# HELP!!  Thoughts on Macbooks?



## ~XanderFox~ (Jun 18, 2009)

I am thinking about getting a macbook, but I am also thinking about getting a fujitsu.  
What are personal Exp. with both, or one or the other?
Anything helps here!
Thanks!


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## Xenke (Jun 18, 2009)

Fujitsu what? It's a company, not a computer.


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## CodArk2 (Jun 18, 2009)

well, i dont own a fujitsu so i cant say a lot about them specifically, though i have owned mac and windows laptops and desktops. 

macbooks have recently been updated and had a price drop, and are fairly well priced for something from an OEM(not something you build, those are always cheaper). They are long lasting and reliable. You can run windows on a mac as well. The cheapest macbook is $999.

Windows laptops are cheaper up front, but usually they need to be replaced every 2  or 3 years while macs can go twice as long easily. Macs also don't have viruses and malware like windows does. Macs tend to be more user friendly as well, and tech support is better.

it really depends on what you want to do with your laptop. macs cant pkay the latest games, but they tend to be good for creative types. Windows is compatible with pretty much anything, but they get way more viruses and malware. Macs are more reliable but cant be upgraded too much...There are pros and cons to both, i named very few. I would go with the mac unless you are a gamer, need something that is compatable with almost everything(software, printers,etc), need to or want to frequently upgrade your computer, or save a little bit.


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## ~XanderFox~ (Jun 18, 2009)

Thank you both for the quick responses, sorry about not clarifying Fujitsu Lifebook.
I guess I should have also stated what I was planing on using it for, I am going to be going to college soon, and need a good computer for writing papers as well as doing some gaming on the side, and when I say some gaming I mean like the type where you stay up untill 4 in the morning. ^-^   
Knowing that, what is the better one?  
if I need to clarify any more please, by all means let me know!


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## Xenke (Jun 18, 2009)

Comparing the two (basic MacBook and the LifeBook S7220):

The LifeBook has a slightly faster processor
The MacBook comes with more ram.
The LifeBook comes with Windows Vista _Business_, while the MacBook comes with Mac OSX Leopard with the ability to dual-boot into any* chosen Windows OS. _*It might only support Windows XP and up, but why would you want anything lower?_
The LifeBook's screen is almost a diagonal inch larger.
The LifeBook weighs a 0.2 pounds more.
The MacBook is $250 cheaper.
The have essentially the same 160GB hard drive standard (I recommend getting a larger one)
They both have CD/DVD drives (whoop-de-doo -.-).
They both have cameras
LifeBook battery life is 3h15, but the MacBook sports a 5-hour battery life
The MacBook is physically smaller

Other Notes:

"LifeBook" is an obvious, and shameless parody of "MacBook".
Windows 7 can be downloaded for free at the moment, so for now you wouldn't have to pay for a copy of Windows to dual-boot into Mac. I forgot you need to have a lower version of Windows to format the hard drive properly (because Windows 7 people didn't include that functionality yet -.-).
Apple computers are generally more reliable than others.
Apple currently still has the "cool" factor, IMHO
Mac OSX is less prone to viruses (simply because there are _virtually_ no viruses for them, although I hear there are a couple out there)

Conclusions:

Although the MacBook has less processing power, my father informs me that the additional 1GB of ram is better than the trade-off for 0.3MHz more processing power for games.

So, after all that, I recommend the MacBook.


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## ~XanderFox~ (Jun 19, 2009)

I am, as of right now thinking about going ahead and spending the extra money to get the Mac. If I dont like it I can always return it in 3 months right? ! ^^
I dont like some of the features on The macbook, but reading reviews, and seeing what people on here have said about either have made me seem to be leaning more to the mac.

Thank  you, both of you, for your help!


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## ToeClaws (Jun 19, 2009)

CodArk2 said:


> Windows laptops are cheaper up front, but usually they need to be replaced every 2  or 3 years while macs can go twice as long easily. Macs also don't have viruses and malware like windows does. Macs tend to be more user friendly as well, and tech support is better.



This is more due to diversity of production.  If there is one thing Apple can be credited for, it's maintaining pretty strict control over the production of their gear.  Even the cheap Macbooks (aka, everything not a MacBook Pro) are still a pretty high quality machine.  Most common laptops are just mass-produced trash.  Cheap, sure, but you get what you pay for.  To get higher-end Windows boxes, you usually have to buy Workstation-class business models.

As for the malware thing - that's because MACs are a type of Unix OS, which is more secure by design, but also not nearly as commonplace, so not as attractive a community to make hacks for.

There is a third option though that you should consider - a Linux laptop, and one made by a company that gets them built specifically for them.  Like Apple, they are generally a higher-end machine, and like the MAC OS, they are much more malware resistent.  Price point is around the same, so it comes down to what you're most comfortable with.  Here's a couple links to said companies:

ZaReason
System76


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## hitokage (Jun 20, 2009)

Xenke said:


> [*]"LifeBook" is an obvious, and shameless parody of "MacBook".


The LifeBook name was around before the MacBook - if they were copying Apple it would be the PowerBook name they copied, but even that isn't too likely as the term notebook existed before the PowerBook did. In fact when the term notebook was first being used the machine Apple had that was close to comparable (at the time) was the Mac Portable, but it wasn't considered a notebook or even a laptop weighing in at about 16 pounds.


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## Shino (Jun 20, 2009)

Don't like macs in general because they're overpriced and not as versitle as a PC. At the same time, the few times I've worked with a Fujitsu-branded compy, they've been horrible.

I personally reccommend HP for laptops, or Gateway if you're on a budget.


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## net-cat (Jun 20, 2009)

hitokage said:


> The LifeBook name was around before the MacBook - if they were copying Apple it would be the PowerBook name they copied, but even that isn't too likely as the term notebook existed before the PowerBook did. In fact when the term notebook was first being used the machine Apple had that was close to comparable (at the time) was the Mac Portable, but it wasn't considered a notebook or even a laptop weighing in at about 16 pounds.


Yes, thank you. That's what I thought. I just couldn't find much information about the LifeBook line. (Old or new...)


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## SirrocoTheServal (Jun 21, 2009)

Shino said:


> Don't like macs in general because they're overpriced and not as versitle as a PC. At the same time, the few times I've worked with a Fujitsu-branded compy, they've been horrible.
> 
> I personally reccommend HP for laptops, or Gateway/e-machines if you're on a budget.



?? What, how are they overpriced when someone just said the macbook was $250 cheaper then the comparable PC. Also with the mac vs pc, you get what you pay for, just like anything. And what is the versatility you speak of, they both do the same things but mac has a nicer cleaner look and feel to its software.


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## hitokage (Jun 22, 2009)

net-cat said:


> Yes, thank you. That's what I thought. I just couldn't find much information about the LifeBook line. (Old or new...)


I couldn't find much either except I found a really old post on another forum I visit mentioning someone having one from '99, so I just went looking for when the term notebook was first used instead.


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## ZentratheFox (Jun 22, 2009)

Shino said:


> Don't like macs in general because they're overpriced and not as versitle as a PC. At the same time, the few times I've worked with a Fujitsu-branded compy, they've been horrible.
> 
> I personally reccommend HP for laptops, or Gateway/e-machines if you're on a budget.



Yes, you're right that Macbooks are overpriced. However, the Fuji laptop he chose was even more so. However, recommending anything eMachines is just mean. 

Get an ASUS laptop. Rock solid hardware.


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## ToeClaws (Jun 22, 2009)

ZentratheFox said:


> ... However, recommending anything eMachines is just mean.
> 
> Get an ASUS laptop. Rock solid hardware.



More simply put: *don't buy cheap laptops*.

If you're not going to drop at least $1500 US on the thing, then save up and wait until you _can._  A good laptop is something you can use for 5 or 6 years whereas you'd be lucky to limp an eMachines budget laptop past 2 years.

Asus, along with other large manufactures like Toshiba, Lenovo, Dell, HP, and so on all have quality models, usually classed as business or "Workstation class" machines.  They also have cheap models designed to attract the foolish but budget-minded consumer who thinks they can get a lot for nothing.  The two links provided earlier to the Linux laptop retailers are the same - they have affordable models, and they have _good_ models.


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## ZentratheFox (Jun 22, 2009)

ToeClaws said:


> More simply put: *don't buy cheap _____*.



To put it even simpler: _do it right, not twice._

Meaning, get quality stuff, even if it costs more, since it will last.


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## net-cat (Jun 22, 2009)

ToeClaws said:


> More simply put: *don't buy cheap laptops*.
> 
> If you're not going to drop at least $1500 US on the thing, then save up and wait until you _can._  A good laptop is something you can use for 5 or 6 years whereas you'd be lucky to limp an eMachines budget laptop past 2 years.
> 
> Asus, along with other large manufactures like Toshiba, Lenovo, Dell, HP, and so on all have quality models, usually classed as business or "Workstation class" machines.  They also have cheap models designed to attract the foolish but budget-minded consumer who thinks they can get a lot for nothing.  The two links provided earlier to the Linux laptop retailers are the same - they have affordable models, and they have _good_ models.


This. 

I've got a Dell Latitude C640 that I bought in September 2002. It still works beautifully. (Except the battery is stone dead, but it's a battery. You're lucky if it lasts 2 years.) And that wasn't a fluke. I have a friend who has the exact same laptop, purchased about six months later. His still works. My mom had one from work for about four years. (Then they took it back and gave her a new one, but it worked fine still.)

"Small Business" store is your friend.

Generally speaking, the Apple laptops I've seen recently are on par or better than business class laptops in terms of build quality. The apple consumer desktop line, on the other hand, would be best avoided. (iMac, mini.)


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## ToeClaws (Jun 22, 2009)

net-cat said:


> This.
> 
> I've got a Dell Latitude C640 that I bought in September 2002. It still works beautifully. (Except the battery is stone dead, but it's a battery. You're lucky if it lasts 2 years.) And that wasn't a fluke. I have a friend who has the exact same laptop, purchased about six months later. His still works. My mom had one from work for about four years. (Then they took it back and gave her a new one, but it worked fine still.)
> 
> "Small Business" store is your friend.



Aye - CAThulu has a Dell Latitude C810 from 2001 and it works great.  Battery was shot on it as well, but was easily replaced.  My ex has a Compaq Armada M7400 - 11 years old, still working perfectly (albeit slowly), running Puppy Linux.  My work laptop is a Dell Precision M65 which is 3.5 years old.  It is on 5 days a week, 8 to 10 hours a day.  Works perfectly, no issues.

By contrast, a cheaper consumer grade Toshiba Satellite S1 that CAThulu's father was issues from work lasted only about a year before blowing the GPU.  In a former job, two Compaq Presarios blew parts in under two years.  

But perhaps the best advice comes from my own bad decision: My own laptop is a Compaq Presario R3000 which was a upper-end consumer grade laptop from 2004 (almost as much as a business class machine), and since then, I'm on my 3rd hard drive, second keyboard, and have had to disasemble and resolder parts and repair things more times than I can count.  5 years ago, I thought the upper-end consumer stuff would suffice and save me a few hundred, and it didn't.  Probably cost me a lot more in the long run.  First and last time I ever try to cut corners. 



net-cat said:


> Generally speaking, the Apple laptops I've seen recently are on par or better than business class laptops in terms of build quality. The apple consumer desktop line, on the other hand, would be best avoided. (iMac, mini.)



Aye - the iMac and iBooks and stuff are just Apple's equivilancey for trying to build very cheap systems that penny-pinchers will buy.  Regardless of whether it's Mac, PC, Linux, or Unix, you get what you pay for.


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## KrazFabbit (Jun 22, 2009)

If you're wanting a laptop that both looks great and would be great for school and gaming I'd recommend a Clevo/Sager laptop.


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## Hackfox (Jun 23, 2009)

Failure for only a few thousand dollars! Mac's fail simply. Get a good PC, if you know how to use a computer they rule. Don't waste you cash. If you still do not like, buy a Ubuntu or Linux machine.

No offense I do not mean any of this is a mean way. These are my opinions, some might feel otherwise.


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## CodArk2 (Jun 23, 2009)

Hackfox said:


> Failure for only a few thousand dollars! Mac's fail simply. Get a good PC, if you know how to use a computer they rule. Don't waste you cash. If you still do not like, buy a Ubuntu or Linux machine.
> 
> No offense I do not mean any of this is a mean way. These are my opinions, some might feel otherwise.



uh, macbook is 999 , only one macbook model is more than 2000, so its thousand, not thousands, of dollars. unless you want the 17 inch.

Why do macs fail? they do pretty much anything a windows computer can except play the latest games. anything else you can do on a pc you can do on mac just as well. I know how to use a computer, i use windows and mac  every day, and have used linux some. Windows is a lot more maintainence just to keep it functioning than any mac i have ever used or owned. Id rather just have my computer work than tinker with it all the time to keep it running. 

Assuming mac users dont know how to use a computer is a bit arrogant really. A mac is a computer, a personal computer(PC). we just use a different OS that you likely have never used or couldn't figure out. i fail to see how you not being able to figure something out makes us stupid, and judging something you havent used is a major sign of unintelligence. (note:using one at school doesnt count. schools usually restrict macs to be nearly unusable for education purposes).

Also ubuntu is a type of linux, so saying linux or ubuntu is technically incorrect since ubuntu is a distro of linux. i havent had a lot of experience with linux so i cant say a lot of bad things about it. in my experience its great for programmers and servers, but its still not there yet in terms of user friendliness for the average guy. Linux isnt bad, but it requires skill to use that many users dont have to be honest, its why linux has even less market share than mac does.


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## Raithah (Jun 23, 2009)

I'd just like to point the shame finger at everyone turning this thread into your typical "MAC !!!!! PWNZ PCS" vs "M$ suuukkkkkzloooolll111" discussion. Could an admin, perhaps, sticky a place for the useless bickering instead (Ã  la linux or windows)?


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## Hyena (Jun 26, 2009)

So much ignorance here... 


Here is the deal and please keep in mind this is my own personal choice, I'll let you know what is up with both laptops as I have tons of experience with Fujitsu.

Fujitsu are one of the better laptop manufacturers, the mactards are not going to like this, but the Fujitsu Lifebook is built far far better than the little macbooks. What it comes down to is the internal bits and functionality. I have a Fijutsu Lifebook that I just use for travel (only point I see in a laptop) I also have a cheap dell (400 bux) that goes to school with me. I have had some dumb friends drop my old laptop (older dell that doesn't get used) only 2 feet onto pavement and the whole thing was just fucked. Spending over $500.00 on something that can be destroyed so easily and as something you depend on, I'll never understand. 

If you take apart a lifebook you'll see many differences to that of a new mac book. The cooling is TONS better than the macs, my lifebook sucks air in one side and blows out the other. The Fujitsu I have doesn't have some dumb fan on the bottom that gets blocked every time you set the thing on your lap. My fujitsu also stays incredibly cool. I can't tell why so much you're spending over $999 for a fujitsu, what you should be doing is go onto ebay and look for Fujitsu refurbished laptops. I have a P series from Fujitsu, it should have been $1,799.99 but I got mine refurbished through fujitsu direct on ebay for like $799 and when I got it, I couldn't actually tell if it had been used or not. Fujitsu throw tons of copper and innovation into every laptop they make, I've never actually been able to find a better laptop. Mine even has built in shock sensors and has monitoring equipment inside that senses if it's about to hit the ground or be dropped and will prepair the hard drive and everything so shit doesn't get damaged.

As for Windows VS OS X  ? Some user stated that "windows has to constantly be fixed" uhh... since when? I've been running Vista Ultimate 64bit for 2 years straight and I haven't ever encountered a problem. It's going to come down to "do you want mac software, or windows software" also keep in mind your budget here, while you pay $999 for the mac book, how much more obnoxious prices are they going to throw at you for the software that you want to use. For me for my G5 I wanted to buy legal Office 2007, Apple wanted to charge me something like $269.99 just for word.I got Office 2007 for my PC the entire setup with powerpoint and all for $109.99

If it were me? get the fujitsu, it will last as long if not longer than some entry macbook. If it were me though, I bet I can find a laptop with the same specs for around $600 on newegg or a better laptop on ebay that's been refurbished.


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## CodArk2 (Jun 26, 2009)

Hyena said:


> So much ignorance here...
> It's going to come down to "do you want mac software, or windows software" also keep in mind your budget here, while you pay $999 for the mac book, how much more obnoxious prices are they going to throw at you for the software that you want to use. For me for my G5 I wanted to buy legal Office 2007, Apple wanted to charge me something like $269.99 just for word.I got Office 2007 for my PC the entire setup with powerpoint and all for $109.99



Fujitsus arent bad from what i heard. the hardware on them both is good, mostly it comes down to os.

though for most things the mac will have the same program or something cheaper. i dunno where you looked or shopped, but i never heard of it being that much just for word. maybe for the whole office suite. You are being overcharged by our friends at microsoft, apple doesnt make office. it makes iWork, but thats $79. of course, openoffice is free


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## Hyena (Jun 26, 2009)

CodArk2 said:


> Fujitsus arent bad from what i heard. the hardware on them both is good, mostly it comes down to os.
> 
> though for most things the mac will have the same program or something cheaper. i dunno where you looked or shopped, but i never heard of it being that much just for word. maybe for the whole office suite. You are being overcharged by our friends at microsoft, apple doesnt make office. it makes iWork, but thats $79. of course, openoffice is free



I was being charged that much for Word at the apple store, and at Fry's electronics. iWork is an okay program, it seems to be kind of incompatible with a lot of things, so I just run Office 2007 on my windows computer. I can't ever really be bothered with Open Office, in my opinion Open Office doesn't compare to iWork or Office


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## Arcadium (Jun 27, 2009)

Macbooks (Now all Macbook Pro's, excluding the Plastic) are very nice. If you do like OSX, there awesome for dependable Notebooks.

Fujitsu, meh. I'm not a big windows Fan. If your running Linux, it's cool. I have an XP desktop, and a Vista notebook, but i'm steadily learning Ubuntu. 


Point being, Macbook you know is a good product. Fujitsu, has a LOT of products, running the worst OS and maybe being Thick, heavy, loud, slow. You didn't name a line, so i can't help you here.


Macbook, you know that it's a dependable product. No hidden strings, so i recomend that, since you failed to couter me with an actual product.


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## Hyena (Jun 28, 2009)

Arcadium said:


> Macbooks (Now all Macbook Pro's, excluding the Plastic) are very nice. If you do like OSX, there awesome for dependable Notebooks.
> 
> Fujitsu, meh. I'm not a big windows Fan. If your running Linux, it's cool. I have an XP desktop, and a Vista notebook, but i'm steadily learning Ubuntu.
> 
> ...



you're really ignorant...


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## Shino (Jun 28, 2009)

Hyena said:


> you're really ignorant...


Seconded.


Arcadium said:


> Macbook, you know that it's a dependable product. No hidden strings, so i recomend that, since you failed to couter me with an actual product.


 *Blinks*
Seriously? No hidden strings? Wow. Just wow.


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## HyBroMcYenapants (Jun 28, 2009)

Arcadium said:


> Macbook, you know that it's a dependable product. No hidden strings, so i recomend that, since you failed to couter me with an actual product.



Uhhhhhuh


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## Q-Lok (Jul 1, 2009)

Shino said:


> Seriously? No hidden strings? Wow. Just wow.



Yet more personal experience here, but I have yet to find such a string with my entry (COLLEGE BOY SALARY CHEAP YAY) MacBook, which I have been using extensively since last September.  I also own a Mac Mini (~5 years) and a G4 Cube (~10 years), and the only problems I've had with either is that they tend not to age well compared to more upgradable products (i.e. homebrew systems or anything else that you can tear the innards out of on a whim).  On their own, Apple computers are in my experience some of the best on the market easily.  However, I do admit that they have this one huge flaw (besides the obvious compatibility and pricing issues) -- they get dilapidated fast under heavy use.  My Mini is showing signs of its age and generally just being too slow for what I need it to do.  But, as has been said plenty of times earlier, you really get what you pay for, and that particular Mini was already a bit aged by the time I got it (at $400, no less).

As for other manufacturers and OS's, I have nothing against Linux, and am in fact planning to eventually dual-boot this very laptop with Ubuntu or possibly Fedora.  Windows is something that I still have yet to hear a convincing argument for, since every new major release seems to just tear open more functionality and security holes.  I will definitely admit that XP was a good, solid OS, but only after it got all the way through three service packs worth of fixes and patches -- in other words, it took Microsoft until less than a year before Vista's release to make XP into what it should have been from day one.  It's not really a complaint against the people working on it so much as just my expression of distaste for Microsoft's apparent policy regarding release times and beta testing.  Vista, on the other hand, is something that I have had nothing at all but bad experiences with, and I don't really see that trend changing anytime soon.

With other hardware, though, I have no real issue.  The only company that I really don't like is HP, simply because they tend to jump ship on their own products regardless of the consumer's needs (see also: any HP computer my family has ever owned).  I pretty much trust Apple hardware more simply because I've had more experience with it, but there's really nothing wrong with other companies.

...Whew, I think I should get off my soapbox now.

Also, I think the guy who wanted help has long since stopped reading this topic.  So yeah.


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## Captain Howdy (Jul 1, 2009)

My 2,500$ Alienware m15x (Win XP pro sp3) outperforms my friends 2300-2600$ish Macbook pro in every way, except rendering & rendering speed in programs like Maya. 

If you're looking for like...3D-rendering programs, and maybe photoshop, movie editing, and the like. The Mac's do it better, but for everything else, there's Mastercar-. I mean Windows. 

Windows, as in XP, not Vista. I don't like Vista :E


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## Runefox (Jul 2, 2009)

If you're using Windows now, prepare to spend a month or so readjusting to how things work in Mac OS to get back into the same kind of efficiency you already had. I'm personally not a fan of how things work in Mac OS, especially considering that they're still living in the land of building interfaces based on co-operative multitasking, in spite of the fact that they're doing pre-emptive multitasking now. But that aside, if you do like it, you'll probably end up getting used to it a lot more quickly, and you'll have the added protection (for now) of security, though honestly if Apple gains more market share, there will be more targeted attacks against its OS, just like with Windows.

Anyway, the OS aside (since you can replace it anyway and it's clear that I'm biased against it), the Macbook is a decently-built computer, but they get their parts from the same places the other OEM's do. Their hard drives, in fact, are rebranded (big Apple sticker) from Hitachi. The Scrabble-key keyboard will also take some getting used to, though I'm told by everyone who uses them that it's great to type on (I found it quite awkward, being that I expect rows of keys and am a tactile typist). As far as audio goes, it's standard Intel HDA (which is decent), and video is going to be a GeForce 9400M, which is enough to run HD video and play a few older games (and Source engine games like Team Fortress 2 and Left 4 Dead, at around medium quality at native resolution). Not bad, but could definitely be better. The screen on the MacBook is pretty small at 13 inches widescreen, so you might be hard-pressed to play games properly without hooking it up to an external monitor or TV. That said, it also means that it's more portable than larger notebooks, which could be a plus for you if you plan on carrying it around a lot (since small things are always easier to carry than large things. Unless they're unshielded blades or bee hives).

As for the battery life, always remember that every company has a different measure on battery life. Most of them, however, measure it by lowest possible power consumption, and then just slap the qualifying phrase "up to" before the result ("Up to 5 hours!" More like 2 with the wireless on!).

Personally, to match up the MacBook, I'd take a look at the Lenovo IdeaPad Y series if you're looking for performance, or the Lenovo ThinkPad T-series for something reliable and feature-rich.

The "ThinkPad T500 with discrete graphics" goes for $909 stock and has a faster processor of the same class (and same power consumption, 25W), 2GB of DDR3 RAM, and is otherwise comparable to the Macbook, and definitely more reliable. It's a business-class notebook, and Lenovo has a long track record for creating reliable, rugged notebooks with measures like honeycomb-mesh screen backing to prevent warping that could damage it during a fall or misuse, full aluminum frames, etc. They also run DDR3 RAM, which means that power consumption (at least by the RAM) should be lower than a comparable unit with DDR2 RAM. It also has a 15.4 inch screen and a Mobility Radeon 3650, which will outperform the GeForce 9400M.

The "Lenovo IdeaPad Y730 - 40532NU" goes for $949 stock, and has a slightly slower (older) processor, 3GB of DDR3 RAM, a 17" high-gloss screen, camera, 320GB hard drive (twice as large), Dual Layer DVD burner, and Bluetooth. You'll get less battery life, but you'll get a more multimedia and gaming-oriented computer for about the same price.


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