# Cardinal Sins & Self-Improvement



## Punji (Mar 27, 2022)

The cardinal sins, also known as the deadly sins, are a set of seven broad categories of sin. These are not the only forms of sin however. The inverse of these sins are virtues, aspects of what one should aspire to be. Sin is natural and expected, and one is no more flawed than any other for bearing sin. One should still seek to improve himself, and to do so requires understanding himself.

With that said, I'll try to keep the theology to a minimum since many people find it disagreeable. Here are my subjective understandings of the seven sins:

Envy - Envy is the state of being discontented with what one has. This is not the same as accepting one's lot in life. Obsessing over having a bigger and better life no matter how good and comfortable it may be.

Gluttony - Gluttony is the overindulgence of material pleasures and excessive pursuit of hedonism. Often thought of as food, gluttony can be nearly anything. While it may be simply overeating, it can also be drinking, smoking, consuming other recreational substances, engaging in recreational activities such as TV, video games, and physical games to the detriment of one's health, and even adult-oriented pleasures.

Greed - Similarly to envy, greed is not being content with what one has. Where it differs however is the methodology of wanting. Greed is often thought to be desire for monetary wealth, but can manifest in a number of other ways. It can be always wanting more friends, partners, status symbols, resources, or even sentimental objects. This sin is committed by not being happy with the good one already has in life, no matter how good life can be for him.

Lust - Lust is the act of loving someone too much. Often thought to be sexual in nature, lust is not required to be sexual or even romantic at all. Typically this is a more religious type of sin, as it is the act of loving someone or something more than God. This does not require the strong emotional feelings of love itself, but merely the devotion to another over God. For true Christians, this sin can actually be rather difficult to fulfill, as loving others and devoting oneself to them is virtuous on its own and is an extension of loving God. One might think of this as tying the reason for his existence to a single thing or person. "If I didn't have X I wouldn't have a reason for being." Often lust is combined with another sin.

Pride - Pride is the act of being boastful and lacking humility. Often thought to be arrogance and similar behaviours, this can also be public acts of charity for the purpose of social credit or appeal rather than genuine charitable acts and refusing to serve others. Serving others itself can be a number of things, but is often demonstrations of kindness and humility to others.

Sloth - Slothfulness is the act of neglecting one's natural skills and abilities and failing to uphold one's own potential. Often thought of as just being lazy, slothfulness is to allow great talents and personal abilities to be underutilized. To create art, to play music, to write great works, or merely to console those in need. It can be anything from playing sports to doing well in academics. What matters is only that a person uses the skills he has to personal effect. Can be thought of as using the skills God gave you, even if it has been an ability developed over time.

Wrath - Wrath is the act of denying love to others. Often thought of as violent or hurtful acts, it is refusing compassion to others for any reason. This may be simply seeing people as tools or means to an end rather than ends in themselves, failure to forgive others, or simply not caring about other people. Judgment is reserved for the Lord. Lover thy sinner, hate thy sin.

No one is without sin. We as humans have a moral obligation to continuously improve ourselves and work towards virtue. The first step to solving a problem is identifying it, hopefully this may give some pause and thought. Feel free to speak to it here or elsewhere, but I would personally recommend one considers the aspects of his or her life in private.

We are all guilty of sin. Here are two of mine: Wrath & Sloth.

I hold others to evidently unrealistically high standards and consistently judge them for failing. I must try to see the humanity in others and realize they may have different priorities and purposes in life, and where I see failure they may see success.

I tend to try very little in life sometimes. Improvement need not be dramatic, but I should not waste my perceived abilities. I have not kept up my writing in quite some time. Whether as small personal short stories, writing in my journal, or something more, I have not made use of my ability as I ought to.

Hopefully some will find the read insightful or helpful in some small way. Theology is a small passion of mine and this has been a topic I wanted to write about for a little while and never really got around to. Disclaimer: This is not about or directed to anyone here on the FAF, sorry.


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## Baron Tredegar (Mar 27, 2022)

I too find theology a quite intriguing subject. I find your definition of pride pretty good, I think it especially applies to Christians who do a bunch of good things just to "lay up treasures in heaven". Do you think extreme purity culture like you see in some fundamentalist circles would fall under lust?


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## Punji (Mar 27, 2022)

Baron Tredegar said:


> I too find theology a quite intriguing subject. I find your definition of pride pretty good, I think it especially applies to Christians who do a bunch of good things just to "lay up treasures in heaven". Do you think extreme purity culture like you see in some fundamentalist circles would fall under lust?


I think it definitely could. Devoting oneself to some extreme ideology to "ensure" access to Heaven or some such thing is a bit close to loving the idea of God over actually loving God. It's a little difficult to pin down exactly I think, but there certainly lies the possible argument for it in my opinion.


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## Firuthi Dragovic (Mar 27, 2022)

There are some who think there's an eighth cardinal sin, Punji.

Despair.

With the corresponding virtue of Hope.

Where would that fit into this?


Baron Tredegar said:


> I too find theology a quite intriguing subject. I find your definition of pride pretty good, I think it especially applies to Christians who do a bunch of good things just to "lay up treasures in heaven". Do you think extreme purity culture like you see in some fundamentalist circles would fall under lust?


In some ways I would have put that under Envy or Pride, with a few hints of Sloth.  But yeah, Lust makes sense there.





Gluttony and Wrath are probably my worst.

Not sure which one's more prominent honestly.  Gluttony's one of those things I've never been able to really halt, and Wrath.... Wrath in my case is what happens when you've been burned one too many times.


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## Punji (Mar 27, 2022)

Firuthi Dragovic said:


> There are some who think there's an eighth cardinal sin, Punji.
> 
> Despair.
> 
> ...


That's an interesting one. I'm not sure if I would consider it a sin personally, but I'd be open to the idea.

If I had to pick a place for it myself, I'd probably call it envy perhaps? Lacking comfort in what one has, always lurching for a better world? It's difficult to say really.

What do you figure? Or would you call it a sin all its own?


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## Borophagus Metropolis (Mar 27, 2022)

Hi, I am Gluttony and Sloth


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## Fallowfox (Mar 28, 2022)

I read the history of this concept on wikipedia, to find out more about where exactly it came from.
Different authors list _different_ sins, and numbers _different_ to seven.

@Firuthi Dragovic points out a lot of christians believe that sins have an 'opposite' virtue,
but apparently the greek antecedents of the 'seven sins' proposed that each virtuous behaviour was a _balance_ between two different 'sins'.

I checked for corresponding schemes in Islam, and their version of seven 'egotistical' behaviours include 'gossip' and 'miserliness'.
The Buddhist versions propose anywhere between 3 and 10 sins, including 'delusion', being 'sceptical', wanting to continue existing, and believing that individuality is permanent.
In religions similar to Buddhism, these 'distractions' from meditation cause you to be reincarnated when you die- and the goal is to escape these distractions so that you can become enlightened and finally stop existing.

Given that the number and nature of sins in these different lists varies, I think they probably tell us more about the history and interaction of these different religions, than representing a fundamental truth about the human condition.


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## Baron Tredegar (Mar 28, 2022)

Punji said:


> I think it definitely could. Devoting oneself to some extreme ideology to "ensure" access to Heaven or some such thing is a bit close to loving the idea of God over actually loving God. It's a little difficult to pin down exactly I think, but there certainly lies the possible argument for it in my opinion.


That sounds exactly like an encounter I had at my old fundamentalist college before I left that place. The New Testament teacher literally said that we should "lust after our heavenly rewards and not the treasures of this world". It was very hard for me to not get in a theological debate with him.


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## Faustus (Mar 30, 2022)

‘Sloth’ in its medieval sense actually means ‘a failure to believe in the saving power of Christ’ and not, in fact, laziness as it is often interpreted.

Well, since I’m an atheist, I guess that’s me.


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## Kumali (Apr 2, 2022)

Punji said:


> If I had to pick a place for it myself, I'd probably call it envy perhaps? Lacking comfort in what one has, always lurching for a better world? It's difficult to say really.
> 
> What do you figure? Or would you call it a sin all its own?



Well, at this point, we might as well throw Buddhism's Four Noble Truths and Noble Eightfold Path into the mix, since it seems relevant to your questions:

The Four Noble Truths of Buddhism (very roughly translated):
1. Life is suffering.
2. The cause of suffering is desire (sometimes translated as "craving").
3. Desire can be eliminated.
4. The way to eliminate desire is by following the Noble Eightfold Path:
Right Understanding, Right Thought, Right Speech, Right Action, Right Livelihood, Right Effort, Right Mindfulness, Right Concentration.

Decent introductory article: https://www.buddhistdoor.net/featur...-truths-and-walking-the-noble-eightfold-path/

Wikipedia seems OK on the topic too: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Noble_Truths

Though I wouldn't presume to call myself a practicing Buddhist, I personally find the Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold Path a more constructive starting point than obsessing over my "sins."


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## Punji (Apr 2, 2022)

Kumali said:


> Though I wouldn't presume to call myself a practicing Buddhist, I personally find the Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold Path a more constructive starting point than obsessing over my "sins."


It's also a thread about bettering oneself through acknowledging one's own flaws.


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## Kumali (Apr 2, 2022)

Punji said:


> It's also a thread about bettering oneself through acknowledging one's own flaws.



Oh, sure, I don't think we're in any general disagreement. Just that, for me, positive spiritual aspirations are more inspiring than dwelling on the negative aspects of my admittedly flawed self. (I suppose it's partly that I've always dealt with low self-esteem - maybe it'd be less important to someone who's more confident in themselves.) I have no problem acknowledging my flaws; the problem is that I acknowledge them far too much.  I can identify with Jackson Browne's lyric "Don't confront me with my failures / I had not forgotten them."

And that can get in the way of positive progress if I allow it to overcome me. So _for me_ a positive focus works better. Each to their own, vive la différence, and all that.


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## Fallowfox (Apr 3, 2022)

So, ancient Greek ideas about ethics propose a 'balance' between extremes, but in a lot of organised religions this changes into a system where being sinful is the _default_ state inherent to all humans. Some religions even believe that humans inherit original sin and that even babies are therefore born sinners who are fundamentally weak and prone to do bad things.

I checked, and the organisation of a system of 'seven deadly sins' in Christianity occurred in the same century as 'original sin' began to emerge.
I feel this could reflect the history of social transformation after the decline of Rome- maybe it was necessary for people to believe they had an obligation to the Church for social hierarchies to remain in place as other authorities were receding away.


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## Kope (Apr 3, 2022)

For me as a Christian I don’t try to overthink it. As long as you’re a good person you will be in heaven. If there aren’t good people up there because they didn’t believe or were gay then I’m gonna fight like hell to get them up there too.


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## Punji (Apr 3, 2022)

*Cough cough* Thread about specifically Christian theology please *cough*


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