# first time fursuiter dos & don'ts



## hijimete (Oct 29, 2008)

I just wanted to know what the do & dont's are for the first time fursuiter & what is it like to go fursuiting for the first time in public becuse I just realized it's got be well scary the first time.


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## NoxTigress (Oct 29, 2008)

My two biggest bits of advice would be as follows...

First, people will give you odd looks, jeer, and pass rude comments.  This seems to always happen at least once to any fursuiter, even those of us who stick with just a tail and/or ears.  Don't let it get under your skin, and try not to respond harshly yourself because that never ends well.

Second, keep an eye on your tail.  Some of the types of people mentioned above like to do things like pull tails.  And, as we all should know, even the strongest stitching can only take so much.  I actually saw someone in a lion fursuit just this weekend at a con, who got his tail pulled.  It didn't come undone or anything (as far as I could tell) but by the way the lion clung onto his tail afterwards, it certainly can't have been a light tug.

Oh and from what I've come to understand from people that go out in full or partial suits (anything with a head really), is to try to make sure you have at least one friend handy to act as 'handler'.  Someone to help you out with zippers, removing your head, pulling up feetpaws, etc.  Simple tasks are not always easy when you don't have full range of vision, or are wearing handpaws, and such.  Plus they can help keep an eye on your tail.


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## Trpdwarf (Oct 29, 2008)

The things that NoxTigress suggested are all good. I say this as I relax at home after going to my College in Costume for an event...make sure you are hydrated.

Hydration is a serious issue when in costume. Your body is going to go through a lot of water and sweat it out. Therefore you need to ensure that you supply your body with enough water. It is important the day before you plan to go about in costume, start drinking a lot of water, and stop drinking things like Energy Drinks or Soda. Those things will dehydrate you. Also try to avoid drinking Alcohol. Being drunk in costume is not funny or cute.

Also, it is important to eat a good meal and give your body a bit of time to digest it before going out in costume. You also will want to get things like Energy Bars that are packed with Protein....and also ensure you eat enough carbohydrates. Your body will metabolize nearly twice as much while you are in costume so what you go through in a regular day probably will not be enough food-wise.

Also, another thing....caution with bottled water. I came back today to find that the bottled water I was drinking....the label had leaked ink that rubbed off into my white paws. So if you are wearing light colors especially white try to avoid things that will stain it.

Another thing don't drink too much water....there is something...and I don't know the name of it, but it is a condition where you drink too much water and your cells burst or something. So while drinking water is good, don't over-do it.

Other than that...wear deodorant while in costume, and ensure that after you get out of costume you wash up, and wash the inside of your costume with something.


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## Beastcub (Oct 29, 2008)

dealing with kids:

let them come to you, the ones who want a hug will come, you do not want to make anyone cry

if the kid seems worried and the parents keep trying to get it to come closer for a picture or something ( i find that some kids will get within 4 feet and be fine, any closer and they want to cry) then try covering your eyes like peekaboo, acting sad or lay down for a tummy rub.

if the kid is worried or scared and the parents are not pressureing the kid then try to stay away, try to keep your back to the kid. if the kid does cry act scared or sad as in show you are sorry (if not for the kids sake then the parents)

do not talk to kids it just confuses the crap out of them more. my cat has a moving jaw and one little boy was all smiles till i meowed and moved it as his face became that of confusion and worry.

avoid areas that will have kids and food, i was horrified when a girl eating blue cotton candy with a face covered in the stuff gave me a hug, by some miracle none came off on me.


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## Ozriel (Oct 29, 2008)

Never accept an offer from an Adult to hold a child. Your vision is limited and you do not want anything to happen like the "Tigger" incident? And you have a good chance of dropping the child.

Watch your Surroundings.
Never drink any caffenated beverages before hopping into a fursuit.
Always have a Spotter in a Public place to bee an extra set of eyes and ears, as well as a "Guardian".
And Underamor and a Balaclava are your friends!


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## Freya (Oct 29, 2008)

Tigger incident?


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## Trpdwarf (Oct 29, 2008)

Freya said:


> Tigger incident?



Sometime ago a mascot person in Disneyland wearing a Tigger costume, took a picture with some young ladies. One of the ladies sued him because she believed he had intentionally tried to grope her breasts because one of the paws when he was hugging the ladies, ended up over her chest area.

When you are in costume, you cannot always see well where your hands or other body parts are. That was the case with this incident. The person in the costume did not know his hand was where it was because of the limits in vision but the lady ran with it, and the court finally put a stop to it because there was no evidence that he tried to grope her and most of the witnesses sided with the side of the costumer.

Now they call it the tigger syndrome, when somebody actively seeks to take advantage of a costumer's limited vision to try to sue them, or provoke incidents that could lead to suing.

Thus you need to be more aware of what you do so you do not provoke give people a chance to misread your intentions.


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## Beastcub (Oct 29, 2008)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> Never accept an offer from an Adult to hold a child.




this one little boy (like just old enough to be out of diapers) was so cute and asked very seriously "why os the kitty so big!" and he was just so cute and wanted to say hi, the mom asked him "you want the kitty to hold you?" my reaction was that of almost panic as i instantly plopped down on my knees and put my arms out ready for a hug....
i did NOT want her to hand me her kid, i cannot see all that well and i have limited dexterity with my paws and there was a good chance i could have dropped him!

i also have another tip to add: if around cars expect to get honked at, honking is not a bad thing neither is hollering out their car if it is not profane. i just walked my niece to her girlscouts party and i got honked and hollered at playfully ("here kitty kitty" "whooooo!" "you rock" one guy at the intersection hollered "man your costume is better than mine, i'm gonna be a whoopie cusion!"), one teenage guy flipped me off but was laughing and took little offence considering his behavior was playful.


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## Smexi Foxness (Oct 30, 2008)

Just don't advertise it to teh public too much


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## Chomper (Oct 30, 2008)

Also, make sure you shower before and after, and wear a good amount of deodorant. Please.


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## Gavrill (Oct 30, 2008)

If in a full fursuit, even if you don't feel hot, try to stay in cool or air-conditioned places, especially if you don't have water or deodorant handy. 

Oh, like it was said before...remove the label on bottled water, the ink may come off.


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## Uro (Nov 2, 2008)

Trpdwarf said:


> TAlso try to avoid drinking Alcohol. Being drunk in costume is not funny or cute.



I disagree. Drunken fursuiting is possibly one of the funniest things ever.


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## Trpdwarf (Nov 3, 2008)

Uro said:


> I disagree. Drunken fursuiting is possibly one of the funniest things ever.



They are also a somewhat re-occuring problem every year and different cons.


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## dog_over_man (Nov 3, 2008)

x


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## Nylak (Nov 3, 2008)

dogoverman said:


> I've encountered more sober people with boundary problems than drunk ones.
> 
> At cons, I mean.


 
Which is why I'm never going to a con.  If anyone freaking touches me, I can't be held accountable for my actions.  I've begun to get the impression that makes me a minority in this community.  e_e


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## Trpdwarf (Nov 3, 2008)

dogoverman said:


> I've encountered more sober people with boundary problems than drunk ones.
> 
> At cons, I mean.



That's your experience.

Personally it doesn't make sense to be to be under the influence of drugs or alcohol while in costume.


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## Klickitat (Nov 4, 2008)

Fursuiting drunk at cons is fun.  Being groped in suit is NOT FUN.  Sadly, drunk fursuiting can lower one's ability to defend against unwanted groping.

But this is totally off topic from the OP.

If you're going suiting for the first time:
-have a handler/guardian to watch out for you
-remember to take a break every 10-15 minutes for fresh air and cool water
-always be mindful of where your feet are, take time going down stairs and stepping over things
-always be mindful of where your tail is (many tails are sat on and then torn off/broken in this way)
-make sure you're going out somewhere it's allowed (ie, not the mall, or banks)
-watch out for kids, and especially be mindful of parents.  you need to be respectful if they don't want their children near the stranger dressed as a giant animal person.

I've found that talking while in suit, out in the general public, helps tremendously to get over the "creepy" factor a lot of people have with mascots.  Even though I know some furries have a taboo about talking in suit, I think that it makes you more approachable and less shady overall.  Barking, yipping, and merfing do not count as talking.

But barking at dogs is fun.  Just don't piss off the dog's owner, I've seen a few people that are none too happy about it!

The biggest thing is to have fun, but be respectful of everyone else's boundaries.  The more respectful and positive an experience they have, the more fun you will have and the better chance you will have of being well received in future outings.


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## TamaraRose (Nov 4, 2008)

just in case it hasnt been covered..
 do pace your self  suits can get  rather warm...
 do   use the headless lounge and drink water... last thing you need is  to be  heat sick or dehydrated for the hole  con...
  have a buddy  if you can to spot for you...

 and fo god  sake yes  watch your tail.. i was playing  with  a  group of  fursuits in  just my  ears and tail... on of them  grabed  yanked and twistied and i  end up  having to have corsi  pulling  twisited safe pin out of my butt


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## TamaraRose (Nov 4, 2008)

Trpdwarf said:


> They are also a somewhat re-occuring problem every year and different cons.



 but  drinking  doesnt help you retan  water  and the heat in the suit  can make you very sick after  drinking

{ ment  to  quote some one esle sorry}


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## Farquar (Nov 15, 2008)

If possible, add some ventilation holes around your mouth (and the muzzle) in the mask. With my first fursuit- Tessy, I had a sort of hole thing that My mouth fit through so I could talk and such. It was a static jaw, but you get the point ;D

Anyway, I went out halloweening in my fursuit and within five minutes, literally, I was being caught by my friend from overheating and too much carbon-dioxide around my mouth.

Basically, if you're not careful, you can inhale a lot of the fumes you exhale without proper ventilation. ;D Hope this helps!


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## Trpdwarf (Nov 15, 2008)

TamaraRose said:


> but  drinking  doesnt help you retan  water  and the heat in the suit  can make you very sick after  drinking
> 
> { ment  to  quote some one esle sorry}



That is true.

One of the things that you will notice if you drink enough water while suiting is that you don't have to use the bathroom as much. Your pores are sweating out the water.

It's not about retaining water when you drink so much water. It is about keeping enough water in there, when your body is sweating it out. However, when you drink...it causes you to sweat more, and thins your blood. So it can make it harder to keep enough water in your body. Or that is the understanding I am under.


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## nedded (Nov 16, 2008)

Some physically-oriented advice:
Make sure, if anything's tied to your head or face, that it's not too tight or that your skin can't breathe.
If you have any sewing skills, bring a travel sewing kit, as you never know when a seam might pop or some idiot tries to trash your suit.
And bring a handbag or backpack you can put your suit in if you overheat, and there isn't a good place to cool down.


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## Art Vulpine (Nov 16, 2008)

I'm not a fursuiter.

However I do have a piece of advice.

Know your surroundings.

When you enter a convention space for the first time, take a look around without your suit on.

See what room will have stuff relating to the con.

See what hazards there might be (areas with lost of furniture, stairs, escalators, etc.)

By scoping out the area without a suit, it will be much easier to have fun with a suit on.

Sage fox


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## Beastcub (Nov 17, 2008)

Inari85 said:


> I'm not a fursuiter.
> 
> However I do have a piece of advice.
> 
> ...




this is nessesary if your costume is BIG or has wings or some other obstacle. i had to check out an anime con space when i came as totoro to be sure he would fit through the doors and to see if there would be any stairs in the way (so hard to do stairs in that costume)


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## gliengul (Dec 2, 2008)

Trpdwarf said:


> Another thing don't drink too much water....there is something...and I don't know the name of it, but it is a condition where you drink too much water and your cells burst or something. So while drinking water is good, don't over-do it.



Water Narcosis is a nasty thing when it happens, you get obsessed with drinking water (no amount of it will seem to quench your thirst) it usually only happens when you are depleting your body's electrolytes (using a lot of energy drinks or sweating a lot without eating).

Avoid most sports drinks as they don't have balanced electrolytes and under extreme conditions (like the ones that cause water narcosis) can cause seizures.


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## Defiant (Dec 3, 2008)

All good advice. But there is one thing I WILL disagree with. Gatorade was made for a reason. Water sucks , it really really sucks! (sorry for the waterboy reference). You sweat out more than just water. Gatorade will put back in what you sweat out. I work on 200+ degree engines on 100+ degree days. Let me tell you that gatorade is the ONLY reason I can make it through the day! I stand behind this stuff all the way and I WILL argue it to the death!
   The interior of my suit is lined in suede and it DOES NOT breathe! I have been drunk and in suit plenty of times. I'll drink a lot of beer and dump at least a liter of gatorade on top of it. I get buzzed as hell and stay hydrated. I have done this several times and I have proven this to work.
  I have kids so I know how to deal with them. DO NOT be drunk around them or I will maim you! That being said , if they show interest in you , kneel down and bring yourself to their level. I have very toony suit and kids LOVE it! I have kids come up to me all the time. I am VERY good at being around them. The suit i have is innocent and cute enought to where the parents feel safe and if given the chance I will talk to the parents while still in suit. The local furs here hav not made a good name. SO I have taken it to myself to be the PR guy. ANd I have done VERY well.
  If the child acts scared  , back away slowly. ANd as stated , never pick them up. Be at their level. I will onyl pick pu my own kids in suit. BUt my vision is also GREAT! 
   Being drukn in suit is not a good idea for 1st timers. I will admit. But at the same time , I am GREAT in suit when drunk. SO are some others I saw at furfright this year! They were simply amazing and I have a LOT of it on tape! She was gret and entertaining. As well as attractive. But thats another story.


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## Hero_the_cat (Dec 5, 2008)

wow this is awesome stuff ^.^ im hoping one day to buy a fur suit of my fursona hero and ill keep all this info in mind when i do go suiting. thank you all ^^


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## Defiant (Dec 5, 2008)

Glad to know we can be of some help to those interested in and new to fursuits. I've done a lot so I can speak form 1st hand experience as well a quite a few others here.


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## Mingan Ohanzee (Jul 10, 2013)

I'm a first time suitor and I was wondering if anyone has tips for being more lively and photogenic. I was in a few photos especially when I go out dancing but in normal circumstances I guess I'm kinda 'flat'. Also what might be the best guidelines for posing for photos, I saw the post about the tiger incident and do not want to be in that position with anyone no matter age group. Suiting is something I've wanted to do since I was but a pup and finally can, ac was my first. I kept hydradate and all that but the spring in my step is more at the club than around the con. It isn't that I am bashful, at least I don't think so. I think part of my concern is I have limited vision to begin with as I can only see out of one eye since I'm blind on one side and my head limits my vision out of my good eye and I'm not always aware of all my surroundings when suiting.


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## Misomie (Jul 11, 2013)

Mingan Ohanzee said:


> I'm a first time suitor and I was wondering if anyone has tips for being more lively and photogenic. I was in a few photos especially when I go out dancing but in normal circumstances I guess I'm kinda 'flat'. Also what might be the best guidelines for posing for photos, I saw the post about the tiger incident and do not want to be in that position with anyone no matter age group. Suiting is something I've wanted to do since I was but a pup and finally can, ac was my first. I kept hydradate and all that but the spring in my step is more at the club than around the con. It isn't that I am bashful, at least I don't think so. I think part of my concern is I have limited vision to begin with as I can only see out of one eye since I'm blind on one side and my head limits my vision out of my good eye and I'm not always aware of all my surroundings when suiting.



I've adopted a few generic action poses for my character that I can pull off without even trying now. (mainly I just use basic Lucario poses, but people seem to love them so whatever. XD) Start playing around with poses and find one you like. Then practice it (without suit first) multiple times until your body knows the pose. However, practice more exaggerated poses (that might look funny without suit) when you do this. Once you can maintain a pose you like, work on a few others as well. I've found out that people will mimic my pose if they want their photo taken with me. Just have fun with it. I personally don't like to go and touch people, but if I know that they are ok with it (if they ask first or start it) I'll do so. However, only do what you are comfortable with.

Here are some examples with my Lucario fursuit (I try to never pose in a way that could be taken badly, you just have to be aware of your environment; try learning the location before wearing your suit or at least have a spotter) :

http://latinomaninblack.deviantart.com/art/Lucario-Fursuit-Cosplay-at-SacAnime-Summer-2012-327030858?q=favby%3Amisomie%2F52021656&qo=17
http://www.flickr.com/photos/iampaparazzi/7922649240/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/iampaparazzi/7922650344/in/photostream/
http://www.critiques4geeks.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/046-fanime-2012-day-2-cosplay-lucario.jpg
http://img-cache.cdn.gaiaonline.com...hlouh/Fanime 2012/sadlucario.jpg?t=1338190014
http://strawberryyoko.deviantart.com/art/Lucario-378778549
http://strawberryyoko.deviantart.com/art/Gin-Ichimaru-and-Lucario-307193142
http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/Kecreed/media/IMG_2585_zps3aa27827.jpg.html


And then once you have the basics down, try more complex poses; I only do poses like these if the person asks specifically.
http://th03.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/i/2013/150/0/f/marshal_and_lucario_by_universalladyn-d6774vr.jpg
http://universalladyn.deviantart.com/art/Marshal-and-Lucario-374886411


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## DarrylWolf (Jul 11, 2013)

Go to a Furry convention because that's where you belong. I'm not a Furry-phobic outsider, it just makes sense because that's where we would be most prevalent.

Go in a group of Furries.


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## Mingan Ohanzee (Jul 11, 2013)

Misomie said:


> I've adopted a few generic action poses for my character that I can pull off without even trying now. (mainly I just use basic Lucario poses, but people seem to love them so whatever. XD) Start playing around with poses and find one you like. Then practice it (without suit first) multiple times until your body knows the pose. However, practice more exaggerated poses (that might look funny without suit) when you do this. Once you can maintain a pose you like, work on a few others as well. I've found out that people will mimic my pose if they want their photo taken with me. Just have fun with it. I personally don't like to go and touch people, but if I know that they are ok with it (if they ask first or start it) I'll do so. However, only do what you are comfortable with.
> 
> Here are some examples with my Lucario fursuit (I try to never pose in a way that could be taken badly, you just have to be aware of your environment; try learning the location before wearing your suit or at least have a spotter) :
> 
> ...



Thanks I appreciate the input and links : o )  I'll have to start practicing poses, that and dancing . Always wanted to be in the the competitions n such but clubbin and performing on stage will be much different with my center of balance altered with my heavy tail


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## Mingan Ohanzee (Jul 11, 2013)

Thanks with a group i would less reserved and playful i suppose. Generally I'm pretty comfortable where ever, even if I may be the quite type. I can see your point with enviroment and it definitely makes sense. I've been wondering about going clubbing locally too, but I would have to call and ask if they would have any issue with a suitor in their midst prolly, the whole public place with face covered thing.


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## Troj (Jul 11, 2013)

*Get a handler, preferably someone with whom you have good all-around chemistry. 
*Communicate with that handler beforehand to create a simple system of signals. When in the field, you need to be able to convey when you need a break, when you need water, when you need a quick exit in the event of an emergency, and when you need rescuing from psychotic children and their parents.
*Stay hydrated. Avoid caffeinated drinks. 
*Eat a good, solid, protein-filled breakfast. 
*Have a little snack before suiting, so that you'll have enough electrolytes in your system.
*Scope out your intended suiting grounds before you actually suit. Identify the exits, obstacles, steps, bathrooms, and places to change and/or take breaks. Make sure your handler knows about them too.
*When encountering a fearful or upset child, keep a respectful distance, and try pretending to be even _more _afraid of the fearful kid. 
*Do not accept offers to pick up or handle kids, because you could drop them.
*Careful with hugs and touches. As much as you can, keep your hands where folks can see them, and direct hugs towards your side, instead of your crotch, when you can.
*When in doubt, ask for permission to suit in a place. If the rules say masks are off-limits, that typically includes fursuit heads, as well. Hospitals and banks tend to be especially paranoid.
*If someone dislikes or seems afraid of you, don't push the issue.
*Beware entering circles or throngs of children, _especially_ if there are no adults around to supervise them. (Note that some moroic adults won't necessarily protect you from aggressive children, because they'll think the aggression is "cute.") Reason #2032 why handlers are important.
*Beware adolescents. When first encountering them, generally err on the side of acting cool, hip, and, especially "ironic," as acting "kiddie" and "cutie-poo" may activate the prey drive in those types of teens who resent "kiddie" things, and/or want to prove to their peers how much they hate "kiddie" things.


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## Misomie (Jul 11, 2013)

Mingan Ohanzee said:


> Thanks I appreciate the input and links : o )  I'll have to start practicing poses, that and dancing . Always wanted to be in the the competitions n such but clubbin and performing on stage will be much different with my center of balance altered with my heavy tail



You're welcome. :3

Once you have poses down, you don't even have to think about what to do. Practice in advance makes the act come out pretty awesome. :3 (Improv is also entertaining, but you want to practice with it first as well to work on your response time)

How big is your tail? If you feel it might interfere, practice routines and stuff while wearing it only and then try the same moves completely suited up.


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## LegitWaterfall (Jul 11, 2013)

Well, everything I could say has been mentioned, but here are some extras:

DO:
-Bring water
-Have a spotter
-Don't jump around, act insane, ect.
-Avoid people with beverages and food
-Avoid approaching people

DON'T
-Ask the kid for a hug
-Be a dick
-Defend yourself from insults
-Drink little water


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## Mingan Ohanzee (Jul 11, 2013)

Misomie said:


> You're welcome. :3
> 
> Once you have poses down, you don't even have to think about what to do. Practice in advance makes the act come out pretty awesome. :3 (Improv is also entertaining, but you want to practice with it first as well to work on your response time)
> 
> How big is your tail? If you feel it might interfere, practice routines and stuff while wearing it only and then try the same moves completely suited up.



My tail is about 4 feet long poofy and a bit weighty. Though it is a seperate entity, it hangs close, and is posable. Sobi can easily practice as you suggest.


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## Zabrina (Jul 13, 2013)

Always, always have cold water and a place to cool off. I can't stress enough how vital it is.


Oh, and don't bump up five-year-old threads.


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## Atrayu (Jul 14, 2013)

When I was making my head, there were two requirements it must have, good eyesight and good ventilation. I succeeded in both.


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## LegitWaterfall (Jul 14, 2013)

Know your fursuit sign languages.
*FUCKING LEARN THEM*


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## Shaloxeroligon (Jul 14, 2013)

LegitWaterfall said:


> Know your fursuit sign languages.
> *FUCKING LEARN THEM*



Do you have a cheat sheet that we could use for quick reference?


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## Troj (Jul 14, 2013)

As for being livelier, I'd say, observe yourself in a mirror, or tape yourself performing different movements and poses in suit, or both. Being able to see yourself from the outside can help you to gain a better sense of your position in physical space, as well as insight into which gestures could be bigger, which could be smaller, which work, and which don't.


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## Mingan Ohanzee (Jul 15, 2013)

Zabrina said:


> Always, always have cold water and a place to cool off. I can't stress enough how vital it is.
> 
> Oh, and don't bump up five-year-old threads.



Yup yup plenty o water
btw when I checked the forums and read around a bit and the thread was near the top already if I'm not mistaken. Didn't check figured it was recent, pardon the necro XD


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## Mingan Ohanzee (Jul 15, 2013)

Troj said:


> As for being livelier, I'd say, observe yourself in a mirror, or tape yourself performing different movements and poses in suit, or both. Being able to see yourself from the outside can help you to gain a better sense of your position in physical space, as well as insight into which gestures could be bigger, which could be smaller, which work, and which don't.



Good idea thanks : o )


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## DarrylWolf (Jul 15, 2013)

Maybe this will be specific only to me, but be wary of "sensitives"- it's hell of a lot easier to talk to a bunch of "PC"-obsessed onlookers about your bizarre costume when you are out of said costume. And for the record, my defense would be to "live and let live" and that some people would always be too sensitive.

How much of a difficulty for people not so acommodating of Furries?


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## Raineyangel81 (Jul 17, 2013)

- go to the bathroom before putting on your suit
- shower before putting on your suit
- put on deodorant
- don't push yourself..if you need to take off your head, go to the headless/rest area
- feel free to stand in front of the fans and languish
- drink water.  sometimes the headless will have some sort of lemonade or gatorade mix, too.
- if you are able to, eat snacks every so often.  I usually go with something easy like red vines, gold fish/crackers.  rolled up sandwich meats and cheese are good too, but I'd take my head off for that.
- if you need help, ask for it.  I need someone to open doors for me and I usually don't have a handler
- the biggest problem I had when I was in suit was I had a gang kids that started to punch/kick me and a friend at a meet-up.  Our handler was unable to do anything, so we had to endure until we could escape into the bathroom.  If you run into a problem where people are trying to kick/pull, look under your head, etc, extract yourself as quickly as possible and go look for someone to help you.  A handler is great, but they can only do so much 
- also, this is just me, dunno about other suiters, but I'm 100% ok with people coming up and hugging me.  Otherwise, I ask if people want hugs, or I do the universal open arm signal and if they want one, they can come get one


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