# Why is the furry fandom a sausage festival?



## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

This has been bugging me for a bit, but why is it that there are far more guys than women in the furry fandom?

The only real reason why I can think off the top of my head is gynophobia.

*edit*
Question was answered, have a look-


Trpdwarf said:


> I've seen several cases of sexism within the fandom. It's not uncommon.
> 
> Not too long ago there was a big stink because some gay guys (some of  which have a rep for being sexist) reserved rooms to attend anthrocon.  To help their costs come down they put out ads to get room-mates. They  decided to post that only "guys" may apply. It pissed quite a few female  furs off at a time when rooms were getting to be limited. You can take  that how you will.
> 
> ...


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## Alstor (Nov 22, 2011)

You're kidding, right?

I'm not going to go into some long explanation involving the creation of the universe or the morality of the human soul, so for now, I'll say that the furry fandom is a nerd culture, and guys are more prone to be nerds than girls. Boys ARE introduced to the technical stuff at an early age, whereas girls aren't.


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

Because girls have more important things to do and aren't normally given access to the "geeky" aspects of life?
...

Was the second part so hard to guess?


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## Recel (Nov 22, 2011)

Im not sure Alstor. I think CannonFodder threads also play a good part in it. *:V*


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## RayO_ElGatubelo (Nov 22, 2011)

Well, at least Cannonfodder is contributing to increase the amount of women in the fandom by turning himself into one. I commend you.

Also, women are generally into gay porn? I know there's female yaoi fanatics... but not a lot of women in general like it, compared to guys who almost universally like girl-on-girl.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> Because girls have more important things to do and aren't normally given access to the "geeky" aspects of life?
> ...
> 
> Was the second part so hard to guess?


Even with that it doesn't explain such a massive difference, very few other geeky fandoms have such a massive difference though.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

I think im a chick... /checks pants

you wigglie bits not danglie bits. im in it cause I like talking animal head people not cuz ima nerd :V


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## Aden (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> You would think with all the gay porn there'd be more women in the fandom.



I wouldn't think that at all, no


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Aden said:


> I wouldn't think that at all, no


Ever seen yaoi fangirls?


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Even with that it doesn't explain such a massive difference, very few other geeky fandoms have such a massive difference though.



How sure are you of this? I guess it may not be so notable among people like the otaku, the trekkies, star wars fans, twitards (haha)... and other groups.
What about gamers?

Also, for a direct answer, I wouldn't know, looking at it that way.



Also, there's a difference between human "bishies" and anthro "bishies". Perhaps a girl's more traditional cultural upbringing "protects" her from feeling attraction to those. Yeah, a stupid suposition I know, and so it is to suppose that women have less libido.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Ever seen yaoi fangirls?




You silly shark, yaoi fangirls arnt people


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> What about gamers?
> 
> Also, for a direct answer, I wouldn't know, looking at it that way.


They just mute their mics.


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## LizardKing (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> You would think with all the gay porn there'd be more women in the fandom.









...no? I swear I should make a book out of your posts. That guy would be the front cover.


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> They just mute their mics.



And that's another thing I was going to say, the fact you don't see those girls doesn't mean they aren't there.


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## Vega (Nov 22, 2011)

The girls are too busy with the Yaoi fandom.  DUH!  :V


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

LizardKing said:


> ...no? I swear I should make a book out of your posts. That guy would be the front cover.


It was a joke about the anime fandom.


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> It was a joke about the anime fandom.



Call them by their name, they're "fujoshi".


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## Onnes (Nov 22, 2011)

If we take for granted that females make up roughly 20% of the furry fandom then that would actually put it ahead of most measures of "serious" gamer demographics. However, it doesn't seem like furries are particularly technologically inclined beyond what you would expect for a largely male group; therefore, I'm not sure you can use the usual split in male/female upbringing and technological pursuits as a primary explanation.


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## Fay V (Nov 22, 2011)

There's a lot of reasons and misconceptions. 1. most girls aren't actually that turned on by gay porn, not the ones I know anyway. just because there's a really loud group does not mean that a lot of girls are like that. So no the gay porn won't help the fandom. 
2. nerd culture plays a part. It's more acceptable for girls in other geek fandoms to be around, but in many cases they either don't really have the same ratio of interest, or don't desire to be as visible. Take for instance the gamers. You claimed most mute their mic. This is true but there's still a notable minority of girl gamers when all aspects are taken in. 
In the same respect imagine how many girls in the fandom are just assumed male until otherwise noted? a fucking lot. So chances are there are more girls than you think. 
3. girl phobic. The fandom has been a haven for gays and such, and so girls are not as readily welcomed as they are in other fandoms. I'm not saying all gays hate girls, I just saying that many don't mind that there is a sausagefest situation, so when a girl joins it's not like the second coming of jesus. 
4. the ratio doesn't seem that off in comparison with other fandoms. I not sure what you're using for numbers to be honest.


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

Onnes said:


> If we take for granted that females make up roughly 20% of the furry fandom then that would actually put it ahead of most measures of "serious" gamer demographics. However, it doesn't seem like furries are particularly technologically inclined beyond what you would expect for a largely male group; therefore, I'm not sure you can use the usual split in male/female upbringing and technological pursuits as a primary explanation.



Since the furry fandom's main place of divulgation is pretty much the Internet only, I'd be inclined to say "yes".


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> Since the furry fandom's main place of divulgation is pretty much the Internet only, I'd be inclined to say "yes".


You do realize how many people use the internet right?


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## Onnes (Nov 22, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> Since the furry fandom's main place of divulgation is pretty much the Internet only, I'd be inclined to say "yes".



That certainly would be the case a decade ago, but now, and especially after the rise of social networking, it's rather hard to consider internet use as a male-dominated activity.


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> You do realize how many people use the internet right?



Yes, I am... I should be clearer. I'm mainly refering to the possible sites of interest and eagerness to participate of it... nah, sorry for that. I think I've got an idealized view of girls and a slightly satanized view on the Internet's plethora of distractions. For now, I'll concede this point.

EDIT:
@Onnes: Good point.

EDITEDIT:
I think it's best to stand by what I said earlier: the fact we don't see those girls doesn't mean they are not there.


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## Recel (Nov 22, 2011)

Most girls have real lives and drama to attend to, while most guys have achievements and top scores to reach and keep.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Recel said:


> Most girls have real lives and drama to attend to, while most guys have achievements and top scores to reach and keep.


Ten years ago this was true, but alas that was ten years ago.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

Recel said:


> *Most girls have real lives and drama to attend to,* while most guys have achievements and top scores to reach and keep.




Scuse me while I go bury my arms up to my elbows in guts and animal flesh before playing skyrim.


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 22, 2011)

RayO_ElGatubelo said:


> Also, women are generally into gay porn?



No, 'course not. Men have a habit of generalising.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

Gibby said:


> No, 'course not. Men have a habit of generalising.





I watch a lotta porn and I gotta say one dude takin it in the ass just doesnt do it for me :/

No offense to the people that like it but most girls ive known in my life have felt the same.


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## Vega (Nov 22, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> Scuse me while I go bury my arms up to my elbows in guts and animal flesh before playing skyrim.



You... go ahead and do that now....  o_o


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## Carnie (Nov 22, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> Scuse me while I go bury my arms up to my elbows in guts and animal flesh before playing skyrim.



You live a good life.

On topic, more dudes seem to be antisocial or awkward or nerdy than chicks do. Plenty of furries are these things, so you can see the correlation.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Jeez there's alot of stereotypes about women being flung as arguments around in this thread :\


dinosaurdammit said:


> I watch a lotta porn and I gotta say one dude takin it in the ass just doesnt do it for me :/


That's another thing, why is there the stereotype that women don't watch porn?


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> That's another thing, why is there the stereotype that women don't watch porn?



Male generalisations often leave such an idea hanging around. Honestly, if a bird told an inexperienced bloke that she loves sex and feels herself up whilst watching porn on the INTERNET OF ALL THINGS, he'd be so very damn surprised.


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Jeez there's alot of stereotypes about women being flung as arguments around in this thread :\
> 
> That's another thing, why is there the stereotype that women don't watch porn?



I think it's partly us expecting too much "progressive-ness" of a woman's education, part us assuming most people in the internet are men by default and part us "idealizing" women a little too much. 
Which are, also, the causes of why anyone would assume your question, I think. Unless we conducted a massive statistic, we couldn't really be sure on whether there are actually so few women in the fandom, or the Internet in general.
In other words, I'll assume an sceptical position regarding this matter and stop wondering.


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## Mentova (Nov 22, 2011)

Gibby said:


> Male generalisations often leave such an idea hanging around. Honestly, if a bird told an inexperienced bloke that she loves sex and feels herself up whilst watching porn on the INTERNET OF ALL THINGS, he'd be so very damn surprised.


I'd be more surprised that a bird is talking then it liking sex and porn.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Gibby said:


> Male generalisations often leave such an idea hanging around. Honestly, if a bird told an inexperienced bloke that she loves sex and feels herself up whilst watching porn on the INTERNET OF ALL THINGS, he'd be so very damn surprised.


I think far too many people are still stuck in the 1990's.


AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> I think it's partly us expecting  too much "progressive-ness" of a woman's education, part us assuming  most people in the internet are men by default and part us "idealizing"  women a little too much.
> Which are, also, the casuses of why anyone would assume your question, I  think. Unless we conducted a massive statistic, we couldn't really be  sure on whether there are actually so few women in the fandom, or the  Internet in general.
> In other words, I'll assume an sceptic position and stop wondering.


I would say something referring to the furry survey, but I found out that there's actually furries that get pissed off by it and fill it out multiple times under proxies.


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## Onnes (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> That's another thing, why is there the stereotype that women don't watch porn?



Well, it is a statistical fact that women as a whole watch a lot less porn than men. Saying that women don't watch any porn is a stereotype, but I don't think anyone is really making that claim here.


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 22, 2011)

Mentova said:


> I'd be more surprised that a bird is talking then it liking sex and porn.



After I beat you with a fish, see number 1. >;c


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> That's another thing, why is there the stereotype that women don't watch porn?




Because the image of women is to be super prude and very wrong.

Following things I do that men do

stick my hand in my pants
belch 
fart
sit with my legs open and slouched while my hand is in my pants and I watch tv
drink beer
kill things
love video games
sweat with such an oder I could knock out a full grown elk at 600 yards
light fires
camp
piss standing up- uh yup I can 
eat god awful things
oogle at women with big tits- not cause im gay but because they are interesting to watch bounce
go commando on some days
love guns
love explosions
love fishing
love cursing
love picking fights


odds are a lot of girls do a lot of shit on that list but men dont know it or are ignorant of it


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## LizardKing (Nov 22, 2011)

Onnes said:


> Well, it is a statistical fact that women as a whole watch a lot less porn than men. Saying that women don't watch any porn is a stereotype, but I don't think anyone is really making that claim here.



They read more though :3


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## Azure (Nov 22, 2011)

Because dicks.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

LizardKing said:


> They read more though :3


I don't care what anybody says, if a book talks about two characters getting it on no matter how well versed it is still erotica.


Azure said:


> Because dicks.


Dicks, dicks everywhere.meme


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## Aetius (Nov 22, 2011)

Whats wrong with a sausage fest?


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## Antonin Scalia (Nov 22, 2011)

Crusader Mike said:


> Whats wrong with a sausage fest?



fo real


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> Because the image of women is to be super prude and very wrong.
> 
> Following things I do that men do
> 
> ...


One of these days society is going to realize it's 2011 and not 1991 and just go, "HOLY SHIT!"

On the downside we're back to square one.



Crusader Mike said:


> Whats wrong with a sausage fest?


Well if you eat too much weinersnitchel and just keep cramming it down  your throat you might choke and have to wash it down with something wet,  not to mention if you are a dummkopf and eat it raw, you could wind up with a  bacteria.  So if you put all the Frankfurter's in your hole das ein bad  idea.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

Oh cum now CF everyone loves weenies


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> Oh cum now CF everyone loves weenies



I don't. I only eat them when their flavor has been muted by bread, mustard, cheese and other sauces, not anywhere else.


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## Recel (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> One of these days society is going to realize it's 2011 and not 1991 and just go, "HOLY SHIT!"
> 
> On the downside we're back to square one.



Well, shit. Im wrong about girls! Time to get my emergency suicide grenade! kkthxby!


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## LizardKing (Nov 22, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> belch



I can vouch for DD's impressive belching ability. They're big burly burps that any man would be proud of.


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## Belluavir (Nov 22, 2011)

I wonder if there's any way to answer your question without making broad, sweeping and ultimately baseless generalisations. You seem to have problem with that, sometimes anyway, either that or I'm not paying all that much attention.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Belluavir said:


> I wonder if there's any way to answer your question without making broad, sweeping and ultimately baseless generalisations. You seem to have problem with that, sometimes anyway, either that or I'm not paying all that much attention.


Well so far all the theories as to why have been broad sweeping generalizations about women from back before most of us have been born, so why not?


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## Fay V (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Well so far all the theories as to why have been broad sweeping generalizations about women from back before most of us have been born, so why not?


Like how women want to see two gay guys go at it?


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## Mentova (Nov 22, 2011)

Fay V said:


> Like how women want to see two gay guys go at it?



_*ICEBUUUUURN!*_

Seriously though Cannonfodder you should probably think before you post.


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## Onnes (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Well so far all the theories as to why have been broad sweeping generalizations about women from back before most of us have been born, so why not?



There's really two problems with trying to answer the topic question.  First, the furry fandom is really weird. This makes it difficult to  compare to other groups and rather hard to pin down in terms of its  character. Second, there really aren't that much data on furries except  for the several demographic surveys from cons and the internet. Ideally,  you'd be able to take some series of traits essentially defining the  fandom and show how they tend to match male and not female cultural  leanings--but I don't believe that is easily accomplished without making unjustified assumptions.


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## Belluavir (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Well so far all the theories as to why have been broad sweeping generalizations about women from back before most of us have been born, so why not?



At least the "women should make sandwiches" meme hasn't come up. 

Okay how about this: Western society has different expectations for women than for men. Women are expected to uphold a high moral standard (moral of course meaning sex), while men are kind of expected to have very low moral standards and be kind of disgusting in general, requiring a strong woman to lift them out of the gutter and keep them on the straight and narrow.  There are less women in the fandom because women effectively aren't allowed to be perverted. 

Still a broad generalisation but I think it's better than the gender stereotyping.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Fay V said:


> Like how women want to see two gay guys go at it?


I was making a joke about weaboos, but apparently nobody has ever heard of yaoi fans.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> I was making a joke about weaboos, but apparently nobody has ever heard of yaoi fans.




trying to cover your ass after the fact isnt gonna work


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## Recel (Nov 22, 2011)

Now that I think of it, listening to George Carlin a lot solved this thing.

Guys are stupid, women are crazy. 
Guys cant know why women like or dislike things, because their stupid. Women know why they do things, but they do all sorts of strange things, because their crazy. So the anwser is, that guys think that they are the mayority, because they are stupid. And girls think there are more of them than there is, because they are crazy.

George Carlin has the anwser.


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## Fay V (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> I was making a joke about weaboos, but apparently nobody has ever heard of yaoi fans.


I made a mistake so haha it's a joke. Honestly I know yaoi, I know weeabos and the crazies that love that shit. It still made no sense in the context of the furfandom. So either 1. you intrinsically connect the two in your head and weeabos = furries or 2. You actually believed yaoi has some sort of draw for the general female.


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## Trpdwarf (Nov 22, 2011)

You know I can only speak for what I see in general when I am around furry groups. It seems to me that people who become furry are predisposed first to be a nerd, or be a gamer. As it stands in both cultures while female numbers are on the rise it is still highly male dominant number wise. Since furry seems to attract people from highly male dominant areas it's only natural you will see more males.

Furry also seems to have a huge attraction for gay males, which also increases the overall male population. In social settings from what I have seen furry groups IRL are also not always very friendly for females. You get two big factors here. One is the issue where a lot of straight males go crazy stalker over female furs (kind of like how some socially awkward gamers get all creepy when they meet gamer girls). That behavior repels females when they feel like bait before a bunch of creepy socially awkward sharks. The second factor is that gay males can end up making the physical community hostile towards females because of a strange stupid phobia/hatred/malice towards women because they don't find them sexually attractive. This repels females too when it becomes concentrated and you get a large enough portion of people exhibiting this behavior.

EDIT: Please remember that I am not saying this applies to every group, female, gay male...etc. I am just speaking of what I have observed with my experiences.


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## Belluavir (Nov 22, 2011)

Recel said:


> Now that I think of it, listening to George Carlin a lot solved this thing.
> 
> Guys are stupid, women are crazy.
> Guys cant know why women like or dislike things, because their stupid. Women know why they do things, but they do all sorts of strange things, because their crazy. So the anwser is, that guys think that they are the mayority, because they are stupid. And girls think there are more of them than there is, because they are crazy.
> ...



If he's so smart, how come he's dead?


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## Recel (Nov 22, 2011)

Belluavir said:


> If he's so smart, how come he's dead?



Didnt you pay atention? All guys are stupid, includeing him. Thats why hes dead.


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## Belluavir (Nov 22, 2011)

Recel said:


> Didnt you pay atention? All guys are stupid, includeing him. Thats why hes dead.



No, I didn't, I'm a guy.

EDIT: Wait a second, doesn't that make what he said complete bullshit if it's true? But if it isn't true then he's an idiot and therefore it is true...


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## LittleMonstar (Nov 22, 2011)

I dont understand yaoi fangirls at all, and I am a girl. I prefer yuri. But thats just me. Also, there are no girls on the internet, silly. So why would there be many furry girls?

Just a thought.

Furry cuz I is an aminal. Not just cuz I'm nerdy. I was introduced through oekaki's when I was younger.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Trpdwarf said:


> Furry also seems to have a huge attraction for gay males, which also increases the overall male population. In social settings from what I have seen furry groups IRL are also not always very friendly for females. You get two big factors here. One is the issue where a lot of straight males go crazy stalker over female furs (kind of like how some socially awkward gamers get all creepy when they meet gamer girls). That behavior repels females when they feel like bait before a bunch of creepy socially awkward sharks. The second factor is that gay males can end up making the physical community hostile towards females because of a strange stupid phobia/hatred/malice towards women because they don't find them sexually attractive. This repels females too when it becomes concentrated and you get a large enough portion of people exhibiting this behavior.
> 
> EDIT: Please remember that I am not saying this applies to every group, female, gay male...etc. I am just speaking of what I have observed with my experiences.


Finally a probable answer,

I can understand that point, if someone is going creeper on a girl cause she's furry, I don't she's going to apreciate that.  Especially given how creepy furries can get when it comes to situations such as this.

That's something I don't get, why are there some gay guys that have a hate/phobia towards women.  I can understand it to a point, but when it's to the point of harassing women that's just assinine.


dinosaurdammit said:


> trying to cover your ass after the fact isnt gonna work


 Not all jokes are non-offensive. It was a broad sweeping insult towards individuals that don't understand how homosexual relationships actually work.  Ever seen someone trying to pair two guys together thinking that because <insert stereotype> they believe the two are gay?  Or ever seen someone into gay porn not understand how biology actually works*cough* mpreg *cough*?  Or that a gay guy is not interested in women?
The tie in to yaoi fans is that all of said above meet in a train wreck of ignorance towards how homosexuality actually works, the tie into to furry is poking fun that I'm surprised that with all the ignorance of how biology actually works going on in furry that the trainwreck hasn't sprung up here.


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## Sirffuzzyloigk (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> That's something I don't get, why are there some gay guys that have a hate/phobia towards women.  I can understand it to a point, but when it's to the point of harassing women that's just assinine.


I have a general dislike of women myself because of how girls have harassed me a few times in the past. I never harass them though.


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## Trpdwarf (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Finally a probable answer,
> 
> I can understand that point, if someone is going creeper on a girl cause she's furry, I don't she's going to apreciate that.  Especially given how creepy furries can get when it comes to situations such as this.
> 
> ...



That's something I don't get either. 

And the thing about furry is a lot of gay furs don't understand how real relationships work. They are just as clueless as these brainless yaoi fans. EDITING: to make clear what I mean to say.

In the anime community the ignorance is perpetrated by non gays. In the furry community the ignorance is perpetrated by gays. It's two different situations. We have a different trainwreck...how can we have a train-wreck of non gay being ignorant when the actual gay community has a lot of ignorance portrayed within the fandom? I think I made that clear enough.


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## Rotsala (Nov 22, 2011)

Maybe because girls in the fandom have to deal with the massive amount of desperate straight male virgin furs competing for their attention or even outright asking to see pictures of their vaginas. Girls who like anthropomorphic animals have probably learned to stay far away from the retard-clusters most furry communities are.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Not all jokes are non-offensive. It was a broad sweeping insult towards individuals that don't understand how homosexual relationships actually work.  Ever seen someone trying to pair two guys together thinking that because <insert stereotype> they believe the two are gay?  Or ever seen someone into gay porn not understand how biology actually works*cough* mpreg *cough*?  Or that a gay guy is not interested in women?
> The tie in to yaoi fans is that all of said above meet in a train wreck of ignorance towards how homosexuality actually works, the tie into to furry is poking fun that I'm surprised that with all the ignorance of how biology actually works going on in furry that the trainwreck hasn't sprung up here.




Your post all of it


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## Zenia (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> That's something I don't get, why are there some gay guys that have a hate/phobia towards women.  I can understand it to a point, but when it's to the point of harassing women that's just assinine.


'Cause vaginas are guh~rossssssss!!! Can't be friends with someone with one! Even if you will never see/touch it! XD

I hate it when guys act like that around me 'cause I am a girl. T^T I am a person, dammit and I don't want to have sex with you anyway!


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Rotsala said:


> Maybe because girls in the fandom have to deal with the massive amount of desperate straight male virgin furs competing for their attention or even outright asking to see pictures of their vaginas. Girls who like anthropomorphic animals have probably learned to stay far away from the retard-clusters most furry communities are.


Asking a woman, "tits or gtfo' will not get you pics.


Sirffuzzyloigk said:


> I have a general dislike of women myself  because of how girls have harassed me a few times in the past. I never  harass them though.


  Having a dislike cause of being harassed is understandable, but there's some serious shit flinging against women in the fandom.


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## Trpdwarf (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Asking a woman, "tits or gtfo' will not get you pics.
> 
> Having a dislike cause of being harassed is understandable, but there's some serious shit flinging against women in the fandom.



You know when I think about the people I know...that have sat and flung some serious shit at female furs...they tended to have a superiority complex. Their attitude was men > women and homosexual > straight. So them they see us females as being inferior and perhaps it makes them "feel" bigger by treating us that way. It also reinforces the complex.


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## â™¥Mirandaâ™¥ (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Having a dislike cause of being harassed is understandable, but there's some serious shit flinging against women in the fandom.


_[citation needed]_


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## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

Trpdwarf said:


> You know when I think about the people I know...that have sat and flung some serious shit at female furs...they tended to have a superiority complex. Their attitude was men > women and homosexual > straight. So them they see us females as being inferior and perhaps it makes them "feel" bigger by treating us that way. It also reinforces the complex.



Wait, you're a girl?!

Oh, the irony. Anyway, ironically I used to think gays were the ones least in need of being chauvinistic (it being associated with heterosexual sexist behaviours). If what you just said is general, then it wouldn't be surprising if girls actually were a minority in the fandom.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Trpdwarf said:


> You know when I think about the people I know...that have sat and flung some serious shit at female furs...they tended to have a superiority complex. Their attitude was men > women and homosexual > straight. So them they see us females as being inferior and perhaps it makes them "feel" bigger by treating us that way. It also reinforces the complex.


That's messed up, maybe if furries didn't tolerate such behavior there wouldn't be such a massive difference in number; but alas furries have turned hypocrisy into a profession.


Tybalt Maxwell said:


> _[citation needed]_


Ever hear of knotcast?  It's vague sexism sprinkled with hypocrisy.


----------



## Belluavir (Nov 22, 2011)

Zenia said:


> 'Cause vaginas are guh~rossssssss!!! Can't be friends with someone with one! Even if you will never see/touch it! XD



I swear I can smell them! Vaginas are an afront to all that is good and decent and whatnot and the very idea that they exist is a source of such a strong discomfort that it's all I think about! That's JUST how GAAAY I AM! Thankyouverymuch


----------



## â™¥Mirandaâ™¥ (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Ever hear of knotcast?  It's vague sexism sprinkled with hypocrisy.



I know better than to expect maturity from a show whose name is a reference to cock

The only "sexism" I've seen within the fandom are gays who say "ew, vagina" when it's brought up


----------



## Rotsala (Nov 22, 2011)

Bears can smell the menstruation 

Also I heard of Knotcast but I've never listened to it because I assumed it was going to be a bunch of nerds talking about their fursona's penis


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## Grae Sparrowkin (Nov 22, 2011)

I'mma just sit here and listen, but only after I give my two cents:

Because the ladies love giant stuffed animals, or so the furry-boys think.

/shot


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## Trpdwarf (Nov 22, 2011)

Tybalt Maxwell said:


> I know better than to expect maturity from a show whose name is a reference to cock
> 
> The only "sexism" I've seen within the fandom are gays who say "ew, vagina" when it's brought up



I've seen several cases of sexism within the fandom. It's not uncommon.

Not too long ago there was a big stink because some gay guys (some of which have a rep for being sexist) reserved rooms to attend anthrocon. To help their costs come down they put out ads to get room-mates. They decided to post that only "guys" may apply. It pissed quite a few female furs off at a time when rooms were getting to be limited. You can take that how you will.

Countless times I have seen suiters mingle with groups of furs and when a group of gays realize the person behind the suit is female they get sudden bad attitudes. I myself have been subject to that when all I am doing is walking to the con center in suit. A bunch of guys "assume" i am a guy, and were acting all friendly and stuff. Then I spoke to my friend to ask something and when they heard a "Girl" voice behind that suit they all got hostile and began throwing me dirty looks. :/

I've also seen gays aggressively cut females out of group conversation(steering group convos to only be guy only when it's a diverse subject), and even seen in situations of planning situations where if you are a girl your opinion literally doesn't matter unless you can get guys to back you up on the same points. Also at some parties there tends to be a lot of endless slander and bitching towards the female sex.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Trpdwarf said:


> I've seen several cases of sexism within the fandom. It's not uncommon.
> 
> Not too long ago there was a big stink because some gay guys (some of which have a rep for being sexist) reserved rooms to attend anthrocon. To help their costs come down they put out ads to get room-mates. They decided to post that only "guys" may apply. It pissed quite a few female furs off at a time when rooms were getting to be limited. You can take that how you will.
> 
> ...


Is there any way that it could be combated?
Maybe a hardcore push in the opposite direction?  Like a push against sexists?


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 22, 2011)

Trpdwarf:

That's depressing. It's like if they considered girls their enemies because they'll "take away their precious" men or will try to hit on them, freudian rivalries and distaste much? 

Edit:
Or as if they thought only boys should exist, but perhaps I'm wrong in seeing this from a freudian angle.
Have tried to stand up to them and listen their supposed "reasons"?


----------



## Cocobanana (Nov 22, 2011)

@original question

Why not?


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

Cocobanana said:


> @original question
> 
> Why not?


Look at what Trpdwarf just wrote.


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Is there any way that it could be combated?
> Maybe a hardcore push in the opposite direction?  Like a push against sexists?




I know a solution that hasnt failed me yet. Punch the fuck out of them and make them scream like a little girl. Fuckin pussies.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 22, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> I know a solution that hasnt failed me yet. Punch the fuck out of them and make them scream like a little girl. Fuckin pussies.


Even though it can work person to person, you'd need River Tam to beat them all up.


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Even though it can work person to person, you'd need River Tam to beat them all up.




I dunno who that is but I have anger issues and I swear on my mothers grave if someone slurs a sexist or racist comment at me their tongue will taste blood and their ass will feel the earth. I do not tolerate it nor will I ever. What I hide beneath my clothing is irrelevant to the person I am.


----------



## israfur (Nov 22, 2011)

I don't mind people mistaking me for a guy online, I think it's very funny in all actuality. irl? Yeeaahh I would probably need a suit if I wanted to disguise my gender. I'm so happy my fursona is a mute. o___@


----------



## Cocobanana (Nov 22, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Look at what Trpdwarf just wrote.



Maybe guys assume that girls are always complaining about them too and feel left out?

At least, that's what I'd always thought based on some bad experiences though I try not to talk bad about anyone and if I do it's not cause they have boobs or not.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Cocobanana said:


> Maybe guys assume that girls are always complaining about them too and feel left out?
> 
> At least, that's what I'd always thought based on some bad experiences though I try not to talk bad about anyone and if I do it's not cause they have boobs or not.


It still doesn't justify that behavior.


*major edit*
If furries view their watchers as their personal army then get the popular furries to join our side.


----------



## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

damn it Cannon, I thought I said "No more stupid topics if you cant stop to think logically and common sense"


----------



## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

oh look an eversleep post

I'd start off with a warning like "don't bitch at me", but I know someone will, so I'll just leave it.
The following is bound to piss off males most likely.
Not  sure if it's proven or not, but aren't males more prone to certain  mental disorders and such? Including things that may make them  anti-social. Just look in special ed. classes and such, there's always a  shit-ton more males than females. Has to do with having XY instead of  XX I think. Females have the backup X so if one X is infected, the other  isn't and they don't get the disorder, but can still pass it down. With  males, they only have one X, so if it gets the disorder, they have it,  no backup. But enough science.
Basically, males are more likely to be  anti-social and nerdy. Not saying nerdiness or being a part of the  furry fandom is a social disorder of some sort... oh what the hell. Yes I  am saying that.
As for why they're all gay, I don't have a theory  for that as much. I think that it has something to do with the straight  socially awkward/nerdy guys not liking them for being gay, so they flock  to a fandom that is more accepting of it? But how it got that way in  the first place I don't know. I almost think gay guys are more likely to  act on "strange" fetishes than their straight counterparts are, because  they're already engaging in a sexual taboo to begin with, so why bother  hiding anything else? This is saying that someone fapping to anthros is  considered a strange fetish in itself with no other details given.

I'm  actually surprised girls would even admit to being part of the furry  fandom, but I have a few reasons why there are girls in the first place:
1)They want to feel special snowflake. "Look at me! I'm a girl in a male-dominated fandom! How cool am I!?".
2)They  have friends in it, and want to have more in common with said friends,  and want to make said friends feel like they're not weirdos. 
3)They  may for whatever reason want a nerdy guy for a boyfriend, and they know  that any straight male in the fandom will likely hit on them if they're  the only girl furry around for miles. Maybe they think furry guys are  more accepting and nice? I honestly don't know where I was going with  this.


----------



## Fay V (Nov 23, 2011)

Yup the only reason I joined the fandom was purely to obtain a boyfriend and attention. It's not like girls could actually like anthro animals at all.

Yep all female behavior is driven by the need to get attention, a boyfriend, or be part of the crowd. We don't need desires and thoughts of our own :3


----------



## DarrylWolf (Nov 23, 2011)

Whenever we compare a woman to an animal, it's usually negative. When we compare a man to animal, it's usually positive.

 From numerous sports teams with animal mascots, plus the intersection of other male-dominated fandoms, such as anime, filk, sci-fi, and online gaming, it should come as no surprise that the majority of Furries are men. But considering that they are the minority in the fandom, female Furries make a disproportionate amount of the artwork of the fandom, and that artwork is the fandom's defining feature.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Crysix Fousen said:


> damn it Cannon, I thought I said "No more stupid topics if you cant stop to think logically and common sense"


Well atleast Trpdwarf came up with a logical explanation.

And I just did have a logical thought, if there are few furries out there that view their watchers as their personal army annex the whole lot and as a result their watchers.  The reason being furries will always defend their fetishes and white knight and there will always be enough to replenish their numbers.  Cut the head of the drama off.
Let's say a popular user is posting sexist comments against women, focus on him and don't give a crap what the other people say.


----------



## Vega (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> oh look an eversleep post
> 
> I'd start off with a warning like "don't bitch at me", but I know someone will, so I'll just leave it.
> The following is bound to piss off males most likely.
> ...



Well, this is good logic, but this makes me feel quite pathetic....


----------



## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> *1)They want to feel special snowflake. "Look at me! I'm a girl in a male-dominated fandom! How cool am I!?".*


*insert something here about that girl needs to shut up and go watch her gay porn in the kitchen*

Sadly I bitch at girls who play video games, "please shut up and resume sniping, no one cared you were a girl before, they just saw a good sniper"


CannonFodder said:


> Well atleast Trpdwarf came up with a logical explanation.
> 
> And I just did have a logical thought, if there are few furries out  there that view their watchers as their personal army annex the whole  lot and as a result their watchers.  The reason being furries will  always defend their fetishes and white knight and there will always be  enough to replenish their numbers.  Cut the head of the drama off.
> Let's say a popular user is posting sexist comments against women, focus  on him and don't give a crap what the other people say.


problem:
Do furries have common sense to just ignore everyone and just kill the damn boss?
answer: some yes, some would take on their whole fanclub.

To me the problem is the person dont have to fight no more, their fan club is now doing all the work if the topic have gone on for a long while. If you catch them very early they will have to deal with you while hoping one of their fan club take over the fight....or they just outright block ya when you slowly destroy their logic


----------



## HyBroMcYenapants (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> oh look an eversleep post
> 
> I'd start off with a warning like "don't bitch at me", but I know someone will, so I'll just leave it.
> The following is bound to piss off males most likely.
> ...










Boi you ratchet.


----------



## Fay V (Nov 23, 2011)

Crysix Fousen said:


> *insert something here about that girl needs to shut up and go watch her gay porn in the kitchen*
> 
> Sadly I bitch at girls who play video games, "please shut up and resume sniping, no one cared you were a girl before, they just saw a good sniper"



I hate the twerps that want to go on and on about being a girl gamer. I also hate the assholes that hear a girl on the mic and have to stop all play. "hey girl, where you live? what's your number? whatcha wearing?" time and place boys, and the zombie apocalypse is not it.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Crysix Fousen said:


> problem:
> Do furries have common sense to just ignore everyone and just kill the damn boss?
> answer: some yes, some would take on their whole fanclub.
> 
> To me the problem is the person dont have to fight no more, their fan club is now doing all the work if the topic have gone on for a long while. If you catch them very early they will have to deal with you while hoping one of their fan club take over the fight....or they just outright block ya when you slowly destroy their logic


Well FaF is one of the few places that has enough sense to realize if you kill the boss the level is over.  There's a few other places, but they do exist.  I don't think anyone has proposed this yet actually.

From now on if a popular user is talking shit about women or anything we should just cut the head off the drama before it becomes a wildfire.


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## Cocobanana (Nov 23, 2011)

Yeah, women are cool dudes. Let em bro if they want to.


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## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Well FaF is one of the few places that has enough sense to realize if you kill the boss the level is over.  There's a few other places, but they do exist.  I don't think anyone has proposed this yet actually.
> 
> From now on if a popular user is talking shit about women or anything we should just cut the head off the drama before it becomes a wildfire.



oh good since I'm not popular I can resume being a complete asshole. brb making a journal about women need go to the kitchen and make me more tea


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## sunandshadow (Nov 23, 2011)

*pokes earlier comments about women not being that into gay porn, despite yaoi fangirls*  I do think interest in gay male romance has increased a lot among english-speaking females in the past 15 years or so.  I'd say as many as 1/3 of young american women like gay romance.  BUT, furry art doesn't engage that interest very well because anthros are rarely drawn like bishounen.  And women in general tend to prefer written entertainment, especially fanfic, to visual.  I do often see women writing Invader Zim fanfic and Avatar fanfic, which I'd include under the furry umbrella.


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## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

sunandshadow said:


> *pokes earlier comments about women not being that into gay porn, despite yaoi fangirls*  I do think interest in gay male romance has increased a lot among english-speaking females in the past 15 years or so.  I'd say as many as 1/3 of young american women like gay romance.  BUT, furry art doesn't engage that interest very well because anthros are rarely drawn like bishounen.  And women in general tend to prefer written entertainment, especially fanfic, to visual.  I do often see women writing Invader Zim fanfic and Avatar fanfic, which I'd include under the furry umbrella.


*deeply wishes they could smack you due to it being a joke*
psh anime fandom and furry is almost same, just dont disregard the writing in the fandom


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## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

Fay V said:


> I hate the twerps that want to go on and on about being a girl gamer. I also hate the assholes that hear a girl on the mic and have to stop all play. "hey girl, where you live? what's your number? whatcha wearing?" time and place boys, and the zombie apocalypse is not it.



You know whats worse? Girl gamers who use being a girl as a control tool. Well, yes, obviously its also the guys fault too, but still. On the Minecraft server I play at we have a girl like that. It goes something like this:

Girl: My castle would look so nice with a big lake, a ship and a dock. But we are in the middle of the land. How sad...
Guys: Yeeeesss misssstreesss, we will build it right awaaaay miiissstreesss... *mindless zombie mumblig*
-The guys bilt all that in three days with minimal sleep.
Girl: Wow, thankyou. Now all I need is a big gate made out of diamond blocks!
Guys: Yeeesss missstreeess, we will mine it at once miiissstreeess...

And so on, and so forth...


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## FoxPawed (Nov 23, 2011)

Trpdwarf said:


> I've seen several cases of sexism within the fandom. It's not uncommon.
> 
> Not too long ago there was a big stink because some gay guys (some of which have a rep for being sexist) reserved rooms to attend anthrocon. To help their costs come down they put out ads to get room-mates. They decided to post that only "guys" may apply. It pissed quite a few female furs off at a time when rooms were getting to be limited. You can take that how you will.
> 
> ...



See, that's just messed up.  The fandom is for everyone, at least I've always thought of it that way.  I'm a male hetero-furry for whatever all that means, and I've never felt unwelcome nor has it ever bothered me that there is a large gay community within the fandom.  I've always wanted to see some more girls around!

Mind you, I've always drawn less of "sexuality distinction" in roleplay scenario.  Ah well...


----------



## Perception (Nov 23, 2011)

Cause us guys have to have a place to go when were either really drunk or really high... Well atleast thats what i use it for i guess...


----------



## jeff (Nov 23, 2011)

Just putting in an idea on this whole gynophobic idea. I mean, the reason some guys probably get defensive when they realize they're talking to a woman is:
A) Women may (for at least some male nerds) represent the first portions of alienation for when they were becoming acclimated to adult society.
B) If A holds true, and this is a comfort-zone for alienated men then being rudely jerked out of that situation by your own misconceptions about someone is double-alienating. You have to question if this really is your comfort-zone and have to deal with something central to your personal alienation.

that happened once on a female-outreach BBS where a male psychologist was posing as a wheelchair-bound lesbian psychologist
and while everything he did arguably helped them, the moment they found out he was a man they were alienated from the process of using the internet to reach out to other women for support, considered the psychologist's advice invalidated, and were disgusted with themselves and him

And while the whole situation is pretty dissimilar (knowing subterfuge), if your underlying preconception is that everyone in a fursuit or in the fandom is a dude, and you have that psychological profile then there you go. It ends up being pretty much the same situation for you.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

FoxPawed said:


> See, that's just messed up.  The fandom is for everyone, at least I've always thought of it that way.  I'm a male hetero-furry for whatever all that means, and I've never felt unwelcome nor has it ever bothered me that there is a large gay community within the fandom.  I've always wanted to see some more girls around!


Well now you know who's fault it is, honestly from now on furries shouldn't let guys be assholes to women like what Trpdwarf said.  The problem is furries mindlessly uphold, "judge not your fellow fur", which also includes letting guys shun women and run them off.  Which is hypocritical actually cause like you said if furries are supposed to some sort of all encompassing tolerance circle jerk, mind you it's not in reality, than woman should be accepted as well.

tl:dr; furries are hypocrites


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> 1)They want to feel special snowflake. "Look at me! I'm a girl in a male-dominated fandom! How cool am I!?".
> 2)They  have friends in it, and want to have more in common with said friends,  and want to make said friends feel like they're not weirdos.
> 3)They  may for whatever reason want a nerdy guy for a boyfriend, and they know  that any straight male in the fandom will likely hit on them if they're  the only girl furry around for miles. Maybe they think furry guys are  more accepting and nice? I honestly don't know where I was going with  this.


1. No.
2. No.
3. No.

Why are your posts so stupid?


----------



## Dreaming (Nov 23, 2011)

I dunno, I don't really pay enough attention to the fandom as a whole to notice these things, honestly. 

Last time I heard, the amount of females in the fandom was at 20%, I think?

[now time for something _really_ silly] and where does this leave the androgynes/intersexed/neither?

(I guess its sort of like asking ''Why do most Furries come from the US'')


----------



## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Well now you know who's fault it is, honestly from now on furries shouldn't let guys be assholes to women like what Trpdwarf said.  The problem is furries mindlessly uphold, "judge not your fellow fur", which also includes letting guys shun women and run them off.  Which is hypocritical actually cause like you said if furries are supposed to some sort of all encompassing tolerance circle jerk, mind you it's not in reality, than woman should be accepted as well.
> 
> tl:dr; furries are hypocrites



it changed to "Let popular folks say what they want, degrade everyone else" :V


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

There are many reasons why, and a lot of it stems from how some men were raised around women (Sometimes mothers abuse their sons etc), how their peers approach it and they just jump on the peer-truck, or rejection from the opposite sex that later leads to misogyny. 

I was subjected to sexism at AC my first and second year as well as the furgroup I attend. Some men in the fandom do not value the opinion, or respect women in general. Most of the hostile anti-female behavior tends to come from the Jailhouse gays.




eversleep said:


> I'm  actually surprised girls would even admit to being part of the furry  fandom, but I have a few reasons why there are girls in the first place:
> 1)They want to feel special snowflake. "Look at me! I'm a girl in a male-dominated fandom! How cool am I!?".
> 2)They  have friends in it, and want to have more in common with said friends,  and want to make said friends feel like they're not weirdos.
> 3)They  may for whatever reason want a nerdy guy for a boyfriend, and they know  that any straight male in the fandom will likely hit on them if they're  the only girl furry around for miles. Maybe they think furry guys are  more accepting and nice? I honestly don't know where I was going with  this.



There's so much fail in this post...I don't even...
Think before you post.



Fay V said:


> I hate the twerps that want to go on and on about being a girl gamer. I also hate the assholes that hear a girl on the mic and have to stop all play. "hey girl, where you live? what's your number? whatcha wearing?" time and place boys, and the zombie apocalypse is not it.



Or "Is your pussy wet right now". 
I kid you not, someone in my raid during WOTLK whispered me that when he heard my voice, and there's a druid in my arena team that keeps asking my bust size because he wants to send me a birthday gift. >:V

The worse out of Girl gamers I despise is the fact that there are women who will take advantage of other men in guilds/raids and instigate drama. Several guilds have collapsed due to that. 

I play a game with others to be treated as an equal, not pampered like some toy poodle.


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## Fay V (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> There are many reasons why, and a lot of it stems from how some men were raised around women (Sometimes mothers abuse their sons etc), how their peers approach it and they just jump on the peer-truck, or rejection from the opposite sex that later leads to misogyny.
> 
> I was subjected to sexism at AC my first and second year as well as the furgroup I attend. Some men in the fandom do not value the opinion, or respect women in general. Most of the hostile anti-female behavior tends to come from the Jailhouse gays.
> 
> ...



I think Eversleep's post brought up a good point concerning the women issue. That is example A for just having no idea how to interact or understand women. If there's guys in the fandom that truly can not fathom that women are unable to enjoy the fandom simply because they want to then it becomes a defensive measure against people that aren't "true furries".
If there are those that honestly believe that participation is dependent on others with women then they will see it as disingenuous.

So in his fail Eversleep showed us that there are guys out there that just don't understand "women are the same as men and can like the same things"

As for the girl gamers thing. I hate that too, or guy gamers that use female avatars for the same reason. It's downright pathetic.


----------



## Aetius (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> The worse out of Girl gamers I despise is the fact that there are women who will take advantage of other men in guilds/raids and instigate drama. Several guilds have collapsed due to that.



Those people piss me off SO MUCH!


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## SnowyD (Nov 23, 2011)

@Zeke: The ventrilo server I regular on has a manipulative girl on it who has most the boys wrapped around her finger. I fill like I'm the only one who can call her out on anything I say, and then she gets super super super pissed. Like over the top pissed and wont log on for a week, and the guys blame me for it.


I think she is one of the dumbest people I've ever spoken to, classic "I can't think for myself because I'm too busy caring about how I look." females. She has no personality and is just a total bitch. One day....


----------



## LizardKing (Nov 23, 2011)

Fay V said:


> I think Eversleep's post brought up a good point concerning the women issue.



What?! An Eversleep post? I refuse to bel-



Fay V said:


> That is example A for just having no idea how to interact or understand women.



Oh :3


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## VoidBat (Nov 23, 2011)

I think most of this topic has been covered. 
The furry fandom is dominated by male nerds, just like most gamer communities and whatnot. If you drop in as a girl not only will you get harassed, but most likely you'll be chased by a horde of pimple-faced, testosterone-ridden and swollen manhippos.


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## Tao (Nov 23, 2011)

I've also heard the theory that the more fetishes you have, the more likely you'll be to get cyber-laid. Sexual orientation is arguably a fetish. That or everyone's just a bunch of homos.


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## Schwimmwagen (Nov 23, 2011)

I just can't understand _why_ nerd guys feel so repulsed by women. I mean, it's ok to not understand women, I know I don't. But this kind of misunderstanding of women from others sounds unfathomable to me.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Tao said:


> Sexual orientation  is arguably a fetish.


:\


Fay V said:


> I think Eversleep's post brought up a good point  concerning the women issue. That is example A for just having no idea  how to interact or understand women. If there's guys in the fandom that  truly can not fathom that women are unable to enjoy the fandom simply  because they want to then it becomes a defensive measure against people  that aren't "true furries".
> If there are those that honestly believe that participation is dependent  on others with women then they will see it as disingenuous.
> 
> So in his fail Eversleep showed us that there are guys out there that  just don't understand "women are the same as men and can like the same  things"
> ...


 It's not just furries, but it's still common belief that women have to like cooking and being in the kitchen.  
However still, just cause someone's female doesn't mean they can't be a furry.  I mean seriously, it's a abstract group of people that like fictional anthropomorphic characters; what is any reason why women can't find animal people cool as well?  A analogy would be furry is a tree clubhouse with, "no girls allowed" sign on the outside.


Crysix Fousen said:


> it changed to "Let popular folks say what they want, degrade everyone else" :V


  Well what I was getting as it is you can attack the mob for level grinding, but if a popufur reveals himself to be sexist against women everyone run dps against him, even the clerics.  Popufurs who hate women are like the level boss; if you win, even though you will still have to deal with the hordes of white knights, they will drop epic loot and the mobs of white knights defending the sexist popufur will scatter about.


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## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

SnowyD said:


> @Zeke: The ventrilo server I regular on has a manipulative girl on it who has most the boys wrapped around her finger. I fill like I'm the only one who can call her out on anything I say, and then she gets super super super pissed. Like over the top pissed and wont log on for a week, and the guys blame me for it.
> 
> 
> I think she is one of the dumbest people I've ever spoken to, classic "I can't think for myself because I'm too busy caring about how I look." females. She has no personality and is just a total bitch. One day....



You know...in late middle school, I used to beat up girls like that. 

The solution is to bring in another girl, or girls. The level of pride should drop and the other men will probably be too preoccupied with the amount of firls coming into the vent server. 
You should do that. :V



Fay V said:


> I think Eversleep's post brought up a good point concerning the women issue. That is example A for just having no idea how to interact or understand women. If there's guys in the fandom that truly can not fathom that women are unable to enjoy the fandom simply because they want to then it becomes a defensive measure against people that aren't "true furries".
> If there are those that honestly believe that participation is dependent on others with women then they will see it as disingenuous.



The glory of it, no gender can understand the other.
And you'd be surprised, there are men who think that. Men at least who have joined for getting "Teh secks" from other men. 





> As for the girl gamers thing. I hate that too, or guy gamers that use female avatars for the same reason. It's downright pathetic.



Some who use female avatars use it as a) Fap material or b) taking advantage of other males to extort ingame items or currency, or c) they like how it looks. It's worse when you are playing D&D and trying to teach a guy how a female character would act.



CannonFodder said:


> Well what I was getting as it is you can attack the mob for level grinding, but if a popufur reveals himself to be sexist against women everyone run dps against him, even the clerics.  Popufurs who hate women are like the level boss; if you win, even though you will still have to deal with the hordes of white knights, they will drop epic loot and the mobs of white knights defending the sexist popufur will scatter about.



People should learn how to use Crowd Control. Hunter traps work well on those pesky white Knight mobs. And Tanks who know how to tank them. :V


----------



## Lunar (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Ever seen yaoi fangirls?



I deal with them on a daily basis.
This thread makes me even more desperately want a fursuit of my clearly-female fursona.

EDIT: Dinosaurdammit, I fucking love you.  Just thought I'd let you know.  :V


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## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> The solution is to bring in another girl, or girls. The level of pride  should drop and the other men will probably be too preoccupied with the  amount of firls coming into the vent server.
> You should do that. :V
> 
> People should learn how to use Crowd Control. Hunter traps work well on those pesky white Knight mobs. And Tanks who know how to tank them. :V


For some odd reason whenever a group becomes homogeneous that leads to extreme disillusionment, bringing in more women would actually work.

Is it just me or is it odd how well the mmo analogies work?

To continue the mmo analogies in this case crowd control would getting other popufur people who are either neutral or oppose hatred of women to join our side and be vocal about it.  Like we could get someone we know would be on our side or switch to our side to become vocal about it.  In this case, if someone we know is popufur or there's someone popufur among us, since watchers will white knight the artist, get the artist  to post journals in our favor.


----------



## Elim Garak (Nov 23, 2011)

I have no problem with women at all, sure I make a sexist joke at times on teamspeak, and get them back from someone on teamspeak. It's all in good fun and nobody minds.

However I hate "gamer gurls" that go "DONT HIT ON ME U SILLY BOIS" and try to twist people of importance around their finger. Not every woman is like that of course, just some are. People should see there's a difference.

tl;dr: act normal and you are fine.


----------



## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

So, from now on, guys and girls should be treated the same. All of you, go to the kitchen and make me a sandwich! :V

Besides. You can understand girls and still treat them unfair, just like how you can't understand girls and treat them like any other person. So I think that its just the usual human nature at play, plus a little history based bias.


----------



## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> Some who use female avatars use it as a) Fap material or b) taking advantage of other males to extort ingame items or currency, or c) they like how it looks. It's worse when you are playing D&D and trying to teach a guy how a female character would act.



I admit to doing this on Video games, mainly in S4 League due to they give girls and guys different animations. I have seen folks complain on not being use to the other gender due to mainly playing one cause of the different animations.


then you get those damn games where a certain class is gender binded to like Vindictus. 

Though in the Idola clan we have a rule about never saying what your gender is, this is helped by a "No voice chat" rule that we are thinking about changing but you gotta morphed it.


we lose so much good female snipers cause they would openly state they are a chick D=

also its better to use decoys


----------



## shteev (Nov 23, 2011)

Women are awesome. Regardless of orientation, I don't see a reason why men should do such a thing.
However, joking is fine unless it's meant to be malicious.

I just don't see why anyone would go to such lengths to put someone else down for being, say, a member of the opposite gender.


----------



## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

shteev said:


> Women are awesome. Regardless of orientation, I don't see a reason why men should do such a thing.
> However, joking is fine unless it's meant to be malicious.
> 
> I just don't see why anyone would go to such lengths to put someone else down for being, say, a member of the opposite gender.



Its because of the thousands of years, when common belief was that males are superior. That belief wont go away fast.


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

lunar_helix said:


> Dinosaurdammit, I fucking love you.


Agreed.

I don't like babies, but lets make some, DD. :V


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Recel said:


> So, from now on, guys and girls should be treated the same. All of you, go to the kitchen and make me a sandwich! :V
> 
> Besides. You can understand girls and still treat them unfair, just like how you can't understand girls and treat them like any other person. So I think that its just the usual human nature at play, plus a little history based bias.


This is one of the few times furries totalitarian acceptance of everything under the sun can work to our advantage; by flipping it back on them and going, "if furries are supposed to be accepting then why are you treating women like shit?  It doesn't seem very accepting of you, you hypocrite".


shteev said:


> I just don't see why anyone would go to such  lengths to put someone else down for being, say, a member of the  opposite gender.


It's cause they have free reign to treat women like shit without having to fear any repercussions.


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

Recel said:


> Its because of the thousands of years, when common belief was that males are superior. That belief wont go away fast.



Nope.

If a girl beats a guy in a videogame or something, he has been dishonored and emasculated. A.K.A a pussy. :V

If a guy beats a girl in a videogame, he is superior and has proven his dominace that he is the powerful one and the woman shall remain in her place. :V


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> Nope.
> 
> If a girl beats a guy in a videogame or something, he has been dishonored and de-masculated. A.K.A a pussy. :V
> 
> If a guy beats a girl in a videogame, he is superior and has proven his dominace that he is the powerful one and the woman shall remain in her place. :V



Makes me grateful that I never lived in this kind of sexist environment. Whenever my sister defeats me in videogames, people mock me not because she's my sister but because she's younger than I am and supposedly less experienced in the game's secrets (admittedly, she plays Super Smash Bros a lot less than I do). How am I so sure? Younger players have defeated me before and the same reactions have been elicited.


----------



## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> This is one of the few times furries totalitarian acceptance of everything under the sun can work to our advantage; by flipping it back on them and going, "if furries are supposed to be accepting then why are you treating women like shit?  It doesn't seem very accepting of you, you hypocrite".
> 
> It's cause they have free reign to treat women like shit without having to fear any repercussions.



yea...
if this was YEARS ago, now we dont accept everything so that wont even work


----------



## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> Nope.
> 
> If a girl beats a guy in a videogame or something, he has been dishonored and emasculated. A.K.A a pussy. :V
> 
> If a guy beats a girl in a videogame, he is superior and has proven his dominace that he is the powerful one and the woman shall remain in her place. :V



With my usually flawless logic I'll prove why girls cant beat guys in video games. There is a reason why they always say girl in video games and not woman. Its because girl is a code word. G.I.R.L means Guy In Real Life. Thus its only guys beating guy, making other guys believe they are girls to increase the effects on being the victor!
*:V*
 (Dont hurt meeee! :C)


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> Makes me grateful that I never lived in this kind of sexist environment. Whenever my sister defeats me in videogames, people mock not because she's my sister but because she's younger than I am and supposedly less experienced in the game's secrets (admittedly, she plays Super Smash Bros a lot less than I do). How am I so sure? Younger players have defeated me before and the same reactions have been elicited.




My ex was the same way. When I'd play a fighting game that we both had knowledge of and I win (like tekken or Bloody roar), he would get embarassed, especially in front of friends, and make excuses to why he lost. In a game like Street fighter (Which I suck in), he brags on how awesome he is and no one can beat him...despite two other people could. 

And for younger kids, sometimes it is expected.



Recel said:


> With my usually flawless logic I'll prove why girls cant beat guys in video games. There is a reason why they always say girl in video games and not woman. Its because girl is a code word. G.I.R.L means Guy In Real Life. Thus its only guys beating guy, making other guys believe they are girls to increase the effects on being the victor!
> *:V*
> (Dont hurt meeee! :C)



With logic like that, you should become a professor. :V

But there's a lot to notice about sexism in the fandom. It sucks if you are a girl, and sometimes if you are a straight male it can be just as bad. I've heard comments at cons on how "so-and-so is straight...I can't believes he is a carpet muncher. He's too good looking to be dating girls" and "That guy with that girl over there. What. a. Skank. How can a guy like that date a girl like that? I bet if I speak to him, he'll be gay in a day" and my personal favorite that someone told me to my face "I am so jealous of your boyfriend. Can you ask him if he can come to my party, oh and don't worry about it, it's just guys. I guess you could come but it's a guy only party. Here's my number, give it to him and tell me what he says"...oh and "Your boyfriend must be bi or something because you have a male fursona". >.>

It can also be said that in the fandom...for the people looking to bang someone, girls can be seen as competition for getting the cute men they want, thus invoking hostilities against the opposite sex and spreading rumors and gossping like a....woman. :V


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Crysix Fousen said:


> yea...
> if this was YEARS ago, now we dont accept everything so that wont even work


I know, the thing though is that many furries still think the fandom is accepting of everything and that furries should be accepting of everything.  It'd be shoving their own words so far up their ass they're going to have to fart to talk, then again since furries tend to speak with their penis it's only a few inches of a difference.


----------



## Lunar (Nov 23, 2011)

Zenia said:


> Agreed.
> 
> I don't like babies, but lets make some, DD. :V



Threesome.  Aaaaawh yeah.

This thread looks like it kinda turned into which gender is better... Sexists just piss everyone off.  Fuck 'em.  And yes, I'm including the Feminazi's, too.


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> "That guy with that girl over there. What. a. Skank. How can a guy like that date a girl like that? I bet if I speak to him, he'll be gay in a day"


That is the one that bugs me. Pretty much the guys that say "All furry guys are gay, even if they think they are straight, it is only a matter of time!" ... WUT?! @VVVV@


----------



## Schwimmwagen (Nov 23, 2011)

lunar_helix said:


> This thread looks like it kinda turned into which gender is better... Sexists just piss everyone off.  Fuck 'em.  And yes, I'm including the Feminazi's, too.



I don't think gender equality can ever be achieved, anyway. For rights and such, *yes it can*, but you know, men and women do have different qualities. We'll always be different in some ways, don't forget that each sex compliments the existence of the other.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Zenia said:


> That is the one that bugs me. Pretty much the guys that say "All furry guys are gay, even if they think they are straight, it is only a matter of time!" ... WUT?! @VVVV@


It only goes to show how little furries tend to understand sexuality and/or the opposite sex.


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

Zenia said:


> That is the one that bugs me. Pretty much the guys that say "All furry guys are gay, even if they think they are straight, it is only a matter of time!" ... WUT?! @VVVV@



That urks me too. It's even moreso when they come to your face and ask you about your gender preference.



Gibby said:


> I don't think gender equality can ever be achieved, anyway. For rights and such, *yes it can*, but you know, men and women do have different qualities. We'll always be different in some ways, don't forget that each sex compliments the existence of the other.



I WANT TO BE TREATED AS A PERSON, NOT A "THING" WITH A PAIR OF BEWBS AND A TOOKIE!


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> With logic like that, you should become a professor. :V
> 
> But there's a lot to notice about sexism in the fandom. It sucks if you are a girl, and sometimes if you are a straight male it can be just as bad. I've heard comments at cons on how "so-and-so is straight...I can't believes he is a carpet muncher. He's too good looking to be dating girls" and "That guy with that girl over there. What. a. Skank. How can a guy like that date a girl like that? I bet if I speak to him, he'll be gay in a day" and my personal favorite that someone told me to my face "I am so jealous of your boyfriend. Can you ask him if he can come to my party, oh and don't worry about it, it's just guys. I guess you could come but it's a guy only party. Here's my number, give it to him and tell me what he says"...oh and "Your boyfriend must be bi or something because you have a male fursona". >.>
> 
> It can also be said that in the fandom...for the people looking to bang someone, girls can be seen as competition for getting the cute men they want, thus invoking hostilities against the opposite sex and spreading rumors and gossping like a....woman. :V



That last sentence is what I was thinking a few pages back. I can't believe it actually has a sort of justification! 
My mind has been blown because of this sex-crazed-horny-cumbag logic... a teacher of mine once said "Gay men are women's biggest secret enemies", seems like he wasn't too far off. The sad thing is that those guys don't seem to be joking... I'm sad, knowing that makes me sad.


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> That last sentence is what I was thinking a few pages back. I can't believe it actually has a sort of justification!
> My mind has been blown because of this sex-crazed-horny-cumbag logic... a teacher of mine once said "Gay men are women's biggest secret enemies", seems like he wasn't too far off. The sad thing is that those guys don't seem to be joking... I'm sad, knowing that makes me sad.



Don't be. And it also applies to lesbians as well with men.


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> Don't be. And it also applies to lesbians as well with men.



*Sad-but-not-too-sad face*
And heterosexuals probably do it as well. It's incredible that this kind of selfishness and objectification exists, of course there are worse, but this is on a more relatable and closer level.


----------



## morphology (Nov 23, 2011)

I've been mulling over this topic in my head, seeing as I've gotten the cold shoulder for lacking a Y chromosome a few times before.  What can we do to kinda change this?  I mean, if a group has sexism heavily ingrained in their heads, its going to be extremely hard if not impossible to change that.  The only thing I can think of is to call folks out on it when it occurs, and contribute to the fandom positively in ways that show regardless of gender, we can all enjoy the fandom?


----------



## Antonin Scalia (Nov 23, 2011)

Feelin offended at these thread posters on my hardcore animal fetish forum, the cisgendered heteronormative majority strikes again (mods?!).  also I have only one testicle that allows me to posses Wicked Cool Internet Superpowers


----------



## BRN (Nov 23, 2011)

Antonin Scalia said:


> cisgendered heteronormative majority



she is hilarious, I read her posts every night for a laugh


----------



## General-jwj (Nov 23, 2011)

This thread made me RAEG some but DD and Zeke are in great shape so it's still fun to read.

And this thread made me think ... why are there so many gays in this community ? I don't even get what's so special about it.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

morphology said:


> I've been mulling over this topic in my head, seeing as I've gotten the cold shoulder for lacking a Y chromosome a few times before.  What can we do to kinda change this?  I mean, if a group has sexism heavily ingrained in their heads, its going to be extremely hard if not impossible to change that.  The only thing I can think of is to call folks out on it when it occurs, and contribute to the fandom positively in ways that show regardless of gender, we can all enjoy the fandom?


As a group beat the shit out of sexists(metaphorically), they've been given free reign to treat women like shit for decades with no consequences. No more I say.


General-jwj said:


> And this thread made me think ... why are there so many gays in this community ? I don't even get what's so special about it.


I actually experienced why firsthand, someone I know that is a gay male and was friends with for a bit found out that I was a furry.  He asked if there really was a large population of gay guys. I replied honestly and his reaction was, "hot damn, where do I sign up?"


----------



## Kinuki (Nov 23, 2011)

Gibby said:


> I don't think gender equality can ever be achieved, anyway. For rights and such, *yes it can*, but you know, men and women do have different qualities. We'll always be different in some ways, don't forget that each sex compliments the existence of the other.


Maybe in case of organs, but you can't reduce people to an absolute set of gender-specific character traits. Women with "masculine" and men with "feminine" skills and traits make a mockery of this paradigm. Don't forget, such flawed argumentation was used to deny women suffrage until the 20th century.


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> I actually experienced why firsthand, someone I know that is a gay male and was friends with for a bit found out that I was a furry.  He asked if there really was a large population of gay guys. I replied honestly and his reaction was, "hot damn, where do I sign up?"



I feel like I should be laughing at this really hard and wondering if the guy is that desperate.
But instead I'm going to ask, was it like this from the beginning? I know that the first "furry-con" apprently was held during the 80's and started like a sort of accepting place for gay men and their fetishes (or something of the sort), but how come this trend has somehow continued? I mean, it cannot be a coincidence that the fandom is so focused on male homosexuality, can it?


----------



## FoxPawed (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Well now you know who's fault it is, honestly from now on furries shouldn't let guys be assholes to women like what Trpdwarf said.  The problem is furries mindlessly uphold, "judge not your fellow fur", which also includes letting guys shun women and run them off.  Which is hypocritical actually cause like you said if furries are supposed to some sort of all encompassing tolerance circle jerk, mind you it's not in reality, than woman should be accepted as well.
> 
> tl:dr; furries are hypocrites




We're all human, and human nature is sometimes stupid.  I will speak out against any sort of intolerance or sexism when I see it, but honestly I think a lot of the time we don't see it -- only the people who are targeted do.

Furries SHOULD be tolerant.  LOOK AT US!  Who are we not to tolerate?  (well, I mean, we all hate pedophiles...  but that's ok right?  lol)


----------



## Schwimmwagen (Nov 23, 2011)

Kinuki said:


> Maybe in case of organs, but you can't reduce people to an absolute set of gender-specific character traits. Women with "masculine" and men with "feminine" skills and traits make a mockery of this paradigm. Don't forget, such flawed argumentation was used to deny women suffrage until the 20th century.



I'm making a generalisation here. A generalisation founded upon thousands of years of being largely correct. I'm not ignoring the fact that there's the odd few here and there who are either masculine women or feminine men. I'm saying that we will always have differences to be found in the majority of people, as well as similarities. And you talking about my argumentation being used to deny women suffrage is irrelevant - I said that we can and should have equality in terms of rights, but regardless of that, the general population of men and women will still have a lot of ways of being different, with some similarities that people need to stop ignoring or treating as if they're alien.


----------



## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

Okay, so the second part of my post was wrong. It was just a joke anyway. I know that girls in the fandom just like anthromorphic style artwork and that's why they're a part of it. 
But nobody argued against the first half of my post- that being XY means getting weird social disorders that cause a guy to join the furry fandom. So I guess you all agree with that?...


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> Okay, so the second part of my post was wrong. *It was just a joke anyway*. I know that girls in the fandom just like anthromorphic style artwork and that's why they're a part of it.



The ":V" symbol exists for a reason. In any case, it didn't seem like a joke to any of us.


----------



## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

FoxPawed said:


> We're all human, and human nature is sometimes stupid.  I will speak out against any sort of intolerance or sexism when I see it, but honestly I think a lot of the time we don't see it -- only the people who are targeted do.
> 
> Furries SHOULD be tolerant.  LOOK AT US!  Who are we not to tolerate?  (well, I mean, we all hate pedophiles...  but that's ok right?  lol)



Good thing about tolerance it allows me to say "I dont like you" still :V







no I mean it... I dont like you already in the 3 posts you made



eversleep said:


> Okay, so the second part of my post was wrong.  It was just a joke anyway. I know that girls in the fandom just like  anthromorphic style artwork and that's why they're a part of it.
> But nobody argued against the first half of my post- that being XY means  getting weird social disorders that cause a guy to join the furry  fandom. So I guess you all agree with that?...


no cause your whole post was full of stupid :V


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> I feel like I should be laughing at this really hard and wondering if the guy is that desperate.
> But instead I'm going to ask, was it like this from the beginning? I know that the first "furry-con" apprently was held during the 80's and started like a sort of accepting place for gay men and their fetishes (or something of the sort), but how come this trend has somehow continued? I mean, it cannot be a coincidence that the fandom is so focused on male homosexuality, can it?


Short version after a clusterfuck of drama back in the day a couple of stereotypical gay guys who were sexist and against heterosexuals joined and with them introduced a trainwreck of retardation.  It's continued on cause they basically introduced a bunch of the stupid shit we see furries do, like hugboxing, calling people trolls, etc.

I'll draw a picture for you, stereotypical person a joins groups, but stereotypical person wants more stereotypical people like him in the group that way there's more people like him.
So person a tells person b lies about the group being exactly like them, person b joins and primarily hangs out with person a who is like him.  But that's not enough, persons a and b now believe the lies person a told person b cause since they both hang out with only each other they begin to believe it.  So persons a and b tell persons c and d about how they view the group.  Persons c and d join.  Persons a, b, c and d begin to be excited that there's people with similar interests inside the fandom even though they caused it.  So persons a, b, c and d tell persons e, f, g and h about the group.  After persons e, f, g and h join they all tell persons i, j, k, l, m, n, o and p about the group and they wind up joining as well.  Skip a couple decades and you have a ton of people who act similarly.

tl:dr; "somebody poisoned the waterhole!"


FoxPawed said:


> We're all human, and human nature is sometimes stupid.  I will speak out against any sort of intolerance or sexism when I see it, but honestly I think a lot of the time we don't see it -- only the people who are targeted do.


Alot of people don't see it cause being a woman furry automatically makes her a target.


----------



## Antonin Scalia (Nov 23, 2011)

being gay "for the win"


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Short version after a clusterfuck of drama back in the day a bunch of stereotypical gay guys who were sexist and against heterosexuals joined and with them introduced a trainwreck of retardation.  It's continued on cause they basically introduced a bunch of the stupid shit we see furries do, like hugboxing, calling people trolls, etc.
> 
> I'll draw a picture for you, stereotypical person a joins groups, but stereotypical person wants more stereotypical people like him in the group that way there's more people like him.
> So person a tells person b lies about the group being exactly like them, person b joins and primarily hangs out with person a who is like him.  But that's not enough, persons a and b now believe the lies person a told person b cause since they both hang out with only each other they begin to believe it.  So persons a and b tell persons c and d about how they view the group.  Persons c and d join.  Persons a, b, c and d begin to be excited that there's people with similar interests inside the fandom even though they caused it.  So persons a, b, c and d tell persons e, f, g and h about the group.  After persons e, f, g and h join they all tell persons i, j, k, l, m, n, o and p about the group and they wind up joining as well.  Skip a couple decades and you have a ton of people who act similarly.



This scenario strikes me as really... odd, but probably because I'm thinking in terms of weird stuff (after all, it's no different from recommending a series). So it's basically a matter of that, advertising the fandom as an universally accepting and tolerant placen for all sorts of people, including freaks. Seems plausible to me (thinking in terms of vocal minorities that-you-wouldn't-suspect).


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> This scenario strikes me as really... odd, but probably because I'm thinking in terms of weird stuff (after all, it's no different from recommending a series). So it's basically a matter of that, advertising the fandom as an universally accepting and tolerant placen for all sorts of people, including freaks. Seems plausible to me (thinking in terms of vocal minorities that-you-wouldn't-suspect).


While it may be a short summary of several drama storms over the course of years, the best analogy I can think of was the original freaks in the fandom were like a little kid having a screaming tantrum for hours to the point the parent eventually caved in.  The problem is that all the drama we've seen is basically the parent trying to take away their toy and as a result the kid begins screaming again as soon as you try.

If the fandom ever reached the point where treating women like shit isn't acceptable they'd probably throw a massive tantrum and wouldn't give up until they got their way.


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## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

Crysix Fousen said:


> Good thing about tolerance it allows me to say "I dont like you" still :V
> 
> 
> 
> ...


First of all, that's very intolerant, don't judge someone by 3 posts.

And the post was not stupid, the XY being more disorder-prone is actually true, I learned it in school. But some girls get social disorders too if both X's are infected. That's why girl furries exist.


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## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> That's why girl furries exist.


No it isn't.


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## Vega (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> The ":V" symbol exists for a reason.



That it does.
All hail the mighty  *:V*  forever will it hold our community together!

:V
------------------------------------------------

As for the subject at hand, who knows why the majority of the Furry community is gay?  This isn't one of those questions where we can hope to find an actual answer.  At least for me.


----------



## General-jwj (Nov 23, 2011)

Vega said:


> As for the subject at hand, who knows why the majority of the Furry community is gay?  This isn't one of those questions where we can hope to find an actual answer.  At least for me.



I wouldn't venture as far as to say it's in majority gay, but no one can deny there is a much higher concentration of gay people within the fandom than elsewhere. Just look at the "sexual orientation" thread. Though people who voted "straight" are still the majority(26.5%), there are also ~19% of "purely" gay people, and if you count bisexuals too (or even just "homosexual leaning bisexuals") they become a very clear majority.

I still don't have the darnedest idea as to why this occurs ... but the numbers speak for themselves.


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

Vega said:


> who knows why the majority of the Furry community is gay?


I know someone who says that the majority of the furry community is straight (or bi)... but I just can't believe that.

Well, there may be lots more bi guys than I know of... but if they only show preference for other guys, how would I know?


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

Furries you would think would be most tolerant of gender considering all the kinks in it. That being said if someone thinks my place is in the kitchen- fine, I like it in there- come in my kitchen and I will cut you. Want a sammich? TOO FUCKIN BAD >:C




eversleep said:


> First of all, that's very intolerant, don't judge someone by 3 posts.
> 
> And the post was not stupid, the XY being more disorder-prone is actually true, I learned it in school. But some girls get social disorders too if both X's are infected. That's why girl furries exist.



Do you think before you have a diarrhea spell on the keyboard?


----------



## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

Zenia said:


> I know someone who says that the majority of the furry community is straight (or bi)... but I just can't believe that.
> 
> Well, there may be lots more bi guys than I know of... but if they only show preference for other guys, how would I know?



Detectives starter case from Hasbro. I rest my case. :V


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> come in my kitchen and I will cut you. Want a sammich? TOO FUCKIN BAD >:C


hahaha! Yes. I like this post.

Maek babby?


----------



## Dreaming (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> First of all, that's very intolerant, don't judge someone by 3 posts.
> 
> And the post was not stupid, the XY being more disorder-prone is actually true, I learned it in school. But some girls get social disorders too if both X's are infected. That's why girl furries exist.


----------



## General-jwj (Nov 23, 2011)

Is it just me, or is eversleep's post quality getting steadily worse by the day -nay- by the hour ?


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

Zenia said:


> hahaha! Yes. I like this post.
> 
> Maek babby?




I cant :<

Can we just share the one I already have? :>


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> I cant :<


We'll just pretend like we can make one. :>

jwj: I think so as well.


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> First of all, that's very intolerant, don't judge someone by 3 posts.
> 
> And the post was not stupid, the XY being more disorder-prone is actually true, I learned it in school. But some girls get social disorders too if both X's are infected. That's why girl furries exist.



As far as I'm concerned, one is enough.
Also, I... hope you're "kidding".


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Zenia said:


> I know someone who says that the majority of the furry community is straight (or bi)... but I just can't believe that.
> 
> Well, there may be lots more bi guys than I know of... but if they only show preference for other guys, how would I know?


Speaking of which I found out that some of the people who are assholes to women vote multiple times on the furry survey under proxies.  So considering there's people out there that hateful and trying that hard just to create a confirmation bias, the furry survey is void.


dinosaurdammit said:


> Furries you would think would be most tolerant of gender considering all the kinks in it. That being said if someone thinks my place is in the kitchen- fine, I like it in there- come in my kitchen and I will cut you. Want a sammich? TOO FUCKIN BAD >:C


Furries have turned hypocrisy into a profession.

I guess DD is the furry survey of, "cupcakes", except the sandwich meat is soylent green.


----------



## Onnes (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Speaking of which I found out that some of the people who are assholes to women vote multiple times on the furry survey under proxies.  So considering there's people out there that hateful and trying that hard just to create a confirmation bias, the furry survey is void.



The survey isn't inconsistent with prior surveys done at conventions, which wouldn't have any issues with multiple voting.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

^The quote button is screwing up.

I know, it just means we should take the surveys with a grain of salt.


----------



## Kinuki (Nov 23, 2011)

Gibby said:


> A generalisation founded upon thousands of years of being largely correct.


We underwent massive cultural evolution since the hunter-gatherer epoch, though, and we rose above the rigid gender roles and segregation of old. Regressing to them would be harmful and disruptive for our modern, complex societies that need equally complex, multifaceted people. We shouldn't restrict one's personality to predetermined, ultimately arbitrary gender-specific limitations that, as is often the case, neurobiology debunks as not actually existent anyway.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Kinuki said:


> We underwent massive cultural evolution since the hunter-gatherer epoch, though, and we rose above the rigid gender roles and segregation of old. Regressing to them would be harmful and disruptive for our modern, complex societies that need equally complex, multifaceted people. We shouldn't restrict one's personality to predetermined, ultimately arbitrary gender-specific limitations that, as is often the case, neurobiology debunks as not actually existent anyway.


There was actually a study a while back into sociocultural evolution as compared to previous eras.  Short version is we're societally evolving as a accelerated rate.
Meaning towards the end of our lifetimes we're all going to be going, "daayyyuuummm" in shock.


----------



## Verin Asper (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> First of all, that's very intolerant, don't judge someone by 3 posts.
> 
> And the post was not stupid, the XY being more disorder-prone is actually true, I learned it in school. But some girls get social disorders too if both X's are infected. That's why girl furries exist.



First of all I'm an asshole
Second I do accept being intolerant at times...cause I'm an asshole
third you're an idiot, you can have my job as the forum moron if you want


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

And as I recall I dont have some learning disorder because I happen to be a female furfag. I am a female- who, LE GASP happens to like animal head people. Or I could be egyptian. WHO KNOWS.

Tune in next week when we discover the in-depth look at assburgers.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> And as I recall I dont have some learning disorder because I happen to be a female furfag. I am a female- who, LE GASP happens to like animal head people. Or I could be egyptian. WHO KNOWS.
> 
> Tune in next week when we discover the in-depth look at assburgers.


If you ask me furries who claim that female furries must-
1)have something wrong with them
2)want to be special snowflakes
themselves have assburgers, want to be special snowflakes and have something wrong with them.


----------



## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> And as I recall I dont have some learning disorder because I happen to be a female furfag. I am a female- who, LE GASP happens to like animal head people. Or I could be egyptian. WHO KNOWS.
> 
> Tune in next week when we discover the in-depth look at assburgers.



Blasphemy! You talk like a guy, you act like a guy, you are a furry like a guy and ofcourse you think your a girl like a guy! So you are a guy! :V


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

Recel said:


> Blasphemy! You talk like a guy, you act like a guy, you are a furry like a guy and ofcourse you think your a girl like a guy! So you are a guy! :V




But I dun have a penis ;~;


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> Tune in next week when we discover the in-depth look at assburgers.


Yay! Assburgers!



dinosaurdammit said:


> But I dun have a penis ;~;


Awwwwww!


Yeah, I am a female furry... I can assure you that I don't have a learning/social disorder.


----------



## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> But I dun have a penis ;~;



Ill send you one. Now, where did I put that kitchen knife and the post stamps... :V


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

Zenia said:


> Yay! Assburgers!
> 
> Awwwwww!
> 
> ...



Only social disorder I have is I tend to punch people who are retarded or self absorbed assholes.


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## Fenrari (Nov 23, 2011)

Because girls and guys like drawing sausages :V

Which is to say many female artists get hired by gay guys and as such feel comfortable drawing such subject matter.


----------



## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

Relax everybody, I was kidding again.
The females within the fandom are usually the sane, "normal" furries that actually make furries look better (well, that's just a general assumption... we all know of one female who made furries look even worse).
I tend to find that males usually do have problems though. Whenever there's a school shooting or something, who causes it? Males. Most of the crimes committed? Males. Except prostitution, but I don't blame anyone for doing that because it's hard to make a living nowadays, and sometimes people need to feed themselves, and their kids if they have any. But it seems like there are more "defective" males than there are females. Which is why it seems like XY has a signifigantly higher chance of having something wrong with it. All the weird "stalker" type people are males. Males seem more likely to commit suicide. Males are more likely to be deemed as "outcasts" and misfits due to there being certain standards for males to follow- males have to be tough, athletic, straight, etc. Stray from the basics, and you've become someone that is hated by everyone in your high school. When everyone rejects you, where else to turn to but the furry fandom, which is full of misfit guys anyway? Sorry for this post to be so anti-male, it's just I feel like nowadays it's almost a curse if you're born a guy who doesn't fit the mold. People treat females nicer than males. 

What I'm getting at is males are part of nerd fandoms because they have a harder time being accepted into society. So there.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

^Eversleep you do realize you are using a eugenics argument right?


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> Relax everybody, I was kidding again.
> The females within the fandom are usually the sane, "normal" furries that actually make furries look better (well, that's just a general assumption... we all know of one female who made furries look even worse).
> I tend to find that males usually do have problems though. Whenever there's a school shooting or something, who causes it? Males. Most of the crimes committed? Males. Except prostitution, but I don't blame anyone for doing that because it's hard to make a living nowadays, and sometimes people need to feed themselves, and their kids if they have any. But it seems like there are more "defective" males than there are females. Which is why it seems like XY has a signifigantly higher chance of having something wrong with it. All the weird "stalker" type people are males. Males seem more likely to commit suicide. Males are more likely to be deemed as "outcasts" and misfits due to there being certain standards for males to follow- males have to be tough, athletic, straight, etc. Stray from the basics, and you've become someone that is hated by everyone in your high school. When everyone rejects you, where else to turn to but the furry fandom, which is full of misfit guys anyway? Sorry for this post to be so anti-male, it's just I feel like nowadays it's almost a curse if you're born a guy who doesn't fit the mold. People treat females nicer than males.
> 
> What I'm getting at is males are part of nerd fandoms because they have a harder time being accepted into society. So there.



Liar. Stop lyinng and go sit in a corner.


----------



## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> ^Eversleep you do realize you are using a eugenics argument right?


Nope... what's eugenics?
And I'm not lying, say all you want, I'm telling the truth.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> Nope... what's eugenics?


http://lmgtfy.com/?q=eugenics

Eugenics and logic like your's has been responsible for ungodly amounts of atrocities against mankind.


----------



## Owllette (Nov 23, 2011)

I'm a bit late here, but just to throw in another number, I am a female... No actual "disorders" but I never fit in well at school, so I dropped out. I'm really shy and a bit awkward, but nothing wrong with me that I know of.


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

Eversleep- have you ever been in the company of females? Do you realize how hard it is for females to fit into groups. Women are nasty vile back stabbing creatures who go after every single other girl with the slight difference. I dont know how most survive middle and high school.


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> Eversleep- have you ever been in the company of females? Do you realize how hard it is for females to fit into groups. Women are nasty vile back stabbing creatures who go after every single other girl with the slight difference. I dont know how most survive middle and high school.



Only the insecure girls do, the others who are mellow and looking to fit in don't have as much of a problem.


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> I was kidding again.


Shush up and take your lumps. Saying "I was kidding" after being told you are being stupid just looks extra stupid.


----------



## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> Eversleep- have you ever been in the company of females? Do you realize how hard it is for females to fit into groups. Women are nasty vile back stabbing creatures who go after every single other girl with the slight difference. I dont know how most survive middle and high school.


Yes, I've had females stab my back and be bitchy to me before, a lot, and it truly was not my fault. I only have a few female friends, because for some reason, most females can't stand me. The ones that can though are the types that are usually in a good mood all the time and have thicker skin than most. Not that I find myself brutally offensive, it's just sometimes what I say can be taken the wrong way.
I realize a lot of women do fight with each other, and damn, they hold grudges forever... once you do something even slightly negative to a girl, she'll never forgive you. But that's not my point. I've seen girls go after each other due to difference, but girls usually do find friends eventually. Males don't always. Females seem to have more success stories than males do. I'm in no way saying girls have anything easy, especially due to things like menstruation, pregnancy, and higher chance of getting raped, but in this one specific social area, males have it worse. Just realize that guys don't always have everything better and aren't always treated better.


----------



## Owllette (Nov 23, 2011)

Also, as a side note from me- Zenia, your avatar is adorable.


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> Only the insecure girls do, the others who are mellow and looking to fit in don't have as much of a problem.




So like 95% of the population of females are insecure- got it. :U

I am serious when I say that I mentor kids in high school and they love the hell out of me because I tell them to grow the fuck up or die. It is pretty much true. I try to mentor the bullies more than the bullied. If you threaten them with the promise of them being killed off in a sniper attack because a fellow student they bullied got to the end of their rope and went on a snap spree it generally fixes their insecurities. 

So kids remember you bully someone you might just get shot. AND IT WOULD BE YOUR FUCKING CUNT ASS THAT CAUSED IT


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> because for some reason, most females can't stand me


No fucking wonder, if I knew you irl I would avoid you like the plague.


----------



## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> Yes, I've had females stab my back and be bitchy to me before, a lot, and it truly was not my fault.


Or so you think. You come off to me as a little oblivious, so it might have been your fault and you just don't know it.



Owllette said:


> Also, as a side note from me- Zenia, your avatar is adorable.


 Thanks Owllette!


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> No fucking wonder, if I knew you irl I would avoid you like the plague.



Agreed. If I met you in RL and you talked the way you posted you would be missing some teeth.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> Agreed. If I met you in RL and you talked the way you posted you would be missing some teeth.


One of these days one of the few women eversleep knows is just going to flip out and cut his dick off.

He's a prime example of the people we've been talking about.


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> So like 95% of the population of females are insecure- got it. :U
> 
> I am serious when I say that I mentor kids in high school and they love the hell out of me because I tell them to grow the fuck up or die. It is pretty much true. I try to mentor the bullies more than the bullied. If you threaten them with the promise of them being killed off in a sniper attack because a fellow student they bullied got to the end of their rope and went on a snap spree it generally fixes their insecurities.
> 
> So kids remember you bully someone you might just get shot. AND IT WOULD BE YOUR FUCKING CUNT ASS THAT CAUSED IT



There are girls in my neighborhood that DESPISE me. 
Seriously. I carry myself a in a way that shows I am confident. 3 years ago, one girl picked a fight with me while I was walking home with groceries....and I am dealing with another that keeps making trouble at my workplace. The thing that makes most back down is the fact that I am intimidating.


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## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

I wouldn't talk like how I posted on here, and you can't say that you'd hate me IRL if you never met me IRL and you have no idea how I'd act. The only people who do hate me IRL are idiots to begin with, and intolerant assholes.
Also girls hating me really wasn't my fault, only one of them was my fault. The one that wasn't my fault was a girl I used to be good friends with, she stopped being friends with me because a friend of mine went out with her and he treated her like shit, and she blames me for it, as if I told him to do that. I can't control how my other friend treats her. She also said she stopped being friends with me because she hated my brother. I hate him too, and again, I can't control him. She's done similar "un-friending" to others as well, so it isn't just me. Strangely, she only does it to guys. She's kind of a feminist and she's bisexual. Also she only does it to guys who are straight (I'm closeted so I count). She's a yaoi fangirl so she loves teh gheys, but usually only the real homogay flambouyant-as-fuck sissy types. I've tried sincerely apologizing to her various times. She wouldn't talk to me, I had to get her friends to tell her I said sorry. I had to leave notes on her desk in school. She wouldn't accept an apology, over shit I didn't even do. Long story short, she's mentally whack and maybe I'm better off not being friends with her.
Other girls don't like me just because they're bitchy and can't handle anyone who's different than they are, even subtle differences.


----------



## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> I wouldn't talk like how I posted on here, and you can't say that you'd hate me IRL if you never met me IRL and you have no idea how I'd act. The only people who do hate me IRL are idiots to begin with, and intolerant assholes.



You just keep shooting yourself in the foot so violently... shall I laugh? Feel pity? Disgust? I don't know.


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> I wouldn't talk like how I posted on here, and you can't say that you'd hate me IRL if you never met me IRL and you have no idea how I'd act. The only people who do hate me IRL are idiots to begin with, and intolerant assholes.
> Also girls hating me really wasn't my fault, only one of them was my fault. The one that wasn't my fault was a girl I used to be good friends with, she stopped being friends with me because a friend of mine went out with her and he treated her like shit, and she blames me for it, as if I told him to do that. I can't control how my other friend treats her. She also said she stopped being friends with me because she hated my brother. I hate him too, and again, I can't control him. She's done similar "un-friending" to others as well, so it isn't just me. Strangely, she only does it to guys. She's kind of a feminist and she's bisexual. Also she only does it to guys who are straight (I'm closeted so I count). She's a yaoi fangirl so she loves teh gheys, but usually only the real homogay flambouyant-as-fuck sissy types. I've tried sincerely apologizing to her various times. She wouldn't talk to me, I had to get her friends to tell her I said sorry. I had to leave notes on her desk in school. She wouldn't accept an apology, over shit I didn't even do. Long story short, she's mentally whack and maybe I'm better off not being friends with her.
> Other girls don't like me just because they're bitchy and can't handle anyone who's different than they are, even subtle differences.




I dunno about you but I can hate people for no reason. You say one thing that rubs me the wrong way and I will fucking hate you. Its not just girls who are like this. Men too. My husband can git irked ONCE and be FURever angry at someone and hate their fucking life force. Also the girl you speak of sounds like a cunt and could use a good boot to the vag


----------



## Evan of Phrygia (Nov 23, 2011)

that last sentence was completely hypocritical, eversleep


----------



## Xeno (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> I wouldn't talk like how I posted on here, and you can't say that you'd hate me IRL if you never met me IRL and you have no idea how I'd act. The only people who do hate me IRL are idiots to begin with, and intolerant assholes.
> Also girls hating me really wasn't my fault, only one of them was my fault. The one that wasn't my fault was a girl I used to be good friends with, she stopped being friends with me because a friend of mine went out with her and he treated her like shit, and she blames me for it, as if I told him to do that. I can't control how my other friend treats her. She also said she stopped being friends with me because she hated my brother. I hate him too, and again, I can't control him. She's done similar "un-friending" to others as well, so it isn't just me. Strangely, she only does it to guys. She's kind of a feminist and she's bisexual. Also she only does it to guys who are straight (I'm closeted so I count). She's a yaoi fangirl so she loves teh gheys, but usually only the real homogay flambouyant-as-fuck sissy types. I've tried sincerely apologizing to her various times. She wouldn't talk to me, I had to get her friends to tell her I said sorry. I had to leave notes on her desk in school. She wouldn't accept an apology, over shit I didn't even do. Long story short, she's mentally whack and maybe I'm better off not being friends with her.
> Other girls don't like me just because they're bitchy and can't handle anyone who's different than they are, even subtle differences.


No offense eversleep, but you aren't really helping yourself any.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> You just keep shooting yourself in the foot so violently... shall I laugh? Feel pity? Disgust? I don't know.


Disgust; cause it's people like Eversleep that are responsible for the fandom having a higher percentage of guys, cause women don't fucking want to deal with people like him.


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Disgust; cause it's people like Eversleep that are responsible for the fandom having a higher percentage of guys, cause women don't fucking want to deal with people like him.



And that's how women-hating Jailhouse gays are born. :V


----------



## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> I dunno about you but I can hate people for no reason. You say one thing that rubs me the wrong way and I will fucking hate you. Its not just girls who are like this. Men too. My husband can git irked ONCE and be FURever angry at someone and hate their fucking life force. Also the girl you speak of sounds like a cunt and could use a good boot to the vag


Really? You should see a psychologist about that. Hating people for no reason isn't good. 
And the funny thing is karma came back and the same shit happened to her. One of her friends randomly stopped being friends with her, she claims it was "for no reason" and she was all butthurt about it. I laughed. Bitch got what she deserved.





This is Tides said:


> that last sentence was completely hypocritical, eversleep


How? I'm not bitchy and while I do seem picky with who I associate with, I keep my thought in my head unless the opposing party provokes me into an argument.


----------



## Evan of Phrygia (Nov 23, 2011)

Itt: eversleep dramallama number a billion
how refreshing

Btw, I'm talking about how you'd bitch us off and deny any credibility
You find no blame with yourself but with everyone else


----------



## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

This is Tides said:


> Itt: eversleep dramallama number a billion
> how refreshing



It makes me happy actualy. 
I want to hug eversleep and say: "Thanks for showing me im not such a bad guy after all!"


----------



## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Disgust; cause it's people like Eversleep that are responsible for the fandom having a higher percentage of guys, cause women don't fucking want to deal with people like him.


People seem to hate me randomly regardless of gender, so your logic is flawed. I fucking hate people blaming me as the reason they hate furries or the reason for the fandom being "ruined". I'm not the reason, there are far worse than me, and you shouldn't judge a fandom based on one person anyway. I don't cause drama like other furries have. I only defend when being attacked.
Also I don't hate women and I'm not a Jailhouse gay.


----------



## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> Really? You should see a psychologist about that. Hating people for no reason isn't good.
> I'm not bitchy and while I do seem picky with who I associate with, I keep my thought in my head unless the opposing party provokes me into an argument.


I don't hate you for no reason, I hate you cause of your attitude towards women.  There's probably a very good reason why they avoid you, and I don't think it's for the reasons you think.
You are outright disproving yourself with your own post.


Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> And that's how women-hating Jailhouse gays are born. :V


If it caused people like Eversleep to ragequit then it'd be for a good cause.


eversleep said:


> People seem to hate me randomly regardless of  gender, so your logic is flawed. I fucking hate people blaming me as the  reason they hate furries or the reason for the fandom being "ruined".  I'm not the reason, there are far worse than me, and you shouldn't judge  a fandom based on one person anyway. I don't cause drama like other  furries have. I only defend when being attacked.
> Also I don't hate women and I'm not a Jailhouse gay.


I can see why people hate you.
Well originally people like you poisoned the well, so you may not be the one who poisoned the drinking water, but you're poison regardless.


----------



## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> People seem to hate me randomly regardless of gender, so your logic is flawed. I fucking hate people blaming me as the reason they hate furries or the reason for the fandom being "ruined". I'm not the reason, there are far worse than me, and you shouldn't judge a fandom based on one person anyway. I don't cause drama like other furries have. I only defend when being attacked.
> Also I don't hate women and I'm not a Jailhouse gay.



Please...Stop posting.


----------



## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> Really? You should see a psychologist about that. Hating people for no reason isn't good.
> And the funny thing is karma came back and the same shit happened to her. One of her friends randomly stopped being friends with her, she claims it was "for no reason" and she was all butthurt about it. I laughed. Bitch got what she deserved.How? I'm not bitchy and while I do seem picky with who I associate with, I keep my thought in my head unless the opposing party provokes me into an argument.




So my dogs and bird and lizards should see a psychologist as well? Take a note from me. You will one day despise a person you are in a room with for NO DAMN REASON thats a part of being a living creature. Also my major is psychology and I am training to be a criminal psychologist so FUCK OFF if you think you know anything about human psychology. You have so many issues I just want to throw the dsm-iv at you and I bet you have what ever page it lands on


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## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> I wouldn't talk like how I posted on here, and you can't say that you'd hate me IRL if you never met me IRL and you have no idea how I'd act.


I gotta ask... why don't you post on here like you talk IRL?

I've only ever hated one person on sight for no real reason. But then after I knew more about him, my hatred was justified.


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## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

I think eversleep might actually be an Asperger. Which still doesn't justify his behaviour, because I've met nice Aspergers over the Internet and don't go flaunting their Asperger. 
Eversleep, you look arrogant and entitled to yourself, please consider before posting and asking why people dislike you.


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

Zenia said:


> I gotta ask... why don't you post on here like you talk IRL?
> 
> I've only ever hated one person on sight for no real reason. But then after I knew more about him, my hatred was justified.




OH OH OH WAS HE A SCUM BAG


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## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> I think eversleep might actually be an Asperger. Which still doesn't justify his behaviour, because I've met nice Aspergers over the Internet and don't go flaunting their Asperger.
> Eversleep, you look arrogant and entitled to yourself, please consider before posting and asking why people dislike you.



Doesn't arrogance and self entitlement close out the posibility to consider the chance your wrong by default?


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## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> I don't hate you for no reason, I hate you cause of your attitude towards women.  There's probably a very good reason why they avoid you, and I don't think it's for the reasons you think.
> You are outright disproving yourself with your own post.
> 
> If it caused people like Eversleep to ragequit then it'd be for a good cause.
> ...


What attitude towards women!? I just said I don't hate women at all. Also I wasn't referring to you when I said not to hate people for no reason. I was referring to DD's post. I'm not poisoning anything. Maybe I'm not making it better, but you guys are overreacting to my posts so much it isn't even funny. The reasons people avoid me is because I don't have common interests with them and I'm different than they are. Same reason people avoid other people. 





dinosaurdammit said:


> So my dogs and bird and lizards should see a psychologist as well? Take a note from me. You will one day despise a person you are in a room with for NO DAMN REASON thats a part of being a living creature. Also my major is psychology and I am training to be a criminal psychologist so FUCK OFF if you think you know anything about human psychology. You have so many issues I just want to throw the dsm-iv at you and I bet you have what ever page it lands on


OVER-RULED. Animals act on instincts, humans generally don't (and yes I know "humans are animals"). I never said I knew anything about psychology, that's why I said you should go see a professional psychologist. And maybe I do have some sort of disorder, who knows, but I'm capable of most things other people are. I'm not insane.





Zenia said:


> I gotta ask... why don't you post on here like you talk IRL?
> 
> I've only ever hated one person on sight for no real reason. But then after I knew more about him, my hatred was justified.


Because no one on the internet acts like they do IRL 100% of the time. That'd be boring. My posts would be like this: "I'm going to sleep." "I'm gonna go play videogames." "I'm hungry". Not very interesting at all. And I act weird and hyper with my friends, I'm sure nobody wants that. I look strange to an outside viewer, but within my circle of friends, people do accept me for the most part and find my behavior normal, at least for me.


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## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

Recel said:


> Doesn't arrogance and self entitlement close out the posibility to consider the chance your wrong by default?



Not if you leave them aside at least for a moment. From there one, it's one's job to improve.


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## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

dinosaurdammit said:


> OH OH OH WAS HE A SCUM BAG


lol Totally. He has a super loud speaker system in his car and would drive around where I lived in the middle of the night with it as loud as it would go. When told that the neighbours were unhappy with him, he said that he "Didn't give a shit about anyone but [himself]!" He was my sisters boyfriend and when I wasn't around, he would make very mean comments about my looks and weight. He would borrow money from friends and not pay it back, then ask for more. When told that he still owed them money (even if it was like $10) he would be all "I don't get why you are so pissed. It is only $10 man! C'mon!" Then he spent all the money on cigarettes and pizza (that is all he ever ate). He was an illegal from Belgium and thought that if he got my sister pregnant, she would marry him and get to stay in the country, so he would sabotage their condoms. When he was talking about immigration coming for him, he bragged that he would "Shoot every one of those motherf****ers in the face!" so they couldn't take him.

Man, I wouldn't even let him in the house. If he came over, he had to talk to my sister in the driveway. He eventually got deported.


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## Recel (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> Not if you leave them aside at least for a moment. From there one, it's one's job to improve.



But usualy you dont know you are arrogant and self entitled, so you would just go "Hes wrong, Im right!" and thus being unable to put it aside. Since you dont realy know what to put aside.

And sorry for asking stupid questions and derailing a derail... wait, never mind.


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## Owllette (Nov 23, 2011)

I'm sorry you were in that situation. It sounds like it was for the best that he got deported.


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## Zenia (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> Because no one on the internet acts like they do IRL 100% of the time.


I do.



			
				eversleep said:
			
		

> That'd be boring. My posts would be like this: "I'm going to sleep." "I'm gonna go play videogames." "I'm hungry". Not very interesting at all.


... That is just listing your activities. *facepalm*


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

@ eversleep as i dont feel like deleting 90 precent of your quote. HUMANS RELY ON INSTINCTS 100% OF THEIR DAY.


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## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

AristÃ³crates Carranza said:


> I think eversleep might actually be an Asperger. Which still doesn't justify his behaviour, because I've met nice Aspergers over the Internet and don't go flaunting their Asperger.


I don't have Asperger's. I'm not "flaunting" anything. If I do have a disorder, I don't know what it is. And if I did know, I'd be trying to hide it as much as possible, not flaunting it. 





Zenia said:


> He eventually got deported.


Aww I love happy endings. Lol, glad he got what he deserved.


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## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

Recel said:


> But usualy you dont know you are arrogant and self entitled, so you would just go "Hes wrong, Im right!" and thus being unable to put it aside. Since you dont realy know what to put aside.
> 
> And sorry for asking stupid questions and derailing a derail... wait, never mind.



Seems like I only hang out with nice people and read too much. To be honest, I've never met anyone who was a full time arrogant person, but I guess a little bit of the adequate amounts of help could actually make a person see his mistakes (or a spoonful of his own medicine, in case it's needed).

EDIT:

Eversleep: 
I meant: "In case he actually had Asperger's, to flaunt it all of  sudden wouldn't be an excuse, since other Asperger's know proper manners and don't use it to justify their behaviour whenever they do something insensitive".


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## dinosaurdammit (Nov 23, 2011)

Also I am the same online as I am in real life. WANT PROOF???? OMG I DO TINYCHATS N GUESS WHAT I AM THE FUCKING SAME AHHHH YOU MAKE ME SO ILL

*WARGARBLEGARBLEGARBLE*


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## Antonin Scalia (Nov 23, 2011)

Another Great Threadâ„¢


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## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> I don't have Asperger's. I'm not "flaunting" anything. If I do have a disorder, I don't know what it is.


http://lmgtfy.com/?q=assburgers


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## eversleep (Nov 23, 2011)

Sorry, I didn't realize humans went by instincts. Do all humans do it or just some/most?
I also didn't realize that so many people act the same online as in real life. It's hard to judge "the same" though, since IRL I act differently depending on who I'm talking to. Same online, actually.
Also I wasn't suggesting that I didn't know what Asperger's was, I very well know what it is, I was saying that if I do have a disorder, I don't know what disorder. And don't say Asperger's, I don't have it, and am not entirely convinced on its existance.


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## Ozriel (Nov 23, 2011)

Back on topic you guys! >:V


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## Owllette (Nov 23, 2011)

I would say I act generally the same online as I do IRL, except maybe a bit more outgoing since I can hide behind my computer screen. But I never assume how others act on the internet is how they actually are. On the internet you can be anyone you want (limits, of course.) But me, I'm just looking for people to accept me as I actually am, hence the being less shy online.


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## Ariosto (Nov 23, 2011)

eversleep said:


> Sorry, I didn't realize humans went by instincts. Do all humans do it or just some/most?
> I also didn't realize that so many people act the same online as in real life. It's hard to judge "the same" though, since IRL I act differently depending on who I'm talking to. Same online, actually.
> Also I wasn't suggesting that I didn't know what Asperger's was, I very well know what it is, I was saying that if I do have a disorder, I don't know what disorder. And don't say Asperger's, I don't have it, and am not entirely convinced on its existance.



Taking all of this, the problem is not your content, but your redaction. Right now, I'm pretty convinced you say a lot of things but don't know how to word them and get in trouble because of that, in which case the problem can be solved by reflecting on what you are going to say and working on your syntax.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 23, 2011)

Zeke Shadowfyre said:


> Back on topic you guys! >:V


Well in that case as eversleep found out that even if it's unintentional, pissing off women doesn't go over so well.
So even if a furry is pissing off women that doesn't excuse their behavior, so really not only is the problem-
1)guys going creeper towards women
2)some guys having gynophobia
3)some guys hating women
but also-
4)guys accidentally pissing off women through their own stupidity even if they didn't mean too

So really it's a quintuple furry fail.


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## FoxPawed (Nov 24, 2011)

Crysix Fousen said:


> Good thing about tolerance it allows me to say "I dont like you" still :V
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hey, I have no problem with that.  "I don't like you" because of what I say is better than "I don't like you because of what you are"

Cheers!


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## FoxPawed (Nov 24, 2011)

Crysix Fousen said:


> First of all I'm an asshole
> Second I do accept being intolerant at times...cause I'm an asshole
> third you're an idiot, you can have my job as the forum moron if you want



Bah, the world is full of assholes - and that you are sir.  I mean, how easy is it to pick out a new forum member...?  Meh, I shrug indifference at this, you can come to whatever conclusions you'd like - and you can change those conclusions at any time too.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 24, 2011)

FoxPawed said:


> Bah, the world is full of assholes - and that you are sir.  I mean, how easy is it to pick out a new forum member...?  Meh,


Think of it as a trial by fire.


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## FoxPawed (Nov 24, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> Think of it as a trial by fire.



That is more or less what I'd imagined before I started posting here - after skimming the insane amount of "READ THIS BEFORE YOU POST!!!1!!!one!!!" stickies.  They all relate common sense in my opinion, but why does it have to be so complicated?


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## General-jwj (Nov 24, 2011)

Because furries.

And you wouldn't need to be tried by fire if you actually had as much common sense as you imply. I fit right in and never got any shit from nobody :V


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## Calemeyr (Nov 24, 2011)

Because women are put off by fat neckbearded men who draw macromastic vixens?


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## Recel (Nov 24, 2011)

One thing I always wondered about is that I actually knew a lot of guys who kind of desperately wanted a real relation, but when ever there was a girl around them they started to make fun of her, do the stupid "girls belong to the kitchen" kind of jokes and such. Than they were like "Aww, damn it..." later. By what logic do these guys think that being an asshole to a girl will end in a good, or any relation?


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## CannonFodder (Nov 24, 2011)

Recel said:


> One thing I always wondered about is that I actually knew a lot of guys who kind of desperately wanted a real relation, but when ever there was a girl around them they started to make fun of her, do the stupid "girls belong to the kitchen" kind of jokes and such. Than they were like "Aww, damn it..." later. By what logic do these guys think that being an asshole to a girl will end in a good, or any relation?


There's actually guys out there that think women like being treated like shit.


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## Cocobanana (Nov 24, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> There's actually guys out there that think women like being treated like shit.



That's what growing up like white trash does to a guy. There should be male sensitivity training seminars that are mandatory for those types.


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## CannonFodder (Nov 24, 2011)

Cocobanana said:


> That's what growing up like white trash does to a guy. There should be male sensitivity training seminars that are mandatory for those types.


I don't know what's worse, the fact they tell women they belong in the kitchen or that they still somehow manage to reproduce?


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## Cocobanana (Nov 24, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> I don't know what's worse, the fact they tell women they belong in the kitchen or that they still somehow manage to reproduce?



It's an endless chain where they grow up seeing their dads treat their moms like that and learning that it's okay to hit people or demean them when they annoy you. And that instead of apologizing and working to really change, you just have to say some nice things and last longer in the bedroom than normal. In addition to teaching kids about sex in public school, even if it sounds a little silly, they should teach kids the right away to treat one another so they might grow up better... since foster care isn't doing shit.


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## FoxPawed (Nov 24, 2011)

General-jwj said:


> Because furries.
> 
> And you wouldn't need to be tried by fire if you actually had as much common sense as you imply. I fit right in and never got any shit from nobody :V



*sigh*  Fine.  I can't see where I said something so horrible, but I seriously don't expect to NEVER get shit from anyone.  That's life.  No one will always agree or be happy.  I never (ok, sometimes) mean to offend.


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## Verin Asper (Nov 24, 2011)

FoxPawed said:


> *sigh*  Fine.  I can't see where I said something so horrible, but I seriously don't expect to NEVER get shit from anyone.  That's life.  No one will always agree or be happy.  I never (ok, sometimes) mean to offend.


Your name and avatar offends me :V

no wait its just how I know how you will be base on how you already act, and I hate folks like that.


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## Kayla (Nov 25, 2011)

RayO_ElGatubelo said:


> Well, at least Cannonfodder is contributing to increase the amount of women in the fandom by turning himself into one. I commend you.
> 
> Also, women are generally into gay porn? I know there's female yaoi fanatics... but not a lot of women in general like it, compared to guys who almost universally like girl-on-girl.



We Are? I'm sure as Hell not. XD


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## Kayla (Nov 25, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> There's actually guys out there that think women like being treated like shit.



Yeah, it's sad but true. No way in Hell I'd date a man like this.


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## morphology (Nov 25, 2011)

Just as a little hint FoxPawed and Kayla, please edit your previous posts instead of multiple posts in a row.  It makes me see double.


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## Recel (Nov 25, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> There's actually guys out there that think women like being treated like shit.



Why do I keep believing that these things aren't really done on purpose... I feel stupid. :S


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## Volkodav (Nov 25, 2011)

CannonFodder said:


> There's actually guys out there that think women like being treated like shit.


Some of them do.
Some guys do too.
The world is not an equal hugbox


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## thewall (Nov 25, 2011)

NOO!!!  NO ONE POSTS CRAPPIER THREADS THAN ME!  GET OUT, CANNONFODDER!  :V


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## CannonFodder (Nov 25, 2011)

thewall said:


> NOO!!!  NO ONE POSTS CRAPPIER THREADS THAN ME!  GET OUT, CANNONFODDER!  :V


It was saved later on with the help of trpdwarf.


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## israfur (Nov 25, 2011)

thewall said:


> NOO!!!  NO ONE POSTS CRAPPIER THREADS THAN ME!  GET OUT, CANNONFODDER!  :V



This topic is interesting to me from an anthropological point of view as a female .


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## FoxPawed (Nov 25, 2011)

Crysix Fousen said:


> Your name and avatar offends me :V
> 
> no wait its just how I know how you will be base on how you already act, and I hate folks like that.



That's a shame.  *chuckle*


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## Ben (Nov 25, 2011)

I'm not sure what this thread is even talking about since I was knee-deep in bitches at MFF, ya'll just a bunch of scary motherfuckers most likely


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## Lobar (Nov 25, 2011)

thewall said:


> NOO!!!  NO ONE POSTS CRAPPIER THREADS THAN ME!  GET OUT, CANNONFODDER!  :V



I got news for ya, CF's threads are the stuff of legends around here.  Crappy legends.


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