# Curious about when FA make their new UI update



## TechKat (Dec 14, 2011)

We all remember Dragoneer saying a Summer Update was coming (Pfft, It's Winter now!) and recently some updates have been made to the current site.
It makes me wonder, shouldn't the coders add these recent new updates to the new UI or have they suddenly decided to give up?
Of course, admins do need to focus on their life with whatever they have important.
Maybe release a beta version? Give a few users accessibility and check out for any bugs and such?

What do you think? No arguing please, just post your opinions.


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## Draconas (Dec 14, 2011)

My opinion is that it needs to be put up right now, been promised this shit for over a year and it just gets old ya know? post it, and if something's broke, then it's faster to have someone point it out.


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## SnowFox (Dec 14, 2011)

I think the current plan is to maintain complete silence on the issue in the hope that people will eventually forget it was ever mentioned. If that doesn't work just make *NEW EXCITING ANNOUNCEMENT* about vague plans to do things that will be released on a very specific arbitrary date in the future plucked straight out of nowhere with no means of meeting this deadline.

Rinse. Repeat.

Also, we're working it. Some things are in the works. An announcement about things will be made.

Stop assuming.


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## Kinuki (Dec 14, 2011)

TechKat said:


> Maybe release a beta version? Give a few users accessibility and check out for any bugs and such?


No, because legacy code.


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## TechKat (Dec 15, 2011)

SnowFox said:


> Also, we're working it. Some things are in the works. An announcement about things will be made.



We're? Are you one of the coders?


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## TechKat (Dec 15, 2011)

Kinuki said:


> No, because legacy code.



Admins won't know about bugs and glitches if they don't use a couple of well-trusted users on the site to review and report any problems out to the admins.


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## Accountability (Dec 15, 2011)

TechKat said:


> We all remember Dragoneer saying a *Summer* Update



Well there's your problem. It's (nearly) summer in the southern hemisphere, and in just a few short months, it will be summer in the US once again!


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## Kadah (Dec 15, 2011)

Hopefully never.


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## Rakuen Growlithe (Dec 15, 2011)

The best guess is it's never going to happen. The new feature updates weren't for the UI anyway they were to distract from all the Furocity admins leaving by making it seem like the site is doing stuff. They probably have a few minor tweaks like that to throw out whenever there is drama.


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## TechKat (Dec 15, 2011)

Accountability said:


> Well there's your problem. It's (nearly) summer in the southern hemisphere, and in just a few short months, it will be summer in the US once again!



Summer time previously was hell for FA with the DDOS's and problems etc, so handling that was more important than the UI, although you do have a point, Summer is just around the corner.


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## TechKat (Dec 15, 2011)

Rakuen Growlithe said:


> The best guess is it's never going to happen. The new feature updates weren't for the UI anyway they were to distract from all the Furocity admins leaving by making it seem like the site is doing stuff. They probably have a few minor tweaks like that to throw out whenever there is drama.



If it were about the Furocity staff leaving and complaining about the lack of work behind FA, fair deal, but if Dragoneer announced a new UI and then it never happens, why would he get us all worked up for it in the first place? This is why I'm curious. Be a shame to hear the UI was called off. The old less-secure version we have now is slowly dying for me.


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## Rakuen Growlithe (Dec 15, 2011)

TechKat said:
			
		

> If it were about the Furocity staff leaving and complaining about the  lack of work behind FA, fair deal, but if Dragoneer announced a new UI  and then it never happens, why would he get us all worked up for it in  the first place? This is why I'm curious. Be a shame to hear the UI was  called off. The old less-secure version we have now is slowly dying for  me.



Well I think the updates were about the Furocity thing but I doubt any admin would agree to that. 
Wikifur has the first mention of the new UI as being in 2007 but Ferrox was meant to be the replacement for FA and that was started in 2006. So it's really been five years since FA was first getting a new UI. It keeps getting announced and promised but every single time it's been delayed or cancelled.


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## TechKat (Dec 15, 2011)

Rakuen Growlithe said:


> Well I think the updates were about the Furocity thing but I doubt any admin would agree to that.
> Wikifur has the first mention of the new UI as being in 2007 but Ferrox was meant to be the replacement for FA and that was started in 2006. So it's really been five years since FA was first getting a new UI. It keeps getting announced and promised but every single time it's been delayed or cancelled.



If FA were tightening their security, you could say a new UI would take 2-3 years to make if they were that desperate on security.
But all these cons and meets that, magically just become created out of no-where, is what I believe is causing the delay.


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## MRGamer01 (Dec 15, 2011)

New UI update?  I'll just be honest here, don't hold your breath for it.  If it comes, it comes.  If not, oh well.  


And they never said "which" Summer it'd be in.  /joke


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## Armaetus (Dec 15, 2011)

When they feel like it (IE When pigs fly) :V

I'm just assuming it will never happen because of all the bullshit that has happened this year.


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## GingerM (Dec 16, 2011)

Meh - the site is free, it's tolerably fast. I'm happy to wait.


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## TechKat (Dec 17, 2011)

We could really do with a new UI, don't you think? Are you not bored of the current UI?
Personally if 'Neer needs assistance getting the UI done, he should've hired a couple extra coders to do some work.


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## Rakuen Growlithe (Dec 17, 2011)

GingerM said:
			
		

> Meh - the site is free, it's tolerably fast. I'm happy to wait.



Why do people keep saying this? Just because something is free doesn't mean it needs to be sub-par. What happened to the attitude of taking pride in what you do and doing something well, not for external reward, but, just because if it's worth doing it's worth doing well?


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## CerbrusNL (Dec 17, 2011)

Rakuen Growlithe said:


> What happened to the attitude of taking pride in what you do and doing something well, not for external reward, but, just because if it's worth doing it's worth doing well?


You are forgetting the usual attitude we have to deal with, as staff, when we handle tickets.

On average, I'd say it's half a person thanking you, and 3 whining to you, per ticket.


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## TechKat (Dec 17, 2011)

CerbrusNL said:


> You are forgetting the usual attitude we have to deal with, as staff, when we handle tickets.
> 
> On average, I'd say it's half a person thanking you, and 3 whining to you, per ticket.



Because none of the staff are arsed enough to answer them! Put me in charge, I'll pwn that trouble ticket system and clear it out with answers in an hour! D< Hehe :3


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## RTDragon (Dec 17, 2011)

Well it doesn't matter considering most art gallery sites are way ahead of FA in terms of features. It really isn't surprising about delayed/broken promises and that coding that is quite old and a security risk.


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## Armaetus (Dec 17, 2011)

GingerM said:


> Meh - the site is free, it's tolerably fast. I'm happy to wait.



Not an excuse when a UI update has been promised for a couple years in a ROW with LITTLE DONE for it.


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## Kinuki (Dec 17, 2011)

GingerM said:


> Meh - the site is free, it's tolerably fast. I'm happy to wait.


Normally the system is thought to be that you provide services that are up to date/better than those of the competition so clients keep using your services.

If you don't provide this you shouldn't be surprised when your clients start to complain or diminish in numbers.


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## Arshes Nei (Dec 17, 2011)

I don't think it was proper to announce an update and not keep to schedule. I know shit happens as they say, but you should keep a calendar of events if it's not going to happen and update people if you miss the schedule and give an eta or state you're working on it at the least.


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## TechKat (Dec 17, 2011)

Arshes Nei said:


> I don't think it was proper to announce an update and not keep to schedule. I know shit happens as they say, but you should keep a calendar of events if it's not going to happen and update people if you miss the schedule and give an eta or state you're working on it at the least.



All in favour of Dragoneer hiring coders that only work on the new UI, say Aye!


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## LizardKing (Dec 17, 2011)

TechKat said:


> Dragoneer hiring coders



Hahahaha, good one ;D


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## TechKat (Dec 17, 2011)

LizardKing said:


> Hahahaha, good one ;D



Yeah I too had a thought that was a stupid thing to say. XD


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## MRGamer01 (Dec 17, 2011)

TechKat said:


> All in favour of Dragoneer hiring coders that only work on the new UI, say Aye!



Hahaha, thats good!  Though in all honesty, I don't see that happening.


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## GingerM (Dec 17, 2011)

Rakuen Growlithe said:


> Why do people keep saying this? Just because something is free doesn't mean it needs to be sub-par. What happened to the attitude of taking pride in what you do and doing something well, not for external reward, but, just because if it's worth doing it's worth doing well?


Well, I'm saying it because I personally don't have any issue with FA as it currently exists. You don't, but your statement that it's sub-par is your opinion, not unequivocal fact. I know a significant number of FA members agree with you, because they also speak up, asking about the new UI. Those of us who are fine with things as they are don't tend to speak out, which leads to the perception that all of FA is dissatisfied with the current UI.  


Glaice said:


> Not an excuse when a UI update has been promised for a couple years in a ROW with LITTLE DONE for it.





Arshes Nei said:


> I don't think it was proper to announce an update and not keep to schedule. I know shit happens as they say, but you should keep a calendar of events if it's not going to happen and update people if you miss the schedule and give an eta or state you're working on it at the least.


Now this I do agree with. Leaving aside for the moment the question of whether the site _needs_ upgrades, upgrades have been - well, not 'promised', but certainly everyone has been given the impression that they're coming. 


Kinuki said:


> Normally the system is thought to be that you provide services that are up to date/better than those of the competition so clients keep using your services.  If you don't provide this you shouldn't be surprised when your clients start to complain or diminish in numbers.


Don't forget, however, that not everyone demands the same level of features, or even the same features. This is not to say it's wrong to ask for these things, but don't be surprised that there are some of us who enjoy FA as it is because in its current incarnation it meets our needs. I'm quite prepared to concede that I don't personally need a lot of features other than the ability to post art, the ability to fave art and the ability to comment/note. I've been a member of quite a few other sites and most of them are too complex for my taste. FA is visually simple and doesn't flood me with options and features I will never use.  
It's also a good idea to remember there will be a certain amount of user inertia. Yes, some are prepared to leave; some have likely left already over this. There are, however, some who may be unhappy but are not going to go to the bother of moving to another site. I don't imagine that moving is an easy thing for artists, particularly; commissioners and watchers expect to find them here and they run the risk of losing potential custom if they move too abruptly.  
In the end, I imagine the upgrades will eventually surface.


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## TechKat (Dec 17, 2011)

MRGamer01 said:


> Hahaha, thats good!  Though in all honesty, I don't see that happening.



Lol, true  would be a shock if I get a note from him saying: "HURRRHEY KAT 8B WANNA CODE 4 ME SO I CAN LOOK BETTER IN TEH FANDUM?! PAY U IN COOKIE DOH!"

O.O


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## Kihari (Dec 17, 2011)

Re next summer:



			
				Fred Brooks said:
			
		

> How does a large software project get to be one year late?
> 
> One day at a time.


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## kayfox (Dec 17, 2011)

How about we fix the easier issues:  Security, availability, efficiency, responsiveness of both the tech staff and the moderation staff.

Then maybe a "new UI" could be manageable, I fear that if a new UI was just slapped on the site, it wont fix anything, the issues that existed before will just continue, and we wont get anywhere with it.


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## Shireton (Dec 19, 2011)

It was never specified which summer it'll be, was it? Hats off to summer, 2034.


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## Kayla (Dec 19, 2011)

lol FA? Update? You funny, sir


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## ferretsage (Dec 20, 2011)

Hey, don't mean to be an asshole, but do you remember a LONG time ago when FA had the most advanced user-customizable themes that allowed users to set the look of their own userpage/gallery/etc? Sure, it was pulled because it had security flaws that a Boeing 747 could fly through -- however -- it has been.... about 5-6 years... and y!Gallery has the same features. y!Gallery is also a free site -- with, arguably less funding and customer loyalty than FA (unlike FA, I don't see y!Gallery's userbase buying every server their site has ever run off of).

Why can't, after 6 very long reasonable years, FA fix the security errors of the old, customizable user themes that made each userpage almost like the artist's own website? If bandwidth is a problem, how can y!Gallery offer this feature with less funding?

Sincerely signed,
              ~a jackass


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## Accountability (Dec 20, 2011)

ferretsage said:


> Hey, don't mean to be an asshole, but do you remember a LONG time ago when FA had the most advanced user-customizable themes that allowed users to set the look of their own userpage/gallery/etc? Sure, it was pulled because it had security flaws that a Boeing 747 could fly through -- however -- it has been.... about 5-6 years... and y!Gallery has the same features. y!Gallery is also a free site -- with, arguably less funding and customer loyalty than FA (unlike FA, I don't see y!Gallery's userbase buying every server their site has ever run off of).
> 
> Why can't, after 6 very long reasonable years, FA fix the security errors of the old, customizable user themes that made each userpage almost like the artist's own website? If bandwidth is a problem, how can y!Gallery offer this feature with less funding?
> 
> ...



In three years they haven't spent the 30 minutes to remove the XSS exploits from the Commission Information page. It took them _months_ to fix other XSS and CSRF exploits (AFTER they were well known), and even then they were only fixed because they were being actively exploited. Things don't get fixed due to a lack of funding, they just don't get fixed because of a small, lazy coding team that refuses to let new people on board.

Also, user customizable profiles tend to lead to eye rape (see: myspace).


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## Armaetus (Dec 20, 2011)

I don't really anything more to say than the current CODER TEAM are lazy, and don't even give us periodic updates (1-2 a year is unacceptable and not enough) on what's going behind the scenes regarding this so-called UI we've seen in screenshots and beta stuff.

Does it really take a year to showcase a new look to a website? Yes I know about it being volunteer and people having a life but jeez, pick up the pace a bit :V

This is my criticism of the main site and staff working on the code (or lack thereof). I won't believe it until it's live and not bugged to shit on day one.

This does not apply to the moderation/supermod/admin team who is not involved in the mechanics of the site.


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## Aeturnus (Dec 20, 2011)

Here's a question for you: are pigs flying?


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## Ben (Dec 20, 2011)

Honestly, I'd be more eager for a competent FA competitor (if not multiple) to launch instead of the UI and slew of absent features being delivered upon.

Also, the "they didn't say WHICH summer lol!!" joke has been made many times in this thread alone. You guys can stop now.


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## Rakuen Growlithe (Dec 21, 2011)

Ben said:
			
		

> Honestly, I'd be more eager for a competent FA competitor (if not  multiple) to launch instead of the UI and slew of absent features being  delivered upon.



Inkbunny and SoFurry are both more than competent and exceed FA in pretty much every respect.


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## Ben (Dec 21, 2011)

Rakuen Growlithe said:


> Inkbunny and SoFurry are both more than competent and exceed FA in pretty much every respect.



I tried selling people on SoFurry, but they were turned off by the slowness of the site, and the fact that human content lacking a furry context isn't allowed. It's going to take a site that's just as or more free (and just as fast) as FA to really convince people to jump ship, not to mention it needs an easy way for people to upload their galleries.


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## Rakuen Growlithe (Dec 21, 2011)

Ben said:
			
		

> I tried selling people on SoFurry, but they were turned off by the  slowness of the site, and the fact that human content lacking a furry  context isn't allowed. It's going to take a site that's just as or more  free (and just as fast) as FA to really convince people to jump ship,  not to mention it needs an easy way for people to upload their  galleries.



I have complained about the speed. Apparently that was going to be fixed once the beta site becomes the main site. I don't really have a problem with their human rule because they're trying to make a furry site, not just another DA. I'm pretty sure there is a tool to copy an entire gallery from FA to SoFurry. The only issue with trying to make those was that FA doesn't co-operate with other sites like that.


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## Aeturnus (Dec 21, 2011)

I was a little reluctant on joining SoFurry, but I'm happy I took the time to sign up. It's nice to know there's a couple of fur sites out there that have a good system for writers.


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## Ben (Dec 21, 2011)

Rakuen Growlithe said:


> I have complained about the speed. Apparently that was going to be fixed once the beta site becomes the main site. I don't really have a problem with their human rule because they're trying to make a furry site, not just another DA. I'm pretty sure there is a tool to copy an entire gallery from FA to SoFurry. The only issue with trying to make those was that FA doesn't co-operate with other sites like that.



Ah, that's good. And the human thing isn't really the worst, since you can just upload it elsewhere, post it in a journal, and the same stuff still goes to the front page for everyone to see. At least they actually have an entire photo section, and don't have an issue with human stuff if it has at least a vague furry context. So it's not so bad. I mean, I certainly use it, but I guess I can understand why someone wouldn't want to.


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## CerbrusNL (Dec 21, 2011)

Rakuen Growlithe said:


> Inkbunny and SoFurry are both more than competent and exceed FA in pretty much every respect.



No-one's forcing you to stay here, Rakuen.


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## Rakuen Growlithe (Dec 22, 2011)

CerberusNL said:
			
		

> No-one's forcing you to stay here, Rakuen.



It's a good idea to spread yourself over many sites to get better exposure and, despite its problems, FA still has the biggest userbase and so is a valuable site.


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## Devious Bane (Dec 24, 2011)

Rakuen Growlithe said:


> Inkbunny and SoFurry are both more than competent and exceed FA in pretty much every respect.


_This is because SoFurry and InkBunny focus more on catering to the artistic freedom of its users as opposed to FA which chooses to cater to the "good image" reputation of the fandom, on a more serious note: It focuses on the community.
FA has a bunch of rules which limit what can be posted, how much can be posted, how large something posted can be, etc, etc, etc. The site also sponsors FurAnthroCon, which probably costs a fuckton more than than the upkeep of the site itself.
To my knowledge, InkBunny and SoFurry do neither of these things._
Misread the fact we're debating "competence" as opposed to "artistic freedom", though I'll leave that there. For the lack of competence in FA, I've been long given the impression that it boils down to the admins going bawface when it actually comes to doing something*
*"OH, THIS WILL BE A GREAT IDEA"*
_2 Years later..._
*"OH, I ACTUALLY HAVE TO DO SOMETHING."*
_*Let alone doing it right._


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## DarkMettaur (Dec 25, 2011)

I wish I could move to SF or IB.

But Pedobunny is creepy and I don't care how much people tell me to just turn on the filter to remove cub, literally then the whole website is basically completely empty. There is almost nothing on there.

SoFurry is just... A kind of clustereff of a UI. I love FA because it's simplistic UI, every time I see some mockup site I cringe because they basically forget the only thing they have going for. :I A site that stretches out as far as your browser needs without random colours and icons and crap everywhere making it look cluttered and ugly.

Seriously that is my second complaint about InkBunny. It sits in the middle of your screen like it's the 90s again and you have a 800x600 screen.


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## Devious Bane (Dec 25, 2011)

DarkMettaur said:


> It sits in the middle of your screen like it's the 90s again and you have a 800x600 screen.


But isn't that a _good_ thing?
Though I will have to agree, one of the biggest turnoffs, in my opinion, for InkBunny and SoFurry is either A: The cons of artistic freedom(e.g. "PedoBunny", "SoFuggy", Etc) or B: The craptastic UI which is more cluster-boned than DA's. These two things alone is enough to convince many people, or at least some I've known, to put up with the infamous incompetency of FA's administration.


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## TheRedRaptor (Dec 28, 2011)

I expect Windows 9 to be released before the new user interface get implemented.

How many administrators does it take to run this site?


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## Archon (Dec 28, 2011)

I'm kind of just going with whatever happens now. I've been waiting so long, i'm indifferent lol


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## MitchZer0 (Dec 28, 2011)

When it's done.


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## DragonTalon (Jan 14, 2012)

I personally LIKE the site as it is.  It works and the things that are wrong with it should be easy to fix.

What I hate about "NEW UI COMING SOON" is it gets pointed at as to why fixes to the current site never happen.  "Oh, we are not going to waste time fixing these little bugs when we have a WHOLE NEW UI COMING!"

There are a number of things (cough.. broken color tags in url's cough...) that have been broken for ages and shoudl be easy, quick fixes.  Lots of little improvements that would make the site a lot more usable and friendlier... but they all seem to get shot down because of THE NEW UI IS COMING.

Also... site redesigns are usually a TERRIBLE idea.  Many a site has basically committed suicide by replacing an old, but functional UI with a brand new spiffy looking UI that is totally broken and leaves out half the features the old one had.  I really don't want to see this happen to FA!  I don't care if the site is 'boring' because it has not changed.  Change for the sake of change isn't always good.

I think if we just got some small, but steady fixes and improvements, most people would be very very happy.


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