# What would You change in the Furry "Community"?



## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

When I first discovered e621 and all of its unending supply of anthro imagery, my thoughts were:
_"This is the best "community" ever!"_ - *Shmallow*, 2012

However, as time went by and my still childish mind developed into today's, 18 year old "adult" one, I've come to several realizations -- not everything is quite as I'd like it to be.

So I was wondering: What would You like to see changed in the years to come? What do you think is "Not Good" or "Sucky"?

I'm personally very disappointed at how some _individuals_ in this sub-culture get _offended_ by certain types of depictions on their websites. 2016 is the year of the *Offended Tiger*, and it certainly showed. Most notably, I remember when [A Very Prominent Furry Porn Artist] drew up a story portraying a functionally-dysfunctional family, riddled with 'unconventional' fetishes and 'shady' characters. While most people seemed to enjoy it, there was a group of Negative Nancies lashing out. They criticized the fact that the characters were "underage" (even though 'technically' they weren't) and overall "unappealing". I'm all for constructive criticism, but name-calling and kink-shaming on a very "sexual" website is... odd. There is the occasional thing I dislike, but I'm never compelled to 'strike it down'. Especially if they're gorgeously well made!

The ban on cub porn on FA and some bumps on Inkbunny were annoying, too.

For *2017*, the year of the Comprehensive Rooster, I wish to see these changes:

 People starting to take drawings, comics and animations less seriously from a "moral" standpoint, and evaluating their quality and artistic consistency instead.


 The ability for some people to understand the normality of even the most incomprehensible of kinks in fantasized settings, far from the confines of reality. We can always debate on subjects like bestiality and underage sex IRL - but nothing should be off limits to artists, who harm nobody with their whacky drawings of fictional beings in fictional worlds.


 The inclusion of more blacklist functionalities for those who're intolerant of certain themes. This'll help prevent unneeded kink-shaming and controversy between fandoms.


 How about we stop "coming out" as furries to our friends and families? A "Gamer" just "likes video games", a "Weeb" just "watches anime" and a Furry simply "likes Anthropomorphology". And if you're a furry artist, just say you're a "Cartoonist" and "Artist". Sheesh.


Less Identity Politics. No, furry is not an "identity", it's an obnoxiously vague description of what you enjoy (Anthropomorphology and Animalistic Attributes). The last thing we need is "Specie-Wars" and more humiliation from the Media: _"These people call themselves Furries, but they're not as cuddly as they sound! Tune in to learn more about this dangerous trend and how it might affect YOUR kids."_


More anatomically correct penises and vaginas. Is that just me? xD
What about you? I'm interested in reading your comments.


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## TheOneRealPotato (Dec 30, 2016)

Yiff must end. That shizz ain't right.


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

TheOneRealPotato said:


> Yiff must end. That shizz ain't right.



If by Yiff you mean "Depiction of Anthropomorphic Characters in a sexual fashion or setting" (example: In the act of Sex or displaying nudity) - then no. I disagree wholeheartedly ^^ I see literally no problem.


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## Very Hairy Larry (Dec 30, 2016)

Shmallow said:


> then no. I disagree wholeheartedly ^^ I see literally no problem.


How do you see literally no problem when it's most likely the number one reason why there are furry stereotypes and anti-furries in the first place?

LOLOLOL! How tf do you not see that?? It's the main reason for me personally why I honestly can't tell a single person I am a furry, because they'll end up thinking I do nothing but beat it to foxes. No thanks to yiff...


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> How do you see literally no problem when it's most likely the number one reason why there are furry stereotypes and anti-furries in the first place?
> 
> LOLOLOL! How tf do you not see that?? It's the main reason for me personally why I honestly can't tell a single person I am a furry, because they'll end up thinking I do nothing but beat it to foxes. No thanks to yiff...



That's just as dumb as saying "Weebs are pervs because plenty of anime is weirdly sexualized and fancervicy". If pornography artists make money off of their works, then it's because there are plenty of people who are enjoying that content (content that, mind you, isn't harming anybody in the process of being created). So no, there is no inherent problem with "Yiff".

Hentai is a sub-genre of Anime, and Yiff is a sub-genre of Furry art. So that's that.

Edit: Also, "Furry" isn't an identity. You just like fluffy cartoon characters and their animalistic features, like tails and cat ears, or fur on their bodies, snouts, etc. etc. etc.


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## Yakamaru (Dec 30, 2016)

TheOneRealPotato said:


> Yiff must end. That shizz ain't right.


Rule 34. Learn to deal with it, get off the internet or avoid it entirely. Personally I'm quite happy with all the extra additions to my porn collection. Makes it a whole lot more spicy.


Very Hairy Larry said:


> How do you see literally no problem when it's *most likely* the number one reason why there are furry stereotypes and anti-furries in the first place?
> 
> LOLOLOL! How tf do you not see that?? It's the main reason for me personally why I honestly can't tell a single person I am a furry, because they'll end up thinking I do nothing but beat it to foxes. No thanks to yiff...


Assumptions won't get you anywhere. Also, I thought I told you NOT to listen to morons nor care about their opinions?

Also, learn the fucking difference between feral and anthro and the different stages. You are clearly completely lacking in this department.

OT: I don't really want to change anything. The fandom is fine as it is. I say fandom because this isn't a community. Literally the only thing we have in common is our liking of anthropomorphic animals.

I am not interested in controlling what others do, say or think.


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

Yakamaru said:


> Rule 34. Learn to deal with it, get off the internet or avoid it entirely. Personally I'm quite happy with all the extra additions to my porn collection. Makes it a whole lot more spicy.
> 
> Assumptions won't get you anywhere. Also, I thought I told you NOT to listen to morons nor care about their opinions?
> 
> ...



Yeah, that's exactly why every time I say "Community" it's between quotes. I don't like calling it a fandom, since there's nothing to be a fan of. It's a tad too vague.
And I'm also not saying I want to force people to change - but, you know, theoretically, if you imagined a "perfect" community, how would it differ from the current one? That was more what I meant. Thanks for replying ^^


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## Very Hairy Larry (Dec 30, 2016)

Shmallow said:


> That's just as dumb as saying "Weebs are pervs because plenty of anime is weirdly sexualized and fancervicy". If pornography artists make money off of their works, then it's because there are plenty of people who are enjoying that content (content that, mind you, isn't harming anybody in the process of being created). So no, there is no inherent problem with "Yiff".
> 
> Hentai is a sub-genre of Anime, and Yiff is a sub-genre of Furry art. So that's that.
> 
> Edit: Also, "Furry" isn't an identity. You just like fluffy cartoon characters and their animalistic features, like tails and cat ears, or fur on their bodies, snouts, etc. etc. etc.





Yakamaru said:


> Rule 34. Learn to deal with it, get off the internet or avoid it entirely. Personally I'm quite happy with all the extra additions to my porn collection. Makes it a whole lot more spicy.
> 
> Assumptions won't get you anywhere. Also, I thought I told you NOT to listen to morons nor care about their opinions?
> 
> ...


Alright, alright, alright. Everyone chill tf out. hs

You're right when assumptions wont get me anywhere. Sorry that I'm "completely lacking in this department." Doesn't really seem that important to me, sry.
I just saw that he said "literally no problem" when I could list a few. But ye, I guess I let that get ahead of me and I wasn't really thoroughly thinking.


























Hey, but at least I wasn't like, "MY experience, MY evidence" right? I'm not that fuckin retarded.


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## Very Hairy Larry (Dec 30, 2016)

I'm basically saying you guys are right and that I just wasn't even thinking. I just kind of let that get ahead of me.



























At least I didn't say I was "joking." lol


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## Yakamaru (Dec 30, 2016)

Shmallow said:


> Yeah, that's exactly why every time I say "Community" it's between quotes. I don't like calling it a fandom, since there's nothing to be a fan of. It's a tad too vague.
> And I'm also not saying I want to force people to change - but, you know, theoretically, if you imagined a "perfect" community, how would it differ from the current one? That was more what I meant. Thanks for replying ^^


Ah, like that. Being a fan of anthropomorphic animals make you a Furry. Which is why I use the term fandom and not community. It's also meant to be vague, same way being a Trekkie is only belonging to a fandom, namely that of Star Trek. It's not meant to say jack shit about what you like, dislike, your connections, etc.

To answer the question:

1. There'd be no fucking snowflakes, SJW's, transtrenders, attention whores and easily offended fucks ruining it for everyone else. This identity politics GARBAGE have gone too far and it's already ruining children's futures
2. People actually knew about, understood and adhered to common sense, privacy and common human decency
3. For more niche art, SFW and NSFW alike, there'd be more dedicated and/or more private groups for them. Getting spammed with gore, cub, vore, dismemberment porn etc is NOT exactly enticing. In fact, I find most of it revolting
4. People would act like ADULTS when confronted with whatever they were doing/saying and held accountable for their shit



Very Hairy Larry said:


> Alright, alright, alright. Everyone chill tf out. hs
> 
> You're right when assumptions wont get me anywhere. Sorry that I'm "completely lacking in this department." Doesn't really seem that important to me, sry.
> I just saw that he said "literally no problem" when I could list a few. But ye, I guess I let that get ahead of me and I wasn't really thoroughly thinking.


Think before you type. 

For all you know he's not seen the.. darker side of the fandom and the hellspawn it creates that you'd rather nuke from orbit? Repeatedly? Which might be the reason why he said "literally no problem". What is a problem for you might not be a problem for him.

Gotta take personal views into account.


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

Yakamaru said:


> Ah, like that. Being a fan of anthropomorphic animals make you a Furry. Which is why I use the term fandom and not community. It's also meant to be vague, same way being a Trekkie is only belonging to a fandom, namely that of Star Trek. It's not meant to say jack shit about what you like, dislike, your connections, etc.
> 
> To answer the question:
> 
> ...



Transgenderism isn't bad on it's own. It's just the SJW portion of it that is annoying. Futanaris are quite popular in the Yiffy sections, it's just not something I personally like myself.
And when it comes to "Groups", I think it's a good idea. But, then again, a Porn artist can occasionally draw very meaningful and adorable SFW pictures, so it's not the artist we should be categorizing, but the art itself. Perhaps when asked if something is "Explicit", there should be other checkmarks like "Cub" and "Vore". By checking them, they will automatically be hidden from anybody who's revolted by those.

I'm actually more disturbed by the HORRIBLE "art" that's on FA and DeviantArt. MS Paint stuff. Cub porn is all right, especially if everybody is enjoying the fun. Orgasms 4 the kids, am I right? As long as there are no IRL consequences, it's OK in my book.


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## Yakamaru (Dec 30, 2016)

Shmallow said:


> Transgenderism isn't bad on it's own. It's just the SJW portion of it that is annoying.


I said transtrenders, not transgenders. Transtrenders are only using the label to get attention. I HATE attention whores, especially if they use other labels just to get attention.

If you want to transition to the opposite sex you are free to do so IF you are of legal age(18+) and genuinely feel you are not comfortable with the gender you were born with. What I can't stand are people and fucking parents brainwashing their children with this crap. It's child abuse and any parents doing this should have their parental rights taken away.



Shmallow said:


> Futanaris are quite popular in the Yiffy sections, it's just not something I personally like myself.
> And when it comes to "Groups", I think it's a good idea. But, then again, a Porn artist can occasionally draw very meaningful and adorable SFW pictures, so it's not the artist we should be categorizing, but the art itself. Perhaps when asked if something is "Explicit", there should be other checkmarks like "Cub" and "Vore". By checking them, they will automatically be hidden from anybody who's revolted by those.


One of the reasons I use only e621.net for my needs. Sort by tags and artists who does a lot of good art. Make an account and you can add tags you don't want to see like for instance gore, vore, vomit, cub, etc.


Shmallow said:


> I'm actually more disturbed by the HORRIBLE "art" that's on FA and DeviantArt. MS Paint stuff. Cub porn is all right, especially if everybody is enjoying the fun. Orgasms 4 the kids, am I right? As long as there are no IRL consequences, it's OK in my book.


Everyone have different skills at drawing. Some suck, some are good. How young would you go before your statement "Orgasms 4 the kids" is null and void? 13?

Kids needs to be taught properly about sex, sexuality and the consequences that might pop up along with the potential dangers. Back in my day we did get properly educated on it when we were 13, almost 14. Dunno how it's currently though. But to teach this shit to anyone younger than 12/13 would be meaningless.


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## C.Y.AN (Dec 30, 2016)

I would like for sex to no longer be the no.1 way to become a popufur.
I'm not saying I dislike sex, hell I love it. BUT- people fuck their way into popularity, they become like pornographers, it's a horrible taint on the reputation of communities everywhere.


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Dec 30, 2016)

TheOneRealPotato said:


> Yiff must end. That shizz ain't right.


Then I say human porn must end as well. There isn't any difference in the two, except one shows actual people doing it and one shows cartoon or anime characters doing it. Both are meant to sexually arouse.


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## Zenoth (Dec 30, 2016)

I would like for squeakers to not a be a thing anymore xD


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Dec 30, 2016)

Zenoth said:


> I would like for squeakers to not a be a thing anymore xD


Lol. They are kinda annoying.


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Dec 30, 2016)

I think all furries should talk. The pantomime blank stare is just.....well..... creepy.


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## Zenoth (Dec 30, 2016)

Okami_No_Heishi said:


> Lol. They are kinda annoying.


Yus !! At least to me they are. Even the ones "done right, and kinda cutesy' get old quick for me.


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## Fileur (Dec 30, 2016)

Zenoth said:


> I would like for squeakers to not a be a thing anymore xD



What's a squeaker?


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## Zenoth (Dec 30, 2016)

Fileur said:


> What's a squeaker?


People that use dog toy squeakers , and bird calls  as their 'voice' while in suit.


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Dec 30, 2016)

Fileur said:


> What's a squeaker?


Telephone made it famous. Now lots Furries have them.


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## Fileur (Dec 30, 2016)

Zenoth said:


> People that use dog toy squeakers , and bird calls  as their 'voice' while in suit.


Ah, sounds pretty cute to be honest! Why would you want that to go?


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Dec 30, 2016)

Fileur said:


> Ah, sounds pretty cute to be honest! Why would you want that to go?


Everything is ok in moderation. Some of late have just over done it.


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Dec 30, 2016)

Fileur said:


> Ah, sounds pretty cute to be honest! Why would you want that to go?


I personally would like for them to just talk.


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## Fileur (Dec 30, 2016)

Okami_No_Heishi said:


> I personally would like for them to just talk.



I wouldn't mind for someone in a fursuit to squeak once in a while, but I agree that they should also talk.


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## TheOneRealPotato (Dec 30, 2016)

Yakamaru said:


> Rule 34. Learn to deal with it, get off the internet or avoid it entirely. Personally I'm quite happy with all the extra additions to my porn collection. Makes it a whole lot more spicy.
> 
> Assumptions won't get you anywhere. Also, I thought I told you NOT to listen to morons nor care about their opinions?
> 
> ...



dude. I'm a minor and yet some people do allow others of my age to view yiff pieces. From the* icons* I've come across when browsing, I'm telling you now, it needs to stop.

Have you ever wondered why furries have bad stereotypes?


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## Yakamaru (Dec 30, 2016)

TheOneRealPotato said:


> dude. I'm a minor and yet some people do allow others of my age to view yiff pieces. From the* icons* I've come across when browsing, I'm telling you now, it needs to stop.
> 
> Have you ever wondered why furries have bad stereotypes?


You can't tell others what to do. You can obviously SAY it, but you can't force anyone. There are filters you can use. You can also stay away sites with a notoriously shitty filter system such as for instance FA.

Some people allowing minors to view Yiff is not the majority let alone the whole fandom. Take it up on an individual level, not on a whole level.


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## Xaroin (Dec 30, 2016)

I hate yiff as much as the people outside of the fandom, but that doesn't mean they should ban it. I also haven't drawn anything anthro (realizes the quick sketch of a fox bat for somebody was) n/m. Anyways I don't care about what others do because it doesn't matter to me. All these steryotypes seem to be tracable to CSI, so I was like "Oh, well that explains basically everything bad I've heard about this group". Another thing I like is the community. I kept seeing how nice they were in comments, and it confused me because (at the time) the steryotypes kept me away from making an account. Like always there are probably some that fit them, and if so, big deal. Once I got a discord channel I have 35% battery usage on my phone for that, and 25% for vainglory, so I'd say I'm hooked. I don't see it as a bad thing, but this has been only positive (besides that raid on the server early today/last night depending on your time zone) but I stopped feeling weird about this and I guess all I want to change is how others view the community from the outside, and nothing to really change on the inside because I cherry pick what I like and avoid the stuff I don't.


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

Yakamaru said:


> Kids needs to be taught properly about sex, sexuality and the consequences that might pop up along with the potential dangers. Back in my day we did get properly educated on it when we were 13, almost 14. Dunno how it's currently though. But to teach this shit to anyone younger than 12/13 would be meaningless.



I dislike talking about IRL issues, so my thread was initially meant to cover cub porn. IRL, pedophilia is a very dangerous activity that can bring much harm to a child psychologically and sometimes even physically - no bueno. So let us not dwell on IRL scenarios and stick to art.


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

C.Y.AN said:


> I would like for sex to no longer be the no.1 way to become a popufur.
> I'm not saying I dislike sex, hell I love it. BUT- people fuck their way into popularity, they become like pornographers, it's a horrible taint on the reputation of communities everywhere.



I understand your complaint. See, I will be another 'pornographer' who will post very 'naughty' stuff on FA and other furry platforms. However, I'm not doing it necessarily to gain popularity (as much as I *really* need the money, as my mother *might* be suffering from cancer), but because I have a massively inflated libido and a talent for art - by combining my wild imagination and finesse with a pen, I'm able to create really good stuff for not only my enjoyment, but for others to enjoy as well.

And, honestly, the furry fandom is the only one that allows me to express myself with the least amount of backlash from viewers. In a way, this community is the most open-minded out there. Still, there are many people (even in this thread alone) who oppose "Yiffing" and want to end everything to do with porn and sex on FA. I'm sorry I'll be "part of the problem ^^' "


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

Xaroin said:


> I hate yiff as much as the people outside of the fandom, but that doesn't mean they should ban it. I also haven't drawn anything anthro (realizes the quick sketch of a fox bat for somebody was) n/m. Anyways I don't care about what others do because it doesn't matter to me. All these steryotypes seem to be tracable to CSI, so I was like "Oh, well that explains basically everything bad I've heard about this group". Another thing I like is the community. I kept seeing how nice they were in comments, and it confused me because (at the time) the steryotypes kept me away from making an account. Like always there are probably some that fit them, and if so, big deal. Once I got a discord channel I have 35% battery usage on my phone for that, and 25% for vainglory, so I'd say I'm hooked. I don't see it as a bad thing, but this has been only positive (besides that raid on the server early today/last night depending on your time zone) but I stopped feeling weird about this and I guess all I want to change is how others view the community from the outside, and nothing to really change on the inside because I cherry pick what I like and avoid the stuff I don't.



Thank you for your comment! I'm glad the pornography aspect of the fandom doesn't disgust you as it does to many others. I know I and many other porno-creators make the furry fandom seem massively perverted, but I believe that the BEST of us (ZonkPunch, RedRusker, Adam Wan, etc.) do it because we love it. And others love it too, thus why it's so popular.
The community is also very accepting and tolerant, even though you stumble across the occasional negative nancy that wishes nothing more than to ban "uncommon" kinks, such as vore, cuckolding, inflation, etc. etc.
Anyway, you're a levelheaded dude! Stay frosty!


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

TheOneRealPotato said:


> dude. I'm a minor and yet some people do allow others of my age to view yiff pieces. From the* icons* I've come across when browsing, I'm telling you now, it needs to stop.
> 
> Have you ever wondered why furries have bad stereotypes?



All sects and fandoms have their "naughty" side, as sexuality is a fundamental part of everyone's life. Furaffinity has an option to hide all explicit material, and icons violating FA's guidelines (no explicit icons) can, and eventually *will*, be reported and taken down. You can report them yourself, actually, and make FA a better place for those who want to see only SFW stuff.

While some artists do it for "the money", many others, including myself, do it because we love it. As I've stated before, I have an intense libido and a talent for drawing, so the combination leads to lots of NSFW art. Right now I'm working on a very NSFW drawing, and I am sorry that I enjoy doing what I love, but you'll have to deal with it, until all of the website bans pornography.

By the way, if FA does ban pornography and explicit content, the website will lose most of its income, as less and less people will be interested in browsing gorgeous pictures of cute kittens by Falvie. It's just something that human beings like. And, again, I'm sorry that I'm part of the problem.


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## Shmallow (Dec 30, 2016)

Okami_No_Heishi said:


> Everything is ok in moderation. Some of late have just over done it.



Honestly, man, I dislike fursuits in general xD I know this is probably an unpopular opinion, but still. The suits remind me of creepy mascots and animatronics, like the ones from Five Nights At Freddy's. The squeaking is also annoying. The not-blinking part is also annoying. The janky movements and over-enthusiastic motions are also annoying.

But hey, that's just my opinion. No need to be angry at them for enjoying what they do. As long as they don't make all furries look stupid. Which, to be fair, they often do.


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## C.Y.AN (Dec 31, 2016)

Shmallow said:


> I understand your complaint. See, I will be another 'pornographer' who will post very 'naughty' stuff on FA and other furry platforms. However, I'm not doing it necessarily to gain popularity (as much as I *really* need the money, as my mother *might* be suffering from cancer), but because I have a massively inflated libido and a talent for art - by combining my wild imagination and finesse with a pen, I'm able to create really good stuff for not only my enjoyment, but for others to enjoy as well.
> 
> And, honestly, the furry fandom is the only one that allows me to express myself with the least amount of backlash from viewers. In a way, this community is the most open-minded out there. Still, there are many people (even in this thread alone) who oppose "Yiffing" and want to end everything to do with porn and sex on FA. I'm sorry I'll be "part of the problem ^^' "


I wasn't talking about art at all. 
There's smutshare channels for local fandoms packed to the brim with people posting actual nude photos of themselves, they go to conventions and hire out rooms, they post "Someone come and fuck me" in the group chats & create the sexual stereotype of furs.


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## Deleted member 82554 (Dec 31, 2016)

Zenoth said:


> I would like for squeakers to not a be a thing anymore xD


Unless it's "Telephone". Only Telephone gets a squeaker since she's the only one that can really make it work for her.


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## Zipline (Dec 31, 2016)

Mr. Fox said:


> Unless it's "Telephone". Only Telephone gets a squeaker since she's the only one that can really make it work for her.


I'm about to blow your mind...


Spoiler



telephone is a boy


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## Deleted member 82554 (Dec 31, 2016)

Zipline said:


> I'm about to blow your mind...
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...


I thought Telephone was just Telephone, a genderless Angel-dragon. :v


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## Zipline (Dec 31, 2016)

Mr. Fox said:


> I thought Telephone was just Telephone, a genderless Angel-dragon. :v


you were right you smexy fox, telephone could pass for gender neutral. It looks a bit triggered though.


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## Deleted member 82554 (Dec 31, 2016)

Zipline said:


> you were right you smexy fox, telephone could pass for gender neutral. It looks a bit triggered though.


I am confused by this picture yet intrigued at the same time.

Well played, you crafty cat-dog, well played!


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## Zipline (Dec 31, 2016)

Mr. Fox said:


> I am confused by this picture yet intrigued at the same time.
> 
> Well played, you crafty cat-dog, well played!


Take me away! :S


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## PlusThirtyOne (Dec 31, 2016)

What would i change?

if i had a single wish, it'd be that people would quit _trying_ to change the fandom or fantasize about their own tailor-made group. The fandom isn't YOURS; it's everybody's. So long as nobody's getting hurt, let people do what they want to do! There are TONS of things i don't like within the fandom but i'd never want to take those aspects away from those that DO like them. if i don't want to see certain images, i block their tags. if i don't care for certain fiction, i simply avoid reading it. if a certain site doesn't allow me to pick and choose what i see, then i leave.

it really *is* that simple.


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## nerdbat (Dec 31, 2016)

Honestly, I would come up with clear, distinguishable names/terms for various subgroups and target audiences within the fandom. If there's something that hurts it more than anything else, it's lack of direction - we have casual hobbyists alongside lifestylers and fursuiters, those who are here for the aesthetic mixed with those who are here for fluffy boobs, etc. That's why we have stupid questions like "How do I become a furry", situations where you're too afraid to talk about your fandom in public (since you're most likely be associated with "those plushie-wearing sex-indulging weirdos"), and stupid holywars about "what is "furry" and what is not", not to mention lots of people who are clearly into anthro art but avoid the fandom like a plague. Speaking shortly, it would be cool to have sub-fandoms or "genres" - anime fans have a well-developed terminology mostly supported by content creators themselves (shoujo, shonen, seinen, etc), and even brony community has something like that (mainly with accepting "cloppers" as separate audience), and in my opinion, that's something that could make things easier for the fandom in many ways.

And on something more general, it would be nice to see more influence from artists and other content creators and less influence from lifestylers and fursuiters. Despite being in the vast minority, it's the latter ones who get all the attention of mainstream media, to the point of, again, turning into some kind of "plushie-wearing weirdo club" in public eyes. Furry musicians/artists/game developers/[insert content here] need more exposure, since they are usually the ones who make most of the stuff within it, good or bad.


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## Fallowfox (Dec 31, 2016)

Make fursuits cheaper. Ha!


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## Sergei Sóhomo (Dec 31, 2016)

nerdbat said:


> aesthetic










nerdbat said:


> Honestly, I would come up with clear, distinguishable names/terms for various subgroups and target audiences within the fandom. If there's something that hurts it more than anything else, it's lack of direction - we have casual hobbyists alongside lifestylers and fursuiters, those who are here for the aesthetic mixed with those who are here for fluffy boobs, etc. That's why we have stupid questions like "How do I become a furry", situations where you're too afraid to talk about your fandom in public (since you're most likely be associated with "those plushie-wearing sex-indulging weirdos"), and stupid holywars about "what is "furry" and what is not", not to mention lots of people who are clearly into anthro art but avoid the fandom like a plague. Speaking shortly, it would be cool to have sub-fandoms or "genres" - anime fans have a well-developed terminology mostly supported by content creators themselves (shoujo, shonen, seinen, etc), and even brony community has something like that (mainly with accepting "cloppers" as separate audience), and in my opinion, that's something that could make things easier for the fandom in many ways.
> 
> And on something more general, it would be nice to see more influence from artists and other content creators and less influence from lifestylers and fursuiters. Despite being in the vast minority, it's the latter ones who get all the attention of mainstream media, to the point of, again, turning into some kind of "plushie-wearing weirdo club" in public eyes. Furry musicians/artists/game developers/[insert content here] need more exposure, since they are usually the ones who make most of the stuff within it, good or bad.



No matter what you do, you will _not _be able to shake the stigma from furry. You can thank MSM and the fact that the first convention required fetish groups to survive which doesn't help us in the least. I also don't think the artists would make much difference since the media would only go for the porn artists. Hell, it might actually be worse for us if they talk about the shit they find with porn artists because the more fucked up it is to general society the more it'll sell as news


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## nerdbat (Dec 31, 2016)

Sergei Sóhomo said:


> No matter what you do, you will _not _be able to shake the stigma from furry. You can thank MSM and the fact that the first convention required fetish groups to survive which doesn't help us in the least. I also don't think the artists would make much difference since the media would only go for the porn artists. Hell, it might actually be worse for us if they talk about the shit they find with porn artists because the more fucked up it is to general society the more it'll sell as news


Welp, shaking the stigma off is out the question - we're a bunch of weirdos by default, so of course there's always something to shit on (and that's perfectly fine - makes for a lot of unintentional comedy both from furries and MSM, lol). It's not like anime fans are so well-respected by outsiders either - despite aforementioned well-developed terminology, they will still be seen as "Those filthy weebs that dry-hump dakimakuras" by majority of the folks outside. What I mean is that it could make things easier for people within the fandom - less flamewars, easier to get groups of people with similar tastes together, and it'll also attract more indecisive folks to the fandom (like, "well, I don't have to hang out in the same room with plushie-humpers/tail-fappers to be a furry, so why not to give it a try", if putting politeness aside). And as for "more exposure" thing, while mainstream media will traditionally go for shittier aspect of the fandom, there still will be more fandom-created or fandom-influenced stuff to talk about than before. As much as it may seem shitty and cringeworthy, there's still a lot of great works of fiction and established, well-respected creators resulted from it. Narrowing the fandom down to "mascot partygoer community" doesn't do it justice, especially when we have guys like Stan Sakai and Dean Dodrill (those who made a name for themselves by years and years of making one cult classic after another, not squeaking around at furcons and bitching about made-up species like Telephone).


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## Yakamaru (Dec 31, 2016)

Shmallow said:


> I dislike talking about IRL issues, so my thread was initially meant to cover cub porn. IRL, pedophilia is a very dangerous activity that can bring much harm to a child psychologically and sometimes even physically - no bueno. So let us not dwell on IRL scenarios and stick to art.


You can ignore reality but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality. 

I also weren't talking about pedophilia. I was talking about being responsible adults and teach children properly about sex, sexuality and to teach them not to be trusting of strangers. But pedophilia is on the same agenda.

Parents are to be responsible and to teach their children properly. You also didn't answer my question.


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## Deleted member 82554 (Dec 31, 2016)

You might want to delete that one too.


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## Mobius (Dec 31, 2016)

I'd wish for people to treat it like any other fandom - like Star Wars, for example. No more "coming out as a furry" and treating it as your only identity.


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## Very Hairy Larry (Dec 31, 2016)

Mobius said:


> I'd wish for people to treat it like any other fandom - like Star Wars, for example. No more "coming out as a furry" and treating it as your only identity.


Some people find the furry fandom as a lifestyle. Or at least that's I've heard. Maybe that's why there's the whole "coming out as a furry" thing.


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## Mobius (Dec 31, 2016)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> Some people find the furry fandom as a lifestyle. Or at least that's I've heard. Maybe that's why there's the whole "coming out as a furry" thing.


Yeah, but it's almost like coming out as an apocalypse prepper or something. People generally see both communities as equally weird, but there's not really a need for coming out.


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## Lemanic (Dec 31, 2016)

How about living with the fact that we're in the Post-Ironic Complex right now. The fact that our little inside jokes and rituals have turned into full-scale hazing rituals that mentally scars people nowadays. Especially acephobic ones like the "yiff desensitization" one. And maybe we need to put our well-earned money on SFW material by obligation to diversify this fandom. 

And how about increasing the quality of yiff while were at it. May be not putting our money on cheap rape fantasies. Maybe we should put our money on depicting healthy relationships where the sex is consensual. Just an idea here.

And how about streamlining the fandom for further accessibility. Since we're partaking in an art movement, maybe we need some mainstream sensibilities to be further accepted as the hi-art movement it is. Maybe market fursuit-builders as designers and make-up artists to popstars who need some fursuits for their performances. We deserve it.


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## Orgunis (Dec 31, 2016)

Shmallow said:


> The inclusion of more blacklist functionalities



The idea is good but people might not use it on purpose 



Shmallow said:


> More anatomically correct penises and vaginas. Is that just me? xD



I'm pretty sure there's more people out there who wants that xD


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

PlusThirtyOne said:


> What would i change?
> 
> if i had a single wish, it'd be that people would quit _trying_ to change the fandom or fantasize about their own tailor-made group. The fandom isn't YOURS; it's everybody's. So long as nobody's getting hurt, let people do what they want to do! There are TONS of things i don't like within the fandom but i'd never want to take those aspects away from those that DO like them. if i don't want to see certain images, i block their tags. if i don't care for certain fiction, i simply avoid reading it. if a certain site doesn't allow me to pick and choose what i see, then i leave.
> 
> it really *is* that simple.



I think you're taking this question way too seriously. What I meant was "What are your pet peeves", things that bug you, etc. We won't literally run a furry revolution and change the fandom, it's just an honest question about what people dislike the most in the fandom. Some of my examples were "kink-shaming" and the subject of "coming out as a furry".

I'm not trying to take away fursuits just because I find them creepy - No! That wasn't even in my post! I mean other more entrenched problems in the community, that you or others might think is making the community less friendly, (aka, kink-shaming, name calling, gender-politics and overall just angry people). But thanks for the response, anyway.


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

nerdbat said:


> Honestly, I would come up with clear, distinguishable names/terms for various subgroups and target audiences within the fandom. If there's something that hurts it more than anything else, it's lack of direction - we have casual hobbyists alongside lifestylers and fursuiters, those who are here for the aesthetic mixed with those who are here for fluffy boobs, etc. That's why we have stupid questions like "How do I become a furry", situations where you're too afraid to talk about your fandom in public (since you're most likely be associated with "those plushie-wearing sex-indulging weirdos"), and stupid holywars about "what is "furry" and what is not", not to mention lots of people who are clearly into anthro art but avoid the fandom like a plague. Speaking shortly, it would be cool to have sub-fandoms or "genres" - anime fans have a well-developed terminology mostly supported by content creators themselves (shoujo, shonen, seinen, etc), and even brony community has something like that (mainly with accepting "cloppers" as separate audience), and in my opinion, that's something that could make things easier for the fandom in many ways.
> 
> And on something more general, it would be nice to see more influence from artists and other content creators and less influence from lifestylers and fursuiters. Despite being in the vast minority, it's the latter ones who get all the attention of mainstream media, to the point of, again, turning into some kind of "plushie-wearing weirdo club" in public eyes. Furry musicians/artists/game developers/[insert content here] need more exposure, since they are usually the ones who make most of the stuff within it, good or bad.



I completely agree with you! The fandom is divided into many 'factions' that believe in their own 'ideals'. The only thing that is clumping us together is the vague definition of "Furry", which is very hard to pinpoint. Maybe even impossible. I'd like more tolerance in the community for various forms of art, but at the same time, I'd love to get rid of all of the dumb MS Paint stuff from the front page. I don't want to sound mean, but the front page should show us the "cream of the crop", beautiful colours, realistic or not, and great creations. Instead, I saw a very poorly drawn picture of a wolf cutting his own throat .-. 

On the topic of influence, I really dislike fursuiters. They're great people with a great hobby, but boy do they make our fandom look so much dumber... The media has totally destroyed our reputation because of people 'IRL Yiffing' and it's annoying. There are so many talented people in this community, shame it's seen as "massively perverted". God knows Falvie and Hax make amazing non-pervy art, but nobody cares. DRAGON DILDOS AM I RIGHT?


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Yakamaru said:


> You can ignore reality but you cannot ignore the consequences of ignoring reality.
> 
> I also weren't talking about pedophilia. I was talking about being responsible adults and teach children properly about sex, sexuality and to teach them not to be trusting of strangers. But pedophilia is on the same agenda.
> 
> Parents are to be responsible and to teach their children properly. You also didn't answer my question.



Why are you pushing this subject? I discuss these things with other people on other forums, not here. Thus why I said "I'd rather stick to art", because the question was about the 'Furry community' and not 'real life ramifications of bad parenting and illegal activities". I don't even remember what your initial question was. If I find it, I'll respond to it.


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Mobius said:


> I'd wish for people to treat it like any other fandom - like Star Wars, for example. No more "coming out as a furry" and treating it as your only identity.



Mom, ... I ... I like Star Wars... ... I draw Jedi warriors for fun... do you still love me???


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Lemanic said:


> How about living with the fact that we're in the Post-Ironic Complex right now. The fact that our little inside jokes and rituals have turned into full-scale hazing rituals that mentally scars people nowadays. Especially acephobic ones like the "yiff desensitization" one. And maybe we need to put our well-earned money on SFW material by obligation to diversify this fandom.
> 
> And how about increasing the quality of yiff while were at it. May be not putting our money on cheap rape fantasies. Maybe we should put our money on depicting healthy relationships where the sex is consensual. Just an idea here.
> 
> And how about streamlining the fandom for further accessibility. Since we're partaking in an art movement, maybe we need some mainstream sensibilities to be further accepted as the hi-art movement it is. Maybe market fursuit-builders as designers and make-up artists to popstars who need some fursuits for their performances. We deserve it.



Hey, I understand your complaint. A few days ago I found an artist on Patreon who earns about 500$ per month on... very bad yiff drawings _(I'm no critic, but it's pretty obvious)_.
The artists I love the most are the ones who are excellent at their work:
SFW: Falvie and Hax
NSFW: Adam Wan, Redrusker (comics and art), Zonkpunch (extremely well done animations) and Zeiro (he's on the bottom of the list lately).

When it comes to supporting non-explicit artists, I'm personally more invested in NSFW art - but that's just me and my brain. I know that the top furry artists are actual great porno-makers, but that's just the free market doing it's thing. "Sex Sells". Maybe we should just stop putting porn on the FRONT PAGE OF FA, seeing as how that's how most people will remember furries for all of their lives...

And streamlining would be great. I have no idea how to do it, but I encourage people's cartoon drawings of Tom and Jerry and Sonic (as long as they're good). Hopefully people will understand that anthropomorphology and the furry fandom are more than just "dogs havin' sex lol". I'm no expert.

Quick Edit: Implementing more anthro art in media and art exhibits would greatly bump the streamlining and give us some good PR, I suppose!


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> Some people find the furry fandom as a lifestyle. Or at least that's I've heard. Maybe that's why there's the whole "coming out as a furry" thing.



Hence why it's a bit too fanatic. How can "furry" be a lifestyle? It's going way too deep into "otherkin" theories and all sorts of ideas that harm our community. So I'd rather people just understood that "otherkin" and "obsessed furries" are far from the majority, but an extreme minority.


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Jan 1, 2017)

Mr. Fox said:


> You might want to delete that one too.


Lol. Happy New Year Mr Fox!


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## PlusThirtyOne (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> I think you're taking this question way too seriously. What I meant was "What are your pet peeves", things that bug you, etc. We won't literally run a furry revolution and change the fandom, it's just an honest question about what people dislike the most in the fandom. Some of my examples were "kink-shaming" and the subject of "coming out as a furry".
> 
> I'm not trying to take away fursuits just because I find them creepy - No! That wasn't even in my post! I mean other more entrenched problems in the community, that you or others might think is making the community less friendly, (aka, kink-shaming, name calling, gender-politics and overall just angry people). But thanks for the response, anyway.


Yes yes yes, a thousand times yes. "Coming out" threads are suuuuuuuch a tiresome occurrence! Good example.
-But, yes, i see (and saw) your point. My gripe wasn't with you or your thread, but with the fandom on the whole, just as everyone else. i wasn't taking the thread too seriously. it's just that MY common complaint was all too fresh, being the very topic of this thread. The irony of my complaints were not lost on me; complaining about complaining. No matter how much it irks me, there's nothing i can do to change peoples' minds, especially changing minds about changing minds. it's a paradox. i don't fear or expect changes in the fandom. it is what it is and i understand that. LOL Apologies of my post got a bit too complain-y.


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

PlusThirtyOne said:


> Yes yes yes, a thousand times yes. "Coming out" threads are suuuuuuuch a tiresome occurrence! Good example.
> -But, yes, i see (and saw) your point. My gripe wasn't with you or your thread, but with the fandom on the whole, just as everyone else. i wasn't taking the thread too seriously. it's just that MY common complaint was all too fresh, being the very topic of this thread. The irony of my complaints were not lost on me; complaining about complaining. No matter how much it irks me, there's nothing i can do to change peoples' minds, especially changing minds about changing minds. it's a paradox. i don't fear or expect changes in the fandom. it is what it is and i understand that. LOL Apologies of my post got a bit too complain-y.



As long as we respect each other and value good art, as opposed to shitty MS Paint art with boobs, I'll be happy. Hey, if MS Painters want to post their art somewhere, there should be a group dedicated to it, or AT THE VERY LEAST, *not* on the front page on FA.


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Jan 1, 2017)

I know why it is called "coming out" as a furry. Because for some of these poor kids and young adults, the reaction of their families and friends is the same as when people come out as homosexual. And unfortunately a lot of those reactions are freakin terrible. I still don't get how people can love their God more than their own kids.


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Okami_No_Heishi said:


> I know why it is called "coming out" as a furry. Because for some of these poor kids and young adults, the reaction of their families and friends is the same as when people come out as homosexual. And unfortunately a lot of those reactions are freakin terrible. I still don't get how people can love their God more than their own kids.



When I was 16, I came out as bisexual to my mom -- it was a childish and unnecessary idea. But "furry" isn't the same thing. Young adults and kids are always quick to jumping onto conclusions and trying to "change the world". Things would be better if they just piped down and bought themselves a dragon dildo. Nobody NEEDS to know about your fandom/hobby


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> When I was 16, I came out as bisexual to my mom -- it was a childish and unnecessary idea. But "furry" isn't the same thing. Young adults and kids are always quick to jumping onto conclusions and trying to "change the world". Things would be better if they just piped down and bought themselves a dragon dildo. Nobody NEEDS to know about your fandom/hobby


I was 21 when I "came out" as bi. But my point is the reactions can be the same. And it is also about identity. The whole "i have a secret and must keep it secret or else" thing wears on the human mind. Not being able to share or express ones self out of fear of retribution is torture for some, not to all. Everyone is different. And it should be that way. But we shouldn't judge those who do want to shout out at the top of their lungs "I AM A FURRY!!".


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## PlusThirtyOne (Jan 1, 2017)

Okami_No_Heishi said:


> I know why it is called "coming out" as a furry. Because for some of these poor kids and young adults, the reaction of their families and friends is the same as when people come out as homosexual


Agreed. But being a furry is NOT an orientation.
Being homosexual and wanting to share your partner with the family is ONE thing but your interests and hobbies (sexual in nature or not) is your own damn business. There's NO NEED to share it, especially if you feel your family might disapprove. Why challenge it? Nobody NEEDS to know your fantasies! _Homosexuality isn't even sexual at its core_; it's romantic attraction. Mom and dad don't need to know you fantasize being spanked by inflated body building fox girls. But if you want to share your _real life boyfriend_ with the family, it's something mom and dad need to know and accept beforehand. Certain hobbies and interests are not without their stigmas and hardships. it's inconvenient, yes, but THE WORLD DOESN'T NEED TO KNOW if you prefer Star TREK over Star WARS, especially if your parents answered Jedi as their religion on the census. Deal with it! LOL :V


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Jan 1, 2017)

PlusThirtyOne said:


> Agreed. But being a furry is NOT an orientation.
> Being homosexual and wanting to share your partner with the family is ONE thing but your interests and hobbies (sexual in nature or not) is your own damn business. There's NO NEED to share it, especially if you feel your family might disapprove. Why challenge it? Nobody NEEDS to know your fantasies! _Homosexuality isn't even sexual at its core_; it's romantic attraction. Mom and dad don't need to know you fantasize being spanked by inflated body building fox girls. But if you want to share your _real life boyfriend_ with the family, it's something mom and dad need to know and accept beforehand. Certain hobbies and interests are not without their stigmas and hardships. it's inconvenient, yes, but THE WORLD DOESN'T NEED TO KNOW if you prefer Star TREK over Star WARS, especially if your parents answered Jedi as their religion on the census. Deal with it! LOL :V


I am not saying it is a sexual orientation. But it IS an orientation. And my point is that if that is what someone feels like they should do, we shouldn't give em a hard time about it. And a word of encouragement or advice never hurts.(well....most times)


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

PlusThirtyOne said:


> Agreed. But being a furry is NOT an orientation.
> Being homosexual and wanting to share your partner with the family is ONE thing but your interests and hobbies (sexual in nature or not) is your own damn business. There's NO NEED to share it, especially if you feel your family might disapprove. Why challenge it? Nobody NEEDS to know your fantasies! _Homosexuality isn't even sexual at its core_; it's romantic attraction. Mom and dad don't need to know you fantasize being spanked by inflated body building fox girls. But if you want to share your boyfriend with the family, it's something mom and dad need to know and accept beforehand. Certain hobbies and interests are not without their stigmas and hardships. it's inconvenient, yes, but THE WORLD DOESN'T NEED TO KNOW if you prefer Star TREK over Star WARS, especially if your parents answered Jedi as their religion on the census. Nobody cares! Deal with it! LOL :V



I'll quickly throw in an interesting example that's a bit less common:
I'm very dependent on mother, as I'm physically incapable of doing MANY things. However, a part of me REALLY wants to explore the sexual side of art, hence why I'm currently working on some delicious smut. *But*, given my dependency on my mother, I need to tell her about what I'm doing, and this might be rough. Do you have any ideas?


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Okami_No_Heishi said:


> I am not saying it is a sexual orientation. But it IS an orientation. And my point is that if that is what someone feels like they should do, we shouldn't give em a hard time about it. And a word of encouragement or advice never hurts.(well....most times)



It's not an orientation. That's like saying "Anime" is an orientation. It's a mix of interests and hobby, and sometimes sexual in nature, but not always. It is not an orientation, sexual or otherwise.


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Jan 1, 2017)

PlusThirtyOne said:


> Agreed. But being a furry is NOT an orientation.
> Being homosexual and wanting to share your partner with the family is ONE thing but your interests and hobbies (sexual in nature or not) is your own damn business. There's NO NEED to share it, especially if you feel your family might disapprove. Why challenge it? Nobody NEEDS to know your fantasies! _Homosexuality isn't even sexual at its core_; it's romantic attraction. Mom and dad don't need to know you fantasize being spanked by inflated body building fox girls. But if you want to share your _real life boyfriend_ with the family, it's something mom and dad need to know and accept beforehand. Certain hobbies and interests are not without their stigmas and hardships. it's inconvenient, yes, but THE WORLD DOESN'T NEED TO KNOW if you prefer Star TREK over Star WARS, especially if your parents answered Jedi as their religion on the census. Deal with it! LOL :V


I love the Star Wars take.


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## nerdbat (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> I completely agree with you! The fandom is divided into many 'factions' that believe in their own 'ideals'. The only thing that is clumping us together is the vague definition of "Furry", which is very hard to pinpoint. Maybe even impossible. I'd like more tolerance in the community for various forms of art, but at the same time, I'd love to get rid of all of the dumb MS Paint stuff from the front page. I don't want to sound mean, but the front page should show us the "cream of the crop", beautiful colours, realistic or not, and great creations. Instead, I saw a very poorly drawn picture of a wolf cutting his own throat .


To be honest, I have to disagree with the whole "rid of all the dumb stuff" thing. Not because I particularly like crappy art, but because, well, it was done before on other sites, and it didn't turn out too good. For a light example, you can look at /r/furry subreddit with trending artwork being displayed at frontpage. Yes, all the drawings are technically well-made, but they're all generic as hell, and half of them usually looks like it was made by same artist or something (despite different names being mentioned). They're getting picked by votes, and you see, popular opinion is not always the right one. And for a particularly nasty example, there's a Russian artwork community called FurNation (not that closed-down FurNation, another one, yeah). There's a differentiation between three ranks - "amateur", "regular" and "master". A good thing on paper, but every "rank" has increasingly more privileges than previous one, and it all results in pro-active bullying of "amateurs" and commission monopoly on "masters" side, which is why there are little to no new members. And "masters" aren't even_ that_ good - yeah, they're technically proficient, but not nearly as imaginative and ambitious as majority of "regulars". So yeah, this thing is bullshit.

And again, there's a difference in styles and preferences. Frankly, I'm not a fan of both Falvie and Hax - they can draw very well, that's for sure, but IMO they really lack in designing interesting characters or pushing any boundaries. Their artwork is pretty and professional, but for the most part, repetitive and limited to me - but hey, everybody has their own tastes. The thing is, how would you rate an artist like, for example, Shenanimation? He's not a professional by any means, he's not good at complex coloring, his knowledge of anatomy is not fantastic, but he's so damn great at creating interesting, humorous scenarios and memorable, charismatic, not-seen-before characters that he earned a huge fanbase because of constantly thinking outside the box. Would you objectively put him below Falvie or Hax because he's "not as professional"? That's what can pretty much happen fandom-wise if you start categorizing artwork on "good" and "bad" - there's the point where the line is blurred, and by making such restrictions we'll only come up with putting one way of drawing things above the other, which is wrong on many levels.


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## Okami_No_Heishi (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> It's not an orientation. That's like saying "Anime" is an orientation. It's a mix of interests and hobby, and sometimes sexual in nature, but not always. It is not an orientation, sexual or otherwise.


Is not an orientation what one identifies as? People identify as Furries. As Ottakus. Weeboos. Pirates. Bronies. Walking Dead. Mario and Luigi! And on and on.


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

nerdbat said:


> And again, there's a difference in styles and preferences. Frankly, I'm not a fan of both Falvie and Hax - they can draw very well, that's for sure, but IMO they really lack in designing interesting characters or pushing any boundaries. Their artwork is pretty and professional, but for the most part, repetitive and limited to me - but hey, everybody has their own tastes. The thing is, how would you rate an artist like, for example, Shenanimation? He's not a professional by any means, he's not good at complex coloring, his knowledge of anatomy is not fantastic, but he's so damn great at creating interesting, humorous scenarios and memorable, charismatic, not-seen-before characters that he earned a huge fanbase because of constantly thinking outside the box. Would you objectively put him below Falvie or Hax because he's "not as professional"? That's what can pretty much happen fandom-wise if you start categorizing artwork on "good" and "bad" - there's the point where the line is blurred, and by making such restrictions we'll only come up with putting one way of drawing things above the other, which is wrong on many levels.



Ah, indeed, a tough problem. In a sense, I believe that no art should be stigmatized or filtered out, but it's not easy to plow through feces in order to find a good amateur image. Steam is currently having issues with shitty games, where the shop is being utterly drowned in dumb projects made by teens and trolls for an easy buck. There HAS to be some sort of filter, at least for the main pages. Maybe we'll never find a consensus, thus why it'll never happen, but I'm not opposed to the idea of cleaning out what's clearly a low effort piece.

Shenanimation is creative. It's not about the style itself, but the slick linework, an interesting design and, perhaps, even humorous content! I've seen loads of small comic flicks that were VERY simplistic, yet meaningful and insightful to some degree. Sometimes just plain funny! So yeah. Incredibly tough question. We might just let it slide for the time being xD


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Okami_No_Heishi said:


> Is not an orientation what one identifies as? People identify as Furries. As Ottakus. Weeboos. Pirates. Bronies. Walking Dead. Mario and Luigi! And on and on.



Orientation implies a sort of "lifestyle", and, honestly, furries don't have a "lifestyle" aside from the crazy ones. We don't dedicate our entire existence to being furries, unlike homosexuality or, I dunno, Christianity where one is governed by a set of rules, and his lifestyle is deeply fused with this 'idea' or 'hobby'. (not implying that homosexuality is a choice, merely that it's part of our almost day-to-day life)

Weeaboos might like anime and collect a bunch of plushies, but usually it's not a "lifestyle" or an "orientation". Just a more precise interest in pseudo-japanese culture and artstyles.


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## Deleted member 82554 (Jan 1, 2017)

Well, The Free Dictionary states orientation as "a direction followed in the course of a trend, movement, or development", "a tendency of thought; a general inclination: a Marxist orientation", "a sexual orientation",  or "an adjustment or adaptation to a new environment, situation, custom, or set of ideas".

So, yeah, the furry fandom is a kind of orientation in a sense, just as much as it is a hobby...


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## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Mr. Fox said:


> Well, The Free Dictionary states orientation as "a direction followed in the course of a trend, movement, or development", "a tendency of thought; a general inclination: a Marxist orientation," "a sexual orientation",  or "an adjustment or adaptation to a new environment, situation, custom, or set of ideas".
> 
> So, yeah, the furry fandom is a kind of orientation in a sense...



Yeah~ Kind of~ But calling it that makes it sound way too serious. Marxism is a movement, Anthropomorphology is barely one. If one day furries begin an artistic revolution, much like Fauvism or Cubism, then I'll be very much inclined to call it an "orientation" or "movement". Right now, it's just a fandom secluded from the rest of the internet and media.


----------



## nerdbat (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> Ah, indeed, a tough problem. In a sense, I believe that no art should be stigmatized or filtered out, but it's not easy to plow through feces in order to find a good amateur image. Steam is currently having issues with shitty games, where the shop is being utterly drowned in dumb projects made by teens and trolls for an easy buck. There HAS to be some sort of filter, at least for the main pages. Maybe we'll never find a consensus, thus why it'll never happen, but I'm not opposed to the idea of cleaning out what's clearly a low effort piece.
> 
> Shenanimation is creative. It's not about the style itself, but the slick linework, an interesting design and, perhaps, even humorous content! I've seen loads of small comic flicks that were VERY simplistic, yet meaningful and insightful to some degree. Sometimes just plain funny! So yeah. Incredibly tough question. We might just let it slide for the time being xD


Now I see where you're coming with that. I'll agree with the "pervy" part, I think it can be fixed by adding some additional filters - there is a SFW one, but it doesn't cover many relatively tame fetishes (like paw fetish or vore), so we still end up with stuff like this on a frontpage. And as for cleaning the artwork out - welp, unlike Steam, there's no market to speak off, and in case with artwork, you can separate good from bad by merely looking at it, without any need to click additional links to see what is it about. And after all, those crappy artists, they're just learning stuff, and in majority of cases they eventually become good ones - just let them hang around with their crappy drawings, they'll get good sooner or later  And by "filtering" their artwork, we may eventually fall into the same trap as FurNation - novice artists will be basically "bullied" off the site, and we'll get a huge gap between skilled and unskilled ones, something that can discourage many aspiring beginners from joining FA in the first place.


----------



## PlusThirtyOne (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> I'll quickly throw in an interesting example that's a bit less common:
> I'm very dependent on mother, as I'm physically incapable of doing MANY things. However, a part of me REALLY wants to explore the sexual side of art, hence why I'm currently working on some delicious smut. *But*, given my dependency on my mother, I need to tell her about what I'm doing, and this might be rough. Do you have any ideas?


Well, i'll say this: At least your art is GOOD. it's not sub-par MSPaint cringe doodles.
i guess it all depends on how chill your mother is and how much you depend on her. if you suspect she'll find it awkward, then keep it private. if you have to, keep a sketchbook with "Private" written on it. Keep erotic digital pieces in a separate semi-hidden folder. Work on erotic pieces when she isn't around. if you need her to help you get situated at the computer or get your tools and things together, get everything read BEFORE you need assistance and work on your erotic art AFTER. if you need her to fetch your art tools, have her gather them for you first so she won't see what you're drawing.

Again, it'd help to know what you need assistance with to help you plan ahead but if you've already gotten away with doodlin' smut, then it sounds like you've got things figured out.


----------



## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

nerdbat said:


> Now I see where you're coming with that. I'll agree with the "pervy" part, I think it can be fixed by adding some additional filters - there is a SFW one, but it doesn't cover many relatively tame fetishes (like paw fetish or vore), so we still end up with stuff like this on a frontpage. And as for cleaning the artwork out - welp, unlike Steam, there's no market to speak off, and in case with artwork, you can separate good from bad by merely looking at it, without any need to click additional links to see what is it about. And after all, those crappy artists, they're just learning stuff, and in majority of cases they eventually become good ones - just let them hang around with their crappy drawings, they'll get good sooner or later  And by "filtering" their artwork, we may eventually fall into the same trap as FurNation - novice artists will be basically "bullied" off the site, and we'll get a huge gap between skilled and unskilled ones, something that can discourage many aspiring beginners from joining FA in the first place.



Very true. Honestly, I go on e621 and go through tonnes of very amateur art, but I just skip it if (from the thumbnail) it's not up to my standards. I'm also not bullying amateur MS Painters, I just wish they'd "try harder" xD


----------



## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

PlusThirtyOne said:


> Again, it'd help to know what you need assistance with to help you plan ahead but if you've already gotten away with doodlin' smut, then it sounds like you've got things figured out.



A part of me just really wants to tell her and not engage in this secrecy. I doubt she'll be too mad, but I'm not sure. We'll see.


----------



## PlusThirtyOne (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> I'm also not bullying amateur MS Painters, I just wish they'd "try harder" xD


*AHEM* i started with MSPaint and i draw'd me some shmexy pixel tits if i do say so myself.
No, really, i know what you're talking about but my MSPaint arts have been praised for their fappability! LOL


Shmallow said:


> A part of me just really wants to tell her and not engage in this secrecy. I doubt she'll be too mad, but I'm not sure. We'll see.


Just the same. She doesn't _need_ to know your sexual preferences. ...or WANT to know them. it's not a deep dark secret you have to keep. Just be modest about it.


----------



## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

PlusThirtyOne said:


> *AHEM* i started with MSPaint and i draw'd me some shmexy pixel tits if i do say so myself.
> No, really, i know what you're talking about but my MSPaint arts have been praised for their fappability! LOL
> 
> Just the same. She doesn't _need_ to know your sexual presences. ...or WANT to know them. it's not a deep dark secret you have to keep. Just be modest about it.



Thanks for the advice. And thank you for the praise! I do think my art is gud~
And I do fap to lots of pixel art. Sometimes pixel art can be EVEN MORE arousing than realism, because of the adorableness xD Tiny pixel boobs, who wouldn't want that?!


----------



## Deleted member 82554 (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> Yeah~ Kind of~ But calling it that makes it sound way too serious. Marxism is a movement, Anthropomorphology is barely one. If one day furries begin an artistic revolution, much like Fauvism or Cubism, then I'll be very much inclined to call it an "orientation" or "movement". Right now, it's just a fandom secluded from the rest of the internet and media.


Still going to have to disagree. As a whole, I'd say the fandom is not an orientation, but that really comes down to how the individual treats it.


----------



## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Mr. Fox said:


> Still going to have to disagree. As a whole, I'd say the fandom is not an orientation, but that really comes down to how the individual treats it.


You're right, everyone is different. But furries have to push a more "tame" version of their fandom to the media and the "normie world". Same as homosexuality or fauvism, etc. etc. By striking with extreme examples of pornography and weird fetishes, people won't be happy about anthropomorphism, thinking it's directly related to sexuality and zoophilia


----------



## PlusThirtyOne (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> And I do fap to lots of pixel art.


i'd show you my pixel tits (LOL) but they're under another username i keep private...
On a more serious note, i totally get that. Pixel arts are easier to animate and leave more details to the imagination. i like simplistic, cartoony art so obviously i like pixel sprites and such. Also, i grew up in the 8/16 bit generation and nostalgia and *_AHEM_* arousal go hand-in-hand.

...or dick-in-hand! Nevermind. Sorry. it had to be said. No it didn't i'm going to sleep now... :V


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

TheOneRealPotato said:


> Yiff must end. That shizz ain't right.


Thanks for your opinion HITLER. Lets just put all the yiff furries in concentration camps. You think thats cool theonerealpotato? Well its not. The fuck outta here


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Zenoth said:


> People that use dog toy squeakers , and bird calls  as their 'voice' while in suit.


And or a fart that you believe will be silent, but all of a sudden your ass goes rogue on you and the plastic chair youre sitting in dont help either, and that motherfucker squeaks its way out and then you start getting hate looks from everybody. And now the girl you like thinks youre an ass clown and everyone calls you ass clown the gay clown. That was the worst birthday ever. Fuck the 1st grade.


----------



## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Honestly, the problem is just with people themselves. Not necessarily the fandom.

People 'come out' because being a furry is still somewhat taboo and to 'come out' is to increase the numbers of furries within the minds of the people closest to them in a way to try and dispel some negative preconceptions people may have.
It's why people don't 'come out' to people they don't trust or like. Why bother, right?

It would be nice if it wasn't necessary, but the thing is, why should people have to hide who they are?
If their furrydom takes a large portion of their life, they shouldn't have to be held back by those around them.

But we don't live in such an idealistic world, do we?


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Prometheus_Fox said:


> Honestly, the problem is just with people themselves. Not necessarily the fandom.
> 
> People 'come out' because being a furry is still somewhat taboo and to 'come out' is to increase the numbers of furries within the minds of the people closest to them in a way to try and dispel some negative preconceptions people may have.
> It's why people don't 'come out' to people they don't trust or like. Why bother, right?
> ...


Wouldnt it be nice if we could wakeup
In the kind of world where we belonged.......


----------



## Okami_No_Heishi (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> Orientation implies a sort of "lifestyle", and, honestly, furries don't have a "lifestyle" aside from the crazy ones. We don't dedicate our entire existence to being furries, unlike homosexuality or, I dunno, Christianity where one is governed by a set of rules, and his lifestyle is deeply fused with this 'idea' or 'hobby'. (not implying that homosexuality is a choice, merely that it's part of our almost day-to-day life)
> 
> Weeaboos might like anime and collect a bunch of plushies, but usually it's not a "lifestyle" or an "orientation". Just a more precise interest in pseudo-japanese culture and artstyles.


Wowowo. Homosexuals? Really? Most gay methand women that I have known don't go out of their ways to promote or express their "homosexuality". Matter of fact, none of them ever have. But that is just the gay folks I know or have known. But I have seen Furries that it is a way of life to them. Our points are going all over the place. To me, my point is that if you want to come out as gay, as a Furry, or a secret unicorn collector, that it is ok, and that we all shouldn't be judgemental of people who do want to do that.


----------



## TheOneRealPotato (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Thanks for your opinion HITLER. Lets just put all the yiff furries in concentration camps. You think thats cool theonerealpotato? Well its not. The fuck outta here


Whoah, don't you dare accuse me of being a neo-Nazi, I am quarter German and I have family who experienced World War Two firsthand. I'm just saying, the yiff needs to be reduced at least.

And don't tell me to fuck off and call me a xenophobe, whilst you're at it. Nobody likes a dickhead.


----------



## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Wouldnt it be nice if we could wakeup
> In the kind of world where we belonged.......


I'm afraid to say, but that kind of thinking can be rather dangerous.
Many, many violent people are ideologues.

Not trying to say that changing the world is an impossible feat, but many people have a tough time figuring out how to go from fantasy to making it a reality.
And that's where the problem occurs.


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

TheOneRealPotato said:


> Whoah, don't you dare accuse me of being a neo-Nazi, I am quarter German and I have family who experienced World War Two firsthand. I'm just saying, the yiff needs to be reduced at least.
> 
> And don't tell me to fuck off and call me a xenophobe, whilst you're at it. Nobody likes a dickhead.


My jokes have gone too far this time. You're right, sorry buddy. I apologize for getting out of hand. Quite often i take things too far for no real reason other than my own amusement. I am not above admitting i was said something i shouldnt have and apologizing. And I respect your opinions. Theonerealpotato I acknowledge that you are a real person on the other side of the keyboard and I appreciate you as a person. I love you


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Prometheus_Fox said:


> I'm afraid to say, but that kind of thinking can be rather dangerous.
> Many, many violent people are ideologues.
> 
> Not trying to say that changing the world is an impossible feat, but many people have a tough time figuring out how to go from fantasy to making it a reality.
> And that's where the problem occurs.


I thought you were going to reply with the rest of the lyrics. Beach Boys- wouldnt it be nice. This is the worst birthday ever


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## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> I thought you were going to reply with the rest of the lyrics. Beach Boys- wouldnt it be nice. This is the worst birthday ever


I don't listen to Beach Boys, sorry.
And I stopped doing the song quoting thing back when Myspace died.

Sorry to disappoint.


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Im a loose cannon cop who doesnt play by the rules.


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Prometheus_Fox said:


> I don't listen to Beach Boys, sorry.
> And I stopped doing the song quoting thing back when Myspace died.
> 
> Sorry to disappoint.


Me either, its the only song by them i know. I thought i was being cute, but thinking about now, it was most definitely not righteous of me. Also, remember myspace and all the drama that unfolded there, ahhh myspace  In conclusion, I am sorry that you felt the need to say sorry to me. Also I dont believe you are indeed sorry. Youre just sorry you got caught.


----------



## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Me either, its the only song by them i know. I thought i was being cute, but thinking about now, it was most definitely not righteous of me. Also, remember myspace and all the drama that unfolded there, ahhh myspace  In conclusion, I am sorry that you felt the need to say sorry to me. Also I dont believe you are indeed sorry. Youre just sorry you got caught.


Meh.
Something like this isn't worth sweating over.
Even being sorry for not catching a quote from an old song isn't worth the energy.

It was just etiquette, I suppose.


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Prometheus_Fox said:


> Meh.
> Something like this isn't worth sweating over.
> Even being sorry for not catching a quote from an old song isn't worth the energy.
> 
> It was just etiquette, I suppose.


I find your reply to civil to respond with a shitty response. I think we can agree that we were both wrong and move forward.


----------



## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> I find your reply to civil to respond with a shitty response. I think we can agree that we were both wrong and move forward.


Even though I may have missed it being a quote, I think my response to it was still valid.

So I can't honestly agree with your outcome.

Sorry


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Prometheus_Fox said:


> Even though I may have missed it being a quote, I think my response to it was still valid.
> 
> So I can't honestly agree with your outcome.
> 
> Sorry



What if I sweeten the pot? I think we can both agree that we were both wrong. And that the beach boys were the ones who in fact are to blame for inciting fur on fur violence. Agreed?


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


>


You don't say that.


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> You don't say that.


But I did.


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> But I did.


Cut the shit Larry. I didn't fight in the war on drugs, so that I could come home and take shit from Very Hairy Larry. You dont even know my life bro.


----------



## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> What if I sweeten the pot? I think we can both agree that we were both wrong. And that the beach boys were the ones who in fact are to blame for inciting fur on fur violence. Agreed?


You keep making worse and worse deals.

I would recommend you not start up in organized crime because of this


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Cut the shit Larry. I didn't fight in the war on drugs, so that I could come home and take shit from Very Hairy Larry. You dont even know my life bro.


What in the fuck are you on about??? I just posted a meme and now you're all like "I didn't fight the war on drugs so that I could come home to take shit from you."

LOLOLOLOL! Are you like, offended or something??? What do you mean cut the shit? If anyone needs to cut the shit it's you because you're being a complete asshole. I didn't fuckin say anything offensive to you. I know I don't know your life. I never said I did. How do you take that from a fuckin internet meme and me saying "But I did"???? HOW ARE YOU GETTING OFFENDED OVER THIS?!?!? LOLOLOL!!!

What tf is your fuckin problem, dude. xDDDD I can't believe someone can get THAT offended over something that isn't offensive whatsoever.


----------



## Casey Fluffbat (Jan 1, 2017)

Remove fetishes


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## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Prometheus_Fox said:


> You keep making worse and worse deals.
> 
> I would recommend you not start up in organized crime because of this


Says you, someone who lies through their teeth, when theyre even a little bit sorry at all, and smokes the devil's lettuce. Think i dont know? I could smell that shit through my keyboard buster. Im good at doing crime, you dont even know me, you dont know my life.


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Says you, someone who lies through their teeth, when theyre even a little bit sorry at all, and smokes the devil's lettuce. Think i dont know? I could smell that shit through my keyboard buster. Im good at doing crime, you dont even know me, you dont know my life.


You've got to be some sort of a troll or something because there is no way someone can act this fuckin ridiculous.


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> What in the fuck are you on about??? I just posted a meme and now you're all like "I didn't fight the war on drugs so that I could come home to take shit from you."
> 
> LOLOLOLOL! Are you like, offended or something??? What do you mean cut the shit? If anyone needs to cut the shit it's you because you're being a complete asshole. I didn't fuckin say anything offensive to you. I know I don't know your life. I never said I did. How do you take that from a fuckin internet meme and me saying "But I did"???? HOW ARE YOU GETTING OFFENDED OVER THIS?!?!? LOLOLOL!!!
> 
> What tf is your fuckin problem, dude. xDDDD I can't believe someone can get THAT offended over something that isn't offensive whatsoever.


Im sorry larry murphy, it was an accident, I was having too much fun.


----------



## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Says you, someone who lies through their teeth, when theyre even a little bit sorry at all, and smokes the devil's lettuce. Think i dont know? I could smell that shit through my keyboard buster. Im good at doing crime, you dont even know me, you dont know my life.


lol hey, I said organized crime.
Can't be making bad deals like that when sitting in a pizza place run by a Jewish mob boss.


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> You've got to be some sort of a troll or something because there is no way someone can act this fuckin ridiculous.


Larry...... you keep shittin' all over my life. This isnt even has anything to do with you.


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Im sorry larry murphy, it was an accident, I was having too much fun.


Well, it seemed like you kind of acting serious, but whatever.


Badger94 said:


> it was an accident


?????




k den


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Larry...... you keep shittin' all over my life. This isnt even has anything to do with you.


LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!! So one moment, you're all like, "It was an accident" and now you're the complete opposite???? LOLOLOLOL!!! I'M NOT EVEN INSULTING YOU!!! xDDDD


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> Well, it seemed like you kind of acting serious, but whatever.
> 
> ?????
> 
> ...


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

I didn't make any mistake. lol. If anything, you made the mistake of looking like a complete wack-job. xDDD











There is no way this can be real. xD


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

I love you


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> I didn't make any mistake. lol. If anything, you made the mistake of looking like a complete wack-job. xDDD
> 
> Denial aint just a river in egypt bro, you need to move on
> 
> ...


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Prometheus_Fox said:


> lol hey, I said organized crime.
> Can't be making bad deals like that when sitting in a pizza place run by a Jewish mob boss.


Well ive got some bad news, because im the top dealer for the jewish mob, and i get the best reviews on yelp


----------



## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Well ive got some bad news, because im the top dealer for the jewish mob, and i get the best reviews on yelp


You know Yelp is shit, right?
They only show the low reviews unless the business pays for the highest ones to show up on the page.


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

Yeah, you're just trolling with me, dude. xD

In no way at all am I denying. If anything, you're denying the fact that you're acting you're insane and rather aggressive. And now you just want to cover that up by just telling me to move on. LOLOL!!!
This is just fuckin ridiculous, dude. xDDD


----------



## Very Hairy Larry (Jan 1, 2017)

Badger94 said:


> Well ive got some bad news, because im the top dealer for the jewish mob, and i get the best reviews on yelp


It's been confirmed that you're just fuckin with us now. xD


----------



## Badger94 (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> It's been confirmed that you're just fuckin with us now. xD


Correction..... you were fuckin with yourself. *Larry's mind blown*


----------



## Zipline (Jan 1, 2017)

Very Hairy Larry said:


> Yeah, you're just trolling with me, dude. xD
> 
> In no way at all am I denying. If anything, you're denying the fact that you're acting you're insane and rather aggressive. And now you just want to cover that up by just telling me to move on. LOLOL!!!
> This is just fuckin ridiculous, dude. xDDD


Larbear, please don't fight over me! :'3
Unless you really want to... >vv<


----------



## Shmallow (Jan 1, 2017)

Prometheus_Fox said:


> Honestly, the problem is just with people themselves. Not necessarily the fandom.
> 
> People 'come out' because being a furry is still somewhat taboo and to 'come out' is to increase the numbers of furries within the minds of the people closest to them in a way to try and dispel some negative preconceptions people may have.
> It's why people don't 'come out' to people they don't trust or like. Why bother, right?



You don't need to "come out" as a furry. It's like coming out as a "weeb" -- it's not your identity, it's a vague description of some of your interests, including anthropomorpholy, animalistic features on humanoid characters, cartoons and art, etc. Just like anime, furry art is very much tied to sexuality and a degree of attraction, hence why others perceive these two forms of art "perverted". As long as we have anthropological animal porn, then we'll always be stigmatized to a certain degree - so instead of saying "I'm a furry", say "I like cartoon characters", it'll more or less free you of most awkwardness.


----------



## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> You don't need to "come out" as a furry. It's like coming out as a "weeb" -- it's not your identity, it's a vague description of some of your interests, including anthropomorpholy, animalistic features on humanoid characters, cartoons and art, etc. Just like anime, furry art is very much tied to sexuality and a degree of attraction, hence why others perceive these two forms of art "perverted". As long as we have anthropological animal porn, then we'll always be stigmatized to a certain degree - so instead of saying "I'm a furry", say "I like cartoon characters", it'll more or less free you of most awkwardness.


I'd argue that it really depends on the person's situation and surroundings.


----------



## Reyna Malone (Jan 1, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> That's just as dumb as saying "Weebs are pervs because plenty of anime is weirdly sexualized and fancervicy". If pornography artists make money off of their works, then it's because there are plenty of people who are enjoying that content (content that, mind you, isn't harming anybody in the process of being created). So no, there is no inherent problem with "Yiff".
> 
> Hentai is a sub-genre of Anime, and Yiff is a sub-genre of Furry art. So that's that.
> 
> Edit: Also, "Furry" isn't an identity. You just like fluffy cartoon characters and their animalistic features, like tails and cat ears, or fur on their bodies, snouts, etc. etc. etc.


Yeah, my mom actually thinks that about anime, and my dad thinks that the furry fandom is weird/overly sexual. While I agree that furry is not an identity and that it is absolutely not comming out, there are still reasons why people choose to hide their interest. I'm open with my peers and my sister about being a furry, but I don't tell my parents because I know they hold a pretty unfavorable view of the stuff here.


----------



## Reyna Malone (Jan 1, 2017)

If I could change one thing about the furry fandom, it would be the diversity. The fandom is about 76% male and about 97% white. (Please forgive me if I'm off by a _few_ points, I don't have the data pulled up rn. If I'm off by a lot, please let me know.) I'd just like to see more women and more POC represented in the fandom.


----------



## Storok (Jan 1, 2017)

I would love to change this fandom a lot to be honest and I will go over every point in depth here... There are some:

Fat people: I hate fat people so i also dont like their existence in this fandom.
They are giving up on the best gift that has ever been giving to them...

Gay people: It is okay if you are gay but... There is one phenomenon that I see in this fandom... People who are gay because of desperation. That is so sad and bad at the same time that I think those people font have the right to exist anyway.

Depression: It is a joke guys lets be honest essay to many furries are pussies that love to cry all day long because of beats by dad or some shit or because of being picked on gor being a furry... They wouldn't be picked on if there were less fat and ugly people without a life in this fandom though also counting in the desperate cringe gays here.

Giving no shit about what you post: This fandom is really fucked up because all most everyone is was waaaaaaay to open with their fetish shit here... Wich again leads to a really weird outwards appearance. That again leads to the kid getting bullied for being a furry that again leads to the crybaby "Depression"
and so on you get it.

Easily offended Cry-baby's:
Those are the people that probably fit 2 of the 3 things I talked about earlier and yeah there are waaaay to many of them around this fandom they hear a word that they don't like and instantly they take some victim role but the problem with those people is that they always Find somebody that also takes their side... Most of the time some SJW with no life.

if you noe think... OMG Storok! I fit 2 of those things you listed there! How can I help it? I can tell you...
if you are fat... Eat less
if you are pseudo gay... There is no help for ya
if you are "depressed"... Okay hold on... Having a bad day does not equal depression. Having a bad week does not equal depression. Also having a bad week does not.
If you are about to post everything about your fetishes... Imagine, does everybody really want to know about it ?
This fandom is not discriminating people of colour or women so if you say there are not enough of them its not the fandoms fault... If you find yourself writing stuff like that you probably fall under the crybaby and SJW category... Just stop it. Thanks


----------



## Vitaly (Jan 2, 2017)

Remove bronies, sanics, macro, voring and shemales.

And this fandom will be


----------



## Shmallow (Jan 2, 2017)

Reyna Malone said:


> Yeah, my mom actually thinks that about anime, and my dad thinks that the furry fandom is weird/overly sexual. While I agree that furry is not an identity and that it is absolutely not comming out, there are still reasons why people choose to hide their interest. I'm open with my peers and my sister about being a furry, but I don't tell my parents because I know they hold a pretty unfavorable view of the stuff here.



You hide your interests more often than you'd think. Guilty pleasures have always been around and people have named them that for a reason. We're supposedly adults with an unusual attraction to cartoons (that alone is out of the ordinary), and a *specific* theme in said cartoons -- aka: an obsession with anthropomorpholy. The usage of "fursonas" leads to people thinking we're "otherkin", and the amount of porn we as a fandom create and consume on a daily basis is extraordinary. Let's face it, we're an odd bunch, and we attract odd people -- like zoophiles -- and that will always be the case.

Not to say we don't deserve some merit! Our fursuiters are hardworking people, our art is adorably great and our pornography is, perhaps, the top ranking erotic cartoon material on the Internet!. However, this is only if we judge ourselves by the "*elites*" - the majority of people creates "okay" art at best, MS Paint fetish compilations and animations of transgender source ponies clopping with ginormous penises, while the other bunch writes criny roleplays and fanfictions. Some create music and other forms of art, but it has little to do with the fandom. So I wouldn't blame people for not understanding us. :/


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## Shmallow (Jan 2, 2017)

Storok said:


> if you noe think... OMG Storok! I fit 2 of those things you listed there! How can I help it? I can tell you...
> if you are fat... Eat less
> if you are pseudo gay... There is no help for ya
> if you are "depressed"... Okay hold on... Having a bad day does not equal depression. Having a bad week does not equal depression. Also having a bad week does not.
> ...



1 - By "Fat" do you mean to say "obese"? I'm also not very attracted to obese people, but I fail to see how they're a "problem".
2 - Sexuality is not easily definable. I'm openly pansexual on the Internet. Honestly, I haven't encountered a single "pseudo-gay" in my lifetime. This is an honest truth, maybe I'm just 'lucky'?
3 - Depression is an illness, and most people are not "depressed", medically speaking. Yet, we can't fault people for wanting to share their awful experiences about "their dad beating them". This community, oddly enough, offers a great deal of support for people who're just going through a bad time in their life.
4 - You don't need to look at "my fetishes". I post my art on FA and e621 because it is allowed. It is my hobby and furthermore might become my job. You can use filters to hide all the explicit content posted on FA, same for e621. 
5 - SJWs are crap, period. They're part of every community as it is.

Try not to sound like a complete douche. We're trying to have a positive conversation about the problems in our community, and you can barely write one sentence in English. Well, okay.


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## Shmallow (Jan 2, 2017)

Reyna Malone said:


> If I could change one thing about the furry fandom, it would be the diversity. The fandom is about 76% male and about 97% white. (Please forgive me if I'm off by a _few_ points, I don't have the data pulled up rn. If I'm off by a lot, please let me know.) I'd just like to see more women and more POC represented in the fandom.



While I would also love to see more diversity in our midst, keep in mind that practically nobody cares about your ethnicity or gender in a community as 'weird' as this one. Both guys and lasses are accepted with open arms! Same goes for whites, blacks, hispanics, asians, etc. The only reason we have a lack of diversity, is because women and non-white folk just don't want to join in. Sadly.

 Just clarifying, in case you want to argue we're "sexist" and "racist", which, trust me, people often tend to say on a whim.


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## Shmallow (Jan 2, 2017)

Vitaly said:


> Remove bronies, sanics, macro, voring and shemales.



Well, that's your opinion, I guess. I also dislike voring and shemales, etc -- but it's hard to judge people when my own fetishes aren't very "conventional". I wish people could just be tolerant and not kink-shame, tbh ^^


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## quoting_mungo (Jan 3, 2017)

Less shitposting in this goddamn thread, that's what I would change.

And by "that's what I would change" I mean "seriously knock it off with the bickering and shitposting right now if not sooner". With my mod hat on. Don't make me tell you twice.


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## nerdbat (Jan 3, 2017)

quoting_mungo said:


> Less shitposting in this goddamn thread, that's what I would change.
> 
> And by "that's what I would change" I mean "seriously knock it off with the bickering and shitposting right now if not sooner". With my mod hat on. Don't make me tell you twice.


You look both cute and cool with that hat on, please wear it more often


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## ChapterAquila92 (Jan 5, 2017)

I'd probably consider nuking the fandom and starting over, but barring such wanton eradication I'd strongly consider excising the cult-like behaviours that are fostered within the fandom, including the identity politics. This behaviour only serves to feed back into the taboo nature of the fandom and further alienate it from society. It's sadly ironic that a loose community that should encourage the freedom to express oneself restricts it by its own self-destructive actions.


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## Sagt (Jan 5, 2017)

Self-loathing furries

Edit: Also kink shaming.


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## Leoni Zheitk (Jan 5, 2017)

Immaturity


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## Toby_Morpheus (Jan 5, 2017)

Lcs said:


> Edit: Also kink shaming.


This is something I'd like to see in other communities as well.

I don't like that baby shit, but damn, if someone gets off on it and they aren't infringing on others, then go right ahead.


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## Yakamaru (Jan 5, 2017)

Shmallow said:


> Orgasms 4 the kids, am I right?


Looks like you don't read.

Here is what I asked you:


> How young would you go before your statement "Orgasms 4 the kids" is null and void? 13?


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## Xandran (Jan 8, 2017)

Lcs said:


> Self-loathing furries



Same here i can't count how many furs I've met that just moan about the fandom, also get super insulted when told to shut up & leave. Old FAF had a few that would hide there main accounts to hide that there not furries just troll's/haters, not active in the community & do same stuff they hate.

Do outsiders count?, Because i think allot of the stigma would die down if people who have no idea what a furry is but pretend they do while going on how they hate them would shut up. Best example was how dramatica(pre shut down version) thought that any site/forum that had a furry userbase was automatically crap, because allot sites that had ED pages was just because the site had furries on it like Reddit.


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## ChapterAquila92 (Jan 8, 2017)

Xandran said:


> Same here i can't count how many furs I've met that just moan about the fandom, also get super insulted when told to shut up & leave. Old FAF had a few that would hide there main accounts to hide that there not furries just troll's/haters, not active in the community & do same stuff they hate.
> 
> Do outsiders count?, Because i think allot of the stigma would die down if people who have no idea what a furry is but pretend they do while going on how they hate them would shut up. Best example was how dramatica(pre shut down version) thought that any site/forum that had a furry userbase was automatically crap, because allot sites that had ED pages was just because the site had furries on it like Reddit.


It would also die down even further if furries in general wouldn't play into the hands of trolls with their own hubris.

Stereotypes are by no means deterministic, but they exist because of persistent trends with the general behaviour of a group.


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## Xandran (Jan 8, 2017)

ChapterAquila92 said:


> It would also die down even further if furries in general wouldn't play into the hands of trolls with their own hubris.


 Which is why i cringe when people at /r/Furry go on a rant how someone insulted them on another sub & its just low effort troll who's probably 12.


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