# Pressure-sensitive pens and other digital art questions.



## Unsilenced (Jan 7, 2015)

So, after years of not doing much beyond doodles with a .7mm mechanical pencil, I've decided to give digital art a try. Currently what I have at my disposal is a Lenovo laptop with a touch screen and a stylus, but it has no pressure sensor in the screen. From the sound of it though, there are products that are styluses with built-in pressure sensors, allowing the user to still have varying line thickness and such on tablets that otherwise wouldn't. 

Are these things any good for drawing, or should I just go whole-hog and get myself a entirely separate tablet? I'd like to be able to draw with pen-to-screen, but I could probably learn to do otherwise. Not having to spend the extra money when I already have a touch-sensitive computer screen would also be nice. 


Other questions: 

Is there any technique or tool for making cleaner lines? Anything I draw by hand on a tablet has a certain resemblance to a seismograph reading when looked at too closely. On paper there's enough friction between the pencil tip and the paper for it not to be noticeable, but with the tablet I have to go back with an eraser and very carefully smooth out my lines. Having watched other people draw, this doesn't seem like something most people do. Is it just because of my clumsiness, or is there a way to reduce that effect? 

Lastly, kind of a generic question, but what are people's preferences when it comes to programs to use? I've tried SAI with what I've done so far. It's worked well enough, but I haven't exactly tried to do a lot with it either. If I were to get one program to learn to draw in, what should it be?


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## Maugryph (Jan 7, 2015)

Yes. Pressure sensitivity makes a big difference when it comes to drawing digital. Because you can easily control the weights and transparency of your lines. Wacom is the gold standard of drawing tablets. Drawing on a touchscreen even with out the pressure sensitivity is still very nice (I do it with my iPad) but you just have to constantly adjust your brush settings all the time.It gets tiresome for me. Get a styus if you are going to use the touchscreen. It's much easier to draw with a stylus.

 Programs like Adoble Illustrator and Manga Studio smooth out your lines when you draw. I'm not a fan of SAI has a very limited amount of features compared to PS and Manga Studio. But others love SAI because of it's simplicity.


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## Crunchy_Bat (Jan 7, 2015)

Hey! Ill address the questions in order.

1. If you are considering seriously drawing with a stylus tool, you should stray away from using commercially sold "tablets" that come with a pen, what you need my friend is a WACOM The undeniable ultimate tool for digital art, and you dont need to drop 300 on the newest models, because thankfully they are built like soviet tanks, go on ebay or whatever and find yourself a gen 3 or newer and enjoy the life of drawing digitally! These devices connect to a computer with a USB, so you wouldn't need to replace your lenovo. I would recommend you look at the Intuos models, as they are affordable used and extremely accurate, with many levels of pressure sensitivity. You may not be able to touch pen to screen, and it may seem frustrating for the first couple months, but you'll be surprised how wonderful it is after you get used to it!

2. Line cleanliness. There are a LOT of answers i have seen in response to this such as "oh its your art program" or " you need a better tablet" But I use an old wacom with photoshop and no "fancy" editing techniques , it pretty much comes down to two things, your hand and the resolutions of the image. If the image only allows for very little pixels your lines will seem jagged as you draw them, also there are only so many pixels on a computer screen, things can be deceiving at times.

3. I wouldn't say there is a better program to learn to draw on, but I am an avid supporter of Photoshop, simply for its versatility and limitless uses, as well as a GIGANTIC number of community supplied add ons to change the way it performs for you. I have heard the arguments that sai or photoshop is better than the other, but i don't see there being any huge difference beside preference in the end. My answer just for the sake of utility and versatility is definitely  Photoshop for a solid investment.


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## Unsilenced (Jan 7, 2015)

Maugryph said:


> Yes. Pressure sensitivity makes a big difference when it comes to drawing digital. Because you can easily control the weights and transparency of your lines. Wacom is the gold standard of drawing tablets. Drawing on a touchscreen even with out the pressure sensitivity is still very nice (I do it with my iPad) but you just have to constantly adjust your brush settings all the time.It gets tiresome for me. Get a styus if you are going to use the touchscreen. It's much easier to draw with a stylus.
> 
> Programs like Adoble Illustrator and Manga Studio smooth out your lines when you draw. I'm not a fan of SAI has a very limited amount of features compared to PS and Manga Studio. But others love SAI because of it's simplicity.



How does using a pressure-sensitive stylus compare to drawing on a surface that's pressure-sensitive to begin with, though? Is it the same thing, or is there an advantage to using a pressure sensitive tablet?


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## Crunchy_Bat (Jan 7, 2015)

Maughryph said:
			
		

> Programs like Adoble Illustrator and Manga Studio smooth out your lines when you draw.




I find it funy how some people love those features so much, because i cant stand watching my lines slightly change shape to become more "smooth"


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## Crunchy_Bat (Jan 7, 2015)

Unsilenced said:


> How does using a pressure-sensitive stylus compare to drawing on a surface that's pressure-sensitive to begin with, though? Is it the same thing, or is there an advantage to using a pressure sensitive tablet?


a pen can more acuratley gauge pressure simply because of the way it is built.


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## Unsilenced (Jan 7, 2015)

Crunchy_Bat said:


> a pen can more acuratley gauge pressure simply because of the way it is built.



So if I found one of these styluses that worked with a PC (a huge number seem to be for the ipad), I could get reliable pressure sensitivity just using my tablet screen?


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## Maugryph (Jan 7, 2015)

Unsilenced said:


> So if I found one of these styluses that worked with a PC (a huge number seem to be for the ipad), I could get reliable pressure sensitivity just using my tablet screen?



No. Unfortunately. Crunchy Bat was referring to the pen that comes with the Wacom tablet. It has a pressure sensitive tip. It will only work on a wacom tablet







 Touchscreen stylus haves rounded nib end. - It has no pressure sensitivity


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## Unsilenced (Jan 7, 2015)

Maugryph said:


> No. Unfortunately. Crunchy Bat was referring to the pen that comes with the Wacom tablet. It has a pressure sensitive tip. It will only work on a wacom tablet
> 
> 
> 
> ...



What I've been looking at are products that have pressure sensitivity and are designed for tablets that don't. Unfortunately pretty much all of them have been for Ipads or other apple products, since what kind of an artist doesn't have a mac?


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## Crunchy_Bat (Jan 7, 2015)

Unsilenced said:


> What I've been looking at are products that have pressure sensitivity and are designed for tablets that don't. Unfortunately pretty much all of them have been for Ipads or other apple products, since what kind of an artist doesn't have a mac?



Bahaha I don't have a mac Alot of professional artists i know don't have a mac, then again none of them are trying to draw on an ipad either.


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## Adagio (Jan 7, 2015)

Well, I haven't heard of pens with built-in pressure for touchscreen computers (?)
but believe me, it's definitely worth it to get a tablet.

The price depends on your needs and what you're looking for:
- *Wacom Bamboo *are especially great for your first try. These are not expensive ($50-$120 depending on model).
(Note: Wacom no longer makes these tablets. Ebay/Amazon is your pal here).
- *Wacom Intuos Pen* are the new "Bamboo". They work just like bamboo tablets; they only look prettier.
These might be not as cheap as the old Bamboo (+$80), but worth it if you prefer new products/out of the box.
- *Wacom Intuos Pro *are the professional standard. If you're looking to really get into digital art, then this is your best bet.
These are kinda pricey depending on your budget ($249 the smallest) but the pressure and durability = worth it!
Aaand there are also *Monoprice drawing tablets*. These are cheaper and bigger than the Wacom brand 
(I have never tried them but I've heard wonders about them).

I recommend a small one if you're not sure if digital art is your thing.

And what do you plan to do?
Paint Tool Sai: +sketch, painting (simple, comfortable tools). -Effects, gradients, edition or lineart (Yes, you can do good lineart in Sai but it's hard if you don't have a steady hand)
Photoshop: +sketch, paint, lineart, effects, animations etc. -Too complicated for a starter; too many tools.
Manga Studio: + really clean lineart, comic/manga style. -Not for painting purposes.
Illustrator: + vector art

JFC I'm sorry... such a big ass post...
*TL;DR*: Get a small tablet if you're not sure. Try different programs depending on your needs.


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## Maugryph (Jan 7, 2015)

Adagio said:


> Well, I haven't heard of pens with built-in pressure for touchscreen computers (?)
> 
> https://store.wacom.com/us/en/product/CS600PK/
> 
> ...


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## Unsilenced (Jan 7, 2015)

What do people think of opencanvas? I have a demo of it now. It seems to have a lot of neat features, including that line-smoothing thing. 

Photoshop is out of my price range, so I'm thinking it's opencanvas or maybe manga studio, since it sounds like SAI is underpowered in post people's opinions.


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## Maugryph (Jan 7, 2015)

Some free paint apps to check out:
FireAlpaca
MyPaint
Gimp
Krita (awesome ps/painter clone)
alchemy (when you have artist block)


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## Zenia (Jan 7, 2015)

As for programs... I use SAI for nearly everything. I only use my old copy of Photoshop if I need to add computer text to comic pages or to do animations. I find that the lineart I can produce with SAI is far superior to anything I did in Photoshop. It took a while to get used to working in it since there are fewer tools than I was used to in Photoshop... but now I really like it.


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## Art Vulpine (Jan 7, 2015)

For drawing I use a Wacom Bamboo Create. Because it's a Wacom it comes with a pressure sensitive pen. For my drawing program I use FireAlpaca which is much more user friendly and less buggy than GIMP IMO. As for clean lines, yeah my art tends to have shaky lines. Really it comes down to redrawing them as there isn't a different pen that would magically fix this.


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## Adagio (Jan 8, 2015)

Maugryph said:


> Unfortunately, its only for the ipad.




Jfc, Wacom doesn't stop surprising me!



Maugryph said:


> Your wrong. Manga studio now has full painting functionality. It's so good that it makes SAI hide in a corner sobbing.



Huh, I didn't know that. I tried Manga Studio yeaaars ago.
I gotta check it again later.


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## Maugryph (Jan 8, 2015)

Adagio said:


> Huh, I didn't know that. I tried Manga Studio yeaaars ago.
> I gotta check it again later.



MS5 is very nice. The interface is still a bit wonky but it's better then it used to be. The paint tools are on par or better then SAI, in my opinion. Plus it has many 'photoshop' tools such as warp and useful section tools. Heck you can even do vector images via 'Illustrator' and the Pro version has page Layout and other tools similar to Indesign. The standard version is very cheep and be bought for around $25-30 on Amazon.com. It's a beast of a program for what you pay for it.
I am a bit hard on SAI even though it's not a bad program.


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