# Xbox 720 to require always online drm and block out used games?



## CannonFodder (Mar 20, 2013)

For those of you xbox players there was a leaked hardware overview of the xbox 720 hardware specification.  In it some of the basic features is that the 720 is going be using blu ray instead and the disc will be used for installing games to the hard drive instead of actually playing from it.  Also require a constant internet connection, even while off giving credence to the rumor of the 720 having always online drm.

What are your views on this xbox gamers?


Personally I think it sucks for xbox gamers cause it's pretty much what happened to simcity, except this is going to be for a entire console and not just one game.  If it were just the blu ray thing and potentially no backwards compatibility then it wouldn't be that big of a deal compared to what is probably going to happen.


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## Kalmor (Mar 20, 2013)

Oh look it's simcity, but now and a much more massive scale. I don't see this ending well.


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## RadioactiveRedFox (Mar 20, 2013)

Simply put, I won't be upgrading.


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## Schwimmwagen (Mar 20, 2013)

AAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA

No but seriously this is a travesty and I feel sorry for our dear console gaming brothers.
AHUAEHUAEHUAEHAEUAEHUAEHAUEHAUEHAEHAUEHEUHAEUHAEUEHAUEHAEUHAEUHEAUEHEUH


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## CannonFodder (Mar 20, 2013)

Raptros said:


> I don't see this ending well.


You're going to want to go to your internet bunker for about a week when it launches, or at least until the inevitable shitstorm calms down.


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## Kalmor (Mar 20, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> You're going to want to go to your internet bunker for about a week when it launches, or at least until the inevitable shitstorm calms down.


I have a feeling it's going to be the shitstorm to end all shitstorms, in the gaming community anyway.

I'm just gonna sit here with my PC thanks. I don't think I'll be upgrading my 360 to a 720.


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## sunandshadow (Mar 20, 2013)

Raptros said:


> I'm just gonna sit here with my PC thanks.



^ This


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## Nikolinni (Mar 20, 2013)

In the words of Spoony (Specifically, from Angy Joe's Aliens: Colonial Marines video):

BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUULLLSHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITT!


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## benignBiotic (Mar 20, 2013)

That sounds awful. I can barely maintain an internet connection here and even if I could I wouldn't necessarily want my XBox online constantly. The used games thing sucks a lot too. 

What happened with SimCity dare I ask?


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## Percy (Mar 20, 2013)

Welp, that just goes to prove that PC is still master race.


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## CannonFodder (Mar 20, 2013)

benignBiotic said:


> What happened with SimCity dare I ask?


Short version:
[YT]0FsrzqJNQF8[/YT]


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## Teal (Mar 20, 2013)

Glad I've never been an Xbox person.


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## TeenageAngst (Mar 20, 2013)

PC gaming master race.


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## Symlus (Mar 20, 2013)

Oh, I hope that the PS4 will not do this. If it does, I'm going to go back and platinum Skyrim and Star Ocean: The Last Hope.


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## RadioactiveRedFox (Mar 20, 2013)

Lev1athan said:


> Oh, I hope that the PS4 will not do this. If it does, I'm going to go back and platinum Skyrim and Star Ocean: The Last Hope.



Thankfully, I don't think we have to much to worry about with the PS4 being it's not a Microsoft product.


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## Symlus (Mar 20, 2013)

RadioactiveRedFox said:


> Thankfully, I don't think we have to much to worry about with the PS4 being it's not a Microsoft product.


True. Sony did acknowledge a download only style, which could have implied DRMs, however, because Sony thinks about people outside of the 1%, they decided against it due to consumer slow internet speeds.


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## CannonFodder (Mar 20, 2013)

RadioactiveRedFox said:


> Thankfully, I don't think we have to much to worry about with the PS4 being it's not a Microsoft product.


Sorry guys, but there's a rumor floating about that the PS4 will as well.  For xbox 720 it's pretty much at the point of whether or not microsoft choses to remove it.  The reason why it's all but confirmed for the xbox 720 is like I said the specifications for the 720 was leaked.  The xbox 720 always online drm started out as a rumor initially also, but look at where it's turned.  The PS4 the rumor's probability of always needing to be online is around "eh".  It could be false, it could be true.  We'll have to wait for the actual revealing or if someone leaks the specs for it.

Basically the PS4 may as well have it too, it's unconfirmed right now though.


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## MicheleFancy (Mar 20, 2013)

So, if I upgraded I'd have to be online at all times to play my games?  Is that what I'm getting from this?

But what if my internet is out? :C
My PC is crap, otherwise I'd just play on it forever.


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## Verin Asper (Mar 20, 2013)

so they want us to buy...a mini computer am I right?


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## Kosdu (Mar 20, 2013)

I'll just stick with my computer.




If they implement those "features" both the 720 and PS4 sales will plummit, and there will be a huge market for hacking them.

Hopefully, they'll run themselves out of buisness, instituting karma.


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## MicheleFancy (Mar 20, 2013)

Verin Asper said:


> so they want us to buy...a mini computer am I right?



At least most computer games allow us to play without being online.. if again that's what I'm getting from all this.


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## Percy (Mar 21, 2013)

Kosdu said:


> If they implement those "features" both the 720 and PS4 sales will plummit, and there will be a huge market for hacking them.
> 
> Hopefully, they'll run themselves out of buisness, instituting karma.


While they may lose some customers, there will be plenty of fanboys who will still buy the console, just for loyalty reasons. Though it could definitely hurt them.


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## Lucy Bones (Mar 21, 2013)

Man, Xbox just gets worse and worse with each console.


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## Captain Howdy (Mar 21, 2013)

I was a die-hard Xbox guy, but after the 360 petered out after a couple years, and I was down to 1 or 2 games a year at most, I simply moved to PC, because it made no sense to drop so much money on a console that's going to just gather dust for most of the year. 

Given the fact that it might very well be online-only, DRM'ed up the ass, and all about the Kinect, I see no reason to get one at all, and I can see it selling worse than the PS3.


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## Teal (Mar 21, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> *Sorry guys, but there's a rumor floating about that the PS4 will as well*.  For xbox 720 it's pretty much at the point of whether or not microsoft choses to remove it.  The reason why it's all but confirmed for the xbox 720 is like I said the specifications for the 720 was leaked.  The xbox 720 always online drm started out as a rumor initially also, but look at where it's turned.  The PS4 the rumor's probability of always needing to be online is around "eh".  It could be false, it could be true.  We'll have to wait for the actual revealing or if someone leaks the specs for it.
> 
> Basically the PS4 may as well have it too, it's unconfirmed right now though.


 FUCK.


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## Jashwa (Mar 21, 2013)

Highly doubt those rumors are true. It would just be a stupid decision all around.


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## Teal (Mar 21, 2013)

Jashwa said:


> *Highly doubt those rumors are true*. It would just be a stupid decision all around.


 They'd better be the case, I'll need that system to play my Square Enix games.


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## Alastair Snowpaw (Mar 21, 2013)

i hope they aren't true and most likley aren't.
as someone who fucking loathes downloading games on pc since it always leads to an inevitable 2 hour fest of bs computer retartedness and someone with shit iternet at my appartment it would make that unplayable.


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## Aetius (Mar 21, 2013)

Im not going to make up my mind until I hear information from an official release from Microsoft regarding the new Xbox.


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## Demensa (Mar 21, 2013)

It seems unlikely to me that they would require an internet connection at all times... 
They're trying to appeal to the consumers so they'll buy the console; and since this seems to be met with universal criticism, it doesn't make sense to require it.
They would lose so much business.

(I swear, if I can't play offline, I'm not buying anything.)


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## MicheleFancy (Mar 21, 2013)

Aetius said:


> Im not going to make up my mind until I hear information from an official release from Microsoft regarding the new Xbox.



If these rumors are flying around enough, and if the leak is true, we'll probably hear something from Microsoft soon anyway regarding it.  Having bad publicity over something that isn't even on the market yet isn't a good thing.


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## CaptainCool (Mar 21, 2013)

The SIM City DRM bullshit was so bad that even the CEO of EA resigned.

I really don't think this is going to be true. The hardware specs? Maybe. But they are just gonna shoot themselves in the foot if they actually want to implement this sort of DRM.
An entertainment device should never limit the user experience for the sake of controlling the user.


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## Lucy Bones (Mar 21, 2013)

HEY EVERYONE.

Fuck your pussy ass Xboxes and PS4s.


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## Sarcastic Coffeecup (Mar 21, 2013)

Gibby said:


> AAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA
> 
> No but seriously this is a travesty and I feel sorry for our dear console gaming brothers.
> AHUAEHUAEHUAEHAEUAEHUAEHAUEHAUEHAEHAUEHEUHAEUHAEUEHAUEHAEUHAEUHEAUEHEUH


Hehehehe, yeah. PC masterrace. At least most games don't have the always online function. Some games do, and they all suck.
If they put it to Xbox, ahuehue, the shitstorm which will follow, will be entertaining to watch.


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## MicheleFancy (Mar 21, 2013)

Ahkmill said:


> HEY EVERYONE.
> 
> Fuck your pussy ass Xboxes and PS4s.



I did that exact same thing by plugging my PC into my television in my living room.
If only I had tried to market it.  I could have potentially made millions. :V


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## Lucy Bones (Mar 21, 2013)

There's just no way in hell I can get a 720 or a PS4 with things like the Piston and the Steam Box coming out. They're just overall better systems.


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## Heliophobic (Mar 21, 2013)

Verin Asper said:


> so they want us to buy...a mini computer am I right?



Consoles have always simply been down-graded PCs with limited use.

My Xbox used to always either sound like a chainsaw or a fat kid wheezing after running a mile.


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## Jashwa (Mar 21, 2013)

Because gaming systems are only a product of their hardware specs, right.


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## Judge Spear (Mar 21, 2013)

If the 720's track record for exclusive arcade shooters will be as good as the 360's, DRM won't keep me from purchasing a unit big as a drawback as this seems.


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## Symlus (Mar 21, 2013)

I feel terrible knowing that my best computer is a think pad, and that has trouble running stuff my DS can handle. 

Fuck it, I'm going back to Apple 2.


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## RadioactiveRedFox (Mar 21, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> Sorry guys, but there's a rumor floating about that the PS4 will as well.  For xbox 720 it's pretty much at the point of whether or not microsoft choses to remove it.  The reason why it's all but confirmed for the xbox 720 is like I said the specifications for the 720 was leaked.  The xbox 720 always online drm started out as a rumor initially also, but look at where it's turned.  The PS4 the rumor's probability of always needing to be online is around "eh".  It could be false, it could be true.  We'll have to wait for the actual revealing or if someone leaks the specs for it.
> 
> Basically the PS4 may as well have it too, it's unconfirmed right now though.



Fuck it, I'm sticking with my PC and old consoles. PC is worlds better anyways.


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## chagen (Mar 21, 2013)

since when has rumors become fact. also i have more hope for the ps4 than the 720 tbh.


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## RadioactiveRedFox (Mar 21, 2013)

nadja said:


> since when has rumors become fact. also i have more hope for the ps4 than the 720 tbh.



With the way Microsoft has been recently, I would not be surprised if its true for the 720. I have higher hopes for the PS4 as well so I'm probity going to play it by ear with it, that being said I've been shifting back to the PC so I probably wont be upgrading anytime soon either way.


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## Aden (Mar 21, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> Sorry guys, but there's a rumor floating about that the PS4 will as well.



Sony has denied those rumors

of course, their track record with promises isn't squeaky clean, so


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## CannonFodder (Mar 21, 2013)

Aden said:


> Sony has denied those rumors
> of course, their track record with promises isn't squeaky clean, so


Yeah, my advice is for those interested in the xbox 720 or PS4 to wait about a week after the launch of the consoles to see if it's true.  If it is true and you bought them at launch then it sucks to be you.  For all we know microsoft and sony could lie and do it anyway.  It's best to have some self control in this situation and wait a couple days after launch to buy the console.


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## Jashwa (Mar 21, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> Yeah, my advice is for those interested in the xbox 720 or PS4 to wait about a week after the launch of the consoles to see if it's true.  If it is true and you bought them at launch then it sucks to be you.  For all we know microsoft and sony could lie and do it anyway.  It's best to have some self control in this situation and wait a couple days after launch to buy the console.



Too bad waiting a couple days sometimes means "Not being able to get your hands on a system until after Christmas"


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## Teal (Mar 21, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> Yeah, my advice is for those interested in the xbox 720 or PS4 to wait about a week after the launch of the consoles to see if it's true.  If it is true and you bought them at launch then it sucks to be you.  For all we know microsoft and sony could lie and do it anyway.  It's best to have some self control in this situation and wait a couple days after launch to buy the console.





Jashwa said:


> Too bad waiting a couple days sometimes means "Not being able to get your hands on a system until after Christmas"


 I'm fine because I wouldn't be getting one for about a year afterwards.


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## Kosdu (Mar 21, 2013)

Welcome to the new console gamer:

http://youtu.be/TAqZb52sgpU


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## Symlus (Mar 21, 2013)

Teal said:


> I'm fine because I wouldn't be getting one for about a year afterwards.


Would "This" this, but feature was removed. :C



Kosdu said:


> Welcome to the new console gamer:
> 
> [video=youtube_share;TAqZb52sgpU]http://youtu.be/TAqZb52sgpU[/video]


There you go, mate.


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## Runefox (Mar 21, 2013)

What is the problem here, exactly? PC games are already like this, and they have been for a long, long time. Thanks to Steam, nobody cares, because:



The games are cheaper (generally - ActiBlizzard and EA still suck for pricing most days, but Far Cry 3 for example launched at $49 and went down to $29 for a while - Entire publisher catalogues are often available during holiday sales for the price of a single new release)
It's easy to use
Games generally go on sale or otherwise get "used-game" pricing anyway
You get to keep all the games you buy
No trip to the store
You don't get shafted by a $5 trade-in credit on a game that gets resold at $30 by companies whose sole reason to exist is to sell used games at 400% profit margins or higher
Less e-waste
Downloads are absurdly fast - As fast as your internet can nom, the games are nommed
Log into your account on another computer, download the game, and play at a friend's house - No discs, no "product key already registered"

That's not to say that Microsoft and/or Sony will get it right. But frankly, people are overreacting. Seriously. It's not that bad. Plus, all the money you used to spend on used games that are now going to lower-priced new games? Straight to the developers. Unlike a used game, which is purchased once at retail, the developer gets a single cut, and then the game gets passed around and used and abused a dozen or so times. Like it or not, that hurts developers, and that's the number one reason why this kind of thing will happen if it does. On the PC, it was piracy. Quite frankly, since Steam, I can't remember the last time I pirated a game, and I've since purchased pretty much all of the games I've ever pirated.

Then again, Steam is a part of the PC master race, and it has to be awesome. Who knows what the MSFT and Sony equivalents would look like... Current digital download services seem to favour full retail pricing. Let's hope that trend doesn't continue.


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## Kosdu (Mar 21, 2013)

Runefox said:


> What is the problem here, exactly? PC games are already like this, and they have been for a long, long time. Thanks to Steam, nobody cares, because:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



PC/Steam is nothing like what they are talking about.

You only have to be online to download the games, and in alot of cases games can be purchased inna physical copy and installed many times.





Also, wtf happened to the "This" button? That was nice.


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## Kalmor (Mar 21, 2013)

Runefox said:


> *What is the problem here, exactly? PC games are already like this, and they have been for a long, long time. Thanks to Steam, nobody cares, because:*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Steam lets you play your games you bought through it offline too. We're talking about a console that may not allow us such a freedom.


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## Judge Spear (Mar 21, 2013)

Raptros said:


> Steam lets you play your games you bought through it offline too.



For some reason, I can't play certain Steam games when I'm not connected even in offline modeand most of my library is strictly single player. I'm not really ever away from a connection, but the inconvenience has occurred multiple times with Steam.


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## Ozriel (Mar 21, 2013)

I'll wait until they unveil it before I make a decision whether to buy the new console or just stick with upgrading my PC.


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## Kosdu (Mar 21, 2013)

XoPachi said:


> For some reason, I can't play certain Steam games when I'm not connected even in offline modeand most of my library is strictly single player. I'm not really ever away from a connection, but the inconvenience has occurred multiple times with Steam.




Are they multiplayer based games or something? There might be something about this on the steam forums.

@Oz

I'd say just buy old games on steam for 1/5-1/10 their price on steam, but that's just me.

Me with a 3(.6 I think)ghz hex core processor and 16gb of RAM, and then a great vid card.....

=P


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## Harbinger (Mar 21, 2013)

I think i might switch to the PS4 next generation, next xbox sounds just like one big fuck you to consumers. TBH we gamers are fucking pushovers, the sheer mass of people giving in is what lead us to the gaming industry as it is today, day one DLC, disk locked content, rushed annual releases, online passes, all that bullshit.


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## Ozriel (Mar 21, 2013)

Kosdu said:


> @Oz
> 
> I'd say just buy old games on steam for 1/5-1/10 their price on steam, but that's just me.
> 
> ...



I do when they are available. I recently nabbed Arkham Asylum and city when it was on sale, as well as Morrowind. Other games that I have disks for I found at Target for dirt cheap. KoToR 1 and 2 were 10 bucks each and I nabbed them before someone else could.

The last "new" game I bought was Skyrim and its DLCs. I am still contemplating on buying Tomb Raider, but I may get it for my Ecksbawks tree-sitty. That and Kingdom under Fire 2.
My Video Card has a good 2 years plus before I have to upgrade it, but it plays new and some older games fine.


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## Aden (Mar 21, 2013)

Runefox said:


> What is the problem here, exactly? PC games are already like this, and they have been for a long, long time. Thanks to Steam, nobody cares, because:





Though you forgot the big one with Steam as it applies to this thread: it has an offline mode


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## lupinealchemist (Mar 21, 2013)

That's it. I'm upgrading my PC. New motherboard, new processor, new RAM; these will go great with my new Graphics card.


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## Runefox (Mar 21, 2013)

Aden said:


> Though you forgot the big one with Steam as it applies to this thread: it has an offline mode


I have to wonder how many people they will alienate in areas without access to broadband. Then again, there's no money to be made via online services from those people, since MSFT will be giving the hardware away at basically cost again, and the developers take most of the share of a game sale.

No offline mode = no sale. Steam does it right - Run the game once online, verify your purchase, then boom, offline mode available. Your internet goes out, hey, your game still works (assuming it's not an Ubisoft or EA game).


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## Stratelier (Mar 21, 2013)

(You never know who you can hotlink images from these days.)


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## Kosdu (Mar 21, 2013)

Ozriel said:


> I do when they are available. I recently nabbed Arkham Asylum and city when it was on sale, as well as Morrowind. Other games that I have disks for I found at Target for dirt cheap. KoToR 1 and 2 were 10 bucks each and I nabbed them before someone else could.
> 
> The last "new" game I bought was Skyrim and its DLCs. I am still contemplating on buying Tomb Raider, but I may get it for my Ecksbawks tree-sitty. That and Kingdom under Fire 2.
> My Video Card has a good 2 years plus before I have to upgrade it, but it plays new and some older games fine.



Genius.

I'd try Thief, see if you like those games.


I think I got Far Cry 2 and all it's DLCs for like 5$ on there. 




Just bought Natural Selection 2 Deluxe Edition for 20$ today, worth it.



Steam for the win.


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## Day Coydog (Mar 21, 2013)

If the 720 does happen like this, I don't know if I will even get it, I don't care, I'll just play halo 4 and minecraft for the rest of my days.


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## Ozriel (Mar 21, 2013)

Kosdu said:


> Genius.
> 
> I'd try Thief, see if you like those games.
> 
> ...



I have thief on a disk somewhere in my apartment, but I haven't installed it on my PC yet. I may give it a shot.


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## veeno (Mar 21, 2013)

Fuck this shit im playing my super nintendo.

On a different note,what about people who cant go over a certain limit with there internet? There fucked.


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## Hinalle K. (Mar 21, 2013)

The whole point of console gaming to me is not needing an internet connection to play them.

It would be seriously stupid if they went with the working internet requirement.
I'd be fucked, my connection is unstable as hell.

*turns PC on* "Oh look, my internet connection is down yet again. Time to play some Elder Scrolls VI.
Oh wait. COCKBLOCKED"


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## CannonFodder (Mar 22, 2013)

veeno said:


> On a different note,what about people who cant go over a certain limit with there internet? There fucked.


Yeah, it's going to fuck over a ton of people.


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## Teal (Mar 22, 2013)

Our internet can't keep a constant signal.


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## Schwimmwagen (Mar 22, 2013)

A lot of people who play consoles don't even _have_ internet.


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## Percy (Mar 22, 2013)

Gibby said:


> A lot of people who play consoles don't even _have_ internet.


Hence why they have consoles... to play games without needing the internet.
Which is why the online DRM idea is just stupid.


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## Symlus (Mar 22, 2013)

I have internet... but 90% of the time, it sucks too much for much of anything, so I typically just play single player games.


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## Artillery Spam (Mar 22, 2013)

If any of this bullshit is true I'm switching to PC. 

And I _hate_ PC.


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## chagen (Mar 22, 2013)

wait didnt sony atemped this with the psp go.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 5, 2013)

Artillery Spam said:


> If any of this bullshit is true I'm switching to PC.
> 
> And I _hate_ PC.


Oh hey, speaking of which guess what Microsoft's creative director has to say on this?
http://imgur.com/fulDo2f


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## Kalmor (Apr 5, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> Oh hey, speaking of which guess what Microsoft's creative director has to say on this?
> http://imgur.com/fulDo2f


He's got his head so far stuck up his own ass, it's crazy. I mean, wat?


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## Sutekh_the_Destroyer (Apr 5, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> Oh hey, speaking of which guess what Microsoft's creative director has to say on this?
> http://imgur.com/fulDo2f




Does this mean the rumours are true, or is it just him expressing his feelings on the rumours? If it's the former then Microsoft must be smoking something to think that an "'always on' console" is a good and reasonable idea. What about all the people who don't have internet? Or the people who's internet is always on the blink? And what about the future, when the console is no longer supported and the servers are offline - the Xbox 720 (or whatever its going to be called) and all the games for it will be unplayable due to the fact it hasn't got any servers to connect to. Many people keep consoles for years after they aren't supported, and so stuff like the Nintendo 64, the Sega Dreamcast and the Atari 2600 will work for ten, fifteen, twenty and even thirty years providing the hardware is still functioning, but if the Xbox 720 will require a constant internet connection then 15 years from now rubbish dumps around the world will be piling up with redundant Xbox 720s.


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## Teal (Apr 5, 2013)

Sutekh_the_Destroyer said:


> Does this mean the rumours are true, or is it just him expressing his feelings on the rumours? If it's the former then Microsoft must be smoking something to think that an "'always on' console" is a good and reasonable idea. What about all the people who don't have internet? Or the people who's internet is always on the blink? And what about the future, when the console is no longer supported and the servers are offline - the Xbox 720 (or whatever its going to be called) and all the games for it will be unplayable due to the fact it hasn't got any servers to connect to. Many people keep consoles for years after they aren't supported, and so stuff like the Nintendo 64, the Sega Dreamcast and the Atari 2600 will work for ten, fifteen, twenty and even thirty years providing the hardware is still functioning, but if the Xbox 720 will require a constant internet connection then 15 years from now rubbish dumps around the world will be piling up with redundant Xbox 720s.


 I have an NES that still works.


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## Sutekh_the_Destroyer (Apr 5, 2013)

Teal said:


> I have an NES that still works.




Great example of an old console still working. I've got a pristine N64 that still works.


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## lupinealchemist (Apr 5, 2013)

Sutekh_the_Destroyer said:


> Does this mean the rumours are true, or is it just him expressing his feelings on the rumours? If it's the former then Microsoft must be smoking something to think that an "'always on' console" is a good and reasonable idea. What about all the people who don't have internet? Or the people who's internet is always on the blink? And what about the future, when the console is no longer supported and the servers are offline - the Xbox 720 (or whatever its going to be called) and all the games for it will be unplayable due to the fact it hasn't got any servers to connect to. Many people keep consoles for years after they aren't supported, and so stuff like the Nintendo 64, the Sega Dreamcast and the Atari 2600 will work for ten, fifteen, twenty and even thirty years providing the hardware is still functioning, but if the Xbox 720 will require a constant internet connection then 15 years from now rubbish dumps around the world will be piling up with redundant Xbox 720s.


I promise in that future, piracy will increase 30000%


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## CannonFodder (Apr 6, 2013)

lupinealchemist said:


> I promise in that future, piracy will increase 30000%


More like the consoles will flop in the long run if there's always online drm.  What will probably happen is on launch day, "The new 720 is the most bought launch console to date" and then next month, "Microsoft can't get rid of their 720's in stock, cause next to nobody is buying them.  People please buy the console.  Pwetty pwease?"

It's going to be funny seeing them try to sell the consoles in the long run if it's true.


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## Avindur (Apr 6, 2013)

Whenever I heard about this always online bullshit, I had a damn hissyfit. I used to loooooove xbox, now they were in my shit list. Yea, I have internet, but does it always work? No. What do I play when my in real life social depriving internet goes out? Single player, but now I can't even do that because what I like to call the "good idea fairy" comes along and slaps this junk on here. I was pissed, but then I just thought that with the shitstorm that resulted that they would make a change or something. Wrong. One of their heads, adam ore or some shit, tweeted that he didn't see "why all the drama, everything is always on now." and he hashtagged dealwithit. That reaaaaally pissed me off. Bye bye xbox 720 and hello PS4. I hope they lose millions of this crap, they deserve it.


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## Sutekh_the_Destroyer (Apr 6, 2013)

Microsoft have made some bad decisions lately - first Windows 8, and now a constant internet for the Xbox 720....


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## TheMetalVelocity (Apr 6, 2013)

If that's the case. Microsoft are assholes for sure. PS4 all the way! Sony is still leading with ps3, and I think it will do so with ps4. What the fuck happened to Wii U?


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## MicheleFancy (Apr 6, 2013)

TheMetalVelocity said:


> If that's the case. Microsoft are assholes for sure. PS4 all the way! Sony is still leading with ps3, and I think it will do so with ps4. What the fuck happened to Wii U?



Wii U is out, one of my friends owns one.  There's just nothing but really shitty games out for it right now, so only the die hard gotta have all the electronics people have it.


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## Teal (Apr 6, 2013)

I keep forgetting the Wii U exists.


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## MicheleFancy (Apr 6, 2013)

I have a feeling that's what happened..  No good games out for its rushed released, so hardly anyone bought it.  Games still haven't come out as far as I know, so more and more people are going to forget its existence.  It was a failed launch imo.

Much like how the new Xbox is going to be >:U
It's a good thing I never buy the new consoles right away.


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## CannonFodder (Apr 6, 2013)

Teal said:


> I keep forgetting the Wii U exists.


I think everyone keeps forgetting it exists.

It did fine on launch, but it's sales rates as of late have been abysmal.  It's probably what is going to happen to the 720 as well.  By that I mean a good launch and then the long term sales rate flops.  The only good thing that will probably come out of this is that xbox exclusive titles are probably going to try and go for multiple consoles to try and regain their potential lost revenue and that we'll see the death of always online drm.  The reason being is that if the 720 does in fact always online drm then in the long run it's going to flop badly and any company involved in video games is going to go, ". . . yeeeaaaahhhh maybe we shouldn't do that?"


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## MicheleFancy (Apr 6, 2013)

I don't understand where Microsoft's disconnect is coming from, though.
Consoles have been around long enough for them to know people buy them so they can play offline.  Instant download features onto the console are great, but that doesn't mean I want to be online at all times.

EDIT:  Microsoft is also playing the "Don't listen to that guy, we don't know him" game and sent out an apology.
Maybe the backlash will make them second guess, if they were really planning on going through with the online all the time plan.


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## lilyWhite (Apr 6, 2013)

Personally, I'm going to hold off on demonizing a company based on rumours and "leaks" until something that is actually concrete is announced.



MicheleFancy said:


> EDIT:  Microsoft is also playing the "Don't listen to that guy, we don't know him" game and sent out an apology.



Well, that article just gives more credence to my low, low opinion of The Consumerist.


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## Artillery Spam (Apr 6, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> Oh hey, speaking of which guess what Microsoft's creative director has to say on this?
> http://imgur.com/fulDo2f



That's just sad.


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## Captain Howdy (Apr 6, 2013)

I always love the "sorry if it offended"-type apology. Despite its condescending tone, it still remains one of the most common forms of public apologies o_o


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## Stratelier (Apr 6, 2013)

Yeah, because it's not apologizing for anything they are actually responsible for.

As for the always-on thing, I agree that it makes sense for some devices to be more or less always-on.  Or at least it's not a hindrance.

Phone?  Okay.

Toaster?  Not so much.

The other problem about always-on things is not just who has Internet connectivity in the first place, but what happens in the event of malicious attacks.  In the event that some hackers can DDOS the 720's servers, suddenly nobody can play any games on their system, online _or_ off.


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## Teal (Apr 6, 2013)

Stratadrake said:


> The other problem about always-on things is not just who has Internet connectivity in the first place, but what happens in the event of malicious attacks.  In the event that some hackers can DDOS the 720's servers, suddenly nobody can play any games on their system, online _or_ off.


 Normally I would say "don't be giving people ideas" but in this case give them the ideas. All of them.


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## DarrylWolf (Apr 7, 2013)

I believe this is the most asinine decision in entertainment history and the greed is literally unprecedented. If I wanted to enjoy the songs and weird music videos of the 1980's, I could go down to a bar that plays '80s music or even watch it on YouTube free of charge- I'd just assume someone would pick up the royalties. If I wanted to watch old VHS tapes, or even DVDs that my friend has, he could let me borrow them for use on my own equipment. In either case, we don't need the original recording equipment to watch the videos but now Microsoft wants to change all that "to prevent piracy". No, it's to maximize profits by making each and every person have to buy a separate console and "register" all the games to it- every other company in the world would know that people lending entertainment is actually a form of advertisement. Whoever the AVGN of the 2030s and '40s turns out to be, he'll have an impossible time tracking down the "registered" Xbox 720 consoles and the games which were registered, too. And given each Xbox generation's susceptiblity to breakdowns, (red ring of death), it would not be advisable to even start a 50+ hour game which you might not even be able to finish before your machine (and all of the games which would be useless afterwards) breaks down.

And, lastly, if we want video games to be viewed as an "art form", then like any art form, it should be as open to the public as possible while still being able to turn a profit for its creators. Every other game developer from the 1970's onward has been able to distribute its games effectively and make money, the ones that still produce consoles obviously became lucrative, and they all had to deal with "pirates" and "hackers" trying to steal their IP. It's disturbing that someone who is borrowing their friends' games will be treated no better than any "hacker" by Microsoft.


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## Stratelier (Apr 7, 2013)

MicheleFancy said:


> EDIT:  Microsoft is also playing the "Don't listen to that guy, we don't know him" game and sent out an apology.


Anyway, to shed a little light on this, the participants in that tiny tweeting tirade both later clarified that:



> â€œApologies for offending non-cities,â€ Orth said. â€œI was trolling [Hier] personally.â€
> 
> Heir added, â€œYou should know we are good friends who joke around with one another. Donâ€™t read too much into our back & forthâ€¦ All those tweets you are seeing about the city being superior. Thatâ€™s him just trolling me. And I fell for it. Donâ€™t bust his balls on that.â€



So while Microsoft's official PR apology is a bit 'stock', the point remains that the conversation was taken out of context.

Lesson to learn, guys:  if you're going to trade personal in-jokes, don't let the whole world see it.


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## MicheleFancy (Apr 7, 2013)

Stratadrake said:


> Lesson to learn, guys:  if you're going to trade personal in-jokes, don't let the whole world see it.



Well said.
Especially now, since most people aren't going to find out it was an in-joke and likely will pass just the tweets around the internet, where more people will take it at face value and think he's a nutjob.


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## DarrylWolf (Apr 7, 2013)

MicheleFancy said:


> Well said.
> Especially now, since most people aren't going to find out it was an in-joke and likely will pass just the tweets around the internet, where more people will take it at face value and think he's a nutjob.



So given the timing of this supposed "revelation" about the Xbox 720, we could say it was just a very tasteless April Fools' Day joke- nobody would be so stupid as to have a policy so unfriendly to the consumer as to treat "game borrowers" as common criminals, would they? I mean, Microsoft is one of the most money-grubbing companies ever, with a history of releasing products that become infested with viruses or fall apart at the wrong times, but even for them the consumer backlash would be too much, right? They played a key role in shaping the Internet into what it is today- they would know that in 2033, the 'Net will bear as little resemblance to what it is today as today's Internet bears to what it was back in 1993. And given their commitment to making games that would qualify as works of art, they would want to distribute them to as many as possible, and selling games that way could still be lucrative.


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## Stratelier (Apr 7, 2013)

http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/1...ys-on-connection-rumors-to-get-out-of-control


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## Sutekh_the_Destroyer (Apr 7, 2013)

Well, here's hoping it was ​just a badly time April fool's day joke.


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## Bittertooth (Apr 9, 2013)

Gotta have an always-on system in the Xbox 720 to prevent people from illegally downloading Xbox 720s.


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## lupinealchemist (Apr 9, 2013)

At least I still have my PC, even though it runs on Vista.


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## lol (Apr 9, 2013)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ME2pPjiVl1Y#t=1437s


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## Dizrawr (Apr 9, 2013)

I play PC, but either way. It's just bad business. I'd buy a PS4 if I had to choose a console if implementations like this are flying into the 720/Infinity/whatever microsoft calls it now.


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## MicheleFancy (Apr 14, 2013)

Apparently, Orth may have either left/was fired from Microsoft over the Twitter fiasco.
That seems a bit much..


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## CannonFodder (Apr 14, 2013)

It's looking like the 720 is going to have the always on requirement anyhow.  I guess Microsoft realizes that even if there's a always online requirement people are still going to buy the console anyhow.


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## CaptainCool (Apr 14, 2013)

MicheleFancy said:


> Apparently, Orth may have either left/was fired from Microsoft over the Twitter fiasco.
> That seems a bit much..



I don't think so. He directly attacked potential customers, THAT was a bit much.


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## MicheleFancy (Apr 14, 2013)

CaptainCool said:


> I don't think so. He directly attacked potential customers, THAT was a bit much.



I wouldn't say directly attacked.  He was having a supposedly joking conversation between his friend (who was the main person responding to his tweets).  It was terrible timing, sure, but I've seen people in the "spotlight" say a lot worse shit in a non-joking way and still keep their jobs.

EDIT:  As an example, Tony Harris everybody.

What Orth did, in my opinion, doesn't warrant being fired over.


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## Stratelier (Apr 14, 2013)

MicheleFancy said:


> What Orth did, in my opinion, doesn't warrant being fired over.


If it was conducted in e-mail or private chat, sure.  But the mistake was conducting it via tweets which everybody and their dog can see it and jump to conclusions because they're not in on the in-jokes.

At any rate, the word I hear on the subject right now is "resigned", not "fired".


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## MicheleFancy (Apr 15, 2013)

Stratadrake said:


> At any rate, the word I hear on the subject right now is "resigned", not "fired".



Is it resigned now?  The article I read when I posted that said he was just gone and no word, which tends to mean removed.


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## Jashwa (Apr 15, 2013)

CannonFodder said:


> It's looking like the 720 is going to have the always on requirement anyhow.  I guess Microsoft realizes that even if there's a always online requirement people are still going to buy the console anyhow.


Not nearly as many. They aren't that stupid.


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## Teal (Apr 15, 2013)

Jashwa said:


> Not nearly as many. They aren't that stupid.


 Can't wait to see the backlash when the people who bought it without knowing it's always on freak out.


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