# What makes a roleplaying system good?



## Neiot (Aug 6, 2021)

This eats at me. It has_ been_ eating at me. For thirteen years, I've hosted roleplaying sessions in a group that I have. Since the group moved to Discord, I've been lost. There are no members anymore. None that haven't already been members for a while. I feel as if I've done everything wrong and need to start all over again, but my pride has gotten in the way and I want to keep things consistent as they used to be. A year ago, I froze all roleplaying sessions so that I could do some soul searching and figure out a way to make things better. But I feel as if I've been surpassed by other roleplaying systems. I know it is not a race, nor a competition, to see which system is the best, I just want to have as much fun as I used to have when I started this project. It's been a long time. I want to unfreeze it.

I do not know how.


----------



## The-Courier (Aug 6, 2021)

In my experience, the best ones are usually homebrewed systems. I've been in several that have lasted years because it allowed players to do their own plotlines alongside the current one, as well as a myriad of other subplots.


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 6, 2021)

What system do you use


----------



## Neiot (Aug 6, 2021)

The-Courier said:


> In my experience, the best ones are usually homebrewed systems. I've been in several that have lasted years because it allowed players to do their own plotlines alongside the current one, as well as a myriad of other subplots.


That is exactly what mine is - I let folks make 3-5 character sheets and build their own stories with the tools (worldbuilding) I've given.


O.D.D. said:


> What system do you use


No system in particular, it's literary. Play-by-Post.


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 6, 2021)

Neiot said:


> No system in particular, it's literary. Play-by-Post.


Well, do you railroad players? Are you too lax about keeping players focused on a goal? Is there even a goal (or set of goals) or is it just completely "do whatever you want" freeform? Have you tried ASKING players who left/are no longer active?
A good GM can make a bad system fun and a bad GM can't retain players with the best system.


----------



## Neiot (Aug 6, 2021)

O.D.D. said:


> Well, do you railroad players? Are you too lax about keeping players focused on a goal? Is there even a goal (or set of goals) or is it just completely "do whatever you want" freeform? Have you tried ASKING players who left/are no longer active?
> A good GM can make a bad system fun and a bad GM can't retain players with the best system.


I am not sure what railroading players means, but so far, I think I've tried just about everything to keep folks engaged in the narrative. But since there is no real overarching plot or goal except in small campaigns, I let folks roam and do what they like. Occasionally, I ask the folks what they like and dislike about the pace of the system. I've made significant improvements to the magic system based on the criticism I've been given. However, the person who gave me that criticism left with two or three others and that was a dark time for me because I knew exactly why they left - I was a selfish prick who took some things a little too personally.


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 6, 2021)

Neiot said:


> I am not sure what railroading players means, but so far, I think I've tried just about everything to keep folks engaged in the narrative. But since there is no real overarching plot or goal except in small campaigns, I let folks roam and do what they like. Occasionally, I ask the folks what they like and dislike about the pace of the system. I've made significant improvements to the magic system based on the criticism I've been given. However, the person who gave me that criticism left with two or three others and that was a dark time for me because I knew exactly why they left - I was a selfish prick who took some things a little too personally.


Railroading means forcing players to take a very particular path, usually by ab/using GM fiat.  Some degree of railroading can be necessary in some campaigns especially if the players are acting like un-herded cats a lot and otherwise refusing to actually play the game (see: that guy who decides to utterly hijack a campaign to turn it into his personal Magical Realm and disrupts attempts by the GM or other players to try and keep it on a coherent course)
So right off hand I see a potential issue: with no overarching goals or story beats, players might be getting bored because nothing they do really affects much in the larger picture (because there is no larger picture).  This is just spitballing and might not be on target but I have yet to see a "do whatever, no hurry, no pressure" setting that could capture players' attention spans.


----------



## Neiot (Aug 6, 2021)

O.D.D. said:


> Railroading means forcing players to take a very particular path, usually by ab/using GM fiat.  Some degree of railroading can be necessary in some campaigns especially if the players are acting like un-herded cats a lot and otherwise refusing to actually play the game (see: that guy who decides to utterly hijack a campaign to turn it into his personal Magical Realm and disrupts attempts by the GM or other players to try and keep it on a coherent course)


Oh my goodness, fuck that guy. I've had that guy. With all of my worldbuilding set up, I had a dude split the planet with a DBZ-Style nuke. 

I try to make just about everything people do canon to the world, so events that are triggered by players are moderated if they get too extravagant, like ... ... blowing up the moon.


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 6, 2021)

Neiot said:


> Oh my goodness, fuck that guy. I've had that guy. With all of my worldbuilding set up, I had a dude split the planet with a DBZ-Style nuke.
> 
> I try to make just about everything people do canon to the world, so events that are triggered by players are moderated if they get too extravagant, like ... ... blowing up the moon.


Just try to remember that limits are not a bad thing.  Constraints turn a puddle into a glass of drinkable water.


----------



## Neiot (Aug 6, 2021)

O.D.D. said:


> Just try to remember that limits are not a bad thing.  Constraints turn a puddle into a glass of drinkable water.


Thanks. I need to think of an overarching plot or goal folks can work towards to make their sessions engaging and interesting. The problem I have is that most, if not all, of my ideas tend to be cliché or overthunk.


----------



## TyraWadman (Aug 7, 2021)

Not sure about system but any time.ive tried dnd stuff it ends up in disaster. People quit or just get bored 30 minutes in, or you're trying to keep everyone engaged but one person gets mad that they can't just kill everyone and get away with it. 

Everyone wants a good story but has a very different opinion on what is considered good. 

I like to layer things and reward those who pay attention  and build relationships. Everyone else wants to mash the skip button or follow traditional cliches and storylines that put me to sleep. 

I think a part of the strategy is to learn the people you are playing with. Pay attention to the things they like, try to incorporate a little bit of everything for everyone based on their IC roles. But I haven't been able to keep a social group long enough to confirm that. X)


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 7, 2021)

Neiot said:


> Thanks. I need to think of an overarching plot or goal folks can work towards to make their sessions engaging and interesting. The problem I have is that most, if not all, of my ideas tend to be cliché or overthunk.


"Cliche or overthunk" describes a lot of TTRPG campaigns.  Don't sweat it, the point is for it to be fun.


----------



## Tyll'a (Aug 7, 2021)

Personally, I prefer a system that one of my friends from FFXIV came up with.  Fitting, since Tyll'a was originally a FFXIV OC before he became my sona.


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 7, 2021)

Tyll'a said:


> Personally, I prefer a system that one of my friends from FFXIV came up with.  Fitting, since Tyll'a was originally a FFXIV OC before he became my sona.


How does this help OP


----------



## Tyll'a (Aug 7, 2021)

O.D.D. said:


> How does this help OP


Oh, I'm sorry.  I misunderstood the OP


----------



## Neiot (Aug 7, 2021)

O.D.D. said:


> "Cliche or overthunk" describes a lot of TTRPG campaigns.  Don't sweat it, the point is for it to be fun.


I am curious, what do you think the appropriate abbreviation is for the type of "system" I use for my roleplaying group? Since it's literary, there isn't any dice rolling, and there aren't stats, so it can't be TTRPG, can it?


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 7, 2021)

Neiot said:


> I am curious, what do you think the appropriate abbreviation is for the type of "system" I use for my roleplaying group? Since it's literary, there isn't any dice rolling, and there aren't stats, so it can't be TTRPG, can it?


Tabletop RPGs can absolutely be played freeform with no number crunch, the tabletop part might be a misnomer here but it's sort of a catchall for a roleplaying game that isn't done via a computer game system.


----------



## Neiot (Aug 8, 2021)

O.D.D. said:


> Tabletop RPGs can absolutely be played freeform with no number crunch, the tabletop part might be a misnomer here but it's sort of a catchall for a roleplaying game that isn't done via a computer game system.


Ahh, I gotcha. So I could call it a TTRPG and get away with it? I've been calling it a PbPRPG(play-by-post), but not everybody knows what that is.


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 8, 2021)

Neiot said:


> Ahh, I gotcha. So I could call it a TTRPG and get away with it? I've been calling it a PbPRPG(play-by-post), but not everybody knows what that is.


Probably, though someone is bound to nitpick it.


----------



## Neiot (Aug 8, 2021)

O.D.D. said:


> Probably, though someone is bound to nitpick it.


That someone is gonna be me, haha. But if I can use TTRPG, then that's definitely convenient.


----------



## O.D.D. (Aug 8, 2021)

Neiot said:


> That someone is gonna be me, haha. But if I can use TTRPG, then that's definitely convenient.


I mean it's something you absolutely CAN do on a tabletop with no computers so at some point you're just looking for a term that gets people on the same page for expectations


----------



## Neiot (Aug 8, 2021)

O.D.D. said:


> I mean it's something you absolutely CAN do on a tabletop with no computers so at some point you're just looking for a term that gets people on the same page for expectations


True, true!


----------



## Paws the Opinicus (Aug 10, 2021)

Enough freedom for people to be able to 'own' their characters, but not too free that it makes gaming the system trivial, imho.

The infamous *Spurt the Kobold* is a textbook example, well, as.... 'long' as his life was.


----------

