# How Can A NSFW Artist Protect Themselves?



## isolato (Jul 11, 2016)

I'm really sorry if this is in the completely wrong forum' but I was wondering how an artist producing pornography or sexual material can protect themselves? Also if you do sell porn,'how do you make sure the client isn't a minor? Do you demand proof of age or identity? If so, what is accepted and what isn't? If not, how do you protect yourself?

I'm interested in selling adult work but terrified of the idea of a minor commissioning me for adult work and their parents finding out and pressing charges. I really don't want to go to jail for that a at all. Advice or knowledge on anything protecting an independent adult artist would be very much appreciated. Thank you in advance!


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## BRN (Jul 12, 2016)

If you take reasonable steps to identify whether your customer is a minor, and they lie to you, you're already protected! 

You can protect yourself by only using methods of communication that leave a record of who said what. If you're able to prove that you asked your customers, and that they lied to you, then there is literally no legal case against you.


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## quoting_mungo (Jul 12, 2016)

As long as you keep an eye out for obvious red flags, you've probably got little to worry about. (Red flags would include things like the individual mentioning high school (yes, I'm aware that you can be 18 in high school, but it's still a reasonable indicator that the individual MAY be underage), sending payment through a third party (again, can be legitimately, but a reasonable indicator you need to be on your guard), mentions of not being old enough to have a credit card (don't accept _any_ excuses after hearing that one!), mentions of being grounded... Just use common sense.)

If you want to protect yourself further, you could always ask new customers to show prior adult commissions they've gotten. It would cut out a segment of your potential customer base, but someone who can show you adult artwork they previously commissioned is someone who is a lot less likely to end up being a "lawsuit-happy-parents" problem even SHOULD they turn out to be underage. If nothing else it shows a pattern of deception on their part. I don't know offhand what may be available, and it may depend on where you/your potential customer are, but if you have the ability to use a payment method only available to 18+ individuals, that would also be pretty solid protection for you. (Which is to say, if you use a payment service that only individuals over 18 have access to, in theory that would make the payment in itself would be proof of age.)

I just state that I won't do NSFW art for minors, and maybe have a cursory glance across their profile if anything seems potentially hinky. Honestly I'm a lot more concerned about being conned into drawing NSFW of third parties' characters without permission, and I've got pretty strict guidelines in place to reduce the risk of that happening.


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## lockaboss (Jul 12, 2016)

what is nsfw mean


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## PlusThirtyOne (Jul 12, 2016)

lockaboss said:


> what is nsfw mean


*N*ot *S*afe *F*or *W*ork
(in this case it's sexually explicit material)


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## quoting_mungo (Jul 12, 2016)

PlusThirtyOne said:


> *N*ot *S*afe *F*or *W*ork
> (in this case it's sexually explicit material)


Honestly, I wouldn't draw e.g. violent material that went beyond tame cartoon violence for an underage commissioner, either. Not saying it's illegal (as I honestly don't know) but I would personally be seriously uncomfortable with drawing e.g. realistic violence or gore for a minor without explicit approval from their guardian. If nothing else it could potentially be undermining that guardian's parenting, and I'm not on with that.


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## PlusThirtyOne (Jul 12, 2016)

quoting_mungo said:


> Honestly, I wouldn't draw e.g. violent material that went beyond tame cartoon violence for an underage commissioner, either. Not saying it's illegal (as I honestly don't know) but I would personally be seriously uncomfortable with drawing e.g. realistic violence or gore for a minor without explicit approval from their guardian. If nothing else it could potentially be undermining that guardian's parenting, and I'm not on with that.


Actual laws aside, i would argue against exposing a child to anything outside their parents' approval. As you said, unless you're a friend or family member and know you're in the clear to expose a minor to sexual or violent material (like take them to an R rated movie), it's best to stay away. i think of it this way: i wouldn't want an adult stranger getting in the way of how i want to raise my child. Therefore i would never overstep that boundary. ...on purpose.
On the internet, nobody knows you're a _______, after all.


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## SevenArms (Jul 12, 2016)

This is something that worries me when I was thinking in starting with erotic art, it’s really easy to a minor to have access to porn and (a little less easy, but still very possible) to have access to a paypal account or another payment method to buy commissions.

What I did was consult mi country laws about it and ask advice from a friend’s brother who’s a lawyer, he say me this:

 No.1 You must specify that your page and work is only for adults, put the proper warnings in the front page of your account or in the submission

No.2 Make a rules sheet where you specify not only what you do and don’t draw, but also put that your work is mature content and the client by buying you something is agreeing that s/he is an adult in his/her country. I use this one that I made: http://sta.sh/0x3scxtco33 it’s just an example and I need to make more specifications and cover a lot of loop holes, but the warning is there.

No.3 Save all the notes and conversation where you negotiate the commission, especially the one where the client accepts your rules.

No.4 If you know the local laws and you think that what they ask you to draw is something illegal, then probably it is. If you feel uncomfortable drawing it, don’t do it! Trust your instincts 

You must understand that if a minor want something and he/she is used to get what he/she wants, they going to get it one way or another. You must also understand that the rules and contracts are made to protect you and the client. Maybe this sheet it’s not a formal contract (at least not in my country) but says the most relevant points and it is important when making clarifications.

Still, check the rules in your local area, look advice from someone who know about them and, like they say, be alert to obvious signals in your clients


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## Maximus B. Panda (Jul 12, 2016)

With a condom....



Spoiler: ...



Just Kidding!


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## Besharia (Jul 13, 2016)

Honestly start with a legal disclaimer, then as someone said just look for red flags. Also do a formal study of relevant laws in your country AND the country the site your hosted on is located in. When in doubt seek guidance from a lawyer if possible and just use common sense. Most kids who lurk those sites are really bad at being undercover.... Or I'm really good at detecting bullshit. Either way make sure when sealing the deal that you ask and keep detailed records of both chat AND exchange of funds.


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## isolato (Jul 15, 2016)

BRN said:


> If you take reasonable steps to identify whether your customer is a minor, and they lie to you, you're already protected!
> 
> You can protect yourself by only using methods of communication that leave a record of who said what. If you're able to prove that you asked your customers, and that they lied to you, then there is literally no legal case against you.




Noted! I will make sure to keep a record of each commissioner and my messages with them, as well as the Paypal account associated with them/their name. Of course, with proof that I took steps to make sure they were a minor or not.




quoting_mungo said:


> As long as you keep an eye out for obvious red flags, you've probably got little to worry about. (Red flags would include things like the individual mentioning high school (yes, I'm aware that you can be 18 in high school, but it's still a reasonable indicator that the individual MAY be underage), sending payment through a third party (again, can be legitimately, but a reasonable indicator you need to be on your guard), mentions of not being old enough to have a credit card (don't accept _any_ excuses after hearing that one!), mentions of being grounded... Just use common sense.)
> 
> If you want to protect yourself further, you could always ask new customers to show prior adult commissions they've gotten. It would cut out a segment of your potential customer base, but someone who can show you adult artwork they previously commissioned is someone who is a lot less likely to end up being a "lawsuit-happy-parents" problem even SHOULD they turn out to be underage. If nothing else it shows a pattern of deception on their part. I don't know offhand what may be available, and it may depend on where you/your potential customer are, but if you have the ability to use a payment method only available to 18+ individuals, that would also be pretty solid protection for you. (Which is to say, if you use a payment service that only individuals over 18 have access to, in theory that would make the payment in itself would be proof of age.)
> 
> I just state that I won't do NSFW art for minors, and maybe have a cursory glance across their profile if anything seems potentially hinky. Honestly I'm a lot more concerned about being conned into drawing NSFW of third parties' characters without permission, and I've got pretty strict guidelines in place to reduce the risk of that happening.



I'm actually looking into finding some services that allow payment only to those who are 18 and older. If anyone reading this thread knows of payment services that support selling adult material, I would love if you guys spoke about it.
That being said, I will actually probably see if they've commissioned adult material in the past - it won't be a be-all, end all if they haven't, but it will certainly be a step I take to assure that I'm safe.


SevenArms said:


> This is something that worries me when I was thinking in starting with erotic art, it’s really easy to a minor to have access to porn and (a little less easy, but still very possible) to have access to a paypal account or another payment method to buy commissions.
> 
> What I did was consult mi country laws about it and ask advice from a friend’s brother who’s a lawyer, he say me this:
> 
> ...




These are all absolutely great points and thank you so much. I'm going to utilize them all and write up a TOS / Rules right away.



Besharia said:


> Honestly start with a legal disclaimer, then as someone said just look for red flags. Also do a formal study of relevant laws in your country AND the country the site your hosted on is located in. When in doubt seek guidance from a lawyer if possible and just use common sense. Most kids who lurk those sites are really bad at being undercover.... Or I'm really good at detecting bullshit. Either way make sure when sealing the deal that you ask and keep detailed records of both chat AND exchange of funds.



Alrighty, I will do that. I'll look into checking with a lawyer as well as doing a study of relavant laws.


Thank you everyone who answered. I do have one more question, if anyone ends up seeing it: are there any money transferring services online that support adult material / digital goods, as PayPal recently changed their Seller Protection and no longer cover digital goods, and I believe someone said they don't support adult content, either.


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## Besharia (Jul 15, 2016)

isolato said:


> Noted! I will make sure to keep a record of each commissioner and my messages with them, as well as the Paypal account associated with them/their name. Of course, with proof that I took steps to make sure they were a minor or not.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Honestly you never heard this from me but alot of those rules can be circumvented. I have a friend who will remain anonymous who runs his own NSFW site geared toward, um..... People like me.... And he receives money from a wide range of institutions he was saying something like marking services are donations or non descript products... Basically don't tell the financial institution what the purchase actually is. I wish I could remember more it was early in the morning and I was hammered from five days of non-stop.... I can't talk about that.


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