# Request for FA Staff



## Arshes Nei (Jul 13, 2006)

This is a request to ask the staff to please remove Colorath from Operator status on the Furaffinity channel, in addition I do believe an apology should be delivered by him for his behavior.


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## Xax (Jul 13, 2006)

I would second this motion: the banning of everyone he doesn't like does tend to get kind of vexing.


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## Litre (Jul 13, 2006)

Third. His mindset isn't very professional at all.


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## facek (Jul 13, 2006)

You know Communist Russia silenced people they didn't like, i'm pretty sure if there were furries then they would have killed them too.


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## nobuyuki (Jul 13, 2006)

I voted yes way back when he first got his oper status, perhaps he has his moments of lucidity but letting him keep his op status is like giving a 5 year old emo kid a gun and expecting him to go to school with it every day and never shoot anyone.


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## Silver R. Wolfe (Jul 13, 2006)

I agree as well, btw what is the address for the FA IRC channel?  I can't access the site to get to it and can't remember it... >.>


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## Xax (Jul 13, 2006)

irc.furnet.org #furaffinity

(editing this because I feel like adding something on-topic)

My issue with Calorath is that he spends most of his time not in #furaffinity, but then when he deigns to join us he generally says that whatever conversation going on at the time is off-topic/offensive/trolling and then proceeds to ban anyone involved or anyone who objects.

He sez we are scaring off the community of furries with our evil hacker talk or whatever, but: the only conversations /in/ #furaffinity that don't peter out awkwardly are the ones about the site itself, and generally the people involved in those conversations are us evil hackers. And, as much as I'm sure Calorath would like it otherwise, we are an important facet of the Amazing Furaffinity Community.

While I am sure he would like it if the channel was nothing but vexing "/me cuddlesnugs" messages and soft-RP, uh... it's not. And randomly banning people who dare take the conversation in natural directions will not fix the problem, it will just further alienate parts of the community and turn the channel into a quiet boring place where no one ever talks.

THE END


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## Thaily (Jul 13, 2006)

I voted no for three reasons.

* Most people who you're asking to vote are unaware of Calorath's "behaviour".
* I saw the log and all I saw was Calorath banning some people who were being annoying in-channel, that's what ops are supposed to do. The people now crying for his blood are the people who were being a pain.
* This isn't a democracy. I have no particular love for Calorath but FA's users can't "vote out" an op or admin the moment they feel slighted by that person.

Go back to watching Americal Idols you whiny pussies. 

Why can't we ban people who've tried to hack the site repeatedly and ruin it for everyone else?


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## Hanazawa (Jul 13, 2006)

My other problem with Calorath:

When asked why someone was banned, rather than saying "they were trolling" or whatever, he just says "I felt like it". Even a weak or incorrect explanation is better than "I FELT LIKE IT".

When people in any kind of power do things "because they feel like it", they need to not have those powers.


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## Litre (Jul 13, 2006)

How about I repost the log for the public's viewing? 

*The original, untouched log, mind you.


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## nobuyuki (Jul 13, 2006)

Thaily: As towards your third point, don't be thick.  A community reserves the right to petition the administration for such things always.  Admins don't have to listen, but they often do because exactly WHAT is a community site with no community?

Also, I don't personally have to make a bunch of points as to what the job of an operator is, even though I could, and I'd consider myself an authority on the matter (being an irc op on this channel way back when -- though I am not super fond to keep bringing this up it seems I have to more and more).  Calorath's behavior can be easily made apparant with the reposting of the appropriate logs.


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## kitetsu (Jul 13, 2006)

Thaily said:
			
		

> Why can't we ban people who've tried to hack the site repeatedly and ruin it for everyone else?



Because we're not God; having the perfect sense of judgement.


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## dave hyena (Jul 13, 2006)

I would like to see some evidence of his behavior.

If for example he was banning people who were all "Lol furries internet serious buisiness" and harassing other people and making them uncomfortable thereby (as such people are wont to) then that is his duty.

However if, like Henry I, he was being a veritable tyrant and evidence can be produced then I shall have no hesitation in adding my voice to those demanding that people are only banned after due process and after a trial by their peers.


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## Litre (Jul 13, 2006)

Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> I would like to see some evidence of his behavior.
> 
> If for example he was banning people who were all "Lol furries internet serious buisiness" and harassing other people and making them uncomfortable thereby (as such people are wont to) then that is his duty.
> 
> However if, like Henry I, he was being a veritable tyrant and evidence can be produced then I shall have no hesitation in adding my voice to those demanding that people are only banned after due process and after a trial by their peers.



http://absolute-zero0.tripod.com/Miscellaneous/Fapowercock2.txt


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## Thaily (Jul 13, 2006)

kitetsu said:
			
		

> Because we're not God; having the perfect sense of judgement.



You're precious, can I keep you?
In a jar? And shake it? Or has someone beat me to it?

You don't need to be a divine power to realize that hacking a site and screwing over an entire community because of sour grapes is a bad thing.



			
				Litre said:
			
		

> http://absolute-zero0.tripod.com/Miscellaneous/Fapowercock2.txt



Nice editing, you should write movie scripts.

Here's the unedited log however: http://www.furnation.com/WhiteLion/Evidence/Whining.txt


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## Tensik (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:   Request for FA Staff*



			
				Litre said:
			
		

> Dave Hyena said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thank you, Litre.

I'd just like to point out that I've been seeing a disturbing trend of things like this . . . people who the staff like can horse around and put folks down all the time, or do things that common sense would say would be completely against anything that the site or admins would stand for, but if people that don't kiss up get goofy or do something out of line the stick comes down hard and often without good reason or in the most ridiculous way possible (forum titles, anyone?).  Or worse, if they are just plain new they are ignored or not treated with any kind of respect and people get away with it.  And it's been getting worse in the past few weeks.

I think the entire staff has to have a good sit-down and rehash over community management, because while I know you've got other site things on the plate it looks like it's tanking hard.


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## Xax (Jul 13, 2006)

I have removed some lines that have nothing to do with the current debate, I have also removed some lines that do have something to do with the current debate but don't really have a lot of impact-- does anyone really want to read through 10 minutes of nick changes &c?

(EDIT: oh right, and all the quotes are from Thaily's logfile. Feel free to CTRL+F them for additional context: there was a lot of talk and I (gasp) trimmed out some of the unimportant lines)



> [02:31] <Pico> so why was he banned exactly
> [02:31] <Calorath> cause i dun like him
> [02:31] <Calorath> wanna be next?
> [02:31] <Pico> good ops here )
> ...


ETC ETC AND SO ON AND SO FORTH AD NAUSIUM

So, uh, why would anyone try to defend Calorath for his actions? He says he's banning people because he doesn't like them, he bans people for NICK CHANGES, he admits what he's doing isn't fair, he says there is no debating TEH OPS... why is someone like this in a position of authority over the FA community?

He's not really a member of the FA IRC community: all the conversations depicted in the log (yes, even the boring ones I left out and yes, even the ones where (gasp) other members of the channel are mocked) are fairly standard fare for the channel. No one, excepting him, seems to care a whole lot. There are idlers and there are people who talk, and the people who talk are primarily of the sort that Calorath does not approve of. When the regulars don't talk, there are not (as some seem to think) conversations about how the evil trolls intimidate them and how they are afraid to conversate. There is just silence and a lot of join/parts.

"The Lurkers Support Me In Email" is a really stupid argument tactic and Calorath doesn't even claim that: He simply assumes there are sad oppressed furries keeping silent because our talking somehow oppresses them. If they have problems with the way the channel conversation goes, then they should /involve themselves/ in the conversation.

It seems to me he's used to other kinds of IRC channels (I'm thinking mostly #maleyiff here) and he's trying to fit #furaffinity to the same ruleset. It's a move that is doomed to failure because #furaffinity is a channel with established regulars who have been around for ages (for one, ME) who do not truck with his op actions.

So, uh, why does he have ops anyway? I just remember him appearing out of the blue one day and banning people he doesn't like.


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## All Seeing Eye (Jul 13, 2006)

> he says there is no debating TEH OPS



Authority is authority. If authority isn't suited for his function is up to his superiors to take action. 



> He's not really a member of the FA IRC community



Define: FA IRC community.



> No one, excepting him, seems to care a whole lot



Others might not have the courage to say things out loud. He has OP status, thus he may have felt more confident.



> When the regulars don't talk



Define: Regulars



> He simply assumes there are sad oppressed furries keeping silent because our talking somehow oppresses them



Proof of such assumption is not found. Assuming an assumption is rarely accurate.



> It seems to me he's used to other kinds of IRC channels (I'm thinking mostly #maleyiff here) and he's trying to fit #furaffinity to the same ruleset.



FA is not your channel. He can define the rules as he wants.



> It's a move that is doomed to failure because #furaffinity is a channel with established regulars who have been around for ages (for one, ME) who do not truck with his op actions.



IRC is not a democracy. Either you accept the way things are done or leave.


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## NightfallGemini (Jul 13, 2006)

eye, are you an idiot?


+1 vote for calorath removal.


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## dave hyena (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:    Request for FA Staff*

It seems to me that that there is a *very* small clique of *very* vocal people who enjoy being obnoxious and actively going out of their way to provoke others.

Through these actions they have turned the IRC channel into a festering pit of their own drama which naturally deters other people from using it, and wherever they go they try to spread this drama.

Some of these people can and do make the occasional observation or suggestion that is positive and constructive.

However they spend the vast majority of their time fellating each other because one of them repeated a catchphrase and attemping to provoke other people.

It seems to me that in this thread and the IRC logs, the majority of the people who appear to be complaining about calorath, are drama llamas who whine and whine about leaving FA or how bad it is but never actually leave it because that would lessen their opportunities for whining and drama making.

It's the same wanky thing that happens a thousand times a day, all over the internet.

I think we should be very careful in situations like this because a tiny minority of very vocal people can make it seem like there is more support for an action than there really is.

We must be calm and considered and ignore any drama-mongers.


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## Hanazawa (Jul 13, 2006)

I maintain that if there is a valid reason for banning someone, it should be explained; "I felt like it" is not a valid reason, and Calorath should at the very least apologize for acting that way.

It's not rocket science to explain why you've banned someone, and if "I felt like it" is all you have, you shouldn't have banned them in the first place.

Did it ever occur to you, Dave, that some people whine about FA without actually leaving because they would LIKE it to turn out halfway decent? Or do you support all those spineless simps who threaten to move to Canada if their candidate of choice doesn't become the US President?


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## Ursus_Amplus (Jul 13, 2006)

Hahahaha, that log file is actually hilarious.

The fact that Calorath just can ban someone for the use of the word doog is turning FA into another of preyfars most hated lol fests.

How the heck did Calorath land ops anyway, who did he have to screw?

I mean seriously guys, it's making the entire FA team look stupid, back to the bad old days of Froyst. (iirc the nick right.)
It makes Jheryn/Alkora look stupid.
It makes the sites profile look stupid.
And it makes Preyfar/Dragoneer look downright cretinous for tolerating an admin like that, after he's repeatedly ranted about Arcturus's immature behaviour.

Shame on you, the admins.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:     Request for FA Staff*



			
				Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> It seems to me that that there is a *very* small clique of *very* vocal people who enjoy being obnoxious and actively going out of their way to provoke others.
> 
> Through these actions they have turned the IRC channel into a festering pit of their own drama which naturally deters other people from using it, and wherever they go they try to spread this drama.
> 
> ...



BRAVO! Well said.

I was so incensed by the attack on Calorath here, I actually signed up to FA to offer my voice on this.

I looked through the ENTIRE, unedited log. All I see are a bunch of troublemakers - flaming, bitching and generally being abusive and an op taking actions to try and reign in the trolling.

So WHAT if Calorath made a flippant comment about not liking one of the individuals? That was nothing more than a throwaway remark. I can see why he made the bans and I'd have done the same at the drop of a hat.

The admin of furaffinity are some of the very nicest people I've met. Everyone in that channel welcomed me and were wonderful to me. Nicest bunch of admins I've seen.

All I see through dint of this log is an administrator under attack for trying to put a stop to abusive infantile attacks. Get a life!


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				Hanazawa said:
			
		

> I maintain that if there is a valid reason for banning someone, it should be explained; "I felt like it" is not a valid reason, and Calorath should at the very least apologize for acting that way.



Actually, it was a jokey, flippant throwaway remark. The real reason the individual was banned was for being a nasty, snide abusive little oik. The only thing Calorath is guilty of is of having a sense of humour. :roll:  I just can't believe people are so anally retentive as to take a jokey comment like that seriously when the ENTIREITY of the log is there for all to see. Deary, deary me.

Captain Pedantic, to the rescue!


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:     Request for FA Staff*



			
				Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> It seems to me that in this thread and the IRC logs, the majority of the people who appear to be complaining about calorath, are drama llamas who whine and whine about leaving FA or how bad it is but never actually leave it because that would lessen their opportunities for whining and drama making.



Hey Dave. If you're going to say something sensible and well thought out at least vote the same way as your convictions, huh?

First you berate the whiny vocal minority...then you vote the same way as them. The poll results are public. Despite the fact this pathetic flamebait 'poll has about as much weight and impact as someone taking a feather duster to the kneecaps, it does contradict what you're saying rather spectacularly.


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## Ursus_Amplus (Jul 13, 2006)

Haha have you never wondered that he's always under attack for a total history of being a pratt?

I dont think I've ever seen him in that channel not causing trouble.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*

The full (unedited) log files speak for themselves. Consistent abuse from a small minority of persistent troublemakers and an administrator trying to keep a good sense of humour up whilst under a barrage of abuse.

Perhaps you'd prefer it if Arcturus was modding the channel?



			
				Ursus_Amplus said:
			
		

> Haha have you never wondered that he's always under attack for a total history of being a pratt?
> 
> I dont think I've ever seen him in that channel not causing trouble.


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## dave hyena (Jul 13, 2006)

KurtBatz said:
			
		

> Hey Dave. If you're going to say something sensible and well thought out at least vote the same way as your convictions, huh?
> 
> First you berate the whiny vocal minority...then you vote the same way as them. The poll results are public. Despite the fact this pathetic flamebait 'poll has about as much weight and impact as someone taking a feather duster to the kneecaps, it does contradict what you're saying rather spectacularly.



I voted without reading the thread properly beforehand or the unedited logs. 

I'd take it back if the software allowed it.



			
				Hanazawa said:
			
		

> I maintain that if there is a valid reason for banning someone, it should be explained



Yes It should, however it doesn't mean that the people Calorath banned didn't deserve to be banned for drama mongering.

Judgeing from their actions on FA (this thread even) and their behavior on the IRC channel, they certainly seem to be.

Indeed, looking that those logs, the channel admins seem to be have been enormusly patient with the most wanky and fellateing drama mongering. 

It's been going on for months and months, and now the drama mongers must drink what they have brewed.


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## Calorath (Jul 13, 2006)

"Perhaps you'd prefer it if Arcturus was modding the channel?"


They would.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:       Request for FA Staff*



			
				Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> KurtBatz said:
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> 
> ...



Thought as much Dave. I'm sure it'll let you change your vote. Have a go! I don't hold any weight with this dumb poll anyways though, to be fair. Strikes me as flamebait crap and should be locked for what it is.

As I said, you've got a administrator under attack for trying to stop a bunch of whiney, flamey, bitchy troublemakers who have no better front of attack then to point to a flippant comment he made to try and keep an air of joviality and humour in the situation. A joke about not liking that person. People on the internet are BREATHTAKINGLY anal.

As you said, look at all the snidey comments on this thread. Proof positive if any were needed that administration action was both required and necessary.

I would NOT have had the patience Calorath has shown. I'd have banned their IP addresses permenantly too for good measure. Calorath must have the patience of a saint, reading through the full log. It's fucking disgraceful how some people choose to act in that channel.


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## I_Own_Charles (Jul 13, 2006)

Thaily said:
			
		

> I voted no for three reasons.
> 
> * This isn't a democracy. I have no particular love for Calorath but FA's users can't "vote out" an op or admin the moment they feel slighted by that person.



If this isn't a democracy, then why did you write 'I VOTED no'????

I don't think people in this thread are voting per se, they're bringing to attention a matter of concern and those replying are showing their support.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:    Request for FA Staff*

Oh I get it. They're morons! DING.

Suspected as much, from the flamebait 'poll' onwards. Especially when I have the benefit of a full, undoctored, unedited log file sitting in front of me.

Oh noes! Calorath took administration action against a bunch of abusive troublemakers and had a sense of humour about it. LETS BAN HIM FROM THE INTERWEBS.  :twisted:



			
				Calorath said:
			
		

> "Perhaps you'd prefer it if Arcturus was modding the channel?"
> 
> 
> They would.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:   Request for FA Staff*



			
				I_Own_Charles said:
			
		

> If this isn't a democracy, then why did you write 'I VOTED no'????
> 
> I don't think people in this thread are voting per se, they're bringing to attention a matter of concern and those replying are showing their support.



Actually, it's merely because the trouble makers (as proven in the log file) are more vocal then most. Most normal users of Furaffinity don't give a shit, quite rightly.

I'm only rallying behind Calorath because this is spectacular moronity, even by the usual shambling troll standards. 

If you're going to try and bullshit about Calorath's behaviour DON'T do it when a full unedited log is available for everyone to see. It makes you look extra great whocking big barrels of special.


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## Ursus_Amplus (Jul 13, 2006)

Kurt once again you define hypocrite. Having a go at people for so called flaming when you joined this community today just for the sake of stirring up trouble when you're not an active member.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*

As my behaviour in the furaffinity channel has been exemplary and I've never so much had the vaguest twinkling of an argument in there, your definition of hypocricy must be a very thin one indeed. 

Do try harder, dear.

PS - My definition of 'stirring up trouble' is posting a poll asking for one of the channel admins to be banned for trying to bring a situation under control by a bunch of immature, petulant mischief makers. A situation you seem spectacularly willing to contribute towards. Gasp, could that be some of this mystical 'hypocricy' you speak of?



			
				Ursus_Amplus said:
			
		

> Kurt once again you define hypocrite. Having a go at people for so called flaming when you joined this community today just for the sake of stirring up trouble when you're not an active member.


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## Ursus_Amplus (Jul 13, 2006)

Haha, dont change the argument, it just makes you look like you're flailing.


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## Myr (Jul 13, 2006)

Ursus_Amplus said:
			
		

> Shame on you, the admins.




*needs to stop working night work...will be back on in the evening when all the action takes place starting friday* Sorry I've missed the fun. I don't know what's going on, but I'm very eager to be back on when all this is going on to see what's happening. I'm not going to judge anyone on things I wasn't around for though.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:   Request for FA Staff*

:roll:





			
				Myr said:
			
		

> Ursus_Amplus said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Myr, quick request. Can you lock this flamebait thread? It's offensive, it's completely unfair against Calorath and most of the 'facts' the troublemakers have offered up are patently untrue.

I would be greatful! :roll:


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## Strawkitty (Jul 13, 2006)

So I decided to read the log through once again, the non snipped log that is, it was pretty funny. 

Anyway I didn't find much of any trolling or bad behavior leading to banning but I guess it's up to interpretation. What I did notice is that Colorath is a bit banhappy person regardless of the validity of the ban.

He bans people way too easily and then just brushes off or threathens those who question the ban. Other say that he did or said those things as a joke... well imho ban isn't a joke, at least not a very funny one.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				Strawkitty said:
			
		

> So I decided to read the log through once again, the non snipped log that is, it was pretty funny.
> 
> Anyway I didn't find much of any trolling or bad behavior leading to banning but I guess it's up to interpretation. What I did notice is that Colorath is a bit banhappy person regardless of the validity of the ban.
> 
> He bans people way too easily and then just brushes off or threathens those who question the ban. Other say that he did or said those things as a joke... well imho ban isn't a joke, at least not a very funny one.



I recognise some of those names in that log. They're persistent troublemakers, with a history of this sort of thing.

Moderating a channel can be a very stressful affair - constantly treading on eggshells. If people are going to systematically attack an administrator trying to do his job, they shouldn't turn around and bitch when he actually tries to bring some semblance of stability to the channel, regardless of the methods used.


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## Myr (Jul 13, 2006)

KurtBatz said:
			
		

> Myr, quick request. Can you lock this flamebait thread? It's offensive, it's completely unfair against Calorath and most of the 'facts' the troublemakers have offered up are patently untrue.
> 
> I would be greatful! :roll:


At the moment, I'm not going to lock it. I don't know the facts about what happened with Calorath on the IRC and I really don't have all the information about what was going on. Questioning the actions of an admin/op is perfectly fine for discussion. However, let's all try to keep the facts straight.

Furthermore, *Ursus_Amplus and yourself* need to knock it off with the flaming. *The same goes for everyone else. Debate, discuss, question, etc. Don't stab each other or someone else behind their back.* I'll lock the thread if it gets out of hand while I'm watching, but I'm not going to censor a perfectly reasonable discussion that's not out of control. So let's keep it clean. >^.=.^<


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:     Request for FA Staff*



			
				Myr said:
			
		

> KurtBatz said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The full, unedited log file is included in the thread, showing users in the channel getting completely out of hand and Calorath taking administrative action to bring them back into line.

This thread was started by the disgruntled users who got kicked for overstepping the mark and being overly abusive in the channel.

Again, I politely request this flamebait thread be closed and I hope and trust you will do so if these patently untrue and unfair attacks on Calorath continue, especially with the entire undoctored, unedited log file available for everyone to see!

Furthermore, I can't accept this is a perfectly reasonable discussion, on account of the 'poll'. If that'd had been removed, then sure, fine. But having a poll trying to get one of the administrators of FA banned for doing his job? How would you feel if the poll had been about you for example? It's a whocking great flame thread from start to finish.


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## Myr (Jul 13, 2006)

KurtBatz said:
			
		

> The full, unedited log file is included in the thread, showing users in the channel getting completely out of hand and Calorath taking administrative action to bring them back into line.
> 
> This thread was started by the disgruntled users who got kicked for overstepping the mark and being overly abusive in the channel.
> 
> Again, I politely request this flamebait thread be closed and I hope and trust you will do so if these patently untrue and unfair attacks on Calorath continue, especially with the entire undoctored, unedited log file available for everyone to see!


I see that log and quickly skimmed over part of it (the beginning). I saw enough in there that I will personally attempt to contact Calorath and Dragoneer over some of the things I saw that I believe were inappropriate. I will not be specific as the contents of what I want to talk about are private. The administration is a team, and I do not want to take sides in this issue. However, I will state to the people opposed to Calorath that I see where you're all coming from in terms of his approach to things, and to the people who support Calorath I see where you're all coming from in the appropriateness of the use of admin/op powers. I sit somewhere between the two sides and agree with arguments from both sides, but not all from either single side. Again, this is a perfectly debatable issue and I do not see justification for locking the thread at this time. I'm mainly just neutrally moderating this thread, but it's a big enough deal to users that I will now involve myself behind the scenes to try to satisfy both sides of the argument.



			
				KurtBatz said:
			
		

> Furthermore, I can't accept this is a perfectly reasonable discussion, on account of the 'poll'. If that'd had been removed, then sure, fine. But having a poll trying to get one of the administrators of FA banned for doing his job? How would you feel if the poll had been about you for example? It's a whocking great flame thread from start to finish.


I agree. I will remove the poll.


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## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:       Request for FA Staff*



			
				Myr said:
			
		

> KurtBatz said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks you! I suppose they'll still be the inevitable cries of 'tyranny' and 'censorship' though even though the poll was deliberately inflamatory and at odds with the forum rules though although I hope to be pleasently surprised  :roll:


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## Myr (Jul 13, 2006)

KurtBatz said:
			
		

> Thanks you! I suppose they'll still be the inevitable cries of 'tyranny' and 'censorship' though even though the poll was deliberately inflamatory and at odds with the forum rules though although I hope to be pleasently surprised  :roll:


Honestly, I didn't like the poll from the beginning, but it took me a while to word why. This isn't a black and white situation. There's no absolute yes or no answer because this situation is a judgement call all admins, mods, ops, referees, police, and other people of authority have to make on a daily basis. It can be debated, but I agree that a yes or no answer is inappropriate. Rarely are these types of situations 100% one way or the other. There's some good stuff and some bad stuff. This situation is no exception.


Btw, for anyone else still following this thread, I've just had my chats so I've got my points across. I will resume moderating this thread neutrally while I'm online.


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## Thaily (Jul 13, 2006)

I_Own_Charles said:
			
		

> If this isn't a democracy, then why did you write 'I VOTED no'????
> 
> I don't think people in this thread are voting per se, they're bringing to attention a matter of concern and those replying are showing their support.



Because this is a poll and you can poll until you're blue in the face, FA admins are under no obligation to adhere to the results. Which is good because Dave is right, the people who made the poll and the people who support it are a minority of vocal trolls.

And enough with the "shame on the admins" bullshit already, they're the people who worked hard to get FA to where it is today, the people who were OMGVICTIMIZEDFURSECUTIONED!!1one!1 by Calorath are the people who've been trying to tear it down since day one.

If you don't like the way they run the site/channel you can always leave, who not go join archives like Bitchplz? Oh no wait, they're not up


----------



## dave hyena (Jul 13, 2006)

Myr said:
			
		

> However, I will state to the people opposed to Calorath that I see where you're all coming from in terms of his approach to things, and to the people who support Calorath I see where you're all coming from in the appropriateness of the use of admin/op powers. I sit somewhere between the two sides and agree with arguments from both sides, but not all from either single side.



I cannot say that I myself have ever done anything than occasionally lurk in the FA IRC, but it really does seem to have turned into naught but wanky drama mongering which is mostly created and perpetuated by a small clique who seem to regard the channel as their private property to behave in as they wish.

Perhaps the malarial swamps that it has become hath sent it's mosquitos far and wide to carry some infection to all involved and even in attempting to drain it, some workers may have taken ill thereof.

However as people have said, that does not mean that the channel should not ultimately be drained of all that ails it. 

Iron brooms for iron times as der fuhrer said.


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:    Request for FA Staff*



			
				Thaily said:
			
		

> And enough with the "shame on the admins" bullshit already, they're the people who worked hard to get FA to where it is today, the people who were OMGVICTIMIZEDFURSECUTIONED!!1one!1 by Calorath are the people who've been trying to tear it down since day one.



Yeah. Those awful, nefarious, evil furaffinity admins. Offering a FREE service to everyone, off their own backs, spending time and effort trying to upgrade and buy more servers/make it faster/fix bugs and such.

How DARE they be so generous, patient and selfless and get ANNOYED when people take every single opportunity to abuse them left right and centre?  * STOMPS HIS FEET * 

So join my alternative art site instead, CHAN-KTHX. Now with 200% added art theft and no DNP list!  (warning, may contain scripts)


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:        Request for FA Staff*



			
				Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> I cannot say that I myself have ever done anything than occasionally lurk in the FA IRC, but it really does seem to have turned into naught but wanky drama mongering which is mostly created and perpetuated by a small clique who seem to regard the channel as their private property to behave in as they wish.



Which is why I have no objection whatsoever to Calorath taking off the kid gloves once in a while and handing out some much deserved administrative bitchslaps.  :twisted:


----------



## Strawkitty (Jul 13, 2006)

KurtBatz said:
			
		

> Thanks you! I suppose they'll still be the inevitable cries of 'tyranny' and 'censorship' though even though the poll was deliberately inflamatory and at odds with the forum rules though although I hope to be pleasently surprised  :roll:


I almost find that assumption to be an offensive flamebait but only almost so I'll forgive you.



			
				Thaily said:
			
		

> If you don't like the way they run the site/channel you can always leave, who not go join archives like Bitchplz? Oh no wait, they're not up


Oiy... now that's a bait if I ever see one imo.



			
				Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> I cannot say that I myself have ever done anything than occasionally lurk in the FA IRC, but it really does seem to have turned into naught but wanky drama mongering which is mostly created and perpetuated by a small clique who seem to regard the channel as their private property to behave in as they wish.
> 
> Perhaps the malarial swamps that it has become hath sent it's mosquitos far and wide to carry some infection to all involved and even in attempting to drain it, some workers may have taken ill thereof.
> 
> ...


There are far better ways to entice 'decent' conversation that you seem to seek than do what you so wonderfully paralled with getting rid of malaria... Like actually taking part in the conversation and that way try to change the subject?


----------



## Thaily (Jul 13, 2006)

KurtBatz said:
			
		

> So join my alternative art site instead, CHAN-KTHX. Now with 200% added art theft and no DNP list!  (warning, may contain scripts)



And then when our site sucks let's waste all of our time trying to ruin a better archive so they can't enjoy the fruits of their labor because we can't be arsed to put our money where our mouth is and spend working on our site! 
Grr! We're really frustrated because our dicks are so small we can't find them with a microscope and tweezers!!


*snrk* :wink:


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:         Request for FA Staff*



			
				Strawkitty said:
			
		

> KurtBatz said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



From the second this thread was started with a flamebait poll attached to it, the person who started it was in the wrong. It should have been locked at that point and not allowed to continue any further, IMHO.

If you're objecting to seeing comments that you consider inflamatory in a willfully flamebait seeking thread as this one, you might have considered backing my request to get this thread locked. Yes/no?


----------



## Myr (Jul 13, 2006)

Dave Hyena said:
			
		

> I cannot say that I myself have ever done anything than occasionally lurk in the FA IRC, but it really does seem to have turned into naught but wanky drama mongering which is mostly created and perpetuated by a small clique who seem to regard the channel as their private property to behave in as they wish.


A lot of people have been complaining about that. I can't do anything when I'm not there, but I will keep my eyes extra alert for that tomorrow when I'm on during all the excitement again.  I do happen to agree with Calorath's intentions here and his use of powers. However, I just had a problem with the "wanna be next?" attitude-like stuff. That's the specifics of why I got involved. Anything else I either didn't read or wasn't bothered by. The channel has a real problem with not being inviting enough to legit users who really want to enjoy the community, and we need to address it. However, each op has their own methods and approaches to things, thus why I don't want to take sides.


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:      Request for FA Staff*



			
				Thaily said:
			
		

> Grr! We're really frustrated because our dicks are so small we can't find them with a microscope and tweezers!!



Ain't THAT the truth. Don't make me post THE photo


----------



## Thaily (Jul 13, 2006)

Strawkitty said:
			
		

> Oiy... now that's a bait if I ever see one imo.



Why, FA isn't the one hacking Bitchplz. We're not making them spend time trying to take down FA rather than work on their own site. I'm all in favor of them finally putting their money where their mouth is and going off to do their own thing.



			
				KurtBatz said:
			
		

> Ain't THAT the truth. Don't make me post THE photo



OMG what photo, note me the link?


----------



## Strawkitty (Jul 13, 2006)

KurtBatz said:
			
		

> From the second this thread was started with a flamebait poll attached to it, the person who started it was in the wrong. It should have been locked at that point and not allowed to continue any further, IMHO.
> 
> If you're objecting to seeing comments that you consider inflamatory in a willfully flamebait seeking thread as this one, you might have considered backing my request to get this thread locked. Yes/no?


I'll just suggest that you read what Myr wrote ealier in this thread.


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:          Request for FA Staff*



			
				Thaily said:
			
		

> Strawkitty said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Sure! Will do so tonight.

PS - Fun fact. Arcturus just got his livejournal account banned for trying to sell it for cash on ebay. Hence I will not be surprised if the latest attack is his doing as he clearly has more time on his hands now.


----------



## Strawkitty (Jul 13, 2006)

Thaily said:
			
		

> Why, FA isn't the one hacking Bitchplz. We're not making them spend time trying to take down FA rather than work on their own site. I'm all in favor of them finally putting their money where their mouth is and going off to do their own thing.


The reason why was that it doesn't have much to do with the subject matter(even if it is correct).


----------



## Thaily (Jul 13, 2006)

Strawkitty said:
			
		

> The reason why was that it doesn't have much to do with the subject matter(even if it is correct).



Considering the site is down right now I think it has everything to do with this. If these people would shove off and make good on their word to make an uber site instead of hacking and trolling this one we wouldn't be having this discussion.


----------



## nobuyuki (Jul 13, 2006)

kurtbatz signed up to fill this thread with completely foaming at the mouth defending Calorath even though he admittedly has no involvement in the FA community.  We should be asking "What's his angle?".  More in that later, if I actually feel like doing the research.  I'm hoping someone else can do it for me.

By the way, removing the poll was garbage.  Even though a situation isn't black and white, people who's opinions were clearly yes or no deserved to make their voices heard and the "Yes" towards removal clearly outnumbered the "No" -- and there's no way around that except to throw the whole thing out and pretended it never happened.  As can be clearly stated by a poll of this dry nature, let it be known that as of 4am last morning, there were 14 votes for Yes, and 4 for No.  An off-site poll may soon follow.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I actually have to go and drudge through the last page of crap to read in order to stay on top of this thread.


Edit 1:  updated the poll numbers to a more recent last count.  Please note that the time this thread was open was between the hours of midnight and 4am in the US, so the vast majority of people who weren't actively around to watch the situation unfold themselves did not get a chance to vote.  Mainly, the only people still awake to vote saw everything first hand.

Edit 2:  I've noticed a few unscrupulous people here going from mere mudslinging to trying to associate the site's hacking with the content of this thread.  Save for the fact the hacking put the admins under extra stress from which may have caused them to act irrationally on IRC, any other conclusions that can be drawn from the two events can only be unfair speculation, completely irrelevant, and without any reasonable support to associate the two.  Stop dealing in logical fallacies.  And while you guys are at it, stop trying to derail the thread with your pathetic appeals to authority.


----------



## Calorath (Jul 13, 2006)

nobuyuki said:
			
		

> kurtbatz signed up to fill this thread with completely foaming at the mouth defending Calorath even though he admittedly has no involvement in the FA community.  We should be asking "What's his angle?".  More in that later, if I actually feel like doing the research.  I'm hoping someone else can do it for me.
> 
> By the way, removing the poll was garbage.  Even though a situation isn't black and white, people who's opinions were clearly yes or no deserved to make their voices heard and the "Yes" towards removal clearly outnumbered the "No" -- and there's no way around that except to throw the whole thing out and pretended it never happened.  As can be clearly stated by a poll of this dry nature, let it be known that as of 4am last morning, there were approximately 9 votes for Yes, and 2 for No.  An off-site poll may soon follow.
> 
> Now, if you'll excuse me, I actually have to go and drudge through the last page of crap to read in order to stay on top of this thread.



Kurt and I are fucking each other, isn't it obvious?


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				nobuyuki said:
			
		

> By the way, removing the poll was garbage.  Even though a situation isn't black and white, people who's opinions were clearly yes or no deserved to make their voices heard and the "Yes" towards removal clearly outnumbered the "No" -- and there's no way around that except to throw the whole thing out and pretended it never happened.  As can be clearly stated by a poll of this dry nature, let it be known that as of 4am last morning, there were 14 votes for Yes, and 4 for No.  An off-site poll may soon follow.



..and to quote myself!

"Thanks you! I suppose they'll still be the inevitable cries of 'tyranny' and 'censorship' though even though the poll was deliberately inflamatory and at odds with the forum rules though although I hope to be pleasently surprised"

My GOD, I love being right about everything. It makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				nobuyuki said:
			
		

> kurtbatz signed up to fill this thread with completely foaming at the mouth defending Calorath even though he admittedly has no involvement in the FA community.



Actually, I've been involved for a while now, just no forum account.



			
				nobuyuki said:
			
		

> We should be asking "What's his angle?".  More in that later, if I actually feel like doing the research.  I'm hoping someone else can do it for me.



Calorath is incredibly good in bed and has a 12 inch penis.


----------



## All Seeing Eye (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				nobuyuki said:
			
		

> kurtbatz signed up to fill this thread with completely foaming at the mouth defending Calorath even though he admittedly has no involvement in the FA community.  We should be asking "What's his angle?".  More in that later, if I actually feel like doing the research.  I'm hoping someone else can do it for me.



Who are you to say who has involvement in FA community? Joining the site automaticaly makes him a member of FA community and by posting on his account he's involved in making the community flourish. By posting his opinion on the whole subject and matter he's also by default involved in the community.



> By the way, removing the poll was garbage.  Even though a situation isn't black and white, people who's opinions were clearly yes or no deserved to make their voices heard and the "Yes" towards removal clearly outnumbered the "No" -- and there's no way around that except to throw the whole thing out and pretended it never happened.  As can be clearly stated by a poll of this dry nature, let it be known that as of 4am last morning, there were approximately 9 votes for Yes, and 2 for No.  An off-site poll may soon follow.



The final question wheter his actions were good or not, should be the subject of administrative discussion. Not a subject of assembling an angry mob. The way facts are presented is clearly baised. If you'd want to make this poll unbaised, attaching a full unedited log in the first post would be a very good way to do so.

Otherwise, this poll is just pressing an issue that only few people care about.

11 people voted. Out of 10,000 FA Users.

That's below 1% even


----------



## Strawkitty (Jul 13, 2006)

Thaily said:
			
		

> Considering the site is down right now I think it has everything to do with this. If these people would shove off and make good on their word to make an uber site instead of hacking and trolling this one we wouldn't be having this discussion.


Eh wrong thread. ^^; You want the one below this one.


----------



## Suule (Jul 13, 2006)

Jesus people. All this fuzz about being banned from IRC. 

OMG!!!! MY FREEDOM OF SPEECH IS TAKEN AWAY! CALL THE PRESIDENT OF THE INTERNET!!!!!


----------



## Thaily (Jul 13, 2006)

Strawkitty said:
			
		

> Eh wrong thread. ^^; You want the one below this one.



Different thread, same bottomline.


----------



## yak (Jul 13, 2006)

i'm here to give a quick glimpse of what i think of this situation
1) all this is terribly wrong, on so many levels that i can't count on all of my fingers. like at the blink of an eye, everything turned from acceptable, even good - to spectacularly and mind-numbingly stupid.
2) i'm going to have /a seriuos/ discussion with all the people involved, to once and for all clarify the situation and not sit here ignorant of the details.
3) something /will/ have to change, since, well - that was bullshit what happened. my brain still refuses to belive in this. 
4) my faith in some people's abilities to handle things levelheadedly, maturely and calmly has seriuosly suffered due to the events that have happened. frankly, i'm irritated at almost all the admins for their actions/inaction. 
5) i'm going to push, once again, the damn issue of admin communication. because, well, i /don't/ know who Calorath is and was not aware/notified that he/she has been given powers above the average user. damn it, this shoud be a) voted upon b) relayed to all admins, so that they'd /know/
seriuosly, this is bullshit granting someone admin powers just because you feel like it at the moment. the staff /REALLY/ has to realise that hell, no one is in the position to do so. instead i see people going 'ownerish' on their own. yeah... great....
6) the hacking that originally brough to this will be investigated /today/, either by my, or someone else, if he gets to in sooner then i do. this implies a partial rewrite of the code to allow more security, and full-action-logging implemented. /nothing/ on the site would not be done without us knowing that. if by doing so i'd break some law, please, let me know. i am not law-savvy.  
7) sorry for the bad language ahead, but i'm so fucking pissed off with some people to no extent at the moment, that i simply fail at words



*sigh* everything i ever fought for - openness with the community, reasonable, properly explained actions, mature way of handling things, not letting your own grudges and problems affect your position, polite conversationing, logical thinking, thinking 3 steps ahead before doing someting, doing all that matters, even at the cost of your own pride, to handle the situation without escalating the issue at question, keeping FA's reputation as a /fair/ place where there is no place for injustice and bullshit  ---- was so horribly violated. i feel like i've hit a brick wall. 
i strived for a simple, fair and open community for people... guess i had my hopes up too high.


*please allow me to give you my personal, most sincere appologies for what has happened*. the situation was handled outrightly wrong, without thinking of the consequences - that is my own oppinion on this. i wish i could have put a stop to this when it was just brewing, but alas, i didn't though it would ever escalate to /this/. it was partially my mistake to let this unfold.

irregardless of my position on FA, and the powers within my grasp (since i haven't been on the team for long, and still feel a it of an outsider) - i /WILL/ try to bring my point to all the administration, and try to sort things once and for all.. 

this was the display of how things /never/ should be, and never should have been. 


at this time i would really appreciate if you could just... not escalate the issue any further.. please... 
it is hard enough trying to figure out what's wrong with the code and have this weight of a full-scale open drama on yourself. i do realise that you've seen some inapropriate actions from the staff, and i tend to agree with you on that - but if it is possible, please try not to spread the wild fire. i assure you that the situation will be /thoroughly/ discussed among the staff, and some actions taken to prevent this in the future. 
either that, or i'll die trying....
thank you for reading this.


----------



## All Seeing Eye (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				Suule said:
			
		

> Jesus people. All this fuzz about being banned from IRC.
> 
> OMG!!!! MY FREEDOM OF SPEECH IS TAKEN AWAY! CALL THE PRESIDENT OF THE INTERNET!!!!!



Though I agree with the first line of your post, the usage of overused catchphrases isn't suitable for this discussion.


----------



## nobuyuki (Jul 13, 2006)

Thaily, there are people who are watching this thread on IRC, and they all seem to agree -- you have a total hard-on for fascism.  I'm not saying that to be rude, seriously think about this for a second.  You love following  "the" supreme leaders.

(I'm making a seperate post for this to keep what may be potentially labeled as flamebait seperate from my previous post -- though it seems to be an undisputed fact, the inflammatory nature of the accusation may not sit well with certain users because instead of implying, it is direct)


----------



## Thaily (Jul 13, 2006)

nobuyuki said:
			
		

> Thaily, there are people who are watching this thread on IRC, and they all seem to agree -- you have a total hard-on for fascism.  I'm not saying that to be rude, seriously think about this for a second.  You love following  "the" supreme leaders.



Coming from you and your clique I take that as a compliment 

The "supreme leaders" are the people who did what you can't; build up a site for both artists and fans to enjoy. All you can do is be a scriptkiddy and bitch about it 

I'm like Hitler, a furry Hitler. Only I paint better, which is the only thing that has averted furry world war III! XD
I wonder if WWII could've been averted with furry porn :3


----------



## All Seeing Eye (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				nobuyuki said:
			
		

> Thaily, there are people who are watching this thread on IRC, and they all seem to agree -- you have a total hard-on for fascism.  I'm not saying that to be rude, seriously think about this for a second.  You love following  "the" supreme leaders.



Is law and order facism? Sorry, but I think you're being overreactive - From my observations, it seems Thaily tries to fight anarchy that some people here seem to like very much. Hidding behind 'freedom of speech' and calling each other fascists, is domain of fake revolutonaries that eat at Mc Donalds while wearing Che T-shirts.


----------



## nullenigma (Jul 13, 2006)

Thank you Yak, I don't know what you'll eventually decide, but it was very nice to hear an actual professional response from the admin team.   Good luck!


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				nobuyuki said:
			
		

> Thaily, there are people who are watching this thread on IRC, and they all seem to agree -- you have a total hard-on for fascism.  I'm not saying that to be rude, seriously think about this for a second.  You love following  "the" supreme leaders.
> 
> (I'm making a seperate post for this to keep what may be potentially labeled as flamebait seperate from my previous post -- though it seems to be an undisputed fact, the inflammatory nature of the accusation may not sit well with certain users because instead of implying, it is direct)



You're skating DANGEROUSLY thin to breaking Godwin's law yanno. http://www.faqs.org/faqs/usenet/legends/godwin/


----------



## Suule (Jul 13, 2006)

Thaily said:
			
		

> The "supreme leaders" are the people who did what you can't; build up a site for both artists and fans to enjoy. All you can do is be a scriptkiddy and bitch about it



Speaking of which - 11 days till ArtFu/ArtPlz/4curio was first announced. I think some people are just growing bitter FA is more sucessful than vapourware.


----------



## dave hyena (Jul 13, 2006)

nobuyuki said:
			
		

> Thaily, there are people who are watching this thread on IRC, and they all seem to agree -- you have a total hard-on for fascism.



Lots of people on IRC are watching this thread and they think you're a troll nobuyuki.

I'm not giving any details or anything, but loads of people agree with me.

Yeah, loads of them!

on IRC!



			
				nobuyuki said:
			
		

> By the way, removing the poll was garbage.  Even though a situation isn't black and white, people who's opinions were clearly yes or no deserved to make their voices heard and the "Yes" towards removal clearly outnumbered the "No" -- and there's no way around that except to throw the whole thing out and pretended it never happened.  As can be clearly stated by a poll of this dry nature, let it be known that as of 4am last morning, there were 14 votes for Yes, and 4 for No.  An off-site poll may soon follow.



When I looked at the list of people who had voted yes, most of them were people directly involved with the IRC banning drama (i.e they had been banned themselves or their friends had).

Not to mention someone involved in the drama created this thread, most of the posts attacking Calorath have, again, been made by people who were involved with the IRC banning drama.

Indeed, I think your own angle is that you are friends with the people who were banned: perhaps you yourself have been banned?

As I have said before: In my opinion, It's a tiny minority of astonishingly loud people.


----------



## Calorath (Jul 13, 2006)

yak said:
			
		

> i /don't/ know who Calorath is and was not aware/notified that he/she has been given powers above the average user.




I'm not an admin. Just a channel op on an  IRC channel, which Dragoneer himself has stated is not directly associated with this site.

So I don't think I'm bound by the rules of the administration team for FurAffinity.  I just removed a few assholes from an IRC channel and they baited you guys here.


Is the picture clearning up?


----------



## Myr (Jul 13, 2006)

This is getting really out of hand. I personally can't read fast enough to moderate all the posts because they're coming so fast. So many users are involved simple text warnings are not going to diffuse the situation. I've locked this thread for the time being.

The administration of FA is aware of what happened with Calorath and will be taking steps to address the situation. I have personally made my points known and taken what I deem as appropriate action in private and in public. We will be discussing this in private to try to meet everyone's concerns on both sides of the aisle.

Please halt this line of discussion so that we may take action behind the scenes. >^.=.^<


----------



## yak (Jul 13, 2006)

i unlocked the thread, because, frankly, at first, i don't see the reason for the lock, and secondly, it will cause more problems closed rather then opened.

the thing is, people will find a way to say what they want to say - and closing down a single thread will make the discussion branch to LJ, Y!, sA, somewhere else. by keeping the thread opened, we, at least, can keep track of the discussion, correct invalid rumours that people might use as valid facts - and try to keep this issue localised.

i want to thank the people who read, but stayed out of this discussion and further escalation of drama at hand, and, again, ask the ones involved to maybe try and calm down the situation.  
name-calling and picking on each other's words, that seems to happen after every second page of any thread, irrlevant of the topic of the said discussion - isn't really going to help. if you have an oppinion to voice - voice it, but please, i ask you - don't be touchy person and don't comment on every single/most of the other people's oppinions that you find wrong..

_(to be honest, this is probably the only case you will ever see me acting 'i feel/don't feel like it' ever.)_


----------



## KurtBatz (Jul 13, 2006)

*RE:  Request for FA Staff*



			
				yak said:
			
		

> i unlocked the thread, because, frankly, at first, i don't see the reason for the lock, and secondly, it will cause more problems closed rather then opened.
> 
> the thing is, people will find a way to say what they want to say - and closing down a single thread will make the discussion branch to LJ, Y!, sA, somewhere else. by keeping the thread opened, we, at least, can keep track of the discussion, correct invalid rumours that people might use as valid facts - and try to keep this issue localised.
> 
> ...



I feel you're being very disrespectful to Myr. Why should one administrator be allowed to run roughshot over the decision of another?

I remember requesting the thread be locked, because I knew it'd turn into a flamefest. I was right.

Please lock the thread again and respect your fellow administrators ability to make a correct decision. This thread had no place on the forum to begin with.

Failing that...

Preyfar, I politely request this flamefest remain closed.


----------



## Myr (Jul 13, 2006)

Yak, you will discuss this in private with me before taking any further action.


----------



## Dragoneer (Jul 13, 2006)

Here's the short end of it:

Calorath was added to the AOP list to help riot control when the FA IRC channel first started. He assisted us as a friend of mine, along with Marth. Calorath is much more heavy handed than most and has a low tolerance for stupidity.

I'm going to go ahead and openly admin that we let people get away with a lot more than we should in the FA IRC and every time something goes wrong in FA the same lil' patrol of trolls comes in for some hot, sexy LOL on LOL action. If they got banned, well... I have no regrets. They contribute nothing but drama as it is.

However, Calorath's AOP was meant to be removed a while ago. Calorath is a friend of mine, and if he did poorly, then that reflects upon me and I will take that into consideration. If he was heavy handed in his actiosn to protect the  interests of the site given the issues at hand then we will take that into equal consideration.

We will discuss it in administrative chat and, until then, we've got extra parking in the rear for your llamas. We'll get it taken care of.


----------



## yak (Jul 13, 2006)

here, again, i find this thread locked. 

i'm sorry, i fail at keeping up with all this. all i'll say now is that i don't like how the situation is being resolved...


----------



## yak (Jul 13, 2006)

posted as a reply to KurtBatz, to clarify the situation



			
				KurtBatz said:
			
		

> I feel you're being very disrespectful to Myr. *Why should one administrator be allowed to run roughshot over the decision of another?*


emphasis mine. 
would it be rude of me to say that you probably lack the details behind the scenes?  maybe it was Myr who roughshooted my decigion in the first place? maybe i was on this earlier then he was, and by coming over without asking questions and locking the thread, despite my posts, indicating that i am also monitoring the thread, thus taking decigions and making actions over my head.  
----
or maybe not.. it doesn't matter really. 

what i want to say is, that given an uncertain situation like this, making firm posts regarding admin actions without knowing even 5% of what's hapened both pulic and behind the scenes... i find hardly logical..

and again, try to push the idea of communication prior making any changes. i really wish people would respect other people's oppinions, and /ask/ them.



			
				KurtBatz said:
			
		

> Please lock the thread again and *respect your fellow administrators ability to make a correct decision*. This thread had no place on the forum to begin with.


*sigh* if i didn't know it better, i'd say that this is prejudice. define 'correct decigion', if you speak so certain of it. there is no such thing.. ever...
but just in case there was, again, due to the lack of information, you can't possibly be sure on just what the correct decigion means. 

and again, emphasis mine. by the rules of logic saying that implies that i took the wrong decigion. the way it was worder implies that this was a majour, majour mistake from my side. and finally, the rules of tone/choice of words imply that by saying that, you put /very/ little value in what i originally say, much less then other admin's.  nothing that bothers me thou, just noticed that.

sorry for the confusion, and a big appology to everyone in front, in case my decigion was wrong....

honestly, i found this inapropriate, and unlocked the the thread. please, i aks you - don't try and imagine myself as the bad guy, because i hardly ever take any actions without consulting other admin's  oppinions prior. 
this time, however, i must admit that i was a bit irritaed with the situation and impulsively reverted the lock. for that i give Myr my sincere appologies.


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