# Best DAW for composing and producing original works?



## BanditBat (Nov 11, 2013)

Greetings! Finally fed up with Ableton Live 9, and finding it's confliction with my style, I'm now looking for a new DAW.  I'm starting to tract a lot more of that retro new wave/80's synth rock sort of sound, with elements of jazz and hardcore rock/metal thrown in for taste.  Ableton Live 9 is geared a lot more towards mixing samples, midi blocks and the like in the powerful performance feature that the program boasts.  This is very helpful for genres such as house and trance, which have sort of constant blocks that gradually build.  However, my work style and compositions do not benefit from this feature hardly at all, in fact it distracts me from the linear composition of my tracks.  This feature is Ableton's main focus, and seems to lack a bit in the features I'd find useful.

So, any suggestions to a DAW I'd find more geared towards original compositions? One that would have a beneficial workflow to my needs? I was thinking of trying cubase, but unfortunately you need their USB E-Licenser to run the Trial, so I'm looking for other options that may have similar features, especially the chord tracking feature.

Any more info will be gladly given!

Thanks <3


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## Vukasin (Nov 11, 2013)

Logic is very good for artists who are trying to compose as it has a lot of tools that will help you out with that. However, it's Mac exclusive, so if you have windows you're out of luck.

Pro Tools is the absolute best for live instrument recording (if that's what you're doing), but if you can't afford it then Reaper would be the next best thing. I use Pro Tools for all of my composing (I do rock and metal).


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## BanditBat (Nov 11, 2013)

I'll have to look into reaper, will be reporting back!  As for Logic, I am indeed using a PC, and as for Pro Tools, the only recording I do is MIDI, all my instruments I create myself in Reason 5.


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## Vukasin (Nov 11, 2013)

Okay, then since you are using mostly MIDI I would go for FL Studio. That's what I started on.

Programming drums, choirs and orchestra on FL's piano roll was incredibly easy. I absolutely LOVE FL Studio when doing MIDI.


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## Python Blue (Nov 11, 2013)

What Vukasin said when it comes to Logic, speaking as a user of the DAW, myself. I realize you're a PC user, though, and it's a shame, because I find Logic very advanced in features out of the box.


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## BanditBat (Nov 12, 2013)

Vukasin said:


> Okay, then since you are using mostly MIDI I would go for FL Studio. That's what I started on.
> Programming drums, choirs and orchestra on FL's piano roll was incredibly easy. I absolutely LOVE FL Studio when doing MIDI.



FL Studio was the first DAW I used, and I couldn't stand it at all.  Is REAPER also good for this?


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## Kalmor (Nov 12, 2013)

BanditBat said:


> FL Studio was the first DAW I used, and I couldn't stand it at all.  Is REAPER also good for this?


The MIDI used to be sub-par on it, but with some new updates now, it's cool.

(There's a 60 day trial you can have a go on).


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## BanditBat (Nov 13, 2013)

Vukasin said:


> Okay, then since you are using mostly MIDI I would go for FL Studio. That's what I started on.
> 
> Programming drums, choirs and orchestra on FL's piano roll was incredibly easy. I absolutely LOVE FL Studio when doing MIDI.





Raptros said:


> The MIDI used to be sub-par on it, but with some new updates now, it's cool.
> 
> (There's a 60 day trial you can have a go on).



Do you know if it's particularly good for what I need it for, or are there better options out there?


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## Vukasin (Nov 14, 2013)

BanditBat said:


> FL Studio was the first DAW I used, and I couldn't stand it at all.  Is REAPER also good for this?


Reaper, like Pro Tools, mostly aims for live instrument recordings. It'll work for what you want, but I really recommend trying the newer FL Studio. For what you're doing it's probably the best option after Logic.


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## Metrix (Nov 14, 2013)

Well, for recording and mastering, I prefer either Audacity or Mixcraft. To produce: Ableton, FL Studio, Logic, or Reasons. I'm not asking you to go out and get them and use it, just recommend you to try them out for a while to see which ones you like.


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## Zylo Wolf (Nov 19, 2013)

Here is a website to give you a little info on the top 15 DAWS

http://www.musicradar.com/tuition/tech/the-16-best-daw-software-apps-in-the-world-today-238905/10

I Picked up Reason 5 about 8 years ago, I stand by it in its superiority in Synth and sound manipulation. It has a very steep learning curve but there are tons of tutorials everywhere for it and most skills are transferable in most DAWS, Your workflow may suffer though till you get use to it. I think the best for workflow would be FL Studio since you can get tons of presets but Reason has its own in the way of Refills, I'm not one to use presets or refills but to each their own. 
Reason works a little differently from most DAWS in the way it simulates your virtual hardware, you have a rack just like a recording studio where you can add devices and take them away as you please. You can even manipulate the patch cables running from all your devices and chain devices in any fashion you desire so long as the sound travels through the device or can be used by it. Reason also has one of the most powerful synths in a DAW called Thor, just like most Synths you can manipulate the wave format, Attack, Delay, Reverb, etc. But with Thor you can chain oscillators together to layer sound within the same device, you can add filters, use LFO's and there is a programing section in the same device to route sound anyway you please within it. It truly is the most complex device in Reason. I've been using it for a while and I barely know everything I could do with it, But the sounds I get from it can not compare to other DAW synthesizers. Reason has allot of functionality and that usually overwhelms allot of people but I stuck with it and I stand by it. 

It sounds complex but it really isn't once you know each of the devices and their uses. Though I am also speaking of Reason 5, I tried using my buddies copy of Reason 7 but holy geeze so much changed and was added that I'd probably have to spend a month re-familiarizing myself with the new layout and devices. 
For just getting the basics of Reason down I recommend getting a copy of Reason 5, you can probably find a used copy on ebay or something for dirt cheap.
Even if it is not the latest it will have allot that you can use to still make tracks comparable to ones being released now. As they say, it is not the DAW but the skill that is required to make great music, I'm no pro skill wise but I know a fair bit about the DAW I use.

If you do choose Reason, I can prolly set you on your way to using it, point you to some good tutorials, give you a few basic rack set ups and run you through all the Devices. I could even open a drop box and put some files in there for a basic side chain set up, a few uses for the Matrix pattern sequencer and generally just tips and tricks. 

Though on a final note, Reason is good for creating raw sound and manipulating it into music. Not so good for recording, it is possible but you may need another side program for recording if you use Reason.


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## Vukasin (Nov 19, 2013)

Zylo Wolf said:


> Snip


Reason isn't really a "DAW"...

I mean, it is, but it's more of a library of synth VSTs


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## Zylo Wolf (Nov 19, 2013)

Vukasin said:


> Reason isn't really a "DAW"...
> 
> I mean, it is, but it's more of a library of synth VSTs



It may be a collection of synth VSTs but they still run within Reason and with that I consider it a DAW, I also know that Reason does not have VST plugins unlike some DAWs like FL Studio or Cubase, but it is still quite a powerful program. All DAWs have VSTs of some sort be it a raw synth or sampler. For whatever program you use and which ever method/s be it creating sound within it, or using recorded samples the software you do it within is your DAW.


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## Vukasin (Nov 19, 2013)

Zylo Wolf said:


> It may be a collection of synth VSTs but they still run within Reason and with that I consider it a DAW, I also know that Reason does not have VST plugins unlike some DAWs like FL Studio or Cubase, but it is still quite a powerful program. All DAWs have VSTs of some sort be it a raw synth or sampler. For whatever program you use and which ever method/s be it creating sound within it, or using recorded samples the software you do it within is your DAW.


By definition a DAW is "An electronic system designed solely or primarily for recording, editing and playing back digital audio". Reason doesn't do any of that until Reason 6. The studio I work at has Reason 5 available for us to use, but the only thing anyone uses it for is sampling and creating synths. For anything else it's pretty much useless because all you can use is what's inside it. You can't bring in audio for playback or editing, nor can you bring in your own VST's or plugins which also eliminates the ability to mix and/or master. It's amazing to ReWire it into Pro Tools though. With ReWire you can use Reason within other DAWs and it basically acts and an incredibly powerful synth VST even though it is it's own program.


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## Zylo Wolf (Nov 20, 2013)

Vukasin said:


> By definition a DAW is "An electronic system  designed solely or primarily for recording, editing and playing back  digital audio". Reason doesn't do any of that until Reason 6. The studio  I work at has Reason 5 available for us to use, but the only thing  anyone uses it for is sampling and creating synths. For anything else  it's pretty much useless because all you can use is what's inside it.  You can't bring in audio for playback or editing, nor can you bring in  your own VST's or plugins which also eliminates the ability to mix  and/or master. It's amazing to ReWire it into Pro Tools though. With  ReWire you can use Reason within other DAWs and it basically acts and an  incredibly powerful synth VST even though it is it's own  program.



I'm starting to like you Vulkasin and I must also thank you for directly  quoting from the Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) Wiki, this will  further solidify my defense that Reason 5 is a completely capable DAW  like any other even if it lacks in some areas. Let us look at the quote  and break it down "An electronic system designed solely or primarily for  recording, editing and playing back digital audio". So lets look at the  first part "An electronic system" That is something be it hardware or  software, whether it be solely either or, or software utilizing  hardware, hardware the utilizes software, software piggy backing on  other software or hardware using hardware. Even if Reason is classified  as a software DAW, it is still classified under DAW, It is completely  capable or using software/ hardware combos and integrating hardware to  be a controller and much more. 

Now let us look at the second part "Designed solely or primarily for".  Alright so, Having something designed solely means it is target  specifically for the task for which it was created. Having something  designed primarily means it is capable for the most part to do the tasks  it was designed for but it also may not be limited be those tasks  alone, Reason falls within the primarily category. It is completely  capable of doing the tasks it was designed for and if your abstract  enough allot more. Let me give a few good examples of abstract use even  if they are not within Reason itself. Say I have a milk jug, a stick and  a large rubber band, can I not combine those and use it as a make shift  instrument? also if I have a piece of cardboard and a broom, I can make  a wicked sweeping noise. A great piece of advice, Do not be limited by  what people call limitations, that is how people achieve what was thought  to be impossible. 

And lastly "recording, editing and playing back digital audio". I give  it to you that Reason does not have much to any type of recording for  sound, but you are able to record automation and midi layouts using  hardware. Your very much capable of editing within Reason even if it is a  bit more painstaking then other DAWs. For a no brainer Reason is  capable of playing back digital audio, be it samples or medi sequences  using its integrated synths. 

I use Reason solely as a DAW to create my tracks, it is completely  capable of doing what I want it to do since I do not use many recording  samples. I do not need to bring much into Reason since I can find lots  of things within Refills and other user created material that I can  convert to use within Reason, I can also create many unique sounds  within it. I can also export midi sequences to other software along with  automation. If need be I can create a large sample that can be a synth I  can use for the entirety of a track. For mixing and mastering within  Reason it may be a little bit more clonky then some DAWs but you are  still able to do so, as long as you know how to use the VSTs within  Reason and how to incorporate them to do your mastering. I know you have  to pay closer attention to your sound levels and your audio  frequencies, but you should be doing that in the first place and as long  as you know you can use compression, or use an equalizer to cut holes  in your frequencies you can use that in any place within your rack to  morph and balance your audio to your desires.

Instead of refuting whether a DAW is a DAW, For BanditBat we should just  be providing options, with details about them and their capabilities.  We have been but at the same time I just feel that this is a bit of a  beat down on Reason. I hope with the reasons I provided that you may  consider that Reason is a DAW even if it does not meet up to your  standards of what a DAW should be and capable of. I believe a DAW is  something you create your music with, whether you use it solely or in  conjunction with other software.


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## Vukasin (Nov 20, 2013)

Zylo Wolf said:


> Now let us look at the second part "Designed solely or primarily for"


But you can't look at it in pieces like that because you cut off key points in the definition. You can say Reason is designed solely or primarily for this, this and this, but the definition is specific because it says designed for editing and playback of audio. Yes, Reason does exactly what it is designed for, but it does not do what a DAW is meant to do.



Zylo Wolf said:


> And lastly "recording, editing and playing back digital audio". I give it to you that Reason does not have much to any type of recording for sound, but you are able to record automation and midi layouts using hardware. Your very much capable of editing within Reason even if it is a bit more painstaking then other DAWs. For a no brainer Reason is capable of playing back digital audio, be it samples or medi sequences using its integrated synths.



Well, first of all, MIDI is not audio. MIDI is just information being sent to the synth to tell it what to do so that you don't have to use a keyboard. Secondly, yes, you can import samples and all that, which is good and all, Reason has great samplers, but when it comes to importing or recording audio you're out of luck. Want to grid edit those drums? You can't. Want to record vocals into your track? You can't. Want to add a guitar part in this spot? You can't.




Zylo Wolf said:


> Instead of refuting whether a DAW is a DAW, For BanditBat we should just be providing options, with details about them and their capabilities. We have been but at the same time I just feel that this is a bit of a beat down on Reason. I hope with the reasons I provided that you may consider that Reason is a DAW even if it does not meet up to your standards of what a DAW should be and capable of. I believe a DAW is something you create your music with, whether you use it solely or in conjunction with other software.



It's not that I'm trying to beat down Reason or anything, I'm just trying to make a point that Reason is lacking in areas that you don't want a DAW lacking in (which is probably why Reason 6 and up now has those capabilities). Besides, he said in his second post that he uses Reason 5 for his synths, yet he is still looking for a DAW.


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