DUMB
> 
> Because everyone who complains is everyone on FA, right? No. The people who are fine with it, or don't care or like it don't feel the need to whine about it. So of course all you'll get is a load of negative comments.


You can gauge how many people dislike the update by how fast the thread is going.  The fact this thread hasn't become a level five shitstorm with 20 posts every minute means yes you are correct not everyone hates the update and there are people who are fine with it.


----------



## PheagleAdler (Apr 2, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> You can gauge how many people dislike the update by how fast the thread is going.  The fact this thread hasn't become a level five shitstorm with 20 posts every minute means yes you are correct not everyone hates the update and there are people who are fine with it.



People do this all the time; furry or no furry. Whenever a site's layout changes or anything else big occurs, people get all bent out of shape about it...but most eventually move on and get used to the new format. FA's not gonna suddenly cancel all the new updates because a few people "hate" it. Let's sit it out and see what happens first.


----------



## Draconas (Apr 2, 2012)

So lets recap!
Any extensions that interact with submissions are no longer working
Custom adblock entries are no longer working
Custom thumbnails are no longer working
The new bullshit takes up a lot of the screen
Buttons are fucked up (at least on my end) along with some formatting.


My honest to god thoughts on this are that, this update needs to die, the old thing was better.


----------



## thoron (Apr 2, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> You can gauge how many people dislike the update by how fast the thread is going.  The fact this thread hasn't become a level five shitstorm with 20 posts every minute means yes you are correct not everyone hates the update and there are people who are fine with it.



Well, lets see...... People need to sleep, plus for me at least when I heard that there might be an option at a later date to customize thumbnail sizes I became content with the update.


----------



## Smelge (Apr 2, 2012)

Draconas said:


> So lets recap!
> Any extensions that interact with submissions are no longer working
> Custom adblock entries are no longer working
> Custom thumbnails are no longer working
> ...



So you are complaining because third-party stuff doesn't automatically work now?


----------



## Draconas (Apr 2, 2012)

Smelge said:


> So you are complaining because third-party stuff doesn't automatically work now?



Did you ignore the last 3? seriously you must have.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 2, 2012)

Draconas said:


> Did you ignore the last 3? seriously you must have.


They've already gone over this several times.
The custom thumbnails and such are coming out later this week.  They just wanted to make sure that the function worked properly before shoving it out the door.
Right now it's a "if you don't update the site people and going to bitch and moan, if you update the site people are still going to bitch and moan, if you shove a function out the door just to appease the Draconas or others and it breaks people are going to bitch and moan, if you wait until you know it won't fuck up the entire site people are going to still bitch and moan" situation.

Let me get this straight?  You CAN NOT wait a single week?  A single fucking week?  Is custom thumbnails that important that you'd rather have something pushed out the door that could potentially fuck up the entire site?  Is it really THAT important?


----------



## Draconas (Apr 2, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Let me get this straight?  You CAN NOT wait a single week?  A single fucking week?  Is custom thumbnails that important that you'd rather have something pushed out the door that could potentially fuck up the entire site?  Is it really THAT important?



1. I didn't see the "wait a week" post at all.
2. I would really love not seeing hyper cock/boobs/assholes on FA, even if it's in the thumbnail


----------



## Karmarsi-Kedamoki (Apr 2, 2012)

Draconas said:


> 1. I didn't see the "wait a week" post at all.
> 2. I would really love not seeing hyper cock/boobs/assholes on FA, even if it's in the thumbnail


Well, you could turn your filter on for now, until the thumbnails are fixed. That's probably the best option for those who don't want to see extreme fetishes during the change.


----------



## Verin Asper (Apr 2, 2012)

Ben said:


> Well I mean, the overall tone of your post implied you were okay with (even if begrudgingly) the way site updates are handled, but sure.
> 
> Also, it's not impossible to pull FA out of a bitchpit, it's just that, because of the attitude that FA is stuck in a neverending spiral of mistakes, that it's just not possible to pull out, a solid effort to do so never materializes. So while it probably won't happen, it's definitely possible to change the general tone associated with the website. Granted it would involve stronger communication, making sure everything works before rolling it out, and actually having things to roll out, but hey, it is technically feasible, even if not likely.


Again, the problem is both the admin team and the users, and until both groups change themselves FA is gonna stay a bitch pit
I would use SoFurry as an example but FA isnt SF, FA is FA and FA needs to do things that work for itself (along with SF manage to do more with less, cause FA still believes More is better and its fine to have it just sitting around doing nothing). If they needed to test out a new feature they should invest in a way to do it small scale and where it wouldnt affect the site.
My clan only believes cause furs are more fucking willing to bitch on FA over SF's communiyy is cause SF takes it slow and methodical, they inform the users of all they planning to do. They do their tests small scale off to the side so it doesnt affect the site as a slow down makes it hard to use the site, then roll it out when the small scale testing shows its fine and move it onto the main site to see how the users react to it.


----------



## jayhusky (Apr 2, 2012)

Draconas said:


> 1. I didn't see the "wait a week" post at all.
> 2. I would really love not seeing hyper cock/boobs/assholes on FA, even if it's in the thumbnail





Karmarsi-Kedamoki said:


> Well, you could turn your filter on for now, until the thumbnails are fixed. That's probably the best option for those who don't want to see extreme fetishes during the change.



As above but you can also use the sfw.furaffinity.net address, that is if your against adult art as a whole. 
But as Karmarsi said you can use the filter until the thumbnails are fixed again.


----------



## Ilse (Apr 2, 2012)

I actually really like the new thumbnails! It makes my custom-made thumbnails on my front page look smoothed out and niiice. 8D

Maybe another (temporary?) solution to problems such as ADF describes would be is to make all content marked as mature have a smaller thumbnail icon - the way it was before - whilst all general art have this current... 150x150 size? I dunno, just my two cents. (8 But since it's already in the works to have personal options of different thumbnail size, this suggestion might be moooot. 



SIX said:


> Hey guys, guys
> 
> guys



I want to see what this is but it asks me for a username and password. O:


----------



## Viridis (Apr 2, 2012)

Punjab said:


> I want to see what this is but it asks me for a username and password. O:



Yeah, they put that in place not long after its existence became known.  It looked promising though, I can't wait for it to be implemented, if it ever does.


----------



## Devious Bane (Apr 2, 2012)

viridis_coyote said:


> it never does.


Fixed.

You'd think they'd be more than willing to show off how well things are going as opposed to hiding it for themselves. Unless it's full of security holes like most of the new layouts have been.


----------



## Fennex (Apr 2, 2012)

ADF said:


> So much for discretion :/
> 
> I've casually browsed FA on many occasions without attracting the attention of those I live with, as the icons were small and not visible unless up close. Where as now those previously indistinguishable icons are quite large and clear when within the room. I'm looking at the dragon other section right now, and there is a clearly distinguishable image of a gaping cunt on the screen and some dongs on the bottom, obvious to anyone who glances the screens direction; even though they haven't been opened.
> 
> This update is going to be the bane of anyone living with others and would rather them not see the entire contents of a FA section on screen.



Once, a long time ago I pissed of FA staff by making small thumbnails large, and DOS-ing the site, and ... . Well, it's a long list, and while I can't un-DOS my accidental DOS I can do something else now. I can magically shrink large thumbnails back to the old size. Like so: http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/129979 (userscripts require firefox)

It's not much and it will probably break horrendously on the very next update of FA's code. But it will hopefully tide people over until Yak can get around to implementing a choice of thumbnail size.


----------



## BRN (Apr 2, 2012)

I thought http://puu.sh/nDgz was interesting. Representative of a new server, and a new way of building the URLs. Nice and concise, too. What's up with the security, though?


----------



## Ben (Apr 2, 2012)

SIX said:


> I thought http://puu.sh/nDgz was interesting. Representative of a new server, and a new way of building the URLs. Nice and concise, too. What's up with the security, though?



Except it breaks people's Adblock settings on certain users thumbnails, since the url for a thumbnail no longer contains one's username, and just the submission ID. So it's kind of a step backward if anything.


----------



## BRN (Apr 2, 2012)

Ben said:


> Except it breaks people's Adblock settings on certain users thumbnails, since the url for a thumbnail no longer contains one's username, and just the submission ID. So it's kind of a step backward if anything.



 I'm saying nothing about adblock because I literally feel it has no relevance to this discussion.  It's added functionality to a browser, that should change around the internet rather than asking for the internet to work within its confines. Not to mention the ethical problems of blocking nonintrusive ads.

However, the point about usernames is interesting. I think there's a definite benefit in decreasing the length of URLs - you might notice the link I used to direct you to that image [it's the same; it doesn't contain my puush ID, just a submission ID] - but removing the artist's username from the direct URL might reduce exposure to artists.

I would hesitate to call it a backwards step, more of a sideways step.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 2, 2012)

Ben said:


> Except it breaks people's Adblock settings on certain users thumbnails, since the url for a thumbnail no longer contains one's username, and just the submission ID. So it's kind of a step backward if anything.


Christ, do you know anything about coding a website?


----------



## thoron (Apr 2, 2012)

Some of the updates that have yet to be put into place I'm not too keen on, hiding favorites and shutting off notes. I've found a lot of great work by looking through other peoples favorites and as for the notes if you don't want to be contacted by someone maybe instead extend the block list, or maybe have the option on to block certain people from sending notes while not blocking them from sending a standard comment?

At least the option to customize the thumbnail size will be put in place.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 2, 2012)

thoron said:


> Some of the updates that have yet to be put into place I'm not too keen on, hiding favorites and shutting off notes. I've found a lot of great work by looking through other peoples favorites and as for the notes if you don't want to be contacted by someone maybe instead extend the block list, or maybe have the option on to block certain people from sending notes while not blocking them from sending a standard comment?
> 
> At least the option to customize the thumbnail size will be put in place.


The more functionality that people can block members the less "harassment" tickets will be filed.

Again, do you know how to fucking read?  They have stated how many times that they are going to allow custom thumbnail sizes?
*ding*
1
*ding*
2
*ding*
3 times that the customize thumbnail size is coming out later this week.

So really can you fucking read?


----------



## Summercat (Apr 2, 2012)

CannonFodder, please calm down a bit. No matter how justified you feel in tearing someone a new one for being stupid, it's just not worth the effort.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 2, 2012)

Summercat said:


> CannonFodder, please calm down a bit. No matter how justified you feel in tearing someone a new one for being stupid, it's just not worth the effort.


Okay.
It's just annoying cause thoron has been told _*WAY*_ over a dozen times the custom thumbnail size is coming out later this week and he still doesn't know.


----------



## thoron (Apr 2, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> The more functionality that people can block members the less "harassment" tickets will be filed.
> 
> Again, do you know how to fucking read?  They have stated how many times that they are going to allow custom thumbnail sizes?
> *ding*
> ...



I think your the one who can't read I said that at least the option to customize "will" be put in place. Why do you seem to be getting mad and  irritable when I stated that I'm pleased by knowing that the option will be put in.


----------



## thoron (Apr 2, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Okay.
> It's just annoying cause thoron has been told _*WAY*_ over a dozen times the custom thumbnail size is coming out later this week and he still thinks it's never coming out.



And no, I haven't been told, I only just saw comfirmation of it in the recent fender journal. Gather up each post I've been told this, and highlight if you think your right, and I'll concead.


----------



## Fenrari (Apr 2, 2012)

My thumbnails are having issues as well. Some of them load and others don't. Happens in both firefox and chrome.


----------



## TakeWalker (Apr 2, 2012)

Everything is a-ok now.  Better, even, because we've got descriptions in the inbox, something I've wanted forever!


----------



## Devious Bane (Apr 2, 2012)

I do hope what we're seeing on the front page isn't the extent of the update. 
It looks like garbage.
Could we at least keep the side menu and news sections? You know, the stuff people actually cared about.


----------



## Bluflare (Apr 2, 2012)

Punjab said:


> I actually really like the new thumbnails! It makes my custom-made thumbnails on my front page look smoothed out and niiice. 8D


yeah I sorta like them, but who wants to see scat, piss, and vomit all the time open up, and big?


----------



## Devious Bane (Apr 2, 2012)

I lowered my settings to view General art only and then I got thumbnails of diaper furs.
I ABP'd the thumbnail server after that.


----------



## Crocdragon (Apr 3, 2012)

I probably missed it in this thread somewhere, but did the admins at all mention if the titles to submissions would be back? Whenever an artist I watch posts a submission, it doesn't say who it's by or what it's called, the same goes for just about any other submission by someone; is that a bug, or is that suppose to be part of the upgrade since the thumbnails or so big? Also, when I roll over an image, descriptions no longer pop up.


----------



## Dragoneer (Apr 3, 2012)

Crocdragon said:


> I probably missed it in this thread somewhere, but did the admins at all mention if the titles to submissions would be back? Whenever an artist I watch posts a submission, it doesn't say who it's by or what it's called, the same goes for just about any other submission by someone; is that a bug, or is that suppose to be part of the upgrade since the thumbnails or so big? Also, when I roll over an image, descriptions no longer pop up.



There's now a "toggle descriptions" button on the new submissions notification page that will let you choose to see the notices or not.


----------



## Crocdragon (Apr 3, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> There's now a "toggle descriptions" button on the new submissions notification page that will let you choose to see the notices or not.



Ooh, I see. Thank you.


----------



## Cloudchaser (Apr 3, 2012)

Fennex said:


> Once, a long time ago I pissed of FA staff by making small thumbnails large, and DOS-ing the site, and ... . Well, it's a long list, and while I can't un-DOS my accidental DOS I can do something else now. I can magically shrink large thumbnails back to the old size. Like so: http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/129979 (userscripts require firefox)
> 
> It's not much and it will probably break horrendously on the very next update of FA's code. But it will hopefully tide people over until Yak can get around to implementing a choice of thumbnail size.



Another solution would be to use the Ctrl+ Ctrl- zoom feature that most any browser has.  Though that changed the size of the text on screen as well, so its usefulness is limited.



thoron said:


> Some of the updates that have yet to be put into place I'm not too keen on, hiding favorites and shutting off notes. I've found a lot of great work by looking through other peoples favorites and as for the notes if you don't want to be contacted by someone maybe instead extend the block list, or maybe have the option on to block certain people from sending notes while not blocking them from sending a standard comment?
> 
> At least the option to customize the thumbnail size will be put in place.



I also would not like it if Favorites are hidden and Notes are turned off.  Notes are a quick & easy way to contact someone privately.  And there's characters that I like but their owners don't post art of those characters to their own gallery, choosing instead to fave the art they've had done, so looking at character owner favorites is the best way to keep up with new art of said characters.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 3, 2012)

Cloudchaser said:


> I also would not like it if Favorites are hidden and Notes are turned off.  Notes are a quick & easy way to contact someone privately.  And there's characters that I like but their owners don't post art of those characters to their own gallery, choosing instead to fave the art they've had done, so looking at character owner favorites is the best way to keep up with new art of said characters.


Letting furries bypass blocks against furries they dislike by simply sending a note is a very good idea.  After all it's not like the admins are constantly being bombarded with "harassment" tickets.  After all why would someone ever think reducing the workload on staff to get tickets solved faster is a good idea?


----------



## Accountability (Apr 3, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Okay.
> It's just annoying cause thoron has been told _*WAY*_ over a dozen times the custom thumbnail size is coming out later this week and he still doesn't know.



We've also been told gallery folders are coming soon
and content filtering
and a new UI
and some commission ratings feature
and a fixed bbcode parser
and web hosting
and a comment system that doesn't suck
and a better support system
and more coding staff
and on demand printing
and better support for written works
and much more

all at some point said to be coming RealSoonNow.

Is it any wonder people might not even notice when FA say they're going to do something anymore? I really wouldn't be shocked if a year from now this still isn't fixed.


----------



## BRN (Apr 3, 2012)

Accountability said:


> .
> 
> Is it any wonder people might not even notice when FA say they're going to do something anymore? I really wouldn't be shocked if a year from now this still isn't fixed.



I don't understand how this could be seen to be constructive in any light. It just seems like a prediction based in cynicism that's ignoring changes that are rather obviously being made. Did you not notice, or is this intentionally solely an inflammatory post?


----------



## Cloudchaser (Apr 3, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Letting furries bypass blocks against furries they dislike by simply sending a note is a very good idea.  After all it's not like the admins are constantly being bombarded with "harassment" tickets.  After all why would someone ever think reducing the workload on staff to get tickets solved faster is a good idea?



If furry A has blocked furry B, trying to get around that by sending them an FA note does not work.  You still get a message saying that you can't send that user a note because you're on their block list.


----------



## Verin Asper (Apr 3, 2012)

Cloudchaser said:


> If furry A has blocked furry B, trying to get around that by sending them an FA note does not work.  You still get a message saying that you can't send that user a note because you're on their block list.


it was a glitch in the past, I would say before the updated block feature that even if you were blocked you could still send notes to the one who blocked you


----------



## thoron (Apr 3, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Letting furries bypass blocks against furries they dislike by simply sending a note is a very good idea.  After all it's not like the admins are constantly being bombarded with "harassment" tickets.  After all why would someone ever think reducing the workload on staff to get tickets solved faster is a good idea?



I don't know about that. I've tried to send notes when I've been blocked and while I could write the note down on the notes page and such the moment I hit send I would be informed that the note could not be sent.

Also, as far I know the block list is limited to 20 blocks at the moment, and as far as I'm concerned if you use up that list to block harrassing users, you might have done something to deserve it. But this isn't always the case since some well known artists simply get trolled, a good compromise would be to have it set up so that if the block list becomes full the option to turn off the notes system would then become available. I don't know if this is possible though.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 3, 2012)

thoron said:


> I don't know about that. I've tried to send notes when I've been blocked and while I could write the note down on the notes page and such the moment I hit send I would be informed that the note could not be sent.
> 
> Also, as far I know the block list is limited to 20 blocks at the moment, and as far as I'm concerned if you use up that list to block harrassing users, you might have done something to deserve it. But this isn't always the case since some well known artists simply get trolled, a good compromise would be to have it set up so that if the block list becomes full the option to turn off the notes system would then become available. I don't know if this is possible though.


Before you could bypass the block in the notes.  Making it harder to get through a block is such a bad idea, don't you agree?  After all who in their right mind would fix a known problem with the site?


----------



## Dragoneer (Apr 3, 2012)

thoron said:


> I don't know about that. I've tried to send notes when I've been blocked and while I could write the note down on the notes page and such the moment I hit send I would be informed that the note could not be sent.
> 
> Also, as far I know the block list is limited to 20 blocks at the moment, and as far as I'm concerned if you use up that list to block harrassing users, you might have done something to deserve it. But this isn't always the case since some well known artists simply get trolled, a good compromise would be to have it set up so that if the block list becomes full the option to turn off the notes system would then become available. I don't know if this is possible though.


I don't believe there is a limit to the amount of blocks, actually. That said, there are some issues with blocking we're aware of that we're trying to fix.


----------



## thoron (Apr 3, 2012)

CannonFodder said:


> Before you could bypass the block in the notes.  Making it harder to get through a block is such a bad idea, don't you agree?  After all who in their right mind would fix a known problem with the site?



I was blocked by a friend for a week cause I pissed him off and I only found out I was blocked when I tried to send a note. I tried to comment, leave shouts and nothing worked. I even tried contacting him through past notes as a responce to that and it still wouldn't let send anything. As far as I can tell, there is no current bug, but then I haven't been blocked in ages. The option of disabling notes is more of a bandaid than a fix. If there is a bug that allows notes through inspite of being on the block list, then that bug needs to be fixed. Then if say your being harrassed and the number of accounts you've blocked exceeds a certain number then the disable option would become available.



Dragoneer said:


> I don't believe there is a limit to the amount of blocks, actually. That said, there are some issues with blocking we're aware of that we're trying to fix.



I heard there was, but that was a year or two ago. I'm a little out of date on that since I've never had to block anyone.


----------



## jayhusky (Apr 3, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> I don't believe there is a limit to the amount of blocks, actually. That said, there are some issues with blocking we're aware of that we're trying to fix.



On the subject of fixing, I'm just wondering but was the XSS exploit on the commissions page ever fixed or are we expecting that on the new UI/Latter updates?
Not complaining, just curious.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 3, 2012)

thoron said:


> I was blocked by a friend for a week cause I pissed him off and I only found out I was blocked when I tried to send a note. I tried to comment, leave shouts and nothing worked. I even tried contacting him through past notes as a responce to that and it still wouldn't let send anything. As far as I can tell, there is no current bug, but then I haven't been blocked in ages. The option of disabling notes is more of a bandaid than a fix. If there is a bug that allows notes through inspite of being on the block list, then that bug needs to be fixed. Then if say your being harrassed and the number of accounts you've blocked exceeds a certain number then the disable option would become available.


It was a bug where if you sent a message to someone that blocked you and while it was going through sent the same note through there was a chance of it going through anyhow.  The bug is easier to place a "bandaid" on it than fix it.  There's a massive number of bugs with the site, fortunately most of them aren't that big.  To use a analogy Fa's code is like a tower of duct-tape trying to hold in water.  It sounds easy to just go "well why don't the coders just fix it" when in reality the whole site needs serious work.  I've had a debate with accountability and other regulars that the best option would be to restart from scratch and make a new UI from the ground up, like what eevee was doing, but considering the shit storm that would cause I can see why they'd rather fix the site.

Think about it this way as someone who doesn't know much about coding, if tomorrow they rolled out the new UI and everything would you be upset?  Chances are there'd be a level five shitstorm.  I'd be hard for yak to explain why it'd be better cause unless someone has a background in html and css they wouldn't understand.  It'd be like trying to explain how to repair a car to someone who has never worked on a car.  Sure they'd catch on eventually, but imagine the person having to explain simultaneously to several thousand people.

It's been stated by several other people in the thread multiple times, "well if it's not broke why fix it".  What has been proposed in this thread numerous times by people upset with the update is treating the symptom, not treating the cause.

So I'll just summarize what known problems this can fix in the future.  The removal of the news section and instead having it as announcements reduces the chances of a fuckup with the artwork, writing, and music section.  It doesn't seem like a big deal, but sometimes when coding if you have a table to the left and one to the right the float can go wonky.  By that I mean it's possible that the artwork area could have overlapped the news section by accident.  It sounds like that'd be easy to fix, but sometimes it is and some times it's not.  I once went TWO hours tearing throw my coding trying to find a single problem.  TWO hours just to find one little bug and in the end it turned out to be a typo in my code.  What is worse is the misspelling of the word is so common that normally your eyes glance over it.  If there is a bug with the table it won't be noticeable and even if there is one there'd be no reason to give a care really.

Having the thumbnails on the same server quite frankly makes it far easier and less likely for a error that you'd wind up tearing through your code trying to find out why it's not linking properly.  You'd think the older system would be better, not for a computer as a computer does not compute like a person.

Half of these updates are fixing fundamental problems with the site and the other half seem as to be for future things, like the hide favorites or such.


Tl:dr; half of the updates will make it easier to fix problems and the other half seem to be for future updates.

So really would you rather them focus on giving what people want by just adding more duct tape to the site or making it easier to update in the long run?


----------



## PheagleAdler (Apr 3, 2012)

jayhusky said:


> On the subject of fixing, I'm just wondering but was the XSS exploit on the commissions page ever fixed or are we expecting that on the new UI/Latter updates?
> Not complaining, just curious.




lol are they even considering bringing that back? They removed it from the interface a while ago.


----------



## Accountability (Apr 3, 2012)

SIX said:


> I don't understand how this could be seen to be constructive in any light. It just seems like a prediction based in cynicism that's ignoring changes that are rather obviously being made. Did you not notice, or is this intentionally solely an inflammatory post?



My point was that FA has _frequently_ in the past insisted that "Oh yeah we're working on that and it's going to be ready _very soon_!" when asked about a feature.

There are dozens of instances of this. Here in July 2010 they say they'll let you add Livestream usernames "in our next update". Right in the same journal "Fender" says the online indicator was removed until an opt-out is ready. At this point there's probably hundreds of "Oh yeah we're working on that!" replies to feature requests scattered over the site.

I'm not saying "They're totally not doing it" but it wouldn't surprise me. People repeatedly asking about it is likely a good thing because it will keep reminding the administration that they have to do it. We've seen that they can add things in mere hours (the Viglink opt-out) when there's a strong demand, but when left to their own devices it seems things never get done.



hg3300 said:


> lol are they even considering bringing that back? They removed it from the interface a while ago.



The page doesn't work, but the navbar element still exists in the userpage source code.



CannonFodder said:


> So I'll just summarize what known problems this can fix in the future.   The removal of the news section and instead having it as announcements  reduces the chances of a fuckup with the artwork, writing, and music  section.  It doesn't seem like a big deal, but sometimes when coding if  you have a table to the left and one to the right the float can go  wonky.  By that I mean it's possible that the artwork area could have  overlapped the news section by accident..



uh what


----------



## PheagleAdler (Apr 3, 2012)

adding a livestream section to your profile doesn't seem like too much work, but I'm not involved in the coding of the site...

I also like the online light bulbs...would be cool to add a chat feature too.


----------



## BRN (Apr 3, 2012)

Accountability said:


> My point was that FA has _frequently_ in the past insisted that "Oh yeah we're working on that and it's going to be ready _very soon_!" when asked about a feature.
> 
> There are dozens of instances of this. Here in July 2010 they say they'll let you add Livestream usernames "in our next update". Right in the same journal "Fender" says the online indicator was removed until an opt-out is ready. At this point there's probably hundreds of "Oh yeah we're working on that!" replies to feature requests scattered over the site.
> 
> I'm not saying "They're totally not doing it" but it wouldn't surprise me. People repeatedly asking about it is likely a good thing because it will keep reminding the administration that they have to do it. We've seen that they can add things in mere hours (the Viglink opt-out) when there's a strong demand, but when left to their own devices it seems things never get done.



But then you're restating known facts. This isn't a thread full of the uninformed; so, what exactly are you *proposing*?

It seems blasÃ© to the point of questionability to bring up a history of nonactivity, in a period that could already well be defined as the single biggest change FA has ever gone through.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 3, 2012)

Accountability said:


> My point was that FA has _frequently_ in the past insisted that "Oh yeah we're working on that and it's going to be ready _very soon_!" when asked about a feature.
> 
> There are dozens of instances of this. Here in July 2010 they say they'll let you add Livestream usernames "in our next update". Right in the same journal "Fender" says the online indicator was removed until an opt-out is ready. At this point there's probably hundreds of "Oh yeah we're working on that!" replies to feature requests scattered over the site.
> 
> ...


...Accountability it's ironic that you have that reference in your signature when you are metaphorically suggesting adding more duct tape to the site.


hg3300 said:


> adding a livestream section to your profile  doesn't seem like too much work


Yeeeaahhhh.... about that the so called "easy" solution would be to make something like how you submit journals or submissions that would pop up in your inbox and would expire after a couple hours.
What you are imagining would go about as well as the commission tab.


----------



## LizardKing (Apr 3, 2012)

thanks for the cool html and css advice here cannonfodder, it's really good of you. are you qualified on the matter though?



CannonFodder said:


> You know more about web design even though my degree requires _basic_ web design classes?  Tell me more about how you know more about my own field than I do.





CannonFodder said:


> ..._basic_ web design classes  ... my own field ...



...okay


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 3, 2012)

LizardKing said:


> thanks for the cool html and css advice here cannonfodder, it's really good of you. are you qualified on the matter though?
> ...okay


Actually even though logically you wouldn't think my degree plan would require you to learn html or css, but for the portfolio development next semester I'm going to have to create a website for my portfolio in which I could log onto and post my latest projects and have at the very least a form that they can fill out and email me directly and I can't very much do that without at least some knowledge about how to make it.  The reason why it was added to the course schedule two semesters ago was that the graduating students were just putting their stuff up on facebook/deviantart/tumblr and... well... let's just say they were having trouble getting hired and the last thing my college wanted was to wind up getting a bad name for low employment of graduating students.  So they just crammed two web design classes onto my course and well now I'm stuck learning the basics at least.

Tl:dr; I've been stuck with two website development classes cause my college didn't want to look bad.  So I at least know the basics.  I can't do java or such, but it's enough.


----------



## Mondegreen (Apr 3, 2012)

This isn't obvious from the answers given so far:

Will previously uploaded custom thumbnails that currently don't work in galleries, scraps and inbox be made to work there again? Or do we have to upload new ones at some point?

(I sometimes use custom thumbnails as to not give away a joke picture or comic in advance, and that's ruined now. I know it's a minor thing in the grand scheme of furry porn, I mean art, but it's rather a downer when the punchline to a joke, as it were, is given away in advance by merely looking at the thumbnail.)


----------



## Arshes Nei (Apr 3, 2012)

Some of this thread looks like a really bad high school debate team. :/ It's just that some comments that may look like support for the site hurt more than help, than other comments that are meant to criticize have little basis or support.


----------



## CannonFodder (Apr 3, 2012)

Arshes Nei said:


> Some of this thread looks like a really bad high school debate team. :/


And that is why it's fun.


----------



## Devious Bane (Apr 3, 2012)

Arshes Nei said:


> Some of this thread looks like a really bad high school debate team. :/


On a site this poorly moderated, did you really expect anything better from the userbase?


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 4, 2012)

Devious Bane said:


> On a site this poorly moderated, did you really expect anything better from the userbase?



Why would the mods need to waste time moderating user discussions?   I mean, this isn't a test.  We won't be getting a grade at the end of the thread.  There is no prize money for 'winning' a thread.  

The userbase is full of kids still in high school, adults who never finished, college students, college graduates, unemployed, people with long careers, managers, office workers, assembly line workers, construction workers, even artists!  There will be as many viewpoints as people, and probably more since opinions will change from the chaos that goes on.

"The Internet" is not some evil monster.  "The Userbase" is not some horrible thing to shun.  The internet and the userbase are us.  It's just people, and we have been arguing and insulting each other since there were words to do so with.  

Would it be nice if everyone was polite and spoke logically and calmly and rationally?  Sure.  Should we all try and do so?  Of course!  Will it ever happen?  Nope.  Still worth trying though.

Just remember, whenever you see someone acting immature.. that was you (insert as many years as needed) ago.  (With exceptions of course, some people really are just morons)

Anyway!   Does the beta site still exist, and if not, why?  Springing changes on however many tens of thousands of users FA has without getting their input first is going to cause a lot of drama. SoFurry 2.0 has some serious issues but there were some REAL clunkers in teh beta that got removed due to people pointing out how dumb they were.  Without a beta you can't really know if what you are doing is going to be a success or a huge pile of garbage.


----------



## Accountability (Apr 4, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> Anyway!   Does the beta site still exist, and if not, why?  Springing changes on however many tens of thousands of users FA has without getting their input first is going to cause a lot of drama. SoFurry 2.0 has some serious issues but there were some REAL clunkers in teh beta that got removed due to people pointing out how dumb they were.  Without a beta you can't really know if what you are doing is going to be a success or a huge pile of garbage.



They never really intended on showing off the betas to begin with. Yak showed off one in IRC once a long time ago and Summercat accidentally linked to the navbar one. Now the navbar beta is passworded for no apparent reason other than "people might see it", I guess.

Because people _love_ surprise layout changes.


----------



## Devious Bane (Apr 4, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> Why would the mods need to waste time moderating user discussions?   I mean, this isn't a test.  We won't be getting a grade at the end of the thread.


It's called a _joke_. I may have well just asked "Did you really expect anything better from the internet?" Same question, just worded differently.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 4, 2012)

Devious Bane said:


> It's called a _joke_. I may have well just asked "Did you really expect anything better from the internet?" Same question, just worded differently.



That's what smileys are for.   Can't always tell the difference between someone being funny and someone being stupid in a single sentence.

I hate wasting a good rant!


----------



## Devious Bane (Apr 4, 2012)

I said it was a joke, I didn't say it was meant to be funny.


----------



## nargus (Apr 4, 2012)

Umm...I skipped like dozen of pages and the comment seemingly changed from issue of FA site design...to...somethings? 
Is it too late to say I *luv* the new thumbnail size? It's finally big enough for me to see what they are, without having to peer at a 1 feet range from the screen...


----------



## Accountability (Apr 6, 2012)

I really want to know how much thought went into this "Fender Journals are news items" thing because, honestly, I can tell the answer is "not very much".

As it stands right now, the page size of the "Spring Update Changelog" journal is huge, it takes a good number of seconds to render fully, not to mention it takes two seconds _just_ for the server to fetch nearly a thousand comments and then the additional time it takes to download almost five hundred avatars.

Back following the Dec 2010 hacks, Dragoneer posted the news about the hacking on LiveJournal saying something along the lines of FA journals were bad places to post site news because the comment threading is broken. I couldn't find exactly where he said it, but here he replies to someone mentioning it that they're "working" on new threading and paginated comments (Oh boy, another thing for "the list"!) BOTH of these things should have happened before this new system was put into place. A user should not have to wait for a page to be generated, download_ five megabytes of avatars_ and render hundreds of tables just to read site news.

I suggest that all news items be posted to the forum until these problems are resolved.


----------



## Traediras (Apr 6, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> Anyway!   Does the beta site still exist, and if not, why?  Springing changes on however many tens of thousands of users FA has without getting their input first is going to cause a lot of drama. SoFurry 2.0 has some serious issues but there were some REAL clunkers in teh beta that got removed due to people pointing out how dumb they were.  Without a beta you can't really know if what you are doing is going to be a success or a huge pile of garbage.


Probably the same with game testers. 90% brag about having early access and then bitch in private about how buggy it is, and the small minority are left to do the work. Needless to say I doubt having a beta would get much traction, but I don't think it'd be a bad idea at all. I did ask Yak about it on IRC and gave me this response:



> *yak[away]:*	it's a development sandbox site, not a preview for others to see.



I can kind of understand having it closed off to the public, but it'd still be beneficial for a small group of regular users to test out the site for bugs.


----------



## DragonTalon (Apr 6, 2012)

Traediras said:


> I can kind of understand having it closed off to the public, but it'd still be beneficial for a small group of regular users to test out the site for bugs.



The way I have done it in the past is you have three verions.

1. You have the development site, only accessable to devs and anyone that is helping with the design.

2. Then you have the beta site, open to anyone.

3. You also have the main, live site.  Everyone has access to this too, obviously.

Once you have a feature working and have decided it is something you want keep, you move it to 2.  After people have a chance to bug test it and you get good feedback, you move it to the live server.

There is no reason you can't have privacy for development AND let users see and test for bugs.  Skipping step 2 just risks making a change that looked good on paper but 99% of the site hates, or has bugs that the handful of testers missed. 

And this is not a shot at the coders.  Bug testing is HARD.  Every change, and I mean EVERY SINGLE LITTLE CHANGE has the potential to break something that at first glance looks totally unrelated.  And on a large site with a massive database and tons of pages and systems, that means a **** load of testing whenever anything changes.   That's what makes the beta site so important.  It's just not possible for a small group of people to thoroughly test every aspect of something over and over again.  That's why companies have entire departments, sometimes in their own bloody building who do nothing but test and test and test.  FA doesn't have that.. but it DOES have a ton of people who would be happy to help out.


----------



## Accountability (Apr 7, 2012)

fwiw the chi.furaffinity.net site is using the upcoming navbar changes.

But it's obviously far from being finished. None of the control panel pages use the new navbar, and the navbar has a bunch of empty links which is messing up spacing.

So much for "this week".


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## Traediras (Apr 7, 2012)

Accountability said:


> fwiw the chi.furaffinity.net site is using the upcoming navbar changes.
> 
> But it's obviously far from being finished. None of the control panel pages use the new navbar, and the navbar has a bunch of empty links which is messing up spacing.
> 
> So much for "this week".


It might not reflect the latest build though, but I can't imagine it'd be difficult to update the layout.


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## jayhusky (Apr 7, 2012)

I'll be completely honest, looking at chi.furaffinity.net it does look ok in terms of the navbar. 

One thing that I don't really like is the advert placement. At the moment I see them one on top of the other and, to be honest that just adds an unnecessary newline to the page. If they were side by side they would look so much better.
Personal opinion of course, but they want constructive thoughts don't they?

Slightly off-topic, the Error pages (403,404,503 etc) really need those links at the bottom fixed. 
http://www.furaffinity.net/lm/tos/ & http://www.furaffinity.net/lm/submissionpolicy/ haven't been active links since I guess 2008/2009. I know its a trivial thing but hey, it helps the site work that little bit better.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 7, 2012)

Accountability said:


> fwiw the chi.furaffinity.net site is using the upcoming navbar changes.


Okay that navbar looks good imo.


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## LizardKing (Apr 7, 2012)

Accountability said:


> fwiw the chi.furaffinity.net site is using the upcoming navbar changes.
> 
> But it's obviously far from being finished. None of the control panel pages use the new navbar, and the navbar has a bunch of empty links which is messing up spacing.
> 
> So much for "this week".



The "My FA" link seems dumb as well. It's far over to the right, but then further options are also on the right, going off the page :V


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## DragonTalon (Apr 7, 2012)

Just checked out_ chi.furaffinity.net and agree with the banner ad placement, they should be next to each other, not on top.

Whats REALLY annoying about that is it takes a second or two for the advertisements to load, making the entire rest of page jump down.  I have missed clicking on things, and clicked on the wrong thumbnails more than once while navigating because the page moves out from under me.  THAT needs to be fixed for sure, it will drive me (and others I'm sure) seriously bonkers.

Using Chrome._


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## Viridis (Apr 7, 2012)

LizardKing said:


> The "My FA" link seems dumb as well. It's far over to the right, but then further options are also on the right, going off the page :V



I thought I addressed this when the beta site link was posted, but I think it was dismissed as me being an idiot or something.

But yeah, that is something that needs to be fixed if the new webpage layout is implemented.


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## jayhusky (Apr 7, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> Just checked out_ chi.furaffinity.net and agree with the banner ad placement, they should be next to each other, not on top.
> 
> Whats REALLY annoying about that is it takes a second or two for the advertisements to load, making the entire rest of page jump down.  I have missed clicking on things, and clicked on the wrong thumbnails more than once while navigating because the page moves out from under me.  THAT needs to be fixed for sure, it will drive me (and others I'm sure) seriously bonkers.
> 
> Using Chrome._



Nice to see I'm not the only one who thought that about the advertisements, as for the miss clicks and clicking the wrong thing because of the load time for the adverts, It doesn't happen that often for me, but I can understand your problem. 

The remarkable thing is that the sudden "jump" of the page because the images have finally loaded can be reduced or lost altogether by placing the adverts side by size, therefore saving 90px of vertical space. Which is quite a fair bit considering your avatar on this forum alone is 150px tall. (Mainsite ones are 100px)


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## quoting_mungo (Apr 8, 2012)

Ads should be placed side-by-side, ideally I'd say they should be vertically centered on a background color the same height as the site banner, or the site banner should be slightly slimmer; having them simply floating v-centered without a bottom line of some sort (such as a different bg color) breaks up the imaginary line under the header elements and therefore is a minor strain on the eye. 

I'm still not a fan of putting the navbar above the site banner; to me the position below it is a lot more logical, more in line with expected-behavior, and less likely to get lost against browser UI, all of which are concerns. 

The site support drop-down should have a "Site News" item linking to Fender's journal - as-is there's no way to see site news if you don't happen to know on what user profile to look if e.g. you've dismissed the notification already or in case there isn't an active news notification. 

I'd personally prefer if thumbs got a little less padding, and along with that, if the thumb generator could force square (or whatever other proportion is decided on) thumbnails somewhere down the line. While the grid layout is generally a good idea, having e.g. two tall-and-narrow submissions side by side generates a ton of whitespace that distorts the perception of the thumbnails being grouped together. This is especially bad for story/poetry and music submissions where the default thumb is super-tiny. Slightly thicker borders to make it easier to actually see the rating-coding would also be a good thing.


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## PheagleAdler (Apr 8, 2012)

quoting_mungo said:


> Ads should be placed side-by-side, ideally I'd say they should be vertically centered on a background color the same height as the site banner, or the site banner should be slightly slimmer; having them simply floating v-centered without a bottom line of some sort (such as a different bg color) breaks up the imaginary line under the header elements and therefore is a minor strain on the eye.
> 
> I'm still not a fan of putting the navbar above the site banner; to me the position below it is a lot more logical, more in line with expected-behavior, and less likely to get lost against browser UI, all of which are concerns.
> 
> ...



In addition, the banner should stay on top when scrolling down. Say you're at the bottom of a long list of comments...it would be easier to be able to click the navbar right there instead of having to scroll all the way back up...

Lastly, the site should NOT require a scroll bar on the bottom (to go left/right). Seems the navbar layout has created one. Some menu options do go off the page. I do hope these issues get fixed before implementation.


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## jayhusky (Apr 8, 2012)

quoting_mungo said:


> I'd personally prefer if thumbs got a little less padding, and along with that, if the thumb generator could force square (or whatever other proportion is decided on) thumbnails somewhere down the line. While the grid layout is generally a good idea, having e.g. two tall-and-narrow submissions side by side generates a ton of whitespace that distorts the perception of the thumbnails being grouped together. This is especially bad for story/poetry and music submissions where the default thumb is super-tiny. Slightly thicker borders to make it easier to actually see the rating-coding would also be a good thing.




I believe 150px x 150px is to be implemented as a thumbnail size (which would be selected through a menu in the controls page). I do agree that the border of the mature and adult submissions needs to be that little bit bigger than the hairline one it is now.
Going back to thumbnails thought, When when the new selection of thumbnail sizes is implemented, I hope it will scale up (or down) the default poetry & story icons.



hg3300 said:


> In addition, the banner should stay on top when scrolling down. Say you're at the bottom of a long list of comments...it would be easier to be able to click the navbar right there instead of having to scroll all the way back up...
> 
> Lastly, the site should NOT require a scroll bar on the bottom (to go left/right). Seems the navbar layout has created one. Some menu options do go off the page. I do hope these issues get fixed before implementation.



 Good point about the banner, it should be floating at the top to allow you to select a page with ease. (Perhaps a additional menu with SFW and the normal site link in to allow people to switch between the two quickly?

I don't have the issue of a horizontal scroll with my PC, perhaps the navbar was created for a slightly bigger screen than yours?


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## LizardKing (Apr 8, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> Lastly, the site should NOT require a scroll bar on the bottom (to go left/right). Seems the navbar layout has created one. Some menu options do go off the page. I do hope these issues get fixed before implementation.



I get the same thing, _regardless _of the current size of the screen. And what does scrolling reveal?







A blank space.


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## jayhusky (Apr 8, 2012)

LizardKing said:


> I get the same thing, _regardless _of the current size of the screen. And what does scrolling reveal?
> 
> A blank space.



What screen size and resolution are you using out of interest? I don't seem to get the problem you are referring to when I use the new navbar site.


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## PheagleAdler (Apr 8, 2012)

jayhusky said:


> What screen size and resolution are you using out of interest? I don't seem to get the problem you are referring to when I use the new navbar site.



FWIW, I'm using 1440x900. Even if that was too small for the navbar, it shouldn't be. The proper way to design it should be so every resolution displays it properly.


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## jayhusky (Apr 8, 2012)

hg3300 said:


> FWIW, I'm using 1440x900. Even if that was too small for the navbar, it shouldn't be. The proper way to design it should be so every resolution displays it properly.



Interesting, I've got two monitors one running at 1366x768 and the other at 1920x1080. Neither have that issue, they are widescreen monitors though.
Oh I agree that the menu should be scaleable to the size of the screen and whatever resolution the user has.


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## Selphius (Apr 8, 2012)

jayhusky said:


> Interesting, I've got two monitors one running at 1366x768 and the other at 1920x1080. Neither have that issue, they are widescreen monitors though.
> Oh I agree that the menu should be scaleable to the size of the screen and whatever resolution the user has.



Mine is 1366x768 as well and the menu options go off of the screen for me. Strange. : P


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## jayhusky (Apr 8, 2012)

Selphius said:


> Mine is 1366x768 as well and the menu options go off of the screen for me. Strange. : P



Very strange, I'm running FireFox 11 when viewing FA, not sure if that is playing any part in this.


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## Arshes Nei (Apr 8, 2012)

Visiting the URL posted, I do not have scrolling issues on the laptop 1366x768 Firefox 11


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## PheagleAdler (Apr 9, 2012)

Arshes Nei said:


> Visiting the URL posted, I do not have scrolling issues on the laptop 1366x768 Firefox 11



Using Chrome 18.0 I do have the problem as previously stated. Same problem occurs using Firefox 10.0.2. 

I did some experimentation and found that the problem only occurs when logged in and when I have no messages.


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## Dragoneer (Apr 9, 2012)

jayhusky said:


> Interesting, I've got two monitors one running at 1366x768 and the other at 1920x1080. Neither have that issue, they are widescreen monitors though.
> Oh I agree that the menu should be scaleable to the size of the screen and whatever resolution the user has.


It was created and tested on a 1366x768 display. I can run the new navbar in a windowed mode on said laptop and not have to scroll left/right. Likewise, it's working okay in Chrome and IE8/9 here.

And yes, scalable nav-bar is something I'm looking into. =3


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## jayhusky (Apr 9, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> It was created and tested on a 1366x768 display. I can run the new navbar in a windowed mode on said laptop and not have to scroll left/right. Likewise, it's working okay in Chrome and IE8/9 here.
> 
> And yes, scalable nav-bar is something I'm looking into. =3




Ah that would explain why I couldn't re-create the issues hg3300 and Selphius had.

I've found if you go below 1004x740 (by resizing the browsing window) the scrollbar shows, so anything below (800x600 etc) will show the problem, anything above will be fine.

As for scalable navbar you could achieve that with some CSS changes. 

While we're on the subject of the navbar, I've seen complaints about no way of switching between SFW and normal mode.
Could we possibly implement a link that allows a switch for those that would like it. (It doesn't affect me personally, I just figured it was a option people may want)


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## Dragoneer (Apr 9, 2012)

jayhusky said:


> Ah that would explain why I couldn't re-create the issues hg3300 and Selphius had.
> 
> I've found if you go below 1004x740 (by resizing the browsing window) the scrollbar shows, so anything below (800x600 etc) will show the problem, anything above will be fine.
> 
> As for scalable navbar you could achieve that with some CSS changes.


I'm going to start importing a lot of changes into a much larger project. The new navbar is a test -- trying to unify the UI. Some other changes will come in time to it, and some changes which should help with lower resolutions a bit.



jayhusky said:


> While we're on the subject of the navbar, I've seen complaints about no way of switching between SFW and normal mode.
> Could we possibly implement a link that allows a switch for those that would like it. (It doesn't affect me personally, I just figured it was a option people may want)


I think that'd be a decent idea, yeah. Not sure the best way to implement, but I think we could definitely look into a hot-button which would change the domain you'd on (like a redirect, maybe).


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## jayhusky (Apr 9, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> I think that'd be a decent idea, yeah. Not sure the best way to implement, but I think we could definitely look into a hot-button which would change the domain you'd on (like a redirect, maybe).



Assuming the SFW version is a php script which filters the adult submissions, I wouldn't think it would be too hard to implement.

I've written a quick implementation idea which could be used, it seems to work in test form on a local machine so I see no reason why it couldn't work on here.
I could send it to you for you to look through, and for yak to look through for potential exploitation issues.


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## PheagleAdler (Apr 9, 2012)

Dragoneer said:


> It was created and tested on a 1366x768 display. I can run the new navbar in a windowed mode on said laptop and not have to scroll left/right. Likewise, it's working okay in Chrome and IE8/9 here.
> 
> And yes, scalable nav-bar is something I'm looking into. =3




As far as I can tell, you probably have messages...I think the only thing that causes the problem is when one has no messages while logged in, so you may want to look into that. (Perhaps "No new messages" is pushing the navbar to the side or something)

I'm not sure if scaling it will fix the problem I mentioned, but as long as we can get it working with everyone's displays (no horizontal scrolling) that will be fine.
If you can look into floating the navbar that would be great too.


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## LizardKing (Apr 9, 2012)

I had a look with Bugzilla and I still can't see where that gap is coming from. I get it even when my browser is fullscreened at 1680x1050. I can see a 2-pixel gap around everything that seems to stem from 1 pixel of padding and margin in the body, but the remaining 7 pixels is unaccounted for. None of the elements on screen appear to reach that far, and I couldn't find anything with the element inspector either. (Firefox 11.0)


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## Mondegreen (Apr 9, 2012)

Hey guys I would really like to know:


Mondegreen said:


> Will previously uploaded custom thumbnails that currently don't work in galleries, scraps and inbox be made to work there again? Or do we have to upload new ones at some point?


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## jayhusky (Apr 9, 2012)

From previous notes and other info from the staff, they are apparently due to return in later updates (No fixed date for that). Some other features are being worked on currently and I believe the thumbnails are being fixed alongisde those updates.


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## Wandering_Smoke (Apr 12, 2012)

I don't know about anybody else but I like not having the custom thumbnails. I personally would rather see a full thumbnail and know if I want to click on it or not. Having to click and see that the art is crap or is something I didn't want to see the full version of, kinda sux lol. I have, not watched, quite a few artists because I didn't want to click on every single pic in their gallery, just to see if there is anything I might like. My favorite option on Inkbunny is the ability to turn off the custom thumbnails. Too bad IB has such a reputation for cub. Most of the artists I had followed there have left but I still have high hopes for IB.

Anyway, back to the question. Will there be an option to turn off the custom thumbnails?


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## jayhusky (Apr 12, 2012)

Wandering_Smoke said:


> I don't know about anybody else but I like not having the custom thumbnails. I personally would rather see a full thumbnail and know if I want to click on it or not. Having to click and see that the art is crap or is something I didn't want to see the full version of, kinda sux lol. I have, not watched, quite a few artists because I didn't want to click on every single pic in their gallery, just to see if there is anything I might like. My favorite option on Inkbunny is the ability to turn off the custom thumbnails. Too bad IB has such a reputation for cub. Most of the artists I had followed there have left but I still have high hopes for IB.
> 
> Anyway, back to the question. Will there be an option to turn off the custom thumbnails?




This is a response from Yak, regarding the thumbnails issue.



yak said:


> This is a bug and it will eventually be fixed.
> 
> There's currently a problem with custom thumbnails and the new thumbnail server. FA's database stores a file path to the original submission file and a file path to the thumbnail, with the thumbnail file being either custom-provided or, in lack of, pre-generated upon upload (at 120px box size).
> It doesn't store the `fact` that a submission has a custom thumbnail, it just overwrites the thumbnail file.
> ...




Since he said that he's open for suggestions I see no reason why we cannot suggest such a feature.


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## DragonTalon (Apr 12, 2012)

Wandering_Smoke said:


> Anyway, back to the question. Will there be an option to turn off the custom thumbnails?



That would be a nice option.  Would be helpful for galleries that are full of identical thumbnails.  That way artists could hide things that might frighten viewers, but people can turn it off if they don't mind being offended/horrified now and then.


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## jayhusky (Apr 12, 2012)

DragonTalon said:


> That would be a nice option.  Would be helpful for galleries that are full of identical thumbnails.  That way artists could hide things that might frighten viewers, but people can turn it off if they don't mind being offended/horrified now and then.



As I said in my post above yours, Yak said he was open to suggestion. 

So I posted it under his original message, saying that Wandering_Smoke had suggested such a feature and would he be able to implement it.


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## Wandering_Smoke (Apr 12, 2012)

jayhusky said:


> As I said in my post above yours, Yak said he was open to suggestion.
> 
> So I posted it under his original message, saying that Wandering_Smoke had suggested such a feature and would he be able to implement it.





Thank you *bows respectfully* I'll look for that post. I don't use forums often but this seemed like a good time to add my two cents.


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## jayhusky (Apr 13, 2012)

Wandering_Smoke said:


> Thank you *bows respectfully* I'll look for that post. I don't use forums often but this seemed like a good time to add my two cents.



Just click on the little icon next to Yak's name on the quote in my earlier post. It'll take you straight there. 

Your welcome by the way, I don't see why I should be taking credit for other peoples idea's, its just not right. Credit given where its due.


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## SkieFire (Apr 13, 2012)

Us Admins actually want that feature too, as being able to see a galleries contents without it all hidden behind identical thumbnails is obviously a good thing when it comes to site administration.

This isn't a guarantee that it will happen, but it has certainly been discussed.


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## Cloudchaser (Apr 16, 2012)

Problem of custom thumbnails not showing first noticed around the first of the month.  Problem not fixed as of 16 days later.  May I be so bold as to ask why it hasn't been fixed yet and when it might be fixed?

/is not upset, but would really like to know


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## Devious Bane (Apr 16, 2012)

It'll never be fixed.


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## jayhusky (Apr 16, 2012)

SkieFire said:


> Us Admins actually want that feature too, as being able to see a galleries contents without it all hidden behind identical thumbnails is obviously a good thing when it comes to site administration.
> 
> This isn't a guarantee that it will happen, but it has certainly been discussed.




Well it would certainly allow you to toggle the thumbnail on/off and see if a image is breaking rules. 
I've actually still got some code laying about for a site toggle feature I suggested to Dragoneer. 
I'm still happy to let him or yak take a look at it and see if they like it.





Cloudchaser said:


> Problem of custom thumbnails not showing first noticed around the first of the month.  Problem not fixed as of 16 days later.  May I be so bold as to ask why it hasn't been fixed yet and when it might be fixed?
> 
> /is not upset, but would really like to know



Please see post #314 (Second Quote), it explains the thumbnail problem.

As for a fix, like yak said it may take time, but it will get there in the end. There are still all those other updates that were mentioned to be applied.


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## Cloudchaser (Apr 16, 2012)

I do like the idea of users being able to toggle custom thumbnails on/off.  I appreciate thumbnails with warnings about content I don't care for, but other than that, I like to have an idea if an image is going to be something I like before I click the thumbnail.  There's probably been a lot of times when I've missed seeing an image I would have liked because of a custom thumbnail that didn't catch my interest.

I don't know about anyone else, but custom thumbnails do not show on userpages for me.


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## GeneralBaz (Apr 16, 2012)

I use custom thumbnails to hide content that some folks might not like - scat for example, behind a 'WARNING' thumbnail.

PLEASE PLEASE fix this feature; I know of at least one artist who's not gonna upload a type of art until it's fixed.

So fix it already, please!


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