# Why I'll never do free art requests every again



## Liseran Thistle (May 30, 2020)

I'm gonna be blunt and say I hate having to try and market myself to furries here because no one here wants to actually buy my artwork. 

It feels like if I open for free requests I get tons of people asking me for free artwork, but do those same people ever think about getting a commission done? No, they don't. Those same people are so quick to go "Oh yes, I would definitely like it if you drew this character for me for free"

But they never come back and ask for a commission, and I don't know how long I have to wait for someone whose NOT into weird kink shit to come and commission me. I've opened for commissions multiple times, and I've done free art requests for people multiple times, and it's gotten me nowhere. I've had more success with Non-furries than I did with actual furries, and I don't want to become a porn artist just so I can get a shred of attention from people. 

I'm not doing free art requests ever again because it tells me that the people who come to those threads over and over again are disingenuous when they say my art is good. I just don't believe them. If my artwork is good, could you maybe _pay _me to do it then? 

And I'm also sick of people lecturing me about how maybe the reason furries don't want my art is because I'm not popular enough because I don't want to have to wait till I have thousands of twitter followers just so I can make a decent amount of money off the thing I like. Call me greedy or whatever the fuck you want, but at the end of the day I don't draw for other people just cause I like it, I do it because I want them to pay me for it in some way. I do it because I would like for them to compensate me fairly for it. Not everyone is doing this art bullshit cause they like sitting at home and drawing the same animals over and over again. 

And that may not fit with the "UwU Cute Furry" aesthetic that everyone in this community likes to try and peddle, but it's just the truth of the matter. This is an awful place to try and advertise for commissions in my opinion because it really does feel like my art has no real value if it isn't some big buff wolf dude.


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## ConorHyena (May 30, 2020)

I think free art is going to hurt your marketing down the line because it breeds the wrong type of audience (those that want freebies)

Other than that, without looking at your numbers and your social media presence, I suspect this has something to do with an imperfect marketing strategy. You could try building a community, or joining one, and advertising your art more and effectively


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## Tendo64 (May 30, 2020)

To be honest, I don't know what you were expecting. Why did you think opening free art threads would make people want to commission you? If you spoil people and get them used to getting art from you for free, they're gonna think suddenly having to pay is "unfair."

Which is why nobody should ever do free art unless they genuinely enjoy drawing for free and are content with not having people pay for it. The people who come for free art are not the same as the ones who come for commissions, which is why I stopped doing free art.


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## Vinfang (May 30, 2020)

I only give out freebies on my terms. and generally don't draw the same character twice, unless I like the designs/personalities.

I agree there are always the same group of people asking for free art on FA forums, but I still think FA mainsite & forum has more marketability than most other sites.

To me, I felt the amino app is more hostile for business. and platforms, like YT, FB, IG, Twitter, Patreon, etc. takes too much time to maintain.


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## Miles Marsalis (May 30, 2020)

I'm sorry that has been happening, @Liseran Thistle . It sucks when people take advantage of requests and don't bring business your way, especially when they liked the work you did. However, I'd say that this is I tell writers and artists not to do free work unless you're ready to let some business go and you can manage the swarms of people looking for free art. I try to only do requests to sharpen my skills and only for close friends or people who can't afford commissions, like kids or people I know who are in hard times.

But getting back on track, you shouldn't feel pressured to do NSFW art to drum up business and I think it is admirable that you aren't. I also think that you try looking for business on both Fur Affinity and other less furry-oriented sites like DeviantArt, Twitter, and Tumblr. Also, you might what to set up shop on newer art sites like Pillowfort and Waterfall to take advantage of the smaller pools of competition and greater demand for commissions. There is also of course FAF for quickly getting business in the door and taking specialized commissions. Once you have a steady client base, set up a reasonably priced Patreon to retain their business and set up a steady revenue.

That's my two cents.

Also, do you have a gallery? I guessing you did your icon, which looks cool.


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## Liseran Thistle (May 30, 2020)

Miles Marsalis said:


> I'm sorry that has been happening, @Liseran Thistle . It sucks when people take advantage of requests and don't bring business your way, especially when they liked the work you did. However, I'd say that this is I tell writers and artists not to free work unless you're ready to let some business go and you can manage the swarms of people looking for free art. I try to only do requests to sharpen my skills and only for close friends or people who can't afford commissions, like kids or people I know who are in hard times.
> 
> But getting back on track, you shouldn't feel pressured to do NSFW art to drum up business and I think it is admirable that you aren't. I also think that you try looking for business on both Fur Affinity and other less furry-oriented sites like DeviantArt, Twitter, and Tumblr. Also, you might what to set up shop on newer art sites like Pillowfort and Waterfall to take advantage of the smaller pools of competition and greater demand for commissions. There is also of course FAF for quickly getting business in the door and taking specialized commissions. Once you have a steady client base, set up a reasonably priced Patreon to retain their business and set up a steady revenue.
> 
> ...



Yes, I do have a gallery. I have my artwork up on both Deviantart and Furaffinity, two places that I haven't had any luck in finding any business at. Some people seemingly have no idea what a Deviantart even is, and I already gave my two cents about furaffinity. 

Userpage of LiseranThistle -- Fur Affinity [dot] net

LiseranThistle - Hobbyist, Digital Artist | DeviantArt


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## Liseran Thistle (May 30, 2020)

ConorHyena said:


> I think free art is going to hurt your marketing down the line because it breeds the wrong type of audience (those that want freebies)
> 
> Other than that, without looking at your numbers and your social media presence, I suspect this has something to do with an imperfect marketing strategy. You could try building a community, or joining one, and advertising your art more and effectively




Listen, Idk how to explain to people that "Building an audience" is the hardest fucking thing ever. I wish people would stop telling me "Just try and market yourself" or "Just try and put yourself out there" as if I haven't been doing that.

There is no trick to gaining an audience its pure fucking luck. I'm not gonna crack the code one day and suddenly become famous because I put the right amount of hashtags or because I posted on the right website. Building an audience isn't easy, and there is no perfect way of doing it. Not even me working myself to the grave and making artwork every day will guarantee me an audience. I've been posting my art on the internet for a long ass time, and I've only got a handful of comments underneath all those posts to show for it. 

"You're just not trying hard enough." 

No, I'm putting my name in a lottery and hoping I'll make it big one day.


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## Miles Marsalis (May 30, 2020)

Liseran Thistle said:


> Yes, I do have a gallery. I have my artwork up on both Deviantart and Furaffinity, two places that I haven't had any luck in finding any business at. Some people seemingly have no idea what a Deviantart even is, and I already gave my two cents about furaffinity.
> 
> Userpage of LiseranThistle -- Fur Affinity [dot] net
> 
> LiseranThistle - Hobbyist, Digital Artist | DeviantArt


Thanks for the links. But people on Fur Affinity have no idea what DeviantArt is?

Like, the vast-majority of my non-furry friends have heard of DeviantArt at least and quite a few commission from there. I do too occasionally, honestly.


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## Liseran Thistle (May 30, 2020)

Miles Marsalis said:


> Thanks for the links. But people on Fur Affinity have no idea what DeviantArt is?
> 
> Like, the vast-majority of my non-furry friends have heard of DeviantArt at least and quite a few commission from there. I do too occasionally, honestly.



I branch out to other places besides furaffinity, and people who aren't on furaffinity have very little knowledge about what deviantart is.


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## Vinfang (May 30, 2020)

Liseran Thistle said:


> Listen, Idk how to explain to people that "Building an audience" is the hardest fucking thing ever. I wish people would stop telling me "Just try and market yourself" or "Just try and put yourself out there" as if I haven't been doing that.
> 
> There is no trick to gaining an audience its pure fucking luck. I'm not gonna crack the code one day and suddenly become famous because I put the right amount of hashtags or because I posted on the right website. Building an audience isn't easy, and there is no perfect way of doing it. Not even me working myself to the grave and making artwork every day will guarantee me an audience. I've been posting my art on the internet for a long ass time, and I've only got a handful of comments underneath all those posts to show for it.
> 
> ...



I totally agreed. It is hard to sell art online, but it is even harder to get people to commission a physical art piece.

The many ways to grow audiences are to...

attend physical events, chat with people and give out links / business cards?
pay for commercials?
leaving comments / shouts on groups / pages?

It doesn't work all the time, but might be the slow and steady route to take before one can finally transforms over years into an A-lister.

I would say the main goal is to try enjoy the process of both making art and marketing, but making improvements and mastering your artistry are the key to an artist 's financial success.


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## Liseran Thistle (May 30, 2020)

Okay but I don't feel like I should have to be an "A-lister" just to make money.


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## Miles Marsalis (May 30, 2020)

Liseran Thistle said:


> Listen, Idk how to explain to people that "Building an audience" is the hardest fucking thing ever. I wish people would stop telling me "Just try and market yourself" or "Just try and put yourself out there" as if I haven't been doing that.
> 
> There is no trick to gaining an audience its pure fucking luck. I'm not gonna crack the code one day and suddenly become famous because I put the right amount of hashtags or because I posted on the right website. Building an audience isn't easy, and there is no perfect way of doing it. Not even me working myself to the grave and making artwork every day will guarantee me an audience. I've been posting my art on the internet for a long ass time, and I've only got a handful of comments underneath all those posts to show for it.
> 
> ...


There are ways to work the system, so to speak. 

1. You can take out an advertisement on the main site and besides building that viewer base from all the people who randomly click to ad to see your work, you'll get an influx of customers. I know people who have taken out ads for various endeavors and it increased their traffic as well business. The prices are reasonable for banner ads too, this can be cost effective. I'm probably going to do it myself to promote a book I'm going to try to self-publish. 

2. Like I said, try Pillowfort and Waterfall along with other newer art sites in conjunction with platforms you are already on. These sites are smaller with users looking for commissions from fewer artists. If join the official Discord servers for these sites and advertise in them, you'll be particular set. The site staff may even actively give you helpful suggestions for running your business on there. 

3. In the meantime, keep of the people who have commissioned you, especially if they have done so regularly. Those are the seeds of your client base. Check in with them to see if they need work done or are interested in offers you are making. Send thank you notes for people who did business with you. I know someone on here who did exactly that and she is doing booming business because repeat business is your base. 

4. Lastly, in submissions, make offer images that will appear in Recent Submissions on the main site, preferably with the tag line cheap commissions. A lot of people search for cheap commissions that way, so you can lasso on to that business if you do it frequently, within site guidelines, naturally.


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## Vinfang (May 30, 2020)

Liseran Thistle said:


> Okay but I don't feel like I should have to be an "A-lister" just to make money.



In my opinion, being quirky, skilled, approachable and professional help sell one's brand.

FA mainsite have plenty of amazing artists from Russia / Thailand / Korea / Taiwan.

Why would a client pick you specifically,  when there are others who offer quality artwork at a similar or lower price?

There's a good reason why I don't show up more on Artstation (not enough clientele / had to compete in a tank full of S-tier sharks) and Amino (too bothersome to haggle with cheapskates / compete with $1~5 commission offers)


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## Vinfang (May 30, 2020)

Miles Marsalis said:


> There are ways to work the system, so to speak.
> 
> 1. You can take out an advertisement on the main site and besides building that viewer base from all the people who randomly click to ad to see your work, you'll get an influx of customers. I know people who have taken out ads for various endeavors and it increased their traffic as well business. The prices are reasonable for banner ads too, this can be cost effective. I'm probably going to do it myself to promote a book I'm going to try to self-publish.
> 
> ...



Yes, keeping returning clients happy goes a long way. They would recommend you to their friends,  if you did them a good job.


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## Liseran Thistle (May 30, 2020)

I don't have many "repeat" customers, by which I mean they're nonexistent. And many art websites where I could sell art don't do commission type artwork. I'm not selling pieces I'm trying to sell commissions, and by packing up and moving to yet ANOTHER website I'm back at square one with no one wanting to buy my artwork. I don't have the money to spend on adspace, I don't have the money for business cards, all these "tips" are just people telling me to spend more money!

This is very frustrating! I just came here to vent, not to hear the same lectures that everyone else in my life keeps giving me!

I have tried everything, there is nothing I could do that could help me possibly make money off of my artwork and it sucks, okay! I don't want to have to beg people to commission me or make people do it out of pity, and I know for a fact going Inbox to Inbox won't work because how many people do you turn away who come to YOUR doorstep asking you to buy something from them? Literally almost all of them! Door to Door salesmen are dead for a reason, its because it doesn't _work!_

I don't have an audience, it's damn near impossible to get one without having to spend exorbitant amounts of money in order to gain one, and the only people even interested in my artwork are people who want me to draw gross porn and fucking moochers!


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## KD142000 (May 30, 2020)

I suppose I could help a little by creating a journal so my watchers can see? That's about the best I can do outside of commissioning you myself (which I am very tempted to and may just do that now). I liked the request you did for me.

As for other advice...I'm afraid I can't give that.


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## Miles Marsalis (May 30, 2020)

Liseran Thistle said:


> I don't have many "repeat" customers, by which I mean they're nonexistent. And many art websites where I could sell art don't do commission type artwork. I'm not selling pieces I'm trying to sell commissions, and by packing up and moving to yet ANOTHER website I'm back at square one with no one wanting to buy my artwork. I don't have the money to spend on adspace, I don't have the money for business cards, all these "tips" are just people telling me to spend more money!
> 
> This is very frustrating! I just came here to vent, not to hear the same lectures that everyone else in my life keeps giving me!
> 
> ...


A minor point of clarification, I meant you would probably be better served maintaining commission services on the big AND small sites to increase your exposure. I also recommended those sites because I know there is demand for commissions there. 

However, have you considered maybe look for a project to join where someone needs an artist potentially?


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## BrightEyedDeviants (May 30, 2020)

I know nothing about business, so there's nothing I can provide you as advice in that field. And, as far as I see, you aren't interested in hearing it anyway


> This is very frustrating! I just came here to vent, not to hear the same lectures that everyone else in my life keeps giving me!


Which is valid! Everyone needs to rant a bit every now and then. But I think you should keep two things in mind:

First off, competence is atrocious. Who wouldn't want to live off commissions? Who wouldn't at least earn enough to indulge in some mindless spending with the extra income commissions could give? Plenty of people here, on Deviantart, and in almost any artistic field thinks that way. So be prepared, it won't be easy and only those who keep going no matter what, for as long as needed, end up finding success. So, keep going! It's not the moment to stop. Also, you need to think, as someone pointed above, what can you offer that makes you different from the miriad of other starting artists? What can you offer that would make someone think twice if they should commission this more or less known artist who they can trust or you, who are just starting? It may be something special in your art, or it could be the next point.

Have you heard the infamous quote "Caesar's wife must not just be honourable, but must appear to be so?". Offer professionalism. Offer open communication and willingness to communicate, to listen and to speak your mind in a proper way. Offer them the chance to trust you, to know you. And to do so, I think you could improve a little bit your FA profile by adding some info. Add something about you, participate more and share what you think. And, and I don't want to sound like an asshole, but try to avoid this kind of outbursts, because I think commissioners want to feel secure, they want to know that the person they are investing their money in is reliable and strong. Some people might find that you aren't tough enough, that you can't work under pressure and that you aren't too patient, a few things that, they think, could affect the resulting piece. Rant with your friends, or with some people you have trust (and if you feel like you don't have anyone, my notes are open for you if you need to vent, I'll be there to listen and even try to make you laugh), but avoid ranting in the places that people might be visiting in order to find someone, even someone new, to commission.

And, overall, try to have fun with what you do. As with love, "desperation" drives people away. Do art for fun, for you, for those you care about and share it. And of course, let it be known that you offer commissions too, but don't set that as a main goal. And if you do, then try to set yourself attainable goals so once you hit them (because trust me, if you keep trying, you will) you feel happy enough to face though times again until you hit the next.

With this said, I hope you finally get some commissions. And keep up the good work!


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## Vinfang (May 30, 2020)

BrightEyedDeviants said:


> I know nothing about business, so there's nothing I can provide you as advice in that field. And, as far as I see, you aren't interested in hearing it anyway
> 
> Which is valid! Everyone needs to rant a bit every now and then. But I think you should keep two things in mind:
> 
> ...



I totally agree, looking back 5 yrs and you will notice your efforts and hard work paid off.


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## JustAlex1997 (May 30, 2020)

Especially during a pandemic where jobs have been lost, free things are very tempting. Even without a pandemic, people accept gifts they normally wouldn't view as worth their money. If you drew your profile photo, you seem to be a competent artist. However, competent art doesn't automatically make people want to spend their money.

You made an offer and people accepted it. It may have been nice for those people to have thrown a few bucks your way, but that's their choice to make. You would've only been entitled to their money had you put a price tag on the art you made for them.


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## oappo (May 31, 2020)

ConorHyena said:


> I think free art is going to hurt your marketing down the line because it breeds the wrong type of audience (those that want freebies)


This.  In my experience the quality of customer is dictated by the price of art. At least to a moderate degree.  If you offer free art, you'll only get people with no money to spend. You'll get the "wtf why do I have to pay you" types.
Twitter is huge for art, so that might be something worth considering. Perhaps tumblr.




Liseran Thistle said:


> 'm not doing free art requests ever again because it tells me that the people who come to those threads over and over again are disingenuous when they say my art is good.


They probably are. Not saying that your art is bad(it's perfectly fine), but as I said above,some of the people who get for free art tend to compliment the artist in hopes of getting them more amenable to a request. It's a common tactic of art beggers. Quality of the art is irrelevant.


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## Liseran Thistle (May 31, 2020)

oappo said:


> This.  In my experience the quality of customer is dictated by the price of art. At least to a moderate degree.  If you offer free art, you'll only get people with no money to spend. You'll get the "wtf why do I have to pay you" types.
> Twitter is huge for art, so that might be something worth considering. Perhaps tumblr.
> 
> 
> ...



that doesn't make me really feel any better, sounds like they're just lying to me about how good they think my artwork is in order to get free shit from me.


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## PercyD (May 31, 2020)

I feel you here, bab~.

But I will say that there are furries who will pay for art. You will just never get to them through offering free art. Free art is good for (1) building your portfolio and (2) practicing some techniques-- thats it.
It's not a marketing tool.

I also do not draw cutesy "uwu" furry art. Everyone is hairy, different shapes and sizes, and my lineart is rough. But I have plenty of people who appreciate my art for it's uniqueness. c:
Just build a proper portfolio.


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## Deleted member 82554 (May 31, 2020)

I will never do a lot of things every again every time too. But I have mixed feeling aboot it.


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## TyraWadman (May 31, 2020)

*1. Stop doing freebies for the love of god, it's not the way to go. XD
2. Be patient. Be active. And instead of uploading screenshots of your prices, upload actual images!
*
You don't have to be an A-lister to make money, I have seen people bragging about how they spent $100 on a kids MS paint art of a cat, and the guy still somehow made a lot of money, but he also catered to a particular audience. To us, it might seem foolish or fetish-based, but he clearly enjoyed it, or had the willpower to rake in the cash. That being said, I feel like you just need to focus on uploading more, whether it be traditional, digital, or both. Create for yourself and perhaps your audience will flock because of your original content? 

Since no one is commissioning you, use this free time to study and develop your style. Some people don't want to buy from someone that doesn't put out consistent work. And also, years ago, I was jumping from software's and someone actually thought I was commissioning artwork of my OC's when it was just me exploring techniques and styles.

You only know how to draw hands in 2-3 poses and in some pictures they're completely hidden. You have  works that have smooth lines and others where they are rough and sketch-like with stray pixels all around. Sometimes there is colour in the lines, sometimes it is out. It's too easy to tell when you're referencing things- like FNAF or (I wanna safely assume) Steven Universe. It's also too easy to tell when you're not, which is a bit of a red flag for people that happen to notice.


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## Bluefiremark II (May 31, 2020)

I think SOME free requests are good to do for people, it helps out those without cash and can help let people know about you, just don't do it TOO much, if you're wanting commission that is. In that case, do SOME free, then advertise commissions- or, link free with commissions, say- a free art raffle and the winners also get a discount. Or, maybe just free art and if someone guesses 1-100 number they get a discount for commissions later if they choose to. 

For me, I'm glad i got free art so i have SOME art, cuz i didn't have online cash for a long time. Now that i do, I've looked at getting things, including those who've given free art away ^^


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## redhusky (May 31, 2020)

I MASSIVELY scaled back freebies because of ungratefulness from the community in general it would foster and divisions it could sow. I would also draw many, many sketches for forum happenings but this fostered a type of "If you don't draw for me too you're being 'cliquey'." Or sometimes people would pretend to be friendly to get art or the people I would scribble for to get to me.

Also, I would also do free art as contests prizes on another forum and the people I did prize art for didn't even share my work around. So one even knew that I was doing it in the first place. Which is double bad since that's what I was asking for as payment from all parties involved.

It's all a really dispiriting situation. So unless I know you VERY well and for only a few people would I ever even CONSIDER doing free art for.

So here are my tips to any artists looking to do "causal" freebies


If someone gives you an idea draw YOUR character in the situation not theirs. 

Only draw for a few "special" people and make sure you know them well enough. 

If you do draw for someone make sure they share the work around so you get you work out there. Just posting it in their gallery is enough for me. 

As an exception do occasionally so some free scribbles but take it no further than some sketchwork and if they want more then have them pay.

Stay safe and more importantly respect yourself.


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## zentt (May 31, 2020)

Have you ever heard the term “starving artist”? It exists because being a successful artist can be just as hard as being a successful actor. Countless examples of success, but behind every successful person is a hundred more who were more or less forced to move on. It is the dream job and not everyone gets there. I’m not saying to give up! Not at all. But I am saying you need to quit sitting there with your arms crossed, throwing a pity party because your dream hasn’t just arrived like you thought it would. Get a day job and keep trying. In my experience with life, success comes after about the third or fourth time when many people would have given up.


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## redhusky (May 31, 2020)

zentt said:


> Have you ever heard the term “starving artist”? It exists because being a successful artist can be just as hard as being a successful actor. Countless examples of success, but behind every successful person is a hundred more who were more or less forced to move on. It is the dream job and not everyone gets there. I’m not saying to give up! Not at all. But I am saying you need to quit sitting there with your arms crossed, throwing a pity party because your dream hasn’t just arrived like you thought it would. Get a day job and keep trying. In my experience with life, success comes after about the third or fourth time when many people would have given up.


Good pints. In my experience, most of the artists that fail is due to not specializing and not being consistent/maintaining a following. Both of those things take years to start up and must be consistently maintained. Like brushing your teeth, you don't just do it once in your life. You must brush you teeth everyday, in fact, several times a day, if needed.


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## Deleted member 132067 (May 31, 2020)

I had good experiences with free sketches from artists, from the standpoint of a commissioner. Like every person I thought "free stuff of my sona, sign me up!"
But after I received the completed sketch I felt like that while it was very well done, I was left wanting more because I really liked what I was seeing. So I commissioned the same person to get something done for me.


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## BunBunArt (May 31, 2020)

Mmmm it's complicated. In marketing giving free samples is to allow people "taste" your product and if they enjoy it and want more, they'd have to buy it next time. The problem is that for artists there are waaaay too many free art offers out there so for this to work, your art must stand out among all the other artists. 
In my case, it didn't work to get commissioners so I used it to advertise my comic instead, drawing people's characters with the main character of my comic. And that actually worked to build an audience. I wasn't selling anything for money, comic is free and the only thing they have to pay for is IF they want extra stuff. 

I think giving away free art isn't the best option unless you use it well. Do raffles for example, that will bring you new users and maybe SOME of them will stay for your art and eventually commission you. In my experience and from what I've seen for other artists... it's a very small % of people from your followers that will want to commission you, so you'll need to grow you audience first of all, and most important, appreciante EVERYONE, not just the commissioners... some people really enjoy our art and they show it in different ways but they just can't afford commissions, so little events like raffes are quite a nice details to show them they're important. ^^


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## Nanominyo (May 31, 2020)

Here’s a few things I learned if you don’t do nsfw to get traffic your way:

1) Do fanart
You may think: but I wanna draw my OCs! Which you can. But you gotta mix it up with fanart - even in the furry community! This will bring attention towards you. I’ve done this trick on both Instagram, tumblr, Twitter and have done it a little on furaffinity! Every time you had a steady growth of followers are you gonna push the: I do commissions.
Now I’ve been one of the lucky artists who have been able to do commissions for games to my computer but some of these games are still $90 which is pretty okay-

2) Have a main specie and spam the category with faves on furaffinity 
This may seem like a really dumb thing but overall it actually helps.
Taking myself as an ex. 
My main specie is equines. I say this in my bio on furaffinity and then tell I’m also able to do other mammals. 
With this knowledge I’ve gone on to spamlike (I’m so sorry) the horses category - but of course holding myself from liking what goes over board in their weird ass kinks. Which there is a lot of in the equines category (bc every horse gotta have big d*ck!) but even then I’ve gained a lot of traffic my way and gained followers that way. Some may ghostfollow me bc I liked their stuff while others will go and like my stuff every time I post. 
I’m not big on furaffinity but I’m still trying to make people aware I exist.
On tumblr I use same marketing strategy. I spamlike a category there belongs to the latest art I’ve posted. 
Beside getting traffic to my latest post can I also get lots of new followers. I’ve currently had another spike the past week and gotten about 80 new followers on tumblr over a piece of fanart I’ve done. I’m not big but at least I’m steadily growing and in the future when I post do many see my art and still like.

Twitter and marketing
This is a beanbag of finding the lucky one. I’ve only currently had a smaller growth (I say as I’ve just gone from 30 followers in the start of the week to 100 followers).
I’ve found out the trick here is to find a big community who doesn’t seem to have much fanart popping up in the tags every day. This helps create traffic and the followers will then go on to see your other art.
Before I only received 1 like on my posts from a friend of mine who always support me. Now I get between 5-15 likes and while this is small numbers is it nice to see it grow as I’ve finally cracked the code.

Instagram and random spamliking
If you like every pic in a tag are Instagram gonna shadowban you for 24 hours!
But a lot of my followers comes from me doing randomspamliking where I like about every 4-5th picture in a tag. This is purposely done to make it look like a real person actually liking what people post. I don’t always do bc it’s not the most wonderful memes or art - but it puts traffic my way.

Facebook: 
Properly where I have the biggest luck selling SFW furry artwork. It’s slow though and there is literally no marketing skills and all you can do is sit and wait. But I get a commissions about every 3rd month from Facebook. I wish it was quicker but Facebook is not really up to my style unfortunately.

The only thing you’ve done is marketing wrong. Freebies create a child audience while serious fanart, spamliking, and once in a while commenting make traffic go your way. Eventually some of these folks who see your art and see you got commissions will commission you!


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## redhusky (May 31, 2020)

Nanominyo said:


> Here’s a few things I learned if you don’t do nsfw to get traffic your way:
> 
> 1) Do fanart
> You may think: but I wanna draw my OCs! Which you can. But you gotta mix it up with fanart - even in the furry community! This will bring attention towards you. I’ve done this trick on both Instagram, tumblr, Twitter and have done it a little on furaffinity! Every time you had a steady growth of followers are you gonna push the: I do commissions.
> ...


Nice post! I think I'll steal it!


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## redhusky (May 31, 2020)

Also, in terms of building a following my best advice is to join a community, such as a forum or chanboard, and be a regular. And make sure to GENUINELY interact with them. People will know if you are faking "community" and they really, REALLY don't like it. If you can get along with them and your work "clicks" with them they will aid you in getting you're work seen. I have several people already posting up my work on imageboards and boorus for me just because we get along well. In fact, I didn't even ask them to do so in the first place they just did it as out of the goodness of their hearts. That kind of community goodwill is what will be required to get your work out there and attract business at all regardless what it is. The type of success you see is next to impossible to do alone. Every successful, top tier artist has an entourage to help them with this sort of thing. If they didn't they'd have no time left to draw, yes?


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## Nanominyo (May 31, 2020)

redhusky said:


> Nice post! I think I'll steal it!


It's just a few tricks I've learned through my time. I forgot to mention use groups on facebook but yeah-

Also people are more likely to buy a gamecode than send money bc then they know where the money went. I think I've gotten like... a few games and lots of expansions to said games this way. Unfortunately I don't have a gaming computer so currently I can't play a lot of these games... not that it matters that much...


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## redhusky (May 31, 2020)

Nanominyo said:


> It's just a few tricks I've learned through my time. I forgot to mention use groups on facebook but yeah-
> 
> Also people are more likely to buy a gamecode than send money bc then they know where the money went. I think I've gotten like... a few games and lots of expansions to said games this way. Unfortunately I don't have a gaming computer so currently I can't play a lot of these games... not that it matters that much...


The fan art one is something everyone should and I used to for awhile, neopets and pokemon for me. But I haven't in so long! X3I'm trying to figure out what to get into next or simply go back to one of those but I want to pick something that will last so I can stay long term established, for business reasons. 

Same for me with the game codes and sometimes I take gift codes from amazon or steam.


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## spontaneite (May 31, 2020)

Nanominyo said:


> Here’s a few things I learned if you don’t do nsfw to get traffic your way:
> 
> 2) Have a main specie and spam the category with faves on furaffinity



This is helpful advice, thank you. I'll be sure to keep it in mind once I get started.


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## Nanominyo (May 31, 2020)

redhusky said:


> The fan art one is something everyone should and I used to for awhile, neopets and pokemon for me. But I haven't in so long! X3I'm trying to figure out what to get into next or simply go back to one of those but I want to pick something that will last so I can stay long term established, for business reasons.
> 
> Same for me with the game codes and sometimes I take gift codes from amazon or steam.


Well there is many furry fandoms:
Beastars, BNA, balto, Disney, Pokemon, neopets, MLP, sonic and god who knows.
BNA right now is still warm and liked and all the characters is over 18 in the main episodes (though some backstory have them at 16). Unfortunately that community is ruled by Antis on tumblr but are a very safe thing on twitter thanks to the japanese community. (Also yes it's literally named BNA)


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## Nanominyo (May 31, 2020)

spontaneite said:


> This is helpful advice, thank you. I'll be sure to keep it in mind once I get started.


It works slowly but it works somehow? I will say that out of 100 you get like 10 things in traffic (either likes, watch, comments or shouts) so it's a very long and annoying prcess if you don't have the time.


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## redhusky (May 31, 2020)

spontaneite said:


> This is helpful advice, thank you. I'll be sure to keep it in mind once I get started.


Yes, this thread is getting very educational for all involved, wouldn't you agree.


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## redhusky (May 31, 2020)

Nanominyo said:


> Well there is many furry fandoms:
> Beastars, BNA, balto, Disney, Pokemon, neopets, MLP, sonic and god who knows.
> BNA right now is still warm and liked and all the characters is over 18 in the main episodes (though some backstory have them at 16). Unfortunately that community is ruled by Antis on tumblr but are a very safe thing on twitter thanks to the japanese community. (Also yes it's literally named BNA)


TUMBLRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR! *RAGE* 
I heard of BNA But not gotten the time to watch, any good?


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## Nanominyo (May 31, 2020)

redhusky said:


> TUMBLRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR! *RAGE*
> I heard of BNA But not gotten the time to watch, any good?



It's okay? I've watched it, made some fanart - tricked tumblr into thinking my shipping art was friendship art. 
The show itself is between trigger's better shows. At least they are not trying to go to space. 
It has a few pacing problems around episode 10-12 though and the Antis are trying to justify the character called Nazuna isn't a narcissist. That all I really can tell you.
They pulled a Kray on the main villain (Which I had predicted) and his goal again comes out of the blue? (Honestly their twist villians doesn't work).
It looks good and the animation is good and a lot of what they do is meme worthy really-
I just like the designs-


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## redhusky (May 31, 2020)

Nanominyo said:


> It's okay? I've watched it, made some fanart - tricked tumblr into thinking my shipping art was friendship art.
> The show itself is between trigger's better shows. At least they are not trying to go to space.
> It has a few pacing problems around episode 10-12 though and the Antis are trying to justify the character called Nazuna isn't a narcissist. That all I really can tell you.
> They pulled a Kray on the main villain (Which I had predicted) and his goal again comes out of the blue? (Honestly their twist villians doesn't work).
> ...


Whoa whoa! Be careful! Shipping is dangerous business! Are you sure you're ready for something like that!?


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## Water Draco (May 31, 2020)

Doing a limited quantities of free art can be a way to have a portfolio of examples of work you have done to show perspective commissioners what you can do. 

Also you should be using these finished works to promote what you can do across social media platforms to encourage others to commission you.

Doing something for free is always a gamble and as such it is always worth keeping the mindset that there is always the possibility that it does not pay off.

I understand what you mean because I have noticed the activity by the same furs always trying to claim all the free art slots with out ever commissioning any one themselves. Or even take the time themselves to promote the artists work. It is just unfortunate in some instances that greed happens to be part of there nature. 

When doing giveaways it is worth setting out in the terms so that the artist still has control over who gets to receive the slot for art. Not just give it away to the first that responded.


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## DingRawD (May 31, 2020)

Water Draco said:


> Doing a limited quantities of free art can be a way to have a portfolio of examples of work you have done to show perspective commissioners what you can do.
> 
> Also you should be using these finished works to promote what you can do across social media platforms to encourage others to commission you.
> 
> ...


Beat me to it! Exactly the same point I was going to make


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## GreyCatfish (May 31, 2020)

Just my two cents...
Drawing free stuff is not a bad thing, it can be beneficial in some way. Just draw characters/things that you find interesting and draw them purely on your terms. It's a good way to practice and to show your works around if you care about exposure or statistics. People are generally ungrateful and very opportunistic - just be the same :3 It works perfectly.
I know nothing about drawing/selling commissions, but I saw few people with pretty bad art selling it for a really good $ so marketing and promoting your art is the key here.
Complaining will get you nowhere.


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## TyraWadman (Jun 1, 2020)

Glad to see you took my advice!


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## PercyD (Jun 2, 2020)

Bluefiremark II said:


> I think SOME free requests are good to do for people, it helps out those without cash and can help let people know about you, just don't do it TOO much, if you're wanting commission that is. In that case, do SOME free, then advertise commissions- or, link free with commissions, say- a free art raffle and the winners also get a discount. Or, maybe just free art and if someone guesses 1-100 number they get a discount for commissions later if they choose to.
> 
> For me, I'm glad i got free art so i have SOME art, cuz i didn't have online cash for a long time. Now that i do, I've looked at getting things, including those who've given free art away ^^


I'm glad things have gotten better for you, but, most people looking for freebies never buy. 99% of the time, in fact. 

Also, it might sound really harsh but it's not our job as artists to 'help people out' with free art.
If free art is given, it's given because the artist _wants _to give it. It's absolutely never given because it's asked for. Art is not like water or food, after all. Art is a luxury item that takes a certain level of labor to make. 

Demanding free art from an artist is like taking food out of their mouth. ESPECIALLY since a lot of artists operate at a loss.  The time they devote to free art is time they could be using for something else.


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## PercyD (Jun 2, 2020)

Nanominyo said:


> Instagram and random spamliking
> If you like every pic in a tag are Instagram gonna shadowban you for 24 hours!
> But a lot of my followers comes from me doing randomspamliking where I like about every 4-5th picture in a tag. This is purposely done to make it look like a real person actually liking what people post. I don’t always do bc it’s not the most wonderful memes or art - but it puts traffic my way.
> 
> ...



Drop your Facebook groups/pages, and your insta maybe~? c:


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## reptile logic (Jun 2, 2020)

I am not a visual artist. I rely on others to bring my ideas to light; in the form of portraits, illustrations and the like. I have not once asked for free work. Every piece has been paid for with cash or some form of trade. Because of this, I can be very particular when hiring artists for a commission.

I understand why someone might want to offer free art, for the exposure; I have given away books for the exposure. That said, these offers have not once enticed me to buy from a particular artist.

There are people who will take anything, as long as it comes at no cost to them. Those that do buy art need examples to look at, but don't need freebies to entice them to buy.


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## Nanominyo (Jun 2, 2020)

PercyD said:


> Drop your Facebook groups/pages, and your insta maybe~? c:



What I meant with Facebook is their algorithm will absolutely destroy you. You won’t be on the front page unless you interact a lot. Their old algorithm with the newest posts first was much better but that’s not how it works anymore :/

(And if you meant for me to drop my page/insta is it Nanominyoarts (fb) and Nanominyo (insta). I use furry groups, humanoid groups, oc groups etc to share art though.)


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## Bluefiremark II (Jun 2, 2020)

PercyD said:


> I'm glad things have gotten better for you, but, most people looking for freebies never buy. 99% of the time, in fact.
> 
> Also, it might sound really harsh but it's not our job as artists to 'help people out' with free art.
> If free art is given, it's given because the artist _wants _to give it. It's absolutely never given because it's asked for. Art is not like water or food, after all. Art is a luxury item that takes a certain level of labor to make.
> ...


Well duh i never said you should demand it, it's just nice to help hand out some free art on your own time with your own choice, and as previously mentioned not TOO often. It can help you practice as well as make it possoble for some to get art, yes majoritively they don't come back for paying but if you're only a crappy artist they're probably out wanting a really good one or they just don't have the cash, others may like your art and just not want to pay and others will like it and go back for it. Besides, unlike irl advertising the only thing this costs is time. And you don't have to do it, are held no responsibility to finish things for it or anything. It's just a free thing you chose to do~

So do whatcha like, do it or not, personally I'm glad i was able to get art of characters i would otherwise never get to see visualized due to money issues. Now i have plenty, and bought multiple times ^^ but anyway, yeah you're BUT argument isn't really an argument to me since i never agreed with the opposing of what you said~ quoting me wasn't really neccessary for that :3


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## Stray Cat Terry (Jun 2, 2020)

I agree on free art =/= help your business on commissions.

I know how you feel, I experienced the same on DA. When I open commissions, not a single person knocks at my door. But when I do free requests, tons and tons of people that I haven't even expected swarm into my page. (Even though I declared that my freebies have lower qualities than commissions)

The fact that this happens is indeed not a pleasant thing. However, if you do want to get people that are willing to spend cash on your work, you're inviting the wrong types of people.

Further, for the NSFW stuff: You know it's not easy to find NSFW, maybe even commissions. People who are likely desperate (and with no free cash to spend) may ask you that. But it's ok, since it's up to you, and it's a freebie, you can skip those you don't feel like working on. No pressure.

Before concluding that people praise your work only for free arts, you may think again if those people really are those buyers you wanna see. Because, they usually aren't. No offense, but just telling you the fact. Don't dig on the dunes when you want water. Instead, go to rivers and ponds.

I know, you may occasionally dig out an oasis in the desert, but that doesn't really happen so often.

Again, I feel you. Hope you find your way!


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## PercyD (Jun 2, 2020)

Bluefiremark II said:


> Well duh i never said you should demand it, it's just nice to help hand out some free art on your own time with your own choice, and as previously mentioned not TOO often. It can help you practice as well as make it possoble for some to get art, yes majoritively they don't come back for paying but if you're only a crappy artist they're probably out wanting a really good one or they just don't have the cash, others may like your art and just not want to pay and others will like it and go back for it. Besides, unlike irl advertising the only thing this costs is time. And you don't have to do it, are held no responsibility to finish things for it or anything. It's just a free thing you chose to do~
> 
> So do whatcha like, do it or not, personally I'm glad i was able to get art of characters i would otherwise never get to see visualized due to money issues. Now i have plenty, and bought multiple times ^^ but anyway, yeah you're BUT argument isn't really an argument to me since i never agreed with the opposing of what you said~ quoting me wasn't really neccessary for that :3


Its not really an argument tbh. It's a statement that pretains to what you were saying. Artists don't have to 'help out' any one, nor should that be the goal or focus. 

If you're annoyed by this somehow then... ???


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## PercyD (Jun 2, 2020)

Nanominyo said:


> What I meant with Facebook is their algorithm will absolutely destroy you. You won’t be on the front page unless you interact a lot. Their old algorithm with the newest posts first was much better but that’s not how it works anymore :/
> 
> (And if you meant for me to drop my page/insta is it Nanominyoarts (fb) and Nanominyo (insta). I use furry groups, humanoid groups, oc groups etc to share art though.)


Lol, yea, I meant for you to drop your pages~. I'll follow you there.
Could you name drop some FB groups you in too? I've been looking for some.

I was watching a thing about SM algorithms the other night. It was basically about democratizing the algorithms so that its easier for content with fewer views to get seen. And how, like, things only get seen when theres a lot of traffic on it.

Just because it has a lot of traffic doesn't mean that it's good content...


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## Bluefiremark II (Jun 2, 2020)

PercyD said:


> Its not really an argument tbh. It's a statement that pretains to what you were saying. Artists don't have to 'help out' any one, nor should that be the goal or focus.
> 
> If you're annoyed by this somehow then... ???


Kinda annoyed but not much, you're just saying something to me in a way that implied i believed or said things that i did not, so it didn't really apply to me


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## Rayd (Jun 3, 2020)

it's your choice whether you want to do free art or not, if you don't want to - don't, it's as simple as that. there's a lesson to be learned here, and it's that you're not owed commissions from the people that got a freebie from you just because _you chose_ to draw them something for free. it's blunt but it's the truth. you can't give someone a product for free with no strings attached and then judge them if they don't come back to buy more of it. that's not really fair.

if your current way of marketing isn't working and you're frustrated about it, try something else and move on.

if you're doing this for money and it's not working and you're frustrated about it, try something else and move on.


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## Nanominyo (Jun 3, 2020)

PercyD said:


> Lol, yea, I meant for you to drop your pages~. I'll follow you there.
> Could you name drop some FB groups you in too? I've been looking for some.
> 
> I was watching a thing about SM algorithms the other night. It was basically about democratizing the algorithms so that its easier for content with fewer views to get seen. And how, like, things only get seen when theres a lot of traffic on it.
> ...



I’m one of the mods in “The Furry Corner”
The “Furry” group there is are... questionable and not bc they have some weird posts but because they got too many rules so it’s not fun.
I’m also in The “Humanoid Art” group
“DrawHouse” group. 
I guess \(•-•)/


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## Punkedsolar (Jun 4, 2020)

Hmm.  I understand the frustration, but depending on how you feel, you may need to just do art for yourself.  I have a family member who is a paid commercial artist - and watching them work, I can say absolutely that advertising, marketing, and constantly connecting with publishers and producers is a skill all by itself.  It takes research, interest, and constant work.  In fact, although my relative has won multiple industry awards (and they are VERY good at both ultra-realism and sequential art), they still have to dog it in a way that I just don't have the energy to do.

I love art.  While I'm out of practice, and only just getting back into it, I'm okay.  I've been paid as a graphic designer before.  I've done book covers, gaming company illustrations, etc.  But you need to be completely relentless at self-promotion, and it will really, really frustrate you - as will the pay, which is generally extremely poor unless you hit rockstar status (same reason as computer game programmers - they're expected to love the job so much that terrible pay is acceptable).  

I gave up a while back, because I didn't have the stomach for what I needed to do to make it as a commercial artist - 12 hour days, endless revisions, understanding the taxation implications.  Sometimes I regret that choice.  Heck, I'm even finding it hard to arrange trades.  I don't do NSFW stuff, and I'm a relative unknown, and that seems to scare off potential trades.

You may need to work out what makes you happy, and the trade off may suck (I often wish I could get paid for art).  On the other hand, my family member had to redraw an entire 24 pages of sequential comic art because the editor got persnickety about _*one *_of the characters and how they looked.  I'd lose my mind completely if I had to throw away two months of work that magically became unpaid because it didn't meet the standard.

A commercial artist is someone who makes the average marketing exec look lazy.


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## Punk_M0nitor (Jun 9, 2020)

Liseran Thistle said:


> I'm gonna be blunt and say I hate having to try and market myself to furries here because no one here wants to actually buy my artwork.
> 
> It feels like if I open for free requests I get tons of people asking me for free artwork, but do those same people ever think about getting a commission done? No, they don't. Those same people are so quick to go "Oh yes, I would definitely like it if you drew this character for me for free"



Free requests will hurt your business. I know this from experience. People want free art because, let's face it, _everyone_ wants free stuff, and if all you're marketing is free stuff, that's what people are going to expect. Your audience will be confused and surprised that you suddenly expect payment when they've been able to get art for free this whole time. That's just the unfortunate truth.


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## Punk_M0nitor (Jun 11, 2020)

Punkedsolar said:


> But you need to be completely relentless at self-promotion, and it will really, really frustrate you - as will the pay, which is generally extremely poor unless you hit rockstar status (same reason as computer game programmers - they're expected to love the job so much that terrible pay is acceptable).



I absolutely concur. I’m a very small artist—I have a considerably insignificant following on FurAffinity and just under 300 followers on Instagram—and it took me several years to start gaining traction with commissions. That’s years of advertising and self-promotions for zero payoff. 

My pay is still abysmal and I get shit for charging because ‘artists should share their talent for free’, no matter how low my prices are. Being a commercial artist is a _very_ difficult occupation. The fact of the matter is that not enough people respect art as an occupation enough to pay for the service, and because it is a luxury instead of a necessity, those who do respect it might not have the money to spare on things they don’t need.


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## Fallowfox (Jun 11, 2020)

Liseran Thistle said:


> I'm gonna be blunt and say I hate having to try and market myself to furries here because no one here wants to actually buy my artwork.
> 
> It feels like if I open for free requests I get tons of people asking me for free artwork, but do those same people ever think about getting a commission done? No, they don't. Those same people are so quick to go "Oh yes, I would definitely like it if you drew this character for me for free"
> 
> ...



This was also my experience. If you offer free services people will come expecting free content. 
I even remember one person asking me if, considering they'd had free work from me before, if they could have a discount on a future commission...as if I would give them money off because they'd already had something for free.


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## Punkedsolar (Jun 11, 2020)

Fallowfox said:


> This was also my experience. If you offer free services people will come expecting free content.
> I even remember one person asking me if, considering they'd had free work from me before, if they could have a discount on a future commission...as if I would give them money off because they'd already had something for free.



Grosssssssss.


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## Narri (Jun 19, 2020)

A suggestion (though it may be more difficult now with Covid) (Where I am things are getting close to being back to normal. Everythings opening again so please take what I say with a grain of salt here and apply it to your own situation and community)

Have you thought about general design work for local businesses in your local community? For instance that pizza shop down the road that's been there for years and the logo hasn't changed? Contact them and offer your services to them. A lot of these places may be wanting to rebrand or something. Be proactive and professional. If you make a good enough impression they will come to you.

What other niches are you into besides furries? You could be into skateboarding and make custom board designs. Or whatever.


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## Valryth (Jun 19, 2020)

Narri said:


> A suggestion (though it may be more difficult now with Covid) (Where I am things are getting close to being back to normal. Everythings opening again so please take what I say with a grain of salt here and apply it to your own situation and community)
> 
> Have you thought about general design work for local businesses in your local community? For instance that pizza shop down the road that's been there for years and the logo hasn't changed? Contact them and offer your services to them. A lot of these places may be wanting to rebrand or something. Be proactive and professional. If you make a good enough impression they will come to you.
> 
> What other niches are you into besides furries? You could be into skateboarding and make custom board designs. Or whatever.



This is really important advice, I cannot stress it enough! It doesn't even have to be something IRL if you're too shy for that, there are a lot of different people, brands and businesses online that may just be looking for your skills, and as it's free, there doesn't seem to be much to lose! You'll be able to build a portfolio where you can say that you have done all of these "professional" jobs, _fancy, huh?
_
Something to consider is that there are many small people who can use your help as they too are trying to climb their way up. I'm going to give you a random example (Narri who I'm quoting already gave you many!), let's consider a small-medium musician that is only starting to put out their stuff on niche places like SoundCloud or even just posting things on social media. Their stuff has potential, and hey, maybe you even fancy it a little! Why not contact them and offer to design a cover for one of their next singles? At best you're going to be the reason why future fans think of that song as "the song with the cool cover", and since you're appealing to a niche (small musicians usually meet hang out with each other, even if just by superficial internet interactions) you may have other people think "hey, this artist does this and I like the idea, maybe it's an affordable option for my own tracks?" and before you know it you've made your way into a little thing you can call your own! Now you're widely known for doing awesome album artwork, while having your own unique style. Pretty cool! At worst, you've just made someone with little resources to invest in big designers quite happy and probably made their day!

I guess I took way too long to explain something that's probably quite clear at this point! But believe me when I say that things work this way, you need to be *proactive* and find opportunities, not just wait for them to appear in front of you. I've had my own share of experiences when it comes to this, and I'm more than happy about taking that step into the dark room without knowing if I'd be somewhere I want to or not.

(Great advice Narri!)


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