# It's the fault of HD gaming



## TransformerRobot (Jul 9, 2013)

This article explains the most likely reason Nintendo is struggling with the Wii U lately.


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## Falaffel (Jul 9, 2013)

Thanks for making a thread to post a link. 
I'm pretty sure I could have read it without this thread. 

Oh wait... We're supposed to talk about it.... I didn't know because of how little was in OP. 

Tell us, instead of posting a link and saying "here, talk." tell us your thoughts.


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 9, 2013)

Well there's been many discussions already about Nintendo, but I will talk about Region Locking and why I'm not surprised to a point. 

I'll explain with an anime company that used to handle Bandai's animation division - Anime Village.

Anime Village had a great goal and helped a lot with anime today. Deliver anime with cheap prices. Anime importing was rather expensive - at least in the US compared to other shows. So Anime Village came out and delivered cheap anime both containing subs and dubs, it was great for the US. It came with a problem and ended up with this company dissolving. Japanese consumers started importing the US versions because even with tariffs, it was *cheaper* than buying it in their native country.

So with Japan, they try to keep their economy rather centric and don't want imports overtaking native product. Hence region locking. The US is big on import goods so it matters less, but countries that are particular about their economy...ehh not so happy about globalization. Some companies are willing to take advantage of that, Adobe being a great example - charging more in Australia *because they can*.

Nintendo is still a strong property because all it does is games, the thing is how long this will remain in a global market is a legitimate question. With the handhelds, the DS and 3DS (specially after the price slash) still has a lot of consumers. I think for the family Nintendo is an easy choice over Xbox and Playstation for various concerns. Parents now had time to grow up with console games and feel Nintendo is probably a "safer" choice in terms of games since they know how gamers are over Xbox Live 

Brawl is still such a hit party game.


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## SirRob (Jul 9, 2013)

It's not the fault of HD gaming. Yes, it's a hurdle, but every console shift has a hurdle like that. It's poor decisions and marketing that hurt Nintendo the most.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 9, 2013)

I think if Nintendo got rid of region locking it would get them a big improvement in product sales.

And yeah, I've heard of Xbox Live drama. *shutter* I hardly *ever* see the likes of that on Miiverse. How did that happen? It's not like people are automatically nicer when using Nintendo hardware, are they?

Yeah, they need to step it up in marketing. Run commercials on every single channel if they have to!


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## SirRob (Jul 9, 2013)

TransformerRobot said:


> And yeah, I've heard of Xbox Live drama. *shutter* I hardly *ever* see the likes of that on Miiverse. How did that happen? It's not like people are automatically nicer when using Nintendo hardware, are they?


Miiverse is heavily moderated, I believe.


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## QT Melon (Jul 9, 2013)

TransformerRobot said:


> I think if Nintendo got rid of region locking it would get them a big improvement in product sales.



Hello TransformerRobot

Not gonna happen between Japan and US because of price. If Japanese can get it cheaper here in the US than their native country, why buy?


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 9, 2013)

Ouch. Nintendo might lose some fans over this - http://vr-zone.com/articles/nintend...-super-smash-bros-melee-tournament/44441.html

The tourney was for Breast Cancer fundraising


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 9, 2013)

It was a stupid thing to do, but I'm still gonna keep buying Nintendo products.


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## Stratelier (Jul 9, 2013)

And here I was wanting to post a random link and walk away just like the OP did....



TransformerRobot said:


> I think if Nintendo got rid of region locking it would get them a big improvement in product sales.


How so?  Unless there's a strong trend of buying imports from other regions, whether a system is region-locked or not will make little to no *practical* difference.


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 9, 2013)

Oh looks like they reversed the decision on blocking the Stream after the rage.


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## Alastair Snowpaw (Jul 9, 2013)

Arshes Nei said:


> Ouch. Nintendo might lose some fans over this - http://vr-zone.com/articles/nintend...-super-smash-bros-melee-tournament/44441.html
> 
> The tourney was for Breast Cancer fundraising



Not really, the way it happened is evo was deciding on an 8th game and the decision for it was done by a donation drive for breast cancer and which ever game received the most donations, melee was ht ewinner with around 85k donations with skullgirls behind the close second of around 79k, which was actually really close since those two where the main games being donated for. The got into the tourney by a breast cancer donation drive.
The tourney however is not for breast cancer, the tourney is the biggest fighting game tourney in the world with poeple from all over the world attending and last time over a million poeple watching worldwide, so yea it's a very big thing and that was a poor choice by nintendo.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 9, 2013)

Stratadrake said:


> And here I was wanting to post a random link and walk away just like the OP did....
> 
> 
> How so?  Unless there's a strong trend of buying imports from other regions, whether a system is region-locked or not will make little to no *practical* difference.



I figured that more customers would be happy with the decision, and that would in turn lead to more sales. When we're happy with a company's products we tend to buy more of them.


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## Runefox (Jul 9, 2013)

I don't think Japanese developers have really been hit all that hard by HD gaming. Sega's doing pretty well with Phantasy Star Online 2, Atlus has long been adored for the Persona / Shin Megami Tensei series, Konami Kojima and the Metal Gear series, Gran Turismo, Namco-Bandai did OK with Ace Combat Assault Horizon (in fact, the game is beautiful)... Honestly, using that as a point for why Nintendo is justified in region locking makes zero sense. The fact of the matter is, like Iwata said, Nintendo sells worldwide, and thus if you're not buying in your local demographic, you're not compensating Nintendo for their efforts to bring the game to your area. Taxes, tariffs, localizations, marketing, that all factors in.

Where I become less understanding is when games are not available outside of the home market. Thankfully, Nintendo themselves are only responsible for a few examples of this (*cough*Mother*cough*).

Either way, the only reason HD gaming has caused Nintendo any harm is because Nintendo has traditionally shied away from it. They lost a console generation's worth of learning the tricks of the trade with the Wii, and now are faced with competition that has not only pushed the limits of HD hardware, but are poised to very quickly surpass them with the next generation's launch. Nintendo on the other hand have until the WiiU been using essentially the same hardware for over a decade. Of course, nobody comes to the Nintendo show to be wowed by graphics, but the fact that they're saying that it's difficult to make HD games seems to highlight the fact that they simply got left behind when they decided on the Wii. I don't see other developers saying anything like that; In fact, there have been calls for even more power among developers for some time.

It's unfortunate for Nintendo, but knowing them, they'll pull through it anyway. Their major strengths have always been in the core gameplay of their titles, and as long as they can keep nailing that, they'll keep their devoted fanbase and continue to grab attention from the rest of the market. I just wish Nintendo, as the sole driving force of their home consoles, would make games more often... It's almost like Valve. It's a trickle of really great titles, but it really doesn't feel like much when that's all you get.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 9, 2013)

Well what can be done to help Nintendo now? It's not like we can just walk around malls and streets wearing signs that tell people to buy the Wii U. That's not just crazy it's something to get laughed at with.


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## Alastair Snowpaw (Jul 10, 2013)

actual advertising would help.


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## JCobalt (Jul 10, 2013)

The EVO thing was reversed.  Most people speculate it was just a hiccup from legal.


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 10, 2013)

JCobalt said:


> The EVO thing was reversed.  Most people speculate it was just a hiccup from legal.



Yeah that was already mentioned by me.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 10, 2013)

Alastair Snowpaw said:


> actual advertising would help.



Yeah, I haven't seen hardly any Wii U commercials lately. How can they sell it without people hearing about it?


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## Judge Spear (Jul 10, 2013)

TransformerRobot said:


> Yeah, I haven't seen hardly any Wii U commercials lately. How can they sell it without people hearing about it?



I don't think there are any TV ads at all. I don't know why they suddenly forgot how to think.


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## Alastair Snowpaw (Jul 10, 2013)

TransformerRobot said:


> Yeah, I haven't seen hardly any Wii U commercials lately. How can they sell it without people hearing about it?


Having actual commercials.


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 10, 2013)

The Wii commercials got me into the Yoshida Brother's music

[yt]a5Yo0JwZ5xA[/yt]


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## SirRob (Jul 10, 2013)

Alastair Snowpaw said:


> Having actual commercials.


Well

They have this commercial

[yt]AJICJccq3ig[/yt]


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 10, 2013)

SirRob said:


> Well
> 
> They have this commercial
> 
> [yt]AJICJccq3ig[/yt]



I was thinking more along the lines of having more of them for viewers outside of Japan.

Also, Miyomoto just revealed that he's working on a new franchise for Nintendo.

Your thoughts on such a thing? Would it speed up sales for the Wii U?


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## Judge Spear (Jul 10, 2013)

A commercial...for DLC...in Japan only. Wow. That's poor.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 10, 2013)

XoPachi said:


> A commercial...for DLC...in Japan only. Wow. That's poor.



My thoughts exactly. -_-


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## Digitalpotato (Jul 10, 2013)

XoPachi said:


> I don't think there are any TV ads at all. I don't know why they suddenly forgot how to think.



People watch TV still?

Almsot eveyrone I know either
a) Streams it online with an ad blocker
b) Just TiVos or DVRs everything and buzzes through all the commercials.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 10, 2013)

Well why not put posters and flyers around communities? It might be a lot harder to ignore those.


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 10, 2013)

Well advertising through Youtube would work. More viral marketing

[yt]hQ-xsBZ_Nqo[/yt]


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## Digitalpotato (Jul 10, 2013)

TransformerRobot said:


> Well why not put posters and flyers around communities? It might be a lot harder to ignore those.



Out here putting posters and flyers around rarely works and they're much more likely to end up in the garbage can. 

You're better off doing what Arshes Nei said and advertising through YouTube... which most people are blocking ads for anyways. 

Not to mention they're trying to give directed advertisment(s) now. Google's known for tailoring your search results depending on what they think you want to see.


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## Runefox (Jul 10, 2013)

What Nintendo SHOULD do is launch a viral campaign. Nobody really cared about Old Spice, for example, prior to the wacky commercials they've been putting out over the past couple years, and BK's creepy king was massively popular. It doesn't have to be as completely wacky, but they're Nintendo, they know how to make things fun. Bring in Mega64 and do a whole web series. Get Rooster Teeth to do a machinima. Get some hype going.

Of course, they need games to hype to begin with...


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 10, 2013)

Not just viral campaigns, but maybe something like they did with the 3DS version of Donkey Kong Country Returns:

[video=youtube;LnxGlw3Sq_s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnxGlw3Sq_s[/video]


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## Sutekh_the_Destroyer (Jul 10, 2013)

Maybe Nintendo should have done more research into how long HD games, whilst they were developing the Wii U? That way there wouldn't be the dry-up of new Wii U games we have right now.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 10, 2013)

It's not so bad, we have Game & Wario now. 

And in just a few weeks, Pikmin 3.


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## Judge Spear (Jul 10, 2013)

Neither of which will move units.



Digitalpotato said:


> People watch TV still?
> 
> Almsot eveyrone I know either
> a) Streams it online with an ad blocker
> b) Just TiVos or DVRs everything and buzzes through all the commercials.



1.) Yes. Millions still watch TV around the world.
2.) Nintendo didn't even do online advertising as much as they should have.


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## Imperial Impact (Jul 10, 2013)

XoPachi said:


> A commercial...for DLC...in Japan only. Wow. That's poor.


Super Street Fighter IV: Arcade Edition


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 10, 2013)

At least in the United Kingdom there's this:

[video=youtube;iOwIoWPGJwc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOwIoWPGJwc[/video]


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## Sutekh_the_Destroyer (Jul 10, 2013)

TransformerRobot said:


> At least in the United Kingdom there's this:
> 
> [video=youtube;iOwIoWPGJwc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOwIoWPGJwc[/video]



Those are some good adverts.

Unfortunately the UK isn't a big enough market on it's own to sustain the Wii U on it's own, but at least there are actually ads.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 10, 2013)

Then I still don't know why the ones in North America aren't so plentiful.

UPDATE:

Think this might also be good news for Nintendo?


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## SirRob (Jul 10, 2013)

Speaking of Game & Wario, there WAS a viral campaign for it. They made a phony Kickstarter-esque website for it.

[yt]XSY98rBOca0[/yt]


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 10, 2013)

I just felt like posting this one

[yt]CGXys7rkq5A[/yt]


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## SirRob (Jul 10, 2013)

It's a shame the 3DS sequel doesn't look like that.


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## Stratelier (Jul 10, 2013)

XoPachi said:


> A commercial...for DLC...in Japan only. Wow. That's poor.


Last I heard it does have a retail release as well ... you know, for those five people under that rock who don't actually have the original.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 11, 2013)

SirRob said:


> Speaking of Game & Wario, there WAS a viral campaign for it. They made a phony Kickstarter-esque website for it.
> 
> [yt]XSY98rBOca0[/yt]



I loved that one. XD


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## Ji-Ji (Jul 11, 2013)

Arshes Nei said:


> I just felt like posting this one
> 
> [yt]CGXys7rkq5A[/yt]



I actually want to play link to the past now. 
That was so strange yet expectant from Japan that it was a perfect ad.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 11, 2013)

This might be good news for Nintendo.


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 11, 2013)

TransformerRobot said:


> This might be good news for Nintendo.



Waiting for more chinese knockoffs of consoles. Praystation, Nintendoll, XBrocks

Then we can watch more stories of Chinese employees jumping off buildings trying to manufacture these things :/


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 11, 2013)

Arshes Nei said:


> Waiting for more chinese knockoffs of consoles. Praystation, Nintendoll, XBrocks
> 
> Then we can watch more stories of Chinese employees jumping off buildings trying to manufacture these things :/



Well it didn't say we had worked out *all* the kinks in the process.

*grabs an aluminum bat* Gimme the address of whoever made the Vii and I'll give him a.....early birthday present.


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## Stratelier (Jul 12, 2013)

Runefox said:


> It doesn't have to be as completely wacky, but they're Nintendo, they know how to make things fun.


Remember the days when

[video=youtube;K783SDTBKmg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K783SDTBKmg[/video]

?


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 12, 2013)

Stratadrake said:


> Remember the days when
> 
> [video=youtube;K783SDTBKmg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K783SDTBKmg[/video]
> 
> ?



That's what got me hooked on Super Smash Bros. XD


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## Digitalpotato (Jul 12, 2013)

TransformerRobot said:


> Then I still don't know why the ones in North America aren't so plentiful.



Cause most people in North America just stream TV or have TiVo/DVR and buzz through all the commercials, because the commercials in the NA market are so incredibly annoying?


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 12, 2013)

Digitalpotato said:


> Cause most people in North America just stream TV or have TiVo/DVR and buzz through all the commercials, because the commercials in the NA market are so incredibly annoying?



VERY annoying.

Just found this article that makes me feel ill. Is this guy kidding me? There's no way Nintendo can succeed in the strategy he describes.


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## Digitalpotato (Jul 12, 2013)

Activision has no plans for Wii U games? 

Hasn't stopped them from making Skylanders games available on the Wii U. :V


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 12, 2013)

Digitalpotato said:


> Activision has no plans for Wii U games?
> 
> Hasn't stopped them from making Skylanders games available on the Wii U. :V



Can you say "Critical research failure"? XD


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## Arshes Nei (Jul 12, 2013)

It worked for Sega, but Sega was at a good point to go 3rd party and stop hardware production, especially since at that time Arcade cabinets were a dying business - which Sega was big on.

But it wouldn't really work for Nintendo unless later on in the years Wii U does worse and its handheld. The 3Ds despite a bad launch did make it up later on. 

I rarely hear about just outright hardware failure on Nintendo's products. Most of the damage are WiiMotes doing the damage on other items, TVs, windows, ceilings, people and cats....etc...

That isn't to say someone hasn't broken a DS screen...but just saying seems Nintendo makes some sturdy products.


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## SirRob (Jul 12, 2013)

Arshes Nei said:


> cats


D:


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 12, 2013)

Arshes Nei said:


> It worked for Sega, but Sega was at a good point to go 3rd party and stop hardware production, especially since at that time Arcade cabinets were a dying business - which Sega was big on.
> 
> But it wouldn't really work for Nintendo unless later on in the years Wii U does worse and its handheld. The 3Ds despite a bad launch did make it up later on.
> 
> ...



I broke the top screen for my first DS.


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## Runefox (Jul 12, 2013)

Ehh, DS hinges were pretty notorious for having fatigue problems, and the NES was pretty fragile. But yeah, beyond that, Nintendo hardware is ruggedly built, or at least simple enough that it can absorb stress without any problem. I recently watched a teardown of an N64 and was rather surprised to see just how little there is on the PCB. They put a lot of thought into the design process.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 12, 2013)

Runefox said:


> Ehh, DS hinges were pretty notorious for having fatigue problems, and the NES was pretty fragile. But yeah, beyond that, Nintendo hardware is ruggedly built, or at least simple enough that it can absorb stress without any problem. I recently watched a teardown of an N64 and was rather surprised to see just how little there is on the PCB. They put a lot of thought into the design process.



Take a look at this test of Gen. 6 consoles' durability:

[video=youtube;s3mIpThXiGk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3mIpThXiGk[/video]


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## Stratelier (Jul 12, 2013)

Arshes Nei said:


> I rarely hear about just outright hardware failure on Nintendo's products. Most of the damage are WiiMotes doing the damage on other items, TVs, windows, ceilings, people and cats....etc...


I saw a used NES cartridge completely mummified in duct tape at a local games store.  Reportedly, its owner (after a ragequit) tried to blow it up with a firecracker.  Not only did the cartridge mostly survive the blast, it _still played_.

Nintendo only uses the word "brick" in reference to actual cobblestones.

[insert Chuck Norris joke here]


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## Runefox (Jul 12, 2013)

NES cartridges are actually mostly shell:







It may just have been dumb luck, but practically everyone I knew back during my childhood had their NES "burn out". What would usually actually have happened is the pins got bent or the 10NES chip got fried (probably by an unlicensed game since early versions prior to cracking it sent a voltage spike to the chip to disable it). At least one failed to output any video at all.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 12, 2013)

Runefox said:


> NES cartridges are actually mostly shell:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Holy crap.


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## Stratelier (Jul 12, 2013)

SNES cartridges are about the same size board on the inside, too.


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## TransformerRobot (Jul 13, 2013)

One good thing about Nintendo finally using HD game making technology:

They'll already have quality first party HD games available before Sony or Microsoft.


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